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Just curious - how many muslims are on mumsnet?

(999 Posts)
Galvanise Sat 01-Dec-12 00:21:53

Hello/Salaam,

I know mumsnet has a wide and diverse population and I tend to recognise some MN usernames as regulars. Just intrigued to know how big/small a community it may be.

Of course, I respect that there may be those who do not wish to even identify themselves for various reasons - which is fine too.

I am not asking for 'religiousness' levels or any vital stats! Nor is this a muslim-only thread or an 'no non-muslims' thread.
If you really wish to tell me that you are not a muslim, that is fine too smile

<Waves enthusiastically to all muslims and non-muslims> smile

CoteDAzur Fri 11-Jan-13 20:22:30

I asked re Arabic words because it seems to me that you are using many of them between yourselves, even where perfectly adequate words in English exist. Like "niyyaa" (niyyah) rather than "intention". And you only seem to be using these words in a religious context, and not when you are saying for example "It wasn't my niyyah to hurt you".

It's not offputting or anything negative. I do understand what you are saying, even though I have to think a little about what they might be referring to. Just wondering why English people talking to each other in English would be using Arabic words in religious context rather than English ones.

Like "jahannam" rather than "hell", "shaitan" rather than "devil", etc.

HardlyEverHoovers Fri 11-Jan-13 20:25:07

Crescent I've never heard of the committee arrangement but it sounds great. Personally I'd rather risk being out of pocket in this life than the next!

Ansar really is great, as far as I know their finance comes from members, who all pay their 10 per month. I think they also have an investment side for people who want to invest money in a halal way, so some of the funding for loans might come through that too. You can always ring them for a chat, they are very friendly, and based in Manchester.

Alhamdulillah you pay back exactly the amount you borrowed, no charge or anything. They ask you to pay it back in a certain time period, and appreciate it if you pay it quicker, as they can then give than money to someone else, but they were very good with us when we felt we couldn't afford the amount they wanted us to pay back per month, and gave us a slightly longer period to pay it back in so we could pay a bit less. Basically they are there to help. I've been a member for years and they do such good work I wouldn't have cared if I never needed to get a loan from them.

WaynettaSlobsLover Fri 11-Jan-13 20:29:21

I use Arabic words for two reasons mainly, one because I'm around Arabic most of the time with dh and in laws and two out of habit. Arabic is a richer and more meaningful language than English so personally prefer to use Arabic in some words due to its meaning being stronger.

CoteDAzur Fri 11-Jan-13 20:35:25

crescent - re normal mortgage vs sharia-compliant mortgage

"the different between sharia and non sharia mortgages are NOT price"

My point was that what you pay fluctuates very close to prevailing interest rates. There are studies on this that show that interest payments of normal mortgages and so-called sharia-compliant payments of Islamic mortgages are curiously similar. Why?

"the difference is on what the profit is made from - the sharia compliant mortgage the bank buys the house and then SELLS it to you so their profit is made on the house, not profit made on lending you the money to buy the house."

And what do you think is the difference between this and a fixed-term fixed- interest mortgage? In both cases, the bank writes the cheque to buy the house from previous owners, therefore bank effectively owns the house. Then bank lets you live in the house as long as you continue to pay them a set amount of money over a set period of time.

If you see a difference, I would like to hear about it.

crescentmoon Fri 11-Jan-13 20:42:44

yes i agree. it probably starts with why do we use Allah between ourselves when God would be more suitable as we all speak English? i think because the arabic religious words reference islam specific concepts which is a variation on what waynetta said. when i use Allah i mean the Most Merciful or the Mighty and Majestic. but when i use God english word it can be little g god or big g God or gods plural or goddess feminine or the way the way the mainstream think of Jesus and God interchangeably when i dont mean that trinity God etc you get it lol.

hardly i used to think converts wouldnt be able to hack 'committee's because everytime iv explained it to an anglo muslim or non muslim the FIRST thing they say is 'but what if someone runs off with the money and doesnt finish paying'! but theres a large one with english convert sisters thats in its 3 year where everyone pays in 100 every month and one sister walks away with £1200. its not a 12 person one though - it has 10 sisters but two put in 'two hands' so they take two payments of £1000. lol its abit complicated - ansar sound great thats my first thing tomorrow if they are open!

