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December 2012 - the Christmas buns are coming out of the oven

(1000 Posts)
PurplePidjChickIsNotTheMessiah Sun 23-Dec-12 17:18:23

New fred...

Marking place...

PurplePidjChickIsNotTheMessiah Sun 23-Dec-12 17:25:31

Thanks pidj

spotty glad his cord is finally off. Ethan's came off at 5 days but never smelled. It's almost completely healed now at 2 weeks.

Going to do hand and foot prints today in his baby book!

Secondsop Sun 23-Dec-12 17:41:33

Marking my place.

brooke89 Sun 23-Dec-12 17:43:42

Marking place smile

Clarella Sun 23-Dec-12 17:48:56

Checking in. George has found his lungs and that he likes be permanently attached to the boob today (tired grin)

Clarella ds has also found his lungs and has turned into a right grump confused

WillYuleDoTheFandango Sun 23-Dec-12 18:04:48

Jamie's super quiet at the minute. It was quite a shock to be woken at 1am by him screaming the house down for the first time! I went in to find both he and DP covered in vomit. It was coming out if his nose sad Think he'd been a bit over zealous with the feeding as he'd not had much in the day, poor thing

Bellaboo123 Sun 23-Dec-12 18:17:43

Marking my place

stacey silly question but what sort of paint are you using? We were thinking about doing prints but scared of painting the baby!

I used poster paints grin comes off with a baby wipe


I think I'm losing my milk out of one of my boobs blush it's always had a bit less but seems to be dropping more. An doing all I'm supposed to do but doesn't seem to help and don't know if there'll be anyone around to ask this week

I think the breastfeeding helplines will be open? I'm often sure my boobs are empty as they never feel full but ds seems ok (not today though, he's being a right grump!)

Afrodizzywonders Sun 23-Dec-12 19:38:06

Honey, are you sure the supply is going down? I remember last time with DS that the engorgement drops and your boobs feel soft even though they are making plenty of nilk.

PurplePidjChickIsNotTheMessiah Sun 23-Dec-12 19:51:18

Honey, i leak loads blush thankfully not had any wet patches yet! My right - which is still sensitive - gets engorged quicker than the left but he gets full from either and only occasionally wants a second side

There's def less in one. I'm going to try pumping it in the morning and see how much I get. Why is this so complicated?

WillYuleDoTheFandango Sun 23-Dec-12 20:13:30

Honey I have less in my right boob. I've super pumped it today and managed to boost the output a little. Do you usually start with the other side maybe?

emilyeggs Sun 23-Dec-12 20:18:49

Just marking my place for when I hopefully can join you all. Feels like your babies will have started school by the time that comes sad

leobear Sun 23-Dec-12 20:35:34

Hello, joining from the ante-natal thread. Sophie born on Thursday night, after a super-fast labour. All going well so far - but feeling quite overwhelmed today, keep having "Oh my God, how can I manage 2 children" moments. Suspect it may be day 4 blues coming on - just blubbed uncontrollably at The Snowman blush

WillYuleDoTheFandango Sun 23-Dec-12 20:41:38

Aw it'll happen Emily s/he can't stay in there forever! I feel like it's all whizzing by way too fast. sad

WillYuleDoTheFandango Sun 23-Dec-12 20:44:28

Hi Leo congratulations. I'm well into baby blues just had a big sob to DP about how this is the happiest time of my life and nothing will ever be so special again. Bloody hormones!

Checking in
Congratulations leo welcome Sophie
Also have a v unhappy baby today. And a 'challenging' DD1. B haschanged from a content baby who sleeps 95% of the time to a crabby one who's hung off my boob/cried most the day.

Feel a lot better on hearing others boobs have deflated a bit as mine feel squishy today (maybe as not been given a chance to fill?!) had bad night last night with her so prob explains my sob today hmm
Doesn't help DP is out 'wetting the baby's head' for the 2nd time this weekend. angry

Secondsop Sun 23-Dec-12 22:10:11

Welcome leo and congratulations. Crying at the Snowman is completely normal behaviour at any time !

I shouldn't read books about breastfeeding confused it's made mr panic that our latch isn't right (it's not the best but works for us) and he's not getting enough milk (which is obv rubbish as we have 8+ wet and dirty nappies a day!). It doesn't help that my boobs are all squishy which is convincing me there's no milk in them hmm why is this feeding stuff full of unknowns?!

Honey I'm just using the kids art paint, same as spotty it all comes off with baby wipes! Lol

Afrodizzywonders Sun 23-Dec-12 22:22:36

Hi leo, I had a week of tears panicking how i'd cope with a newborn and toddler! Thankfully that has passed, things have settled and feeling really happy now, its just really daunting isn't it. DP, myself and the childn went out today and it was challenging, DS walks everywhere, i had DD in a sling....hiw will i manage the two on my own was all I could think.

CODwidow Sun 23-Dec-12 22:36:11

Just marking my place grin

ellliebelle Sun 23-Dec-12 23:03:53

leo oliver was born on thursday morning and i have been very teary today sad going ti upload a pic of him now smile after 2 dd's i still cant believe i have a son

Secondsop Sun 23-Dec-12 23:07:34

Oh huge congratulations elllie!

brooke89 Sun 23-Dec-12 23:19:58

Welcome leo and ellie and congrats on LOs

I have a question re breastfeeding - my boobs have never got hard since my milk came in and I thought they were supposed to get hard every now and then when milk was being produced? In the day Isla feeds roughly every 2 hours but from 7 she is constantly on the boob... She's just been on me for over 2 hours and I had to take her off cause my nipples were hurting so I gave her 3oz of formula (After failed attempt at expressing) and she's guzzled it down?? If she was getting milk from me for the 2 hours she was on how could she possibly be hungry? I'm worried I'm not producing enough, mw said today she's only put on 30g since Wednesday? Is that normal weight gain, I thought it didn't seem much?

ellliebelle Sun 23-Dec-12 23:29:51

brooke not sure on the weight gain side of things but i know babies can cluster feed on an evening as a way of increasing supply.

Just added myself to stats and i have the biggest baby so far smile i think im still in shock from the dramatic birth which is part of tbe reason ive been so teary today but just managed to feed o on both sides and pop himnin moses basket so hoping for some sleep now smile also got bed to myself as poor dh has had to go to asda to do our xmas food shop which was supposed to be delivered yestetday but never arrived sad

Hope everyone has a good night im sure ill be back soon up nursing

soandsosmum Sun 23-Dec-12 23:40:55

My dd has been cluster feeding tonight. My boobs never get v hard Brooke. Weight gain wise it depends how old the baby is and what your HV is like. Mine hadn't regained birth weight at 12 days but HV wasn't worried. She said to give it another week. I've a friend who was put under a lot of pressure to give formula top up as baby hadn't regained birth weight by 2 wks sad

WillYuleDoTheFandango Sun 23-Dec-12 23:44:54

Congratulations Ellie

Congratulations Ellie welcome Leo grin
I have not had my boob free for more than 5 mins since tea time, this is ridiculous. I am losing the will to live she's been cluster feeding all day and she's not really slept.

I don't know much about weight gain etc, you could well be producing enough milk, my boobs haven't been hard since this feeding upped. Still having wet/dirty nappies so I'm telling myself she must be feeding from it. Can you hear swallowing?

Am wondering whether or not she's just greedy.. Regained birth weight by day 7...

brooke89 Mon 24-Dec-12 00:16:03

Maybe I'm just being paranoid then, I wish a note popped out after a feed saying how much milk she'd just had haha I think I'm just overly worrying about quantities!

Just on my way to tescos to do Christmas food shop! DP thinks I'm mad but seeings as I have a nocturnal baby it makes perfect sense wink

Tonight DH took Ethan as I was knackered and he was still awake. God I needed it! Up and feeding now.

pmgkt Mon 24-Dec-12 04:09:27

Hi. My boobs hurt!

Felix still had 5oz to gain to reach his birth weight at 2wks, formula was mentioned once at his 5day weigh in, but only as a last resort. We have another weigh in booked at 3wks and realistically he should have gained that 5oz by then. Don't let it panic you Brooke, if they are concerned they will discus a feeding plan with you (Felix was fed 3hourly round the clock with ebm top ups)

First night I haven't set my alarm for feeds and he slept from 23.00 until 03.55, lovely stretch of sleep!

spicegirl13 Mon 24-Dec-12 04:36:57

DD2 born at 9.39pm last night, been feeding constantly since then! Not sure if my boobs are actually even producing anything yet?! confused

Bellaboo123 Mon 24-Dec-12 04:47:13

Congrats Ellie and Spice!!!

Brooke we had a similar evening and in the end I face Aurelia 3oz of formula top up she then slept from 1145 to 4...bliss...I feel like a new woman! While she was breast feeding I actually checked that milk was still coming out and it was - we have hungry babies!

Bellaboo123 Mon 24-Dec-12 04:47:35

Gave not face!!!

Afrodizzywonders Mon 24-Dec-12 04:50:10

The constant feeding is the bubs increasing your milklsupply, just go with it. I breastfed my DS for 2 years exclusively, believe me, the constant feeding in the early days is normal, if you had no milk the baby would be getting. Dry annoyed!

Clarella Mon 24-Dec-12 05:57:23

congratulations Ellie and spice!

although not 'nice' to hear everyone having same 'baby suddenly Mr grumpy pants and permanently attached to boob/ boob only thing that stops crying ' its reassuring!

I was told soft boobs have more of the hind milk in them so have settled in sync with baby's needs - then they'll cluster feed to stimulate supply when they need more. you could always express a little in the mornings to stimulate further and freeze it. I keep thinking I should do this to get some in the freezer in case I'm ever poorly and dh needs to do top ups? expressed bottles at mo appear to be totally pointless - he ends up screaming for a feed straight after! Im feeling there's a lot of attachment stuff going on at the moment.

do the crazy random sadness of baby blues go after day 10? I seem much better in the last couple of days, plus my section scar seems less sore and my core muscles feel slightly stronger - enough to sit up ok from lying down so might be that?

WeeJo08 Mon 24-Dec-12 06:14:45

Happy Christmas Eve everyone! Hope you're all not as disorganised as me?! Doesn't help that it's absolutely pouring today either! confused

We tried a new bedtime routine last night & I think it worked better. Instead of her staying in the living room with us up until her midnight feed, we put her down in the bedroom after her 9:30 one (finished just after 10). She slept until about 1am, got fed then, then she woke again at 2 but went down after until just after 5am. Think it worked quite well...but this could obviously all change!!

Congratulations & welcome to the new babies! grin

itsallinmyhead Mon 24-Dec-12 06:18:18

Hi all, just found this thread.

Been up all night with snuffly Jude, who is 19 days old. Poor little man is poorly and wants to just lie on me, hence me being awake all night.

Bellaboo123 Mon 24-Dec-12 08:07:57

Welcome itsallinmyhead hope Jude gets better soon!

Weejo we've been doing something similar...HV suggested leaving Moses in bedroom and when she sleeps put her in her basket upstairs in bedroom, it does seen to work a bit better...for now - I've probably gone and jinxed it lol!

Happy Christmas Eve...can't believe it's Christmas...rushes off in panic...

yuletopian99 Mon 24-Dec-12 08:17:29

Just marking place for when i get to join you (i hope!! - seems like it'll never happen sometimes!)

Argh I have so much to do today and I'm soooo tired!

MaMaPo Mon 24-Dec-12 09:20:25

Here you all are! I got briefly lost. And welcome to all the new arrivals.

Went out yesterday for very spicy lunch (Sichuanese food) and maybe it's my imagination but Little C seems to be a bit more fidgety and stretchy, trying to fart/poo. Hoping very much it's not the influence of chili in my milk. She looks so uncomfortable, poor wee thing!

Off to make her a proper person this morning! She's going to have 5 names - first name, middle name, and then 3 family names (will only use the last one on day to day basis). Seems quite a lot for such a small person.

RudolphTheRedNosedGiraffe Mon 24-Dec-12 09:30:43

Hi all, hope everyone's doing well. Not sure if I'll have time to follow this thread judging by how things are going so far, though it would be nice. But I just wanted to let you know, we had a beautiful baby girl on Thursday night, 9lb 4oz, very fast delivery following the induction! Tired but doing well.

Congratulations giraffe!

WeeJo08 Mon 24-Dec-12 09:54:54

Congratulations Giraffe & BabyGiraffe! grin Hope you're feeling good x

ISpyDingDongMerrilyOnHigh Mon 24-Dec-12 09:58:01

Just checking in to the new thread - will try and keep up a bit more this time grin.

