Possible reflux?? Ways to ease it?

(74 Posts)
ratbagcatbag Sat 13-Apr-13 01:38:21


Got a dd who's four weeks old, after every feed she's hiccuping and being sick and generally unsettled. Worst thing is I can get her to sleep sat up, or on her tummy on me, but the moment she lays on her back no matter how deep a sleep she's in, she wakes after about ten mins because she's been gurgling away with sick coming up, and you can here it all in the back of her throat sad
I raised the Moses basket with a few books but that seemed to make it worse as she can't spit out what's in her throat.
Anyone got any experience of this?

Bessie123 Sat 13-Apr-13 02:01:54

Sorry to hear your dd has reflux. My ds' reflux was caused by food intolerance/allergies. Are you breastfeeding? If so, you might want to consider changing your diet, to see if that has any effect. If you are formula feeding, try a special formula for allergies.

My ds had problems with dairy, egg and soya.

ratbagcatbag Sat 13-Apr-13 02:05:17

Thanks Bessie, I'm going to go to the drs on Monday, I'm doing all the other stuff, smaller regular feeds, sat up for ages after feed, burping lots during one feed, she's fab until I lie her down. sad

Bessie123 Sat 13-Apr-13 02:09:18

Don't let the doc fob you off and tell you it's normal - the gp dismissed my concerns for a whole year, then dp and I figured it out on our own sad andds could finally sleep for more than half an hour without pain.

Ds had overly runny and strange coloured poos, too, if that helps you identify a problem..?

Notsoyummymummy1 Sat 13-Apr-13 06:35:37

We found Infacol sometimes helped with reflux and raising one end of the cot slightly like you've done helped to stop the milk coming back up.

DolomitesDonkey Sat 13-Apr-13 06:56:41

Time. confused We finally got a diagnosis at 17 weeks and changed formula to a "stay down" one which helped, although I honestly think by that point he was coming past the worst anyway. Weaning helped a tremendous amount.

We too worried about intolerances but now at 14 months it is quite clear that gannet has no issues in that dept.

DolomitesDonkey Sat 13-Apr-13 06:57:02

Oh and in desperation gaviscon.

gd1976 Sat 13-Apr-13 07:06:23

I would try and get into the system to see a paed consultant as unfortunately most GPS aren't very knowledgable about reflux. We weren't diagnosed until 17 weeks with ds1and with my second ds I knew the signs, got him diagnosed early and managed to get him on the right milk and meds and his wasn't too bad to live with, so hope you can get a referral. I hope you're ok, I know how hard it is sad

MiaowTheCat Sat 13-Apr-13 20:34:21

Just been to our GP about DD2 - "oh we don't do anything unless they're gaining weight" says he, about to launch into a "stressy mummy fob-off" manouver... changed his tune slightly when I reeled off a list of things that were making me suspect reflux and made it fucking obvious I knew what it actually was - plus I did play the premature baby card as well.

We've been trying milk thickener for a couple of days now - it seems to have helped a lot.

Overberries Sat 13-Apr-13 20:41:30

Sounds like it. DD had the same - gaviscon and upright for half an hour after each feed did the trick. Gaviscon is a pain when BF though, I ended up giving 1oz formula with gaviscon in before every BF... for 9 months!! It worked though :-)

stargirl1701 Sat 13-Apr-13 20:45:40

Talk to both your GP and HV. Ask for a paediatric referral so you're in the system. Ask about infant Gaviscon. Ask about Reflux formula. Ask about milk feed thickeners. Ask about Ranitidine. Have a look for a sleeping wedge online. Try to get to a sling meet nearby to find a sling that suits you - I loved my Kari-Me. Keep baby upright 30 mins after feeds.

And, good luck. Reflux can be hell for everyone.

ratbagcatbag Sat 13-Apr-13 23:44:28

Thanks stargirl, miaow what did you say to convince them?
Will they give me a paed referral straight away? There is no way I'm leaving on Monday without something such as milk thickeners to try. I've done everything advised that isn't medication and she can't lie down for more than twenty mins without choking and crying.

nannyof3 Sat 13-Apr-13 23:53:38

Is she formula fed

If so, change the milk to a 'comfort or stay down' milk

ratbagcatbag Sun 14-Apr-13 07:25:14

She is formula fed.

After another night of horrendous sleep and the added bonus sg is now refusing half her feed despite being hungry I'm waiting for a call back from nhs direct,I know they're not always fab but if I cn get a prescription for something sooner to help her then bonus.

You guys are keeping me sane so many thanks as its bloody tough.

