The new Paleo/Primal thread - please reintroduce yourself, newcomers welcome!

(906 Posts)
misscph1973 Mon 24-Jun-13 13:53:00

Wow, we got to 1000 messages!

Welcome back from the previous thread and welcome to all new!

I have been Paleo since September last year, I started as an ex-vegetarian/vegan, I wanted to give up gluten and I had been doing 5:2/IF, which lead me to Paleo/primal. I am 40, I have 2 kids age 8 and 6. I have no major health issues, but I would like it to stay that way. I have bad skin, which has improved since starting Paleo and my dandruff has disappeared. I have gained some weight since starting Paleo, but I was not overweight before, although I would like to get back on my pre Paleo weight - I just love Paleo mayonnaise too much ;) I still practice IF and I lift weights 2-3 times per week. My family is also Paleo.

I have just come back from a camping weekend where I was not strict Paleo as I was camping with other families and I just didn't want to spend my entire weekend telling my kids "no, you cant have it". I do think that Paleo camping is entirely possible, think tinned fish, nuts, sausages, eggs etc.

FavadiCacao Mon 24-Jun-13 20:10:19

Lovely to see you again miss wink

I've been paleo for over 3 years and lost almost 30kg grin. Also, my asthma, eczema and ulcer have disappeared. I do sit-ups, resistance steps, a few light weights, some squats and walking. The rest of the family is mainly Paleo (when away....).

I've always cooked from scratch and bought locally (organic where possible). I have always enjoyed turning my gardens into edible gardens instead of traditional flowers/shrubs/hedges. So adapting to Paleo has not been difficult. There is something so rewarding of harvesting and cooking your food- we even indulge in a bit of foraging. smile

snoworneahva Mon 24-Jun-13 21:40:11

Thanks for the new thread Miss

I've been low carb for a year, then turned Primal a couple of months ago. I love eating, love cooking and trying new dishes, I am firmly in the live to eat camp and eating primal allows me to do that without feeling too restricted.
My dcs eat mostly primal....with the odd rebellion, we try not to be rigid.
I run 2-3 times a week and do an outdoors bootcamp class twice a week to keep in shape, walk as much as I can.

RabbitFromAHat Mon 24-Jun-13 21:46:56

Hello! I've been reading the old thread avidly, so I suppose it's time to introduce myself. grin

I am RabbitFromAHat and I am, it has turned out very recently, a coeliac. So although I won't necessarily be strictly or ideologically Paleo, I will certainly be eating that way a lot of my time (I am keen on the odd brown rice and sweet potato addition to my diet, not least because I am a penniless student, and I love dairy and also have osteoporosis so I am all set to add More Cheese Than Is Socially Acceptable to many of my meals).

I am quite optimistic about being able to cope with my new diagnosis, at least for the moment, not least because I have been unsuccessfully TTC and alas coeliac disease is closely linked with unexplained infertility.

This evening I made baked aubergines stuffed with a minced beef stew type thing, topped with Parmesan, and baked some mini frittata for breakfast tomorrow - smoked salmon and green bean. smile

I've found all of your posts so helpful and I'm looking forward to the rest of the thread.

MacaYoniandCheese Mon 24-Jun-13 21:48:13

Yay! I wondered what happened to the old thread. I've been doing paleo for three months for health reasons (VERY strong family history of diabetes and insulin issues). Have lost 10 lbs, unintentionally. I run 5 days a week and do a little bit of hand weights/squats/push-ups a few times a week. Not missing the bread, pasta, noodles, potato at all as you get to keep all the good stuff grin.

I'd love to know what all of you are serving for family dinners as I'm stuck in a bit of rut....not that it's hard to adapt dishes to be paleo, just needing inspiration smile.

RabbitFromAHat Mon 24-Jun-13 21:53:16

I forgot to say one of my major goals is to get back to proper exercise - I enjoy adventure racing and obstacle racing as well as gym work, and was training for a marathon in October.

Unfortunately it turned out due to the coeliac disease having damaged my intestines, I am incredibly anaemic (ferritin count of 5 and awaiting transfusion if it doesn't improve soon) I have been advised to halt the exercise for a wee while. I ran a half marathon in May but after that decided I should probably obey the doctors nothing to do with me feeling half dead for a fortnight afterwards, not at all

buildingmycorestrength Mon 24-Jun-13 22:02:30

Hi all, am back. Thanks for new thread. Have given up grains for a couple of months now, and have lost weight slowly but (sort of) steadily. Overdo the carbs sometimes...I have chronic fatigue syndrome and can't exercise so really have to limit them if I want to lose weight, which I DO!

Am so much more able to control my eating without the grains.

Still eat dairy, but less than I used to, and mainly natural yoghurt.

Have just bought some coconut flour and am keen to try some recipes....please?

EMUZ Tue 25-Jun-13 04:37:10

smile I posted about my fall of the wagon under another name I think. Started paleo/primal in January and lost 9kg and many inches. Fell unexpectedly pregnant and have been through termination which floored me. So I am back on it this week and doing ok so far
I eat dairy but only have milk in coffee and I do use protein shakes for after workouts
Today was a bit of a rubbish day as I need to sort my sleep patterns out.
B/L - 3 scrambled eggs with ham and cheese
After workout protein shake
Tea - 2 97% pork sausages, sweet potato mash and veg
Wanted something sweet so had an apple and peanut butter
3.5L water

Workout wise I do HIIT, and a circuit/boot camp class which is lots of squats, lunges, weights etc as well as horse riding and usually a personal training session. To complicate matters I put my back out completely and ended up in an ambulance with gas & air blush so I couldn't train either. Luckily I don't appear to have put much weight on, probably due to stress!!!

buildingmycorestrength Tue 25-Jun-13 07:04:33

Hi, Emuz. thanks Hope you are okay. Sounds like a really difficult time.

forcookssake Tue 25-Jun-13 07:49:26

I lurked avidly on the previous threads and even sat down and made an excel sheet to collate the recipes, meal plans and shopping tips grin
I had been eating low carbing for extended periods over the last six years then at the start of this year began paleo and feel very well eating without grains. Also I have MS and there is some really interesting research about the positive effect of a pale diet on auto immune conditions smile

RawCoconutMacaroon Tue 25-Jun-13 11:16:05

Wow, we got to 1000, not seen that with a paleo/primal thread before!

Reintroduction of myself for this new thread, low carb, 6+years, paleo/primal for a couple, with a bit of a blip just before that (after sleep problems really hit with DC4 at about 6months old), Health issues flared massively in line with my increased carb/grain consumption at that time.

Benefits to me, health wise of eating this way, list of autoimmune and suspected autoimmune conditions and symptoms about a mile long, all disappeared, or are resolving (hair loss and nail ridging are resolving, but not quite 100%), joint, muscle and bone pain, resolved, dry eyes, mouth and lips, resolved. Thyroid symptoms gone, blood sugars now low normal and very steady, rather than wildly fluctuating.... Etc!

RawCoconutMacaroon Tue 25-Jun-13 15:37:08

... And a LOT of weight lost too!

FavadiCacao Tue 25-Jun-13 16:45:15

My goodness, Rabbit. Could you not get away with an IV iron infusion? flowers
Chris Kresser has written quite a few articles on dairy, some related to osteoporosis as well.

Emuz flowers Really pleased to see you back.

kellykettle Wed 26-Jun-13 07:56:14

Thanks for the new thread Miss

Welcome Rabbit smile

I have been Paleo since searching for a way to avoid the type II diabetes and heart disease which plagues my parents and grandparents. I was scared for my children more than anything.

Rabbit Paleo on a budget is totally possible but I would ditch the brown rice. Grains are the first thing you should ditch but if you must eat rice make it white. It's nutritionally a nothing, basically a starch so will impact your blood glucose and insulin (which we aim to keep low on paleo).

If we're having a budget week on Paleo I go to the supermarket and get 3 packs of meat for £20 and frozen veg. Usually a whole chicken or two in there which I will roast and turn into litres of stock. Asda sell 2 packs of 12 or 15 free range eggs for £4. Liver, heart etc are v cheap and make yummy pâté (liver) or bolognese (heart). Tesco sell big packs of sweet potato now which makes them more economical too.

Drink the stock with some organic sea salt - I forget the brand but its rich in minerals and the stock will be great for your joints and bones. I add it to everything - I made chilli last night and mixed some into the sauce.

Breakfast is usually eggs of some description with butter and I try I get some veg in there too. Courgette frittata is a popular one here. Throw cheese on if you eat it and keep the cold left overs in the fridge. I make mini ones for the DDs with sweet potato & bacon in and they love them.

I usually take leftovers for lunch or soup (made with the never-ending stock!) or salad if I can be bothered to make one. I am addicted to bacon and avocado at the moment. I made a huge salad last week - red cabbage, spring onions, baby plum tomatoes, carrots, peppers and bacon and an entire avocado. It took absolutely ages to eat it but I loved it.

We do buy into Paleo as a lifestyle rather than a diet but I have been pretty rubbish on the exercise front. However, I am starting Crossfit in a few weeks. I'm scared senseless (partly because my pelvic floor is totally not what it was pre-kids) but I'm looking forward to it. Does anyone else Crossfit?

EMUZ Wed 26-Jun-13 08:14:29

I don't crossfit but I do a similar boot camp type thing smile lots of squats, dead lifts, lunges etc
Goes well with Paleo

kellykettle Wed 26-Jun-13 08:15:50

Rabbit I been fretting about your post since I replied! There is a Kindle book called autoimmune paleo which you might find useful (it's about £2.50 I think). The grains (brown rice) really will be a bad idea for your gut - especially with coeliacs. Don't forget that Paleo fats, meats and veg are more filling than carbs so once you adapt you may find that you're eating less often but more nutrient-dense food.

Grains don't want to be eaten and so aggravate the gut when consumed. There are people (WAP not paleo) who believe that well prepared grains - ie soaked for hours and hours - are fine but I have never explored that. I don't love any grain enough to soak it or sprout it for three days just to eat it.

Also on the stock front (realise I sound a bit obsessed) it contains gelatine and other great things for gut health which I think you will find really helpful & possibly soothing.

And lastly I'm sorry to hear your fertility has been impacted. Eat clean whole foods, food that benefit gut health (probiotics are another good choice) and hopefully your overall health and fertility will improve. smile

kellykettle Wed 26-Jun-13 08:17:55

emuz do you enjoy it? I used to do a weights class before having DD1 but I feel totally out of shape now. I'm scared of collapsing with patheticness in front of a room full of strong people! grin

Also <shallow question> what do you wear?

EMUZ Wed 26-Jun-13 08:26:59

Love it gringrin except the barbell circuit we did on Monday. My legs feel like painful leg and I've found a muscle in my bum I didn't know I had
Mainly I wear tight Capri type things and long vest tops - my newest one says "your workout is my warmup"
Treated myself last month to some new Nike free run trainers

EMUZ Wed 26-Jun-13 08:28:37

Here was the barbell circuit (all with 15kg barbell)
Squat, clean and press, lunge (both legs), bent over row. Run 200m. Repeat but 2 reps of everything, then 3,4.. All the way to 10 reps then back down to 9,8 until you reach one

kellykettle Wed 26-Jun-13 08:36:13

Oh dear God! It's been so long since I've done a class that needed commitment. I mean, aerobics or something - you just dance your way to the end don't you?

How long have you been going?

I'm off to google your new trainers grin

RabbitFromAHat Wed 26-Jun-13 08:39:15

Cacao sorry, yes, I did mean iron infusion, I'm still getting those things confused! Hopefully it won't come to that though. smile

kelly thank you so much for your posts, that's really helpful - I'll be taking notes from it, and very interesting to hear about the brown rice. I get paid Friday so I'm really looking forward to a big shop over the weekend. I am fond of offal, too! The autoimmune Paleo book sounds like a fine idea, particularly as I'm being investigated for autoimmune liver disorder as well as the coeliac (it might well be just aggravation from the coeliac disease though).

I don't have any Crossfit setup near me, but when in good shape I do kettlebell and Rip:60 (a form of TRX) classes, and in fact was feeling well enough yesterday to do my first Rip:60 class in over six months! One of my goals this year is to really build up my strength.

EMUZ Wed 26-Jun-13 08:39:26

Phew um started in January 2012 but didn't do the paleo alongside until January of this year. Got the trainers off eBay, they released the free run 3 so I got the free run 2 cheaper wink
Purple and silver for a bit of colour!
I do have personal training sessions too and try and do spin. They've just started new classes though and there is power stretch, body pump and.. Crossfit grin <might die in a heap>
I'm no teeny person, am a size 16 but can now do 15 full press ups

kellykettle Wed 26-Jun-13 08:48:59

Rabbit grin I'm focusing on strength this year too (hence my quizzing Emuz grin). I'm 35 next week and I suddenly feel like I'm ageing. I don't want to be one of those women who's skinny-fat. I'm thin but I have absolutely no strength!

Emuz ooh that's a good tip - thanks. I like the idea of a bit of colour. Might see if DH wants to get me some for my birthday wink

RabbitFromAHat Wed 26-Jun-13 08:56:05

Hurrah! I like the way we're all in it together.

I know that Paleo doesn't necessarily recommend long-distance running but I enjoy it, so if I get back to full health I'll be doing at least a bit. But for the next six months anyway I don't see myself worrying about doing anything over 10k. But I do love my Rip:60 classes, it's sets of suspension training interspersed with Tabata circuits - tough! I'm quite a fan of the Girls Gone Strong group, if you're familiar with that, and Molly Galbraith, they're really motivating.

Today I will mostly be eating the store cupboard and freezer contents grin so, smoked salmon and green bean frittata for breakfast, lunch will be a tuna and avocado thing of some kind with red pesto dressing, and dinner stirfried pork with leaves. Nom.

EMUZ Wed 26-Jun-13 09:05:18

I'm back to work tomorrow after 3 months off shock
Vague food plan for today is some form of scrambled eggs and meat then a salad for tea (a paleo one not a low cal one) wink
Food for work is sweet potato mash, homemade burgers and veg

snoworneahva Wed 26-Jun-13 09:26:31

Just had 4 sausages with Paleo ketchup for breakfast.
Avocado & ruby grapefruit with chilli dressing for lunch.
Dinner is going to be Patatas Bravas with bacon for kids - dh and I will have the same but we'll have celeriac rather than potato.

Off to do some gardening/digging today. Very I pressed Emuz with your 15 press ups - I've been trying to do full press ups for 2 years now - I'm nearly there, my arms are less twig like, but my butt is filling out, used to be flat and it's 2inches bigger but it's all muscle. I think 10k run isn't a problem, it's the chronic cardio running - 50-80km a week that seems to cause difficulties.

EMUZ Wed 26-Jun-13 09:28:38

Oh I can't run grin used to run for a local harriers and can do 100m and hurdles and beat most people but not built for any form of distance. Always jealous of people that just pop out and run a few miles
I don't know why but I do seem to have insane upper body strength. No idea where from

snoworneahva Wed 26-Jun-13 09:35:21

My very skinny 10year old dd has more upper body strength than I do and although I can distance run - my sprinting is poor, I'm always last in short races. I guess we all face body limitations - I will do a proper press up one day, I'm determined!

GiraffesEatPineapples Wed 26-Jun-13 11:22:03

Thanks for the new thread Miss thanks. Hi all smile

I need to catch up properly but will just reintroduce myself. I also found this woe through 5:2 fasting. Previously I had thought low carb no grain is def not the way for me, but somehow going from 5:2 it made sense. I haven't really done any planned fasts since changing and as weigltloss was so slow before I kind of think maybe its not right for my body at the moment.

Not sure what my weight is as currently doing whole 30 (half way through) with slight mistake/cheat of butter. I have cut out eggs and nuts due to mysterious body rash and increased sensitivity on face. Have become a tiny bit addicted to paleomom website which has a focus on clearing autoimmune and skin issues etc, but think I am going to end up with nothing I can eat! Even cutting nightshades (reccommended for skin and joint problems) isn't happening so far! maybe lifes too short and I should just wear foundation and put up with creaky knees...

Trying to do paleo with children but finding it hard. We have 3 dc the eledest of whom I suspect has wheat/gluten issues, he craves wheat big style and feels deprived by having even porridge for breakfast never mind meat!

This morning I had chicken liver with mushrooms, bacon (thought the liver made up for nitrates) and garlic. It was pretty ok but noone else would eat it so left with some in the fridge.

FavadiCacao Wed 26-Jun-13 11:32:48

Rabbit Usion always bring confusion! grin
I agree with kelly that, as a diagnosed coeliac, all of the grains (quinoa too) should be off the chart; it was the first thing my GP told me. I'm not officially diagnosed, because after only 1 day of reintroducing gluten I had a scary severe asthma attack (after 3 months of not needing an inhaler and never needing one since). My Hb had been low since my teens and it was always put down to endometriosis but it reads in the good/great range since going grains free smile
Also be careful with potatoes as the phytate in them can be difficult to remove and phytates prevent iron absorption.

I love offal too: my favourite is liver cooked in freshly squeezed orange (a good dose of vit c to aid iron absorption)

On a Budget suggestions:
In our youth a whole chicken would last dh and I four meals: breasts; wing and thighs; carcass used to make a lovely broth (a few veg thrown in too); the broth to make soup. Now I know we missed a on bone stock! I'm not so sure we could have afforded the gas to cook it with! wink

Ham shanks gave us 2 meals and a treat: ham; broth and cracklings.

marzipananimal Wed 26-Jun-13 12:43:55

Hi everyone, thought I'd mark my place on this thread although I've been mainly lurking on the last one. I'm interested in trying paleo to see if it will give me more energy and sort out my asthma, hayfever, dust allergy etc. However I'm nearly 40 weeks pregnant so am going to wait until life is a bit easier and baby cuts down on bfing before trying it. DH and I did try to do a whole 30 about a month ago but failed miserably! Really enjoy reading everyone elses ideas and experiences though

GiraffesEatPineapples Wed 26-Jun-13 13:04:57

Def interested in getting into excersise side of paleo, kelly I am 35 at end of year too and want to be fit at 40 [cheesy] Love how enthusisatic you are about it Emuz grin

Snow my upperbody is rubbish. Was trying shred but couldn't do a lot of the pushupy stuff. Actually i found the stretching at the end hardest, I am totally unflexible.

Rabbit along the line of kelly and favadi's comments here is some stuff on gluten cross reactivity please ignore if you dont want extra food complications though.

Hi marzipan and forcookssake smile

I had another long post which I lost so hope I haven't missed anyone out but hi again to all

PS Himalayan pink salt is on offer in my hfood shop does anyone use this?

GiraffesEatPineapples Wed 26-Jun-13 13:21:41

PS marzipan why not go ahead and make some small changes now it can take years months to feel like life is easier plus people will be fussing around making meals for you for a while hopefully? Might even be positive for breastmilk? how cool it would be to do baby led weaning if you have managed to get primal/ paleo by 4 -6 months time! At least that way you wont have to wean your 7 year old off weetabix and toast for breaky, cheese sandwiches for lunch and pasta with cheese for dinner like I am trying to do blush

misscph1973 Wed 26-Jun-13 13:26:28

Giraffes, I am a fan of the paleomum as well, and my DH use it currently as he is on AIP at the moment. Although he misses his coffee, he is enjoying his food even with the restrictions, lots of mince (think patties and hash/scrambles), steaks, chops and cabbage. This he has had bacon and leftover chicken breasts for breakfast. I think once you get into it, AIP is not so hard and quite enjoyable. I am considering if myself at the moment.

