DS moved off his table where he is very settled, very annoyed!(36 Posts)
DS has been so settled of late on his table in class, really working well and happy. One child was moved next to him as a parent had complained that the child was distracting to her child so they move the kids around the table and said child was sat next to my DS - all last week the child has constantly talked and distracted him, I told him just to ignore and see what happens, then the child was taking his pencils and putting them in their pencil case etc... he told the teacher last thing on Fri and she said she would leave a note for the other teacher for Monday (job share) to move him!!!!
This morning he didnt want to go to school as he doesnt want to be moved onto another table he was so settled before with the others. I been in to school this morning and spoken with the teacher and expressed that I dont want him moving - she said she would have to look at the abilities around the class and see what she could do, she cant just move the said child which is NOT what Ive asked, I asked for my DS to be moved around the table and not to be moved.
I now feel that my very settled DS is now going to become very unsettled grrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr
lovely - thank you. It is something I think I am going to have to raise with my daughter's teacher because she keeps saying the same 2 kids are pestering her constantly to explain to them what they are supposed to be doing. now my daughter just wants to get on with her own work and is fed up with it so she tries to sit next to different people but in a smallish group she can't always. I told her to tell them to ask a teacher if they get too annoying and I did also ask her if she thought they didn't understand (and told her the teacher needs to know if this is the case) or weren't listening (when again the teacher needs to know - could indicate hearing problem or anything). She said she tried that and one child did ask the teacher but was told to ask someone in the group. fair enough but unfair if she always asks the same child and it is constant as it means DD can't concentrate on her own work. difficult situation, they are only young and I have explained to DD that sometime she might need to ask her group to repeat something to her, say she was blowing her nose or coughing and didn't hear the instructions or wasn't quite sure about something but I think because it is all one way it is really bugging her. both did similar last year although only one was with my daughter. the other did it to my friends DC.
It depends. We have a loose 'process' that the children are supposed to work through if they are stuck:
- Think harder
- Use a resource (e.g. the board, a display, a dictionary, a times table grid, counters)
- Ask a friend
- Ask a teacher
If I had a child who used the 'ask a friend' option a little too freely, I would be looking to see if they were thinking / using a resource first, and if not would have a workd with them. I work with all my groups in the course of a week - usually several times, as my target group will change for different parts of the lesson - and so I would be probing to see whether those particular children were struggling, or simply being lazy. or not listening to instructions first time round. If the behaviour persists, and has no good basis, then I might sit those children separately from the main group, or with a group or partners working on something different, for a few days to encourage them to focus on the task and rely on their own resources.
out of interest if a class is split into ability groups for some subjects and within those groups a couple of children persist with always asking a child what they are supposed to be doing all the time how would you deal with that?
(Missed a 'usually' from that sentence)
And of course, in my classroom, a separation may only last for half of a lesson or a lesson, because the next day's grouping may bring those children together again, or separate them completely, or anything in between. There is no feeling of 'others being disrupted' because there is no 'static' arrangement to be upset. That might be why I find the tactic so useful, and why it has so few downsides in my classroom...
Pusslet, think it through practically:
2 children are seated together in an unsually static seating arrangement (I do think that set seats which have not changed since September for any subject is relatively unusual). There is an issue between them.
For most teachers, the first step in a plan to change the behaviour of the children involved would be to separate them. In most classrooms, there are no spare chairs, so that means that 1 or 2 other children need to move too.
If the problem persists after a move has been tried, then there will be next steps in terms of consequences. But tbh in my experience simply separating two children who aren't working well next to one another sorts the problem out.
It's not about "taking the easy option," pusslet, as various teachers on here have attempted to explain. Classrooms don't run as they used to be 20 years ago, where everyone sat in set rows for everything and the "naughty ones" got moved to the back it they played up.
When I seat children for a lesson - and bear in mind that I change seting arrangments lesson by lesson, and also day by day - my primary concern is 'where do children need to be in order to make progress'.
Sometimes that will be 'with an adult'. Sometimes it will be 'with a partner of similar ability'. Sometimes it will be 'with someone they don't usually work with'. Sometimes it will be 'with a fully mixed ability group'. Sometimes it will be with an individual who has a similar strength or a similar problem with the work done on the previous day, so that when I am providing support or differentiated work or differentiated equipment, it can be used efficiently. Sometimes it genuinely doesn't matter, because it is individualised work, but it helps if they are away from a child with whom they chat all the time...
