Mixed class of year 4/5? Any teachers comments?

[steppemum]

dd came home today with the news that they are mixing up year 4 and 5 to make 2 x year 4/5 mix classes

I used to teach, I don't like mixed year classes and I am not happy.

dd is very bright, top of her class, she will be year 5 next year. But she is a quiet not pushy girl, and tends to get lost in the crowd.

What do you think of mixed classes, would you be happy? Am I worrying for nothing? School's line is that a good teacher teaches every child where they are and so the split in level doesn't make any difference. True in theory, but in practice?

[steppemum]

sorry, this thread exists twice as I was asked to move it to primary ed.

[lljkk]

Am not a teacher, but DC have often been in mixed groups, including DS who was high ability yr5 with yr4s. Our school mixes them up again for math lessons. I think it worked well because they could have much more differentiation by recombining all the yr 4s & 5s as needed.

[Cheebame]

I think that in general it's a good idea, but it depends on the children.

Assuming they are going to teach in smaller, differentiated groups it makes sense to put children of a similar ability together. Of course if there was a linear relationship between age and ability you would end up with a bottom set of year 4 and a top set of year 5 - but there isn't a linear relationship, so there won't be.

By the sound of it your DD will be in that top group, but you may be surprised that there are year 4 pupils at the same or similar level.

Of course your DD may be miles ahead of anyone else in either year, in which case the school will need to provide her with approrpriate resources, but that would be the case whether or not they were mixed groups.

[lljkk]

It was a bit of a problem for DD when in a mixed yr4-5 class because she got picked on by yr5s who didn't think she belonged in their ability group (argh). She befriended them in the end by drawing pony pictures named after them.

[Cheebame]

That's sweet, lljkk :)

I wonder if that is an age thing or a culture thing? DC1 (age 5) is also working with older children and seems to get on better with them than her age peers.

[steppemum]

cheebame, dd would be fine with children older than her. I would be less bothered if it were a mix with the class above, but that is not possible because of sats. But that would be from a selfish point of view, it would still be a concern for the top of the class above.

I cannot see how you get better differentiation at all. The spread is wider. They are not proposing to mix the two classes for different subjects, eg set across the two classes for maths. Each class will be taught as a unit.

I obviously don't know the kids in the year below, but dd and a couple of others are pretty ahead. dd was doing level 4 maths in year 2. I don't think that there will be a group of year 4 joining the top set of the year 5s, the bright kids in year 4 will be doing what dd and her friends did a year ago, so each class now has a wider spread. I don't see how that improves differentiation, it just makes more work for the teacher.

I am pretty annoyed by the splitting up of all the friends for one year and then splitting them again to rejoin the class as a year 6 group.

[lljkk]

Splitting & rejoining another yr happens a lot at our school. Plus to encourage responsibility they have to eat lunch with their class which is a problem when your friends aren't in your class.

Am very impressed by a school or parents that produce kids who reach L4 in maths in yr2.

[Cheebame]

So are they putting them in two classes (class A and class B) where each class is discrete and contains y4 and y5?

I assumed you meant that they would be in groups (say groups 1,2,3,45 and 6) for each subject, where the group members might come from either year, so to use maths as the example, group 1 might include the best mathematicians from year 4 and 5.

Don't assume that there are no comparable mathematicians in the year below. It sounds like most people would have been wrong if they'd thought that last year ...

[Hercule]

My DCs' school has had numerous mixed class combinations over the years. There are pros and cons. In every case though it has been through necessity not through choice- I think most schools would prefer to have single year classes.

If you're unhappy with mixed year classes then campaign to the government for a fairer funding structure. With fluctuating pupil numbers, and funding given per pupil often there just isn't the money to fund enough teachers or facilities to provide the required class groups and mixed classes are the inevitable result.

[Cheebame]

hercule said "I think most schools would prefer to have single year classes. "

I know of schools locally that teach by ability rather than age. So if you're 5 but level 3b, you work at that level with others at that level, be they 5, 8, or 11.

Seems to work well for them, and makes sense to me.

[steppemum]

Thanks for all your replies
lljkk - definitely not anything I (or the school) has done, she is her father's daughter! She was (teacher assessment) 3a at the end of year 2, but was doing some level 4 work in class.