Crying - Wrong Preference

[Tazbo]

Hi All,

My wife and I were separated at the time we applied for our daughters primary school place as she was suffering from severe depression. We were both going through a divorce and I somehow (stupidly) ordered our school preference in the wrong order. We today were offered a place at a school which should have been our third choice and since my application I have heard nothing but negative things about the school. I was in tears when I realised my mistake today.

My wife and I have since got back together and what should have been our second choice option is walking distance from our home, I called my LA and they have said you can't technically appeal as your second third choice was never offered due to the second choice being accepted. I have been in bits all day and sat in a car park with my head in my hands. I have no idea what to do as according to the Manchester City council website the school of our choice says 90 places and 90 places offered (155) applicants. I don't think I have a chance now of getting her in. Can anybody please help a father who has possibly made the biggest mistake of his life.

[darksideofthemooncup]

Take a deep breath.Firstly, this is primary school and you have a lot of years ahead before you have to panic about having done the 'right thing' regarding her academic education. Have you checked it's latest Ofsted report and position in the league tables? I live across the road from an outstanding according to Ofsted, primary school but I went with my gut and placed my Dd in a school that scored satisfactory with Ofsted and is locally known as being the 'wrong side' of a relatively posh town.
2 years in and my Dd has grown in confidence, is scoring excellent on all her assessments, the school has gone up to good with Ofsted and is outstripping the outstanding school in the league tables

[Bumpsadaisie]

I don't have any advice but I wanted to say perhaps it is not the end of the world. You made a mistake but it sounds like you had the weight of the world on your head at the time.

Keep trying the official channels but if it doesn't come right, don't despair. At the end of the day, primary school is not THAT important, especially not in the first years, and in the fullness of time you can work out how to get her moved if you need to.

[Tazbo]

Hi, thanks for taking time out to reply. The school had a satisfactory report in 2009 however I have a new friend who was a teacher at this particular school and a few days ago she basically said its awful. The teachers seem down the children seem to hardly speak English as it's so diverse in any classroom and the majority of the parents she has spoken to just seem to use it as a day care centre. There is a real lack of morale and has warned me in advance but I told her it was to late. My only argument which I feel I have not to send her there is it's quite far from our new address, when my wife did apply it was close to her old address. If a school shows 90/90 places have been taken is there any point of an appeal or can I apply for the primary school at this stage as we have not technically been rejected.

[Spellcheck]

You don't have grounds to appeal, but you could place your daughter on the continuing interest list at your preferred school. You never know - some of the children offered a place may not take it, as they could be going private or prefer another school. You might have to choose another school and wait a year or so for a place, as we did with our eldest, but it's an option.

[whatcolour]

In Manchester huge numbers got 3rd choice and 300 odd children got a school they did not put down. I have several friends in this situation. We got in 1st choice but several from nursery didn't and lots who would have got in previous years. Get on waiting lists and see what position you are at, at all your options.

[whatcolour]

When you say walking distance do you mean less than 0.4miles?

[mummytime]

What you want to do is ask to be placed on the waiting list of all schools you prefer. I would think in Manchester there will be quite a bit of movement, so you maybe lucky.

Also don't just listen to one friend. I have known friends who have taken their children out of the "desirable" school and put them in a less desirable school, as the first one wasn't the best one for their child. Also in my small town I used to be prejudiced against one school in the less desirable part of town, however having been in there I came to the point of seriously considering moving my child to that school.

[SaveTheMockingBird]

My DS is at a Manchester primary school where it is 90 intake for reception year (also my DD is starting there this Sept too). It is an oversubscribed school, but even then there was a bit of movement, i.e there was a girl who moved to a nearby school just after starting as it was closer to her and recently my DS said a new girl started in his group very recently and these cases I just happened to hear by chance, so there might even have been more. So it's worth getting on the list of the school that you want.

[whatcolour]

We are a Manchester 90 intake massive over subscription school and there is quite a bit of movement every year.

[nikki1391]

I would accept the offer but explain your mistake again to the LA. You don't have grounds to appeal but you can request to go onto the waiting list of schools that you would prefer. Hopefully this way you can get a place at a school that you are more happy with. The waiting lists are ordered according to distance so if you are fairly close to the school then hopefully you will be high on the waiting list. Don't worry its not the end of the world and people make mistakes all the time...try not to beat yourself up over it. I know right now you're probably panicking and feeling terrible but believe me you still have a chance of getting the school you want and as previous posters have stated there will probably be quite a bit of movement on the Manchester waiting lists. Good luck :)

[Mumoftwoyoungkids]

This is not the end of the world!

Right - phone up, explain your mistake and get on the waiting lists for all the schools you prefer. (Make sure they have your new address.)

However, the error is unlikely to make much difference.