DolomitesDonkey Sun 14-Apr-13 07:39:56

ratbag My GP referred me to the consultant straight away and we had an appointment the next day I think it was (not NHS obv.) - whilst the consultant was doing what they do, my son looked up and spewed on him... case pretty much closed! wink

We were told to change formula, use gaviscon when he was really suffering and if things didn't improve they could keep him in 24 hours to monitor the levels of acid coming up and if necessary could perform a small surgical procedure. Thankfully the change of milk did the job. Just being told it was reflux helped enormously because until that point I think we thought we were going mad.

ratbagcatbag Sun 14-Apr-13 08:19:04

Well nhs direct have sent me to a and e, thankfully it's empty. Will update later.

GiraffesAndButterflies Sun 14-Apr-13 08:29:13

Marking place as sounds just like my 8 week old. Good luck ratbag

ratbagcatbag Sun 14-Apr-13 10:45:11

Saw paeditrician, he confirmed reflux, and has prescribed infant gaviscon, he said give it a week and if no better go back it drs. He also suggested once fed putting her up on my shoulder similar to how I'd wind her for twenty mins to let milk digest. I really don't like our drs so the fact she's been diagnosed by a paed makes it easier if I have to I back just to move to the next thing to try and resolve. I'm hoping fir a miracle that involves at least an hours sleep tonight smile

Cuddlydragon Mon 15-Apr-13 18:45:34

Good luck and don't get disheartened if gaviscon doesn't help, there are several meds that can help too. Good luck. My DS had sever reflux but since we hit the right meds he's a happy little thing.

furryfriends57 Mon 15-Apr-13 21:11:18

Had to reply as this happened with DD and I got no support from anyone, either medical or other mums I knew. I tried infant gaviscon and it caused more problems eg constipation. What worked for her was cranial sacral therapy, within days she was much happier and less refluxy. Cranial therapist was very good with babies and also suggested limiting milk feeds to every 3 hours as more frequent feeds can result in part digested milk to mix with new milk and mess up digestion. It worked for us and is well worth considering. Best of luck as its so upsetting to see LO so sick.

ratbagcatbag Mon 15-Apr-13 21:34:11

Thanks both, gaviscon has definitely shown a massive improvement in dd, far less sicky and first night ever she didnt choke all night, she did in the early hours get a bit worse, however in my sleep deprived state I put her in bed with me (very bad as not set up co-sleeping) and had a lovely three hours straight through.

Cuddlydragon Mon 15-Apr-13 22:05:46

Glad to hear that ratbag. Sleep helps! Pm if I can give you any reflux help. We are 9 months in and asides from medication once a day and being careful introducing foods, DS is fine. There is light.

DolomitesDonkey Tue 16-Apr-13 05:28:37

That's great news ratbag - I know when I first gave gaviscon it was almost as though his whole body made a sigh of relief and he settled straight down and slept through.

Cuddly is right, it does get better - and then you can congratulate yourself for surviving and your marriage still being intact - my god we had some barneys - I don't think either of us could think straight for months.

ratbagcatbag Tue 16-Apr-13 05:33:25

Bugger spokento soon, a bit more unsettled, but it's because I couldn't get her to bring up wind, which then always seems to make the reflux worse, still an improvement though, if still hit and miss ill go back to the drs and ask bloody demand to try something else. smile

I'm just glad there is so much info around and you know because of threads like these it's not normal and you need to be forceful in getting what you need.

acjfluff Tue 16-Apr-13 06:34:29

My now 18 week old DS was diagnosed with reflux at 8 weeks and put on infant gaviscon.

I found that he would still bring up milk during his feed so I stopped winding him until 5 minutes or so after he'd finished a bottle. I'm only guessing but I think this gave the gaviscon a chance to work properly.

He now only needs sitting up and a bit of back rubbing to burp. He always had difficulty with trapped wind so I was a bit dubious about doing this but it was the only thing that seemed to help. As the reflux has calmed down, his painful trapped wind has also reduced.

I really hope your DD improves soon for you, I know how you feel. We had 8 weeks of misery but now have a happy, chuckling boy who still throws up occasionally smile

ratbagcatbag Wed 17-Apr-13 09:28:05

Hi again everyone

Gaviscon has definitely eased her symptoms but she's still gurgling and choking and generally unsettled, I'm going to go back to the drs with her, but wanted advice on what the next step on medication is as I really don't want to be fobbed off, last night was hell.

ratbagcatbag Wed 17-Apr-13 19:24:01

Hello, just bumping for advice before I go to the drs tomorrow morning on what my next steps should be.

lifesobeautiful Wed 17-Apr-13 20:47:46

Ugh reflux is horrible - it's just awful seeing them uncomfortable.

