Please read. Shocking blog about mum who had her twins taken away. :-(

(59 Posts)
TickledOnion Mon 18-Feb-13 21:20:06

helpbeth.org/about-our-campaign/ A friend linked to this on fb.

TickledOnion Tue 19-Feb-13 06:27:40

bump

PenguinBear Tue 19-Feb-13 06:43:17

That's disgraceful, I have signed!

thereistheball Tue 19-Feb-13 06:43:54

Have you got any other information about this? Perhaps something a bit less biased? Why did your friend link to it - does he/she know the mother? I would never sign a petition based on such a one-sided account of the story, or without knowing who was asking me to sign, or why.

medjool Tue 19-Feb-13 06:53:15

I've read about this In the press and it's heartbreakIng. I didn't read this article properly but I heard the case will be retried because the judge knows the father's family so was biased in his favour. It sounds like Austrian social services are even more screwed up that British. Both kids have had teeth removed but they haven't looked into their quality of care.

TheNebulousBoojum Tue 19-Feb-13 07:14:10
thaliablogs Tue 19-Feb-13 08:04:35

What a horrible story. Those poor children.

foreverondiet Tue 19-Feb-13 14:04:47

Yes truly vile story.

re: thereistheball - after I read about it the first time my reaction was the same as you, but on looking into it further, and I have read several articles on it - sadly the article isn't one sided, its a huge miscarriage of justice, and as a result Beth's two little boys are being neglected.

milk Tue 19-Feb-13 15:31:43

I am honestly horrified this injustice could be allowed!!!

There must be a new court hearing with all the facts!

milk Tue 19-Feb-13 15:32:48

thereistheball I also thought it was biased, then I heard the whole story and I am just in utter shock!

OHforDUCKScake Tue 19-Feb-13 15:42:50

Its not very intelligently. All the bold, underline and italics make me go hmm.

_^The childrwn are confused and disturbed^_

Really? In what way? How? Nappies at nearly 4 is not that bigger deal.

It'd be horrendous if the first bit were true. Unfortunately the very bias of it and poorly written angle make me wonder if any of its true.

milk Tue 19-Feb-13 16:15:21

The blog does read like it was written by the Daily Mail.

milk Tue 19-Feb-13 19:07:19

Super bump!

EndCorruptionInAustria Tue 19-Feb-13 20:13:21

I would urge everyone to sign this petition and email everyone you know to sign this petition. It needs to be publicized on all your social networks (facebook, twitter, etc) as much as you can.

The petition only calls for fairness in the Austrian courts which should be a fundamental human right anyway. There is nothing controversial about it. Anyone who discourages this action is probably a friend or supporter of the perpetrators of this atrocity.

Even if only 1% of what I read on the blog is true, I would be horrified enough to put my name to this cause. There has been enough independent media coverage to give me enough confidence that this woman needs our help!!

www.change.org/en-GB/petitions/the-british-and-austrian-governments-ensure-a-fair-court-hearing-for-beth-alexander-s-twin-sons-in-vienna-2

PickedLast Tue 19-Feb-13 20:46:31

I had the same doubts when I first heard about the case but I have now been following it for many months and have no doubt that a terrible miscarriage of justice has come about here.

It is unusual that a judge should remove children from a mother, a competent mother. It has come to light that the judge is a friend of the father. The children have deteriorated whilst in his care, noticeably, both physically and mentally. This should have alarm bells ringing, and social services investigating... but they aren't.

OHforDUCKScake - I understand your doubts but I would ask you to consider what I mention above and hope you realise that there is something unusual about this case that deserves attention.

bodo2 Tue 19-Feb-13 20:59:05

It truly is a terrible story. Every time a new update is published, it seems to be worse than the one before. She has been totally let down by the systems in place and ultimately, the children are suffering greatly. I urge everyone to sign the petition and help to spread the word about this shocking case.

treedom Tue 19-Feb-13 21:00:40

Why are people being nitpicky about writing style when it is clear that it is WRONG that a mother should not even know the basics about her children e.g. why were their teeth removed? At the very least these children deserve a fair trial. Imagine your kids without a mother. Please sign and share.

Signed!!! Poor boys and poor mother sad

ladypineapple Tue 19-Feb-13 21:43:10

Please please sign this thanks

hendoner Tue 19-Feb-13 21:44:00

I have namechanged for this as I'm too easy to identify otherwise.