If your dd would have got a place then she will be near to / at the top,of the waiting list. There will be movement with 90 kids. Someone will leave the area. Someone will go private. Loads of people who have places will not have them as first choice so if another school moves then yours will too.

If your dd wouldn't have got a place then you are no worse off than if you had filled in the form correctly.

No go and hug your wife, hug your dd and breathe!

[prh47bridge]

You need to apply to the school you want. You will be rejected but you will then be on the waiting list and you have the right to appeal. Your chances at appeal are virtually nil, I'm afraid. However, the waiting list is another matter. If you would have got into this school had you applied correctly you should be at or near the head of the waiting list. The fact that you would be, in effect, a late applicant is irrelevant. They can't put you at the end of the list just because you are late. So you have a decent chance of getting in that way.

[admission]

Think that you need to take a systematic approach to this. Firstly accept the school you have been offered. The LA have done everything legally they need to and whilst Manchester LA will eventually offer you another school if you reject this one, it will almost for sure be a worse school and a further distance away.
Secondly you can go on the waiting list of any school that you wish, so you should talk to the LA admission office about this and get your name down on every school that is acceptable to you in your changed circumstances, especially the one that you want.
Thirdly you can appeal for a place at any school you want to go to. As your preference school is a 90 entry school, it will be an infant class size case and the reality is that you have to prove a mistake was made and you should have been offered a place at this school. From your post, no mistake was made by the LA, the mistake was made by you in your initial application and your third preference (which should have been your first preference) was never considered as an option as you could be offered the second preference school. I know this might seem stupid to ask but are you absolutely sure that you made the error and put them in the wrong order and it is not the LA that has put them in the wrong order? It is definitely worth making 100% sure.
As such I can see little point in appealing for a place and the priority has to be to get on the waiting list, where you will probably be well up the admission criteria order and hope that there is movement over the next couple of months. With a 90 intake that would be quite likely. One thing I would say is to make sure that everything is done in writing so that there is no possibility of any mistakes being made.

[whatcolour]

Tazbo the admissions data for all schools had been published on the web site now do you can see where has places, what the distances were etc - have you had a look? If may help you to navigate options

[whatcolour]

Sorry typos. The data has been published on line so you can now scrutinise it.

[OuterFromOutersville]

whatcolour, do you have a link?

[whatcolour]

www.manchester.gov.uk/download/downloads/id/21692/reception_2014_-_how_offers_were_made


Pm me if you want any more info

[whatcolour]

It wax on the offer letters in Manchester

[OuterFromOutersville]

Thank you, we're in Leeds though...

[whatcolour]

Yes sorry I was replying to OP. Leeds LA will have same info available but may not have published it yet - give them a call on Tuesday?

[OuterFromOutersville]

Thanks

[Tazbo]

Hi All,

Many Thanks for your kind replies and words of encouragement.

I called Manchester Schools Admissions team today and the advice they gave me was as follows;

1. Reject the offer for the third place school which is 1.5 miles away
   
2. Send in an email to the admissions team and explain that you have rejected the offer as the preferred order was incorrect due to my mistake on my behalf.
   
3. They will then confirm by Wed / Thu that the school place we were given has been declined by us.
   
4. We need to then email in our new choices of schools, 1 school is 0.6 miles away and the other is 0.3 miles away.
   
5. We will be almost instantly be rejected by both schools as the places have been allocated.
   
6. We apply to be put on the waiting list and then appeal.
   
   
   After sending the email I was sent the following;
   
   
   Dear Parent,
   
   Thank you for your email.
   
   At the moment we are still processing all ontime applications.This a late change in preference order and will be updated after all ontime applications has been processed.
   Regards,
   
   The Admissions Team
   Manchester City Council

[Unexpected]

I am incredulous that the admissions team told you to reject the school that you were offered. You do realise that this now leaves you with NO school place and no guarantee that you will get one at either of your other choices or indeed, any school which you will deem acceptable? If they really told you that, it is very poor advice. Any LA only has to find you one school place and, if declined, they are not under any obligation to find you another one.

They did, at least, correctly inform you that you will almost certainly be rejected by your other schools as they are full. However, on what grounds do they/you think you can successfully appeal for either of those schools? There has been no mistake in the allocation of a school place for your dd so you are not appealing on that basis. If the schools are full and you have no valid reason for appeal (putting them in the wrong order on the form doesn't count) then you are very unlikely to win an appeal.

Please reread the advice from people like Prh and Admission on this thread who are very expert in this area. Then contact the admissions team again (unfortunately after the weekend at this stage) and see if you can withdraw your rejection of the place which you have been offered. And finally, get on the waiting lists of the schools which you would like your daughter to attend.

[Tazbo]

Hi, I actually did ignore the advice regarding rejecting the offer. That actually made no sense to me.