Gaviscon worked very well for us. He still used to bring up milk a bit - but he wasn't uncomfortable. The really revolutionary thing for us was a dummy - which was recommended by our GP I think. The sucking helps keeps the acid down and gives them comfort. You give it to her straight after her bottle.

Otherwise I"m afraid you just have to keep a huge supply of muslins and dribble bibs at hand and wait it out. They do grow out of it and it will get better.

Good luck!

lifesobeautiful Wed 17-Apr-13 20:50:32

Oh sorry - just saw your latest posts. They'll probably offer you ranitidine - which is like zantac, and I think works well, though DS never had it. You just have to be very firm with the doctor about how serious you think it is.

Cuddlydragon Thu 18-Apr-13 00:02:35

Ranitidine is very very weight sensitive. It needs adjusted every pound or so. Losec less so but much harder to give if they prescribe Losec Mups over the solution.

ratbagcatbag Thu 18-Apr-13 00:40:49

From your pm cuddly I've been looking it all up. I tried lying dd down within minutes she was choking and distressed. sad I'm going to ask for losec, I can't see me getting the solution, but I'm going to ask for it. Also ordering a sleep wedge on next day delivery from the website you recommended, I'm hoping a 15 degree incline is enough, she seems to need a very small one once settled, so currently she's in the crook of my arm , so virtually lying down, no choking at all. I'm really hoping that works.

It will be a big change here as she's nearly outgrown her Moses basket so have got to dismantle her big cot bed and reassemble it in our room, getting the cat net tomorrow for cot bed, although as the cat is glaring at me lots when I have dd I'm not sure that she's going to be that bothered. Wedge will turn up Friday, so Friday night I really hope I get some sleep, interestingly dd can go over four hours when propped up, so lets see.

MiaowTheCat Thu 18-Apr-13 08:26:32

We've had a rough couple of days of it - not so much the upchucks, which have dropped to a weak watery dribble so the milk's not coming up as much - but with her just being so uncomfortable, and sometimes I HAVE to put her down in her basket as I've got a just turned 1 year old, who's learnt to crawl and is hellbent on finding ways to try to injure herself or destroy things... plus she's desperate for some of my time and attention too. Zero sleep the last two nights - I've got pain in my shoulders from trying to sleep with her supported semi-upright to make her more comfortable... she won't even tolerate being in a sling so that's not an option.

Just not even sure it's worth going back to the GP since they're of the opinion that weight gain = all is good and shiny and happy.

Cuddlydragon Thu 18-Apr-13 11:23:13

Oh no Miaow, please please go to gp and ask for a referral. Honestly not being content or happy is enough to treat. Weight loss is only an indicator. I get so cross with GPs. I ended up changing gp as he disagreed with the paed, who is a specialist in reflux. My gp wouldnt adjust meds for weight even on the paeds telephone advice. My DS weight gain was ok because we sat hour on hour dribbling milk in if he would take it, sometimes with a syringe. Weight loss and more importantly dehydration is just another bloody problem to fix. Please, it doesn't have to be so miserable for both of you.

Cuddlydragon Thu 18-Apr-13 11:25:36

Rat, I prefer the mups. The solution is hard to find and unstable. The mups tablet dissolves in a teeny bit of water and can be syringed in. I have proper local dispensing chemist who could make the solution but the tablets were more reliable for us. 15 degrees worked for us.

MiaowTheCat Thu 18-Apr-13 12:42:23

Going to broach it again in her 6 week check which should be in a week and a bit's time (but the damned GP hasn't put the appointment slots on the system to get things booked in yet - grrr)... poor lass has a frown line wrinkle already and she's only 4 weeks old!

She's so far (touch wood) been better today - taken two nice big feeds in one installment, settled straight off after the second one as well in her sloped moses basket.

Hoping if I can get the 6 week check booked with the decent GP I normally see I can push the protecting my maternal mental health angle (I've had anxiety issues for a while linked to my first's birth) and get some joy that way if needs be.

Nicolaeus Thu 18-Apr-13 13:07:34

Def keep trying. We tried lots of meds until at 6 months we were told there was nothing else to try (not in uk). At 9 months the paed was concerned that DS was still throwing up 10 times + a day and referred us for tests. Then a gastro specialist (for children). FINALLY got meds which worked when DS was 12 months.

The difference to his sleep was incredible. Still threw up occasionally until 15 months but is better now at 19 months (tho still on meds)

ratbagcatbag Thu 18-Apr-13 13:24:59

Ok my lovely dr went to prescribe losec, but in our area it can only be done via paeditrician, cue emergency referral going through smile more gaviscon given and the wedge you advised on the site cuddly is being delivered tomorrow, I was seeing how low n angle I could get dd last night whilst she was sleeping on me and I was on mn, interestingly so long as she stayed upright for thirty mins then it was fairly low, so I'm hoping the 15 degree one does it.

