Is there ever a time when you'd advise your DS to hit back?

[Saturn74]

DS2 is 8yo. He is a chatty and friendly child, quite sturdy and certainly not oversensitive IMO. We are friends with another family, who have a 9yo son. Their son taunts DS when he thinks they're out of earshot, and gets very physical with him. It starts off as rough and tumble, but soon gets out of hand, and my son often ends up getting hurt. I have waited for my friend to step in and tell her son that this behaviour is not acceptable, but she doesn't, so I now tell him. (I think I am now seen as a controlling and over-strict old witch, but hey ho!) It still doesn't stop though, and I am sick of feeling that I cannot leave this 9yo to play with my child without watching him like a hawk. My DH says that the only thing to stop this child thinking he can ride roughshod over our DS is to advise DS to retaliate physically. Is he right? I have considered stopping seeing this other family, but everyone else gets on really well, and I am loathe to give a 9yo the power to decide who we socialise with. The 9yo also makes a great show of saying how my DS2 is his best friend in front of his mother - and puts his arm round his shoulders etc. GRRRRR . Advice please.

[laneydaye]

tell him to lamp him one right on the nose.....the little shit..xxxx

i bet he wont carry on being bullyish...

[laneydaye]

by the way i dont advise smacking to anyone i just think sometimes especially kids when they are learning to stick up for themselves they can only take being walked over for so long..... a good smack might bring the older lad to his senses...xx

[colditz]

No, wrong thing to do. The other child probably does feel your ds is his best friend - he may well be his only friend. Stop seeing them. You aren't letting a child dictate who you do and don't see, you are teaching his mother that if she does not exert some control, you will withdraw your company.

[edam]

Tough one. I know in the olden days when I was young, the advice would have been 'hit him back' and it is tempting.

If you don't want to do that, then you need to think of other strategies to help your ds stop this nasty kid. Maybe he could shout, loud enough for the adults to hear 'NO, DON'T HIT ME' so the nasty kid gets the message and the careless mother can't avoid hearing.

Or make sure they don't go out of sight?

Do you know any other parents who have a similar problem with this boy? If so, have a chat with them to see if they have any bright ideas.

[Greensleeves]

No, I think it's always the wrong thing to do.

[kittywits]

Yes I have done and continue to do.
I always say to explore all other avenues first, try diplomacy, try involving another adult. Sadly other adults can't solve the problem alot of the time. I think your son she stand up to this bullying and give him a jolly good punch. 8 year old children have to learn to start defending themselves and for some children the only way they will learn lesson is to get timely thump. Have you got someone who can show him the best way to punch? My dp has taught both my sons. It's given them real confidence and ds1 has only resorted to using this once whilst under extreme provocation. I'm so glad for them that they have this knowledge now.

[airy]

I wouldn't. Kids do need to learn to stand up for themselves but if they learn to do it by lashing out then they're not going to get on very well as adults.
I wouldn't necessarily stop seeing them, Id get ds to shout out 'don't hit me' as mentioned earlier, as loud as he can whenever this boy hurts him. It may embarass the other boy enough that everyone knows what he's doing, and should make it impossible for his mum to ignore the behaviour.
If she didn't deal with it though, I'd have to tell her that until she can control her boy then you won't be seeing them. Tough but necessary I think!

[Greensleeves]

"for some children the only way they will learn lesson is to get timely thump"

Hmmm, kittywits. Perhaps it's less of a leap to tell your children to hit others if you are already a parent who uses violence as a response to bad behaviour.

I teach my children that hitting is wrong. Full stop.

[FillyjonktheBananaEater]

No, I would remove ds from the situation. I would not put my kid into a situation where he was being physically assulted, just as I would not go out socially with anyone who taunted or hit my dh. If your friend won't take it seriously or can't-

I think this is probably a very manipulative, confusing situation for your ds.

I also think its probably hard for the kid who is hitting. This needs to be addressed. But possibly not by you. Your ds does not need to be this kid's punchbag.

(I'm not trying to sound criticial, btw, its very easy from the sidelines)

[VestibularProwess]

I tell my kids if they get hit they're allowed to hit back. Bullies will target the kids who don't hit back. Sad but true.

