Angels to believe or not to believe.

(85 Posts)
chubbymomie2012 Wed 16-Jan-13 22:53:04

Today I saw an interview with Lorna Byrne. She believes she can speak to the Angels. i wondered did anyone else see it or have any of you read the book she has written about her life. i am not sure what to think and im very interested in whatbyou guys think please.

amazingmumof6 Thu 17-Jan-13 12:07:06

no, but I read a nook called "Angles" by Hope Price

amazingmumof6 Thu 17-Jan-13 12:07:48

a book, not book, typo, sorry!

amazingmumof6 Thu 17-Jan-13 12:10:13

grrrrrrr, I can't even correct a mistake so I'm going to try again:

no, but I read a book called "Angles" by Hope Price

chubbymomie2012 Thu 17-Jan-13 13:48:07

lol. your typing is as good as mine. what did you think? i just ordered the book from Amazon cant wait to readit.

amazingmumof6 Thu 17-Jan-13 15:55:20

grin
well, I didn't read it to decide whether to believe or not, as I already did...

I think until something similar happens to you or someone you know well and trust there might always be a bit of doubt, it's one of those things that if you want to believe it you will, if you don't no amount of stories will convince you!

people choose to believe in angels and God, but only if there's a feeling or calling or seed of belief in their heart and minds.
and the non-believers will doubt and reject the idea that God or angels exist.

tough subject actually! I hope you'll enjoy it - and if you truly want to believe you will!

FeeFoo Thu 17-Jan-13 18:12:20

I've read her first book and thoroughly enjoyed it. It's a comforting read and anyone whose open to the idea of Angels, won't be disappointed.grin

susanann Thu 17-Jan-13 18:26:40

I believe in Angels. Im into spiritualism too. Its a fascinating subject, though some people think Im barmy! lol. Each to their own. Theres a lot of things we dont understand, that doesnt mean they dont exist!

Twosugarsplease Fri 18-Jan-13 19:11:39

I believe, have done since I kept having the same dream of a young girl all white, when I was 3 or 4, my parents split when I was 4, we moved out of the house when I was 4 also, and the bedroom I slept in was in the marital home, so I was definitely that age.
The girl was really pretty, pale, with very blonde, long hair., she was always sat in a bed, white sheets, and gown.
She was about 12 I would say, and I just remember having a feeling of admiration for her.
Even now if I see anyone who resembles her, I think of her.
I remember her clearly.
I believe she was perhaps my angel, now I am a parent myself, if my 3 to ds could tell me he was having reoccurring dreams if a nice young child, I would definitely think it was something very special, as a child you don't know or comprehend anything like that, looking back as an adult, that was definitely special.
I now send thoughts to them if I feel I need a little help in any way

expatinscotland Fri 18-Jan-13 19:12:39

No, I don't believe.

waitingtobeamummy Fri 18-Jan-13 19:16:13

Her book is brilliant! I believe totally and utterly.

CharlW1 Fri 18-Jan-13 19:17:33

I believe in Angels - whenever I see a feather I always think it's an angels way of saying they are there. Will have to read the book too.

waitingtobeamummy Fri 18-Jan-13 19:18:30

Their is also a book by glenyice (?) Eckersley. An angel at my shoulder. Very good.

susanann Fri 18-Jan-13 19:19:27

Yes I agree about the feathers!

suburbophobe Fri 18-Jan-13 19:23:20

Oh, Lorna Byrne is lovely. I saw her live a couple of years ago. Everyone in the audience got a hug from her!

I've read her first two books, not started on her third yet tho.

Did I mention I believe in angels? grin

chubbymomie2012 Fri 18-Jan-13 20:10:27

my copy of the book arrived this morning and i have read a little but its frightening me a little. not sure what that says about me.

IndigoBarbie Fri 18-Jan-13 21:53:14

I love angels, they are a huge part of my life. Just as was said above it's whatever your experiences are smile

Msbluebozooka Fri 18-Jan-13 23:54:44

I believe angels or guardians what ever we need to call them. There has been three occasions in my life that I have experienced this. I also believe when your times up its up. Makes me feel better when I get my heart ache.

tinselahohoho Sat 19-Jan-13 00:02:14

Not at all.

Feathers, pennies - they're lying around anyway; can't 'angels' do better than that?