Back to the paleomum, that's where I learnt to make coconut milk kefir, which you can have on AIP, I think it's DH's only treat at the moment, and what a good one ;)

I think the wheat cravings in kids are peer related, they see their friends having all that crap in school, it's hard not to think the grass is greener ;) I do find that my kids are very good and really enjoy most of the food they have. Last night we had meatballs in tomato sauce with cheese and served with broccoli and they loved it. This evening I am making liver pate served with fried mushrooms and crispy bacon, I swear my DD would eat the entire batch on her own if I let her;)

EMUZ Wed 26-Jun-13 14:10:49

I have some Himalayan pink salt I keep meaning to do the morning drink with it but haven't done yet!
Today has been rubbish so far as not slept but have had protein shake and total yoghurt with raspberries

FavadiCacao Wed 26-Jun-13 14:24:03

Marzipan Congratulations on your imminent arrival!flowers

What is bothering you or you're not convinced about Paleo that is stopping you from starting now? With both my pregnancies I couldn't stand the smell of bread or the taste of pasta, so I was pretty much paleo (with too many potatoes and way too much fruit). Also, when dd was born pasta was still a novelty in this country, the bread was more expensive than potatoes, Basmati rice had the same price as gold and the 'easy cook' rice was/is just that;lean meat, other than chicken and rabbit, was out of our price range; the only pulses available I didn't like; so I continued to eat grain and pulses free all through breastfeeding. Dd is a healthy young woman, who does her best to follow paleo on a shoestring.

Thanks to snow, I'm now addicted into making Bacon. grin The current batch is producing more liquid: the belly is meatier than the last one.

FavadiCacao Wed 26-Jun-13 15:19:02

In the last thread we discussed some hot topics that we felt best aired in this little group rather than in the open arena! And some of us felt somewhat relieved in venting out! grin

Again, recently, in the news I spotted the nth facilitation towards installing smart meters-what's wrong with the good old fashioned analogue meters? I like the idea of being able to track what I consume, I always used to when young and pennyless (switch everything off, try the kettle, fridge...). But I don't like is a meter that has potential health hazards! and if installed can't be removed without a court order! arrrrg!

Feel better now wink

marzipananimal Wed 26-Jun-13 15:58:26

Favadi I found that cutting out sugar and grains made me a bit dizzy and faint - probably normal but I didn't feel comfortable with it while pregnant. Also, DH and I have both been so knackered that we found the planning of different meals/shopping lists to our usual ones just too challenging. I also don't want to be an awkward customer for all the friends who will make meals when the baby arrives, so it's easier if we'll eat anything!
Giraffes, very true about it taking ages to feel like life is easier - took at least a year with DS! Paleo BLW does sound like a great idea but DS (2.10) is pretty fussy and lives mainly on bread, fruit, cereal and dairy, so it would be difficult to avoid giving the same things to the baby. We have made a few changes though - we have salads more often for lunch instead of sandwiches and eat more meat, eggs and veg than we did before

GiraffesEatPineapples Wed 26-Jun-13 16:57:48

marzipanimal Primal is a lot less hardcore than whole 30 - dairy is fine maybe check out briffa for a more moderate approach. Microwaved sweetpotato is a great way to keep carb flu away. Getting toddlers to eat anything can be a mission though so I don't blame you for not wanting to upset the applecart with big change ahead . My 2 yr old dd has been ok with paleo ish homemade nugets and fishfingers, she also likes duchy originals beef burgers if I cut them up and tell her its sausages grin She is still eating plain choc and yog but no biscuits and gluten free bread. She will not eat any veg which is tricky.

GiraffesEatPineapples Wed 26-Jun-13 23:20:47

Miss interesting about your dh, glad he is finding it ok on aip . I have managed to skip coffee today (by drinking lots of tea) I am quite confused by allowed vegetables; what veg is your dh eating besides cabbage?

Fav apparently 3g is being installed around here, I don't think that can be all that healthy either.

3ismylot Thu 27-Jun-13 07:30:06

Hi all I posted a little on the last thread but mainly just lurked!

As a recap I have been following primal since the start of april and have lost a total of 2st 6lbs grin

I have also taken up running in that time and am currently in training for the Great North Run in september!
This WOE is amazing for running as I get up at 530am and go straight for a run and have breakfast when I get back and I have all the energy I need! No need for carbing up the night before or eating running gels half way through when you eat properly to begin with wink

I have gone from being a terrible daily binge eater to being completely in control of my eating and have never felt better. I intend to eat like this for the rest of my life and urge anyone lurking on this thread and thinking about giving it a go to just do it as you certainly wont regret it smile

RawCoconutMacaroon Thu 27-Jun-13 07:39:42

Marizipanal, hello!

The single most beneficial thing you could choose to do now, if not wanting to immediately adopt a paleo/primal woe, is to cut gluten containing grains out of your

That way you will make a very positive change you can build on. Grains strip nutrients from you (your body needs to use them to process the toxins which occur naturally in all grains).

I read some very interesting papers on bone density (higher) and breast milk quality (higher nutrient content on ancestral, grain free diets), so you don't need to be concerned that grains are needed in your diet for health, quite the opposite is true!

Ancestral diets are not of them selves "low carb" you can eat that way, healthy, natural foods without being low carb -although it will be low carb compared with a SAD (standard American/awful diet!).

If you chose to remove grains, you could transition by keeping white rice (not brown or whole grain), potatoes (peel them), sweet potato, and that will make it easier to gradually change your toddlers diet. I have a 2yo and know how fussy they can be!

Btw, feeling faint etc when dropping carbs does suggest blood sugar spiking and falling a bit more than normal, I speak from experience here, take it as your body gently telling you you need to eat fewer carbs to stabilise that. Just dropping grains would be a big help.

Also, especially when pregnant, animal fats which come naturally on your meat, butter, avacados etc, these are where the vitamins are! So great for baby!! Embrace those tasty healthy fats grin.

RawCoconutMacaroon Thu 27-Jun-13 07:48:40

Giraffes, my 2 yo is also not keen on veg, but when I make burgers, I grate carrot, courgette etc and add it in ( meatloaf if even better as you can add a lot of veg!). Also, tomato cooked in with things, he will eat no problem, but not raw. ATM he doesn't like anything cold/raw, sad.

misscph1973 Thu 27-Jun-13 09:07:13

Giraffes, any veg, but obviously not legumes, and not potatoes and nightshades. So you are fine with carrots, leafy greens, sweet potato, butter nut squash, onion, garlic etc.

misscph1973 Thu 27-Jun-13 09:09:35

This is a good overview of AIP:

78bunion Thu 27-Jun-13 12:42:18

It is a good way to eat (and does not have to be particularly low carb unless you want it to be).

On MS (which I don't have) Dr Wahl's is worth reading - sounds sound research. I would imagine most conditions and depression never mind obesity are improved by eating whole- real foods/paleo.

I like and marksdailyapple sites.

FavadiCacao Thu 27-Jun-13 12:59:21

Marzipan, I agree with Giraffe and Raw. It sounds you might have cut the carbohydrates too quickly and possibly too low. Mark's Carb curve is here It's worth noting that even the dietdoctor (in the low end of LC of primal) feeds fruit to his child!

I understand not wanting to be awkward with people being kind to you and only you know how to handle them. Maybe to the closest friends/family you could mention that you would like to try gluten free to relieve your asthma, in my experience people automatically understand it as 'meat and two veg' recipes. smile

FavadiCacao Thu 27-Jun-13 18:35:15

Finally got round to trying this pizza. I only tried the base and it's really nice, it's firm enough without becoming soggy when adding sauce. It doesn't taste eggy or coconutty and it takes seconds to mix in just one bowl (I didn't bother with beating egg and oil together before adding to dry ingredients). grin One serves comfortably two adults, I daren't thinking how filling it would be if I had made the cheese too!
I believe this base would also lend itself to make a lovely Bruschetta and a beautiful hot or cold Crostino (just imagining a creamed avocado with prawn/bacon topping with a hint of garlic and chilli, and just splash of lemon!). Having made crackers with a similar recipe, I don't think the tapioca flour is necessary.

snoworneahva Thu 27-Jun-13 21:02:10

Thanks for the link fava I've nabbed a few recipes from that website.

misscph1973 Thu 27-Jun-13 21:12:59

I don't have any scales, they stress me, but I have been wondering for some time what I weigh as I have been IF'ing and cutting carbs as well as going a bit easier on the Paleo mayonnaise and red wine ;) So today when I took my kids to the nurse for their yearly asthma check-up, I jumped on her scales, and I have lost 2 kg in the last 4 months ;) Not bad, seeing that I have only been really serious about it in the last month or 2. Unfortunately the skinny jeans are still impossible to get on ;)

GiraffesEatPineapples Thu 27-Jun-13 22:25:47

misscph that was a good summary thank you! I had a slight coffee relapse today unfortunately but it was delicious smile

Fav that pizza looks amazing - I can't believe its not cheese shock

raw good idea about veg, I have made nuggets most to her taste by putting slow cooked chicken and egg in the blender then rolling the sludgey mix in balls and coating in almond and arrowroot. I am thinking courgette might blend in without adding too much colour. Will start with a little and increase veg ratio!

Hi 78bunion

FavadiCacao Fri 28-Jun-13 10:20:24

Ds started eating veg when he started to grow his own. Salad and spinach grow fast, they are a eat and re-seed crop and can be grown on a windowsill. Ds used to love decorating his pots and have them admired. smile Borage is another easy crop: it tastes like a mild cucumber and the flowers are edible too; the older leaves are a bit prickly raw but not cooked.

Now, I can't stop ds (12) eating veg!and as vegetables don't grow fast enough in my garden, I have been known to collect even the outer leaves of cauliflowers! smile

Also, a little bit of foraging might encourage to be a little more adventurous. Some country parks/forest schools do mini courses in foraging. Here is a list of edible flowers.

Karbea Fri 28-Jun-13 10:28:45


I'd like to join, I did really well earlier in the year, but ever since have failed pretty badly. I'm going to ease myself back in, using up food in the house for the next month or so, but by August I'm going to be back on it 100%.

Karbea Fri 28-Jun-13 12:25:17

Ok for lunch I'm having a jacket potato, beans and cheese, all of which are no, no's but once they're gone they're gone ;)

RabbitFromAHat Fri 28-Jun-13 15:00:54

I'm kind of doing the same Karbea - easing myself in while finishing the cupboard contents! So yesterday I had a tuna and mixed bean salad for lunch, today I had a berry and protein powder smoothie for breakfast and crayfish salad with rice for lunch: not 'proper' but that can all start tomorrow.

It's payday and I now have a loooooooong shopping list - I'm looking forward to getting started!

Had a very interesting dinner experience - was brought out for dinner (Mexican) by a friend and decided to at least notionally eat Paleo. So instead of automatically going for the usual corn- or rice-based option, I had scallops with vegetables, and a pork belly dish with a kind of Mexican slaw. Delicious, and although they were small portions, I am certain I felt fuller than I would have on equivalent grain-based dishes. To keep with the theme, I had agave cocktails. Nifty. grin

Can I ask, when in a pub and not drinking alcohol, what you chaps do? I would usually go for a blackcurrent cordial or something, but all that sugar doesn't seem appropriate for now. Just water seems a bit dull.

Karbea Fri 28-Jun-13 15:31:34

When I did it earlier in the year, my dr friend who advised me to do, said a vodka or gin and tonic was probably the best option, but only when I had to.
Apart from that it's water :/ everything else has way too much sugar in it.

snoworneahva Fri 28-Jun-13 15:32:25

It's not often I find myself in a pub not drinking alcohol! But - in the event that I do then I always have a sparkling water.

GiraffesEatPineapples Fri 28-Jun-13 16:01:07

3 is my lot meant to say before I loved your post, well done on your weight loss! I feel a lot more in control of my eating too - to the point where its kinda weird!

I get to weigh myself soon, about a week and a half left of whole 30. Been a couple of tiny slips but nothing too major. Nearly did a sneaky weigh in with clothes on and keys in my pocket (obv that wouldn't count ;) ) but restrained myself.

I would def find it hard to be in the pub (unless with dp) and not have a drink, esp if in a big group - I would feel like I need to explain myself or make up an illness otherwise people would suspect I was pg!

RabbitFromAHat Fri 28-Jun-13 17:03:51

This makes really interesting reading for anyone like myself, who was brought up on the strict orthodoxy that runners can't function without seriously supermassive carb intakes.

FavadiCacao Fri 28-Jun-13 18:00:14

Some pubs might do non-alcoholic mojito (spelling?), soda water and lemon/lime, tomato juice (V8).

RabbitFromAHat Sat 29-Jun-13 12:23:33

Good ideas, thanks a lot Favadi!

RawCoconutMacaroon Sat 29-Jun-13 21:09:55

Alcohol- I stick to potato vodka, or 100% agave Tequila... No grains, no additives so no headache (unless I over do it!).

FavadiCacao Sun 30-Jun-13 08:39:37

Second batch of bacon is drying in the oven and my tummy is churning because the smell is incredible: I'm really looking forward to lunch. smile

snoworneahva Sun 30-Jun-13 15:33:20

I must make some more fava.

Dh took the dcs out yesterday and they were allowed to buy their Saturday treat - ds chose gobstoppers and dd chose jelly beans. When they got home I read out the ingredients on the packet of gobstoppers - they didn't contain one ingredient from a normal kitchen cupboard - everything about them was chemical - interestingly instead of ds trying to negotiate to keep a few, he said he didn't want them....and asked if he could buy a better treat with his own money...dd wasn't keen on the ingredients in her jelly beans either. So both of them decided on a tube of fruit pastiles because a few ingredients were normal and they liked them. Normally I wouldn't be that keen on fruit pastiles but in comparison to the crap in the gobstoppers they were almost Paleo. wink I hope this experience has taught them a little bit about the rubbish factories put in their treats and to have a think about whether they want to put factory produced chemicals in their bodies rather than food.

Steak for dinner today, cooked on the fire pit, with onions, mushrooms and swede chips - dcs will have potato chips, followed by homemade cherry and dark choc chip ice cream.

marzipananimal Sun 30-Jun-13 17:10:59

That sounds really yummy snow. Yesterday we had homemade pork and apple burgers with caremelised onions, sweet potato wedges and curly kale. Was delicious. First time I've ever made burgers!

FavadiCacao Sun 30-Jun-13 21:28:40

Yes!!!! You should make some more snow! It's just amazingly good.
Three other people thank you as I passed the recipe to them and my neighbour and family fell in love with today's batch. flowers

I've altered the recipe slightly: rub salt and pepper in every tiny fold then rub the herbs having converted tsp to tbsp and then some (I'm using fresh). I had noticed in the previous batch that the herbs changed and looked dry in colour but yet saturated; it made no difference in taste but I guess they and the fridge are keeping the bad guys abated grin. I didn't bother to drain any liquid this time and grease proof paper worked better than kitchen paper. Again there will be none to freeze...working on the principle that novelty would wear out! yeah, yeah! me think need bigger fridge!

Love the plan about the sweets! grin

Marzipan, that is the problem with homemade everything: it tastes so darn good! grin Fancy sharing the recipe?!

GiraffesEatPineapples Mon 01-Jul-13 18:36:29

marzipan your meal sounds delicious.

Fav I haven't found the link to the bacon, what kind of cut do you use? Could i start off with a small shoulder?

snow what is a fire pit! Would you reccomend your ice cream maker - what are the useful functions to look for? I am hankering after one now smile

snoworneahva Mon 01-Jul-13 19:48:23

giraffe it's also known as a fire bowl - just like a bowl you light a fire in. On the ice cream maker I have a Phillips delize I think. It's a bowl in the freezer, I think they do disks now which is better if you are tight on freezer space.
But the ice cream I'm making at the moment is very lazy and doesn't require a machine due to the high fat content. It's not paleo but it's a good deal better than the store bought alternative and it's very easy - 500ml double cream, 100g condensed milk, a bit of vanilla....whisk till stiffish, add whatever flavouring you like and spoon into a loaf tin lined with parchment, freeze for 4 hours and then turn it out and cut into slices. I serve it with thin almond crackers.

FavadiCacao Mon 01-Jul-13 21:32:17

Giraffes the bacon link was snow's link and it's only fair that snow should get to post it on this thread first.

My mum has one of those fancy, supa duper, ice-cream machines (the kind that eat your bench space)...Not worth the price tag...Churning is no other than taking the 'ice-cream to be' out of the freezer and beat it now and again. Unless one injects the rubbish the manufacturers do, the ice-cream would go solid. The only alternative to soft scoop, is to pump sugar into the mix- unless you prepare it to eat 'on' the day 'for' the day.

I have some cherries...bought some mascarpone, yoghurt and cream...Whilst debating as to the paleo suitability of any of the ingredients...Brain/Gut will eventually make a choice as to type of ice-cream (ug!!), attempt a recipe (ug! ug!!!!) and will report back in the hope of a grin and not a sad experience. smile One still has to hmm it all!!

GiraffesEatPineapples Tue 02-Jul-13 01:01:35

Sorry that's true Fava I should have put snow's name too as it was her inspiration, just got caught up in your bacon enthusiasim grin I did look for it in the old thread before, but missed wherever the bacon started. Hope lots of grin for your ice cream, sounds delicious flavours.

Ok thanks both for ice cream info, so I probably don't need another appliance on the worktop anyway (slow cooker, bread machine and blender getting lots of use recently!) wink perhaps i will keep an eye out for one on a really good offer - my freezer is pretty small (mainly because it needs defrosting tennis ) so good to know that model could work for space. Actually I recently made the strawberry and coconut cream mix someone suggested - I loved it but the rest of the family more up for something fluffy. At the moment I am buying organic ice cream for them but even that has lots of ingredients so your option sounds good snow

Not paleo but on the subject of appliances I also dusted off a popcorn maker gift we have never used and made popcorn for the children, again not paleo but it was fun watching it shoot out of the funnel and cheaper than buying the packaged butterkist plus we didn't add sugar or salt. I am wondering if i could put quinoa in it and make a puffed cereal . Could be asking for trouble hmm

snoworneahva Tue 02-Jul-13 07:33:44

I haven't got my original link to the bacon handy, so if fava has it and can post it again that would be great.

I do feel slightly bad at times giving the dcs sugary ice cream and other treats but all I have to do is think of the ingredient in those bloody gobstoppers.....I learnt the hard way that to convince people around to your way of thinking you got to move closer to where they are. Dd is not keen on my ice cream, it's too creamy - she's a dedicated skimmed milk I'll educate those tastebuds by making a cookie dough ice cream this weekend - this is a Paleo version. She normally has Ben&Jerrys cookie dough, so to get her seal of approval is pretty impressive, you could make the coconut milk version of the basic ice cream but I find coconut milk ice cream tastes a bit weird and I normally like coconut.
Passion fruit makes a great ice cream and would potentially cover the weird coconut thing. And I had an amazing honey and nutmeg ice cream a few weeks back....I'm sure that would be a great flavour to Paleofy.