Secondsop Mon 24-Dec-12 10:11:59

Morning all, and congratulations on the new babies! giraffe I also had a rapid delivery after the induction - hope you are recovering well.

Urgh, how the hell do you get them to open their bloody fists for hand prints?! Am resorting to trying to do it when he's asleep. If that doesn't work I give up!!

kate2boysandabump Mon 24-Dec-12 12:30:54

Just managed to catch up and find you all again.

I'm waiting in for the midwife. Ds3 hadn't gained any weight when she weighed him on Friday so she's coming to check him again. Have tried to feed him up all weekend and try not to stress about it too much. He seems happy enough and I was ill for a time which probably didn't help. Fingers crossed he's gained today.

So I''m stuck in on my own as the others have gone out to get on with Christmas stuff sad I'm just hoping she comes before it's time for church. I really don't want to miss it.

Merry Christmas to all have lovely days tomorrow with your newly grown families smile

Clarella Mon 24-Dec-12 12:36:14

lol stacey - I cut nails when he's feeding.... try then?! messy!

congratulations giraffe!

I love my doctor! just rang as running out of pain killers and mw said can get lansinoh on prescription so thought if I asked today it could be there for thurs (running out already!) and she totally reviewed all the pain killers (diclofenac not best for bf) plus those lovely peppeemint pills for wind etc plus lansinoh plus okayed proctosydl (best for piles) AND faxed it all through to the local chemist fir me to pick up this afternoon! I'm going to be a new woman! who rattles somewhat

Clarella Mon 24-Dec-12 12:39:14

and got George in the moby sling very happily - tummy seemed to cope at mo if sitting (actually a massive bonus) and walking though can't do anything else yet except stuff my face so that'll be good for tomorrow grin

FriendofDorothy Mon 24-Dec-12 13:22:11

The midwife has been to visit and has signed us off. Edward lost 2 oz off his birth weight when he was weighed last but has now put on a massive 5oz so he is 3oz up on birth weight. It would seen that my milk is good stuff for a growing baby! Also, he only woke up once last night which was fantastic.

In other news about my nether region, the health visitor also visited today and she seems to think that I may have vulval variscosities. She knew lots about them because she also had them after she had a baby - fortunately this is a health visitor I know well from work and she and I can talk about absolutely anything.

She agreed they are more painful than anything else, including childbirth, and there is not much I can do about them other than recline as much as possible to take the weight off my pelvic area and to take anti-inflammatories and painkillers. She reckons that it took a good 2-3 weeks to stop hurting. Bugger!
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PurplePidjChickIsNotTheMessiah Mon 24-Dec-12 13:33:06


Stats list bump smile wonder if we'll get any Jesuses tomorrow?!

PurplePidjChickIsNotTheMessiah Mon 24-Dec-12 13:33:38
itsallinmyhead Mon 24-Dec-12 13:39:25

Thanks for the warm welcome!

Midwife has just been here too. She told me to get the gp to make a home visit as there have been a few babies diagnosed with pneumonia recently and she didn't want Jude going out in this weather....cue call to surgery and despite my insistence, as well as relaying the midwives instructions, gp refuses to come, so Jude will need to go out after all.

I don't expect the baby to have more than a cold and a high temp but all the same, I'm bloody fuming!

Had to get that off my chest.

I can't add to the stats list as I'm on my phone...

Ouch FoD I feel for you. I found the gel (preparation h?) quite soothing for that with dd (I don't know if it's recommended or not confused)

Secondsop Mon 24-Dec-12 22:18:58

Hello, as I'm sure tomorrow will be hectic for all of us I just wanted to get in now to wish you all a wonderful Christmas with your beautiful babies. This forum has been such a support and comfort to me in what has been simultaneously the hardest and most amazing time of my life.

brooke89 Mon 24-Dec-12 22:29:51

Second what seconds has said... Thank you everyone for all the support smile have a merry Christmas everyone!!! x x

WeeJo08 Mon 24-Dec-12 22:56:57

What a lovely message, seconds! Totally agree, thank you everyone, for support, encouragement, laughs & advice. Have a lovely first Christmas with your squidgy, scrunchy, beautiful babies...enjoy the forbidden foods from pregnancy! (And maybe a cheeky glass of something fizzy!) grin

Congrats to all new babies!! Happy Christmas everyone!

Merry Christmas everyone! Have a great time!

Bellaboo123 Tue 25-Dec-12 02:59:12

Great message seconds and totally agree...! Has been a fab support group both during pregnancy and more so now we've got our little ones.

Merry christmas everyone x

Bellaboo123 Tue 25-Dec-12 03:00:47

Omg aurelia was just feeding in my arms and having a break and little just scream really loudly and high pitch...I nearly jump out my skin...it was as though she was testing what noises she cld make...woke DP up lol...anyone else had this!!!

Hope all are having a fantastic Christmas. I've been very spoilt- DH got me a relaxation kit of bubble baths, chocolate, body butter, body scrub and the promise of looking after Dash while I make use of them! Dash got me an early edition of one of my favourite books. Very spoilt mummy!

WillYuleDoTheFandango Tue 25-Dec-12 17:35:30

Merry Christmas everyone smile, hope everyone is having a relaxing day with your lovely babies. I list mine to an endless game of pass the parcel about an hour ago hmm I'm about to snatch him back in a moment!

WillYuleDoTheFandango Tue 25-Dec-12 17:35:50

Lost not list

Argh we have green poo...

SeymoreInOz Tue 25-Dec-12 22:30:07

Merry Christmas everyone!

Congratulations to all the new arrivals. I wonder if we've had any Christmas day babies!

Thanks for all the advice on baths, I thought it was different to what I remembered. Anyway I had a lovely bath this morning (boxing day here) and it was nice to lean back and not be squashed by my bump!

Christmas day was hard work for us. DS has a cold and his bum was still v raw so he was extremely grumpy. Between 7am and 3pm he slept for 20 mins and spent the rest of the time crying. We muddled through it though and the DCs were distracted by their new toys. His bum seems a bit better today after our trip to the GP on Monday. He's still pooing all the time though. We got through 50 nappies in a day and a half!

Spotty DD used to do green poo a lot, DS hasn't done one yet though. I could never figure out what caused it but she always seemed quite unsettled beforehand.

We have lots of poo to seymore I was told green poo can mean too much foremilk? It's the first one though so will just keep an eye on it...

Ds won't settle tonight and dp is asleep next to me sad

spotty I hope ds settles for you soon.

Well today hasn't been too bad. We got to bils almost on time, I have him ds when we arrived and he cuddled for around half hour. Mil (the amazing baby hog) was busy preparing dinner so ds slept and fed happily. We did presents and then dinner, Mil kept saying 'I still haven't had a cuddle I will in a minute'. After dinner ds fed straight away and mil went out of a cigarette angry when she came back in she tried to hint for me to hand him over but I ignored it, then got 'can't you take a hint?' spat at me! shock I asked her to wash her hands first and she took offence and stropped while cleaning the kitchen! hmm About half hour later I said to dd 'I'll show you such and such while nanny has a cuddle' mil didn't respond, so DH said 'mum I think you're getting ds' and she snapped 'apparantly so!' hmm wtf?! She then spent the rest of the day hinting that I should put him in his Moses basket rather than cuddle him (to the extent of taking him off of DH 'for a cuddle' and within 5 minutes was celebrating that ds was asleep in his Moses basket) tbh I couldn't give a fuck of I cuddle him too much. He's 17 days old and he's MY BABY!!!

Sorry for that epic rant and I salute you if you managed to get through all that! Other than that we had a lovely day. Just going to bed and tomo morning we have to drive home to hand big dcs to their dad until sat morning.

Secondsop Tue 25-Dec-12 23:36:43

Hello all, hope you had lovely days. We had a really nice first Christmas with Zachariah - my family came over and my sister did most of the cooking. There was a lot of baby hogging - we were skyping my husband's parents (who live abroad) when my family arrived and my family each tried to take the baby while we were still on the Skype! My poor inlaws won't even meet him till next year and they nearly had ther Skype time cut short too!

Argh Stacey I would have made her change her top too!

I feel bad for saying it but I hate the whole feeding for comfort it makes me angry because I just want to sleep! I don't feel I could bed share safely so that's not an option for us.

Can I join? I was briefly part of the antenatal threads but lost track!

Baby Lily was born on the 19th weighing 8lb 3oz by elcs. I think she's wonderful!

WillYuleDoTheFandango Wed 26-Dec-12 00:16:03

Ugh Stacey as if you'd allow dirty smoky hands on your beautiful baby? My MiL pulled a classic - she kissed DS all over and then said I didn't sleep at all last night. This cold is killing me I can't even breathe! angry why would you do that?

DS is very unsettled after a couple of days of being handled by everyone. I just want to hibernate and keep him all to myself. I understand that everyone loves a newborn but seriously he's not a dolly.

Yay we've had a break through! DS (tongue tie) is taking the bottle much better today. The catalyst? A dummy! It seems to have taught him how to suck. I was hoping to breastfeed but getting any food into him is the most important thing right now!

willyule I'm so glad ds is eating better. As long as he gets fed one way or another, nothing else matters! Well done for getting as far as you did. I gave up bf with much less reason with dd and ds1. You've done amazingly well!

spotty see I thought I was being very lenient, I don't think mil saw it like that.

I had a chat with DH when he came to bed to check he didn't think I held ds too much and he said I'm a protective mum and he's happy ds has got me. Phew, aa long as me and DH are on the same page mil can go fuck herself tbh!

Oh and welcome back state

Welcome back state smile

Well we had an awful night and ds has been wanting to feed every hour and not settling so I'm on the sofa with him in just a nappy and my top off. Have been feeding him for an hour, is this the right thing to do? I'm wondering if my supply is low?

spotty my dd had a night like that, I did the same, made a nest on the sofa and let her have free access, she's now snoozing in the crib (first time upstairs away from me but I was showering/getting dressed etc then didn't want to disturb her) I keep going to check her. I don't think its supply issues just a bit of cluster feeding in response to a more chaotic and noisy house.

willyule my ds was like that, a dummy really helped him to feed more efficiently, he struggled to even suck a bottle thanks to a tongue and liptie. I felt like I was forcing it into him, but he soon got there at around 4wks I think, he's 5 now and just as fit and healthy as my bfed dd, he's pretty damn clever too smile

How's everyones older dcs coping with the new additions? My big ones are 4 and 5 and I'm not sure if its christmas/no school or Lily but they are being very challenging!

Had my staples out today (c section) and now feel like I can move, the relief was instant.

spotty I think you're doing the right thing. He's probably growing and trying to boost your supply (not that it's likely to be low, more that he's just needing more now). Ethan did this the other day, it felt like he was constantly on the boob. And now I'm leaking occasionally again do he must have boosted my supply.

Enjoy your skin to skin, try not to worry I think it's completely normal.

I got DH into the wrap sling today and sent him out for a walk with his dad, brother and Ethan. Very sweet seeing the 3 generations going for a stroll. [sappy emoticon]

I hope everyOne is enjoying the Christmas season!

I wouldn't mind but we've got to go to MIL's in a bit! Also we were home all day yesterday with no visitors so he shouldn't be unsettled. Might keep him in the sling at MIL's!

I had Lily in the sling yesterday so I could wash up and do lego with ds, and she slept for ages.

pmgkt Wed 26-Dec-12 13:30:18

Hi guys. Edward arrived on the 20th after I spent 2 weeks in hospital. All fine. So day 5 and my boobs are still hard, not so bad after he has fed but still not soft as I remember. Is this normal.

I think I will start using it more indoors. Plus roll stop all the family getting their grubby mitts on him wink

Dd has settled down a lot with Felix in the last week she seems used to him now and his crying grin she still tries to wake him though and always steals his blanket hmm

I think so pmgkt mine were hard until gone two weeks but I was expressing exclusively for a week and a half... They will probably settle down soon

My boobs still go hard, especially at night when it's been a while between feeds. Having a fussy day today, think he had too much attention for the last 2days and just wants to be cuddled. I'm sure one day of frequent cuddling wont do any damage!

My faulty boob seems to be working again after a few days of expressing and massage smile
Am still worried that we're not really getting eye contact much - not even during feeding as he just gazes at the boob. Is this normal?

honey he's a boy they just love the boob! grin I think it's normal, what's his adjusted age?

Adjusted is 2 weeks now. He does love boob. I am sick of the nipple tweak he's mastered though!

