Lies and deceit from 12yr old DS - what to do?

[Dotty342kids]

I have a 12yr old DS. Essentially a really good kid with sensible morals. However, he really struggles to resist temptation of any sort and then of course, knowing that whatever he did was wrong, attempts to cover it up (badly!).
Ongoing examples are:
During the last year when he has money on his school canteen account for a hot lunch - he often buys the exact things I tell him (every week!) not to eg. bacon rolls / squash drinks / cakes rather than an actual hot lunch. Despite repeated conversations about why I want him to actually buy a hot lunch, rather than junky snacks he just can't seem to resist the lure of them.
His friends often watch films which myself and DH feel are very unsuitable for their age. Ted being a prime example - and one that we've been explicitly clear about him not being allowed to watch. Checked tablet the other day, and he'd clearly been watching it.
He's recently been given his dad's old ipod just for music, as he'd lost his own mp3 player a while back. He's installed various apps for FB, his emails etc on there without discussing with us first (we'd have said no as he has these on his tablet and the ipod was agreed as solely being for music).
In the last week we went to get something out of his tennis bag and found a pocket stuffed with sweet wrappers / empty crisp bags - again showing that he's secretly buying this stuff, knowing he shouldn't be.
Went to bed the other night, with all tablets etc downstairs as normal. In the morning his wasn't there. When I woke him up he confessed that he'd woken in the night and couldn't get back to sleep and went and got it so that he could "read". There are books on his bedside table! Again, doing something he knows he's not allowed to.

When challenged about any of these behaviours he just shuts down and says he doesn't know either why he does them! I know they're not major in themselves, but I worry about the behaviour itself - the doing of things he knows he shouldn't and the attempts to cover it up - as much as anything else.
DH and I have decided to enforce a complete gadget ban next week, once he's back from the grandparents, as punishment for the behaviour. And we're going to insist of having passwords for his instagram and FB accts (only agreed to him having FB 2 weeks ago as we felt he was pretty trustworthy online!) so that we can check them regularly.

Any other tips or advice though, really would be welcome as I'm really worrying about the trouble he might find himself in when more risky temptations come his way in the coming years.

[JiltedJohnsJulie]

Can I suggest that he has packed lunches. Isn't he a bit young for a FB account?

[ImperialBlether]

One thing I noticed about my son when he was that age was that he was constantly starving - for a couple of years he nearly doubled what he was eating. He was always thin and didn't put on any fat, but he grew six inches in one school year so obviously needed the extra calories. He'd almost be beside himself with hunger at times. Maybe your son is going through a growth spurt and this is why he's eating more than normal?

[Dotty342kids]

Re. the FB account. He's 5 months off being 13 and is years "late" joining FB in comparison with his peers so we did think carefully and talked with him about it before going through the registration process with him

He has packed lunches 4 out of 5 days but the day he has a hot lunch is because he has various clubs after school that make cooking and eating a hot tea a bit of a logistical nightmare, hence the hot lunch.

Imperial I have wondered about that, and I don't mind him eating lots, as long as it's not lots of crap and hidden from us!

[BertrandRussell]

Do you think you might be being a bit strict? He's not doing anything particularly awful, surely?

My ds never wants to get a sit down lunch at school because there's no time to do anything else once he's queued up for it. How about coming to a deal that if he has something like a bacon roll for lunch he has to have some fruit as well?

[BertrandRussell]

And there's no particular reason why you have to have a hot meal every day!

[BertrandRussell]

Sorry- me again! Why can't he have apps on the iPod?

[Berthatydfil]

It seems to me he is being much like most 12 year olds.
I can't see he's done anything do terrible and find some of your rules a bit difficult to understand.
So I think you are being much too strict and Ott in your punishment.

[LynetteScavo]

I think your DS would get on fantastically with my DS (but they'd probably get into lots of mischief together )

If DS doesn't make good choices at the school canteen, it's back to packed lunches. Complete with celery and carrot sticks.

We turn off internet at pm.

I haven't found a solution to the sweets, apart from insisting on very good teeth brushing and lots of exercise. If DS has money he has earned and access to a shop sweets will be purchased. Lots, and lots of sweets and Twix and donuts. It's amazing how much sugar you can purchase for very little money.