Pufflemum Tue 02-Jul-13 07:46:36

Hi everyone, I'm in, I was on the last thread but got lost somewhere. I have been eating mainly paleo for a few months now, I have lost 6 lbs and even better, 6% body fat. I am really pleased with this as I am not overweight but have been trying to seriously tone up and lose the layer of fat that covers my new muscles! I do seem to of plateaued now though.

Can anyone recommend any great cookbooks? I have The Paleo Diet but it's not very inspiring. I generally try and adapt recipes from ordinary books, but would like something to focus on for the last few weeks before my holiday. Thanks.

RawCoconutMacaroon Tue 02-Jul-13 08:36:14

Giraffes, we have a popcorn maker too, The kids love it as an occasional film night treat. No, not paleo/primal but you know exactly what's in it (corn and kerrygold butter in our case), so it's a better choice, if not "perfect".

As Mark "daily apple" Sissons says, don't let the perfect be the enemy of the good!

When I get my Excalibur dehydrator (soon I hope!) <wistful>, I look forward to making "perfect" veg crisps and meat jerkies ( I'm appalled at the ingredients lists on every jerky I have seen in the shops. The gluten, the MSG! Some are 30% carb!!! Online grassfed, gluten free jerkies are very expensive...

RawCoconutMacaroon Tue 02-Jul-13 08:47:31

Snow, DON'T FEEL GUILTY! Honestly, a really good ice cream (short ingredient list, real ingredients), is hardly the worst thing you can feed your child smile.

Actually, in this house, it tends to be chocolate, not ice cream, but same idea, we go for dark, good quality. Although obviously watch the amounts, IMO a small bar of good chocolate is very much better than a (grain based) cookie or cake.

The kids (and us parents), are surrounded by SAD crap food, and I think learning to make the wiser, better choice is something they need to do, a positive choice so there is no feeling of being "deprived".

A row of good chocolate squares, or a kitkat? I know which I'd go for!

snoworneahva Tue 02-Jul-13 09:31:21

I am so jealous raw I want a dehydrator! But I have bought too many gadgets this year already. Looking forward to you reporting back on your culinary adventures. We're big dark chocolate fans here too - well everyone apart from dd, who struggles more with big flavours - but she's getting there, we shift very gradually. Must do popcorn for them again. They like it sweet, so I melt butter and add in maple syrup for a toffee like flavour - haven't done that in so long, good birthday party treat.

giraffe is it your dh who is on AIP - how's he finding it? I'm considering it, as my mouth sores are not has no idea what it is, he's sending me to an ENT consultant, then Dermotology and Allergy testing. I'm struggling with the no alcohol rule - actually all the rules are tricky when socialising or eating out. I'm not sure I want to give up alcohol and eating out for 6 months in the hope something improves...but if my mouth gets much worse I may not have a choice.

GiraffesEatPineapples Tue 02-Jul-13 11:25:49

snow sorry you haven't had luck with GP etc - i hope it gets sorted. my dp isn't on AIP but Misscph's is. My dp avoids certain alcohol as it makes his mouth ulcers worse, at the moment his tipple is gin and tonic having ruled out cider and acidic white wine - maybe trying a different drink will help?

I have sort of been following aip for skin complaints, but haven't cut out coffee successfully. I had redness on either side of my mouth and this has cleared up and my complexion looks clearer however the rash on my legs has got worse and spread!! I went to the GP today and she wasn't sure what it is but thinks its fungal blush. I have to go back in a few weeks after using hydrocortisone. I think I may have picked it up from new jeans. Another possibility is that I have candida which is being affected by change in diet and having read this on Marks daily apple I think I will increase carbs for a while.

Raw I googled the dehydrator it looks very sleek grin Kitchen gadgets are addictive! I still want a spiraliser but reviews on amazon pretty so so. I also really wanted to get a blendtech/vitamix blender but actually pretty happy with my magimix. still I cant help but think it might have been worth forking out extra for one of those models as the children don't like the seeds etc that my blender leaves behind in smoothies.

snoworneahva Tue 02-Jul-13 11:30:14

Thanks giraffe, I regret not buying the vitamix too. My Magimix blender is too lightweight, I get frustrated using it, it was bought to relieve the pressure on the magimix food processor which is used constantly.

FavadiCacao Tue 02-Jul-13 11:48:22

Bacon recipe is here smile

FavadiCacao Tue 02-Jul-13 12:34:06

I had enough cherries to make to types of ice-cream: Mascarpone based and yogurt based.

Creamy Cherry/Berry and Mascarpone ice-cream


250g Mascarpone
150ml Cream
2 tbs honey (or to taste)
2tbs rose water
200g cherries (stoned and pureed)/berries

1) Beat cream and Mascarpone together-it will form a stiff cream.
2) add rose water and cherries
3) Sweeten to taste
4) Scoop into ice lollies moulds and freeze; place in freezer and take out every half hour to beat until set; place in fridge for a softer scoop.

I have done 4 huge lollies in the freezer and 4 ice-cream glasses in the fridge.

Instead of cherries/berries, just add 1 more tbs of rose water.

Home-made Rose Water
Place rose petals (5-6 large fully opened roses) in 150ml of boiling; cool down at room tmp; place in fridge 8-12.

Light Cherry/Berry and Yogurt ice cream


250g Yogurt
150ml cream (can use 250ml for richer taste)
2 eggs (separated)
2 tbs honey
200g cherries (stone and pureed)/berries

1) whip egg white with 1/2 tbs of honey and set aside
2) whip cream with remaing honey
3) fold egg whites and cream together
4) mix cherries, yogurt and eggs until well blended.
5) fold the cherry mix into the cream mix until fully incorporated.
6) place in freezer and remove every 1/2 hour to beat until set (4hr)

This one would be best served on the day any left over are best frozen in ice lollies moulds.

FavadiCacao Tue 02-Jul-13 13:23:18

giraffe flowers It might be worthwhile adding some probiotics (mininmum 1 billion viability). Here is an interesting thread on Mark's forum.

snow flowers I hope the queue isn't too long. sad

snoworneahva Tue 02-Jul-13 13:44:52

I'm liking the look of those ice cream recipes - the dcs oddly love rose flavoured Turkish delight...I'm sure the ice cream would be very well received too.

Challenge time! Part of the whole healing process for autoimmune is eating organ meats - but I'm determined but a bit squeamish. So, do you eat offal? If so what recipes would you recommend for an offal newbie. I remember hating liver as a kid - but then I hated most foods I eat now. And I've tried tripe with milk and onions when in Cork last year and that wasn't a great success.

Just got some beef shanks to make a Korean BBQ dish - I'll be eating the marrow in the bone - hopefully that will be a good start.

FavadiCacao Tue 02-Jul-13 14:29:31

Dh and I love liver in orange.


200g Liver
butter -enough to cook with
1 orange freshly squeezed
a few chopped chives


The thin skin around the liver is what makes it chewy, so I first remove the skin and then I slice it into thin pieces.

Heat a frying pan, when hot add butter, liver and seasoning. When liver is sealed (1 to 2 mins) add a little orange juice at a time (wait for it to almost disappear before adding some more). Stop adding orange juice when only a couple of spoon are left. Let the liver caramelise a bit and then the chives and the last bit orange juice and cook for further 30 sec.

Lovely with spinach and mushrooms.

GiraffesEatPineapples Tue 02-Jul-13 14:35:32

Thanks fava I will check that link smile

Snow - you can do it! I think chicken liver is supposed to be one of the milder ones. I made this last week and it was my first proper try at offal I think cutting it up pretty small and having a forkful with a bit of the mushroom or bacon is key wink Misscph mentioned a pate which sounded good too. I felt pleasently full after, ordering some next week.

I booked dd for her 1st mmr today and they gave me a same day appointment (she is 2 and a half - we waited deliberately) going to have to wake her up and take her in a minute, some lollipop treatment afterwards I think - maybe for both of us ;).

FavadiCacao Tue 02-Jul-13 14:51:54

Thanks giraffe I was about to post a similar recipe. If using home-made bacon you really don't need any herbs or seasoning.

Kidney is lovely stewed in white wine, onionsand parsley, where you can also add different cuts of meat (steak and kidney! wink )

My grandma used to add mince heart to meat balls and ragu' but I haven't tried.

misscph1973 Tue 02-Jul-13 15:08:30

Liver: Make a liver pate by throwing 500 g liver, 2 eggs, a pack of butter, an onion and salt and pepper in the food processor. Pour into ramekins / muffin cases / whatever you got and bake for 20 min. Fabulous with bacon and mushrooms! My kids love it.

Just realised you can't have eggs on the AIP - sorry! Hearts are quite nice, actually, calf's hearts are less offensive in my opinion. They can be used in stews.

I need help - I have swapped the biscuits for almonds when I have a cup of tea, but I really need something with a carb/calorie content like a celery stick ;) These almonds are my "domino foods" - can't stop, and they are too high in calories/fat for me (well for my bum!). I need crunch!

marzipananimal Tue 02-Jul-13 15:08:37

my burger recipe: 500g minced pork, 1 smallish cooking apple, 1 smallish onion, 1 egg, sage (though I didn't have any), seasoning.
Grate the apple and finely chop the onion, mix with your hands with the pork, egg and sage. Mould into 6 burgers and fry for 7-8 mins on each side.

GiraffesEatPineapples Tue 02-Jul-13 16:20:37

DD was fine covered in stickers now!

They sound good marzipanimal

Misscph I was mainlining nuts and nut butters before whole 30 and your post has made me realise I have been having tea without a snack shock I hadn't thought about it in ages. What about sweet potato crisps or still fattening and dairy but low carb - baked parmesan crisps? Otherwise carrot sticks biscuit

FavadiCacao Tue 02-Jul-13 17:06:47

miss Changing habits is hard and so some of us need to make little steps.
You could try making some crackers and dips. Crackers are addictive but with dips, you spread (ah!ah!) the time and you get way to full to domino eat, avocado and pate work really well.
Olives and tea/coffee don't mix that well, so you tend to leave one or the other!
Maybe changing the drink of choice might help with changing habits?! I can't imagine Peppermint or nettle teas tasting that good with almonds.

marzipan I'm looking forward to making some, thank you. smile

giraffe glad dd is fine. smile

Mascarpone lollies went down a treat and as the mousse in the fridge was not setting I made more lollies. They are super filling, so the yogurt ice cream is going to become lollies too. smile

GiraffesEatPineapples Tue 02-Jul-13 19:14:02

actually, my last post was a bit misleading - I have had snacks, found the 3 meal thing really hard, just not with my tea grin Also I was having nuts when I started w30 and on one occasion had an entire M&S luxury roasted nut assortment as my lunch... think nuts might be one of those all or nothing things for me.

snoworneahva Tue 02-Jul-13 20:36:39

Had some great food this evening - Korean barbecue Osso Buco cheap, easy and the best thing I have tasted this year - impressive enough I think to serve if you are entertaining, kids liked it too. We served it with celeriac mash and springs green - drool! We will make it again and again!

And the second thing, I came up with a treat for the dcs.

2 medijool dates mashed up with a satchel of coconut cream (50g), i used the pestle and mortor, add a heaped teaspoon of ground cinnamon. Roll into balls and coat with chocolate. Very easy and according to them, very tasty, I'm still on a chocolate embargo. sad

Thank you for the offal recipes, I will be trying them out - does anyone do liver with beetroot?

snoworneahva Wed 03-Jul-13 06:12:43

Pufflemum welcome back to the new thread! I generally use recipes from Paleo blogs. I have a few of their cookbooks, probably use "Paleo Comfort foods" more than most but I am having a thing with southern American cooking atm. There's not much in the way of British blogging or British Paleo Recipe books. I go through all my standard cookbooks and thumb down the recipes that will convert easily, and that will keep me interested - I am always after a new taste. <obsessed> Word of warning - don't buy a cookbook co-written with a doctor - the food will be dull and worthy....unless that's the kind of food you like! grin

GiraffesEatPineapples Wed 03-Jul-13 07:55:14

Pufflemum I am sort of in the same boat would like a book but so many to choose from. There are none in the libraries either. I keep reading about 21 day sugar solution I think it is an e book but that might be one way to lose a few stubborn lbs before hol. The blogs are pretty useful though.

def a gap in the market for an English book!

FavadiCacao Wed 03-Jul-13 08:55:54

I rarely cook from cook books but it's easy enough to remove offending ingredients form books I already own.
My problem is I love Chinese and Thai cuisine too, but I rarely eat anything sweet and I don't do soy. I miss Teryaki sauce too- initially I would occasionally make a vague form of it at home, using Tamari, xylitol and sake- but it's essentially grains, legume and sugar! sad

I'm finding that I cook mainly Indian (no rice) and Italian dishes, with the occasional Thai or Chinese. Recently, ds has been fancying some SAD foods, so I've been trawling the net to find recipes that work and writing them down (as it happens in a little black book grin )

hopefulgum Wed 03-Jul-13 09:12:39

HI. I have been paleo for about a year. I started by doing the "Whole 30" which had me feeling so healthy, so I have tried to stick to paleo since. Unfortunately I have recently fallen right off the wagon and need to get back on. I am a teacher and have had a hard term (I'm Australian) and when I get tired I get lazy with food and find it hard to resist sugar. I do a yoga class three times a week (and I consider it as good as doing weights as I have to hold up the weight of my body hmm) and swim twice a week.

Anyway, lately I have tried to stick to Paleo, but can't seem to find a quick and easy breakfast, so have resorted to gluten free toast. I'd love some suggestions for easy breakfasts that don't take up too much time.

I am going on holiday on Saturday for a couple of weeks in Bali, but I don't think it will be a problem to stick to Paleo with loads of vegies and meat in stir fries etc. I can easily say no to rice.

It will be nice to hear what other's are eating, especially with a family as convincing my kids to give up bread is proving

hopefulgum Wed 03-Jul-13 09:16:12

Oh, I forgot to say, one of the reasons breakfast is tricky is because I don't like eggs very much. Since I was a kid eggs make me feel sick.The weird thing is I can happily eat them in a cake,pancakes,custard etc (though not now as I don't eat dairy). I am not sure if it is a psychosomatic thing or whether I have an intolerance - I do have a gluten intolerance).

FavadiCacao Wed 03-Jul-13 09:49:39

Welcome back aboard, hopefulgum. smile

Given your schedule and stress I would suggest to cook and extra portion at dinner time to have for breakfast.

Avocado takes second to mash with a fork and can be a quick substitute to mayonnaise to go with tuna, prawns, bacon. BLT a la paleo (no bread). Berries and cream (coconut or normal).

GiraffesEatPineapples Wed 03-Jul-13 10:34:58

Hi Hopefulgum - I think fav is right, preperation the night before with some leftover coldcuts is a good idea - either that or if your in sleeping well and in good health skip bfast occasionally and say you're fasting ;) Tinned mackerel in e v olive oil with a microwaved sweet potao and, if you can get any, good samphire that can be eaten raw is one of my favourites. Nuts and fruit might be ok but would make me more hungry in the long run. I have been giving the children porridge or gluten free bread with eggs and the homemade bread is beginning to really tempt me - stayed away so far.

Fava I would buy it - some of the food you and others like snow post make my mouth water! I can see it now the mumsnetters little black paleo book ;)

Really should get on with housework now - snore.

FavadiCacao Wed 03-Jul-13 12:15:21

The Little Black Book: Paleo Saucy Secrets I like your think Giraffe grin

Maybe we could do summary posts of our favourite recipes, links. I wish I knew how to create a web page where we could post links and guest recipes!

FavadiCacao Wed 03-Jul-13 12:16:36

[think]=[thinking] Clearly, I couldn't be the editor!

snoworneahva Wed 03-Jul-13 12:37:57

Think breakfast is always a tricky one because we have become so conditioned into eating cereal. Leftovers are great. Have made Paleo gingerbread muffins from the health bent cook book for the kids, they loved them. Paleo pancakes freeze well - 3 bananas, 1/2 cup almond butter, 3 eggs, 1tbsp cinnamon - all whizzed up in the food processor. You could make up some breakfast sausage and have it cold with Paleo ketchup.

My kids are gradually coming around to my way of thinking - even dd who now feeds her friends dates and raw honey, like she's some kind of risky food adventurer. [Grin] Six months ago she wouldn't touch dried fruit or honey (she ate both as a toddler) And yesterday she gave in to coconut cream and really liked it. I have to be careful not to push them too hard, when I hear sounds of rebellion I back down. Paleo isn't so important as to cause disruption to household harmony.

Maybe we need a Paleo recipe thread?

GiraffesEatPineapples Wed 03-Jul-13 14:22:35

Fava grin

It's a shame facebook doesn't have an annonymous function we could set up a group and post pictures of recipes as well on there. A recipe thread on here might be the easiest option though..

misscph1973 Wed 03-Jul-13 20:15:12

Thanks for ideas for biscuit substitutions, I tried making a version of the sweet potato crisps today, I didn't have the time they needed, so I cut them slightly thicker and added olive oil and salt, cooked them at 200 C and they were lovely with dinner! Not all of them went crispy, as it is too difficult to turn each of them over individually. I also made kale crisps as I wanted to make the most out of the oven being on, and the kids ate all of it! Not sure how many nutrients are left in the poor kale, but now I can say my kids love kale ;)

On another note, my DH gave up AIP today, he had a cup of coffee and eggs. He just had enough, he was thinking about coffee constantly. I am obviously not very impressed, as he has a lot of health issues, but people can only do what they are ready to do. He is going to stay off the dairy, though, as he is quite sure it is upsetting his gut. And I think he is going to take it easy on the nuts, sugar and alcohol.

GiraffesEatPineapples Wed 03-Jul-13 21:19:25

misscph what is it with coffee - I am finding it harder than anything else to give up. Have seen mention that kale chips are nice - will have to give it a try smile

Have snacked on a lot of grapes today - justififed by the fact they are £1.50 in tesco for organic. Made a tabboleh with cauliflower rice dry fried and some marniated lamb and lemon and corriander was pretty good.

Salbertina Wed 03-Jul-13 21:23:57

Evening! Waves to Giraffe! Love flaxseed crisps but not been able to make them successfully and pricey to buy. Made almond loaf earlier to have with soup, okay actually and lower carb, less dry and more palatable than many esp those horrible, overpriced GF loaves one can buy. Got the pmt munchies though, paleo doesn't always hit the spot!

Salbertina Wed 03-Jul-13 21:26:24

Kale crisps... Nicer than they sound?!
I cannot give up coffee, i have it w tiny bit of cream. Low carb at least!

snoworneahva Wed 03-Jul-13 21:35:53

AIP is so tough, I'm trying to stay off a few things - nightshades, nuts, diary, chocolate and eggs, i think my mouth is's so hard to tell.

snoworneahva Wed 03-Jul-13 21:39:05

I'm down to one cup of black coffee a day, I really crave it first's such an ingrained habit. Had some green tea today and was pleasantly surprised, I really wanted something hot and wet.