WillYuleDoTheFandango Wed 26-Dec-12 17:18:40

Thanks State and welcome back. He's like a new boy! He wakes himself every 2.5 hours like clockwork wanting his dummy. He sucks it for 30 mins, then spits it out and guzzles down his 2oz. I've now got the breast feeding consultants stalking me and I still haven't decided whether to persevere or if it's all too much. Think I'll ask to speak to someone tomorrow and talk it through confused

How awake are all the babys? Lily occasionally has a half hour awake but mainly its eat sleep blink through being changed and repeat, I can't really remember much from the big two and was wondering if I should try and keep her awake at all?

WillYuleDoTheFandango Wed 26-Dec-12 17:44:06

Jamie (10days) is awake a little bit more now State. He hates being changed so will be awake for that and will wake up 30-60 mins before each feed. He's zonked as soon as he finishes it though, if not during.

honey I think that is completely normal then. Ethan is 18days now. He doesn't do eye contact but does look at me/boob/tv. He has also started grabbing my nipple, it's great fun! <wince>

state Ethan is 18 days and is now staying awake for 30-45 minutes once or twice a day. We just came back from bils house and earlier bil turned round and said 'they really do just eat sleep and poo don't they?'. And yet me and DH have been commenting on how much more awake he is these days! Lol.

Thanks stacey we have just had our first smile grin

Oh wow, I can't wait for smiles! smile

Felix can easily be awake for 2-3 hours shock he follows me across the room and only makes eye contact with me not dp. He does only look at my boob when feeding though!

Obv when I say awake I mean awake and not feeding , he is awake for more than 45 minutes! Lol

Bellaboo123 Wed 26-Dec-12 20:48:42

Aurelia is awake for 45mins a couple of times a day. Definitely getting more alert.

We get smiles but how do you know they're smiles and not wind as everyone keeps bursting my bubble and telling me confused

She's so grizzly tonight hmm

Ime real smiles are much bigger than windy smiles and they will be looking at you grin

Secondsop Wed 26-Dec-12 20:54:11

I think for most of us smiles will take a bit longer - honeymum's boy is a few weeks older than everybody else.

We're getting more alertness and looking around as well now (Z will be 4 weeks tomorrow). We'll be taking him to the hv clinic - REALLY hope he's gained weight this time.

Yup, Dash is 9 weeks tomorrow so behind where he would be if he were on time bit doing well for almost 7 weeks early. smile

Up until about 5-6 weeks Dash was rarely awake other than feeding or screaming or being changed.

Bellaboo123 Wed 26-Dec-12 21:26:01

Is anyone using a dummy?

Urgh just leaked milk all over my duvet sad

Oh and a question to l who use slings, what do you do for coats? I want one that goes over me and ds but the 'baby wearing' coats are so expensive sad

bella Ethan has a dummy sometimes but it's hit and miss if he wants/needs it or not.

Bellaboo123 Wed 26-Dec-12 21:31:38

It's just aurelia was sucking on my finger so contented and I wondered if that's what's she's looking for and not always boob!

i woke up with a wet duvet the other day too and was running a bath and had dripping boob! Mmm nice!

I tend to give it if he's looking for boob but then not drinking iykwim. He normally only has it for 2-3 minutes before it pops back out but he doesn't cry for it again.

In the sling stacey Dash has his snowsuit then the fabric of the sling. I wear my coat but don't donut up. The sling fabric acts as an extra layer plus your body heat means that should bed all they need (as far as I understand)

My main thing is weather, I don't use umbrellas because they either break or I manage to attack random strangers with them in the street hmm so if it's raining he'd get wet. confused

Salukigirl Wed 26-Dec-12 21:55:26

I didn't expect to be in a December 2012 thread as DS wasn't supposed to be here until next year but he decided he wanted to be here for xmas after all so we got to meet him on 20/12/2012.
After 5 days in hospital as i haemorraged nearly 3 litres after a retained placenta we eventually got home for christmas.
this thread is great as I have been struggling with BF as he won't latch on, and it is reassuring that i'm not the only one.
I was also concerned about how little time he spends awake - enough to eat and complain about being changed/bathed.
Thanks for reassurance that he is pretty typical!!

MaMaPo Wed 26-Dec-12 21:59:39

I think I have discovered cluster feeding - little C has fed 8 times in the past 6 hours, when at this time she usually sleeps for stretches of 2-3 hours. I'm hoping it resolves soonish so I can go to bed - had a frantic few days, hosting 7 people for Christmas in our tiny flat, and my father in law having a small heart attack last night and causing lots of ruckus within the family for refusing to let us call for help. Eventually talked into it by GP friend over the phone, but it was awful - myhusband is an only child, who has just had his first child, so to see his dad being so cavalier and selfish with his health was anger-inducing and so sad. I want little C to have her grandfather around!

Sorry for the non-postnatal rant!

As for awake time - we have also noticed she's more alert and awake, for patches of 30-45 minutes. She's 3 weeks today.

Lilys had a dummy a couple of times, usually it makes her decide she needs a feed but yesterday she had it and dosed off on me so I could eat my dinner, not mastered one handed feeds yet.

Thanks for the reassurance re. Awake times. Typically Lily has been more awake this evening, but as I'm (slowly) remembering, no two days are the same!

Welcome saluki. Congratulations. When was DS due? My DS was due Dec 8th but turned up October 25th. If latching is a problem I'm a major advocate of nipple shields- scbu recommended them when my LO was having issues and they've helped so much. Doubt we'd still be exclusively BF without having used them sometimes.

stacey I never use umbrellas either. I'm with you on their rubbishness! Dash has a hat on and there's a good on his snowsuit if needs be but generally stays fairly dry just from being in the sling/under my chin! Admittedly I don't have other DCs to worry about/get to places so if its really bad we don't go out or I take the pram.

I think that's my problem honey as with school runs I have to go out regardless of the weather sometimes. And as the school is literally 300 meters from my house. But we'd still get soaked. I did get a cheap 'showerproof' jacket from primark the other day but I had to get an 18 to fit over ds and it is the least flattering thing I've ever seen. Was hoping to find a more stylish option. Oh I don't know!

Secondsop Wed 26-Dec-12 22:18:08

welcome saluki and congratulations!

bellaboo we use a dummy now and again to get Z to sleep if he wants the comfort of sucking to get to sleep - if he's crying but is well fed and keeps falling deep asleep within a few minutes of being on the boob, we try a dummy and it often instantly calms him. If he's actually hungry he won't take it.

Secondsop Wed 26-Dec-12 22:19:08

honey and stacey - re coats, rain etc - I am perilously close to getting a rainhat.

Bellaboo123 Wed 26-Dec-12 22:21:52

Seconds that's when she's needing a dummy...I'm going to try it.

Weigh in tomorrow!

Welcome saluki!

WillYuleDoTheFandango Wed 26-Dec-12 22:26:25

Bella I discovered the dummy yesterday when Jamie spent the entire day sucking his fist/sleeve. It seems to delay his feed to exactly every 3 hours and makes him take a bigger feed each time. At least I can take the dummy away eventually! He's not overly fussed most of the time but when he wants it he looks so content while sucking it.

Oh goodness Mama is your FiL okay?

Could you get Ethan a waterproof snowsuit stacey one with hood? I've found no matter how wet the outside feels they tend to stay quite snuggle and dry while we take the brunt of the rain!

I didn't realise you could get waterproof snowsuits. I'll look into it, thanks for the idea honey

Hope you find something smile

Have a look at JoJo Maman Bebe stacey they do tiny ones and have a sale on at the moment smile

WillYuleDoTheFandango Wed 26-Dec-12 22:49:24

For a cheaper option I got one from asda for £12. I know asda is a mumsnet nono but I don't care grin

Thanks you lot! willyule are the waterproof ones the spots ( girls) or cars (boys)?

Oo Jojo has a boys one in 0-3 in the sale for £24, tempting!

WillYuleDoTheFandango Thu 27-Dec-12 00:15:06

Yes and they have a quilted one that I bought here that's reduced to £7 and I think it would be waterproof (it's at least shower proof)

MaMaPo Thu 27-Dec-12 02:22:09

Feeding almost constantly since 4pm. Someone reassure me that I'll get some sleep eventually. Am going insane.

PurplePidjChickIsNotTheMessiah Thu 27-Dec-12 03:50:00

MaMa, I've had a couple like that. Check your latch, keep drinking and feed lying down if you can so you can doze!

In the stretchy, R wears his 2 indoor layers plus hat and bootees then we both wear dp's big skiing jacket which goes over us both. Not sure what we'll do when he's bigger! He's got a fleece sleepsuit for colder days.

MaMaPo Thu 27-Dec-12 05:13:32

It's a very long and lonely night here - little one just feeds furiously, settles for 6-10 mins, then fidgets, yells, squirms and is sick. Then cries for more food. 13 hours and counting. I could cry but don't know where to begin.

PurplePidjChickIsNotTheMessiah Thu 27-Dec-12 05:31:20

Do. Get it out of your system. Can someone bring you a cup of tea and some porridge? Brilliant comfort food smile

PurplePidjChickIsNotTheMessiah Thu 27-Dec-12 05:31:20

Do. Get it out of your system. Can someone bring you a cup of tea and some porridge? Brilliant comfort food smile

MaMaPo Thu 27-Dec-12 06:12:27

Just called my lovely mum in Australia - only time the time difference is actually helpful! She's so great but sadly there's a limit to what you can do so far away. Lots of lovely support though - has a bit of a cry, which is definitely also homesickness, making her ask if I had a c

MaMaPo Thu 27-Dec-12 06:14:59

A cold - I think she twigged when I told her I didn't!

Can't believe it's 6am - maybe will try putting her down one last time and seeing what happens. Then I might give it up as a bad idea and just keep holding her.

Thanks Pidj!

PurplePidjChickIsNotTheMessiah Thu 27-Dec-12 07:18:07

Any luck?

PurplePidjChickIsNotTheMessiah Thu 27-Dec-12 07:18:08

Any luck?

I think Dash is developing his first cold. It's making him so clingy. I need some sleep. Those of you who co-sleep how so I let him curl ip in bed with me for a bit safely?

Bellaboo123 Thu 27-Dec-12 07:22:59

Manapo Ifeel your pain I've had a few nights like that if it makes you feel any better. Just watch you'll put her down soon and she'll sleep for hours, if you can try and sleep too. It's most probably a growth spurt and should sort itself soon. Just cry it'll make you feel better! Hugs to you

MaMaPo Thu 27-Dec-12 07:37:58

Thanks everyone - she just slept for an hour which feels miraculous.

Sorry you had a bad night mama sad

Dd came in thinking it was morning at 3:30 and turned my lamp on which woke Felix only an hour after I'd put him down so he decided he was hungry again hmm

It's my due date today!

PurplePidjChickIsNotTheMessiah Thu 27-Dec-12 09:22:40

Co-sleeping off the top of my head: head at boob level, keep pillows away, duvet below your waist, position yourself on your side in a C shape around baby, DO NOT DRINK OR SMOKE

I got 5 hours out of R by putting him on his front, he's basically comfortable in the same position I am, on my right about 3/4 flat! Will try him in the crib when we get home tonight grin

WillYuleDoTheFandango Thu 27-Dec-12 09:27:33

In the past 15 minutes I have been violently vomited on, then peed all over. Ain't motherhood glamourous?

Thanks pidj. Might try that, although currently is having nothing except full on cuddles. DH is at work and I'm stuck in bed as he won't be out down. How bad a mummy am I if I put him in his basket and let him scream while I get dressed? confused

On a more positive note I've just uploaded a picture of him with his Christmas present from granny.

willyule I got a handful of poo on Christmas Day and Dash started Christmas Eve by weeing into his mouth! It really is all about the glamour!

WillYuleDoTheFandango Thu 27-Dec-12 09:29:27

Also Honey I was told to place my arm straight out in front of me to stop you from rolling over in the night

WillYuleDoTheFandango Thu 27-Dec-12 09:31:05

grin Honey

And it's fine to let him scream for a second, you'll go mad if you can never put him down!

I prob need 5 mins to get washed and dressed. Still ok? Or will I psychologically damage him for life?!

He will be fine smile

WillYuleDoTheFandango Thu 27-Dec-12 10:00:36

Save your sanity, cut yourself some slack, he'll be absolutely fine. I'm starving but am waiting for the midwife and DP is having his first lie in since Jamie was born! He's taken every 8 o'clock feed so far but has finally given in to his need for sleep grin

honey he'll be absolutely fine. You have to put them down sometimes however much they hate it!

I want to go to the sales today but I don't think DH is very happy with the idea! Lol

Today Ethan has managed a poosplosion and peed while I was changing his bum! Thankfully I hadn't yet removed the wet nappy and managed to 'catch' it.

Oh and Ethan will sleep in his Moses basket but not his crib. I have put the Moses basket in the crib and he went in it happily last night. I think the crib is too open for him. Glad to have found a solution!