Meow you ought to look at baby reflux.co.uk, they explain thy to get the same angle as a 15dgree wedge you would need nine house bricks under the end of the cot, the wedge is fairly cheap too, around £20. Well worth a try, I'm hoping tonight is my last bad night.

MiaowTheCat Thu 18-Apr-13 13:30:25

Going to look at the wedge but it needs to wait till payday next week cos we're desperately skint since all the outlay from me spending the best part of a month and and out of hospital on and off's just hit this month (flipping TV and parking charges!) The moses basket's quite easily inclined - I just wrapped a load of blankets around one of the parts of the stand, harder to do with the cot really.

DolomitesDonkey Thu 18-Apr-13 14:57:45

Don't worry about the wedge - just stick books under the legs of one end of the cot! smile

Cuddlydragon Thu 18-Apr-13 18:28:13

Glad you've got a plan of attack guys. Good luck!

ratbagcatbag Sat 20-Apr-13 01:57:26

Cuddly, I possibly luffs you for ever and ever wine flowers hell more flowers this is my first check in after putting dd down in her own cot at 10:45, that means I've had nearly three hours fantastic deep sleep as there was no choking or gurgling and dd woke me purely by making sucking noises although ignoring the fact she has taken 1 measly oz and is snoring again the wedge has worked, I still need to sit her up for thirty mins, but she was zonked on it and didn't wake up when I put her down. Also thanks to advice re gaviscon, I noticed shes not constipated but its definitely changed consistency of poo and she's struggling so I've stopped daytime gaviscon as can have her upright for ages and currently just using it in the night feeds which are getting less as shes settled. I guess we will have good and bad days, but at least this is a fab start.
Miaow I found it really has made such a difference smile

ratbagcatbag Sat 20-Apr-13 02:17:38

Sorry, also massive thanks to everyone else who offered advice too, it was also invaluable and I have no doubt ill be back again soon asking for more smile

ratbagcatbag Sat 20-Apr-13 08:29:39

Bugger second half of night nowhere near as good, but it's also dd first night in a cot so when put her down the second time she woke up which then resulted in getting het up, this made reflux worse so back in on dad upright for hours. Oh well, I know it does work.

MiaowTheCat Sat 20-Apr-13 17:20:23

Interested to hear how it's going - looking into wedges the middle of next week-ish.

Anywhere easy to get Carobel over the counter anyone knows of? (Boots is miles away) Don't really want to be bothering the GP for a prescription since he was snotty about prescribing it the first time around and I live in fear of running low on anything!

We had a shit night - not so much the little reflux lady but her slightly bigger sister who is teething badly with the world's slowest cutting pair of teeth (so far we're on week 2.5 of the utter hell screaming phase with no luck). She woke up screaming, and eventually her sister decided to join in, at which point the reflux then kept her (and us) awake the remainder of the night.

I swear if my inlaws giggle about sleepless nights again I'll reach down through skype and murder 'em...

Cuddlydragon Sun 21-Apr-13 00:02:15

Great news on improvement. The gaviscon might be better in alternate bottles but the thing with reflux is to experiment til you find what works for you. Some combination will work. If you find gaviscon in every bottle is what you need your gp will prescribe lactulose for the constipation for example.

ratbagcatbag Mon 22-Apr-13 00:15:43

Everything bad again, getting to wits end now. She's so asleep upright on me, within minutes of lying her down even on the wedge she's choking and waking herself up. I just can't do this night after night. sad

blondieminx Mon 22-Apr-13 00:36:28

It's hideous isn't it? I really do sympathise. What time does the GP surgery open, ask them to chase up the emergency referral for you.

ratbagcatbag Mon 22-Apr-13 00:55:43

I'm just sat here in tears, she's fast asleep on me on my tummy, it's just so tempting to sleep like that but so dangerous. sad I really don't know how I can do this, I will ring drs tomorrow to chase up appointment, I can't survive on so little sleep, but have no idea how to get any safely.

ratbagcatbag Mon 22-Apr-13 00:58:42

Miaow - check this out http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Baby-Reflux-wedge-cotbed-Sleep-Positioner-/181125615187?pt=UK_Baby_NurseryBedding_RL&hash=item2a2bed8e53

Sorry crap at links smile

ratbagcatbag Mon 22-Apr-13 01:00:44

Although I'm tempted to bid just for the sleep positioner smile

DolomitesDonkey Mon 22-Apr-13 05:27:53

Just checking in to send you lots of love. I know there's nothing I can do from here but I just wanted to let you know that people do care and are thinking of you. x

