Are day nurseries suitable places for babies?

[ArtichokeTagine]

My DD is 9 months and started nursery 3 days a week last week. I have been stunned my the reaction of people when I tell them this. If I hear one more person say "that is young for nursery" I will scream. Alot of people seem to think that it is cruel and under twos need one-to-one care.

One-to-one care is not a financial option for us. Even if we could afford it I honestly beleive that it could be more damaging. What kind of lesson is it for a baby if the person they see as a second Mum and are deeply attached to disappears after X months to be replaced by another person who disappears after Y months? That is a horrible thing to come to expect.

I guess I am just wondering how many other Mums would choose nursery for a baby even if they could afford a nanny? And whether there is evidence that babies are damaged by a lack of one-to-one care during the day (as no many people have implied to me this week).

[Sunyshineymummy]

My DS has been going to a day nursery since he was 7 months old. He loves it and we're over the moon with the care he receives. He's a very social child and we think some of this is down to him socialising at nursery. He'a also extremely confident and very independent.

[Kif]

well, i went for a nursery rather than childminder. Childminders seemed to spend a lot of the day in transit doing school pick ups - didn't want my dd spending day like that - and a bit funny about people driving my kids (I'm very particular about car seats and cars that do well in crash tests - among other things).

Nanny would have been too expensive for us - but also my SIL had an au pair, who made friends with the local nannies - and came back full of stories of how they do as little as they can get away with - just leave the kids to their own devices all day while they gossip with their firends/watch tv/read mags. Is that what is meant by 1:1 care?

[ajj]

I chose a Childminder for my DD when I went back to work. I wanted her to mix with other children, but didn't want a large setting with lots of different carers. I found it worked really well, she had fun and made lots of friends. We still keep in touch with her now even though we haved moved away, and I am now a cm myself.

[chilledmama]

I have chosen a day nursery for my DS (7months now, will be 10.5 months when qI go back to work fulltime).

I didn't want him spending all day every day with just one person unless that person is me or my DH! Perhaps that is slightly wrong of me but I think that nursery gives the best of both worlds if you have to use childcare...lots of adults and children therfore lots of social skill development and lots of kisses and cuddles!

[tinymum]

I think its a personal choice.

Having read Steve Biddulphs book, its made me think twice, personally.

[ScottishThistle]

It would appear you've made your mind up so I'm not sure you'll want to hear what I have to say?

As a qualified NNEB Nanny, I have yet to be convinced Nurseries are a suitable environment for Babies...The first 2 years of a child's life are very important & I don't feel a nursery can meet the needs of one so young.

Some nurseries have a very high turnover of staff, did you ask how long each member of staff had worked in the nursery?

Children are very adaptable & sadly they can forget a former Nanny in a matter of months if she's been replaced by another good Nanny.

Nannies generally stay for more than a year with the same family & I know of nannies who have been with the same children for as long as 7yrs!

[tinymum]

www.stevebiddulph.com is worth a look.

Its a contraversial point of view.

[Genidef]

We went for a nursery from 7 months for some of the reasons that have been mentioned here - cost (very pricey one child); most of the nannies I interviewed were overly keen on 'getting out and about' in their car somewhere, which I didn't like or feel was necessary at that age, and seemed like more for their entertainment; socialisation; felt comfortable with the particular nursery we chose; CMs seemed, as you say, awfully busy with school runs and didn't want to work the hours we needed some days.

We then went to a combination of nanny/nursery care - not becuase it proved unsuitable but because DD got sick ALL THE TIME at that age. So, there ended up being pretty much no cost savings relative to having a nanny (the nursery was pricey).

We are now going back to nursery only (and me working from home 1 day) because boy can it be a hassle being an employer. We're taking a breather from that one. Plus, she's older now and not as prone to illness, and the nursery itself is cheaper once they're passed a certain age, so the days we do need babysitting cover we don't end up losing out as we did before.

It all depends on the nursery or whatever care you have, what is good for your child.

[Kathyis6incheshigh]

Depends on baby, depends on nursery.

I would choose nursery for dd even if I could afford nanny, because she has been at hers since 5 months (now nearly 2 years old) and loves it. But we are very lucky that it's a lovely place with low staff turnover and she is the sort of child that thrives with lots of people around her.

[Oblomov]

I think people are anti childcare of young babies - both nursery and childcare - that is what is probably causing their reactions to your news.

Childminder ? Nursery ? That old debate ? Depends what it is that you want for your child.

Ds has been at a nursery since 7 mths. But deep in my heart, even I agree, that most cbabies, particularly boys, shuld be at home with mum. I guess I agree with stevebiddulph.
But, at the same time, I am happy with my choice of sending ds to nursery.
Should we / shouldn't we work/ send them to childminder ....... the life long question. Who knows.

[nogoes]

I agree with ScottishThistle and Tinymum. I was planning to send ds to a nursery for 3 days per week when he was 12 months but it just didn't feel right although there was nothing wrong with the nursery I just did not feel comfortable for him to spend such long days in that type of setting. My own personal preference would be for a nanny or childminder but that is just my opinion and I would not berate someone for the choices that they have made.

[PrincessPeaHead]

I know lots of nannies who used to work in nurseries.
All of them say they'd never send a child under 1 to one. They all say they'd stay at home or get a one-to-one carer (whether that is a nanny, a relative or a childminder).
I must say I feel the same way.

[Genidef]

I agree it depends on the child. DD is really outgoing and independent and enjoys her days. In the morning she says to me: "Wanna get dressed and go into town!" There do seem to be fewer boys in the nurseries we've used I've noticed. Some people have theories about this, but it could also well be random.