PurplePidjChickIsNotTheMessiah Thu 27-Dec-12 10:10:32

If we're not allowed to put them down in case they scream, SS will be beating down my door any minute! R has to wait while I:

Use the loo
Dress, including sling and coat on
Load the dishwasher/washing machine
Disinfect the kitchen (cat makes this important)
Hang out washing (mostly nappies)
Prepare food and drink
Finish a car journey

<evil mamapidj>

Normally he's fine to be put down, he's just not feeling well today I don't think and is being grizzly and screamy. With calpol does anyone know when it says 'do not give more than 2 doses' is that in 24 hours?

Bellaboo123 Thu 27-Dec-12 12:32:08

Honey - hope little man is feeling better, he'll be fine if you put him down, I sometimes have to let her scream for me to get things done and stay sane!

Mamapo hope you managed done sleep grin

Well we were both up and out early today, docs for me to check my mastitis...still not fully gone so another dose of stronger antibiotics hmm. Then we went for a weigh in for Aurelia we've put on 5oz in 6 days and now weigh 7lb exactly. She also managed a lovely massive wee while being weighed!

We also went to tesco and got the new davina work out DVD - decided need to shift mummy weight!

Booked to get her registered on 8th - that should make us pull out finger out and decide on a middle name. DPs nan passed away just before Xmas and he mentioned giving A her name as a middle name - AIBU to say no as I really don't like the name, I feel out of order BUT! Advice please!

Sorry for mammoth post.

Thanks smile
I don't think YABU to not want it. We had a similar situation but I really don't like DHs grandads name. You both need to be happy with the middle name. Congrats to A on the weight gain smile

I can get back into all my pre preg clothes no prob, poss a little muffin top left to lose before really back but I just don't feel comfy in them. DH says they look fine so I think I've just got too used to elasticated waistbands!

Bellaboo123 Thu 27-Dec-12 12:43:42

Thank you!

I'm back in my clothes but don't feel great in them have pigged out over Xmas though - that might also have something to do with it!

Tmi but I think I've stopped bleeding - fx!!!

We had a similar thing re the middle name. I put my foot down!

I bought some new jeans yesterday in a sale and am same size as before if not smaller confused just need to tone up a bit.

Taking our tree down today, even though we have more family to see on Friday, Saturday and Sunday, as it's dead and making a mess!

ISpyDingDongMerrilyOnHigh Thu 27-Dec-12 13:01:57

Mama - sorry to hear you've had such a bad night. Hope ypu get some rest soon and that your FIL is ok.

Honey - Dash will be fine if you put him down. I know it feels horrible at the time, but sometimes it's the only way to get even the basics done. I'm sure it happens with all babies at one time or another.

Bella - lovely news about weight gain. Wrt middle name - although it can be a nice idea to use family names if you both like them, I don't think you should feel obliged to agree to a name you don't like. There are lots of other ways to remember your DP's nan.

Interesting reading earlier in the thread about how often the babies are sleeping. I was starting to get a little bit concerned about just how often N is asleep for, but he sounds pretty typical based on other's experiences. He does also seem to be having slightly longer periods of wakefulness today - think because it does change quite quickly, I'd forgotten how little DS1 was awake but not feeding in the very early days.

Secondsop Thu 27-Dec-12 16:29:02

Hello, Z is still not up to his birth weight (he is 4 weeks old today) but he has put on 180g in 8 days so is going in the right direction.

Well done to Z seconds and a big well done to you too, sounds like you're doing a great job smile

Bellaboo123 Thu 27-Dec-12 17:08:47

That's great seconds - the only way is up!

That's great news seconds smile

Ds keeps pulling away whilst he's still latched on and it's not particularly comfortable hmm does anyone know why he might be doing it? I thought it was if he'd emptied that side but he's now doing it at the beginning of a feed too confused

No idea why they do it spotty bit Dash does it too.

PurplePidjChickIsNotTheMessiah Thu 27-Dec-12 18:03:27

Dp's had a stroke. Fuck.

PurplePidjChickIsNotTheMessiah Thu 27-Dec-12 18:03:27

Dp's had a stroke. Fuck.

Aw seconds I'm glad z is gaining weight. You're doing so well!

Just had a lovely few hours nap. Mmmm babies are a great excuse for afternoon naps! I fed Ethan in the car earlier after doing a supermarket shop. Only problem was I got in the back as its got tinted windows, but forgot there are child locks sO I couldn't get out again! blush I had to climb through to the front, it was not very elegant! grin

Oh my god pidj I hope he's ok. Huge love being sent your way. Have you got support?! If there's anything any of us can do please let us know!

Oh god pidj how's he doing? Huge hugs and love being sent to all 3 of you. Like stacey says if we can do anything let us know.

PurplePidjChickIsNotTheMessiah Thu 27-Dec-12 18:14:31

Well he can walk talk and eat so its just wait and see. He'll be in hospital for a while though I expect.

Staying with (lovely) MIL till we know more

All good signs pidj it must be so scary though. It's good you can stay with mil (and helps a lot that she's lovely). <hugs>

Oh pidj thanks for you and your dh. I wish him a full and speedy recovery envy

WillYuleDoTheFandango Thu 27-Dec-12 18:35:41

Oh my goodness Pidj, sending him best wishes for a speedy recovery thanks

Bellaboo123 Thu 27-Dec-12 18:46:02

Thoughts are with you pidj - hope he makes a speedy recovery thanks

Clarella Thu 27-Dec-12 19:11:25

oh no pidj hope he gets well soon. very worrying for you, sounds positive but still hard for you all. sending best wishes thanks

PurplePidjChickIsNotTheMessiah Thu 27-Dec-12 21:08:25

He was sparko at evening visiting, we'll know more once he's been assessed by the therapy team tomorrow

Fingers crossed for some sleep hmm

ISpyDingDongMerrilyOnHigh Thu 27-Dec-12 21:15:42

Thinking of you Pidge and hoping he makes a speedy recovery.

JoJoB77 Thu 27-Dec-12 21:19:00

Oh no pidj, i'm so sorry. I do hope he makes a speedy recovery thanks

Thinking of you pidj wishing him a speedy recovery xx

Oh pidj. Other than lots of hugs and good wishes I don't know what to do. Just remember how much support you have here.

My gran had a lot of strokes and did well so I have a lot of experience of them. PM of I can help at all xx

MaMaPo Thu 27-Dec-12 22:22:14

My goodness Pidj - what news. Hope you find out more soon.

I work as a therapist for people who have had strokes so do send me a PM if you want any info or have any questions. Also trying to remember what part of the country you're in and whether I know the unit or therapy team...

In other news, am hoping madly that Little C's growth spurt ends s

MaMaPo Thu 27-Dec-12 22:24:39

Ends soon, as if plays havoc with her behaviour and makes me a worried mum!

Also, an update about FIL - he did indeed have a small heart attack on Christmas Day and has been in hospital since then. He's had an angiogram and 2 stents put in and will be discharged tomorrow and can enjoy the rest of their holiday in the UK. Eventful!

PurplePidjChickIsNotTheMessiah Thu 27-Dec-12 22:26:18

Thanks thanks everyone. Hopefully coming to the end of tonight's cluster session, I've had him asleep all day so as not to disturb anyone so can only hope we sleep tonight.

Mama I'm actually at the in laws near Slough

Secondsop Thu 27-Dec-12 22:29:05

Oh pidj - really hope all is ok. Thinking of you x

WeeJo08 Thu 27-Dec-12 23:06:25

Hope you're okay, Pidj, that must have been such a shock hmm Really hope DP makes a speedy recovery...it sounds like signs are good so far. Glad you're with family xx

ellliebelle Thu 27-Dec-12 23:19:54

pidge do sorry to hear your news it must hsve been very scary fx for a speedy recovery for your dp

How much weight did everyones little ones loose in the first week? Ds has lost 6oz which seems like loads (although midwife wasnt concerned) but i cant remember what is normal.

Is anyone using expressed milk for the odd feed hear and there? I never did with dd2 but dh asked if i would today and it would be nice to know i could take the dd's out in a couple if weeks and leave ds with dh jusy wondering how much milk he would be likely to need for one feed

yuletopian99 Fri 28-Dec-12 01:46:09

Crikey pidj I hope your dp recovers swiftly and is okay?

Was just joining post natal - About to conk out but very happy here. Oscar Blake (born at 8.38pm, 8lb 7oz after it turned out I didn't need to be induced after all!) has already cottoned on to feeding - two stints of 25 mins - and is now making snuffly noises beside me.. Will fill in proper birth story tomorrow!

brooke89 Fri 28-Dec-12 01:50:48

Hope he has a quick recovery pidj

Congrats Yule thanks

SeymoreInOz Fri 28-Dec-12 01:59:46

pidj thinking of you and DH. X

Congratulations utopian smile

PurplePidjChickIsNotTheMessiah Fri 28-Dec-12 02:48:20

Congrats Utopian thanks

Its about now I'd normally hand over and get a proper kip

Congratulations utopian

pidj I hope ds is behaving for you. X

Bellaboo123 Fri 28-Dec-12 04:52:48

Congrats utopian!

Keep your chin up pidj and hope you're getting some sleep.

Ellie I try to express a bottle day for DP - depending on what time of day he's feeding her he needs anywhere between 2oz - 4oz (more as the day goes on I find and Aurelia is 4 weeks tomorrow). Just a tip we've been using the medela calma bottles - the teat and motion required to suck is apparentely most similar to that needed on the nipple - we've had no bottle/nipple confusion but you never know we may never of had with a normal teat!

Also they say its ok to lose upto 12% of birth weight in the first week.

PurplePidjChickIsNotTheMessiah Fri 28-Dec-12 07:10:35

11-2:30 and 4-7. He's a good lad.

We were getting in the routine where I'd express during the day so dp could do a feed when he got in from work. Eventually we aimed for him to do bath, book, bottle, bed as a routine

Glad ds understood you needed sleep pidj Fx that dp recovers quickly and can start giving ds that bottle again soon! X

We had an awful night, up every hour and a half and it takes 30-45 minutes to feed him. I have not had much sleep! <yawn>

We had a bad night too. Dd has developed a cough and came into our room three times, waking ds up each time (inbetween his usual feeds) hmm

My sister and bil are coming today, they live in bath so we hardly ever see them smile

pmgkt Fri 28-Dec-12 09:41:08

Thinking if you pidj.

Quick question about feeding. Edward is a week old, and during the day he feeds every 2 1/2 - 3 hours. At night he is happy to go longer. Last night I fed at 8, 11.30 3.30 and then had to wake him at 830. He has a good feed each time, rather than just falling back to sleep, and I have already started offering the second side which he then takes a good feed from too. I shouldn't complain about nice sleeps at night but is this ok? It is ds2 and I never set alarms or anything for ds1 but he was 2lb heavier at birth so never felt as delicate.

Bellaboo123 Fri 28-Dec-12 09:43:49

That sounds like bliss pmgkt grin as long as he's not going longer than 5 hours I think you're doing great!

Sounds fine to me too smile

pmgkt Fri 28-Dec-12 09:57:55

Cool, thanks for the replies. He is feeding again already so only an hour later than last feed, so making up for my lie in! I just remember hospital saying 3 hours but I assume that is before milk comes in.

Ds was 7lb13 and the nurses in SCBU said five hours

pmgkt Fri 28-Dec-12 10:40:59

Well if a scbu baby is 5 hours its not going to be more for Edward. Thanks spotty. I've not been keeping up with reading over the past couple of weeks, how are you and your Lo

Afrodizzywonders Fri 28-Dec-12 11:07:03

Pidg, hope everything is ok thanks

Afrodizzywonders Fri 28-Dec-12 11:08:28

Pmgkt, providing your babber has no jaundice making them sleepy then I'd say go with it!

We are good thanks smile he likes to cry and now prefers my finger to his dummy hmm hoping to settle into some kind of routine after Christmas! Have to get him weighed on Monday so fingers crossed he's putting on weight!

Afrodizzywonders Fri 28-Dec-12 13:16:36

Health visitor just weighed Kitty who is 3 weeks today and she gained 1lb in 1 week!!! She's been packing the weight on, the 2-3 hourly feeds are paying off, hopefully they will ease off soon though.....

Thinking of you Pidj

Felix has finally passed his birth weight, after dropping from 7lb13oz to 6lb13oz (12%) he is now 8lb2oz! I'm so proud of him, makes these endless feeds and painful nipples all worth it!

WillYuleDoTheFandango Fri 28-Dec-12 13:55:06

Spotty Jamie much prefers my finger to a dummy. Very strange. He's also started rooting for my nipples now that my milk has started to dry up. confused He still can't latch though and gets very upset when I try.