It's hideous and shitty I know, but it WILL get better and then you'll forget and you'll find yourself idly contemplating another baby... and that's when you know you're over it! grin

We were told that if needed a small operation could be done on the bile duct but we didn't want to do that. The hospital did though offer to take him for a night so we could just sleep. We didn't take them up on the offer because we were terrified it would set off a klaxon over at social services - but we were very tempted!

ratbagcatbag Mon 22-Apr-13 07:55:10

Haha Dolomites, DH is for the snip. tonight if I get my way I'm still here after zero sleep last night. Sweet pea swing workd as she's upright in it, tummy sleeping is getting massive consideration with a monitor.

DolomitesDonkey Mon 22-Apr-13 08:05:03

I get that. My husband had the snip less than 5 months after our reflux baby was born.

Pleasenomorepeppa Mon 22-Apr-13 08:05:03

Hi. Both by DD's had reflux. It's awful. DD1 was diagnosed at 4 months & we were given infant gaviscon. It was like a miracle!!
DD2 was diagnosed at 10 days as we were very aware of the symptoms (I also think my GP has recently had a refluxy baby himself so is more sympathetic & proactive this time!!).
She was on ranitidine but it really didn't work. Her reflux is quite high up in her throat so she finds feeding really hard. She's 3 months now & pretty much totally refuses to BF.
She's now on Omeprezole & aptimal Pepti. Gaviscon just made her v constipated.
We got referred to a Paed purely because by her 6 week check we'd been to the GP 4 times!!
She is also gaining weight.
Good luck & keep on at the GP smile.

Pleasenomorepeppa Mon 22-Apr-13 08:09:38

Also try a stretchy wrap sling. It isn't so tight on her tummy & she seems to quite like it.

MiaowTheCat Mon 22-Apr-13 09:27:29

Sadly DD2 HATES the Moby! Annoying as hell since DD1 loved being worn and DD2's generally the more snuggly out of the pair of them.

Crap night last night - DD1 is teething incredibly slowly and badly so I ended up having her next to me (couldn't re-settle her cos we have separation anxiety and a shitty "I've heard about these terrible twos so I figured I'd make a head start on them" temper added to the mix), coupled with DD2 being incredibly hard to settle.

Cuddlydragon Mon 22-Apr-13 11:42:36

Oh Ratbag. I've pm you. It's hard but you will fund a solution. I'd be asking for an emergency appointment today. It really is hard to fund the energy to keep pushing when you are so tired. You can though x

narmada Mon 22-Apr-13 23:55:21

Has milk allergy been ruled out?! Seriously, we had MONTHS of what you are describing and eventually the thing that helped most was changing to modified formula (not lactose-free, not comfort formula). Something like nutramigen or aptamil pepti.

You can buy it OTC in boots but may have to pre-order it in.

In meantime the best advice I have is sleep in shifts with your DP. He does 8 pm to 2 am awake, You do 2 am to 8 am or vice-versa.

narmada Mon 22-Apr-13 23:56:32

When we finally got to see a paed btw, milk allergy was his first suggestion.

MiaowTheCat Fri 26-Apr-13 20:14:08

We're back at the docs for DD2's 6 week check on Tuesday and I feel we're (well probably me to be honest) going to be having to push for more.

We were told to try carobel - which had worked a bit we thought in terms of containing the waves of sick, but not in terms of reducing her discomfort much... but it seems to have got worse over the last week or so and during the day now we're getting a good wave of vomit after every feed again (you have to hold a muslin there to catch it as it all comes up) - it doesn't seem to be working well anymore.

Not sure where we should be pushing for - she doesn't scream (thankfully) but it's loads of squirming, back arching, grunting, rooting to suck for comfort (and of course she's a typical baby in that she hasn't associated pulling this interesting thing she's found by her mouth out with the indignation her dummy's gone) and the trails of watery acidy possetting are now being replaced by waves of sick up again. I don't think hubby realises how bad it is since most of that seems to happen during the day.

Do I try to push to try Gaviscon next? I'm really hesitant about that since she seems to be slightly prone to constipation and quite dry poos anyway. GP's line (hopefully the one I've asked to see this time is more helpful) is that if they're gaining weight they won't do anything - I'm already thinking I might have to push the fact it's having a detrimental effect on my mental health (it's not really but I've got a proven track record of anxiety/depression I could use for this) in order to get them to agree to act for her. They cannot have the line of leaving a baby like this for months - it's bloody immoral and it's dangerous to do in case a mother reaches breaking point over it all.

