I hate being a parent.

(159 Posts)
TitsUp Sun 29-Mar-09 10:39:38

I am ashamed to admit this, but I feel like I have made a terrible mistake in having a child. I never really bonded with DS and am sick of all the sick, snot, lack of sleep, destruction, chaos and general lack of freedom, though he is cute sometimes. I am not depressed, I just don't want this life. I want my old life with my well paid career and fast car not a boring p/t job, sick all over my clothes and bloody sensible estate car.

Should I give him up for adoption as I am such a selfish useless cow, or will I feel differently in time? I fear I am not cut out to be a mother and don't want to ruin his life.

Everyone keeps telling me, when I mention how difficult it all is, that things just get worse!

rubyslippers Sun 29-Mar-09 10:41:39

do you have a partner?

how old is your DS?

it is not unusual to mourn the passing of your old life (pre children)

Podrick Sun 29-Mar-09 10:42:49

Tell us more - how old is ds, do you have a partner, can you go back to working full time?

TitsUp Sun 29-Mar-09 10:42:58

Yes I have a partner. DS is 2 years old.

TitsUp Sun 29-Mar-09 10:43:39

I could work full time, but when I get home I need some space, otherwise it like working 24/7.

Podrick Sun 29-Mar-09 10:47:17

OK ,so you could get the well paid job and fast car back?

And then pay for some babysitting in the evenings and at weekends maybe?

How does your dp feel about being a dad, and does he leave everything to you?

scrooged Sun 29-Mar-09 10:47:50

Did you find it difficult to bond with him when he was born?

Podrick Sun 29-Mar-09 10:48:59

I think you will get more freedom back by degrees as ds gets older - age 2 is "terrible twos" - a notoriously hard work stage!

TitsUp Sun 29-Mar-09 10:49:02

My partner tries to muck in but just ends up contradicting any (much needed) discipline I try to impose. DS is running wild and having his tantrums given into.

TitsUp Sun 29-Mar-09 10:50:14

Scrooged, yes I did, I felt/ feel like I was/am looking after someone else's baby/ child. I suppose I have grown to now, logically, that he is mine, but my feelings are not right.

Podrick Sun 29-Mar-09 10:50:18

Also some people love babies especially, others like tinies, others prefer school age or above.

TitsUp Sun 29-Mar-09 10:50:37

grown to accept I meant

scrooged Sun 29-Mar-09 10:51:11

This won't be helping you if the discipline is not consistent, it'll be giving your son mixed messages. This is something you need to discuss with dh as it will get alot easier if you work as a team.

Podrick Sun 29-Mar-09 10:52:34

What about some parenting classes with the aim of making it more enjoyable and less tiring to be at home with your ds?

TitsUp Sun 29-Mar-09 10:54:00

The tragedy is that I never expected to feel this way so made the decision to step away from my career and be a SAHM. I realised this would not work and ended up in a boring dead end job which is beneath me and driving me crazy with boredom and frustration. I feel so under-valued and as if I am selling myself short and my brain is going to rot. I am so sorry if that sounds conceited, it's not meant to, just that the job is not right for me and has no challenge or stimulation, yet it would be difficult now to get back to my old career as I have taken a general dead end role in the interim.

TitsUp Sun 29-Mar-09 10:55:26

What would be the impact on my son in later life if he was brougt up by and lived with his grandparents? Would he hate me?

Ivykaty44 Sun 29-Mar-09 10:58:42

Does your dp know how you feel?

scrooged Sun 29-Mar-09 11:00:52

Parenting classes are a good idea. They hand you a baby at the hospital and expect you to know what to do. Madness!!!

You're finding it hard because

A) the discipline is inconsistent as you and dh are not working as a team

B) (I'm guessing here) You have not bonded with him and are unsure of his temprament. You need to establish a connection with him in order to understand his personality and get to know him. It's like any relationship, you have to get to know each other. If he feels like you don't have time for him and would rather be somewhere else then it's natural that he'll be child from hell and this will make you more unhappy because you won't 'get' the thing's he's doing. Small children are often naughty because they want your attention, it can be hard to turn this into positive attention if you feel (this isn't your fault by the way) like your child's a creature from another planet. Your best bet is to take baby steps in this, you are both still learning. Sit on the floor and play with him, see where it takes you. What does he like to do?

acebaby Sun 29-Mar-09 11:06:49

TU - 2 year olds can be awful. It honestly honestly gets better when they are older. DS1 is 3.8 and is happily playing with his cars while DH reads the paper and I am on the internet (obviously!). At 2, he wouldn't leave me alone for a single minute. He can now wipe his own nose, is rarely sick, and is basically a normal human being. He is not an easy child by any means, and I am not a natural mother, but in the last few months there has been an enormous improvement.

If your DS has grandparents that he gets on with, and who are willing to have him, why not send him to them for a weekend a month and have some time to yourself? I honestly think that you should give it a year before you make any drastic decisions or decide you have made a dreadful mistake.

Babbity Sun 29-Mar-09 11:06:53

is there any scope for you to go back into your old job and go full time? I work FT with 2 young children. I'm sure some people think I must be a terrible mother as I don't have to work as much as I do but I cannot stand the messy stage and am happy to pay someone else to do it so I can do the fun bits. Still stressful but so much morre enjoyable as they get older and you can have proper conversations with them. 2 is a really tough age; I feel for you.

TitsUp Sun 29-Mar-09 11:07:30

What does he like to do? Pull apart things he's not supposed to. He has loads of toys but ignores them and empties cupbaords and wants to play with plates etc.

I am not sure how to access parenting classes?

DP knows I am unhappy and unfulfilled at work but doesn't know 100% how I feel about ds, although I have (half) jokingly said I wish I'd never had him.

TitsUp Sun 29-Mar-09 11:09:18

Also, scrooged, I don't like playing with him. I just want to do my own thing. I feel so sorry about it, but ATM I feel as if he is just a terrible inconvenience.

scrooged Sun 29-Mar-09 11:13:21

It's alright. smile

They are really not very good at entertaining themselves at this age so he will be into everything, he's watching you in the kitchen and is curious to find out what you are doing. You do need to sit and play with him, he won't be able to play by himself until at least nursery. They are really easy to distract at 2 though, a can, a box and a wooden spoon whilst you are in the kitchen can make so much noise (which is good, when the noise stops you know he's up to mischief)
Are there any toddler groups you can take him too? It will get him away from the kitchen and will give you a chance to get you out of the house.

Your health visitor can help with the classes.

Podrick Sun 29-Mar-09 11:14:22

"Playful Parenting" by Lawrence Cohen is a great book about how to enjoy playing with your child - for lots of us it's a learnt skill not an instinct.

All the feelings you have at the moment are very important and I think you need to do more with them than air them on mumsnet. I think you should access professional support.

TitsUp Sun 29-Mar-09 11:16:46

Podrick, what do you mean by professional support? I am not depressed, I have just made a mistake which has far reaching consequences (for both me and ds).

scrooged Sun 29-Mar-09 11:19:01

Sorry if I'm being harsh but you wanting to do your own thing is part of the problem and isn't helping your relationship with him. If you want to change the way you see him then you need to make the first move. The grandparents are an option but it will come back and bite you on the bum. I'd be inclined to try and work with what you have. You do have the option of working full time but this isn't going to make things better for either of you. I do completely understand how you feel. It's really not that easy but it does take time and patience. You can get the grandparents to take over, there's no shame in admitting that this was a mistake but it really is a very drastic route so maybe you need to try and bond with him first and take it from there.

brandollarz Sun 29-Mar-09 11:21:16

do you love him?

TitsUp Sun 29-Mar-09 11:21:22

I know it's part of the problem scrooged, I know I have a big problem. I suppose I was just hoping someone else on MN would maybe have felt the same way and could advise me which way it went for them.

TitsUp Sun 29-Mar-09 11:21:52

Yes I love him but I hate what he's done to me.

scrooged Sun 29-Mar-09 11:22:16

I don't think pod means she thinks you're depressed. I do agree that you need some help though, it's the bonding connection with him that's the problem here. It's not anyone's fault, it happens quite alot. I really would contact your health visitor or pop and see your GP, they can refer you to people, a play therapist or something.