Clarella Fri 28-Dec-12 15:09:42

hope all Is well pidj thinking of you and your family.

pmg sounds all good to me! I was advised to keep with same boob if he demanded within 2 hours in order to get more of hind milk and that has worked well when he's gone through a cluster.as George was so little I didn't let it go past 3 hours at night till this week (he's 3 weeks on Monday) but now allow 4 only at night which he occasionally does (not last night mind!!)
if you're demand feeding Edward will dictate when he wants/ needs more as this one did last night

those frequent feeds and sore nipples do pay off - proud mum again - from 5lb 2oz at birth, he was weighed today (18 days) and he's a grand 6lb 15 oz! one ounce off 7 lb!!! he can go in dh s sling! hooray!

Weissdorn Fri 28-Dec-12 16:17:08

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

Welcome weissdorm have you got a sling? That used to be the only way to get ds1 quiet when he had colic. He had reflux too thoughso I'm not sure what was attributed to what illness. Hopefully others will have some ideas for you. Oh and congratulations!

Hi Weis have you thought about baby massage? Agree with Stacey about a sling too. I feel for you with the colic it must be awful. Congratulations smile

Weissdorn Fri 28-Dec-12 17:20:02

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

WockComble Fri 28-Dec-12 17:22:23

Hello everyone and congrats on your babies. I had one too (DS2) on the 16th Dec - can I join please?

Brief info: Zacharias (*Seconds*, looks like we have the same taste in names!) was born just before lunchtime on Sun 16 Dec weighing 6 pounds. Felt first twinges of contractions at around 9.30am and he arrived super-speedily 2hrs 6 mins later (men's marathon world record time!). Had been planning an epidural but all I got was 2 paracetamol! He's only a tiny scrap but loves his feeding - he'd put on 4oz in as many days! Am co-sleeping with him which has resulted in much more sleep at this stage than I was getting with DS1 nearly 3 years ago. Plan to move him to his moses basket at some stage but it's working for now, especially as I can sleep in a different room - and on a different floor - from DH and DS1, meaning DH can tend to DS1 and neither DC disturbs the other. Not great for cuddles with DH, though.

Feeling pretty good nearly 2 weeks after the birth but DS1 has a cold (again) and is being a right pain in the ass. Mildly terrified at the prospect of looking after both DCs when DH goes back to work next week. ALthough I have nursery and my mum on hand to help out most of the time so I'm v lucky.

Nice to e-meet you all! x

Welcome Wock another fast labour!

It's very windy here tonight and wet confused ds is apparently cluster feeding tonight whilst dd isn't going to bed well because of a cough and cold hmm oh and dp is going out sad

weiss baby massage can work wonders, my ds changed over night after I learnt it, some hvs run classes but I'm sure you can get books or watch vids on youtube.

Secondsop Fri 28-Dec-12 20:28:54

Welcome wock great taste in names! Another fast labour too - mine was similar after an induction although I at least got some pethadine.

I'm co-sleeping with my little Z too. I'm happy now that we've found a way to do it that works for us. It certainly beats spending half the night trying to settle him in his carrycot.

Secondsop Fri 28-Dec-12 20:34:37

Oh and welcome weiss. I know what you mean about the crying all the time - took me a good 2 weeks plus to get over that.

yuletopian99 Fri 28-Dec-12 20:52:12

I'm still in hospital and dh has just been sent home again. sad All is fine with Oz apart from they can't prove for definite that he's weed, so won't discharge me, but he's feeding really well and no signs of dehydration. Was really hoping we could all go home as a family this evening.

On the plus side both sets of grandparents came to visit this afternoon and are very happy, and dh and I are besotted! grin

PurplePidjChickIsNotTheMessiah Fri 28-Dec-12 21:21:04

Hello newbies, congrats thanks

SIL showed us a brilliant way for winding where you sit him on your lap sideways on and bend him back and forth. I also find the flat-along-the-forearm position very good. Alternate patting and rubbing.

Dp was in fine form this evening, watching tv in the day room. He's already strong enough to lift and carry R (although he had the nurses in a flap over the last one!) We've got quite a flock of admirers on the ward, apparently, and one hca wants BIL's phone number grin

Bellaboo123 Fri 28-Dec-12 21:33:12

That's great news pidj!

Fx you get home tomorrow yuletopian!

Well I have a very grisly lady on my hands tonight grrrrrrr non stop feeding and crying argh! Although as I write this she's finally fallen asleep!

Did the new davina DVD tonight got a feeling I'm going to ache tomorrow!

yuletopian99 Fri 28-Dec-12 22:13:41

Sounds like great news pidj, thumbs up for continued progress!

utopian they thought about keeping me a second night as Ethan didn't wee but they needed the bed, the midwife was coming the next day and he's my 3rd. He did his first wee at about 36 hrs old. It's rubbish they've kept you just for that. But you should be home tomorrow. Fx for you!

pidj that's great news, do glad dp is doing so well!

Well I envisage a bad night as Ethan has slept since 7.30 only waking to feed and do a huge poo on me and the bed while I changed him

This child has decided he doesn't need to sleep again! Since 2pm, he has spent 6hrs feeding, and slept for 45mins, I'm starting to go insane and loose the will to live!

Correction, make that 7hrs.

JoJoB77 Sat 29-Dec-12 00:59:11

Evenin' all smile

Well i'm finally here after waiting a week for labour to start. Last saturday night i started having contractions which eased off but cranked up again on sunday afternoon but were 10 mins apart at that stage. By 7pm they were down to 5 mins apart and becoming very painful so we waited for pil's to cone over while dd was asleep and we headed to local mlu.

I'd already warned them of my racing heart during dd1's birth but dont think they were prepared for 160bpm, me not baby blush. So we had to go to hospital but before we headed off i was examined and was only 2/3cm hmm

Got to hospital, cx's tailed off but my heartrate slowed so was told to get moving for an hour to try & get things going again. And boy they did, in less than two hours later i was fully dilated and ready to push. Emilia was born at 0125am weighing 7lb 14oz on 24/12/12 so we also share a birthday grin

She is the spitting image of her big sis i cant believe how similar they are.

Hope everyone is well and glad to hear your dp is doing good thanks

Congratulations jojo and grin that she decided to come on your birthday!

yuletopian99 Sat 29-Dec-12 03:53:51

Thanks stacey - i now have Proof Of Wee so will be let out first thing tomorrow..

Oz has gone from being super-docile to feeding solidly for almost 4 hours; every time he drifts off on the boob if I put him down he's awake again in 10mins.. Argh!

MaMaPo Sat 29-Dec-12 04:33:56

Chocolate for everyone with hungry/wakeful babies tonight. Little C seems to be sleeping less than 2 hours between night feeds - am crossing my fingers that this is just the tail end of her 3 week growth spurt. Wish she could invert - she sleeps for 3 hours between feeds during the day.

kate2boysandabump Sat 29-Dec-12 04:33:58

So sorry to hear your news pidj.

Ds3 still not regained birth weight, so trying to feed all the time, but he is so lazy sometimes, I'm always trying to keep.him.awake to.feed. he seems happy enough so I'm trying not to stress.

Hope everyone had a good Christmas. We had a very quiet day and even ate our Christmas dinner in our pj's.

Wow JoJo a busy time of the year for you! Yule that's exactly what Felix was doing yesterday, drove me mad. Thankfully we finished his last feed at 1.30, and he has only just woken up. 4hrs sleep, bliss!

yuletopian99 Sat 29-Dec-12 07:53:42

Oooh envy.
That being said, he has allowed me 1.5hours sleep so I feel a lot more human now, plus he's back to snuffly cuteness.. grin

Snuffly cuteness makes up for lack of ddp in the early days!

My big kids are back today. Cant wait to see them smile

Ddp?! hmm sleep!

obv lack of sleep affects my typing abilities!

Dash has been making very strange noises but doesn't seem too bothered by them so trying not to worry confused

I'm now full of cold and feeling rubbish and convinced this child hates me. DH took the 3am feed but I'm still so tired.

WLmum Sat 29-Dec-12 09:03:56

Hello, can I join in please? Tabitha was born on 18th dec via elc, she is gorgeous dd3.

Waves to state :-)

pidj so sorry to hear about dp, that sounds horrendous. Glad he seems to be on the up.

Well this bfing lark is certainly a challenge isn't it! I'm reassured to hear other people experiencing mammoth feeding sessions with only seconds in between to air the boobs. Tabs was feeding all night solid pretty much for most of the first week (she's now a grand 11days old) and hospital feeding advisor found a slight Tongue tie and suggested topping up with ebm after 30 mins of boob. Unfortunately I have often had to resort to formula top ups as I can't express the 2-3 ozs she still wants after a feed. I'm expressing as often as possible, and taking fenugreek to try to boost my supply so I can stop the top ups asap - anyone have any experience of how to do this while still making sure Tabitha gets all thd milk she needs? Got apt to have tt sniped on 3rd - any experience anyone? Will it really make the difference?

Sorry for long first post, just feeling quite anxious about feeding. Boob, bottle, pump is an exhausting regime!

Congrats everyone on their new editions.

Clarella Sat 29-Dec-12 10:23:52

glad dp seems to be improving pidj

welcome and congrats to newbies!

starting ti think a tad bit of thrush here sad hv ummed and ahhed and was going to drop a prescription off yesterday but then called to say see if metanium helps the little suspicious patch on his bottom over the wknd but I'm now thinking my nipples don't feel ok at all. I wouldn't be surprised the amount ive been sweating at night. anyone else having that? plus I seem to leak terribly. if it is thrush it's v slight at mo. I'm really struggling with breast pads - the boots own irritate me, asdas are ok but turn into lumps and slip as not v sticky and so far the pricey lansinoh are the only ones that seem any good but ran out a few days ago - am sure my nipples were better with those. anyone tried reusable ones? I think I must leak a lot sad does it calm down soon?

and Dh just triggered tears after having headaches and tiredness fir 2 days he's announced a baby head wet tonight. and is it aibu to say please don't visit to a friend? I really don't want any more visitors this weekend - seems to end up we gear whole day towards them coming. I just don't know what to say! we had a house full yesterday.

sorry for being a bit blue. .bf was hoping so well sad

WLmum Sat 29-Dec-12 10:34:11

Not unreasonable at all clarella, I have turned people away this time - the most important thing is that you get to where you need to be with ds and a constant stream of visitors won't help. Remember dr Zeus - those that matter wont mind and those that mind don't matter. Dps can be stupid! I just told mine off for saying he's tired - I know he is but I have only asked him to get up once in the night since dd was born, and that was only for a quick nappy change because I was desperate. I on the other hand sit up for hours with get listening to him snore! Tell him it's too soon.

clarella I found the tommee tipee breast pads best so far for price/effectiveness compromise. They have them in my little local boots so they should be fairly easy to get. They still aren't wonderful but idont think any are really!
Re:sweating at night. It does calm down although I still get the occasional night of it.
No advice on thrush here I'm afraid, although if you think it is get something ASAP as one of the other threads said if it gets into the ducts it's a bugger to get rid of

Have you thought about reusable ones clarella?

Oh and I still wake up drenched in sweat blush

Clarella Sat 29-Dec-12 12:11:44

oh sorry you're poorly honey - and dash loves you lots! is he still a bit poorly? not good when you are too.

wise words thanks ladies my rants have passed. Dh swears it's just an hour and a half at the local and I'm feeling bad for saying no after all the stuff he's done for me over Tue last few weeks. and found 2 last lansinoh pads and I swear everything feels so much better! dunno if it is thrush or just hammered nipples from cluster feeding plus pads not very comfy. nursery nurse coming on Monday to have a look at his bottom though I think it's better already after a day of metanium.

on a positive George just had the best bath time so far, and he loved spending time being massaged and clothes free for ages smile

wlmum no advice I'm afraid but it sounds exhausting I do feel for you. hopefully your supply will be increasing..

I swear this baby has nipple narcolepsy.

Clarella Sat 29-Dec-12 12:17:41

can anyone recommend reusables? been scouting about

ISpyDingDongMerrilyOnHigh Sat 29-Dec-12 13:01:30

Congratulations Jo and WLMum, and welcome Emila and Tabitha thanks.

Not tried them but the Avent ones look good Clarella?

PurplePidjChickIsNotTheMessiah Sat 29-Dec-12 13:18:45

I like Sainsburys disposables but now have Mothercare washables - 3 for 2 in the sale and a nice shape

CODwidow Sat 29-Dec-12 13:28:24

Personally I really like avent breast pads and pampers nappies. I tend to leak a lot and I find them the best.