Potterer Fri 26-Apr-13 20:52:16

Both my sons had reflux, ds1 just vomited with no pain, ds2 arched his back, took tiny feeds, screamed when lay down etc etc The HV didn't care because he was gaining weight but I was exhausted because he was hungry due to the tiny feeds so I fed him about 10 times a day!

With ds2 we had tried gaviscon but it didn't help, so we saw a paediatrician at Bupa who said he would want to try him on formula first rather than meds.

We were prescribed Enfamil AR (anti-reflux) which is a formula that thickens on contact with stomach acid so you can use the normal teat on the bottle ie it doesn't thicken in the bottle. See here

You can get it from a pharmacy (without a prescription) we got ours from Boots. They just ordered it in for us. We were fortunate that we were given it on prescription from the beginning.

I used a sling to carry ds2 around and to be completely honest, in the day he slept semi upright on me (I am a SAHM so this was a possibility) or in the pram if we were taking ds1 to preschool. His cot was propped for night time and the paediatrician told us to give him a dummy to help keep everything down.

We were told to try early weaning at 17 weeks with starchy stuff only like potato or sweet potato but that didn't work for us so we went with baby led weaning at 6 months.

Ds2 was on the Enfamil till he was 14 months old, we kept trying cow's milk but he didn't like it, ditto follow on milk.

I will tell you that he has finally stopped refluxing at age 7 years! It would only happen at night and only once a week or so. I hope this helps.

narmada Fri 26-Apr-13 20:58:03

Don't waste your time with gaviscon if carobel hasn't worked - they have similar methods of action.

I agree it needs sorting, for everyone's sake - you don' t want to end up with feeding aversions - now that is truly stressful beyond words.

Really, honestly, do explore the milk allergy thing. It's not an airy-fairy thing in the imaginations of lentil-weavers, but an accepted clinical diagnosis. Otherwise you could have months of serious drugs like ranitidine and omeprazole on your hands.

narmada Fri 26-Apr-13 22:09:01

The dry poos, btw, aren't usual for a young baby - they could be the result of the carobel but (at the risk of sounding like a stuck record) constipation can be a symptom of CMPI. Do you see any stringy bits of mucus in the poo at all?

I hope I didn't sound too negative there, about being stuck with months of drugs. It's just I have been there, twice, and I don't recommend it. It may be that it's just reflux pure and simple, in which case your doc can prescribe antacids (proper ones, not gaviscon) if he or she is so minded. Ours was happy to dish out omeprazole to our 3 week old shock and for that I wanted to kiss his feet grin. Most insist on it being done by a paed, which is probably for the best in the long run, but feels like another looooong wait in the process when you're in the thick of it.

MiaowTheCat Sat 27-Apr-13 06:27:00

I think the dry poo is just something she's prone to anyway that I don't want to make worse. She's done them from before we went onto the carobel sip they're not directly connected.

narmada Sat 27-Apr-13 13:15:49

Well then I am even more suspicious of a cow's milk issue.

MiaowTheCat Fri 10-May-13 21:45:49

Bumping to see how people are getting on.

We went from bad to worse. DD2 developed a rash all over her face that's gradually spread and become quite scaly and upleasant - and would go redder when she was fed, and gradually calm down again over the few hours between feeds... still was uncomfortable, alternating between constipation and very liquid poos that flew straight out of the top of her nappy and up her back. Gaviscon made minimal difference, comfort milk reduced the discomfort somewhat but the rash continued to advance across her face, neck and shoulders.

HV was of the "why the hell are they giving you Gaviscon - oh well" half-finished train of thought brigade... so trotted back to the GP to be dismissed as a neurotic mother, have the rash dismissed as heat rash because it happened to be a hot day (despite booking the appointment a few days prior when it was pissing down with rain) and told to go back to the HVs.

So went and had to sit for 2 hours to see one after baby clinic because no one ever answers any of the HV phonelines. She then left a post-it for my own HV to call me... she called me... then called the dietician - whose opinion is it sounds like an allergy issue (especially with the asthma and eczema that runs in both families)... wants her on neocate (which HV helpfully and morale-boostingly described as "absolutely awful") and to have allergy bloods done. Was going to send fax to the GPs to tell them to do this.

Thought that would be it solved - however fax went AWOL at GPs and it's taken me sobbing on the phone to get it found and the prescription written before the close of play today. GP refused to prescribe the full amount specified by the dietician on cost grounds - so I'm getting the impression that if it DOES work I'll be having to beg for every single scoop. Ran out in torrential rain to pick up the prescription - pharmacy don't carry it in stock so got to go back out tomorrow to collect it.