nailak Fri 11-Jan-13 20:49:59

it sounds like new cred www.newcred.co.uk/

crescentmoon Fri 11-Jan-13 20:53:01

ok so iv had a look at ansar finances home finance scheme and first of all they allow a deposit of 20%! thats amazing definitely cheapest in the sharia compliant mortgage market i did not know that this was possible. but we need to be members for a year or a couple of years first subhanallah hardly DH and i were in the doldrums about never making it to 40%.

and the explanation of their mortgage scheme is very clear,

ok taken from this page:

http://www.ansarfinance.com/home-finance/

"A customer wants to purchase a house for which he does not have adequate funds. He approaches AFG who agree to participate with him in purchasing the required house. 20% of the price is paid by the customer and 80% by AFG. Thus AFG owns 80% of the house while the customer owns 20%.
After purchasing the property jointly, the customer uses the house as his main residence and pays rent to AFG to the extent of its share in the property. For instance if the market rent is £ 900 per month, the customer will pay AFG 80% of £900 which is £720 per month.
At the same time AFG’s share of the house is further divided in eight equal units, each unit representing 10% ownership of the house.
The customer agrees that he will purchase one unit each year thereafter. Accordingly, after the first year he purchases one more unit of AFG’s share of the house by paying 1/10 of the price of the house at the prevailing market rate.
This reduces AFG’s share of the house from 80% to 70%. Hence the rent payable to AFG is reduced to that extent. So the rent that the customer pays is 70% of £900, which is £630. At the end of the second year, the customer purchases another unit increasing his share in the property to 40% and reducing AFG’s share to 60% and consequently reducing the rent to that proportion.
This process goes on until at the end of eight years the customer has purchased AFG’s entire share of the house reducing AFG’s share to zero and increasing the customer’s share to 100%. At this point the customer pays zero rent and both the property purchase and tenancy agreements are terminated and AFG transfers the Title Deeds to the customer’s name."

it seems very clear and well explainable what do you make of it sisters? within 8 years that would require alot of gritting teeth though.

is this how a fixed term fixed interest mortgage works?

crescentmoon Fri 11-Jan-13 20:57:03

(newcred has 19.6% APR)

www.newcred.co.uk/borrowing.htm

what about you naila ever heard of committees growing up? i know asian muslims do it but not sure asian hindus would know but its based on the same honour based type culture.

HardlyEverHoovers Fri 11-Jan-13 21:05:44

Alhamulillah crescent the joys of information sharing! By the way, I'm not sure it has to be 8 years, think that might be just an example. Not sure though.

CoteDAzur Fri 11-Jan-13 21:08:34

crescent - Funny you should mention the words Allah & God. I was just thinking about that.

In Turkish, the words Allah and Tanri are used interchangeably. And Tanri is a very very old word that we share with ancient Mongols, from before Islam. I'm running it in my head as I type this, but I don't think we have that feeling that Arabic words are more fitting than our own in a religious context.

We also have quite a few religious words of Arabic origin, but they have been turned into Turkish words somewhere along the way and we can't even easily see which ones they are. Like, "jahannam" has become cehennem, "thewab" has become sevap, "niyyah" has become niyet and we do for example say things like "It wasn't my niyet to hurt you", so these words are not just used in a religious context but have become part of the language.

crescentmoon Fri 11-Jan-13 21:42:06

i think that the turks have been muslims for so long that it has become part of their language? whereas it would take some doing to get mashaallah or jannah into english.

however the word mecca is used in english to mean a centre for a specific group eg. a mecca for shoppers. theres also mecca bingo which secretly grates.

my chemistry alevel teacher who was this eccentric old guy once said to me 'oh well if muhammad wont come to the mountain the mountain will come to muhammad' and i was like muhammad? mountain? i still dont understand what that expression means or its history!

i read that whole wiki page. i remembered learning about the sky father term tengri from reading the first 3 of conn iggulden's (fiction) 'khan series' on genghis khan and his line.

nailak Fri 11-Jan-13 21:44:30

cote thats like urdu, instead of thewab they say sawab, instead of ramdhan they say ramzaan, etc instead of salaah they say namaaz, they also use the persian word khuda meaning God, like khudafiz etc.