I also thought the story was quite strange and one-sided when I first read it in July but obviously very sad and disturbing. So I talked to one of her brothers who I know and then dug further. This is what I found through a database of Austrian courtcases which confirms one of the incidents I had been told.

ge&Dokumentnummer=JJT_20110128_OGH0002_0060OB00253_10I0000_000&ResultFunctionToken=f4d93840-3ce2-43c1-884a-0f3ffa839694&Position=1&Sort=2%7cDesc&SearchInAsylGH=&SearchInBegut=&SearchInBgblAlt=&SearchInBgblAuth=&SearchInBgblPdf=&SearchInBks=&SearchInBundesnormen=&SearchInDok=&SearchInDsk=&SearchInEbm=&SearchInEbmj=&SearchInGemeinderecht=&SearchInJustiz=&SearchInLgbl=&SearchInLrBgld=&SearchInLrK=&SearchInLrNo=&SearchInLrOO=&SearchInLrSbg=&SearchInLrStmk=&SearchInLrT=&SearchInLrVbg=&SearchInLrW=&SearchInNormenliste=&SearchInPvak=&SearchInRegV=&SearchInUbas=&SearchInUmse=&SearchInUvs=&SearchInVerg=&SearchInVfgh=&SearchInVwgh=&ImRisSeit=Undefined&ResultPageSize=100&Suchworte=zwillinge

If your German is better than mine you can read it or put it into chrome/google translate which is what I did.

It appears that SHE had custody of the kids initially and it was then removed. I do not know why. There is also reference to the husband being forcefully removed from the marital home.

What I have been told is that she was abused and the incident of the removal related to her husband turning up with a doctor friend attempting to sedate her and section her. She sensibly called the police and the court case above seems to show that the husband's behaviour was completely uncalled for or in more simple terms assault.

I agree it does seem one-sided but as I can see it there are only two extreme options and the truth is likely to lie somewhere between them.

1. She is an unfit mother or
2. He has manipulated the Austrian system to abuse her and his boys.

The reason why I think 1 is unlikely is for the following reasons:

1. He has never defended himself through a campaign of communal newspaper reports and blogging since July. The newspapers regularly print at the end that they have asked for his comment. If there was a clear case that she is an unfit mother surely he would have raised it by now?

2. Social services are not infalliable. We known this from experiences in this country - Baby P, Victoria Climbie. I also have a good friend who was in an abusive relationship in another country. She succeeded in divorcing her not so dh and had to deal with social workers. She had 1 who insisted on her exh having sole visitation rights because it's important to protect the father's relationship with the dc. This is a father who had given the oldest child a fear of having her hair washed as he regularly held her head under water while washing her hair. The child was 18 months at the time. So while some social workers are very good this cannot be said of all.

Some of their recommendations sound like sheer lunacy. She's meant to pay alimony and find a job as a cleaner. She has a degree from Cambridge and had not worked since the boys were born. He has enough money to pay for 2 philippinos to look after the boys.

3. She is a foreigner living in a foreign country not able to work the system or speak the language to native standard. All these factors prejudice the outcome against her. If you google Austria, divorce, custody, foreign parent you find stories of prejudice against foreigners in divorce cases. In addition, if you look at some of her blogs on the case they reveal different attitudes. For example he made a case that she was an unfit mother because she didn't know how to put a calpol suppository into the babies after an operation. As we all know suppositories are not generally prescribed in the UK and I personally have never had to insert one with 3 kids.

My only reservation is I don't know how much petitions will actually achieve as what she needs is for the courts to give her custody of the kids and let her live somewhere where she can be supported as a single mother. And that in my view needs a good lawyer. However, the more spotlight that's put on this case the less likely it is to be forgotten.

Maybe getting the Daily Mail to look into it wouldn't be such a bad idea....

Tabliope Tue 19-Feb-13 21:45:22

Having read through her blog I've signed too. One of the reasons she was told she was an incompetent parent was she didn't know how to insert a paracetamol suppository. The letter from two UK doctor's explaining that culturally they're rarely used in the UK (paracetamol usually given as a syrup) means it wasn't surprising she was nervous about doing it. Not just this but there seems to be many little things in the blog that don't sound right. Also those kids looked far healthier and happier when they were younger and still with her. I hope she gets them back.

TickledOnion Tue 19-Feb-13 21:49:06

Thanks for the bump milk and for the extra information hendoner.

dramaqueen Tue 19-Feb-13 22:00:29

I have signed. Poor, poor woman.

Sharv Tue 19-Feb-13 22:04:00

Heartbreaking

Sharv Tue 19-Feb-13 22:26:11

http://helpbeth.org/visit-sunday-17th-february/

girliefriend Wed 20-Feb-13 20:05:39

I have signed, poor woman and poor kids sad

Zipitydooda Wed 20-Feb-13 22:21:14

Bumping this; poor children.

FriggFRIGGisPoorlySick Thu 21-Feb-13 23:28:42

Signed.

It is beyond me to even contemplate anyone forcibly parting my children from me,let alone having to watch,from a distance as their development deteriorates.

sad

TiredMule Fri 22-Feb-13 14:43:18

signed and shared on my facebook page. I will be following this case and I just hope those poor boys are reunited with their mother VERY soon sad

OliviaMumsnet (MNHQ) Fri 22-Feb-13 20:51:45

Hi there
We have moved this to our petitions noticeboard

EndCorruptionInAustria Wed 27-Feb-13 20:40:29
PatsysPyjamas Sat 02-Mar-13 21:11:40

There is a piece about Beth Alexander in this month's Easy Living. I read it, cried, then googled her straight away. she seems to have had v little UK coverage, except the Jewish Chronicle. Why isn't the Daily Mail covering this?