The lying is because he doesn't want to get told off...probably normal in a 12 yo. My DS would also lie about eating loads of crap, but hide all the evidence in his under bed drawer.

My 12yo doens't want FB, but I know form DS1 that if you don't allow it with monitoring, they will just set it up without telling you. DS1 did it using his Nintendo DS, and we only found out completely by chance.

Also, I know my DS really wants to watch Ted, and knows about it through friends. For all I know he probably has, but would probably deny it if I ask him. Wait, I just did, he smirked and shyly admitted it. Probably at a grandparents house.

I think these at 12yo they are getting their first taste of freedom, and it must seem like a lot of fun.

[JiltedJohnsJulie]

OP are you coming back?

[ClareDeLune]

He wants a bit of control in his life. He's growing up and is feeling like he can make his own decisions. Because there's such a lot he can't do because of your rules, he will do it anyway and then lie so he won't get into trouble.

He's almost 13, let him choose his own lunch and only serve good stuff at home. It's only five meals out of 21 (based on 3 meals a day).

Ted - while I wouldn't necessarily want my 13 yr old watching it, I accept they they probably will. I'm sure most teens who watch it haven't turned out to be drug taking losers who talk to their toys.

You say he struggles to resist temptation - they're not huge temptations anyway (sweets and films) - is there any mileage in not enforcing these (minor) rules now so that you can put your foot down when there are bigger issue later?

[Dotty342kids]

I'm here
Really interesting to read all your views. I really don't think we're that strict so it's intriguing that that's how we're coming across! It hadn't occurred to me that finding things he's hiding from us, and being cross that he's sneaking downstairs and going online in the middle of the night might be seen as ok behaviours

I see your point claredelune, about not fighting the small battles, but on the other hand, I worry that if we let these small lies and behaviours slide, that they'll escalate into bigger ones.

[SenecaFalls]

I think punishment in this case is OTT. I would sit down and discuss the issues with him and maybe come up with some compromises for the future. He wants more control over his life and, at this age, that is completely normal.

[ClareDeLune]

Actually I agree. The one thing I'd be cross about here is that he sneaked downstairs and got his tablet. Crossing a boundary there and I think you are right to enforce a gadget ban for a week for that particular incident.

The other stuff he's doing because you're being unnecessarily strict about small matters (bacon roll instead of stew and veg). Honestly, pick your battles. Wait until he wants to play CoD or GTA like all of his other mates, if you've been strict about other (small) stuff then he's not even going to discuss the like of this with you and do it anyway, completely without your knowledge. Then you've lost any battle you might want to have with him. Keep avenues for discussion open at this age and that'll help hugely when he's a less communicative teenager. As they get older they are more easily able to cover their tracks.

Might I suggest that instead of you "laying down the law" on these small issues, you tell him these are the choices you'd like him to make, but it's up to him if he doesn't. By giving him some control you may find he is better able to make good choices. Let him watch Ted and the like, because it's not as bad as other things he could watch, where you would have to put your foot down. Essentially what I'm saying is there will be times you have to say (and mean) no, but let those times be few and far between in order to preserve the relationship and encourage discussion rather than put a barrier up.

It's difficult but at some point you have to let go and let them make crap decisions. You're still at a stage where you can make good food at home, restrict sweets etc at home so perhaps what he's doing isn't so bad in the bigger scheme of things.

[Dotty342kids]

Thanks for all your comments.
DH and I had good chat about this last night whilst DS was at grandparents. I think you're right in that these aren't, on their own, major issues, but at the same time, he needs to learn that lying and doing things we've expressly told him not to isn't acceptable behaviour.
So, this week there will be a ban on gadgets until 5pm each day and we're going to ensure that from now on, gadgets are left outside his bedroom at night. Plus we're going to make sure that we have the passcode for his tablet to that we can sporadically check his social media accounts and browsing history. Not constantly, but from time to time! Until we're sure that he's using his new FB account responsibly and isn't viewing things that he shouldn't be!