Podrick Sun 29-Mar-09 11:22:19

I mean counselling to help you through a difficult part of your life/ your relationship with your dp - and maybe parenting advice?

compo Sun 29-Mar-09 11:25:03

can you do things with him that you like to do?

my dh hates all that messy play, getting down on the carpet with them, going to mother and toddler groups

what he does like is walking in the woods , go swimming and taking them to the cinema. You can find ways of still doing waht you like with your child.

Can you go back to work, retrain etc? you need a focus I think, something to get you through this hard time.
Ask friends and family to help and get your dh fully on board

TitsUp Sun 29-Mar-09 11:25:55

Yes, I could pay for some counselling I suppose.

I am not having any 'truck' with the useless system of forumalic health visitors/ GPs.

brandollarz Sun 29-Mar-09 11:26:16

im sorry to be rude but he hasnt done anything to you.

YOU had unprotected sex, YOU decided to keep him and YOU had him and it is YOUR job to look after him. I feel sorry for him. Do you treat him like he is an inconvenience? If so there is the cause of his behaviour issues right there. I miss my old life to - sometimes I cry but never would I be like that about my children. I hope the girls have some good advice for you,

TitsUp Sun 29-Mar-09 11:26:35

formulaic

MarlaSinger Sun 29-Mar-09 11:28:17

What has he done to you?

I appreciate you want support but you keep going on about giving him up to someone else so it doesn't sound like you want support to be a better parent - rather to not be one at all. I feel very sad for your son. And you.

TitsUp Sun 29-Mar-09 11:28:18

Brandollarz, you are not beoing rude, I appluad your honesty. I am selfish, unkind and useless, I know that. I too feel sorry for him. All the things you have said I say to myself.

The problem is, what to do now to limit the impact on his life, I don't want him growing up knowing he is a nuisance to me.

TitsUp Sun 29-Mar-09 11:28:57

MarlaSinger - no I don't want to be a parent.

rubyslippers Sun 29-Mar-09 11:28:59

2 is a hard age

i think the idea of parenting classes is agood one

what about homestart?

My DS is into being outdoors

even wheeling him up the road to the playground on his trike is great for him

your GP can refer you for counselling

TitsUp Sun 29-Mar-09 11:29:35

I thought I did. I liked the idea but hate the reality. How could I know that in advance?

rubyslippers Sun 29-Mar-09 11:29:39

have you liked/enjoyed any part of parenting?

MarlaSinger Sun 29-Mar-09 11:30:05

Then parenting classes etc don't sound like what you're after?

scrooged Sun 29-Mar-09 11:30:09

It's not his fault though Titsup. He hasn't done anything, he didn't choose to come into the world. I can see why you are feeling this way, I'm a single mum, I have had moments when I have felt that ds is too much and would be better off without me but when I play with him (whether I want to or not) I get to know him and I understand him so much better. If you met someone at work you would have to spend time getting to know them right? Same principle here only you don't take your child to the pub and have a chat over a glass of wine. He wants your attention and will do whatever he can to get it, it's just how they are. He needs your attention, it makes him secure. If he doesn't feel secure then he's going to cause havoc.
You may have to force yourself to play with him at first but it'll get easier, you have to do this though. As I said before, he isn't able to occupy himself at the moment so giving him a few toys won't do anything. Someone need to show him what to do with them, bang a few saucepans etc. Make it up. Noise is good, so's mess.

Babbity Sun 29-Mar-09 11:30:32

I think if not depressed you sound deeply unsatisfied and unhappy and I think that will only be resolved by looking deeply at yourself as a person as well as a mother. I have honestly felt very similar and it was at a time when my career was stumbling and I regularly felt like running away from my child. Finding fulfilment at work really helped - I think for some people their self-esteem is very tied to their work - and without thtat they can feel worth little. If you're unhappy it's very difficult to find within yourself the selflessness that you need to develop a good bond with a young child.

Podrick Sun 29-Mar-09 11:30:37

I think you need to find a way to be honest with your dp about how you feel at the moment because I think you need to work through this together. I think a good counsellor would make this easier.

TitsUp Sun 29-Mar-09 11:31:00

You see, this is just why I feel I should give him up to someone lovely like you on here who will care for him, play with him, want him and help him grou up feeling wanted.

MarlaSinger Sun 29-Mar-09 11:31:33

None of us (surely!) enjoy it all. I can't stand playing on the floor with toys for example, but I do like joining in painting/crayons and reading. I don't much enjoy soft play so go with my mum or DP and relax with a coffee while they play, but I do like walks in the park etc. There must be something you enjoy?

brandollarz Sun 29-Mar-09 11:32:02

shes made it quite clear she dosnt want to be a mum so classes/councillors ect would be a huge waste of time. Would yours or OHs parents take him on so he isnt placed with strangers?

Can I just ask you though? - when he gives you a hug or a kiss and tells you he loves you, what do you feel?

TitsUp Sun 29-Mar-09 11:32:12

I know he hasn;t done anything! I am not blaming him. I want the best for himand clearly that is NOT me.

rubyslippers Sun 29-Mar-09 11:32:36

i don't enjoy it all that is for sure!

TitsUp Sun 29-Mar-09 11:32:45

He can't even talk, he never tells me anything. He's more likely to thump me that hug me.

rubyslippers Sun 29-Mar-09 11:33:08

have you spoken to your DP? Does he have any idea of the depth of your feelingS?

scrooged Sun 29-Mar-09 11:36:12

That's because he's confused and insecure. If you don't spend time with him then he's going tobe like this. Sorry to be harsh. There's an equation to everything:

Time + effort = maximum output

He'll thump you because he can't just turn a cuddle on if he's unhappy and insecure. You seriously do need to start playing with him, have a laugh and be silly. He really needs this and it will help you aswell.

TitsUp Sun 29-Mar-09 11:37:25

my self esteem is/was very tied to my work, maybe I resent ds for 'making' me give it up, although it was my (wrong) decision. I thought I wanted to be a mum but it's not what I expected.

MoreSpamThanGlam Sun 29-Mar-09 11:40:06

My 3rd child is 2 and it is hell on earth...but I know it will pass and the good age will kick in.

I am not a natural parent, I dont do the SAHM thing, and found it thankless for years, so decided to go back to college to tax my brain, be with adults and be told once a week when I had in my essay that I am brilliant and worthwhile. As a result everyone is happier because I am.

BUT

I have to set time aside to do things with the kids..especially the 2 year old, who is doing all these "naughty" things to get your attention, becaue even you shouting at him is better than no attention at all. SO! If you give him some attention (and I dont mean yet another toy for him to get on with), get him involved in what you are doing. Sit him by the kitchen sink while you are cleaning up and give him some beakers to splash about with. Give him a duster to help you clean...but most of all...talk to him all the way through it, ask him questions.

You dont have to play with Thomas the Tank engine on the floor every day.

I applaud your honesty and think that by being honest you are on the right track and clearly care about his welfare.

Babbity Sun 29-Mar-09 11:40:09

Hav you seen "The Hours" - there's a scene in that film that was so resonant with me that I sobbed and sobbed. Julianne Moore's character is icing a cake, tears running down her face, so stifled and unhappy with her life that you could see she was just going through the motions with her dear son who was an innocent victim. I think that there are people who really can't cope with the realities of parenthood - we are lucky living in times that we do that there are options to work more and get other people involved in bringing up our children; that we don't need to be eyeballs in valium to get through the day. (Her character left her child btw with devastating consequences for him.)

scrooged Sun 29-Mar-09 11:40:13

It never is what anyone expects.

You can go back to work full time but it isn't going to help things at home, the problems will still be there when you return so you need to take the time and try and fix them. Go to the GP and ask for some help or contact your health visitor. They can send you and your son to someone who can help you. Give it a try before you consider anything else.

brandollarz Sun 29-Mar-09 11:42:32

i have never said thi to ANY mum but i think you should give him up. for his sake and yours. who knows, the time apart might make u realise u do love/miss him. if not then at least u will both be happier.

His lack of speaking/hugs sounds like he shows poor development so your feelings are having a huge impact on him.