The piece in Easy Living concurs with what hendoner was told. I agree that if whoever wrote the petition site happens to be reading, it would be really helpful if some more detail was given.

EndCorruptionInAustria Sun 10-Mar-13 02:37:54

There has been extensive coverage in the Austrian media:

http://helpbeth.org/category/media/heute/

http://helpbeth.org/category/media/kurier/

http://helpbeth.org/category/media/tv/

If you feel it should be covered in the daily mail, then everyone reading this should contact them to ask them to cover the story. They won't listen to one person alone.

I'm not sure how much more detail PatsysPyjamas is looking for. The http://helpbeth.org site is pretty comprehensive and even contains a video explaining what has happened. The main message to take away is that the court that was previously handling the custody case has now been suspended on suspicion of alleged corruption pending investigation from a higher authority. It has been a number of weeks since this suspension took place, yet the Austrian authorities don't seem particularly interested in installing another court. Is this how an EU country should be conducting itself? Austria needs to be shamed in front of all the other countries for their abysmal disregard of the human rights law to give everyone a fair hearing in court.

I will be at the demonstration on Wednesday wagging my finger at the Austrian embassy in London and I hope you will all be there too.

Austria claimed they knew nothing about the Fritzl scandal, Austria claimed they knew nothing of the Kampusch scandal, are Austria going to brazenly claim they knew nothing of the Schlesinger twins scandal once it is too late?

Longdistance Sun 10-Mar-13 03:32:08

Signed.

The trainee doctor should have his doctorate removed. And all those involved should be sacked. Those children look abused. Four front teeth missing, their hair looks matted, and their overall outlook is poor. Those poor children sad

Their father should be imprisoned for abuse, not just of the children, but the system too.

It's made me feel rather ill, that a so called 'civilized' country like Austria can let this happen!

EndCorruptionInAustria Thu 28-Mar-13 10:13:55
EndCorruptionInAustria Mon 15-Apr-13 00:51:36
EndCorruptionInAustria Mon 10-Jun-13 23:26:25

This case is certainly getting more attention now. Please fill out this small online form to alert your local UK MP.

helpbeth.org/tamba-endorses-our-campaign-for-justice/

I have signed it and hope you will too. This small effort could save the twins and give them a proper childhood.

EndCorruptionInAustria Sun 30-Jun-13 10:15:24

The more I read about this case, the more I am shocked:

helpbeth.org/the-vienna-review/

EndCorruptionInAustria Tue 09-Jul-13 09:59:38
EndCorruptionInAustria Fri 12-Jul-13 08:19:10
EndCorruptionInAustria Wed 24-Jul-13 21:34:07

helpbeth.org/custody-decision/

Please email this link to everyone in your contact list, share it on your facebook status, tweet it on Twitter and broadcast in every way you can. Everyone is entitled to justice.

“You may never know what results come of your actions, but if you do nothing, there will be no results.”
― Mahatma Gandhi

EndCorruptionInAustria Fri 02-Aug-13 14:12:41
EndCorruptionInAustria Fri 09-Aug-13 08:14:37
EndCorruptionInAustria Wed 06-Nov-13 20:16:41
EndCorruptionInAustria Sun 24-Nov-13 23:33:21
EndCorruptionInAustria Sat 30-Nov-13 20:01:43
EndCorruptionInAustria Sat 14-Dec-13 19:56:55

Finally, it looks like it is becoming widely accepted that corruption is undoubtedly at play in the the judge's rulings:

helpbeth.org/jewish-chronicle-12-12-2013/

EndCorruptionInAustria Sun 15-Dec-13 19:26:05
EndCorruptionInAustria Wed 18-Dec-13 22:54:17
EndCorruptionInAustria Tue 07-Jan-14 21:40:32

Judicial incompetence or corruption?

helpbeth.org/jewish-telegraph-03-01-2014/

MisForMumNotMaid Tue 07-Jan-14 21:50:22

Signed.

ILoveGlyfada Tue 07-Jan-14 22:10:51

Just awful.
Signed it.

EndCorruptionInAustria Wed 05-Feb-14 22:34:56

And just in case anyone had any last remaining doubt...

helpbeth.org/last-visit-tuesday-4-february-2014/

EndCorruptionInAustria Fri 07-Feb-14 00:27:29

Serious stuff. Gradually the world is waking up to the reality of the situation:

helpbeth.org/british-parliament-14th-january-2014-highlights-and-discussion/

Pimpf Fri 07-Feb-14 01:05:22

Signed

EndCorruptionInAustria Tue 18-Mar-14 01:54:54
ljny Tue 18-Mar-14 02:07:10

How horrible.

Signed.

EndCorruptionInAustria Tue 18-Mar-14 23:37:57
EndCorruptionInAustria Mon 07-Apr-14 22:54:00

How can this Rabbi be so evil whilst claiming to be so righteous?

daattorah.blogspot.co.at/2014/04/schlesinger-twins-court-document-rabbi.html

daattorah.blogspot.co.uk/2014/03/schlesinger-twins-rabbi-bidermans.html

Please write to your local Rabbi and ask for Biderman to be "struck off" in light of his actions.

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