Am now so stressed myself about this hideous formula that DD2 is never going to drink apparently and managing the transition over with the vomiting and what-not that's bound to happen while we change over, coupled with caring for my 13 month old on my own while hubby's at work until we get things under control that I'm an utter wreck myself... I already have an anxiety disorder - that's going completely mental, my eczema is going ballistic (stress triggered in my case) and the stammer I only ever have when really really wound up about something is doing my box in at the moment.

Poor DD2 looks almost like a burns victim in the hour or so after she's had a feed her face is so red and bumpy - it's heartbreaking and I finally succumbed to sobbing over it today. Had minimal sleep for the last few days as well as she's been so unsettled after her nighttime feed - course then she finally settles just before the alarm goes off and I'm laid there bleary eyed greeted with this little bundle snuggled up nice and warm and dozy - while I've had bog-all sleep - I swear she rubs it in sometimes... like splatting yourself out in a starfish shape when you're having an "Only comfy on your left boob" day - splatting out is just taunting me that I can't move a muscle.

Oh and smiling... which seems to be always followed by a nice vomit shower for me... and the squits which escaped the nappy and ended up absolutely all over me in the middle of Costa Coffee the other day... end of tether rapidly being reached. Texted my mother with how crap it all was this afternoon - and get some stupid fucking political comment about NHS cuts and how I should vote Labour in reply... so fuck all support from either side of grandparents (can't ask MIL - she'll just flip out and melodramatically sob at the state of DD2's skin).

Not good at all at the moment.

narmada Fri 10-May-13 22:09:39

Good god, you poor thing, that dounds awful. It's so obviously a feckin allergy, why are you primary HCPs being so bloody dense!!?!?

I think it is absolutely disgusting they are rrfusing to prescribe neocate in the quantities needed. You either need it or you don't. You wouldn't say to a diabetic patient that they could have some insulin, but only a bit, because it was too expensive, would you?!?!? I am so angry on your behalf.

Now, I won't lie, neocate is not ever so palatable but there are ways and means. Banana crusha syrup, golden syrup, splenda if you're not concerned about artificial sweeteners.... There are also more palatable, but more reactive, milks like aptamil pepti. Your baby might be able to tolerate those...

Hope things look up soon - is there anyone at all you can hand kids to for a few hours respite tomorrow?!

narmada Fri 10-May-13 22:19:53

Plus your baby is still v young and may well accept the neocate for that reason.

MiaowTheCat Sat 11-May-13 16:46:03

No family around here, no friends (my one real one moved away) - finally succeeded in getting two cans of formula to try, but they'd said they'd set it up on the computer for me to get the remainder of the prescription if she would take the feed of this lot (they're REALLY getting me incredibly anxious about getting her to take this - plus now to add to the poor mite's bothers she's going to be miserable getting fed this stuff that's been built up to me to be so hideously traumatic to take that she never will)... but they haven't so I'm going to end up up and down to the GPs and pharmacy endlessly trying to get the remainder of the prescription if it works out - and I KNOW they'll then insist on an appointment with the doc, who'll tell me to go to the health visitor... and so on.

They've made me so stressed about how they're going to be over the cost of it as well that there's no way I can get away with making up the bottle sizes the HV told me to - they'll kick off and complain at me if I do - so I've got to pray she suddenly drops 2 oz off her feed size to get her onto what the can recommends.

Plus with everything we try seeming to be brilliant for a week or so then going back to being crap again - I'm not expecting anything to work and us just to have to put up with this until we can wean her... alternated with dreading weaning her if she IS allergic since the bulk of our cooking centres around dairy, and financially we're barely scraping by so can't afford masses of extra food costs - and she's got a sibling less than a year older than her so either it's a childhood of denying them both, or her having to be told she can't have the same as what her sister's having.

Oh and dreading in case they find an allergy to pets when they do the bloods - which I have to go all the way to the hospital I can't get parked at anymore since they're doing tonnes of building work - with a double buggy and a bus route that's a good 40 mins walk from the house for me since they pulled our local one.

To say I'm getting myself in a state about things is a bit of an understatement... just want her to be happy and giggly like her sister is - isntead of the only smiles we get being precursors to her throwing up all over us.

Gurke Sat 11-May-13 20:44:58

Miaow that all sounds bloody awful. I don't know how you're staying sane.

Suggestions from other people can be the most irritating thing when things are rough, can't they. But if it was me I would try to get my DH involved to take some of the burden off you. Is that feasible?

Also, I think you said elsewhere that your DD1 was prem - did you get to know a pediatrician you trust? I would try to get a referral asap - god knows you have the grounds to insist on that. This is going way beyond what HV and GPs can handle, even if they are otherwise ok (I loathe my GP, so this is my standard response anyway - but it really does seem totally warranted). Once you're seen by a pediatrician you don't have to play the HV-GP pingpong anymore and s/he can order all the tests you need and handle any further referrals to dieticians and allergy people etc.

