Breast feeding to sleep

[sarah1girl]

I'm a fisrt time mum and have dug myself into a hole! My little girl will only go to sleep wilst feeding, then will only stay in her cot for 2 hours max. She then comes to bed with me and snacks all night. I have been told that at 8 months she dosn't need to feed during the night and should sleep through, what no-one seems to be able to tell me is how I get her to do that. Please someone help me I need some sleep

[bundle]

try feeding her until she's v drowsy (at "normal" bedtime) and put her down into her cot. if she grizzles, give her a cuddle but no more milk, she needs to know what it feels like to fall asleep by herself. a dummy might help (both my girls started with one - only for bedtime - at around this age)

[Witchycat]

My dd only started sleeping through at about 8.5 months when I stopped b/f at night.

I didn't do the whole drastic controlled crying thing though.

Over a week or two I just gradually gave her less attention when she woke up. I.e. on the first night of 'the I need sleep campaign' I made sure she had a really good feed about 10.30pm then when she woke after that with me or dp would go in, switch on a machine that makes the sound of waves, and cuddle her & rock her back to sleep each time she woke up.

After a couple of nights of that, we would go in but not pick her up - just swithc on the wave machine, pat her and say shhh until she went back to sleep (sometimes this took up to 20 mins and she'd cry as if it wasn't going to work but it did after a bit - I made dp do this bit);

after a few days of this we started not going in at all (so long as she wasn't getting distressed) and she would wake & cry for a few minutes but then settle herself back to sleep. Now she usually sleeps from 7pm till about 10-11pm, has a quick 5oz & then back to sleep till 7am. I can't tell you what a difference it makes to get that much sleep!

Good luck, whatever you decide to do.

[Ironmaiden]

You could try getting her into a very strict routine during the day as well as following Witchycat's night time instructions. Babies like routine and mine thrives on knowing what's going on. She gets herself mentally prepared for 12hours in bed at 7pm because she has had the same day routine for 5 months and the same thing happens every day. Your dd is still small enough to establish a routine. Its hard work but very worth it. Good luck.

[Maiakins]

I know just what you mean. I've got the same thing, but at 18 months! My dd only had her first sleep through the night last month! I found that the No Cry, Sleep Solution book by Elizabeth Pantley had lots of advice on gentle methods if you can't bear control crying. What I found helped was just as your dd falls asleep, slip your finger in between her mouth and your breast and ease her off. The idea is to get her to sleep without sucking on the nipple. If she keeps desperately trying to latch back on, then let her and try again later. You'll find that if she's just on the edge of sleep, she may then fall asleep then. Each time, try slipping your finger in earlier and earlier, thereby getting her used to the idea of sleep without the breast. It is a very gradual, slow method so not ideal if you're looking for a quick method that works within a day or too, but a good one if you can't face lots of crying. Good luck!

[Ironmaiden]

Forgot to say, if you establish the feeding / sleeping routine in whatever pattern suits you and your baby but limit daytime sleep to 3 hours between the hours of 7am and 7pm. I give dd 3 naps a day every 2-3 hrs and then she's tired enough for bed at 7pm.

[sarah1girl]

Thankyou all. I had heard about controlled crying but don't think Ive got the will power for that, but will def. try the more gentle advise. we're moving house on Friday and she has strating cutting a tooth, so all in all plenty of stress!! many thanks

[hunkermunker]

I'd say don't try anything at a time of stress for you or teething for her - you'll make more stress for yourself!

Also, I found it really helpful when wanting to stop night feeds for DH to do the settling for a couple of nights. DS knew I could feed him, but he knew DH couldn't. Is that an option for you?

Good luck with the move and hope the tooth comes through relatively easily!

[highlander]

actually, she might still need 1 or 2 BFs until she is 1 year old.

[Tatties]

Sarah, you have my sympathies as my 7mth old ds wakes every few hours at night, only to be settled by bf.. Sometimes I think I can cope with the broken nights, and other times I really wish he would sleep through. At this age I wonder if he will ever do it on his own! I realise that I probably need to instigate some changes, but I could never do anything as drastic as cc, because how could I ever be 100% sure that he isn't hungry? I think it can't do any harm to try the gentle methods mentioned here.

What are the facts about whether babies need night feeds? I have been told they don't after 6mths, but Highlander, you say different. Would love to know the truth!

[Tatties]

Also Sarah, just wanted to add that people on MN really reassured me on a BF to sleep thread a while ago. I understand that you need some sleep and don't want to be woken every couple of hours at night, but what you are doing is not wrong, if that is how you are feeling. The babies don't know any different and if they have the lovely breast to soothe them back to sleep every time they wake why would they settle for some shushing? As far as they know that is how they get to sleep and it is perfectly natural. But of course that conflicts with our desire for a good night's sleep! I would really love to get a good sleep but not at any cost (i.e. CC). It is fine trying out the 'gentle' alternatives to BF, like cuddling, rocking, shushing, etc.. but they don't seem to work for my ds, except on the odd occasion.

Sorry that was a bit rambling, I suppose what I am really trying to say is of course gently encourage your lo to go back to sleep without BF, but don't feel bad if it doesn't work & you go back to BF to sleep, because maybe she's just not ready to do it yet. Different things will work at different times.

Hope things do work out though and you get your sleep soon

[fishie]

oh so pleased to see this thread, have been mentally composing my own at 3am... my ds (6 months) snacks away for hours. we're co-sleeping, he only wakes up when hungry, but i am under such pressure "is he still in your bed" "you're storing up trouble" "poor dp" aaarg and hmph (he loves it doesn't ever have to wake up!) so glad to see this is still perfectly normal for at least a few months yet.