[ComeOVeneer]

No I don't advocate retaliation of a physical nature in any circumstances. In this instance (as others have said) I would speak to the mother and say that you are unhappy with the way her son treats your ds and as she doesn't do anything about it you are reluctant to spend further time with them and put ds in this unpleasant situation.

[Pinotmum]

Some children just can't bring themselves to hit back - it's not in their nature. Being told it's OK to say "don't hit me" or "stop doing that" may give them the confidence to deal with unacceptable behaviour. I wouldn't necessarily tell my child to hit back - I know 1 of them just wouldn't - but if they did hit back I wouldn't be too hard on them as I know they must have been pushed very hard. As a child who never ever hit anyone but had a big voice I would encourage shouting "get lost" or similar

[alexsmum]

i always thought i would never advise hitting back but sometimes they have to hit back.they really do or they will end up being one who always gets picked on.

[JoolioTooterini]

send him to judo classes is my advice

judo teaches you to step out of the way and the bully is caught by his own impetus

[Greensleeves]

I agree jools - judo is a great idea, builds confidence too.

[airy]

But bullies are cowards, we all know that. Never hitting back doesn't necessarily mean that your child will always be picked on.
I was bullied at primary school, and finding the courage to verbally stand up for myself is what stopped it.
Kids that use violence to pick on others arn't generally expecting to be shouted at or stood up to loudly by that child and ime it almost always works.

[PinkTulips]

when i came home from school at 4 crying because a boy had hit me my mom said 'well go in there tomorrow and kick him and he'll never do it again, and whenever some one hits you, hit back. don't ever be the first to hi, but never let some one get away with hitting you' i've followed her advice my whole life and it has always worked. once they see your not an easy target they don't pick on you.

[edam]

Or, is there any way you can get nasty kid on his own, look him very firmly in the eye, and in a voice of authority tell him 'listen here sunshine, any more hitting and you will never play with my ds again'. Or tell him you are a witch or something (if he's young enough to believe it).

[ScummyMummy]

Judo sounds like a great idea jools.

Where is ds1 when all this is going on hc? Can't the two of them unite against this kid? I thought it was an older sibling's job to sort these things out, within reason? Is that not fashionable any more?

[FillyjonktheBananaEater]

what are judo classes like for kids? Are the teachers generally good? I know it can be great, a method of teaching self-discipline etc, but I remember being karate chopped quite a few times at school Am wondering how well it works for kids, or if it just gives them the skills to hurt others?

Am curious, cos I have a 3 yo who I think would benefit (in a few years, of course)

[kittywits]

Greensleeves,from what I understand of you verbal lashings are ok then?

[QueenEagle]

As a last resort, yes I would.

Depends on the child though - if they are not comfortable about hitting back then other means are needed. Like avoidance probably.

If like my ds1 he is a softy but tough when he needs to be, then advise him to give as good as he gets. If that means a well aimed punch in the mouth, then so be it.

[Greensleeves]

Not where children are concerned, kittywits, no. Lashings of any description aren't necessary towards children IMO.

[mytwopenceworth]

I have to say I really hate this new approach that you shouldn't ever hit back. If someone is a threat to you, you have the right to defend yourself. I think it is dangerous to give our children the message that someone can do something to them that harms them and they are to just take it on the chin!

I think it is important to teach kids to walk away from trouble when they can, to seek help from a safe adult but also to teach them that if they are in a situation where they are being threatened, that it is actually ok to push, to yell or even hit out if that is the only way to get out of the situation.

If I was cornered and being hit, I sure as hell wouldn't stand there and take it and I wouldn't ask my child to either.

So, I would teach my kids to yell out NO YOU DO NOT HIT ME. GET OFF. To tell an adult. To run away if they can. But if it comes right down to it, to fight back enough to get away is ok.

[FillyjonktheBananaEater]

I think my difficulty here is that this child is NOT in a sitation where adults cannot defend him.

Adults are around and they are failing to protect him. He is only 7!

I think judo etc is potentially a fab idea for self confidence but...he is being bullied here! It needs sorting!

(but i am another controlling old witch, so hey)