I know a couple of people who have public profiles on this sort of thing and I still can't believe a word. However, it comforts some people and as long as it does no harm (which, I don't believe is necessarily the case with the people who make money out of it, but I mean those who just use it to get them through a hard time), then fair enough.

expatinscotland Sat 19-Jan-13 00:08:12

Exactly, tinsel.

timidviper Sat 19-Jan-13 00:41:51

I believe in angels and really think I saw one once.

I read Lorna Byrne's book though and did not find it convincing at all, I can't put my finger on it but something just didn't feel right to me about it.

headinhands Italy Sat 19-Jan-13 09:20:07

I can see that it's a comforting notion but I can't see any evidence for it. I'm sure a bit of googling would reveal the species of bird each and every one of these 'angel' feathers came from.

IndigoBarbie Sat 19-Jan-13 09:21:41

Re the feathers: I tend to find them at the exact moment a specific thought is crossing my mind. Pennies-check the year on them.
In my experience Angels use all kinds of communications with us. They cannot interfere with our own free will, unless you ask for help.

headinhands Italy Sat 19-Jan-13 09:30:12

So what were angels doing before humans started to believe in them?

seeker Sat 19-Jan-13 09:31:24

If you focus on something you will see lots of whatever it is, whether it's white feathers, or pennies. Or in my case, robins. I do not believe in life after death, and neither did my mother. But she loved robins, and I always feel happy when see one, because they remind me her. A different person would say that my mother sent the robin or was the robin. But no, it's just q robin. And when I die, my children take comfort from them too, because they will remind them of me and of their grandma. Nothing supernatural or spiritual. Just human connections.

chubbymomie2012 Sat 19-Jan-13 10:19:58

Timid viper I agree, I'm reading the book and I'm not convinced. I'm an intensive care nurse in a children's hospital and a lot of our parents use angel cards and angel 'things' for their kids. Some of them have very convincing stories but again it's a highly stressful environment for them and they get comfort from it. I want to believe but the "scientist" in me throws in doubts. I'm a Catholic so was brought up with the notion of a guardian angel and when I was a child everyone who knows me tells me about my obsession with my imaginary friends. The thought of seeing something now though terrifies me. If I'm on night duty I run through the corridors at work for fear of seeing something.

Do I believe???? I must do or I wouldn't be afraid! Do u think?

headinhands Italy Sat 19-Jan-13 11:37:06

Hi Chub, I reckon it comes down to the power of suggestion plus humans natural hyperawareness at night. I don't believe in ghosts but I wouldn't want to spend the night in a cemetery. Late at night I would end up thinking about horror movie scenes in cemeteries and my senses would be at such at heightened state I would be pooping my pants over every sound. grin

expatinscotland Sat 19-Jan-13 12:24:54

I agree, seeker. I'm not sure if there is life after death but don't believe in angels or fairies or unicorns, all the same ilk, as far as I can see.

PedroPonyLikesCrisps Sun 20-Jan-13 08:22:20

"Theres a lot of things we dont understand, that doesnt mean they dont exist!"

Doesn't mean that they do exist either. Like apostrophes, I mean what are they all about?

On a more serious note. Not understanding things means we should research them and find real answers rather than just making stuff up to explain unusual happenings.

susanann Sun 20-Jan-13 11:05:10

I believe I have looked into it and am not making stuff up. Of course its your perogative not to believe, just as its mine to do so.

headinhands Italy Sun 20-Jan-13 11:22:05

Susan, can I ask how you looked into it? Do you mean you read lots of books is was there more to it?

headinhands Italy Sun 20-Jan-13 11:25:34

Surely the question of existance has a yes or no answer. It's not 'yes' for some and 'no' for others.

PigletJohn Sun 20-Jan-13 12:26:59

it's not a question of existence, it's a question of belief.

Like all religions, it's an arrangement of stories made up by people who are mostly long dead, but probably thought they were acting for the best.

If you find that one of more of these stories appeals to you, you are free to believe that it's "true." And if not, not.

susanann Sun 20-Jan-13 12:36:32

I have read quite a lot on the subject. I have also had "supernatural" experiences that I dont think can be explained away. EG. messages from friends who have passed away. I assume you dont believe, which is fine. But I do get irritated by people who dismiss it as stupid and that people who believe are deluded or weak. (apologies if you are not like that head) I would not dismiss other peoples beliefs as I think its rude and posssibly hurtful. I take a live and let live attitude.