[frannyandzooey]

Yes, I agree, change things if they are not working for you, but not because you think she "shouldn't" need milk or she "should" learn how to get to sleep by herself. It is completely natural for young children to fall asleep this way - there are substances in our milk which induce sleepiness, nature intends us to do it this way. Night time feeding also boosts your daytime supply, and helps to prevent you returning to full fertility, which is good for your health in many ways while your baby is young.

I found the Dr. Sears books very helpful and reassuring on night time breastfeeding and also night time weaning when you decide the time is right for both of you.

Personally I have had several periods where I felt night time feeds were getting too much for me. These periods never last long however and are usually followed by ds sleeping better for a few months. Teething and other disruptions are bound to lead to a more wakeful night. Try to rest with your dd during the day and look after yourself in other ways to help you get through this wearing time. This will all be far behind you one day and you will miss these night time cuddles...

[frannyandzooey]

Fishie it's normal for as long as you want! People all over the world sleep with their children and enjoy it

[chipmonkey]

I love having ds3 in bed with me, he's all soft-skinned and snuggly!

[chipmonkey]

dh not so keen though!

[Hattie05]

You don't have to work out how to stop her feeding to sleep if you don't want to. I asked the same questions when my dd was 1 year old and everyone in the world was lecturing me about the fact she was still bf, still getting into my bed after a couple of hours in the cot ....nobody ever had the answers.
I tried various 'methods' of sleep training, decided i hated them and that they were making me and my baby very stressed. So we went back to what 'we' knew best, which was stick the baby in our bed and let her feed whenever during the night. DD continued this until she was two when she then felt quite grown up and that she'd like her own bedroom.
I now have a near three year old who goes to sleep on her own in her own bed and stays there until morning when she jumps in our bed and has a lovely snuggle.
SO you have not dug yourself into a hole, the world around you is trying to make you feel like that. But at the end of the day you need to do what feels most comfortable to you. This will not harm your child, only provide the security and comfort that an 8mth old needs.

HTH

[Tatties]

F&Z, I have had a few nights where ds has got me up for a feed, I feed him, put him back down and he starts crying again.. This is when I feel I can't cope with night feeds. The other night when this happened I just left him in his cot and said to dp I couldn't do it anymore, so he went in and comforted ds back to sleep (which doesn't normally work). I think that sometimes just when you think things are getting on top of you, things suddenly change and get better. I am just starting to learn that when ds has a run of particularly bad nights, he improves just at the point when I feel like I need to introduce some drastic measures! Although you may consider your baby to be a 'bad sleeper', they have their ups and downs within that title, just as you will have periods where you feel better equipped to cope with it all.

It annoys me too when people say, " he's got you wrapped around his little finger.." or ," give him water at night, then he'll realise it's not worth waking up for.." Sorry, but I really don't believe (even at 6mths plus) that babies are the conniving little imps people make them out to be. They certainly don't wake themsleves up for milk in the night, so erm, don't think they can convince themselves not to wake up for it and just try giving my ds water at 3am..

[Tatties]

PS - I read a Deborah Jackson book, When your baby cries. Very positive.. Reading it made me feel oh so much better (and a bit smug) about continuing night feeds. Really in our society we are a bit obsessed with making babies independent at such an early age. I know it is convenient for us and we would like a bit of independence back, and some people have no choice if they are going back to work, etc.. but it is not necessary purely because we think that if we don't teach them to sleep by themselves now, they will never do it. They will do it when they are good and ready.

I like this, it's turned into a feel-good BF to sleep thread

[aloha]

I hate it now tbh. DD is nearly nine months and I don't look forward to bed (can you tell?) because I know I will be woken up in the middle of the night, and I also can't fully relax with dd in bed with me. I am beginning to feel really, really tired. But I also can't face yelling at 3am and feeding makes her go to sleep.
And she started off as such a great sleeper!

[Tatties]

I suppose I can't really complain about not getting a good night's sleep when I am sat here at ten to midnight..

[aloha]

But I'm sat here because I feel a sinking sense of dread whenever I go to bed these days...

[Hattie05]

But is part of the hating it, about the fact that it is not the "socially acceptable" way to manage a sleep time?

I found that i used to hate it because i felt i wasn't doing the right thing. Once i realised that i could say sod the lot of you i'm doing this my way. I began to enjoy it, became routine that i'd come up to bed whenever dd woke, we'd snuggle and she'd feed during the night, by morning i could never remember whether she had or hadn't fed!

[aloha]

No, it really isn't. It's just that on the rare occasions she has slept all night I've felt absolutely fantastic. I hate being woken in the night, and I don't sleep as well with her in the bed - I'm terrified to turn over in case she wakes.
Nothing to do with acceptability. Don't care about that at all.
Just would like to snuggle down and know that was it until morning. Ah well, it won't be forever, I suppose.

[Tatties]

Oh dear.. Does this mean that in 2 months time all this positivity will have evaporated and I will dread going to bed too? What about when you've just tucked them in for the nth time at, let's say 4am, then you get yourself tucked in, all nice and warm and snuggly and then they start bleating again That's great isn't it..

[Hattie05]

Maybe the fact that i sleep like a log helps me there then .

DP often would wake me saying, can you move your elbow off dd's face. I swear thats what encouraged her to want to go in her own bed