MarlaSinger Sun 29-Mar-09 11:42:48

It's not what I expected either. Far from it. God I never imagined I would be so tired. It is over 2 years now since I slept more than 4 hours straight. My body is ruined. In fact the effect pregnancy and birth have had on me physically are the major things that make me hesitate over having another. You're not alone in feeling a bit crap about it. But my son fills my heart whenever he smiles at me. It sounds like your resentment runs so deep you cannot let yourself like him. This thread is about you, and not him.

izyboy Sun 29-Mar-09 11:43:33

Tits up. Although I dont feel like you exactly, there are certainly days when being SAHM is numbingly boring ime. Although I dont manage to do this all the time, I try to tell the kids I love them and hug them as much as I can, sometimes this really helps to diffuse the feelings of frustration.

In general things do get better when they are about 4 years old (I have 16mnth old and 5yr old) they are more independent and starting school. I would say 'sod the money' - if you can - and give yourself a day off once a week by placing him in nursery or with a childminder. This day of Oasis can be a lifesaver!

MarlaSinger Sun 29-Mar-09 11:43:41

You're ignoring a lot of questions from people trying to help. So I'm leaving this thread now.

TitsUp Sun 29-Mar-09 11:45:39

Oh really marla? what have i ignored? I have answered a lot I think.

izyboy Sun 29-Mar-09 11:45:49

Make yourself hug and kiss him - it is likely that eventually you will begin to feel affection at least.

TitsUp Sun 29-Mar-09 11:46:35

And yes of course the thread is about me - when did I suggest otherwise?!

brandollarz Sun 29-Mar-09 11:46:56

you cant force love

peggotty Sun 29-Mar-09 11:47:32

Would your DP consider going part time at work and taking over the childcare, and you could be the breadwinner? If you told him the extent of your feelings towards ds and that you are seriously thinking of giving him up he may consider this. Remember that your dp is probably not going to support your decision to have him adopted/brought up by gps.

izyboy Sun 29-Mar-09 11:47:53

I think you can learn to love, Tits Up and this is what you must do.

cktwo Sun 29-Mar-09 11:48:20

Titsup - did you say your son can't talk? Is there a reason for this?

TitsUp Sun 29-Mar-09 11:48:40

READ the thread! I have said I love him. I want the best for him. That is why I think he would be better off without me.

brandollarz Sun 29-Mar-09 11:49:02

i think you are brave and honest and you now need to do the thing that is best for your boy. I think deep down you know what that is and you was looking for some reassurence in you choice.

I am leaveing this thread now as my baby has woken up, but I wish you all the luck in your future and the best for your boy

izyboy Sun 29-Mar-09 11:49:04

See brandollarz, this is where we differ. I think the OP needs a break and othe stimulus. She also needs to train herself to give and receive affection.

TitsUp Sun 29-Mar-09 11:49:24

I suggested to my dp the other day that we could split and he could have ds.

peggotty Sun 29-Mar-09 11:50:15

What did he say?

brandollarz Sun 29-Mar-09 11:50:54

and in the meantime that poor boy suffers

MarlaSinger Sun 29-Mar-09 11:51:24

It's this drip-feeding of information - so now you wait for someone to ask what he said - just say it all in the first place. This isn't a cry for help, it's naval gazing.

izyboy Sun 29-Mar-09 11:52:00

Sorry Tits up I am not saying you dont love him, but it is more about really feeling this. That is hard to do when you feel so compromised. I think therer is not much balance in your life - you need a break and a more satisfying job.

TitsUp Sun 29-Mar-09 11:53:55

sorry the phone rang. dp said don't be silly it will get better.

Marla I am sorry I do not have a crystal ball.

cktwo Sun 29-Mar-09 11:54:30

i think you are depressed and you should get some help. I also think your son needs help as your behaviour is having a nagative impact on his life. Please see your GP, HV or someone before this situation spirals more and more out of control.

MrsMattie Sun 29-Mar-09 11:54:37

You say you're not depressed. You sound it. You haven't adjusted to your new life, aren't coping with the changes and are miserable - what is that if not some sort of depression? Sounds exactly like my PND, anyhow.

You know, life gets easier as they get older. You'll have loads more freedom in a couple of years time. The difference between my life when my son at 2 yrs old and when he was 3 yrs old, even, was enormous (only I went and had another baby around then. Doh!).

Seriously, I think you'll be pleasantly surprised at how your life frees up as your child gets older. Oh, and start looking at getting back into your career, even if only to get some extra training under your belt or go out and do a bit of networking or something. Lots of women mourn the loss of full time work and all that it can bring. It doesn't have to be a permanent loss, though.

TitsUp Sun 29-Mar-09 11:54:58

Thanks for all your comments. I am going to phone social services tomorrow. Goodbye.

TotalChaos Sun 29-Mar-09 11:55:07

ok - so he's 2 - do you mean he literally isn't saying any words? just wondering if part of the problem is that your little one has a communication problem. I found the 2-3 year part hardgoing which in retrospect was due to DS having a language delay.

MarlaSinger Sun 29-Mar-09 11:55:46

hmm
You need crystal ball to know that if you post half of a story people might ask for the rest?

Okay then.

izyboy Sun 29-Mar-09 11:55:49

.. yes accepting outside help is the first step to enabling your son and yourself to feel better.

brandollarz Sun 29-Mar-09 11:56:16

good luck xx

izyboy Sun 29-Mar-09 11:56:30

Well Tits Up I think that is a shame.

cktwo Sun 29-Mar-09 11:57:30

Well done TU. I hope everything works out

MarlaSinger Sun 29-Mar-09 11:57:56

You can't just phone social services, he has TWO parents and you can't decide that your DP is no longer going to be a father.

I smell bullshit. There, I said it, and now I will get called a fucking troll-hunter, I'm not but this is the least convincing thread I have seen all bloody week.

brandollarz Sun 29-Mar-09 11:58:17

its not a shame

social services dont 'take' children away, only if the circumstances are really bad

she may get the help her and her boy so desperately need.

izyboy Sun 29-Mar-09 11:58:33

However they may well be able to put you in contact with services that will enable you all to fuction as a family unit very effectively. If so this would be a very good thing.

izyboy Sun 29-Mar-09 11:59:04

Oh we have agreed eventually - x posts.

brandollarz Sun 29-Mar-09 11:59:48

lol izyboy xx xx

izyboy Sun 29-Mar-09 12:01:38

Yeah I know what you mean Marla, but I suppose you still have to rise above those suspicions, as we have all tried to do on this thread.

I also applaud your honesty. You obv want the best for your son but I don;t think Grandparents is the answer (plus you are ignoring the fact that your partner is very unlikely to agree to this...or is he?).

I'm a great believer in acting the role until you feel it. Play with him, pretend you are an uber mum, smile, big cheesy fake smiles, do things with him that you enjoy, talk to him, talk about what you see, what you are doing, comment on what he is doing, hug him even if he thumps you, tell him you love him, tuck him in and read him a bedtime story, act it, act it, act it, until you begin to feel it and the smile becomes less forced and the bond begins to grow.

Don't beat yourself up about this - your feelings are what they are but you owe it your boy, your partner and most of all yourself to at least try a last ditch attempt. You sound very career driven and motivated so turn your energies away from that onto your son. It will feel odd, awkward, daft, embarrassing but persist, persist, persist and fake it until you make it.

Start now

Littlepurpleprincess Sun 29-Mar-09 12:04:58

I think it's great to see a parent be so honest. Being a mum is bloody hard work, and that honesty and asking for help makes you a good mum.

I can't help but think that you may be depressed. I know you say aren't but why don't you talk to your GP, they can help you if you are and they can help you even if your not. I know it's a scary thing to do, but admitting you feel that low and getting a bit of help is what you and your child needs. It will give you piece of mind at least. Sometimes, when your in a difficult spot, you can't see what's right in front of you.

You could also try going to more local parent groups. Find out if there is a SureStart Children's Centre near you. They are a fantastic resource. It's all free. In my area they have weekly Stay&Plays, Story Clubs, Swimming Lessons, Parenting Courses, Support Groups (I go to a Young Parents Group once a week) and there is always someone to talk to and get advice on your child's behaviour and development. It will keep your son busy, use up some of that energy and put it to good use. It also gives you the opportunity to meet other mums, who all have terrible toddlers themselves!

Also try reading Toddler Taming by Dr Christopher Green - it's very practical advice on dealing with day to day challenges of haveing a toddler.