Well baby k has had oral thrush which I then caught so now have drops for her and cream for my nipples but after only a day they feel a lot less sore- phew!

yuletopian99 Sat 29-Dec-12 13:47:34

We're home!! Oz has had a bath in hospital so we have an idea of what to do and a refresher from the nct classes..

The cats are politely interested but being good and we've opened the presents given to 'the unnamed arrival' (as he was overdue we kept them.) DH is being super and Oz is asleep after his exciting morning. Now we have to survive on our own!

They're not reusable, but the tesco ones are great.

Felix has nipple narcolepsy too, I think he has finished feeding, hand him to my DH who then gets pissy cause he thinks I've not fed him properly!

Well they'd sold out of the breast pads I like so I'm trying johnsons ones. Will report back.

How wrong is it to be seriously considering a bottle of wine tonight...?! I'm feeling really rotten, not convinced I'm cut out for this motherhood thing. I'm convinced Dash hates me and also that there's something wrong with him as he's not hitting milestones (admittedly I'm looking at things for his real age rather than adjusted age) I just feel like I've been working so hard for ages we aren't getting anywhere. I'm just feeling isolated and lonely and not sure I'm the best person to be his mum.

Sorry. Having a bad day.

MaMaPo Sat 29-Dec-12 15:46:49

Honey - who else could be dash's mum? Nobody on earth is as well equipped for the job as you. And if you gave the job up to someone else, Dash would be devastated. Hang in there, I'm sure he's doing fine and thinks you are too (even though he might be a bit rubbish at expressing it!)

I have a box full of breast pads in the bathroom and have use precisely 2. I almost never leak, and when I do, I'm in bed and not wearing a bra. Ill probably end up tossing out the whole lot.

Tried expressing for the first time today - I have a medela swing. I did about 15 minutes on one breast (which Little C had just fed from) and about 10 on the other, and got about 115ml/4oz. Anyone know if that's any good? Seemed quite a lot.

Honey I think you should go to some groups/classes (baby massage?) in the new year, meet some new people smile you're not a bad mum, is it just the milestone things getting you down?

So glad you're home Utopian grin good luck with your first night it can be quite daunting!

That's really good mamapo!

Secondsop Sat 29-Dec-12 16:02:16

honey - you're doing such a brilliant job. Take the wine - you deserve something to make yourself feel human again.

I think we all forget sometimes that historically, women wouldn't be raising children without a big support system - poorer women had sisters, mothers, other local woman nearby to help them, some of whom works be breastfeeding too so could even do some of the breast feeds, and richer women pretty much outsourced the whole thing. The idea that we spend every waking minute childrearing without constant assistance is relatively modern. So we are all doing something extraordinary every day.

Definitely Seconds, a lot of us live no where near our mums, where as it was almost unheard of for our parents to not have support, that's just one generation. Honey you have that wine, my MW mother prescribed me baileys last week, and I will be enjoying a glass of it again tonight (think ill drink it in the bath!) of cause he loves you, but he is a baby with limited thought processes, and love to him means food, warmth and a clean bum!

Thanks smile mama i just don't think I'm good enough for him but at the same time I would never give him up. But then that makes me wander if I'm being selfish cos he would be better off with someone who knows what they're doing.

spotty the plan is to start some groups in the new year. That was always the plan when he was due in December but having had him so early I feel like I've been alone a lot as we couldn't really join classes till the new term anyway. I think the milestone thing is getting to me quite a bit as I'm a natural worrier so I'm sure something is wrong. But DH thinks he is getting lots of eye contact - so either he is over thinking random looks which aren't actually eye contact, or Dash is making eye contact with him and not me. Which reinforces me thinking he hates me. I know I'm overreacting. But even at his adjusted age of 2 an a half weeks shouldn't he be doing plenty of eye contact?

seconds thanks for your kind words. It's good to try to remember things like that. I am feeling particularly alone today as friends are busy, family is busy and DH is on a late shift.

MaMaPo Sat 29-Dec-12 16:31:18

Oh yes, honey, I meant to insist on the wine! Bottoms up.

I'm not the only one to have returned to drinking regularly, albeit at reduced quantities, am I?

Thanks eggnog. I like the sound of your mum!

MaMaPo Sat 29-Dec-12 16:37:18

xpost - and honey, you definitely know what you're doing. You have a healthy, happy little boy who sounds like he's thriving and who arrived ahead of schedule! That's enough of a challenge for anyone, and he's doing marvellously. Things like eye contact as a milestone seem really hard to quantify - if he's eating, sleeping, gaining some weight and producing dirty nappies then you have a champion baby on your hands.

Definitely think classes are a great idea. I need to look into it myself... and are there any local mums groups you can link in with? I have met up with the mums from my NCT group once, and it was completely great, can't wait to do it again!

My nipples are starting to feel quite sore. That first minute is rather painful sad

Honey dd didn't smile until mind weeks, sit up until eight months, crawl until a year or walk until nearly two. It can be worrying and so hard not to compare but by the time they start school they will be doing all those things and you will wish you hadn't worried so much! (I know it's easier said than done) smile

spotty was your dds smile actual age or adjusted?

leobear Sat 29-Dec-12 17:31:14

Hi honey, sorry to hear you are feeling down. I drove myself mad with DD1, worrying about milestones, especially as she was a late walker. She's2.1 now, and everything has evened out, you honestly wouldn't know the difference between her and the very early walkers.

You are doing a great job!

It was her actual age, she was nearer ten weeks I think and she was four months before she laughed. SHe can talk for England though wink swings and roundabouts smile

Thanks spotty. We thought we had a smile the other day but now I'm bit sure it wasn't just wind. I know I should stop being so hard on the little guy as he was so early so needs time to catch up but part of me us so scared something is wrong.

Is everyone starting to get eye contact already?

Also my Saturday has been spent watching to newly-discovered 'pregnant in heels'. It is the most terrible, horrendous, awful car crash tv but I can't stop watching!

Secondsop Sat 29-Dec-12 17:57:25

spotty I've been using nipple shields when mine start to get sore, to give them a bit of a break.

Good idea seconds I have got some but haven't opened them yet! Will sort them out tomorrow

FriendofDorothy Sat 29-Dec-12 18:09:31

Honey I wouldn't worry too much yet about milestones. They are notoriously unreliable for an early baby.

I have had a tough week or so and Christmas Day was hard as I was in a lot of pain. This vulval variscosity has been agonising and I have had to take a lot more painkillers than I would like. I have even had to take co-codamol. I also had different advice about ibuprofen. The midwife said it was fine to take it if breast feeding and the GP said I shouldn't take it.

To add the misery I now have a urine infection and I am on antibiotics and I suspect I have vaginal thrush. I have been using topical Canesten. Des anyone know if this is ok to use when breast feeding.

Sorry this is a me me me post!

Barbeasty Sat 29-Dec-12 18:48:59

Honey the milestones are just a rough guide, and with a baby as early as Dash you need to think in adjusted ages.

I remember a friend with twins born around 3 months early being really frustrated when the hv doing the 9 month check used actual age and so referred them to the pediatrician. Pediatrician just said they were fine for adjusted age (which friend knew). Now at around 30 months you wouldn't know they were premature.

If you're worried then you could talk to your hv. They should be able to put your mind at rest.

And yes to the wine!

Anthony is just 2.5oz off his birth weight now, which isn't bad given he lost over 11%. Hopefully he'll have put the rest on when the midwife comes again next year.

SleeplessInGarforth Sat 29-Dec-12 18:50:34

Hi all,

I'm new to being a mum and new to mumsnet so hello everyone!

My beautiful dd was born on 9th December so she's 3 weeks old tomorrow. We're having fun and games trying to get her to sleep in her Moses basket. Ok it's not fun and by 3am I normally give up and let her sleep on me.

Yes I have tried swaddling her - but she was 10lb4oz when she was born (yes it hurt!) and she already breaks out of swaddling really easily - even the so called miracle blanket won't keep her legs in. We've got dh's shirt in the basket, try her in it for naps, have tried with dark room, white noise, after a bath etc. etc. but nothing really works. I thought that perhaps she was getting overtired by bedtime so yesterday I dutifully followed her sleep cues and encouraged her to nap every time she looked tired. It was a disaster as she didn't want to sleep at all last night after so many naps in the day!

I wondered how people with similar aged babes were getting on... Us anyone else having the same experience?

Thanks all smile

Secondsop Sat 29-Dec-12 19:05:51

Welcome sleepless! My baby is a week older than yours and we haven't nailed sleeping in the basket by any means. Although the nights are getting slightly better. I must confess that I just let him cuddle up with me so that we both get some sleep - he's so little that he just wants his mum at the moment and i figured there's time to get him into a proper routine. He doesn't like being swaddled - thrashes around and cries - so we've given up on that!

Secondsop Sat 29-Dec-12 19:17:24

friendofdorothy you really are having a rough time of it aren't you - poor you. I don't know the answers to your questions about the medications - is there a midwife number you can ring? I'm having some pelvic pain and discomfort that I'm going to ask the midwife about tomorrow as I suspect it's a urine infection.

FoD I would have thought the canesten is fine, not sure about the iburpofen? Google should tell you though....

Welcome Sleepless, I can't help but I think it's very common. They're still tiny at the moment, you might find after six or seven weeks things get easier. Sounds like your dd is awake a lot in the day?! DS is five weeks on monday and is rarely awake in the day at the moment. Possibly a growth spurt I suppose as he was awake for an hour or two at a time before. Anyway it takes me a while to settle him after a night feed sometimes but letting him suck on my finger, then quickly swapping it for the dummy and rocking his moses basket seems to work!

We have sort of got the Moses basket sleeping sorted, I have to cuddle him to sleep after a feed, but then he goes down fine. He has a Ewan the Sheep which makes heart beat sounds and I put him down on his side with a blanket rolled up behind him (not the recommended position but hi hates sleeping on his back)

How's the Ewan Eggs?

CODwidow Sat 29-Dec-12 19:44:18

honey I remember when I had ds1 and I chose not to bf, I can remember crying for weeks because I felt so guilty I honestly thought he would be better off somewhere else. I just had such overwhelming love for him I felt there was no way I could be good enough. So I know how you feel but you honestly are, I would say though don't be worried to speak to a good friend or hv if you think your feeling really low. Sending lots of hugs your way.

Stacks Sat 29-Dec-12 19:57:45

Just a quick post to say hi and mark my place. DS was born on Christmas Day, but has kept me so busy since I've not had time to come over and post. Hoping this'll change now we're home and settled.

WLmum Sat 29-Dec-12 20:00:57

Have decided that the breast/bottle/express must stop! Apart from bring unsustainable for me, I'm worried that Tabitha is getting to know that she doesn't have to try at the breast cos there will always be a nice easy bottle at the end. Spoke to a really nice supportive lady on one if the bf helplines today and am going to try not to give bottle top ups in the day time unless I feel it's really necessary and will just prepare myself for some hardcore feeding. Will continue with night time top ups for couple more days to be sure of a bit of sleep. Wish me luck!

Good luck WLmum! Expressing is exhausting so I think you're doing really well smile

Welcome Stacks looking forward to hearing all about the arrival of your ds

Congratulations Stacks, welcome to the dark side!

Spotty I love Ewan, Felix is so much easier to put to bed with it. Before I would have to try several times to put him down, but fingers crossed he has been going down first time. Plus it puts me to sleep instantly!

WLmum Sat 29-Dec-12 20:21:37

honey try not to be hard on yourself (easier said than done of course), I remember feeling a bit like that with dd1 especially as at times everyone else's babies were doing really well and she was really behind with weight, and was quite slow with milestones. As others gave said though, it really does balance out. Physically she was slow, and is still not the most coordinated but was an early talker with an amazing vocabulary and now at 5.5 is one of top in her class for reading.
Groups are a good idea, I was referred by hv for a baby massage class - we called ourselves the specials cos we'd all been referred for one reason or another rather than just signing up. It was def helpful to see others needing support too.

Welcome newbies!

honey it may be useful to talk to your mw/hv about how you're feeling. It sounds a lot like I felt after ds1 and I got referred to home start for a helper/friend for 3hrs a week, and to a parents group and baby massage.

We are cluster feeding, better than 11-3.30 last night hmm

Thanks all for your support today. Am currently having an internal battle - have a carton of formula in the cupboard and am trying to decide whether to go to bed and let DH give Dash that before he comes up. Does formula reall make them sleep longer?

formula is harder for their systems to digest and therefore stays in their stomach for longer and may make him sleep longer. If it means you can get some shut eye and look at things with a better perspective in the morning I'd go for it honey there's no need to over think things. You need sleep, dash needs food. Formula can tick the boxes for now and you can think with a clearer head in the morning.