And yes, I may have to accept that I can't stop the bad food habits. I'll just have to stuff him with fruit and veg at home

[maybebabybee]

I think you are being a bit OTT personally. Teens will watch things that aren't suitable to keep up with their friends. It's normal. I remember watching one of the scream films at a sleepover when I was about 12. My Mum wouldn't have wanted me to see it , obviously, but what was I going to do - say sorry, mum won't let me watch it? Would have been social suicide!

[ggirl]

He sounds exactly like my ds.
Don't sweat the small stuff .Agree with the advice given already.

[gamerchick]

There is a lot of not allowed to dos in your posts. He's 12, puberty has hit and he's growing up. He needs to feel as through he has some control in his life and you need to recognise that he's leaving childhood behind and entering that horrible middle phase where being too strict can backfire and you end up with a nightmare on your hands.

Pick your battles, change your approach from I am the parent and you will do as you are told and that's the end of it to something else, whether it's giving choices or some other method so he feels as though he has some control when in reality his boundary has just been stretched a bit.

[landrover]

Still a bit meh at the fact that you went through the registration on Facebook with him, including lying about his age, I think thats worse than the other stuff! I know, as you say, you aren't the first or the last. It just seems wrong to teach him to lie! (sorry, only my opinion)

[Dotty342kids]

landrover I know exactly what you mean, it didn't sit comfortably with me either but I'd rather we did it together and looked at privacy settings etc, than he did it on his own and he didn't get that stuff in place.

When we talked to him last night he was pretty understanding of what we were saying and I think he was surprised we weren't inflicting any more severe a punishment
Without a reminder, his ipod was duly outside his bedroom door when we went to bed.

[BertrandRussell]

I really wouldn't try to control what he eats when out of the house- if the meals he eats at home are healthy the others don't matter that much.

[landrover]

Im sure he will turn out to be a lovely kid, and in ten years time you will wonder what you were worried about. I have a 12 year old girl, I just worry about her all the time! (Im sure thats not healthy!!!!)

[coffeeisnectar]

Stop trying to control what he eats out of the home. You won't ever achieve your aims but could cause food issues as well as him becoming secretive and binging on crap.

I've always told my kids if they do something wrong and lie about it, the purpose judgment for lying will be worse than the punishment for the wrong doing. I try really hard not to judge my 17 year olds choices in life, she has been making her own decisions, with guidance, since she was 13/14 such as bed times and clothing as well as food. I might not be happy about her food choices but I do have a good relationship with her and she is open and honest with me.

[Fannyupcrutch]

As a mum of teens I sympathise but will share something with you. At 12 years old you need to start allowing him to make his own decisions and then face the repercussions of his choices. At 11 years old he is closer to being a grownup than a child. This is where we need to start allowing them to develop into their own person.

I tried to force my teenage daughter conform and it went tits up, massively. She went from being a lovely friendly high achieving primary school kid to being a withdrawn 11 year old that wanted to fit in with her friends at senior school. I refused to allow her to eat crap, hang around on street corners etc and in reality, all she wanted to do was to fit in. Yes, I wanted a child that knew to make the correct decisions for their own health and well being.....the child that chose to follow the rules instead of rebelling. But what I got was a feisty child that knew their own mind, needed to belong within a group and test the limits of their rule breaking in a safe ish peer group. In fact, a girl just like me and what I was before I turned into a mum! I battled with her for 3 years and it almost destroyed my family. At age 15 I agreed defeat and she and her dad moved out of the family home into a flat of their own. This was done to try and salvage my marriage and my relationship with my daughter.

It is barely working. She sees me as a naggy enemy that is trying to rein her in 24-7 despite the fact that she starts driving lessons this month! In hindsight , I should have given her the freedom to make her choices and face the consequences and rely on the fact that I had a sane level headed daughter for 11 years and she would have easily learned in that 11 years how to ask for help, how to bounce back etc. But instead I ruined our relationship while fighting for control over her, control that I had no right too. And she only comes to my house to visit my parrot or to ask for lifts or money now. Hopefully our counselling will help but I doubt it, I'm waiting for the hormones to die down.

[NickiFury]

You're far too hard on him. Keep going like this and he will end up rebelling massively in a couple of years because to him it's like you're never happy so what's the point of even trying. That's how I felt and I had parents who overreacted massively just as you describe.