And be reasurred, your toddler sounds absoloutley NORMAL. I work with this age group and they all do it, they're all challenging, but they are also learning so much and parts of it are magical. Don't miss those bits by focusing on the difficulies. Try to think of one good thing your child has done everyday and praise, praise, praise. He will feel happier for it, and so will you.

izyboy Sun 29-Mar-09 12:05:04

Connie you have eloquently said what I was trying to say 'act the role until you feel it' - but with additional breaks (child minder ) and outside support.

TotalChaos Sun 29-Mar-09 12:06:03

try giving him 1/2 hour per day of your undivided attention - follow his lead as to which toys/books etc to play with. it's often harder work trying to ignore attention seeking behaviour than doing something with your kid for a bit.

morningsun Sun 29-Mar-09 12:17:15

He's your child,you can't turn the clock back.
Its no longer a choice whether you have him or not its now about responsibility,finding out where you've gone wrong,getting help and advice to turn this around and engaging and looking after your child.

You can have help personally to help you come to terms with your life change and bond with your child.You say you are not depressed i'm not so sure you're not putting a brave face on all your feelings of frustration,disappointment and loss.

We all make a choice to have or not have chidren but when the child is there you have to find a path for yourself while putting your childs needs first.He is a person with a future,not a belonging and he is yours.

Did something happen at the birth or after that made you feel he wasn't yours?like midwives or mil or dh taking over,pnd,lack of quiet time with the baby,lack of confidence with him?

We all dislike certain things,whether its playing castles,getting up in the night,going to parents nights,staying in hospital with los,but we do it out of duty ans well as love.

It sounds to me as if you are hiding from your real feelings and are totally lost with your ds atm,both of which can be helped.

Start trying to plan a better future for you and your child with as much help as you need,instead of trying to change the past.

Wispabarsareback Sun 29-Mar-09 12:24:32

This is a very brave and honest OP - I hope she's still around. TitsUp, I understand so well so much of what you say - in my case I have felt much like this since I had DD2 (19 months old). I've been in some very dark places recently and have talked to DH about giving DD2 to someone who would look after her better than I feel I can. I do love her - without question - but like you, I hate what she's done to my life. And I do recognise that it's not her fault - she didn't ask to be born, poor baby, and she didn't ask to have SN.

I think it's exceptionally harsh of whoever suggested that the OP's DS may be delayed with speaking because of her attitude to him - it could very well be the other way round, that he may have development issues that haven't been picked up. If that's the case, my sympathy and empathy extend even further.

Like you, TitsUp, I've resisted labelling myself as depressed, because I'm not convinced I am (but could of course be wrong). I think I'm responding in a rational way to a situation that makes me feel panicked and that I can't control. (But may of course be kidding myself.) I totally understand not wanting to go to the GP or health visitor, who are likely to be useless.

I don't have any answers - I wish I did. But looking after yourself is really important - perhaps you could consider going back to a similar job as the one you used to love, and find good day-care for your son. And if he has good, hands-on grandparents (fantastic for you if that's the case), do consider leaving him with them for a weekend - perhaps you and your DP could go away together and have a proper talk about your lives and what needs to happen to make you all feel OK.

If you call social services, perhaps that might result in some genuinely useful help and support - I'd be interested to know how they respond to calls like this.

But please don't give up on yourself and your son. Will you come back to the thread and let us know how you're doing?

steviesgirl Sun 29-Mar-09 12:28:34

Sounds like you've all wasted your time giving OP advice. She's already made up her mind she's going to call SS.

Is this thread for real? I mean we all get feelings where we'd love our old freedoms and our kids can drive us bonkers at times. I battled PND and never bonded straight away with dd, it wasn't easy. But I can honestly say, hand in heart, I'd never be without her and I'd never turn the clocks back now.

Many of us get some of OP's feelings but we just learn to get on with it and learn to enjoy our children, even if we've struggled at times. I think OP just wants a cop out. She had him, now she should adapt and get on with it.

Yes, my dd is a little monkey at times, but that makes me love her all the more. At least I know she's healthy and happy.

morningsun Sun 29-Mar-09 12:36:46

I think op can't accept somethings gone wrong in her life that she can't control and instead of fixing it wants to pretend it isn't happening.
OTOH to actually consider going to SS she must be desperate ~ also won't the childs father want him anyway?Maybe the dad isn't supportive and is undermining her and causing problems with the los behaviour.

Titsup come back and talk and think this thru,please?We'll help you smile

RealityIsMyOnlyChocolateEgg Sun 29-Mar-09 12:38:27

I'm going to stick my neck out and call troll as well.

I actually wrote out a long post earlier, and then rethought sharing my feelings.

Surely you would mention sooner that your 2 yo is non-verbal?

And the high-powered job/fast car thing is bollocks, why would you have to buy an estate car with only one child?

Anyway, on the off chance it's real:

I'm getting really quite pissed off with hearing, 'it's not how I thought it would be,' (both here and in RL). Boo fucking hoo, you have a child now, that you brought into the world. This isn't a game. Suck it up and be a parent, it's not that hard. In three years time he'll be at school and you can have a bit more of your life back.

Or put him in FT nursery and get a better job, at least then he'll be getting some stimulation during the day, as will you.

As someone else said earlier, stop navel gazing. You are not 'special' or different. Just because you had a career doesn't mean you are unable to be a parent. You seem to have a sense that you are a tragic figure, and that parenting is beneath you. It's not, you are no different to every other mother, just that you are obsessing about this.

TitsUp Sun 29-Mar-09 12:40:54

I think it's ME who has wasted my tyime actually, what with being labelled a troll. As if I would muck about with something so serious. I was hoping for others who felt the same, so thank you to those who have responded in this way.

And just to clarify, I am not going to ask SS to take ds away -DUR! As if they would anyway, just like that! I have no time for the health services, they have been worse than useless IME. But I believe that many social workers are actually very positive and helpful, I had experience of this when my grandmother was very old.

Maybe I am depressed, I don't feel depressed, but many of you say the symptoms seem the same, so I don't know.

brandollarz Sun 29-Mar-09 12:43:02

I am the one that said his speach is probably delayed because of her feelings towards him. Children thrive on love and routine FACT If she isnt showing consistent love/time/attention of course this poor boy is gonna misbehave and almost definately develop slower. Children dont learn out of thin air!

morningsun Sun 29-Mar-09 12:43:15

well when did you first feel like this,after the birth or during pregnancy?
Hi btw!

TitsUp Sun 29-Mar-09 12:46:09

Hi morning sun. I felt nothing for about 10 months, as if I was looking aftre someone else's baby. I suppose the realisation that I am not a good mother has just gradually developed since then. I had a CS and was not handed my son straight away, people have said to me that this can cause problems with bonding, one minute he wasn't there, then he wass (no 'birth' process) and then I didn't even get to hold him as I had expected. I had to ask after about 15 minutes.

This parenting lark can be hell, and 2 yr olds are particularly tiresome, so I do feel for you. smile We have friends where the traditional roles are reversed - dh at home, dw at work. Perhaps that would work for you?

Is there any option of going back to work full time? What would stop you returning to work - regaining position? childcare? costs?

IMO less is more, working full time and spending a couple of quality hours together over the weekend can be so much better than a whole week of 'un'quality time.

TitsUp Sun 29-Mar-09 12:49:24

>>What would stop you returning to work - regaining position<< - yes, this would be the problem.

HeinzSight Sun 29-Mar-09 12:51:28

I've just skimmed this thread, but TU I would agree with others in that it does sound like you maybe depressed sad, I had PND after all my babies and thought I'd made a massive mistake and wanted my old life back, I was fortunate that i was treated quickly and am happy to say I am thoroughly enjoying motherhood. Depression can sometimes be somewhat enigmatic and not terribly easy to recognise. I do sincerely hope you get some good advise from social services and that you start to feel happier.

TitsUp Sun 29-Mar-09 12:53:40

If you are depressed, what treatment do you receive and how do you start to feel different?

compo Sun 29-Mar-09 12:57:21

so what about answering this question that others have already asked:

why doesn't youer dp be a sahp and you go back to work?

TitsUp Sun 29-Mar-09 12:57:23

I have to go offline now, but thank you to those who have posted constructive advice.

TitsUp Sun 29-Mar-09 12:58:03

er, sorry compo, I must have missed that one. That is a possibility, thank you.