Viviennemary Sun 20-Jan-13 12:39:40

I'd like to believe in angels but I'm afraid I don't really. I read Lorna Byrne's book and was totally not convinced by it. Better not say what I really thought. But I am surprised she ever found a publilsher.

headinhands Italy Sun 20-Jan-13 12:45:24

Piglet, my last post was in response to Susan's claims that she had looked into it and wasn't making it up. It appeared that she maintains that her belief isn't just based on how appealing the notion of angels is but that there was something she felt more concrete behind her belief.

IndigoBarbie Sun 20-Jan-13 12:49:07

I take a live and let attitude too smile I mean, how can any of us ever judge or dismiss another's experiences? Regardless of what those might be. Sure, there are lots of people who make up stories etc, but I know what I feel is my reality and what I feel in my heart to be true.

It surprises me every day that if you stand up and say I know angels are real, and I talk to them everyday: that people think you are stupid for believing such hocus pocus. It's ok to believe in god though, right? Oh, wait.....can we prove he exists? We may never in our lifetimes have any kind of technological proof or measurement device that would show or prove the existence of god. But just look how many people in the world pledge their lives to teachings from various books on the subject, each one seeing 'their' truth.

I looked into it possibly like you did susanann and I felt like I had to share my stories. There's no way I'd try to convince anyone if anything. Like you said headinhands-it's a yes for some and a no for others.

If it feels like truth in your heart, then it feels like your truth.

headinhands Italy Sun 20-Jan-13 13:50:10

Number of people believing something is not evidence either way though is it. Same as feeling something to be true.

As Thing said over on t'other thread, I respect people but reserve the right to make judgements about the validly of any beliefs. Although no, I wouldn't walk into someone's house uninvited to quiz them on what they believe in but on a public forum, yes I will and I do. If people feel hurt then they probably shouldn't be airing their views in a public space. I personally like to have my views challenged robustly, it's how we all learn and adapt.

seeker Sun 20-Jan-13 14:16:31

"If it feels like truth in your heart, then it feels like your truth."

It may feel like your truth- but that doesn't mean it's true......

IndigoBarbie Sun 20-Jan-13 14:51:06

So how do we determine what feels true to us?

I do it with what my heart feels. Lots of us are told certain things by people and we choose to go with what they have said rather than what feels right to us.

seeker Sun 20-Jan-13 14:58:59

I'm glad you're not mending my car or taking my appendix out!

headinhands Italy Sun 20-Jan-13 14:59:44

So the things you believe in Indigo. No one ever told you about them prior to you believing in them? You've never read a book about them or discussed it with anyone and the information came to you via supernatural means without you having ever heard of them?

headinhands Italy Sun 20-Jan-13 15:06:11

Indigo, I reckon I try to determine what is fact the same way you do with 99% of what you think. I try not to use sheer feelings as they are very subjective.

PedroPonyLikesCrisps Sun 20-Jan-13 17:47:31

When we are presented with unusual situations which we don't understand, our brains attempt to fill in the gaps. We may think we have experienced things which we have not. This has been proven in many experiments.

So personally I place absolutely zero faith in the pure experiences of other people. I lay my understanding on well executed and repeatable experiments.

You can believe what you like, but just don't forget that even though you think you might have experienced something, doesn't mean that you have and even if you did, doesn't mean that just because you don't understand it that it is paranormal.

myroomisatip Sun 20-Jan-13 18:34:43

Well I believe, for many reasons.

Also I purchased a pack of angel cards for myself and one for my daughter and I used them fairly often. I think there are 44 cards - if that is relevant.

On using them say ten times, on eight occasions a particular card came out. It was 'Serephina'. I happened to mention this to my daughter who confirmed that she has had this card a few times also.

Neither of us could actually see how it was relevant to us as it told of a 'happy change or addition to the family'. I just kept worrying that my daughter would end up pregnant. As it turned out, another further removed family member announced that she was pregnant within two weeks.

I still use my cards when I feel troubled, they have been very well shuffled and cut and shuffled and there are many cards that have not come out for me, I often get the same messages and they are usually relevant.

I accept that the messages are vague and obviously designed to be uplifting but hand on heart, just skipping through them now, they are many that would not be relevant (unless my circumstances were to change).

I sent a pack to a dear friend who lives in another country and we were Skyping one evening and decided we would use our cards. We both chose one card out of the pack - and we both got the same card. I dont know what the odds of that are but I was fairly surprised by it.

Last December I did a spread of cards. Three times. Each time a particular card came out which was something that really pleased me but I was feeling sceptical. I put all the cards together shuffled and shuffled and cut and then asked my guardian angel, 'If this is true and this is what you want me to know, then this card will come out next' and it did. Absolute confirmation.