Salbertina Wed 03-Jul-13 21:45:21

Gosh, eggs too? hard with paleo

pigleychez Wed 03-Jul-13 22:05:45


Just dipping my toe in the Paleo waters. A friend has had a great weight loss result doing paleo for the past month which has made me look into it. Id never heard it before.

Any kind soles care to explain about paleo to me and how realistic/easy it is to stick to! I have zippo will power and do enjoy too much naughty foods! I dont really want to be making completely different foods every night as we like to eat as a family. Us all eating more healthily sounds more appealing although we dont do too bad.

Im 32 on Friday and really cant keep blaming my spare tyre on baby weight now the girls are 3 and 4. Having them close together really hasnt done my body any favours though!

Anyway, any info or websites to read, rules on what foods are allowed etc would be great. smile

GiraffesEatPineapples Wed 03-Jul-13 23:07:20

Hi salbertina {waves back}

I think its actually quite useful to cut out eggs for a bit of a challenge ;)

Had tinned sardines today it was hard work, tbh squeamish factor set in when I suspected the pink dotty stuff was eggs blush

Hi pigley there are so many good blogs! Here is a list of the top 50 with a description I also like paleomom, paleomg ...

GiraffesEatPineapples Wed 03-Jul-13 23:11:53

oh salbertina try coconut milk in your coffee if you haven't already - I really enjoyed mine earlier, much prefer it to cream. keep meaning to try it with oil but not quite there yet!

Hope it all helps snow

hopefulgum Wed 03-Jul-13 23:26:20

Have you been to NomNom Paleo? I love her website, so many great recipes. I have the Ap on my ipad, and I use it alot.

Today I plan to make some paleo pancakes for breakfast : microwave a sweet potato and mash, add eggs (probably about 4), some coconut cream (maybe half a cup) and almond meal until it resembles a batter. I cook them in coconut oil. It makes a lovely breakfast with sliced banana, but it does take a little time.

The suggestions of leftovers is a good one, but I do find that I don't have enough, as I am feeding a family of six to start with, then DH and I like the leftovers for our lunch.

I think I have just become lazy to be honest, so it is time to get on with being proactive as I know how good this way of eating is for me.

Paleo cured my Carpel tunnel syndrome, got rid of painful periods,joint pain went away and it sorted out the irritable bowel syndrome I had my entire adult life, which no doctor could help me with. I used to get so bloated and have terrible wind pains and diarreah, but it has disappeared since going Paleo.

My Dh did the Whole 30 too and it made such a difference to his health. He stopped snoring (alleluia!), slept better and woke everyday without the snotty nose he has always had. And he lost 6kgs too. When I did it I lost about that too.

GiraffesEatPineapples Wed 03-Jul-13 23:29:58

Pygley this is from paleo mom on what you can eat: Whole foods, including meat {ideally grass fed}, poultry, fish, eggs, vegetables of all kinds, fruits, nuts and seeds {coconuts are a paleo superfood}. A paleolithic diet avoids all grains, legumes (including soy and peanuts), dairy (except butter, ghee and heavy cream), modern vegetable oils (like safflower and canola), and processed foods

If you want a more gentle start Briffa from escape the diet trap says cheese and organic full fat cows milk are ok in moderation as are quinoa and wild rice which are basically grasses rather than grains.

Some people eating paleo also eat white potatoes and or rice - these are seen as more 'benign' choices and a good option for children. There is also an attitude of aim for paleo 80 % of the time the odd slip doesn't matter.

hopefulgum Wed 03-Jul-13 23:31:31

I have also been enjoying coconut cream in hot chocolate. I bought a hot chocolate chia powder (no sugar) and have that with coconut cream (whisked in with a mini whisk). It really hits the spot when I am craving chocolate - with no sugar! It isn't sweet, but the coconut cream and spices make it sweet enough.

The stuff I've bought is Australian, but I bet there would be something similar in the UK?

GiraffesEatPineapples Wed 03-Jul-13 23:31:53

Wow hopefulgum you have had amazing results!

EMUZ Wed 03-Jul-13 23:58:27

Just seen there's a documentary on next Wednesday, channel 4 I think at 8pm. Not paleo but its the "fat, sick and nearly dead" one which I've been wanting to watch for ages

EMUZ Thu 04-Jul-13 00:00:08

A quick question too. What do you eat when
A) you aren't hungry but should really eat
B) you are hungry but forming any kind of meal is a huge effort

FavadiCacao Thu 04-Jul-13 09:27:22

Saw this and thought of you Giraffe (different chai recipes)

snow don't envy your task but I'm pleased for you that it's starting to work.

EMUZ, if I'm not hungry I don't eat, unless is dinner time when we sit together. In which case, I just pick at dinner and save the rest for when I'm hungry. In case of B), I either cook quick familiar dishes or find what leftover sauces/stocks I've frozen. I try to have portions, sauces and stock cubes in the freezer for the very reason of 'no-clue-days'.
Last night I was so tired, when I got in...I open the freezer stared at it, found a langoustine stock jar, a piece of salmon, some prawns and with the aid of a couple green thai paste stock cubes, some courgettes, mushrooms and a tin of coconut milk it turned into a lovely soup in 20 mins. Served with rice noodles for ds and extra coconut mik for me. I was tempted buy the turkey broth but I couldn't be bothered to go harvest herbs from the garden. wink

hopefulgum Great, isn't it?! grin For me Paleo cured asthma, ulcer, hayfever, anaemia and few other niggly things.

Hi Pygley. Paleo is incredibly easy at home (and suitable for all) but a little trickier when out and about. It can take sometimes adjusting to the no cereal for breakfast concept and getting used to your handbag looking like Mary Poppins' with emergy knife (swiss one is great), fork and spoon, so you can cut cheese, avocados; a packet or two of nuts, dried fruit; and on the odd occasions bottles of dressings or coconut milk, so you can buy a bag of salad on the go! grin

FavadiCacao Thu 04-Jul-13 09:33:42

Saw this and thought of you Giraffe (different chai recipes)
Apologies: should read hopefulgum. {waves at Giraffe}

GiraffesEatPineapples Thu 04-Jul-13 10:08:06

Ok I think I have it (salbertina and misscph and anyone still having chocolate) the solution to pms and crunch munchies

HI Fava I was wondering - something I have wanted to try though ;)

Coffee is so confusing, articles like this make it even harder to give it up

GiraffesEatPineapples Thu 04-Jul-13 10:09:01

Obv leave sugar out of above recipe smile

RawCoconutMacaroon Thu 04-Jul-13 13:12:59

If you are not hungry - don't eat! Or have something light.

The top 50 paleo blogs had most of the ones I'd recommend but 1 missing - it's very good, more "British" (ok Swedish but I mean its not American). Possibly not on list as it it's low-carb-high-fat but essentially it is paleo/primal.

snoworneahva Thu 04-Jul-13 13:40:32

I think if my condition continues to improve and I uncover the cause of my dodgy skin conditions - i have a few and they are all autoimmune disorders, then at the very least I'll be in control of the flare ups...a life without chocolate and chilli would be too sad to contemplate, I'd put up with the occasional discomfort for the odd edible pleasure, knowing I could flick the switch and improve my skin condition by restricting a few foods for a while....that's how we manage ds's citrus sensitivity.

I'm developing a bit of a thing for smoked mackerel which is great because I can't have chipotles at the moment and I'm craving a smoked flavour and part of the AIP is feeding yourself highly nutritious foods, so I'm attempting oily fish three times a week - which is a challenge because I'm not a big fish eater. Salmon wrapped in Parma ham and baked disguises the fishy flavour.

Finally to answer the 2 questions posed -
If I'm not hungry, I'll still eat dinner with the family as long as it's something tasty, if I haven't eaten recently...if I'm not hungry in the sense that I don't feel like food I won't eat.
If I can't be bothered cooking - I'll do something simple like fried steak, roast chicken, sausages and mash or leftovers from the freezer. And if I'm completely fed up with cooking I'll order salt and pepper ribs from the local Chinese take away or I'll have a selection of cheeses with almond crackers, Parma ham and raw veg - not sure what I'd do now I've temporarily given up so many foods. hmm

EMUZ Thu 04-Jul-13 13:55:06

Thank you for answering! Basically after the shit time I've had recently ive defaulted back to just not eating. If I only ate when I was hungry I wouldn't eat at all so I need to force myself a bit with some easy food smile

GiraffesEatPineapples Thu 04-Jul-13 18:18:49

emuz flowers Maybe you should take the easy route for a while and stock up on some not too processed convenience foods - so ready made soup with as few ingredients as possible, bagged salad, parma ham (in lidyl this only has salt added), tinned mackerel or any other fish you like, bananas, apples, nuts, natural yoghurt if you can have dairy, maybe some meat based ready meals in the fridge or freezer for emergencies and just don't eat too much of the sauce. If you cook a chicken then strip off all the meat you can make a stock from the bones and have a pyrex full of chicken in the fridge to dip into. Maybe do an online order of quick and easy things?

snow I think your plan makes total sense - AIP for 2 years does not appeal to me but just watching out for signs that you need to step back into it. I think the no nightshades has helped me but it would be sad not to eat italian food for two years! By the way the recipe thread is brill thanks

EMUZ Thu 04-Jul-13 21:46:20

I have some mince that needs cooking so going to make chilli and sweet potato mash tomorrow and just do smaller portions.
Gone completely off paleo today and just thought "what do I want?" This is how not hungry I am, out of an entire supermarket I ended up with a microwave burger grin

GiraffesEatPineapples Thu 04-Jul-13 22:25:33

Emuz sometimes you just gotta follow your cravings grin Meal tomorrow sounds yum and saves you making a meal another night if you divide it into portions.

I did a first ocado order today so saved £25 on a £100 order. They do eversfield meat boxes and organic veg boxes. I was a bit dissapointed with the meat box because the mystery joint was chicken wings, customer services gave me a discount as a good will gesture which made the price more reasonable. Ocado also sell bob's red mill flours but ££ so didn't order any in the end.

EMUZ Thu 04-Jul-13 22:28:06

I'm a bit skint as well which doesn't help. Usually for ease I just grab a cooked chicken and have some of that with veg but I'm off chicken totally and eggs don't appeal either
Am almost tempted to have a pizza blush and see if it makes me hungry! Weirdly I've put no weight on which is good, just trying to concentrate on loads of water, some food and staying away from sugar
If I go off track I'd rather do it with carbs than sugar

GiraffesEatPineapples Thu 04-Jul-13 22:42:07

I start to get queazy when I think about how much I am spending on food at the mo - I was sainsburys basics all the way and if the bills are too mammoth I will be back there next month!

GiraffesEatPineapples Thu 04-Jul-13 22:44:21

Could you do some kind of thinly sliced sweet potato with cheese on top thing to get the pizza effect?

EMUZ Thu 04-Jul-13 22:46:04

Yeah that might work. Am watching man v food - that is helping me get hungry!! gringrin

GiraffesEatPineapples Thu 04-Jul-13 22:59:40

Make sure you switch off before the end when its less appetising grin

EMUZ Fri 05-Jul-13 05:48:34

Ooh I've found something I want to eat smile
Going back to an old staple I make and portion for work. It's basically a ratatouille with chorizo and chillies in, sometimes with a little brown rice. Heat it at work and add shredded roast chicken or feta cheese
<rumbling tummy> off to the supermarket for me!

RawCoconutMacaroon Fri 05-Jul-13 07:51:47

Giraffe, sliced sweet potato doesn't work well as a "pizza" base, unless you add egg as it goes soggy.

Fritatta type recipes make good "pizza", nice to cook ahead for several days breakfasts too.

Grated or thinly sliced sweet potato, yam or courgette layers (a combination is good) with egg on top makes a solid sliceable base, throw toppings on and cook for about 40min on about 180. The dish needs to be well greased, or the egg will stick to it.

Good toppings -thin slices of onion, veg, pesto, bacon, anything you fancy!

Nice toppin

RawCoconutMacaroon Fri 05-Jul-13 07:57:28

grin, I have had a few disasters trying to make a suitable pizza substitution, and the frittata ones are the most successful as with several very thin lavers of different coloured veg for the base, and about 10-12 eggs, you end up with something very pretty when sliced into wedges, and have served it up to non paleo people who loved it!

EMUZ Fri 05-Jul-13 08:07:22

I am an idiot. Due to not sleeping well I have been listening to a hypnotherapy phone app I've had for ages. Not helping me sleep but its relaxing

I'd imagine the fact I'm not hungry is maybe because its a gastric band app? confusedconfused FFS

GiraffesEatPineapples Fri 05-Jul-13 20:35:20

Emuz ast least you know the cd works ;)

Raw that sounds really good - will try that thanks.

I lost the whole 30 and aip plot today - made gluten free pumpkin wraps but I didn't follow the instructions properly and they didn't work so well, so I ended up eating some of them. also gutted as used posh chicken to make curry for dc and their friends and they didn't like it either sob!

Dp has decided he only likes the homemade gluten free bread so making some now for everyone else to go with picnic.

prettybird Fri 05-Jul-13 22:01:18

Not sure if it's paleo but I've had success with a cauliflower "pizza" base: from memory, it was grated cauliflower cooked and them drained/squeezed of excess moisture and mixed with goats cheese (and an egg?) and patted out into a pizza base shape and cooked at 200C for c.15 minutes until golden and then the pizza topping put on.

It's about 2 months since I did it, so I'd need to check the details.

Salbertina Sat 06-Jul-13 12:25:08

Yea, Pretty, me too! Sounds same recipe and didn't taste of cauliflower at all, thankfully from my kids' pov.

GiraffesEatPineapples Sun 07-Jul-13 09:03:11

Caulifower comes into its own on this woe! Rice - mash and now pizza base!

Ok - my coconut oil which is quite a new jar - has totally turned to liquid, I am guessing its fine to use it as cooking oil but if it tunrs back solid does it become trans fats or rancid?

prettybird Sun 07-Jul-13 10:31:49

Shows you have a good quality one as the melting point is only about 23C (it's much higher for the hydrogenated ones). smile

As long as it is clear and not yellow/brown, it'll be fine.

GiraffesEatPineapples Sun 07-Jul-13 11:31:41

Yes its clear - thanks!

prettybird Sun 07-Jul-13 12:31:17

Keep it in a cupboard/the dark: UV will accelerate something going rancid. It's why crisps are now in foil laminated bags.

Itstartshere Sun 07-Jul-13 13:16:21

Hello everyone, can I join you? I've just started eating Paleo (doing a Whole 30 first) so I could use some support/people to chat with.

I'm only on my 3rd day and I won't lie, I'm finding it a bit tough, but it's not been as bad as I was dreading. Just feeling a bit worn out and fragile and wanting to hide from the world.

I'm loving the food, I've been on a low fat diet for years which I found so yeurch. I always felt deprived. I can't believe what nice food I'm able to eat now. I think today is the first day I've thought 'I wish I could have some bread' but it's not a huge craving, and I'm reminding myself that the changes I'm going to see are far more important to me than any bread. I want to change so badly - I need to have better energy, lose about 2-3 stones and just generally get my life on track. I'm a bit scared at this point that I'm going to be one of the few people who is just going to put on 2 stones doing this, as it's still very strange to me that I can eat fat/meat, but hoping in a month's time I'll be able to convince myself otherwise when I step on my scale.

Anyway, nice to 'meet' you all, and look forward to chatting.

GiraffesEatPineapples Sun 07-Jul-13 22:44:17

Hi itstartshere the first days are the hardest with whole 30 - so should get easier soon. unfortunately having said that I ended mine a bit early but really want to do another soon but this time without snacking! I put a halt to nuts for most of the time and I think that helped a lot because I was really overdoing them. I lost about 8 lbs over 3-4 weeks and have lost about 18 lbs in all over the last 6 weeks. Glad you are enjoying the food - snowornevah has just started a recipe thread if you have any good recipes to add grin Unfortunately I am really not a good cook but hoping to add some links smile

snoworneahva Tue 09-Jul-13 07:13:17

Morning! Yesterday I decided to give up on my restricted diet, my skin was showing no signs of improvement, my mouth is still raw and I was thoroughly fed up! Made some Gluten free cookie dough ice cream for the dcs - ahem....really! Ended up eating some and I'm not sure whether the results were directly attributed to the dairy/almonds but my skin went crazy - could be the weather but looks like the experiment needs to continue - off things again and will deliberately break the diet in about a week's time and note the results!
Bought a bottle of Coconut Aminos and tried it out last night - was very pleasantly surprised but it's incredibly expensive and unless you have issues with soy, I would think Tamari would be just fine.

Hi, hope you don't mind if I join you? A friend started paleo and was raving about it, so I did a bit of reading up and it does make a lot of sense!

I've been following it for a couple of weeks now, haven't really noticed any weight loss (though dh thinks I've lost a bit - think he's just being nice & encouraging tbh grin) but the biggest difference has been in my moods. Even the dses have noticed I'm no longer grumpy in the mornings.

I feel better in myself, not as tired, and less inclined to snack on sugary things so for me, its worth it just for that smile

misscph1973 Tue 09-Jul-13 13:15:34

Welcome, tilly! Good to hear that your mood is improving. I find that my mood really improves when I add IF to Paleo - it even eases PMS!

It was DHs birthday this weekend and we had gluten free birthday cake, my MIL makes the best. We ate all of it in less than 24 hours, I am embarrassed to admit sad Normally we give at least a quarter to the neighbour kids, but not this time ... I have been IF'ing today and yesterday to make up for it.

Oh, and thanks to all for the support with my almond addiction. I ate the last of them and I am not going to stock up on them again, at least for some time, going cold turkey, and I am fine.

Pizze: I make a mix of wrung out (they get so wet when grated, wring out in a tea towel) grated potato (probably 1-2 baking poatatoes), 1/2 thinly sliced onion) 2 egg whites and salt/pepper. I spread it thinly on baking parchment and bake it at 175 C until golden on the edges, then carefully turn it over and repeat. Then I spread a thin layer of tomato puré and water (1:1), sprinkle grated mozzarella over and top with pepperoni (Sainsbury's Basic Pepperoni works well). Bake at 225 C for about 15 min or till the cheese is golden. It is VERY nice ;)

kellykettle Tue 09-Jul-13 20:15:02

Hello everyone just checking in briefly - snowed under with work right now so chat - paleo or otherwise - has gone out of the window!

Welcome new Paleo-istas.

Someone brought doughnuts to work today and for the first time in ages I thought "I want one". I resisted. I are my chicken liver pâté and carrots instead but it reminded me that I'm going to do some primal baking this weekend.

Did I mention that DD1 has been for some school settling in sessions? Lunch was sausage and boiled rice with sweetcorn. She's asked if she can have packed lunches grin

Going to go back and catch up on the thread now.

GiraffesEatPineapples Thu 11-Jul-13 00:20:50

kelly - i think ignorance is bliss when it comes to school dinners!

Hi tilly grin

misscph your pizza also sounds tempting! I have ordered some mesh bags for making coconut milk which might be good for squeezing liquid from your pizza base too!