HeinzSight Sun 29-Mar-09 12:58:49

There are various types of therapy, from talking therapy to anti depressents. Recent findings are that they are most effective if used together. REMEMBER if you are offered anti depressents, they are NOT addictive and there is nothing to ashamed about in taking these. When you're depressed, changes happen in your brain so that any happy chemicals you naturally produce are immediately sucked up, anti depressents (SSRIs) help stop this over absorption of happy chemicals. So it's just helping your brain regain it's natural balance. There are many different drugs out there, personally speaking I found Fluoxetine (Prozac) worked brilliantly. I hope that helps you.

I think the troll comments are very premature - besides which this is a bit of a taboo subject that touches the heart of many parents so may be helpful to others to read.

TU - what kind of role does your partner play? What do you do as a family? What's your routine when it;s just you and him?

As for this so called speech delay - how old is your DS TU? because if he's 2- 2.5 then I would say he was more of a late developer. One of my daughters was non-verbal at 2....she's 2.5 now and is talking in full sentences and has pretty much caught up with it. If your DS is 2.5 plus, I would take him to the hv and request some salt input. My hv gave me some worksheets as well to help my DD and that would be a nice activity to do together.

I must say I disagree with those saying to interact for a small part of the day and build it up....I think throwing yourself at the problem is the best way - totally submerse yourself in your sons world, dedicate your whole being to him. Like I said earlier you have to fake it to make it. I do agree you cant force love but you can force time and positive attention and with this the love will come.

Niecie Sun 29-Mar-09 13:06:45

I have to say that you sound depressed to me too and it is often the case that people don't recognise it in themselves. Is there any area of your life that gives you satisfaction, or anything that makes you laugh and feel good about things, even if it a favourite TV programme? If there isn't then I would seriously think about whether you are depressed and maybe see a doctor.

When you say that your DS isn't verbal, does he not say a word or is just not saying much? It is very hard if they aren't saying much and this can't be helping the bond between you. However, it does make a difference whether he is a bit slow to talk or whether he is not communicating with you at all.

Can I also ask why you have such a downer on GP's and HV? OK we all know that they can and do get it wrong but if you need help then I am wondering why you have no faith in any of them to give you that help.

TitsUp
Firstly I am so sorry that you feel this way. Secondly, well done for being so brave and admitting how you feel.

I'm going to be honest with you, parenting is not something that comes naturally to all of us, I didn't find it easy at all. My eldest son was a nightmare baby, he never slept, took ages to feed and was just awful until he was about 2. Then, when he became a teenager he became awful all over again.

I don't think that you are awful for feeling like this. I think that you want help, thats why you have posted on here. You obviously know that how you feel is not normal. I don't know if you are depressed, maybe a visit to the GP might help to clarify things in your mind re: depression.

You come across in your post as someone who cares deeply, you are aware that things cannot cary on as they have been. Your partner sounds a bit unsure of what to say and do to help. Try writing him a letter to explain exactly how you feel. I always find putting it in words helps, you can do it calmly and leave him to read it on his own and then discuss it later.

Have you tried to get some 'me time'? You know, time away from being a mum. Be it going to the gym, swimming, even taking an evening class in something that appeals to you. It might help to stimulate your brain and make you feel more like a person in your own right.

Being a mum to a small person can be the most unrewarding job in the world but it can also bring the most amazing rewards. You cannot become a good mum instantly, they don't come with an instruction manual. I didn't find being a mum easy, I still don't. It becomes easier with time, one day something that seemed impossible a few days ago, suddenly seems completely manageable.

Try to remember that you both wanted this child, remember the excitement you felt when you found out that you going to have him. It is the scariest thing in the world, suddenly you are not just 'us' but a 'family'. You cant just get up and go, you have to plan and organise. I hated that, I hated having to make sure that I had everything in the bag before I left the house. I don't 'do' planning, so I did struggle.

At times, lots of times, I deeply resented my children, I resented the loss of my old life and the person I had been. I also had some fantastic moments when I totally 'got' why I had them.

I think what I am trying to say is that you are not a bad person, you are someone who is struggling with the hardest job in the world. You have realised this and have asked for advice, that is the first step to finding a solution. With help and support, you will work though this. Please dont give your son to anyone until you have explored all the other options. You will regret that even more in the long run. Use all the options open to you, I never found HV very useful, they always seemed to be loking down their noses at me and my lifestyle. But I did find my GP really good. Ask for some form of therapy, you might find that is useful.

Be gentle with yorself, you are mourning the life and the person you used to be. You are entitled to do that, not everyone is good at being a parent, just like not everyone is good at being nurses. But with time and support, you can learn. If after help, you still feel the same, at least you can face everyone and tell them that you did your best.

Much love and thoughts for you,

Mo xxx

Wispabarsareback Sun 29-Mar-09 13:29:42

Brandollarz - some children are developmentally delayed, for all sorts of reasons - certainly not just because their parents fail to provide love and stimulation.

morningsun Sun 29-Mar-09 13:35:20

Hi Titsup sorry, am on and off pc today,thanks for replying .I don't know your personality type but it can be very disheartening when the birth is a shock then you feel left out by not being handed the baby~i had a emergency cs after a badly managed labour and when i got to hold the baby i'd nearly forgotten i was having a baby after what i'd been thru,plus its incredibly difficult to move around in and out the bed and bf or see to the baby.If you didn't get a lot of help fromthe nurses and this was your first i could see how that could lead to a lot of problems.

My advice is,start afresh.Don't feel guilty about whats gone before ,we all have phases of being a bit lost in our parenting.Talk to your ds,hold him,sit him on your knee and read stories to him,get in bed with him and read to him there,hold his hand,tell him he's lovely and you love him every half hour with a big smile.

2 is very young and you can do this,and don't feel guilty,guilt is the curse of mothers and its really not necessary.
Good luck and chat to you later.

Go and do that bonding this afternoon,in a totally over the top way[why not?!] and see how you feel at tea timexx

HarryB Sun 29-Mar-09 13:45:01

Titsup: I think that you are suffering from PND brought on by a traumatic birth - I think the way you described the birth was very telling. Ask yourself. Do you feel like you abandoned your son at birth because you did not hold him? Do you feel that things would be different if the birth had been "normal"? You are obviously a high achiever - are you embarrassed that he isn't talking yet? If so, do you feel bad for feeling that way and that it's because you hadn't bonded. Do you feel guilty for pushing your son away because rather than you not wanting him, you feel like he might not want you, and/or that, from the beginning, you've let him down in some way and are not good enough? All because you didn't hold him ergo wasn't there for him when he was born.

My DS is only 11 weeks and I am haunted by the birth - which was an Emergency CS like yours (and post birth not helped by a load of shit from the MiL but that's another story). Some days I think DS hates me and I feel guilty and know that I didn't bond with him right away. But I have shut everyone out (except DH) and almost force my love on DS in the hope that he will love me back - and you know what, it is working. Your DS is 2 but it is never too late to get that bond. You just need to deal with the underlying issues first. I was lucky, I knew the birth f*cked my head up a bit so recognised it early and am dealing with it in my own way and you will too. There is so much help out there and so many women that have gone through this. Please speak to someone and work through this. Good luck.

TitsUp Sun 29-Mar-09 13:47:52

>>mumoftwoteenboys: remember the excitement you felt when you found out that you going to have him<<

This statement has really affected me deeply, i did REALLY want him. And I feel so useless now, and confused. I think the 'me' time is key, and I will try what has been suggested - ie for ds to go to grandparents one weekend a month. I think I was feeling very low and desperate this morning when I posted and maybe things have got a little out of perspective.

To answer some other questions:
>>what kind of role does your partner play? What do you do as a family? What's your routine when it;s just you and him?<<
DP works away, gets home late. He is very tired at weekends and a bit ratty. We take ds to the park etc, or to indoor play from time to time. When just me and him it's me trying to get the housework done and him being disruptive / 'playing'. If I have time I take him to the swings or sometimes to grandparents where he will ride toys/ run about in their garden (which is very large). They seem to have the patience and time I don't seem to.

>>As for this so called speech delay - how old is your DS TU?<<

He is just 2.

I will not be online until tomorrow now, I am going out.

MarlaSinger Sun 29-Mar-09 13:49:13

TitsUp
Sorry I doubted you. I hope you find what you need.