Hugs being sent your way.

Thank you stacey

Bellaboo123 Sat 29-Dec-12 22:13:27

Honey we've been giving Aurelia a formula feed about now-ish every evening for the last week and it does generally make her sleep longer. I bf all other times...it just keeps my sanity! Go for it!

Ps I think you're doing a great job...oh and I hope you enjoyed the vino...I've had the odd one and its bliss!

Salukigirl Sat 29-Dec-12 22:46:27

I was in hospital for 5 days and they gave me ibuprofen 4 times a day and I've just been prescribed canesten by the mw so you should be fine.

brooke89 Sat 29-Dec-12 23:06:20

Honey I've been doing a mixture of ff and bf- LOs feed around 10 is ff and then every other throughout the night

Thanks again everyone. Just been on a proper downer today. Has a postnatal consultant appt yesterday which is hoped would give me some answers about why he came so early and if I needed tone worried about Dash and it was a locum who was a total bag of shite a bit rubbish and hadn't bothered to even read my notes before I got in there so thibk I'd been counting on that appointment for answers but didn't get any. I'm still worried about all he little things Dash does (eg lifting and dropping his head repeatedly on my shoulder, eyes rolling when hes tired) which are 99% perfectly normal but whoch dr.google suggests could be something awful and with a history of depression and anxiety I'm scared its all starting up again.

Just feeding Dash now then hopefully some sleep - is it normal for them sometimes to kind of pull of the boob and writhe around a bit?

honey Ethan pulls off and writhes a lot. Especially in the evenings. He gets a bit confused as to if he wants boob or not. It can be hard work but they're still really small.

Writhing might be wrong- he kind of pulls of and shakes his head back and forth like he's looking to latch but its right there! Then pulls away and shakes again then goes back on confused

Secondsop Sun 30-Dec-12 00:12:25

honey is it a little like pecking with his mouth wide open, like a baby bird? if so, little Z does that all the time. It just takes him a minute to be sure he's in the right place.

Sort of seconds but he goes on fine got a couple of mins before he starts doing it!

Honey that sounds exactly like what my dd does, I often wind her/check nappy/switch sides when she does this, but sometimes she just does it because she can!

Ds does the same and I'm sure he just permanently damaged my nipple by pulling away really far whilst still latched on confused

MaMaPo Sun 30-Dec-12 00:50:43

Another here whose little one does the same frantic trying to relatch behaviour - wide open mouth, passing right over the nipple, but too frantic to realise! Silly wee thing.

I woke up from a nap this afternoon with conjunctivitis - trying hard to remember not to touch my eyes as I don't want to pass it on, especially not to the baby. Eurgh.

Secondsop Sun 30-Dec-12 00:55:58

How long are your babies going through the night between feeds? Z is one month old now but still a few ounces short of birth weight, and so we've been feeding him every 3 hours or whenever he asks, whichever is sooner. So he's due a feed at 1.30am, but is sleeping well at the moment and I'm wondering whether to still wake him at 1.30 or to stretch it till 2 or 2.30. Of course anything might happen in the next half-hour...

Felix goes anywhen between one and four hours. He did a five once, never again though sad at the moment the battle is getting him back to sleep afterwards he's such a grunter! Been trying for forty minutes so far...

Secondsop Sun 30-Dec-12 01:19:17

My question has been rendered moot by Z waking up a few minutes ago sad

The only time he's slept 4 hours at night was when cuddled up to me.

He normally only goes four hours after the last 'night' (early morning) feed hmm

Glad I went to bed at nine now...

Secondsop Sun 30-Dec-12 01:32:01

I haven't had any sleep yet sad

I was you yesterday secomds I hope you get to sleep soon.

I had 12-1.30 sleep now I'm feeding and hoping Ethan will go back in his Moses basket after.

Is anyone else really insecure about their relationship? I think I'm being ridiculous god I hope I'm bring ridiculous but I'm really insecure about my marriage and seeing signs that DH may be hiding something on his phone, which may/may not be my imagination. But I just can't help worrying, however much I know it's unlikely. It's driving me insane!

yuletopian99 Sun 30-Dec-12 02:53:55

stacey i imagine it's just tiredness talking when it comes to relationships, this must be a testing phase for anyone what with the disturbed sleep/disrupted intimacy, but i doubt it means anything?

Has anyone got an irrationally excitable boob? My right starts leaking uncontrollably if he's feeding on the left, but not the other way around - very bizarre? Also, it's clear fluid (2 days after delivery now,) not yellow or white. Sorry if tmi but does that sound normal??

It's just changing Yule, I expect your milk will come in tomorrow smile if you collected it all it would look pale yellow but nothing like how yellow it is to start with!

I'm struggling to keep my eyes open..

Morning everyone...still lurking and reading.

Hope you and your dp are ok pidj, sounds like he's doing better!

Thought I'd check to see if anyone has an iPhone have you downloaded the white noise app? (it's free) it has a crashing waves setting on and Pheebs has been sleeping very well since I've started using it.

Afrodizzywonders Sun 30-Dec-12 03:14:51

Just changed Kitty.....on 3rd nappy, each time I think she's finished pooing and change her she fills it again within minutes!!! Arghhhhhhhh

yuletopian99 Sun 30-Dec-12 03:38:22

afro I feel your pain. Same here tonight but each change provokes waves of outraged crying.. Am in bed but Oz will NOT sleep in his hammock which is the same as last night with the cot in hospital - he finally settled at about 4.30 i think. DH is trying manfully to stay awake but has in fact been asleep for the last 2 hours but there's no point both of us being tired and he looked after oz this afternoon while i kipped. It is v nice to be at least sharing a bed again after two nights apart in hospital though.

yuletopian99 Sun 30-Dec-12 03:39:48

P.s. Thanks for milk tip spotty, does milk coming in hurt like hell? Time for some new bras soon i think!

It can be painful. The engorgement is uncomfortable and the shooting pains are painful. Definitely wait a few weeks for it all to settle down before you spend money on a bra. My boobs are much smaller than they were three weeks ago!

WillYuleDoTheFandango Sun 30-Dec-12 05:23:14

Jamie has colic, going out of my mind listening to him whinge. He's clean, dry, infacoled, fed and I winded him for an hour using every possible method. He must be in so much pain sad off to buy anti-colic bottles in the morning

Morning everyone. Sitting here in tears, god I hope this is irrational emotional shit. it does not help that my XH left me after an affair before ds1 was a year old

On the brighter side Ethan slept for 4 hours straight! Win!

willyule I hope Jamie feels better soon. I remember colic from ds1 and it is soul destroying, especially as there is very little you can do. Have you looked into baby massage?

Bellaboo123 Sun 30-Dec-12 06:37:01

Stacey can you talk to DP about how you're feeling?

Willyou I was told Woodward gripe water is more effect than infacol but can't be used until LO is 1 month - anyone else tried it?

Stacey not sure what to suggest. I'm sure it's just hormones and lack of sleep but only you really know.

Dr Browns bottles are meant to be good WillYou. I've never used gripe water but my friend, whose dd had colic, swore by it.

Every two hours last night sad and he took ages to settle. Seriously what is with the grunting??

Clarella Sun 30-Dec-12 08:15:48

grunting - does it sound like they are constantly trying to hack up a load if phlem like an old man? and why only at night and not in the day?

sorry Jamie has colic willyule, how old is he now? I'm not sure if George does or if just a growth spurt - tried infracol but tbh it seemed to cause more burps and painful ones than not using it!

No not phlegmy more annoyed with arms flailing! He doesn't do it in the day but we tend to only put him down once he's asleep or bounce him in his bouncer blush also I think everything seems louder at night!

Afrodizzywonders Sun 30-Dec-12 08:48:14

Willyule, how old is Jamie? I was told by midwives that colic does not inset until after 6 weeks, I had Kitty yelling for no reas

I thought it was 2-4 weeks? They need a baby bible, there's so much conflicting advice!

yuletopian99 Sun 30-Dec-12 09:00:14

Got 3 hours sleep from 5.30-8.30am! Yay! Dh woke up and helped hold him for a bit then i got him into his hammock after pre-warming the mattress by sleeping on it.. Do many of you seize the moment for day time sleeping too? I ask as the last two days he was asleep from about 1-4pm.

Also - is it normal for them to be sick quite so often at this early stage?

Is it just posset Utopian? Some babies' are just sicky. I've been napping in the day but it will have to stop once dp is back at work as dd doesn't nap anymore sad

WLmum Sun 30-Dec-12 09:21:57

MornIng all! Interested to read all the nocturnal posts, if I had a third hand I could have joined in! As we're still concentrating hard on feeding I need both hands, and unfortunately feeds take up to an hour with another hour to settle. Not sure why as settling seems to be much easier in the day. Tabs makes lots of horrible noises too, am on the look out for reflux which I fear is raising it's ugly head again. I was hoping to catch a bit of sleep this morning as DH taking big dds to swimming lessons but tabs is not showing any signs of agreeing to that plan. Does anyone manage much by way if day time naps? I had a couple when we were first home but as the days go by they get harder to squeeze in.

Stacey so sorry to hear you're feeling worried. I would def try talking to dp if you feel able. Like someone else said, newborns do put a he'll of a strain on relationships and sometimes we forget that, and that it will settle down soon enough. Hope things are better soon.

Ahh I've lost track there's just toomuch going on (and too little sleep!)
Bella- I used gripe water with dd1 and yes I'm sure she had to be 1 month, I remember waiting for what seemed like forever for her to be old enough. It worked better than infacol for me. Massive sympathies to anyone who's LO is suffering, it really was the most sole-destroying thing!
Boobs have shrunk so much in the past few days and become saggier

I can't get the bloody nipple shield on!

Bellaboo123 Sun 30-Dec-12 09:50:56

Morning all...

We get the grunting and mucus sound and clearing of the throat - it's so loud it keeps me awake!!! Is it normal - what's reflux symptoms?

Dr Browns bottles are amazing, I used them with dd1. They are a pain to clean but really help, I might get some today as lo has been having some wind issues and in pain, don't really want it to get any worse. I also noticed mothercare has 3 for 2 on them at the moment.

Stacey I was convinced dh was having an affair about a week and a half ago with one of my friends!?!? He is on his phone a lot for work and my hormones were everywhere, I had to tell him and have a big cry but realise I wasn't quite myself now. Have you spoken to him about it?

And I've read colic starts at 2-3 weeks and peaks at 6 weeks before tailing off?

Just tried expressing and got 10ml I could cry. Why don't I have any milk?! I could express 2-3oz in hospital sad feeling totally shit and have to go to my aunts and watch ds be passed around whilst we have a crappy time.

Sorry for the moan blush

PurplePidjChickIsNotTheMessiah Sun 30-Dec-12 10:20:06

<Hug> Stacey. If you feel tearful for more than a day or so, please talk to your hv or dr. Down days are normal but longer could be depression, and the sooner that's caught the better. I reckon a good half of us will have PND to some extent - I have a history of anxiety and PTSD so am on constant watch for symptoms!

I have a thread in Chat called "Please tell me about Stroke" if anyone wants updates on that.

PurplePidjChickIsNotTheMessiah Sun 30-Dec-12 10:22:42

Spotty - babies are a bazillion gazillion times more efficient at getting milk out than crappy manmade shite. You've plenty of milk, your body just has fixed ideas on the method of delivery <hug>

PurplePidjChickIsNotTheMessiah Sun 30-Dec-12 10:22:42

Spotty - babies are a bazillion gazillion times more efficient at getting milk out than crappy manmade shite. You've plenty of milk, your body just has fixed ideas on the method of delivery <hug>

FriendofDorothy Sun 30-Dec-12 11:05:52

I am finding that Edward is feeding really well but at night he s much harder to settle than in the day. He seems to have wind at night but not in the day. Has anyone else found this?

Any advice for winding a baby?

WLmum Sun 30-Dec-12 11:50:43

bella reflux symptoms include horrible noises as gastric acid comes up the oesophagus and causes irritation - this gets worse over time if not treated and lo would cry when laid down. They often arch their back too. Another symptom is a constantly White coated Tongue where the milk keeps coming back up. Dd1 had it and it was miserable. Dd2 was quite a puker but was never bothered by it so I guess that was more just immature stomach muscles/valves.

WLmum Sun 30-Dec-12 11:56:11

spotty I'm not great at expressing either, and after a feed there is s limit to how much you should be able to get out as most of it should be in los tum! Why are you expressing? Nice bf lady I spoke to yesterday said putting baby on the breast to feed is much better for increasing supply than expressing.