I dont make major decisions based on the cards but I do find them very comforting sometimes.

susanann Sun 20-Jan-13 19:06:55

my room, Ive done this too. Its amazing isnt it?

PedroPonyLikesCrisps Sun 20-Jan-13 19:13:50

Are all 44 cards different? If so, then the odds of two people selecting the same card are 1 in 44. So that's a nice coincidence but better odds than winning a tenner on the lottery.

These kinds of things are designed to be very wide reaching. A change or addition could refer to so many things, especially in a two week time frame. I reckon I could find a change or addition in my extended family every week of my life with no trouble at all. Even cards you think would bear no relevance to you, probably would if you drew them out because you be looking for them to be true.

I don't know what methods are used with the 'spreads' and shuffling. But having some experience with card tricks, I can tell you that it's very easy to make things appear like they are more common or important just by following some instructions.

You say they comfort you, and that's great. I'm not wishing to take that away from you, but ultimately they are just cards and there's nothing supernatural going on here!

seeker Sun 20-Jan-13 19:34:26

Coincidences happen all the time. Please don't be taken in. For example, I went to talk to my ds's new form tutor last week. It turned out that he is the uncle of a school friend of my dd's, who goes to a different school in a town 12 miles away.

COINCIDENCES HAPPEN ALL THE TiME!!!!

tinselahohoho Sun 20-Jan-13 20:44:33

I have worked closely with a number of psychics, they've all 'read' me, told me about my angels, 'done' my angel cards. Really, there was nothing there at all. They'd have been more accurate Googling me. Now, it was absolutely in their interest to impress me, but, even knowing that, there wasn't a single thing they could say that was accurate or relevant.

I think that, generally, a lot of people don't understand statistics and probability (I don't mean that in a snarky way, I'm no maths whizz myself, but many of the 'what are the chances of?' comments people make are a bit . . . misguided); sometimes we all need something to hold onto when things are tough; and, the people who punt this stuff are incredibly good at it.

Again, I'm not taking anything away from someone who has found the notion of angels helpful at a difficult time, but I could scream at some of the beliefs the career angelists and psychics have, and it can be downright dangerous and hurtful. No different to religion really.

myroomisatip Sun 20-Jan-13 22:03:16

smile thanks for your comments.

I have had many coincidences in my life but not always the same ones. And yes, all 44 cards are different.

I have been using my cards for almost seven years and believe me, I have shuffled and I have cut etc. and there are over ten cards that I have never ever drawn. My own response to that is a shrug of the shoulders. I dont worry about it.

tinselahohoho, I went to a medium recently. So far, at least 50% of what she said to me was totally accurate. What really surprised me was that she gave me the name of my mothers best friend. I was very careful not to lead her on, but in all honesty she never asked me any questions, she just came right out with it, got it right first time. I dont have any explanation. All I can say is that until you try these things for yourself you really dont know. smile

myroomisatip Sun 20-Jan-13 22:10:42

tinselahohoho

I will say this,

I dont use my cards when things are going great for me.

Why would I need to?

However, maybe when we are troubled we open ourselves up more. I dont know. Go and get your own pack of angel cards smile Then see what happens smile

I have had some amazing things happen to me that I cannot explain. I only know that they are good things.

headinhands Italy Sun 20-Jan-13 22:24:08

Why would these supernatural beings need 44 pieces of 3X5 card to communicate with you? Can't they just turn up at the dinner table and recite their spiel in English?

expatinscotland Sun 20-Jan-13 22:30:58

In a city of over a million people, I have run into one particular person I met only once in my life the past five times I have been in this place. Five. If he were an angel, I'd take it as a sign of . . . that woo exists. But seriously, it's just a coincidence. It means . . . we both like to shop in the same spots and drink wine in pubs.

seeker Sun 20-Jan-13 22:35:19

At least 50% accurate,eh? What a great hit rate. And I will put money on her scatter gunning and coming up with the name of your mum's best friend that way....Honestly, have a look at Derren Brown's work on cold reading on Utube,- it will really make you think.

tinselahohoho Mon 21-Jan-13 08:08:55

headinhands - exactly.