I have been doing some normal baking in prep for dd's birthday party and really enjoying it - a lot less stressful than trying to get a decent gluten free loaf (lets just say I have been whizzing up a lot of gluten free french toast and breadcrumbs for the freezer!). Planning to try some paleo/ gluten free baking for ds' birthday in hol though.

snow hope you are able to pin down a trigger for your skin flare up. I have slipped a bit a fair bit on eating this week because I am using steroid cream on my rash, but to be honest not much improvement yet. Eating some sugar and mainly gluten free grains has resulted in a large zit on my nose, a bit of ibs and a couple of extra lbs. Have eaten pretty well today prob a bit too much protein though, but feels good to be getting back to paleo.

Thanks to the person who mentioned fat, sick and nearly dead being on tonight. I recorded it but the break meant i missed the middle part where the american guy changes his diet! Def makes me think I need to up the fruit and veg.

snoworneahva Thu 11-Jul-13 06:46:51

Welcome Tilly!

Kelly my dcs will always chose my food, they prize it above everything else, which is quite flattering but it has always been my intention that I introduce them to good tasting real food so that the processed stuff pales in comparison and for the most part it has worked. School dinners is a flavour fail....but it's my fall back if they ever complain about not having Kit Kats, crisps and sweets drinks in their lunch box - they immediately stop complaining at the threat of having to endure the school dinner again.

I have a planned cheat tomorrow - dh and I are treating ourselves to have a Michellin starred lunch, I nearly cancelled because i was so worried about my skin but then thought life's too short! Really hope it doesn't go nuts afterwards but giraffe has reminded me to go straight to the steroids and not just suffer on - rashes are best contained because when they break out, they take on a life of their own without need for an irritant to continue.

How's everyone coping with the hot weather? I'm finding myself a little sloth like.....melting every evening into a snooze on the sofa.

FavadiCacao Thu 11-Jul-13 08:28:51

snow, have you tried switching to Castile soap and using pure aloe vera gel on your skin?
I buy this one.

Ds wanted junk food after the cinema, yesterday and I gave in. blush We went to the supermarket and scoured the aisles in search of the least bad. Ages later,--I'm sure it would have been quicker to cook-- he chose prawn crackers, salsa and some cooked prawns to defrost at home! I was really proud of him for reading every ingredient and knowing which ones to avoid! grin

FavadiCacao Thu 11-Jul-13 08:33:02

Oops! Enjoy your meal, snow smile

Giraffe could you remind me what channel was fat on, I'm hoping to find it on one the i players

Welcome to all new grin

Itstartshere Thu 11-Jul-13 08:33:30

I have to say I'm looking forward to doing some paleo compliant baking after my Whole 30. I'm not craving anything right now, which is a massive relief as I know this would be much worse if I was, but I still want to make something that resembles cake or scones or bread.

Day 7 here for me - the last 2 days have been grim with fatigue but I'm so far, touch wood, feeling much better today. Just trying to up my fat a bit and eat more starchy veg. This first week I've allowed myself bacon, some nuts and 2 portions of fruit a day but from now on the bacon is going, I'm going to reduce the nut portions and try to stick to one portion of fruit a day, just to see how I cope.

Still can't believe how delicious my meals are on this!!

RawCoconutMacaroon Thu 11-Jul-13 09:30:36

I watched fat sick and nearly dead last night- spent most of the program shouting "it's not the meat, it's the wheat!!!" At the TV.

Amazing transformation in both the docu-maker and the trucker, but the anti-meat revulsion got me a bit, it was like "a third of the plate is MEAT(disgusted voice, wrinkle of nose)" when looking at people's SAD diet.... Yes ok, and what about the grains in the meat product, and the pasta, and the bread that goes with it!

The autoimmune condition he (both people actually) is a recognised atypical presentation of celiac or gluten allergy- I wonder if he had a negative blood test for that (false negatives common), anyway, the 60 day juice fast WAS GRAIN FREE! So not surprising his autoimmune symptoms improved and disappeared.

Not sure what the "mostly vegan" diet the vegan dr was recommending for them after the juice fast phase (details were a bit lacking), but it sounded mostly raw fruit and veg, therefore not leaving much room for grain foods so I guess they will be getting a small fraction of the wheat they were eating on the SAD, it sounds woefully short of fats and proteins though that may be lack of explanation of the long term aspects.

I felt it was very anti animal products, interesting nonetheless.

Hi everyone, thanks for the lovely welcome smile

Interesting what you've been saying about dc's following it too. My dses are carb monsters - love pasta/rice etc - as well as sugar but since I've been doing this my eldest has been showing an interest in it too. He's been asking for chicken for lunch instead of sandwiches and won't have flapjacks anymore. So happy he's taking an interest and making choices around it smile

misscph how are you doing without nuts? I've become addicted to macadamia nuts since starting this so limiting myself to one handful per day.

raw programme sounds interesting, was it on BBC?

misscph1973 Thu 11-Jul-13 11:20:38

Raw, interesting to hear about the tv-program, will see if I can find it elsewhere (did you see it on channel 5?). I have had similar thoughts myself about raw food and green smoothies (which I have had a fair share of myself), that the absence of grains (and processed food) is more likely to be the reason people get better on these diets, rather than the absence of meat.

tilly, I am doing fine without nuts, thank you for asking. I have been having fruit instead, peaches, strawberries and sharon fruits. DH has just asked me to stock up on almonds, though, and I am pretending that I keep forgetting or just "not going to that shop" ;)

I am really hungry today, as I am IF'ing, not having breakfast, and I can't wait for lunch!

RawCoconutMacaroon Thu 11-Jul-13 13:43:53

I think the program was on 5, not sure tho.

GiraffesEatPineapples Fri 12-Jul-13 17:02:27

I am wondering a bit off path as doing birthday baking and keep licking the spoon ;) Resisting the broken biscuits so at least thats something! Colouring fondant my little pony colours tonight blush

Having a meal of cod, samphire and brocolli and trying to make a dip from squash this eve yum.

I think jucing is interesting as at least in both cases it cleared up their symptoms which paleo prob wouldn't have without becoming complicated, ie aip, but for the long term it can't be optimum?

Mmmm macademia nuts, so good with dark choc.

snow how was your meal smile

FavadiCacao Sat 13-Jul-13 10:59:53

I finally watched the program on channel 5.
Loving my vegetables and some fruit and being hot, I was curious about the recipes to make delicious drinks (I would drink V8 all day if it weren't processed!)
I was pleasantly surprised to find out the juices are not as carby as I thought and also I realised I eat more vegetables in one day that those on the diet plan! grin

The results Joe and his American counterpart have achieved are amazing but Dr Terry Wahl's speech is my favourite inspirational video

Itstartshere Sat 13-Jul-13 20:31:26

Urgh today was hard! I went somewhere where there was an ice cream van. It was there for an hour with people coming back from it with their mountains of the stuff. I didn't have one, but it was a tough test! I keep reminding myself of my goals and how amazing I will feel if I can lose weight, but it's still hard to resist sugar on a hot day like today

snoworneahva Sun 14-Jul-13 07:34:20

Hi giraffe the meal was good but not the best, nothing made my heart sing but I was stupid and had bread - and I suffered for it sad. It was a good reminder as to why I eat the way I do, I think my gluten cheating days are gone, the discomfort is too much.

Itstartshere well done on resisting the icecream! I got a recipe off another thread for frozen bananas blended with almond milk, it's delicious. Not much use when you're out and about I know, but it's good as a treat when you get home.

Favadi thanks for the link to the juicing website, I'm loving smoothies atm but would like to mix in some veg so I can have a quick meal that's not just fruit.

I've been doing ok, but find myself slipping, especially if I'm having a busy day which is just frustrating. I've started a food diary & weight loss spreadsheet so hoping that can keep me on track.

misscph1973 Sun 14-Jul-13 14:59:26

Almond addiction update: Since giving up almonds for just over a week, I have lost more than 1 kg of body weight! Unfortunately it is probably mainly loss of muscle mass as I have not been lifting weights for about 2 weeks as it has been too hot and I have been too busy with work - and I still can't fit into my skinny jeans from 2 years ago. But never the less interesting that almonds appear to be the culprit of my weight gain.

GiraffesEatPineapples Sun 14-Jul-13 22:29:57

snow a shame the food wasn't amazing but its proabbly a reflection of the good food you have been making for yourself day to day; non paleo food is def not as delicious to me anymore. Have you tried sourdough bread to see what effect it has on you - I thought this on cheeseslaves blog was interesting sourdough

miscpph interesting you dropped weight so quickly by skipping almonds - could you lose muscle so quickly - maybe it is fat you have lost!

Tried frozen slices of banana blended on their own for ice cream recently and was yum (need to be really ripe though) also did frozen mango blended for sorbet.

Itstartshere Mon 15-Jul-13 20:12:03

I'm definitely going to try the paleo ice creams after my whole 30 - looking forward to frozen coconut milk with maybe some strawberries and a bit of honey. Yum.

I'm on day 11, and into my stride now. Loving not feeling hungry anymore and really enjoying the food. I'm just keen to start seeing some more weight loss! I'm struggling to cut down my fruit and nut intake (only have a small handful each day but I hear it can stop you losing weight and I'm very sedentary)

misscph1973 Mon 15-Jul-13 21:37:46

Itstartshere, did yopu know that Laverstock makes buffalo milk ice cream? I have not had it, but would like to ;)

Well done on making it to 21 days on whole 30!
For me personally nuts seem to be a major issue for weight loss, but it may not be for you. How is your carb intake?

FavadiCacao Tue 16-Jul-13 12:01:28

Itstartshere I had the same problem with fruit and nuts. The solution for me was to switch to lower GI fruit. here is a table.

miss Well done in giving up the almonds! smile I had to give up the nuts too, whilst trying to lose weight.

Well ds is really enjoying the juicing and, as my juicer is a bit rubbish, we've been making ice lollies with the pulp! smile The chickens have enjoyed the vegetables pulp but I'll freeze some next time into ice-cubes trays to use as flavouring in sauces and soups.
Saying that I'm not sure how long I can keep up the extra cleaning! wink

FavadiCacao Tue 16-Jul-13 12:04:01

Giraffe very interesting about the sourdough. Have you tried making it?

FavadiCacao Thu 18-Jul-13 13:32:38

The closest to UK Paleo site I have come across: The saffron girl. There are some lovely recipes in there grin

Itstartshere Thu 18-Jul-13 15:33:32

Buffalo milk ice cream, wow! Have to try that.

I am so chuffed today. You're not supposed to weigh yourself on the whole 30 but I really felt I needed to, just to see if this is paying off. I've lost 4 pounds in two weeks. That was such a boost, as I lost a lb a month on my low fat diet. My clothes are noticeably baggier too. I know some people who cheat on weighing themselves regret it but it has made me more determined to cut out the nuts. I'm still enjoying the carby veg like sweet potatoes which are allowed on this, but I'm not needing them so going to reduce them a bit just to get the carb count down lower. But not stressing about that in anyway, I'm quite happy to eat them if I fancy them.

buildingmycorestrength Thu 18-Jul-13 15:43:45

Y'all fell off my list! Hello again. grin.

Thought you'd be interested that I went to GP today to update him about my various health things, and mentioned in passing that I had stopped eating grains, felt much better for it, finally had a normal relationship with food, and was slowly losing weight. He didn't bat an eyelid, just said, 'Sounds great, very good.'

RawCoconutMacaroon Thu 18-Jul-13 17:16:19

grin building... IMO, more than a few gp's are eating this way themselves! I'm married to one, and know several others. However I think it's going to be a while before HCP are giving out grain free (or safer grain) lifestyle as official advice. I know dh does advise it in "maybe you could try this, many people feel better eating like this" sort of way, but it's a bit difficult when much of it conflicts with official advice (very little of which has any scientific evidence backing it up anyway!).

buildingmycorestrength Thu 18-Jul-13 20:43:54

I keep asking myself what nutritional value is other in grains really? When people get worried that I am missing out I just say that I hardly need carbs as I can't exercise and get all my nutrition elsewhere. I mean, what vitamins are in pasta or porridge anyway?
Sort of rhetorical but would also like to know. Could Google it, I just quite lazy and more interested in your opinion.

misscph1973 Thu 18-Jul-13 20:51:29

Two lovely Paleoish things this week:

I am going to Denmark, my native country, for five weeks, leaving next week, and I have been more than a little worried about sticking to Paleo. Yesterday my mum e-mailed me that she is reading Sara Fargosos Everyday Paleo and loving it!

Today when queuing in Waitrose, the teenage boy behind me was talking to his girlfriend about how he didn't want to eat pasta any more as "the gluten attacks your intestines". I nearly turned around and started talking to them! But then I thought they would just think I was a crazy old bat, as my speech was slurry because I had just come out of the dentists for a tooth extraction and the local anaesthetics was still very much working, so I left it and just enjoyed the idea that young people are catching on to this.

On another note, last week my DS came out of school with a mini pizza they had made and he was so proud. It took at lot of convincing to get him to agree that we could peel off the toppings and put them over a base of potato slices. He was quite happy with the result. Later in the week, he showed me his paper work for the project, and in the section where the question is "If you did it again, what would you do different?", he had written "I wouldn't do it again, I am not allowed bread". I felt a bit mean and wondered what the teachers thought of that, but he hasn't mentioned it, so I guess it's not as big a deal as I fear.

GiraffesEatPineapples Thu 18-Jul-13 23:49:44

misscph that's really great about your mum!

itstartshere well done on weightloss grin

fav that does look like a nice blog - funny that paleo isn't taking off here confused. I haven't tried sour dough but will report back if I ever do. It is something I want to try - part of me thinks it might be healthier than some gluten free bread for rest of family. Love all you jucing tips - I might ask for a juicer for christmas as i really need to increase my veg intake.

My teeth are thanking me for this woe - my gums look healthier (sorry tmi!) Rash not improving though.

Interesting that your husband is a GP Raw - must be difficult for him when he sees people who would benefit from paleo but he prob feels he can't push the message too much sad

GiraffesEatPineapples Fri 19-Jul-13 00:00:22

building a lot of what I am learning through reading into paleo is that there are two sides to the tale with nutrition so there may be nutients in grains but I guess that may be balanced out by other negatives. A bit like flaxseed being high in omega 3s but our bodies not being able to access it efficiently confused . This chriskresser article is kind of on the same lines but plays down importance of fruit and veg which kind of baffles me. I have accepted grains aren't great but fruit and veg shock

RawCoconutMacaroon Fri 19-Jul-13 09:31:14

Giraffes, tell me about your rash! <because I'm nosy>.

When I mostly (but not completely) cut grains about 7 years ago, many skin symptoms disappeared. Breakouts would happen when I had more grains than usual. Since being completely gluten free, I noticed rashes after eating the occasional gluten free "treat" with maize/corn flour or modified maize starch, as well as sore stomach. I don't eat ANY grains now with the exception of some white rice in small amounts.

Building - Health benefits of grains - none, literally none. Do have a wee look at some of the blogs I mentioned up thread (a surprising number of which are written by doctors or scientists challenging everything they have been taught!). But don't take my word for it, or anyone else's, read, evaluate and make up your own mind smile.

In short tho, the processing of natural toxins in grains strips vitamins and minerals from our bodies (getting rid of toxins is more important in the short term than building strong bone and other body tissue). We (society) eat massively more grains than even a few decades ago (due to the low-fat debacle), and those grains are often from new wheat varieties that appear to be even worse than ancient grains for human health), and we are also Eating new grain derivatives such as HFCS and modified starches which didn't even exist 50 years ago, but are in EVERYTHING processed, especially things that have "low fat" or "cholesterol free" on the package!

RawCoconutMacaroon Fri 19-Jul-13 09:43:03

That's an excellent Chris Kresser link, btw.

GiraffesEatPineapples Fri 19-Jul-13 12:26:16

raw it is flat, red, non itchy mainly covers the sides of my shins and ankles but a bit on my body. Gp described it as widespread, didn't really diagnose but thought fungal as mainly round. applying dakacort for over two Weeks but keep forgetting to apply as in fridge. Has faded on my body not so much on legs. I was very strict with diet for about a month but didn't improve.

Itstartshere Fri 19-Jul-13 12:42:39

I just survived a massive biscuit session. There were heaps of them! I had a nice sniff, and they were just as enjoyable that way. grin.

I still have quite dry skin, hoping as I go on that will disappear. I had mild IBS before this and that has gone.

RawCoconutMacaroon Fri 19-Jul-13 16:41:06

It does sound a bit fungal- spreading round areas with clear bits in the middle? As a child, caught ringworm (fungus, not a worm) several times from our cattle, this needed regular application of the cream or it won't work ( usually a couple of different creams as Dr would use one for "human" fungal infection first, before admitting that ok maybe we caught it off the cows!).

But... Could it be the dreaded scabies mite? I think that is often mistaken for. Allergy, fungal attack, and of course then the treatments don't work (Just going by another MN thread that I read on the subject).

RawCoconutMacaroon Fri 19-Jul-13 16:41:55

Although... For all those things, shouldn't it be itchy???

GiraffesEatPineapples Fri 19-Jul-13 18:42:29

hmmm, I didn't think it was ring worm as mostly not clear in the middle but a few are now. It's not on my wrists or arms and nobody else has it as yet so possibly not scabies (hopes fervently)? I think it migt be something I picked up from some new jeans i bought but I had them for quite a while before I wore them (they didn't fit!). Oh well back to GP!

snoworneahva Fri 19-Jul-13 18:58:19

Could it be discoid eczema or psoriasis? I have a round patch on my knee - it's not often itchy but it's scaly and red.

GiraffesEatPineapples Fri 19-Jul-13 20:00:50

snow interesting, I just googled and read up on discoid excema (never heard of it before); 'Sometimes the skin patches can clear in the centre, just leaving a ring of eczema' so that sounds right as I have a mix of patches and the odd circle. The legs are the most common place for it too. Again it should be itchy confused but it seems the most likely of things I have looked up so far (excluding the fact it is most common in 60 year old men!) unless it is just a random fungal infection/ ring worm.

snoworneahva Fri 19-Jul-13 20:05:10

The diagnosis is so often the hard bit - mind you, healing is a nightmare too hmm

RawCoconutMacaroon Fri 19-Jul-13 23:16:24

Giraffes, maybe you are just not an itchy person?!

GiraffesEatPineapples Sat 20-Jul-13 17:05:39

grin Raw that could be true!

I did some paleo baking with my 2 year old this afternoon and she dribbled a bit of honey into the pretty full coconut oil jar - decided to still use it but bummer.

FavadiCacao Sun 21-Jul-13 11:26:34

Well done Itstartshere smile, in a little while you won't even like the smell of 'normal' biscuits, instead you'll start smelling the rancidity in them!

Thank you, snow smile. It explain why I couldn't get rid of what I thought was ringworm 2-3 years ago. Eczema makes more sense since I've regularly suffered with it since childhood.

Girafffe I hope that rash goes soon. I like Chris kresser's articles but I'm baffled too by the vegetables and I tend to agree with Dr Terry Whals on the subject.