ManicMother7777 Sun 29-Mar-09 13:49:27

Well said Mumofteenageboys. I agree with you. TitsUp, don't despair, I remember feeling exactly like you. However I disagree with other posters that you are depressed and need counselling...I'm no expert but this is what people said to me and I thought, no I'm not depressed I just don't like babies, sleepless nights, sick, snot, poo and relentless tedium!

You sound intelligent enough to work out solutions for yourself, don't line someone else's pockets! I admit I haven't ever tried counselling but I've had a couple of friends who became obsessed with it and they became very self indulgent and it didn't actually help at all, in fact one just became more depressed. It just seems to make you focus of the problem more and more...no amount of counselling is going to make you LOVE sleepless nights, poo etc is it! I await howls of indignation as I know there are a lot of counselling fans out there. But also I had one friend who had behaves appallingly, her marriage fell apart etc but the counsellor just kept legitimizing her outrageous behaviour and she became even more full of self justification.

Also, if you go to your GP with depression it'll be on your records for ever, you'll have to declare it for future jobs and there will be all sorts of repercussions (I know because I've worked in HR).

My advice on a daily basis is - obviously make sure your baby is safe, fed and watered and properly looked after, but apart from that - sounds awful - but ignore him, put him in nursey, whatever, and do your own thing as much as you can, anything that keeps your brain ticking. I hated it when mine were young, I hated playing silly games, was bored senseless reading stories etc, and by and large (apart from when MIL was watching), I didn't do any of it! They haven't exactly suffered. They're now 9 & 11, doing well at school, well adjusted etc and I enjoy them much more now they're real people with personalities, and we are very close and I'm ashamed of how I used to feel, but only because society seems to expect something different, not because I am REALLY ashamed IYSWIM.

Must dash - Good Luck xx

I didn't mean to upset you TU, far from it, I was only trying to think of a positive fact about the situation.
Good luck with whatever you decide, you sound like a very lovely person to me. Take care of yourself and don't be so hard on yourself xxx

Niecie Sun 29-Mar-09 14:22:35

From manicmother7777 -

"Also, if you go to your GP with depression it'll be on your records for ever, you'll have to declare it for future jobs and there will be all sorts of repercussions (I know because I've worked in HR). "

So the stigma of mental health illnesses lives on. No wonder women don't go and get help when they genuinely need it if there is scaremonging like that.

I can't say if TU has PND or not but that sort of talk doesn't help anybody, including those who may be lurking and thinking that they identify with TU and maybe they do need some help.

There is a world of difference between not liking the baby stage and finding it tedious and nasty, as we all do sometimes, and not taking any pleasure at all from any aspect of life. TU doesn't even enjoy her life when she isn't with her DS and I think that this might be quite telling.

TU - I agree not saying much at 2 is no big deal but but what I was trying to get at with my earlier post was to find out if your DS communicates with you at all. Does he point, make eye contact, attempt to speak, understand what you say to him. Being able to speak is only part of communication.

Quattrocento Sun 29-Mar-09 14:47:04

TU, I had a horrible time adjusting to parenthood. It's harder to adjust if you've had a fulfilling career beforehand, I think. You get used to me-time, and doing what you want to do more or less 100% of the time.

My suggestions are:

1. Give up on the idea of adoption. There's lots of data supporting the fact that even inadequate mothers (and I'm not convinced you are an inadequate mother) are psychologically less damaging than being adopted - despite fantastic adoptive parents.

2. Concentrate on making yourself happier. Get back into that good job of yours so that you get some fulfilment at work. You would have to be a saint or a natural mother-type to find fulfilment fingerpainting with a two-year old. I am neither of those things and boy I needed my job.

And it will and does get better. Trust me.

HTH

ManicMother7777 Sun 29-Mar-09 15:06:06

Sorry, didn't mean to scaremonger, but that is my experience and I think it's reality. I suppose I just mean that if you really need help, of course you should seek it, but if it's a case of disliking the small baby stage, then this isn't 'mental illness' is it? Are we too keen to medicalise everything? A different debate perhaps.

brandollarz Sun 29-Mar-09 16:35:59

Wispabarsareback

I totally agree with you but she hasnt stated that there is anything medicallly wrong with her son.

at 2 years old - for a child to be able to say nothing or next to nothing shows that there has been lack of effort. If I am wrong I apologize but I really dont think I am.

I am not on here to knock anybodys parenting skills and I really hope this lady gets some help but she sounds like she has already made her mind up.

I hope the outcome she chooses is best for the little boy.

suwoo Sun 29-Mar-09 16:46:04

My DS was barely talking at 23 months. He is nearly 28 months now and is talking in 8 word sentences and knows all his colours and shapes for example. So yes, it is possible for a child who is played with/encouraged every day to be non verbal at 2.

Good luck titsup.

Coliewobbles Sun 29-Mar-09 17:10:51

I would say you aredepressed. Depression doesn't have to mean you are crying a lot. You are grieving for your old life which is verycommon. I think you will def benefit from talking through your feelings with someone who won't judge you but will help you. There's a lot to be said about traumatic births and the affect they have on bonding. As for depression being on your records; well it's us women who had great jobs we loved that are the ones who struggle with the change parenthood brings and anyone who says they've never felt low or depressed has probably been in denial.
I wish you luck but it will get better if you talk it over. Maybe put your son into preschool/nursery a couple of mornings to give you some space.
Keep us posted xxx

chocolatecremeegg Sun 29-Mar-09 17:23:47

Titsup I understand how you feel. I felt the same when my ds was born. I remember telling my dh I was unable to look after him and wanted to put him up for adoption. I hated looking after him, hated the sleepless nights, hated dealing with the constant illness and yearned for my old life. I used to cry and cry all day every day for months. I think I was actually going through a grieving process. I missed my full-time job with all the perks that brought and hated working part-time. I think in part, my traumatic birth played a big role in my being unable to bond with my son. Was your birth traumatic? I posted on here (under a different name, I was so ashamed) and was told that things would improve and I would grow to love my son. I never believed this not for one moment. However.... it was true! I now love ds unconditionally and although there are days which are awful (pretty normal for any parent) I wouldn't go back to my old life for the world. I don't want to patronise you but I think you need to stick with it, things WILL improve. I hope in a few months/years you will look back on this and laugh. I certainly do. I am looking at ds now and cannot believe I ever thought about having him adopted.

brandollarz

"at 2 years old - for a child to be able to say nothing or next to nothing shows that there has been lack of effort"

that is a completely ridiculous and unfounded statement. Reminds me of the refrigerator parenting theory os autism [shudder]

my dd said next to nothing at 2 - my older kids were talkinge extremely well by 18mths. My youngest at 15mths is starting to say the odd thing....more than his sister did but less than the older 2. Horses for courses - nothing to do with 'effort'.

8oreighty Sun 29-Mar-09 17:47:34

I actually think you do sound depressed...and really haven't bonded. Everyone can relate to bits of what you say sometimes, but it sounds like it has gotten to quite a bad level, where you feel you don't "care" so much. And you keep putting yourself down...as well as him. Try to talk to someone...try to maybe do a class with him, something structured where you are with him one on one? It is so normal to get "depressed" when they are this age, I know you don't consider that you are, but your outlook and perspective really seems to say that you are.

blinks Sun 29-Mar-09 18:05:36

go right back to square one.

take baths with him.

massage him and roll about the floor like a loo with him.

give him your make up and let him loose on you.

sleep with him.

let go.

blinks Sun 29-Mar-09 18:06:00

loo = loon

luckywinner Sun 29-Mar-09 19:21:11

Blinks, I think that sleeping next to him is a really good suggestion. I had similar feelings to TU, although not in such a strong way, when my ds was born and I had a v similar birth. But there is something about lying next to them when they are fast asleep and not 'threatening' that is really healing and really helped me.

Titsup, I think your post is very honest and brave and it shows that although you don't really feel like it you are considering his needs above yours. I was seeing a therapist already when my son was born and I think if I hadn't been seeing her before his birth I would be in a similar place to where you are. I would really recommend going to speak with someone. It makes you think about why you are feeling this way and that really it is not about the child you have had but about yourself and how you feel. It sounds like you have a lot of resentment that is being directed towards your son.