I'm trying to be brave and not give formula in the day, and just accept that Tabitha will want to feed tons over the next few days. Not particularly looking forward to afternoon with dhs half sisters and family with my boobs out!

Just so when I'm having a bad night I can get dp to give ds a bottle of ebm rather than resorting to formula. I know I can express so it's just annoying to not get any out!

yuletopian99 Sun 30-Dec-12 12:25:26

fod not sure about wind but Oz is definitely harder to settle at night and seems to get more alert if anything, between 1-5am, it's exhausting and we're only on day 3!

WLmum ours is puking for Britain too but doesn't seem.overly bothered. I just wonder how much is staying in?

Community midwife is supposed to be coming today - what happens?

Also more tmi - my discharge letter says 'perineum intact, episiotomy', i thought these were mutually exclusive, and Dh swears the doctor at the time said they'd made a small cut, so what does this mean? Sorry for all the questions!

MaMaPo Sun 30-Dec-12 12:40:11

FoD, my little one is much gruntier in the nighttime than daytime. Bit frustrating as others coo 'Oh, what a quiet, contented baby!' and I think 'No, we're sharing our room with a lawnmower.'

I think she gets wind too, as she grunts and strains and then farts or poos. I have tried some of the techniques to help her shft it, but without luck. Just seen a YouTube video with some other techniques I might try. When she's straining, she doesn't seem to want to be touched/manipulated at all.

WL, just park yourself on the couch, feed feed feed and let everyone else run around after you. smile

PurplePidjChickIsNotTheMessiah Sun 30-Dec-12 12:58:25

R is far harder to settle when I'm fretting, once I came to accept that I'd be up half the night it actually got easier and less often! Bizarro baby hmm

ISpyDingDongMerrilyOnHigh Sun 30-Dec-12 13:33:01

Honey - how are you feeling today? I think it is really hard not to get too hung up on milestones, and what you think LO 'should' be doing but there is so much variation that they can only ever be a rough guide. I'd speak to hv if you're worried - hopefully will be more help than the pants consultant who sounds like the last thing you needed - but one thing you don't need to worry about is that you are absoultely the best person to be looking after Dash.

Stacey - <hugs>. Think hormones and sleep deprivation can do funny things, but also def agree with talking to DP about how you feel.

Well, after a few nights of thinking we'd cracked it (majority of night in moses basket, just waking for feeds and settling quickly afterwards) we had a terrible time last night. He would not stop crying unless he was lying upright on one of our chests. Pretty certain it was wind related but none of the usual sure-fire methods would bring it up. Also starting to wonder about reflux given he would scream if we put him on his back. Felt so bad that we just couldn't seem to make it better for him sad.He's snoozing contently now though and DH and I are taking turns to catch up on sleep. Also feel a bit guilty that we're not doing that much with DS1 - had planned to go out for the day (not that he knew) but we're both too shattered. He seems happy enough playing with his new Christmas toys but just concious that DH is back at work again soon and would have been nice to do something as a family. I'll stop moaning now - realise that it's not that bad in the grand scheme of things.

utopian the episiotomy is a small cut and most likely will have been to the side in a J shape. In tact perineum probably means no tear towards your bum? They can make mistakes though, they put the wrong gestation for Felix!

Well I broke down majourly this Afternoon and DH has told me he's not leaving and loves his family etc etc. but he didn't actually explain why he's being so cagey with his phone. hmm

Ethan has been laying under his play gym for 10 minutes. He's content and managing to whack the dangling toys, not sure if that's intentional or not! Lol

Clarella Sun 30-Dec-12 18:09:48

oh <hugs> stacey

and hugs all round for lots of stressed and frazzled mum's.

I wanted to pop on to say my hv offered a nursery nurse to pop out to give us a colic techniques / winding workshop as well as checking for thrush (don't think it is, I just seem to need lansiloh breast pads to feel ok hmm and G's sore bottom is loads better with metanium) so it might be worth finding out if hv can offer similar thing. I'm going to bombard her with little detail qs on bf too eg better positions now c section getting better.

had my first big melt down yesterday afternoon/ eve. I kind of think not bad for almost 3 weeks.

Stacey <hugs> could you try asking him directly about the phone? maybe he's being a typical man not realised the specific things that have upset you? THey don't realise how irrational hormones can make us you'd think they'd have figured it out after the last 9 months

THanks everyone for your support yesterday. I am feeling better today thanks, though still worrying but trying to be rational about it. It's prob helped by DH being off today too. I think i worked out that Dash's head banging last night was due to the boob being empty confused my supply has gone incredibly temperamental when i'm stressed.

We've been using infacol for a while now but don't really know how much use it's been. Did a dose of gripe water today and things have improved (touch wood). Those who are using it/have used it before how long can you use it for? The infacol seemed to be use it as long as you need to as it works on the build up but the gripe water i'm not sure how long we can use it for?

Also, this is going to sound stupid but how do you know if they've got a cold or sore throat? He's not snotty but the grunts sound very mucusy and his chest feels rattley when he breathes, if that makes sense. He's also coughing and sneezing a bit but i always assumed if they got colds there would be mammoth amounts of snot! what can i do for colds?

thanks And biscuit for those feeling a bit down sad

I think I might have to give some formula tonight sad I'm exhausted and ds fed at 3, 4, 5 and 6 and is still feeding now he doesn't seem tired and my nipples feel bruised!

Spent the day at Parents with extended family, with the hope of passing Felix off on an aunt/uncle/cousin to have a break, however Felix had other plans, and fed solidly for 4hrs, little monster! Everyone got very well acquainted with my nipples today!

MaMaPo Sun 30-Dec-12 19:33:24

Anyone else slightly dread the approach of evening? The amount of sleep (or not) is so unpredictable, and nights can be so slow and lonely... sad little C has jut stated cluster feeding (at about 4pm) and last time this happened I stupidly assumed that she'd finish up by 11pm or midnight but was still going strong at 6am. So now I am feeling nervous.

Honey, I'm also unsure if infacol is helpful but I'm not really brave enough to stop cold turkey... I bought colief drops too but haven't used it yet.

Secondsop Sun 30-Dec-12 19:37:14

mamapo I absolutely dread the onset of the evening...

Another one who dreads the night, it's the same feeling I got when working on a mental health intensive care ward, wondering who would kick off and when!

honey I kinda did ask (well I'd said I felt he was only here because of ds2 and not because of me and he said he loved me and I was being silly, to which I burst out 'so how come you're getting texts from random numbers and are hiding your phone from me' but I grabbed ds2 walked out the room and collapsed in tears in the hallway, he just told me he loved me and wouldn't risk me and ds2 leaving but he didn't explain what had happened.)

WillYuleDoTheFandango Sun 30-Dec-12 19:45:45

Thank you everyone thanks

Responses to questions: Jamie is 2 weeks today, which my midwife says is peak time for onset of colic. I have started infacol as too little for gripe water and have used tommee tippee anti colic bottles for last 2 feeds. He's like a different baby and we can even lie him on his back! Would only sleep on us last 2 nights. We've had the grunting, arching back, scrunching legs up and making vomiting noises.

Sorry to hear so many are struggling. Hope everyone gets a little sleep tonight.

leobear Sun 30-Dec-12 19:58:15

I know what you mean about dreading evenings - I felt like that with DD1 - part of me feels the same now, with DD2, but on the other hand I know how quickly this phase passes - it doesn't feel like it at the time, but it honestly goes by, and then they won't snuggle any more! It is really tough, though - I've felt weak and lightheaded all day.

Bellaboo123 Sun 30-Dec-12 20:01:30

Another one who dreads evenings!

CODwidow Sun 30-Dec-12 20:02:40

Oh stacey I really feel for you, maybe ask him totally outright but I do think once you have an idea in your head it's hard to shift. I have my own issues with dh as he just does not pull his weight around the house and with 4 other dc's it's becoming hard work to keep up. I just wish he would see what needs doing and do it! He spends the majority of his time ion his phone or the I pad, grrrangry

Weissdorn Sun 30-Dec-12 20:29:51

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

stacey hugs again. I think cod is right and if poss you just need to ask hi outright as if you're anything like me it'll keep worrying you till he tells you very bluntly there is nothing to worry about.

I don't mean to bang on about it but info struggle with knowing what to expect with Dash. The milestones thing is one but things like colic and growth spurts and things like that I don't know of I should be expecting them for his actual age or adjusted (ie colic would be hitting now for adjusted age but he's too old with his actual) or will I just never l ow when to expect things?!!

WillYuleDoTheFandango Sun 30-Dec-12 20:36:43

Oh COD that's rubbish too. Can you sit down and make a list between you containing the absolute essentials as you both see them? Then you and DP could make sure that at least those are done before he sits and plays in his iPad? it's like the kids watching tv before homework is done but do just phrase it like that unless you want to see a spectacular man paddy! You need time to look after your newborn without worrying about fitting everything else in.

Tmi question - has everyone been doing their pelvic floor exercises? I've been doing mine a lot and I've found that the muscles feel tired and achy really quickly and I can't do many at once. Is this normal, do I just need to build it up until they're stronger?

CODwidow Sun 30-Dec-12 21:26:38

I just find it frustrating but trying to let it go and just enjoy the dc's and worry about washing/housework later but it's hard when he's sat here. On the plus side he did make me some veg soup earlier that will be my lunch for the next week smile

Well we're still feeding every 3-4 hours and I hope it's ok to say this but my nights are not too bad compared to others. We feed at 9-10 then 1:30-2:15 ish and wake at 6:30 so hoping this continues as it fits in with doing the school run in the mornings.
Nipples are sore though, not sure if it's still the thrush or my latch whilst feeding lying down.

PurplePidjChickIsNotTheMessiah Sun 30-Dec-12 21:58:31

COD tell him to appreciate what he's got - my dp'd give his eye teeth to be capable of changing a nappy right now! Or, in fact, walking and talking properly!

Is it possible to overfeed a demand EBF baby? MIL has her own opinion on the subject...

PurplePidjChickIsNotTheMessiah Sun 30-Dec-12 22:08:40

Poo 7pm. Feed till 11, then again at 4 and 6 for 20-60 minutes. Up to play by 9, short feed at 11, lunch at 1, big sleep 2-4 (thank fuck that's visiting hours!) Feed and play 4-7.

Too much feeding? Should I let him cry? I've been following early cues whenever possible but he'll be 6 weeks tomorrow so not so teeny any more confused

I didn't think it was possible to overfeed demand EBF babies...

PurplePidjChickIsNotTheMessiah Sun 30-Dec-12 22:39:30

Me either but MIL is vocal in her disagreement hmm

PurplePidjChickIsNotTheMessiah Sun 30-Dec-12 22:39:30

Me either but MIL is vocal in her disagreement hmm

CODwidow Sun 30-Dec-12 22:43:11

Pidj, I'm sorry I probably sounded really insensitive posting as at least I have him here healthy and well. I just needed to vent and your the right people for that.

Stick to your guns pidj he's your son and you're doing what's best for him.

Clarella Sun 30-Dec-12 22:59:52

purple you may be hitting the 6 week growth spurt - I'd still be going with the demand feeding for now if you can manage and they do say as honey said not poss to over feed ebf baby?

while trying to find out about colic online I came across something researchy that said that babies born prematurely hit the colic phase at the same time as if they were term honey - but as I say it's Dr Google! and can't work out how a 42 weeker fits in with that!

George seems a little wheezy at times - and snored last night! I imagine one of the best things for a cold is keeping them hydrated with milk, which I know you'll be doing!

we were convinced George was ramping up to colic a couple of days ago but now I think it was growth spurty fussiness - though we'll see what tonight brings!

I agree with cod stacey - it'll brew inside you other wise. hope all is ok.

and cod that would drive me insane! I'd have a firm chat about putting ipads before family life.

I think pelvic floors will def be weak at first, keep practising and they should recover though I keep forgetting!

PurplePidjChickIsNotTheMessiah Sun 30-Dec-12 23:00:47

Don't be daft, COD, you have every right to moan here. I just thought you might be able to use it as an example to scare the bejaysus out of him nudge him into seeing your point grin

I have a friend up the road with a spare bed. I'm going to try and wiggle things so I stay with her for a day or two - to take the pressure off MIL y'know

CODwidow Sun 30-Dec-12 23:17:51

Just puts it into perspective though.

Ouch!! Dd just pulled away whilst still latched on, why does she do that!! So painful.

PurplePidjChickIsNotTheMessiah Sun 30-Dec-12 23:29:04

Hopefully for your H too, if you use the example to stop him acting like a knob!

R does that too so I unlatch him for the break he clearly wants then he cries for more hmm