I'm back from a short stay at the hospital, courtesy of ds (appendicitis)! A few things have taken me by surprise not really... Ds's surgery had been late afternoon and before he was allowed to eat, it was past midnight; the nurse insisted that it had to be something simple to digest like toast or a biscuit BUT the hospital does not have gluten free bread or biscuits outside kitchen hours (kitchen opens at 9 am!). Come 5am the following day ds couldn't wait any longer -it had been 3 days since he ate anything other than via IV bags! So he ate some plain chicken and and few salad leaves whilst he waited for his dad to bring him some nice broth and food.
The consultant who came to assess ds (for possible discharge) asked if he had had anything to eat; and when told what ds had eaten the Dr asked: ''What's wrong with cereals?'' Ds replied:'' They are processed and taste like cardboard!'' grin

I survived on bags of salad and avocado/plain chicken but I watched other parents microwaving ready meals. sad Both ds and I are looking forward to a full fat meal! grin

oohdaddypig Sun 21-Jul-13 11:42:47

Hello all. Would you mind if I join you?

Strictly speaking I'm not paleo or primal. I eat a moderate amount of non grain carbs (potato, white rice) as that is what works best for me (fast metabolism).

Really interesting link to chris Kesser - his stuff seems really sound and backed up by evidence. Not sure he is paleo/primal in the strictest sense either?

I was pretty healthy until I had kids and since them have developed a few issues I'm trying to sort. Allergies, sinus congestion, fatigue being up there. I don't miss grains at all and feel significantly better in the last few months.

Would love to chat more about this stuff if you will have me?!

FavadiCacao Sun 21-Jul-13 12:22:56

Welcome aboard, oohdaddypig

The work best for you is the most sensible approach and Kresser talks about it in his Paleo Template article

I'm pleased you're starting to feel better. A lot of us on here have resolved or improved a number of conditions and complaints. smile

oohdaddypig Sun 21-Jul-13 12:49:23

Thanks favadi. Hope your DS is ok? I can imagine trying to find much to eat in a hospital which is healthy would be hard which is ironic...

Another great link. I am really enjoying Paul jaminet's blog right now.

What do you all think about legumes? At the moment I lean towards Sally fallon's views about them being good if properly prepared. But I know a lot of folk reckon they are a toxin.

I have fussy DCs but they will happily eat my bone broth soup if it has lentils in it!

GiraffesEatPineapples Sun 21-Jul-13 13:46:22

favadi I hope your son is doing well flowers

oohdaddypig welcome! the kresser link from beofre also mentions that legumes properly soaked and pos sprouted may not be toxic - it was the fact that people may not properly prepare them that was the issue. I have been eating kidney beans this weekend funnily enough. We have loads of tins in the cupboard and I decided to make some space, I made gluten free wraps for everyone else and we had them with salsa and guac - yummy grin Money going to be an issue the month ahead so makes sense to use stuff up.

oohdaddypig Sun 21-Jul-13 13:53:30

Thanks giraffe!

Your wraps sound lovely - do you use rice flour?

Money a bit tight here too.... Tonight it's lambs liver which is surprisingly cheap and the kids love it. I haven't explained exactly what it is..

FavadiCacao Sun 21-Jul-13 17:19:09

Thank you, oohdaddypig and Giraffe. Ds is doing really well. grin He is taking the Dr's advice to heart and he is walking about but not bending or lifting (other than a few remotes and controls wink ).

Healthy food in a hospital?! hmm Didn't even try. grin I asked the wonderful staff about supermarkets nearby and they gave us the directions to two. smile The only reason it was harder than it needed to be was due to having pets and a 50 mile round trip Thank you, Dh.

Legumes are a tough one. As a whole, we only eat peas and green/runner beans when in season (and mostly from our garden/pots) with the exception of 24hr soaked and sprouted lentils at midnight on New year as an Italian tradition to bring health, wealth and prosperity for the New year ahead.

misscph1973 Sun 21-Jul-13 21:24:35

oohdaddypig, welcome!

Good to bring up legumes etc again. I know they are not strictly speaking Paleo, but as former vegetarian I find it hard to give them up, especially as my cupboard is still full of dried lentils etc ;) Tim Ferriss (the 4 hour body is Paleoish in that it is gluten free) reckons that they are fine as long as they are soaked and cooked properly. My DH refuses to eat legumes, and I respect that, but we got a Riverford veg box this week with broad beans, and they were delicious! I am not going to make anyone in the family eat them, though. But I will allow my kids (and myself) to have them when we go to Denmark to visit family next week, as my sister is vegan, so it's going to be hard to avoid legumes. She know her stuff and prepares them well, so I am not too worried. The main reason I went Paleo was to go gluten free, so legumes don't bother me too much.

Giraffes, kidney beans are probably one legume I will not eat again, as they are toxic if not prepared properly, but I completely agree with you about emptying out cupboards - I do not bin food (well, maybe pasta), and I still have a few things to use up, among these oats which are begging me to bake them, into flapjacks ;)

oohdaddypig Sun 21-Jul-13 21:32:32

Ooh what do you do with your runner beans? I get them in my box too and would love to make them more palatable to DCs.

It's great to discuss such issues - everyone looks at me blankly when I talk about soaking lentils grin

Did any of the docs comment adversely on your food choices favadi? If I hear another "whole grain" comment...

Is Denmark a bit more forward on this stuff? Must be great to head home!

GiraffesEatPineapples Sun 21-Jul-13 23:30:32

favadi glad he is doing ok grin My ds has given me lots of back chat on wheat based on the healthy eating posters at his school so really impressed that your ds would defend the choice not to eat it to Doctor.

oohlady I have added some lambs liver to my next order - how do you present it to your children - might adopt your method for mine!

misscph I agree on the kidney beans tbh, prob wont buy them again and they used to be a staple. I have lots of lentils to use too. I don't think occasional consumption can be all that bad it is partly about a change of attitude and seeing them as a treat rather than a health food for me. Maybe some lind of sprouted lentil bread would be a good use? Oh and if you have any condensed milk to use up too search on here for soup dragons flapjacks - seriously yum.

GiraffesEatPineapples Sun 21-Jul-13 23:32:23

Btw misscph I found the 4 hour body really interesting but I didn't lose any weight eating the way he describes. Have you adopted any of his other ideas?

GiraffesEatPineapples Sun 21-Jul-13 23:37:15

sorry oohdaddy not oohlady! grin bear

FavadiCacao Mon 22-Jul-13 18:46:05

Those food pyramid posters look weird in our household! grin But we learn them for exams! wink
Ds is happy to recognise that wheat is not worth the tummy pain he has been sneaking some in occasionally, the little so and so and regretted it every time!! Indeed we thought we had reached a point that we thought dairy could be at play,too... Took ds to GP thinking it's about time we investigate for IBS or allergies, I wasn't expecting appendicitis!

On a different note, it has been years since I had Twiglets but tonight I was brought back a few years when I had a little accident with the brewers' yeast on my oven baked greens crisps! grin Just yum!

Itstartshere Mon 22-Jul-13 21:39:00

I'm not eating legumes, or dairy. I think ultimately I'll eat the odd portion of broad beans if they're served to me as they're yummy but they won't be a regular part of my diet.

I really want to try lambs liver, have never had the urge before, it's funny how this changes you.

This is such a weird diet to get used to in a way. Now I'm seeing things everywhere about people eating healthy diets (then listing their whole grains, lentils, beans and low fat foods) and it's like I've stepped into a parallel universe. I just wish everyone knew about the benefits. It makes me so cross that people are suffering needlessly.

RawCoconutMacaroon Tue 23-Jul-13 08:23:58

Itallstartshere... smile, "this is such a weird diet", wait till you've been eating this way a while, 6 months, a couple of years, it's interesting what the inside of a supermarket looks like "weird" would be a good description!!!

These days I walk in, and don't even go down most of the isles- about 80% of the floor space is manufactured "food-like" grain products which our grandparents wouldn't have recognised (certainly not in those quantities).

But yes, it does boggle the mind a bit, coming to the understanding that pretty much everything about current nutritional advice needs turned on its head.

snoworneahva Tue 23-Jul-13 09:41:04

fava good they caught the appendicitis in time, I've known a few kids to go septic, glad your ds on the mend. Hospital food is shocking, when i have the misfortune of eating in a hospital I always order Asian - at least sometimes the food is edible.

FavadiCacao Tue 23-Jul-13 10:23:28

I agree with Raw, supermarkets look very weird! Now and again, they look positively scary. I went down the cooked/ready to eat fridge aisle of a small Tesco and a medium size Asda recently; only Asda carried something vaguely edible with only 3 ingredients! The deli counters don't fare any better: why is Natural ham not available? Other (hotter) countries do.

The Fat=Bad=Heart attack message is very well ingrained in people's mind. When people ask me about Fat, I point out that I agree that certain fats are really bad, for example the hydrogenated fats found in bread and most baked goods; but I also ask them if they have ever heard of oily fish, avocados or olive oil being bad for the heart (or cholesterol) ? I generally get a smile with the ''Oh, yes!'' acknowledgement but I doubt they'll swap the bread for the fish! It is more likely that the message changes to Fat=Excess Calories=Fat!

oohdaddypig Tue 23-Jul-13 22:45:26

Tis interesting favadi, I like your explanation. I have say that I have given up explaining to friends/ family as to what I'm eating as the whole low-fat/whole grains is so ingrained (s'cuse the pun)

I've even been scoffed at "you are going against official medical advice" hmm

So I just eat my butter and coconut oil quietly! It's difficult explaining why I want to minimise the kids' consumption of wheat though.

Is anyone taking the supplements recommended by chris Kesser?

Itstarts - we are on liver once a week now - it's yummy cooked in butter with onions smile

RawCoconutMacaroon Wed 24-Jul-13 16:18:46


Re kids, "wheat gives he/she/them an upset tummy/rash/headache" would be true of many kids (either now or when theyve been eating it for a couple of decades!!!) probably yours too so bending the truth only slightly, if at all! smile.

Could be followed with a swift "I make sure they get all the nutrients they need from other foods", to disarm the horrified grainsarehealthy crowd in CW (carb world! It's a different planet).

But really, you don't have to explain if you don't want to - if your kids are healthy and growing I don't think their diet is anyones business other than parents/caters.

RawCoconutMacaroon Wed 24-Jul-13 16:20:08

*carers not caterers!

marzipananimal Wed 24-Jul-13 16:26:45

Hi just popping in to let you know I had my baby dd 2 weeks ago. She's gorgeous and doing really well but people keep bringing us cake so we're not remotely paleo at the mo!

RawCoconutMacaroon Wed 24-Jul-13 16:42:50

Congratulations! That's lovely news (the baby,not the cake heehee, wink)

FavadiCacao Wed 24-Jul-13 17:44:07

Congratulations!grin flowers

oohdaddypig Wed 24-Jul-13 20:55:30

Congratulations marzipan! Enjoy every minute of baby AND cake... <jealous on both counts> smile

Fav - actually what you state is true in as much as DD has stopped complaining of a sore stomach EVERY day. But I do get fed up of the hmm looks when I mention the wheat free stuff. It shouldn't matter but we are often at friends' houses so I end up bringing my own snacks.

Macaroon - your name makes me chuckle as I have got a hankering for trying my own macaroon recipe using coconut, lime, egg white and rice syrup. Will report back...

snoworneahva Thu 25-Jul-13 07:23:09

Congratulations Marzipan - nevermind about the cake, enjoy every moment!

buildingmycorestrength Thu 25-Jul-13 07:45:10

Marzipan, big congratulations. thanks How wonderful. grin

FavadiCacao Thu 25-Jul-13 09:23:26

daddypig, you'll learn to ignore the looks, especially when thinking about your dd no longer suffering. smile Your friends will eventually get used to it, your dd will not be the only ones eating a diet free from something.
Last year's birthday cake to be taken to one of ds's activities had to be gluten, nut, dairy and strawberry free!

Re: Supplements. I take vitamin D and K2 because I know I have already lost quite a lot of bone. Dh also wants to start, to see whether he can control cardio exercise induced migraines before starting using a prescribed medication.

Here are some links to the availability of fat soluble Vitamins in foods: Vitamin A
Vitamin D
Vtamni K
Vitamin E

snoworneahva Thu 25-Jul-13 10:41:29

Gluten free is becoming more mainstream - older people seem to suffer more than younger people but eating out options have improved. I had a gluten free pizza in pizza express - it was just ok but it was an option and there was plenty of choice.
My dcs eat gluten free 70-80% of the time....they have friends sleeping over this weekend and we'll make spelt bread and they'll have a gluten them this kind of stuff occasionally tends to stop them from feeling too deprived. When they were younger their diet was much stricter and I did get a few people grumble at my refusal to allow them to ingest food full of hydrogenated fats and artificial additives - I expect my stance made people either think I was bonkers and would regret the day i restricted junk suggesting my kids would obsess over it or i made them feel guilty about the food they gave their kids.

To reassure my dcs don't obsess over junk food - sugary crap from party bags can sit in the cupboard for 6 months and they won't even ask about it and they are becoming ingredient aware, choosing treats that don't contain masses of ingredients - they have learnt that the more ingredients a food contains the more likely it's going to taste awful.

oohdaddypig Thu 25-Jul-13 14:28:30

Thanks favadi - you are a mine of information.... I'm sorry about the bone loss - can I ask how you know?

I take vit d and k, magnesium and, controversially, iodine. I also take selenium and some of the b vits once a week.

Snow - that's great your kids are making those choices now - not so sure we are there yet smile

FavadiCacao Thu 25-Jul-13 18:19:04

Long story, daddypig. Replied in private smile

snow, I too believe the key is for Dc to take ownership of their diet. Compromises will always be inevitable along the way but ultimately they will able to make personal and informed choices. smile
It is really rewarding when dc describe 'processed food' as tasting funny, (*weird*, I guess grin )

GiraffesEatPineapples Fri 26-Jul-13 20:42:47

Congratulations marzipanimal grin

I am finding paleo a bit hard to stick to at mo. I might try adding vitamins back in and see if that helps. Feeling down sad (most probably because my eating has slipped a bit into SAD ways!) Daft really, nothing stressful going on and I have no excuse not to eat well.

FavadiCacao Sat 27-Jul-13 09:08:50

Oh no, Giraffes flowers

What is that you're finding difficult to resist? I can't remember how long ago you started but cravings for SAD products can be really strong in the first few months. Are there particular smells or times that you struggle with? Is there any comfort food you love that could substitute the SAD one(s)?

RawCoconutMacaroon Sat 27-Jul-13 12:45:37

Key to avoiding cravings ime, is to have no grain product AT ALL, none, not even trace amounts as for a lot of people, small amounts just make them crave more - and on the other side of the equation, at the same time you need to eat more fat!

That is a hard thing in the beginning, to lose that fear of fat we are told to have! But you need the calories and the satisfying satiating effect of the fat (or fat/protein).

Keep at it! You will get there it just takes time smile.

GiraffesEatPineapples Sat 27-Jul-13 22:14:31

thanks both flowers I think it is a mix of things, the hot weather making me not feel like cooking, rest of family wanting grains (even if it is gluten free I don't think I should be eating toast) cost is a biggie, not wanting to throw away kids reject food when I could eat it for my meals etc

I think it is easier being strict somehow raw, one thing leads to another. It's almost not even a craving but oh what harm will it do this once ... which then becomes twice etc...I feel and look better when I don't eat grains yet somehow I have still gone a bit off course in the past few days.

FavadiCacao Sun 28-Jul-13 09:51:59

I know how you feel about cooking in this heat. I've been cooking fast and easy dishes that are also lovely cold, such as steamed vegetables drizzled with olive oil and lemon juice; baked vegetables salad: peppers, aubergines and courgettes are lovely served with a salsa or guacamole; meat and fish cooked in tomato based sauces (on the hob or in the oven) keep tender once refrigerated; meatloafs...

I think we are all guilty of finishing our children's meals! grin

Could you entice the children with some grain free SAD food such as homemade oven chip with homemade ketchup and paleo chicken nuggets or fish fingers?

Pasta is quite bland in taste and it's more about the filling or sauces. I make ravioli by stuffing hollowed out tomatoes with traditional ravioli stuffing and then bake. (Omitting bread crumbs from the stuffing means allowing the stuffing to rest in the fridge for 1hr before using)

FavadiCacao Sun 28-Jul-13 10:06:38

I find tomatoes the number one food in the summer. I Came across this page on stuffed tomatoes ; the recipes are not Paleo but most are easily adaptable. smile I hope google translate works but if it doesn't I'm happy to translate any recipe anybody fancy! smile

GiraffesEatPineapples Sun 28-Jul-13 21:05:57

Those meals do sound lovely fav I guess organisation really helps cooking early when its cool then having the food ready in the fridge. Have resolutely ordered lambs liver, organic eggs, kale and samphire in addition to usual organic salad box.

My dc will mostly eat those paleo SAD things but nuggets have been too dry - I plan to try using potato flour next time smile Gluten free at home is def doable but grain free is difficult for me to implement as they are all fussy eaters in one way or another and I am not quite deaf enough to complaints or good enough a cook to persuade them!

oohdaddypig Sun 28-Jul-13 21:10:55

You have my sympathy giraffes with fussy DCs. So what is on the menu with the lambs liver?

We had a wedding this weekend which meant I slipped up with my eating and my stomach is not happy. Made me realise just how much better I feel when I don't munch rubbish... hastily puts away midget gems

goodasitgets Mon 29-Jul-13 01:13:37

Just caught up on this thread (under another NC!)
I'm juicing a fair bit at the moment. After watching the programme it does appeal - I have chronic cholinergic urticaria. Appeared from nowhere when I was 11. I've tried everything under the sun, an urticaria specialist ramped up my antihistamines to 285mg a day shock with no effect. My only option is cyclosporin which is a hefty drug. Am not convinced its wheat/gluten as paleo has made no noticeable difference
With juices it means I eat (drink) a lot more veg especially spinach which I don't like eating!
My sciatica is sorted gringringringrin and I have been approved to go back to spin/yoga/Pilates but no weights sad yet. Basically weak core meant piriformis and sacroiliac were compensating and facet joints were stuck. Hammering the core exercises and stopping all exercise for 6 weeks has made a huge improvement
Eased myself back in with my first pole fitness class. OMG. New found respect for people who do it, my bruises are insane, and the strength you need is ridiculous!

FavadiCacao Mon 29-Jul-13 10:59:11

Good to hear your back is on a mend, goodas. smile

Silly question: have you tried removing capsaicin containing nightshades from your diet?
There are a couple of research that indicate that capsaicin inhibits antihistamines (at least topically). Although Capsaicin can be used topically to treat a number of conditions including itching and some skin problems, it is also becoming apparent that some people have mutations in the capsaicin receptors.

Pole fitness sounds fun, it reminds me of the Quadro svedese I used to love when I was young. A lot harder than it looks and a lot more bruises than you'd imagine! grin

goodasitgets Mon 29-Jul-13 11:01:41

I haven't (must google what contains them!)
I got weighed today - good and bad news, I've lost muscle from not training and so it's not a brilliant loss. But 13lbs down

FavadiCacao Mon 29-Jul-13 13:01:26

That's great, goodas! grin

Giraffes, I've just tried the chicken nuggets and they are very dry and quite faffy to make. Most of my days are hectic, so I Need quick and simple recipes...Below is how I've solved the problem smile

Chicken nuggets


Enough Almond flour to cover the bottom of a small frying pan (30-50g?)
1/4-1/2 lemon zest
1 egg beaten
2 chciken breasts cut into small strips (about a little finger's width)
Herbs optional
Fat to cook


1) I mixed the almond flour with the zest of 1/4-1/2 lemon (to give a fresh taste), salt and pepper and cooked the mix in a dry pan a medium heat until the desired colour was achieved. Set aside.
2) I marinated the chicken in the egg for a few minutes before cooking it at medium heat in a frying pan. I added a bit of thyme and lemon zest whilst the chicken was cooking.
3) Once the chicken was cooked to a lovely golden yellow, I rolled each piece in the almond flour mix, shook off excess flour and served (lovely with a slice of lemon). It would be easy to pick up with little finger too!