If it makes you feel better, my ds is now 4 and I have a dd, 2. I am now a very happy person and love my children and myself and my life. What I want to say is it did get better for me, but only after a lot of hard work with a therapist, who I still see.

I hope you come back to this thread and continue to find help and support.

Gateau Mon 30-Mar-09 10:04:13

I haven't got much advice, TU, but I applaud you for being so honest about how you feel; your feelings can't be easy to admit, even on here. But you do have to realise that you are airing your feelings BECAUSE you care about your son, and that is such a good start for the way forward.
I am disgusted at the posters who have made you feel even worse. You posted on here as a cry for help,not to be made feel even worse. Ignore these negative posts and focus on the constructive ones.
I really hope you get all the help you need to move forward and start enjoying your son. I believe with the right help that will happen. Take care.

Gateau Mon 30-Mar-09 10:06:50

OH, and I don't agree with the person who said that your son's lack of speech is down to you.
I know a three-year-old who was loved and adored by his parents who didn't start talking until he was three.
So don't take the blame for this on top of everything else.

morningsun Mon 30-Mar-09 10:08:10

Titsup,how are you feeling today?

izyboy Mon 30-Mar-09 10:12:09

Good luck Titsup - it is a tough old road this parenting lark but it also has its rewards (or so they tell me lol). Some great advice here.

RubyrubyrubyRaven Mon 30-Mar-09 10:20:07

Titsup - I haven't read the thread so this may have been said already.

Remember, you are a Mum for life and maybe the early years are the trickiest stage for you. Some Mums are brilliant with babies but struggle with primary years or teens. Your time will come ...............

Notquitegrownup Mon 30-Mar-09 10:34:05

I have thought about you lots since reading this yesterday TU. I also think that you were very brave posting. There are lots of positive points here TU, for you to consider.
Just one thing I would add. Your relationship with your partner doesn't seem particularly close or supportive. You talk about yourself in relation to your job and your son, but very little about your partner, or friends. It may be that you like to keep people at a bit of a distance, and that you aren't expecting much from him, or it may be that there are problems there which could be resolved, which would leave you happier in other areas of your life too.

Best of luck.

spinspinsugar Mon 30-Mar-09 11:05:46

Have not read the whole thread, so I'm sure this has been covered... TitsUp, how much of your unhappiness is tied to your job dissatisfaction, and how much to parenting your ds, do you think? Are you projecting other areas of your life onto your relationship with him? Can you focus on repackaging your working self? Sometimes parenting can be such a thankless task, even on a good day! I also gave up a high flying career to be a sahm, it was very hard. I think it would kill my spirit to be working below my capacity now. I hope you can get your self esteem and sense of self back on track, I really think it will help uncover the joy in your ds too.

Lizzylou Mon 30-Mar-09 11:15:13

Titsup, I think you need a break, could your DS go to a pre-school/playgroup for an (extra)couple of mornings a week? Or could the Grandparents have him? I mean time when you are not working, so you can do housework/read/exercise whatever but time just for you?

Having time just for myself is the one thing I miss most about being a mother if I'm honest and makes a massive difference to my morale.

Agree with Suwoo, my DS1 barely said a word at 2, he is now a very bright 5 yr old. It doesn't necessarily mean anything.

TitsUp Mon 30-Mar-09 16:22:20

I wanted to thank you for all your help and support. There have been sone really insightful posts on here.

I am feeling less overwhelmed today. DS is actually at his grandparents' and I am taking some time out. I will try to follow this through as a regular occurrence - they are only too happy to have him - and see how it works out.

I do love him. But I just felt yesetrday that I was not being a good parent and felt selfish and that he deserved better. I know you have to be selfless to be a parent and this is something I am struggling with.

I feel very encouraged by posters who have said that there are different ages which different parents cope better with: it really is enlightening and strengthening to read comments like 'your time will come'... so thank you.

Several posters have asked about DS' speech (or lack of). He does understand what I say and will fetch things if asked, but doesn't 'speak' as such (ie string words together). He makes some sounds which sound a bit like words. I have absoultely no yardstick against which to measure his development, so have no idea how normal or otherwise his speech is - but again, reading posts on here there seems to be a lot of variation.

Spinspinsugar, you sound very like me. 98% of my unhappiness is my general lack of fulfilment. I think I am redirecting this at DS as being the 'cause' (ie I 'gave it up for him', but it's not his fault). I gave it up because I wanted to focus on being a mum. Maybe there is no shame in admitting I can't be a full time stay at home type mum (the type I wanted to be); I need stimulation from my career to make me feel complete, and this in turn will hopefully be reflected in my feelings towards ds.

Lizzylou Mon 30-Mar-09 16:27:28

Good for you, you have been very brave in posting what I would imagine is a farily common feeling in Mothers.
Becoming a mother was a massive shock to my system, all those years of being able to do what I wanted, when I wanted, suddenly this little baby needed me constantly and I couldn't even shower in peace.
Glad you got some time for yourself, you are not alone in this, I often feel like I am a useless/crap Mother.
And yes, 2 year old boys (have no experience of girls, but I can imagine they can be pretty similar) can be massively trying.
My Mother has a friend who openly admits that she couldn't stand parenting her lads until they were around 4/5yrs old, she loathed the baby and toddler stage. Strangely enough she now can't get enough of her GC.
Stick with it, hope you find what is best for you.

muffle Mon 30-Mar-09 16:39:43

I have only skimmed thread but - I think you've been brave to be so honest, and you can't help feeling like this. I totally agree with those who say that different stages of childhood suit different people - I know parents who say they only really enjoyed it once their kids were over 5 for example. Also, I think your love for him is such that you don't actually want to give him up, sorry if that's presumptuous.

I think what you should do is go for a fulfilling full-time well-paid job as soon as you can, and get him some proper, quality childcare whether it's a good nursery you trust, a good nanny or childminder, whatever suits him best - and/or discuss your DP going part-time and being a SAHD. Many men get to be highly part-time parents and compartmentalise their time with their children to what suits them - maybe that life would suit you better and make your time with your DS much happier. Although I don't have the same feelings about my DS that you describe, I know full well that I would go bananas PDQ without my creative and fairly intellectual career which is a huge part of me, though I do it part-time at the moment.

HelenMc1 Mon 30-Mar-09 16:44:55

I love my little boy (14 months) to bits but as soon as the grandparents offer to take him off my hands for the day/night he is packed and ready to go in half an hour! And I dont feel guilty for a moment because I know he is having a riot (his Granny also has the knack of playing - I think it is something to do with handing them back)

He also goes to nursery as I work full time, and acording to some recent threads he is being severely damaged there, but no matter as he loves it.

This all means that I have plenty of non-mummy time which means that when I am looking after him we genuinely have a good time.

I think you need to get back to work in some capacity. You say you cant because of the lack of position but I cant see that you have an alternative if the current situation is bringing you so low that you would consider giving your son up.

I also think that although you say he is a right little terror at the moment it is important to remember that he loves you and you belong together. BUT, that does not mean that you cant change things to make the both of you happier.

applepudding Mon 30-Mar-09 18:52:49

TU - I would agree with the posters who feel that you are depressed.

I found the first few months with DS as a baby very very difficult, and looking back I think that I probably had undiagnosed PND. DS cried all the time and I found that the HVs all seemed to offer conflicting advice. DH worked shifts and came home tired just wanting peace and quiet whereas I wanted adult conversation and support. I did see my parents a couple of times a week plus my MIL who was helpful with regard to babysitting but I would not have let anybody know how difficult I found things - pride perhaps? I don't know. I had been used to feeling in charge at work and also being an older mum I found being totally out of control of the situation very difficult to cope with.

I think at the time I went back to work when DS was 7 months that I was actually beginning to enjoy motherhood, DS was on solids, had started putting on weight, and slept better.

I was lucky in that I was able to return to my previous post on a part time basis and that I was able to find quality nursery care for DS.

I would recommend firstly that you do have a conversation with your GP about the fact that you may be depressed, and see what advice and support you are offered.

Secondly I really would make the effort to look for an alternative work situation where you will feel fulfilled. It doesn't need to be full time. I can recall the relief to feel that I was actually good at something again, that I received thanks and compliments, and that I felt in control of part of my life. I think that if you do this, and are feeling good about yourself that your relationship with your DS will improve.