I'm not closed to things, I'll accept what there is proof of, so if there are angels and they chose to communicate directly with me, I'd be very interested. However, if they need someone on £40 a reading, or a pack of cards to do it for them, I do have a few questions hmm . . .

easylife73 Mon 21-Jan-13 08:32:49

Not getting involved in the debate at all - people will believe or not believe by their own choice - but statistically the odds of one person picking a particular card from a pack of 44 is 1 in 44. The odds of two people picking the same card is surely 1/44 x 1/44, so actually 1 in 1936.

expatinscotland Mon 21-Jan-13 08:34:30

And what are the odds of two random people meeting up in a city of over a million people five times in five months? Maybe he's an angel grin and next time I should hit him up for a reading instead of laughing about running into him so much.

seeker Mon 21-Jan-13 08:57:08

I once made a conscious decision to notice all the coincidences that happened to me in a week. I can't remember how many there were, but there were loads. Including selling three things on EBay and discovering that all three were going to small towns that were very very significant to me.

Oh and the probability thing. It's simply a 1:44 chance. What the other person has chosen does not affect what you choose. So there's a 1:44 chance of you choosing Azrail. And there is a 1:44 chance of your friend picking him too.

So actually not very unlikely at all!

headinhands Italy Mon 21-Jan-13 11:07:23

How did angels communicate with us before we had developed speech? Why are angels in developing counties so crap at their job?

seeker Mon 21-Jan-13 11:32:55

Why are angels always white?

Why don't they step in when somebody is in real danger or distress?

And why are they so incredibly elusive and so rubbish at communicating?

expatinscotland Mon 21-Jan-13 12:34:39

Good questions, seeker. Someone will be along to tell you they can't interfere with the will of God and yadda yadda yadda.

PedroPonyLikesCrisps Mon 21-Jan-13 18:56:16

"but statistically the odds of one person picking a particular card from a pack of 44 is 1 in 44. The odds of two people picking the same card is surely 1/44 x 1/44, so actually 1 in 1936."

No, because the card that the first person picks could be any card in the pack. The statistics only apply to the odds of the second person picking that same card out, hence one in 44. Basic statistics.

seeker Mon 21-Jan-13 19:11:04

And what the first person picks out has no effect at all on what the second person picks out. So it's 1:44 for person one, and 1:44 for person two.

Not understanding this is behind a lot of paranormal belief. Coincidences are really really common!

PedroPonyLikesCrisps Mon 21-Jan-13 19:54:04

It's 1 in 44 chance that person one picks a specific card, but in the case of two people simply picking the same card (not a pre-determined card), the probability on person one is 1 in 1 because it doesn't matter which card is picked. The second person then has a 1 in 44 chance of picking that same card, so the odds are (1/1)x(1/44) which is 1/44.

CloudsAndTrees Sun 03-Feb-13 20:36:03

I believe in Angels, but I'm sceptical about the cards. I think they can be used by angels to convey a message if your angel wants to, but I don't believe that every time someone picks up a deck of angel cards that they are automatically going to have angels communicating with them.

Why don't angels step in when somebody is in real danger or distress?

Well, there are lost of accounts from people that believe their lives have been saved by angels, so perhaps there are times that angels step in.

I came close to being in serious danger once, well, I was in serious danger but it could have been a lot worse. Something told me what I had to do to save my life, and I think now it may have been an angel, because I'm not sure how I would have known, or how I would have known how to do it so easily otherwise. I didn't think of angels at the time though, I hadn't really considered angels at all at that point in my life.

headinhands Italy Mon 04-Feb-13 10:38:46

Well, there are lost of accounts from people that believe their lives have been saved by angels, so perhaps there are times that angels step in.

So if personal testimony is as much proof as you need you also need to believe in werewolves, vampires, fairies, the loch ness monster, Yahweh, Allah and alien abductions etc.

I find the modern belief in angels as cute friendly beings with feathery wings to be quite odd.

People have communicated with angels throughout history - google John Dee and Edward Kelley for some fascinating stuff. But prior to the cute Bottticelli beings, angels were considered pretty scary messengers of the Gods and elaborate ceremonies had to be carried out in order to communicate with them. Angels spoke a language called "Enochian" which Kelley used to tell Dee that God wanted them to share their wives - nuff said!

I'd find it surprising that angels suddenly got to the 21st century and decided to start speaking through cards and new-age tat instead?

Anyway, I do believe in angelic forces, i.e. some sort of force that aids communication between us and the Divine, but not as cute feathery personal guardians?

PigletJohn Mon 04-Feb-13 15:39:59

if they're imaginary, then there is surely no problem at all. People just imagine whatever they like, with some influence from imaginary sightings they've heard from other people.