With the left over egg and flour I cooked some thin slices of courgettes (using same technique).
I would think it would work with fish and minute steaks.

RawCoconutMacaroon Mon 29-Jul-13 13:35:49

Capsicum/nightshades might be worth eliminating and adding back in to the diet.

I react really badly to dried, powdered powdered peppers (paprika, chilli powder and so on), but I'm fine with fresh chilli and sweet peppers in moderation (itch, rash, joint pains).

I'm assuming that its because of the surface area- the powder is fine and allows all the irritant compounds out into the digestive system, whereas fresh chopped stuff is quite big even after chewing. Does that make sense smile?

Similarly, too many raw tomatoes is quite irritant to me, but cooked ones are absolutely fine.

RawCoconutMacaroon Mon 29-Jul-13 13:38:01

Mutations in my capsicum receptors - lol, I suppose I must have!!!

RawCoconutMacaroon Mon 29-Jul-13 14:20:34

Goodasitgets, was thinking about your histamine response - presumably you have an elevated response hence the antihistamines?

I have several Migraine triggers which are (I'm sure) related to the tyramine content of those foods (blue and aged cheeses, fermented foods like sauerkraut, marmite), and interestingly, I remember when reading about tyramine (a natural product of decay), that these foods also tend to have a very high histamine content too (several articles I read had the title low histamine and tyramine diets, or similar titles)... And these seem to badly affect some people. I am wondering therefore if anyone has suggested histamine in food as a cause/trigger of your urticaria before?

I know the tyramine/migraine link was just something I stumbled on myself, after 20 years of migraines! I had no idea about it until about a year ago!

goodasitgets Mon 29-Jul-13 14:44:11

Yeah basically it's not known as to what my triggers are - I know change of temp and raised heart rate are triggers for me
Interestingly (or just to pee me off!) I've developed vitiligo on my hand, never had it before, no family history

goodasitgets Mon 29-Jul-13 14:48:49

This is more about it. I do find bringing it up every day helps deplete the severity of it, so the more exercise I do the better!

FavadiCacao Mon 29-Jul-13 14:49:28

Interesting Raw. Also interesting about your joint pain reaction. Capsaicin receptor (TRPV1) in implicated in the heat and pain response and it has been researched in relation to arthritis. this article might interst you.

RawCoconutMacaroon Mon 29-Jul-13 15:11:57

Favadi, that was indeed interesting, a pretty heavy read after my weekend of no sleep (sadly not related to wild living, but to toddler and too much work!).

That is probably enough evidence for me to justify eating fresh chillies and and sweet peppers in modest quantities, I love the taste but had wondered if the pain reaction to eating too much meant damage to the affected joints (normally on a clean, grain free diet I don't have an joint pain now, where as before, I had it all the time in many joints). But that paper would suggest that a potentially positive benefit, very interesting indeed!

RawCoconutMacaroon Mon 29-Jul-13 15:36:05

Goodasitgets interesting also, I think I used to get this (or similar) in response to sweat? In hot weather ie back of the neck, underarms, but lucky for me, not very often and haven't had it for a year or two. I got told it was heat rash/prickly heat?

It sounds a bit scary to provoke it with hot showers!!! You're brave grin, that would make me itch massively!

FavadiCacao Mon 29-Jul-13 16:16:54

I'm currently reading a fascinating older review on TRPs which is not as heavy on the eyes but it's 34 pages long plus 32 pages of references shock. I first came across caspaicin receptors because of my reactions to some medications, products and plants: I either itch and develop eczema or I itch and develop urticaria; add to that the desire to scratch my eyes out and the inside of my nose if suffering hayfever! For years I couldn't eat peppers without getting a migraine but since going paleo not only I can eat peppers but I get no migraines, nor hayfever. smile

goodasitgets Mon 29-Jul-13 16:20:10

Yep grin starts on chest and crook of arms mainly. When v bad it's huge raised hives even on feet and palms of hands and I plunge in an ice bath. I tend to bring it up via exercise as hot shower more unpleasant!
Currently take 4 x cetirizine a day

goodasitgets Mon 29-Jul-13 16:20:44

And yes I guess it's like an turbo charged version of prickly heat!!

FavadiCacao Mon 29-Jul-13 17:12:18

That's a massive dose! I felt awful with just one tablet and preferred levocetirizine to the rest. A friend finds that by rotating the antihistamines gets a better control (different condition).

goodasitgets Mon 29-Jul-13 17:23:08

Ha at one point I was on the equivalent of 28 x 10mg tablets shock
Which did precisely nothing grin
I also have dermographism so I can write swear words on my skin with my nail which makes a good party trick wink

FavadiCacao Mon 29-Jul-13 18:09:48

Wow! shock That's some party trick!!
I can see your wanting to juice. Are you just juicing like Joe or an add-on like Dr Wahls?

goodasitgets Mon 29-Jul-13 18:27:15

I'm doing it as an add on at the minute but am tempted to do a 3-5 day fast when I have a week off work just to see really smile

goodasitgets Mon 29-Jul-13 18:31:31
RawCoconutMacaroon Mon 29-Jul-13 20:40:09

grin, so how long does it take for the "writing" to apear?

goodasitgets Mon 29-Jul-13 20:42:05

Goes red all up my arm straight way then settles into writing in about 5 seconds grin

RawCoconutMacaroon Mon 29-Jul-13 21:13:50


FavadiCacao Tue 30-Jul-13 10:05:30

Good luck with your fast, goodas! Looking forward to hear about the results. smile
Would you be doing the winter version for the fats?

goodasitgets Tue 30-Jul-13 11:07:31

Not sure, I'm looking at the 3 or 5 day plan from fat sick and nearly dead. Just a bit confused about the whole not eating thing but I think it's mental ability to get through it more than anything!

FoxPass Tue 30-Jul-13 14:49:15

hello everyone, I've been primal since January to help with a suspected autoimmune disorder. I've also done the candida diet for 2 months but am now going back to full primal.

looking forward to trying some of the recipes here and sharing ideas smile

FavadiCacao Wed 31-Jul-13 14:26:52

Welcome aboard FoxPass smile

RawCoconutMacaroon Wed 31-Jul-13 15:26:46

Hello Foxpass, would be interested to know if you've found primal helpful to your health issues?

I had a long and boring list of immune and suspected immune issues, which got worse, longer and more boring as I got older, and it has all either gone away or radically improved on a "clean" grain free diet (I do need to keep it completely grain free!) - it's always good to hear from others who've had similar improvements!

Hello, been lurking now posting. Big Daily Apple fan here getting back on it after 3 years (pregnancy and SN parenthood and emigration derailed me).
Started clean low carb/ no grain or sugar etc etc on 9th July.
Also doing IF - 5:2 or 6:1 or 16:8, whatever. Using MFP to track initially just to see where my hunger triggers/optimum carb/fat levels work out.
Cheers for helpful thread smile

oohdaddypig Thu 01-Aug-13 07:49:58

Hello foxpass and trucks - look forward to chatting on this insightful thread.

Trucks - how do you feel doing more prolonged fasts? I so 16:8 but that's enough for me. Sounds like you have had a lot on your plate these last few years. Do you find primal is helping?

Well it's chucking it down here today so off to find some sun smile

LouBeee Thu 01-Aug-13 21:42:56

Hello - can I join?
I've been paleo since doing my first whole 30 in March (was a big dive in - had never even heard of paleo before then!) and have just finished my second. Tended to eat mainly paleo in between with the exceptions being eating out.
DS is nearly 2 and is not paleo but I have definitely moved him more that way. He is allergic to eggs which makes it a bit harder.
DH is also not paleo but is happy to eat the same meals as me in the evening/weekends. He's allergic to fish, nuts and eggs - which does mean that paleo would be quite dull for him!
I don't do cross fit but do lift heavy weights/ Tabata 4 times a week.

I didn't have any big health problems before but did have a BIG sugar addiction - it's much more under control now but definitely my demon. I was attracted to this more from an energy point of view - was so sick of the sugar crashes which coupled with my toddler's sleeping meant I was constantly lacking in energy.

Anyway nice to meet you all!

snowlie Fri 02-Aug-13 14:32:14

Welcome to all the new joiners...

I'm back with a new name and a possible diagnosis for my mouth sores - saw an ENT surgeon and he ruled out anything serious - ie cancer, but nothing else made sense either, he said if it was an allergy I'd have to eliminate foods one at a time as there was no way to test everything you eat. So after a lot of thought I believe I have a sugar allergy. The only time I have a reaction is after eating something sweet, even an apple made my mouth tingle.....I'm a bit gutted, I like sweet stuff occasionally but it seems that more than a mouthful leaves my mouth stinging and feeling raw. I think I've been in denial about this but it explains a lot - why dark choc didn't set it off the same way as milk chocolate - I thought it was the milk, I thought it was chocolate, egg, nuts but the only ingredient these items had in common was sugar whether is was unprocessed fruit or refined it makes no difference. Pah!

Off to catch up with everyone's news!

GiraffesEatPineapples Sat 03-Aug-13 16:47:24

snow at least you can relax a little, but its hard not knowing exactly what the cause is. What about anti candida diet, very similar to paleo but obv there is an emphasis on sugar reduction sad foods to eat on anti candida diet.

GiraffesEatPineapples Sat 03-Aug-13 16:50:54

or 21 day sugar detox seems to have a fun paleo community but you have to pay to find out the secrets hmm

Hello again and to answer re fasting q: it's getting easier probably because I'm in ketosis frequently.
I skip breakfast, eat something like a hard boiled egg or steamed green beans with butter or oil and herbs about 2pm, then big bowl soup at 7pm. So I'm fasting from 8pm - 2pm really - about 18 hours.

Sometimes I fast once a week, sometimes twice. Usually work out fasting then have something like eggs or chicken drumstick after swimming, about 10.30am. So I guess mini fasts between 8.30pm - 10.30am - 14 hours happen most days. I understand there are benefits for women with 12-14 hour breaks from food but longer fasts suit men better; can disrupt women's hormones and cycle negatively.


Sorry - the 18 hr fast doing <500 cals is once or twice weekly. The overnight fast/workout/swim then eat mid morning is most days, and 5 days a week I eat about 1600-1900 calories made up of meat, fowl, fish, eggs, veg - the usual primal food.

GiraffesEatPineapples Sat 03-Aug-13 17:34:50

Good point about men and women being different with fasting trucks&d, makes sense as paleo women might have been more home based. Also i also think age makes a difference.

Yes, post-menopausal women can fast longer I think: fertile women require extra fats to balance hormones. And therefore store fat differently to men and older women/children.

Itstartshere Mon 05-Aug-13 08:46:33

Hi everyone, hope you're all well. Lou I just finished a Whole30, glad to see someone else on here who is doing it.

I just weighed myself, I lost 6 pounds in 30 days. Given that my average over the last ten years is a pound a month I'm really pleased. I haven't measured myself yet. I have been massively stressed the last couple of weeks and I've not slept much so I wasn't expecting to lose that sort of amount. Plus I went out on Saturday and had a bit of bread, crisps, Eton mess and a lot of champagne. I was bracing myself for the scale being a lot higher than it was!!

I was really pleased to negotiate Saturday ok. I was really worried it might trigger me wanting to stuff my face with sweet and carby things but actually I've been very happy to get back to my regular food. I had the most amazing tomato salad last night with feta and am looking forward to my breakfast eggs. So that is a relief. Just keen to see how my body will change between now and Christmas. I'm off on holiday in 2 weeks time and the meals there will be Vegetarian. However they do have fish, and the evening meals will be eaten out so will have meat then. Have no plans to have grains whilst there.

Incidentally has anyone else's menstrual cycle changed? I hear it's quite common. I'm having a period 2 weeks after my last one, but I'm on the pill, that shouldn't be happening. Just hoping things even out over the next month.

snowlie Mon 05-Aug-13 09:05:17

Thanks giraffe interesting link on he Candida Diet - I think the simplest thing is just to cut out sugar and's hard though, especially to begin with, saying no to some lovely homemade ice cream yesterday was close to torture, once I have a week under my belt I won't even think about sugar in any form. My mouth is still raw from Friday which helps with the motivation.

I used to fast, twice a week for around 10 months. I gave up a few months back, after finally accepting that it made me irritable, increased my cravings, made me feel ravenously hungry and led to me obsessing about food too much. Eating when I'm hungry, which sometimes means skipping meals seems to work much better for me.

nappyaddict Mon 05-Aug-13 10:43:12

I have just had a microwave baked pear - cored and filled with butter, cinnamon and nutmeg with a dollop of extra thick double cream. Also nice with apples or bananas. Very satisfying! could add honey or maple syrup if you eat it.

PeoniesPlease Mon 05-Aug-13 11:28:22

Hello, I hope I can join! I'm pleased to see a Paleo/Primal thread on MN.

I lived primal for about 6 months a couple of years ago. I fell off the wagon because of some pretty major upheavals in my life, and I was also diagnosed with hypothyroidism at around the same time. I have essentially no thyroid function at all.

I'm on a pretty massive dose of Armour thyroid which is a natural dessicated porcine hormone, instead of on synthetic thyroxine. I think it is working reasonably well for me, but I have put a lot of weight on in the last few years whilst trying to get to the right dose and so on.

I tried straight-up low carbing, but I didn't lose any weight and found it pretty hardgoing because I really missed fruit and veg, which have always been a big part of my diet.

So, I'm thinking of going back to Primal, which I really loved doing when I did it before. I'm probably going to get started next week because of various commitments I have this week which will make it more difficult. I'm going to aim to be at the lower end of the carb curve so that I can hopefully lose some of the weight, thyroid permitting!

I have a gluten intolerance, so haven't eaten that for a couple of years anyway, which I'm hoping will make the transition easier.

PeoniesPlease Mon 05-Aug-13 11:28:47

Sorry - what an essay! blush

FoxPass Mon 05-Aug-13 15:40:49

hi everyone smile coconut I have found going primal helpful in my general wellbeing. I had biofeedback treatment for the possible autoimmune skin condition I have, and discovered I had rampant Candida. I cut out all sugar for 2 months and took a mixture of antifungals. I have had an almost complete reduction in my symptoms. I had neck acne and high thyroid levels too, as the Candida was messing with it. I am using natural progesterone cream to balance my hormones which is helping the acne. now the Candida is gone, I am reducing the cream and hoping my body is able to rebalance and heal now my gut is healthy.

candida can cause leaky gut syndrome which in turn triggers autoimmune issues. so cleaning up your diet by cutting out refined carbs can really help.

oohdaddypig Mon 05-Aug-13 21:38:25

Hi and welcome paeonies. Sorry about your thyroid issues. Have you checked out the thyroid stuff at perfect health (paleo with "safe" carbs") really interesting reading about why very low carb can make thyroid issues worse. Also about iodine/selenium/magnesium for thyroid function.

Hi foxpass - your post was v interesting - can I ask what antifungals you took? I'm fairly certain my sinus issues are candida related and whilst everything is improving I wonder if I should think about doing more....

Well I somewhat fell off the wagon this weekend as it was quite stressful with ill DCs and nights out so I had a lot of sugary rubbish and not surprisingly feel awful today!

Has anyone any views on xylitol?

Hope everyone had a more energetic Monday than me smile

oohdaddypig Mon 05-Aug-13 21:40:31

Sorry meant to add - itstarts - yes, my period has been wonky since I started all this. I am only 8 weeks in mind and am also taking some supplements which might have knocked it. As I'm feeling so much better overall I'm taking it as a sign of my system re syncing.....

RawCoconutMacaroon Tue 06-Aug-13 09:11:21

Xylitol - may be less bad than some other artificial sweeteners but I say "no" to it.

For me, I think it's probably better to not use artificial sweeteners, but to use small amounts of honey, maple syrup or even cane sugar (but not agave due to the fructose content), as an occasional part of the diet (occasional does not mean everyday!!!). Essentially natural sugars are a (small) part of the natural human diet, unlike grain foods which are a very recent addition to the human diet.

Candidiasis - yes, the leaky gut thing seems to promote it but its my understanding that lectins and other compounds in grains and other seeds start that process by damaging the gut wall. Once the damage is bad enough, sugars and gluten etc can leak into the bloodstream and set off the immune responses that are at the root of many autoimmune conditions.

There are a lot if complex interactions going on there, but IMHO and IME, grains (all of them), are the root of all dietary evil!!! grin. Of course once that gut damage is done, I think there needs to be a no sugar diet at least for a few months even for people without candidiasis symptoms, to reset the tastbuds.

The thyroid issue is interesting - it's another autoimmune problem (often autoimmune, not always), and strongly connected with gluten antibodies (they will attack thyroid tissue), so again, grains are a possible cause and in order to remove natural toxins in grains from the body, the liver has to use up magnesium, vitamin D and other valuable minerals, and low levels of those are associated with thyroid problems, and the hundred and one other "metabolic syndrome" conditions. Previously known as syndrome X, basically these are the "diseases of civilisation" which are all very common now, but were very very rare in pre-agricultural humans (ie before grains became an important part of the diet). These diseases include heart disease, diabetes, thyroid, gout, rheumatoid arthritis... Other autoimmune conditions, osteoporosis and dementia. Quite a list!

Did I mention that I think grains are evil grin shock smile????!

FoxPass Tue 06-Aug-13 09:41:04

oohdaddypig for antifungals I ate 3 cloves of raw garlic daily. I also eat coconut oil and take a supplement of caprylic acid, which is a component of coconut oil which helps the gut maintain proper acidity.

I've stopped the raw garlic now it's gone (thank goodness!) but I still take everything else, and a good probiotic. If you're tackling candida you need a probiotic with s.boulardii. Holland and Barrett do a good one called Probiotic Gastrohealth.

Stevia is a great natural sweetner, it does not stress your adrenals. Asda sell it for about £2, under the brand name purvia.

FoxPass Tue 06-Aug-13 09:56:18

I don't know if grains can damage your gut wall but they feed candida. When candida switches to it's fungal form (rather than yeast) it grows roots which pierce the gut wall and lead to leaky gut. It is then more like a parasite and will make you very unwell indeed!

The candida infestation I had was affecting my thyroid function which in turn was messing with my hormones big time. I was totally staggered to learn the impact diet makes to overall health (I feel silly saying that but nobody teaches you these things.) Everything is connected!

No I feel like I have healed my gut and like you say, my tastebuds are reset and I can enjoy food as it should be! I also think grains are evil grin

PeoniesPlease Tue 06-Aug-13 10:23:16

Thanks for the info about thyroids. I'm going to have a big read of the perfect health diet to see what they say about it.