I have used committees before, through my in laws. my sis in law normally organised it so i didnt have any issues, i didnt really think anyone would run off with the money!

nailak Sat 12-Jan-13 01:25:36

oh yeah i did do some work with solace, there was one sister who was like 60 and had arthiritis couldnt clean her house it was full of clutter, another who had a caesarean and 4 older kids, one who had newborn twins, one who had an op needing 6 weeks bed rest and a toddler, i didnt do much of the support service, more the household help.

WaynettaSlobsLover Sat 12-Jan-13 08:13:12

Nailak. How did you manage doing the household help what with having your own kids etc? I would like to get involved with solace when the kids are a bit older and ive given birth to this last one inshallah. I'm v familiar with it as aunties in the local community send out texts about it and the link to the website. I'm just glad it's up and running alhamdulilah.

crescentmoon Sat 12-Jan-13 08:17:20

may Allah reward you naila thats really good work. and its great that sister managed to get out of her marriage, though divorce is halal cultural conditioning has left alot of women thinking it is haram even when the Quran says they have that recourse.

nailak Sat 12-Jan-13 17:16:44

barakallah fi

i left my kids with my husband, it was like a few hours a week, i would tell myhusband there is this sister she has had an op etc, and he would say you have to go and help her, even though kids drove him mad, he thinks i am purer then him or something because i am a revert, that i have less sins or whatever, and i dont even feel like a new muslim right now, just a normal muslim, but he thinks that Allah must be guiding me and putting blessing in to my efforts, and if i say that it is a duty on us to help our neighbours then it is and he should enable that.

he basically lets me do what i want, and if i say i need you there is open day at the gym tomorrow, keep the kids, he will just remember he needs to keep the kids and not even bother remembering where i am going!

WaynettaSlobsLover Sat 12-Jan-13 18:35:41

Alhamdulilah for lovely husbands lol grin mashaallah it's all about helping the neighbour isn't it. Remember that Hadith (can't remember the narrator or the isnaad) but there was a follower of Mohammed (saw) who, when he heard the great rights given to neighbours, became concerned that even inheritance rights would be given to them! I think it's great you are helping sisters out even though you have kids, it's easy to use them as an excuse sometimes subhanallah. I'm really hoping to get more involved some point soon inshallah, so many people are in need but without the right help.

crescentmoon Sat 12-Jan-13 21:15:25

did anyone hear about these uk protests against 'that' film back in october? it involved thousands of people but no mention in the mainstream media at all.

i think because they involved roses, rocks get you onto the media sad roses dont! but mashaallah on the sisters and brothers for persevering anyway. the comments of non muslims are really heartening as well.

1st london protest against film

2nd london protest against film

manchester protest against the film

birmingham protest against the film

norway protest against film

auckland nz protest against film

vancouver protest against film

and this blog has pictures and details of other protests which i couldnt find videos of!

muslimroses.wordpress.com

crescentmoon Sat 12-Jan-13 21:23:16

double linked:

the one that started it off

i think its really important for us to reach out to our neighbours, both on our street and neighbours in our town/ city. they have huge rights on us almost to the point of inheritance lol as you quoted of the prophet (pbuh) waynetta! what do you all think though, the music is abit cheesy but subhanallah i would have liked to have got involved.

nailak Mon 14-Jan-13 17:46:13

salaam, been a bit quiet here? where do you all live? anyone up for a meet up? cote are u in uk?

CoteDAzur Mon 14-Jan-13 21:17:06

Much as I'd love to have a glass of champagne grin with you ladies, I'm in the South of France.

WaynettaSlobsLover Mon 14-Jan-13 21:20:16

I'm in south east London what about you guys? Cote you are very fortunate to have escaped the brutal British weather. I bet you are living it up on the sun and snail pâté aren't you? *drools at snail pâté due to weird pregnancy cravings

CoteDAzur Mon 14-Jan-13 21:23:36

I have to say it's not a bad place to live smile

Never heard of "snail paté". I'm not into snails nor paté, tbh. Love love LOVE oysters, truffle oil, and the wine, though grin

WaynettaSlobsLover Mon 14-Jan-13 21:28:42

I'll pass on the wine but second you on oysters and truffles. Do you visit turkey much?

nailak Mon 14-Jan-13 22:05:19

well how about we have the meet up at cotes house instead! lol

I am in East London,

Crescent?
hardly?
fuzzy?

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