Titchyboomboom Sun 24-Feb-13 07:49:30

I believe in angels and often ask to see mine and am always greeted by a white feather. My mum also finds white feathers in her house

I have no idea if angels exist or not. I do talk to my dead gran quite a lot and like seeker I smile whenever I see her favourite bird - a song thrush. We have one that comes in the garden sometimes and it does make me feel better.

She also seems quite helpful when I ask her to help me find my keys grin

seeker Sun 24-Feb-13 08:04:34

"My mum also finds white feathers in her house"

She needs new pillows.

IndigoBarbie Wed 27-Feb-13 21:09:07

seeker, what exactly is it that attracts you to these threads?

seeker Wed 27-Feb-13 22:43:27

I don't like people being encouraged to believe nonsense. The white feather thing is particular nonsense-the are always white feathers everywhere

IndigoBarbie Wed 27-Feb-13 22:53:29

Seeker, using my own personal experiences as a reference point the 'white feather thing' is not nonsense. However, I can understand where you are coming from. I even make jokes about the white feather thing, and I explain it in a way that might help others understand what might be going on.

If you are no longer part of the physical world (or in the case of angels you didn't have a body anyway), then you don't really have a mobile anymore to text your loved ones, therefore you have to be so much more creative to get the message through. I know how crazy it actually sounds, but I only speak the truth of my own experiences, and I never encourage people to believe me - I always advise people to go with what resonates with them, no matter what someone elses says.

What if you were to consistently find black feathers? Would that mean that my pillow was full of black feathers? Each of us has our own perceptions of what is going on, I do believe though that any form of 'attachment' to receiving the signs from the other side is where it perhaps borders on dependency, and can be looked upon in a different manner.

seeker Wed 27-Feb-13 22:56:06

But I wouldn't consistently find black feathers, would I? Because pillows, coats, duvets and cushions are not stuffed with black feathers. Because the under feathers of pigeons are not black.

IndigoBarbie Wed 27-Feb-13 23:01:50

That's my point. I have found black feathers. It's not nonsense to me. Anything in the physical world can and is used as a mechanism to send a 'sign' or a message. Not everyone can hear in their mind the thoughts or messages from passed loved ones, therefore - they are creative in their choices, sometimes.

expatinscotland Wed 27-Feb-13 23:07:20

LOL @ seeker.

I agree.

seeker Wed 27-Feb-13 23:12:14

Near where I live there are a lot of naturalised parakeets. If you don't know that, you would think you had got a very special message when a green feather drifted down onto your picnic rug, as it did to me recently!

Pan Wed 27-Feb-13 23:14:56

I thought this was the Philosophy/Religion/Spirituality topic. Not the 'I am sooo bored and impressionable' topic. There must be one for them peoples, shorely??

<a tad harsh, but, still>

EllieArroway Thu 28-Feb-13 04:38:27

Not harsh Pan - try silly and irrelevant. Anyone can discuss religion & spirituality, it's not the private fiefdom of believers hmm

Pan Thu 28-Feb-13 08:27:13

That's a tad harsh, Ellie.grin

Cooroo Thu 07-Mar-13 13:58:18

I must lead a very sheltered life. I had no idea anyone actually believed in angels after the age of 4. Until I saw a section on them on a bookshop this week (next to 'Mythology', which made me wonder why they didn't just lump them together).

How can truth be 'your truth' when it is something as specific as angels existing? People have always believed in the supernatural, it seems to be a built-in thing. Doesn't make it true though.

IndigoBarbie Thu 07-Mar-13 14:34:24

What makes god some people's truth? How can god be true, or real? We each are subjective reality processors as a result of our learned experiences and our own perceptions and summations. It's all relative, truth is a relative concept.

Cooroo Thu 07-Mar-13 19:48:59

Some truths may be relative, though that probably has more to do with the way a proposition is worded. But surely there either is or is not some supernatural being outside of our normal experience? Creator or observer, loving father or impersonal. People may or may not believe, and may believe very sincerely, but they are either right or wrong.

IndigoBarbie Thu 07-Mar-13 21:13:31

And who would be the judge of that then? given that I cannot say you are right for your beliefs, as much as you cannot say I am wrong for mine.

At 4 I don't think I had any concept of what angels were, never mind that they were somehow 'real'.

I perceive angels to be real for me. That's it. I don't attempt to convince anyone, but I don't make stuff up either. If it's about sharing my experience, then yes, I do this. My experience cannot be measured or argued or quantified, nor do I require it to be. It just is what it is for me. I feel this is neither right or wrong.

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