Really hope you get some answers and solutions soon. Once the allergy tests are done you will be much wiser. Hold on in there!

Cuddlydragon Sat 11-May-13 23:01:30

Miaowthecat I couldn't read and not say how sorry I am that things are so tough. I can only agree with Gurke, stuff, this treatment and HV/GP ping pong insist on a paed referral or even better, are you anywhere near a children's hospital? If so, go to A and E there try to time it to a feed. If you can and get help there. We tried Neocate it smells horrid but we didn't have any difficulties with it for a transient intolerance. The smaller they are the less of an issue the taste will be. Please try not to mess with feed sizes either. This is just so wrong of your GP. If you don't feel like you can go to A&E or push your GP, can your DH come with you to your GP. I found our truly crap ex GP took him more seriously with our little ones health. Good luck.

ratbagcatbag Sat 11-May-13 23:45:02

Big hugs miaow, this is so tough, agree with cuddly, go to a and e if needed. sad

MiaowTheCat Sun 12-May-13 08:37:39

Both girls are technically prem - but DD2 was a whopping 7lb 36 weeker so I feel a fraud saying that. She's thrown up from the start thinking back - I remember buzzing several times in the hospital to query the colour of the throw-up and the sheer quantity of it and being fobbed off with "oooh some babies are a bit sicky" like I didn't have a clue what babies could output out of each bodily orifice.

Thankfully (although I was pissed off at the time that they did this with no notice to the parents at all) they've reorganised the health visitors locally meaning that I've got one who IS very assertive in pushing things forward at least... if needs be if the GPs continue being prats (they're normally very good but I guess budgets are biting) I'll go down to baby clinic and sob melodramatically and get her to kick their arses for me. (Old HV was very nicey nicey - but I told her from the point of my post hospital discharge visit that I suspected there was something wrong in at least the reflux department and she just did the "pat pat see how you go and we'll talk about it at her 6 week check" thing - considering I was still waiting for DD1's 9-12 month check to be done at 13 months from her... god help us!)

At least this one seems to be taking it a bit more seriously (and doesn't fucking call me "mum"!)

Managed to get her taking 1 scoop of it to 5 of her normal formula overnight at least... been told to increase it to 2:4 today and then 4:2 which I think might be a bit of an overly steep transition but we shall see.

Kafri Sun 12-May-13 18:07:38


Not read every post but the OP defo rang true.

DS would only sleep upright on me or DH so we literally did shifts with him. Would not lie on his back at all - just screamed constantly in discomfort
I took him back and forth to GP who prescribed Gaviscon which seemed to help for a few days but then it crept back in and made him constipated which only added to our problems. Then tried Lactose free milk which again helped for a few days and then crept back in

GP then referred DS to hospital where we have a lovely consultant who prescribed Aptamil Pepti 1 milk for him (cows milk protein free) and Ranitdine. Again, he improved for a few days and then it all crept back in. By this point I was getting to the point where I wondered what I was thinking wanting a baby (which I felt awful about as we had wanted him for soooooo many years).

Back at the consultant, he wanted to try gaviscon WITH the ranitidine but listened to me when I said I was reluctant after the gaviscon had constipated him last time and he had ended up on Lactulose to get things moving again. So, he prescribed Omeprazole along with his Pepti 1 milk and, touch wood, we haven't looked back. He's 5m now and has had his dose increased a couple of times when the squealing started to return in the night. All I do is give the consultant's secretary a call and he returns my call after his clinic and increases his dose based on DS last weight check. I really cannot fault the staff we have seen.

The other thing is, which some people will flame me for I have no choice but to let DS sleep on his tummy. He has never yet spent a night on his back as he wakes within minutes of being put down. It took me a long while to accept this and for ages DH and I continued with shifts so that we could keep an eye on him sleeping but gradually I have accepted it a bit more. Don't get me wrong, I would prefer him to sleep on his back, as per guidelines, but he will not do it.

I really feel for anyone not having the same luck as I seemed to have with my GP/hospital. It really is a tough time until you get things under control. My GP did say to me that he didn't know the rules about prescribing formula vs buying it but when I spoke to the pharmacist, she said that yes you can buy it but that it is available on prescription and to get it on prescription because it's double the price of non specialist milks. I have tried to justify getting his milk free by donating the money I would have spent on his original cow and gate food to Ronald Macdonald house which helped my sister out when her little one was born and needed an operation straight away, they gave her a room to stay in so she could be with her DD

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