My memories now of the time when my DS was about 3 are of it being such a happy time; me being in work 3 days a week with DS happy in nursery, and I really really appreciated the days I had at home with him, playing with him, talking to him and just going for walks or shopping, holding his little hand.

DS is now 7, and so far, after a difficult start it has got easier all the time.

I hope things work out for you. Good luck.

redflipflops Mon 30-Mar-09 19:45:22

'98% of my unhappiness is my general lack of fulfillment' - having just read the thread I agree with that. If you can find a stimulating job that you love and become happier in general this will no doubt help. You won't be able to 'blame' your DS.

Life is long.... you will have years ahead of you when you become a career girl/woman again! All those things you gave up will be yours again.

Once children start school they become much more independent - 2 is a very 'full on' age. My DD is 5 and it's lovely - you can chat about life and school and friends. They become little people rather than 'needy' screaming toddlers!

People definitely enjoy different phases of parenthood.

I also think you are very brave and honest to admit your feelings. It is still such a taboo for women to admit ambiguous feeling about motherhood.

mummytopebs Mon 30-Mar-09 22:59:26

I felt exactly the same as you. I had emer c-section didnt see dd till the day after she was born, everyone had seen her before me and then she was given to me and left there in a room with me after an operation and i had to look after her. I had pnd but wasnt diagnosed till she was 2.3 when the stress made me have a nervous breakdown. I like you had a high powered job and now work ptime in a job where my colleagues i worked with are now my managers! 2 Years on i am still in the same job but quite happy that i have seen my dd and been able yo work ptime, and quite relieved that i dont have the stress my managers have (plenty of time for that) I am now quite the opposite and hate bein away from my dd, i feel guilty for her first 2 years of life, when i feel i wasnt a good mam. Please get help, see your doctor, i didnt think i was depressed until it came down on top of me.

susia Mon 30-Mar-09 23:08:53

Hi titsup, I am a single mother of a five year old and I can honestly say that 2 years old is a very hard age and definately the worst age for me.

At 2 my son was aggressive, up at 5 every morning, hardly eating and constipated! It was a nightmare, I felt like a terrible mother and felt very judged.

But he got better and better and now is a well behaved lovely little boy.

The world does gradually open up again and this is what you need to realise.

Now my son and I can go to films we both enjoy, go to the theatre, stay up and watch fireworks, go to parties for adults and kids, do loads of things...you have a partner so you could go out sometimes in the evenings or get a babysitter and just go for a swim or meet up with friends.

You could discuss with your partner, him downsizing his job so that he is at home more and you take on a more challenging job.

As he gets older he won't need you so much so that he will play on his own more, be happy to have sleepovers, stay at his grandparents etc.

I do think 2 is a very difficult age but around 2 and a half is when everything starts to get easier bit by bit...

theQuibbler Mon 30-Mar-09 23:10:41

Bonding with your baby is automatic for a majority of women, but that leaves a clear minority where it isn't the case. It can happen for many reasons, a traumatic birth, PND, psychological trauma. It doesn't matter as the important thing is that it can be treated. It is nothing to be ashamed of, but it should be tackled for your own sake and for the sake of your child. What you describe is beyond the irritations and vagaries of life with a toddler.

A very good article on the subject is here, (with contacts for help). this page
Unless you have a very clued up HV/GP, I would research your options about who would be best to speak to for the appropriate advice - a specialist would be better. The book mentioned in the article is a good starting point.

I hope you are able to move forward with your clear desire to improve the situation. Good luck - it can get better.

TotalChaos Mon 30-Mar-09 23:11:59

Re:speech/language - it's obviously very positive that you reckon he understands you well - but he could still have a problem with pronunciation -so I think with no consistent use of words by two you should be looking for a speech therapy referral (you may be able to arrange this directly with the department rather than going via HV/GP, it varies from area to area) or go private (www.helpwithtalking.com). If he's having difficulties expressing himself, then that can impact on behaviour. Some kids are just "late talkers"; i.e. they will catch up of their own volition by 3. But it can be a bit of a catch 22 - that without having a professional opinion you can't always tell if there is going to be a problem or not - and if you don't think there's a problem you don't bother going for the professional opinion.

How are you feeling today? You sound like such a wonderful mum, so caring and thoughtful.
Glad to hear you are thinking of having more time to yourself and having the g'parents baby sitting for a few hours. Even if you do nothing but go for a walk, its a wonderful feeling to be able to walk without a pram and without ambling at 5cm per hour!

Please do not listen to the posters saying you are to blame for the speech. dd2 has 3 'real' words (mama, dada and apple blush). At the same age dd1 had 40 words, including 3 syllable words and putting two words together! Both have had a very similar input. Children just develop differently.

Is there one enjoyable thing you have done today with ds? Read a story, jump in puddles, run down a hill, splash in a bath, roll on the floor and giggle. Just do one thing every day. Force yourself to smile, pretend you are enjoying yourself. Smiling is contagious (sp?), you'll both feel more positive for it.

Keep posting, let us know how things are going. Many of us have felt the same.

pinguthepenguin Wed 01-Apr-09 10:09:34

There are days when I could write your post....and indeed have posted similar threads under a different name in order to seek advice. I too was harshly judged by some people. I am sad and very disappointed to see that some long-standing posters on here have treated you this way. (Thankfully though, most of the advice you've recieved is excellent and heartfelt).

Experiences of parenthood are not the same for everyone and the OP has the right to her feelings, no less than those who find parenthood amazing. Telling the OP to 'suck it up' is frankly appalling.

We may not always like what we read, but just because it is not palatable, does not mean that it is not real or deserves our compassion.

I feel for you OP and I genuinely believe that you are a good mother, and that is why you posted. I think you will get through this

welliest Wed 29-Jun-11 19:49:01

hi titsup, i'm knew to mumsnet so dunno how it works exactly. Anyway i just wanted to say that i feel the same as you; more complicated by the fact i have 2 kids. I wonder did life get any better for you?
I dislike parenting, it frustrates me, distresses me and bores me to death. Have no idea what would be best for the children (3 & 1) .. I know everyone else has 'off' days, but i genuinely hate most of the time i spend with them, the whining, and hassling etc.

Orangeflower7 Thu 30-Jun-11 22:31:01

Hi there, Titsup just wanted to mention something about boys and talking, I've got two boys 2 and 6. I have been struggling a bit with my 2 year old whi has been having lots of tantrums and tricky behaviour and also delayed speech. I was taking him out loads so he could run about somewhere as it was so frustrating being home with him. In the afternoons I felt guilty relief as we have a long way to go to school so a long walk in the buggy for him. I just wanted to say firstly it gets better (with age the 6 year old is lovely now)- something you could focus on in the meantime as I think things will improve in the next few months for you, and when he is 3 he will be able to get the free 15 hrs funding which will be a good break for both of you.-

d "It takes two to talk" it is a bit expensive but gives some great simple ways to tap into play/ interaction with him and help him to talk. 5 have found since using it the last few weeks he is interacting with me more and saying 'look mummy' naming things, it's great and has made me feel much better. It gives you lots of ideas of easy things to do with them and following their lead in the play which can be hard but helps them...anyway worth a look at, and you could get in touch with speech and language therapy, through your health visitor. They change a lot at the age of 2 so don't want you to worry unnecessarily however it has been helpful for us as it's enabled us to get a special 'toddler talk' playgroup place. the speech therapist runs a session based on the book, and the other one plays with the children talking to them etc. if you don't get the book the main thing is OWL- observe, wait, listen then try and think what they might want to say.

purpleplump Thu 30-Jun-11 22:42:23

This thread is over 3 years old. I wonder what happened?

Freddiecat Thu 30-Jun-11 22:48:52

I think you should get a full-time, more fulfilling job. Kids are very hard work at that age but you sound like you kind of know that. Most of your problem seems to be the lack of self-worth you get from your current job.

I took 3 months maternity leave (out of neccessity) after DS and then longer after DD but retrained and have worked full-time ever since (they are 9 and 7 now). When they were younger I'd make sure my lunchtimes at work I went out for a walk or for lunch with work friends at least a couple of times a week and as I was working a lot i really looked forward to seeing the kids and also someone else (nursery) dealt with tantrums shock

Also - i don't like playing much but did things like jigsaws with them which I do like, or cooking rather than imaginary games. Now we can play board games etc which is more my thing.

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