[PrincessPeaHead]

oooh I've just seen scottishthistle, saying much the same thing from a nanny's point of view.

our fantastic lovely kind nanny of 5 years has just left - the children love her, think she is wonderful... and embarrassingly didn't turn a hair when she went. They were "right, bye then!". Children do not become emotionally attached to nannies unless they are not getting proper mothering from the mother, and effectively turn the nanny into a mother substitute. My kids know that they will see ex-nanny now and then (she lives close by) and are more excited about what the next nanny will be like!

[chipkid]

I sent my ds to nursery from 7 months for three days a week. With my dd I made a decision that she would not go to nursery until she was three. She was cared for at home by a nanny.
Nursery is a difficult place for small children. There are massive benefits for a young child to be in a home environment. I found with ds that he became more aggressive and more competitive in the nursery environment. As he got older he loved it and really benefitted from the activities on offer. I wish that I had not sent him there as a small baby.

[ArtichokeTagine]

Interesting. I should say I have not got a closed mind. DD has started nursery but if she doesn't settle, or seems to suffer, then I would reconsider. I would also reconsider if I read something that really convinced me that nurseries are wrong for babies. I will go and read that Steve Biddulph link now.

One thing I have thought about is whether DD is having an experience that will help or hinder her in later life. At nursery she is learning to associate with other kids and she is learning that you do not always get someone's undivided attention 100% of the time. Those are useful "lessons". As I said in my OP I question whether it is useful to learn that those you are attached to might disappear and not be seen again. I am not committed to this argument but it makes sense to me.

[ArtichokeTagine]

X-posted with lots of people then. Sorry i sounded dismissive.

PrincessPea - can I ask why the nannies who had worked in nurseries were so against sending babies there? Did they give details?

[ScottishThistle]

ArtichokeTagine, I've seen no evidence of any children becoming distressed when I or another Nanny has left, usually it's Mum who's in tears!

I'll stay away from this thread because it's an issue I feel very strongly about!

[edam]

Not surprised nannies would say no to nursery, it's the competion, isn't it? Probably not as crude as that but if you are a trained, experienced nanny, presumably you think that is the best way to care for children, otherwise why do it (unless you are that mad maternity nurse who does the celebs and believes prem babies should sleep through the night from day one with only one feed. Think she said she did it for the money).

FWIW ds went to nursery at 7 months - couldn't afford a nanny, couldn't find a childminder I'd have left my cat with tbh (am sure there are lots of lovely ones, just none with vacancies near me). I don't think it's had any major long term harmful effects on him but If I had another, I think I'd rather go for childminder/nanny at the baby state, assuming I could find/afford one. Just don't think the way nurseries recruit, pay and train staff is the way to get a stable, happy workforce.

[Sunyshineymummy]

DS enjoys his days too. He's really thrived in the nursery environment.

[motherinferior]

I think all forms of childcare - nurseries, nannies, and childminders - can be utterly fabulous. Depends solely on what you get. I'd say nine months is fine for a nice nursery, actually.

[Kathyis6incheshigh]

Anyway, there are some really awful nurseries out there, so if you're a nanny who's worked at a few it would tend to put you off them.

But there are some great ones too.

[Grrrr]

I think that 3 days a week is different to full-time.

Basically, 4 whole days and 3 part days (evenings and mornings) your dd is with you getting one to one care. I presuming she isn't unhappy with her time at nursery, although it will take her time to settle in.

What if you had twins, no one to one care there. Also if you had another child quite soon after the first, no one to one care possible there.

All children are different (I kind of think 9 months is getting past the "baby" stage) and if nursery doesn't suit your dd you can think again about trying something different like a childminder.

I suppose I am in the position of being able to afford a nanny as I now have two children in under fives type daycare so the costs are much closer to those of a nanny. I did think about it when pregnant for the second time but chose to stick with the nursery option because it suited the first child so well that I felt it would be wrong to pull him out for the sake of the less disapproved of alternative of a nanny. The second child is currently loving nursery (9 months old too) and I do feel that some people who utter these sould destroying little phrases have not experienced a good nursery and what it has to offer the child.

There are good nurseries and disgraceful nurseries, crap nannies and marvellous nannies, rotten childminders and excellent childminders, the trick is to find a good childcare provider that suits you and your child and then keep monitoring the situation and the effect on your child so that you can take appropriate action to continue to ensure your child is a happy as can be given the constraints on your personal circumstances.

Don't torture yourself with the idea that all babies of SAHM parents are getting doting, lovey dovey, stimulating one to one care. Some are pushed/trailed round shopping centres daily or exposed to too much cigarette smoke or allowed to watch an awful lot of T.V. A minority hopefully but in the same way that for a minority, childcare provided by someone other than the parent is not good for them becuase the quality thereof is not up to scratch.

[AnnabelCaramel]

Good post Grrrr.

[PrincessPeaHead]

no it isn't as simple as that edam. most of the NNEB trained nannies around here work in nurseries as there aren't really that many traditional nanny jobs around (I'm in the country, not london or home counties). So my last nanny had been previously 4 years in a nursery, then before that 2 years as a teaching assistant in a school, then 2 years before that in a nursery and we were her first "nanny" job. The new one is also out of a nursery where she has been for 3 years, and before that in a nanny job for 2. So they all have experience of both. In fact the new one has been running the Baby 1 room (youngest babies) for 3 years. Both of them (and others I've interviewed and met etc) are adamant that nursery isn't a good place for young babies. They think that is just too institutional for them, that babies need a home environment, that they don't need the constant stimulation of other people and babies around for long hours a day. They both find young babies in nursery really sad.

Sorry that probably isn't what everyone wants to hear, but I keep hearing that from people who work in them, and I pay attention to it.