Because part of the point is that a child who may be disruptive in one environment / with a particular partner may cause no problem at all if moved to sit elsewhere. 'Dealing with the problem' may be exactly synonymous with 'swapping places with another child'. I have recently moved a child who was disruptive - chatty, low level fidgeting with equipment - when next to a particular person. Swapped to move away from that person - completely changed behaviour.
I would also agree that, practically speaking, I have exactly the same number of chairs as children. If part or all of the solution to a child who is chatty, not focusing, simply not a good fit where they are (they may be bored and need more challenge, or avoiding work that is too hard and need more adult support) is to move to a different place, musical chairs is the inevitable result!
>>will just have to go with the teachers judgement
>OP, I love you!
I'm hoping that was irony! :-)
"If the disruptive child is moved, where is he/she moved to? In my class, to move one child I would have to move another so the first has somewhere to sit, I don't have spare seats dotted around the room . One moves, we all move!"
Depends on the school, I suppose, but I still think the school should be dealing with the problem child and not taking the easy option by moving the ones who don't cause problems. Seems obvious to me...
If the disruptive child is moved, where is he/she moved to? In my class, to move one child I would have to move another so the first has somewhere to sit, I don't have spare seats dotted around the room . One moves, we all move!
will just have to go with the teachers judgement
OP, I love you!
If the children are sitting on the carpet, or lining up, and one is being disruptive or annoying those around him/her, then generally speaking it would be the instigator or trouble-maker who is moved. But their general working tables are different. There are more complex issues at play there, as has been described above.
I have to say I personally think if there is a disruptive child then THAT child needs to be dealt with. how they do this is up to them but one child shouldn't be allowed to disrupt the experience for everyone else and no the other children shouldn't be moved. IF that child is disruptive then they need to learn not to be.
Seems I'm the only one to disagree.
If one child has now disrupted two children who aren't themselves disruptive, I don't see why one of those two children should be moved off the table.
Yes, it's up to the teacher, but I think the expectation is that a teacher will make these decisions fairly and reasonably. How is moving the non-disruptive child off the table he is settled at fair or reasonable?
OP: I understand why you're upset about this.
How would you feel if your child came home and said that they had been moved from their table because the parent of the child next to them said that your son was disruptive? You'd be at the teacher demanding to know why other parents get to make decisions about your child.
You don't get to decide how the teacher manages any other student in the classroom. You didn't want your child sitting next to that child, so therefore it is your child that gets moved.
Think it is a normal part of life, being moved isn't punishment. If he is in year 2/3 + it is definitely something he just needs to get used to and built a bit of resilience over.
I can imagine my own DD would have been similarly upset about this, but I think pandering to her
(as I proabably did!) did her more harm than good and made her think she always has to get her own way and that every little thing was the end of the world. If I'd been a bit more chilled and nipped this kind of thing in a bud by putting a positive on it 'Oh, never mind, it is great you've got to move table your teacher obviously thinks you are really hard working and will do well on any table', then it would have been easier to stop my DDs wingey/dramatic behaviour later on in primary.
They sit in the same table and group for each lesson, they are not moved....I don't have a problem with mixing them up in fact like many if you say its a good lesson. My gripe was, is, why should he be moved.
Job share teachers are great, no problems there at all, he was moved today to another table whilst the said child had stayed where they usually sit ... A note today from teacher said it was because her friends are in the table...will just have to go with the teachers judgement
teacher has to juggle needs of many, OP.
It would be reasonable to explain your child is unsettled, but understand that he will move often in yrs to come. He will have to get used to it fairly soon.
They move ds1 all the time. Last time they had him sat next to the quietest girl, with the loveliest handwriting. To try and improve his handwriting. Teacher said. I was most impressed.
Sounds like you need to take a step back and let the teacher get on with organising her own classroom!
If he doesn't get to experience moving desk regularly and perceive it as normal then he won't settle . Does he normally respond badly to change ? Has he responded ok to a jobshare ?
In ds3's class they seem to move round every few weeks.
I move my children frequently. It does them good to work with different children. I have reading group seats/maths grouping seats/free choice partner work as well as a general 'normal' place.
I've had a parent make exactly the same complaint last year - that I'd moved the child being bothered by another child, not the child who was doing the bothering. They made their point clear, but I had to politely stick to my guns an explain that the best thing as far as the larger picture of where ALL the other children in the class were arranged was to move their child.
If nothing else, it stops the child being bothered by another child then being blamed by that child for being the cause of them being moved.
My class sit in different places for every lesson, and even in one lesson e.g. maths or english, may move between different groupings within the lesson. The idea of 'being on a table all the time since September' is just alien to me....
What tinytalker said, although my class sit on different tables for different things, so they rarely get "stuck" with the same person next to them for long.
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