FoxPass - from what you say about the gluten/thyroid link, do you think it would be worth taking supplements of magnesium and Vit D, as well as the selenium and iodine? I already use epsom salts when I have a bath, but don't really take any supplements at the moment. I also intend to supplement with a good quality omega 3 fish oil.

I'm coming to the conclusion that grains are evil too!

FoxPass Tue 06-Aug-13 12:00:07

peonies I take a spoonful of coconut oil every day as it is very good for supporting thyroid function. I also eat 3 brazil nuts for selenium and use a magnesium spray daily.

I'm not sure what else directly supports thyroid function but I also take a multivitamin and omega 3 oils daily.

PeoniesPlease Tue 06-Aug-13 21:40:23

Thanks Fox, I already cook with coconut oil quite a lot so hopefully I'm getting that anyway. Will do more research into whether other supplements would be helpful.

oohdaddypig Tue 06-Aug-13 21:48:08

Rawcoconut - do you think you could clarify your views on grains, please? grin

Actually I don't disagree with you. I think that properly prepared grains a la Nourishing Traditions book are probably ok but no one does that anymore....

Paeonies - I'm fairly certain that I was subclinically hypothyroid before I came to all this. (A number of years of preg and b/feeding had been the final straw for my overly taxed body). My diet was probably ok ish - lots of fruit and veg but I ate grains. Anyway, I'm now taking magnesium, vit d, vit k and iodine and vit c daily, b vits and selenium once/twice a week, as well as being primal plus safe carbs. The perfect health diet folk don't recommend either a multivitamin or fish oils - it's all there on the website, it's fascinating reading.

I do know that taking iodine for hypothyroid issues is very controversial. The theory seems to be that it helps only if selenium and magnesium levels are ok too. But you don't want to take too much selenium either.... Also, there is also a theory that too low carb can exacerbate hypothyroidism in the long run. Minimal carb definitely did not agree with me so I eat white rice and white potato.

My DH is slightly horrified by my diet (aghast that I eat eggs in butter most days etc) so I have agreed to get my cholesterol checked. I'm slightly scared about it - what if my levels are sky high hmm!!

oohdaddypig Tue 06-Aug-13 21:54:52

Ps fox pass - I agree with you about feeling staggered by it all. I think I have heard "eat whole grain" and "low fat" so long that you don't question any other way.

I couldn't believe how crap I was feeling 3 months ago. Chronic sinusitis, brain fog, exhaustion, always cold, dry skin, gut issues. Yet all blood tests "normal".

2 weeks into my changes, it began to lift. I have a long way to go but all conventional medicine could offer me was nasal steroids!

I try not be too evangelical to others with similar health issues as I know it's not everyone's cup of tea. But I do wonder why there isn't more focus by governments into diet and modern living and the rise in all the weird issues mentioned by rawcoconut...

RawCoconutMacaroon Tue 06-Aug-13 23:14:20

For clarity! Grains=evil grin.

Magnesium- it very poorly absorbed from suplements and even from food, which is why the body using magnesium stores to process grain toxins is a problem- it leads to deficiencies.

Magnesium baths are good (dead sea salts for example), it's expensive but you can cut it with Epsom salts, as the sulphates in that are good too. Both are good for the skin but may initially cause minor rash (the magnesium salts anyway) so use smaller amounts to start with.... Or you could swim in the sea daily!

RawCoconutMacaroon Tue 06-Aug-13 23:19:54

Ohdsddypig - yes, there are good reasons why traditional cultures prepared food stuffs in certain ways.

I don't think I would try the sprouted or soaked, fermented grains now, but I bet if I'd been raised eating them, I would never have developed the food allergies, intolerances and immune issues.
I think modern preparation methods as well as the sheer amount of grain foods we are told to eat are both a big part of the problem.

RawCoconutMacaroon Wed 07-Aug-13 07:46:22

Ohdaddypig- cholesterol check, remember its not the total number that's the important thing but the ratio of high to low density cholesterol, so a higher number, but with a healthy ratio is better than a low number with the wrong ratio,

And testing you numbers now, is not going to tell you what it was before paleo- just suppose you get a bad result, maybe it was worse before paleo iykwim, so retest in 3 or 6months...

Wilding Wed 07-Aug-13 10:01:04

Hello, everyone! Haven't been on any paleo/primal threads before but I saw this one and thought it would be nice to join in smile

I'm a relative newcomer to paleo - I first started reading/thinking about it when I read Escape the Diet Trap last year but was a veggie (of 20 years' standing!) at the time so it didn't really appeal. Then at the start of this year I joined a CrossFit gym and started rethinking what I was eating.

I've now been doing paleo for about 5 months and have started eating fish and meat again (experimentally). I have lost nearly a stone since the start of the year and feel much better when I'm eating this way, although I still get guilt pangs sometimes! Unfortunately I haven't been able to keep up the CrossFit due to money/location issues but I have signed up for Tough Mudder in September and am running and doing kettlebells at home in preparation for that. I never used to have much of a sweet toothy but I find that now it's my biggest weakness - I give myself Saturdays off so I can indulge.

Hi, thread dropped off my active list, summer holidays really interfering with my MN time grin

The summer holidays are also really interfering with my paleo diet! Doing the best I can - still off bread at least (it just seems so unappetising now!) - but just can't seem to settle into a routine of meals, keep missing at least one which means I usually end up eating SAD food.

GiraffesEatPineapples Thu 08-Aug-13 18:50:18

Hi all smile Wildings what exactly is cross fit. I would love to try kettlebells but cannot find an instructor. One of the paleo books I can get from the e library goes on about kettlebells being good for womens sex drive - fraid thats not the reason I want to try them though - apparently its an efficient way to excersise.

BeingMoreDog Fri 09-Aug-13 09:27:08

hello, I'd like to join. I want to cut gluten and sugar, so paleo seems a good approach. But I live on sugary carbs so it's going to be a tough one!
Please could you give me some ideas of quick, non-offally meals for the week ahead?

Wilding Fri 09-Aug-13 09:47:00

Hi Giraffes!

CrossFit is basically a sort of combination of weightlifting & gymnastics moves that you do in a group. It's supposed to turn you into the perfect all-rounder - good for strength, flexibility, stamina etc. It's very high-intensity and quite scary to start off with but I really loved it! Just sad that I can't do it now due to money/travel issues. There are a couple of videos here and here (disclaimer - I am nowhere near that level of fitness!)

Kettle bells are a great exercise tool - swings, especially, are a really good & quick way to build up core strength - but technique is really important and you really need someone to check that you're doing them properly as you can put your back out otherwise.

FavadiCacao Fri 09-Aug-13 09:55:32

I'll hold your hand snow smile
As someone with an acidic mouth, sugar is pure evil. It burns like hell! Have you tried switching to a Lauryl sulphate free toothpaste?
After a couple months without Lauryl Sulphate, I was able to eat sweeter fruit. I still don't go anywhere near sugar, molasses but I might taste an ice-cream with honey.

FavadiCacao Fri 09-Aug-13 10:25:06

Hello BeingMoreDog and welcome. smile

Ideas for the week ahead:
Butternut squash mash take only 5 minutes to cook.
Steamed vegetables with butter or olive oil (and lemon).
Stir fries.
Sweet potato, swede, butternut squash chips in the oven take about 15 minutes
Fish can be ready in 5-10 minutes
Minute steaks are incredibly versatile ( saltimbocca , pizzaiola and other sauces )
Avocado caprese with rocket salad
Avocado (mashed with garlic, lemon, chopped basil and a pinch of seasoning) with prawns or tuna served on lettuce leaves.

BeingMoreDog Fri 09-Aug-13 12:38:42

They sound delicious fava - I love avocado. Looking fwd to shopping tonight so can get going on this!

How about snacks? I need to reduce the sugary snacks, but keep the fatty ones as breastfeeding. I don't want to lose weight (could do with gaining a bit tbh), but I need to eat a lot more healthily.

Is natural yoghurt a go-er? I love that with seeds and nuts.

I love full fat Greek yog with seeds/ nuts berries too (also BF)

One month since starting this
Ten pounds down
Body shape changed.
Back in size 12.
Bikini pic on profile eeekk!

snowlie Fri 09-Aug-13 14:02:51

Well done trucks that's a great result.

Interesting Fava, will definitely give the sls free toothpaste a go - can you recommend one that doesn't taste hideous? I haven't had a flare up since I've gave up sugar and fruit, my mouth is still sore but bearable and doesn't interfere with eating and drinking. Off to google acidic mouth....

TheYamiOfYawn Fri 09-Aug-13 14:09:36

Am on my way back from a week being fed by in-laws, and I feel grim. Am writing a grocery shopping list on the train and if I get home in time to do grocery shopping will do a reset Whole30 starting tomorrow.

FavadiCacao Fri 09-Aug-13 15:17:44

Ultradex toothpaste and mouthwash (colour, flavour and alcohol free & PH neutral) are very good.

Well done, trucks smile

giraffeseatpineapples Fri 09-Aug-13 17:56:20

Yami, I will join you with whole 30 tomorrow (well at least whole 14, dp on hol end of month) I need boundaries!

Thanks wilding will check it out smile

BeingMoreDog - welcome!

Fav those ideas sound yum. Do you defrost frozen fish or just put it straight in oven?

giraffeseatpineapples Fri 09-Aug-13 22:45:35

OMG just watched the second cross fit link - safe to say no way i am doing that shock don't think I could even get onto a rope never mind climb up it....and as for flickflacks and hand stand push ups shock! I was not expecting that - 17 year old girl is like spiderman!

snowlie Sat 10-Aug-13 10:01:33

Brilliant Fava just got some. What is acidic mouth, have googled but it's a term that seems to be a applied to lots of conditions.

FavadiCacao Mon 12-Aug-13 10:49:33

Giraffe Depends on the fish. White fish is fine from frozen unless doing fish fingers; others take little time to defrost in cold water if already cut in portions.

snow It just means the PH in my mouth is acidic. smile It can go as low as 5 instead of the normal neutral of 7 or slightly alkaline. As far as I understand it, acidity promotes the not so nice bacteria in your mouth as well as corroding enamel (hence sensitivity). It also means I'm addicted to disclosing tablets and very careful with mouthwashes! grin

BeingMoreDog Mon 12-Aug-13 13:06:41

wow, I'm really enjoying this woe and so impressed at not feeling hungry or craving my normal mountains of pasta and cake. Only thing is, I don't really like meat, so not sure how long I'll maintain it for...

Started on fri evening and so far I've eaten (am only a beginner so don't be too harsh wink):

Fri: steak, sweet potato wedges, mushrooms cooked in double cream
Sat: asparagus and spring onion omelette, baked ham with sweet potato, broccoli and carrots
Sun: lunch disaster (stir fry at ILs with rice AND noodles, wtf [hmm?]. I managed to shovel lots onto DH's plate... Dinner leftover ham, beetroot, avocado, tomato, feta
Mon: more ham for lunch with tomatoes and feta, dinner will be ratatouille with pancetta chunks
And tomorrow's plan is salmon with veg for tea.

Breakfasts: natural yog with seeds and nuts, banana
Snacks: dark chocolate, one chocolate frog, carrot batons and guacamole
Drinks: coffee (don't like it with cream but only 2 a day max anyway), red wine, mint tea

Started shredding too - please tell me my post c-section tummy will shrink!

giraffeseatpineapples Mon 12-Aug-13 13:18:00

favadi thanks that's good to know. I have some skin on frozen salmon I need to cook - I guess best to defrost that.

My gums have become inflamed/ sensitive in recent years the hygenist has recommended those little plastic unterdental brushes but I don't get on with them. I found changing diet makes a bigger difference than using the sticks as sensitivity went away during my stint of whole 30.

What is everyone doing about suncream? I saw a thread on Mumsnet about advice you would give your younger self, and the main thing was to use suncream. I bought some lavera suncream but it is really oily so haven't been putting it on much. Seems like paleo forums are quite anti suncream and that diet can increase skins spf? We were at the park for a while and had picnic lunch sans suncream. Not too sunny and mainly in shade so seems to have been fine.

giraffeseatpineapples Mon 12-Aug-13 13:32:53

Being more dog great start, your food sounds yum. Not sure how it works with csection but i lost my tummy apron a couple of years ago through diet and excersise , unfortunately it needs a bit more work now after 3rd baby (who is 2 btw, hardly a baby) I gave my sister my shred dvd as she was hinting she wanted it - I might have to buy another copy, I have got quite a few of JMs other dvds but the workouts are too long - 20 minutes is perfect. I really find it hard to maintain excersise even though I know stacks of reasons why I should do it.

snowlie Mon 12-Aug-13 17:18:53

Bought a coconut at the weekend, it was easier to extract the meat than I imagined. I made a whole in the eye with a corkscrew and drained the juice, then i bashed the coconut with the blunt edge of a cooks knife but that didn't work, so I baked it in the oven for 10 mins - a few more bashes and the job was done.
Coconut juice was too sweet and irritated my mouth, but the flesh was delicious and it was so cheap and surprisingly filling - a great snack food if one were needed.

What's everyone feasting on at the moment, we had some friends around for dinner and I cooked Lamb Shawarma and served it with homemade pitta, I just had the lamb with salad, Harissa sauce and tahini sauce and didn't feel like I missed out. We finished with a selection of stinky cheese and some almond and rosemary crackers - which were very well received.

Itstartshere Tue 13-Aug-13 19:39:22

Argh, I'm struggling. Not sure where to go for advice really. I have M.E and I really crashed recently. It was because I was overdoing it, it happens a fair bit, but normally I pull out of them much quicker. For the last 4 weeks now I've been struggling hugely with my energy levels. I'm feeling a bit down about it all because I think my body just wants more carbs. I have been quite low, and I keep trying to eat a bit more sweet potato but it feels so unfair because I'm not seeing other people having this issue. I need to lose weight so if I eat too many carbs I won't do so. I had a friend to stay this weekend and I joined her in eating a bit of ice cream and some white potatoes. And I think it made me feel better. It's so hard to tell. I'm about to go on holiday but when I get back I might do another Whole30 just so I can see what's what, but just so scared I can't really low carb (and I know Paleo isn't technically low carb but I still want to keep my carbs low).

I think I'm eating enough, having enough fat etc. Will keep a food log for a bit so I can show people in a few weeks. I just want my energy to pick up! This is scaring me.

oohdaddypig Tue 13-Aug-13 20:21:19

Just a quick one... Itstarts - you might want to experiment with the carbs. Too low carb makes me feel very weak so I eat potatoes, white rice etc with fat eg butter or coconut oil. Some people can cope just fine with minimal carb but I'm not one of them. There is lots of interesting stuff online about it. Some previously strict paleos are introducing more carbs again....

I think sometimes we need to listen to our bodies. If your body is craving carbs it might be needing them to heal.

Sorry you are so tired. I had chronic fatigue after a virus years ago - I was lucky it didn't develop into full ME - and the fatigue is overwhelming. Maybe you are fighting a virus off just now? That can leave me feeling exhausted....

Giraffes - I don't wear too much sunscreen as I have naturally dark skin but I like the lavera stuff. Green people do a nice one too....

giraffeseatpineapples Tue 13-Aug-13 23:03:29

itstartshere I think I remember reading about dr wahls diet that things can get worse before they get better so maybe it is similar in the case of ME? Don't carry on feeling ill though, I would agree with oohdaddypig about listening to your body - maybe if you can keep just away from obvious grains and eat lots of veg? Whole 30 describe the white potato rule as 'somewhat arbitrary,' which suggests to me it is a bendable rule. Are you including any liver - I don't like it much but genuinely feel like it nourishes my body instantly and gives me energy blush sorry bit too over the top!

snowlie good tip to bake the coconut! We got a coconut for about 80p but struggled to get anything from it when we tried. Maybe I will try again. I have some nut milk bags because I have been intending to make coconut milk for ages but still not got round to it. I have finally got a spiraliser though - went for the lurch grin Was really surprised how nice beetroot is thinly sliced, oldest dd really liked it too. Btw do you cook courgette spaghetti or eat raw?

babylann Wed 14-Aug-13 09:16:52

Hi everyone smile Hope it's okay if I join. DP and I have been doing Paleo for about three weeks now. He's lost a stone and I've lost 5 lbs. The weight loss was definitely a factor for me (I've been feeling really uncomfortable in my skin lately, particularly around my stomach), but mostly we're interested in the lifestyle and health benefits.

We're really enjoying it so far, but it's been difficult from time to time, especially when we're feeling lazy. I've definitely realised just how much of my plate was stocked up with "fillers", and how it was stopping us from really focusing on making everything in front of us tasty.

That said, I might be growing tired of the taste of coconut... We have something coconutty at least once every 2 days. And I'm definitely fed up of eggs!

snowlie Wed 14-Aug-13 09:18:18

giraffe did you cook the beetroot? My dcs hate beetroot - or at least they didn't fall for lipstick soup - aka borscht and were not impressed with beetroot and goats cheese risotto....maybe time to reintroduce it through the spiraliser. As for the courgette, I think a quick fry in olive oil or butter is probably the most successful, you don't want to cook it too much as it turns to moosh but raw doesn't gel with the sauce properly. A quick blanch might work too.

Discovered a new food yesterday - dried sweet potato, it had 10% sugar added and it tasted like sweets, the kids loved it and it makes a healthy alternative to Haribos. Bought it my local Chinese supermarket.

snowlie Wed 14-Aug-13 09:33:28

Itstartshere if you are going very low carb, it is perfectly normal to feel quite poorly for a few days while your body adjust from burning carbs to burning fat, known as carb flu, your body is moving into ketosis...eating carby food during this time will solve the immediate problem, you will feel better but it will also bring you out of ketsosis, the state you wanted your body to be in. You can still lose weight without being in ketosis, it just might take that little bit longer. The posters on Biwi's bootcamp thread are more experienced on this than the Paleo folk, who don't aim to restrict carbs by quite so much.

Your ME no doubt complicates things and my knowledge on that is close to zero so I won't comment further other than to post an inspirational story of a fellow sufferer. I'm assuming Chronic Fatigue Syndrome and ME are the same thing, forgive me if I'm mistaken.

giraffe we try not to use sunscreen, unless it's a day where we're at serious risk and fresh white bits are showing - like at the beach. I use facial sunscreen cause I'm vain like that. Kids have never my judgement hasn't been too screwy....we're just soaking up that vit D. smile

Itstartshere Wed 14-Aug-13 11:37:06

Thank you everyone. Snowlie I'm on week 5 or 6 (can't think!) of eating Paleo so I'm not sure I should still have carb flu. I had it badly the first week, felt absolutely fine the second week, crashed my 3rd week (having massively overdone it) and just can't pull out of that crash however much I rest. I'm just very, very, very exhausted.

It makes me think my body can cope with being low carb if I'm on top of things, just not if I overdo it. I don't think I have a virus, but I could, and it might be that the sugar from the ice cream I've had in the last week is contributing to me feeling vile.

CFS is possibly different from M.E (different criteria) but pretty much the same thing, yes. Thank you for the link.

I really think experimenting with carb amounts is the way forward. I think white potatoes aren't necessarily harmful for most people. Will just stay away from grains. I will try and have some liver some time and I want to eat coconut oil more reliably too as some people find they feel better having a spoonful of it a day. When I crash this badly it always takes a good few weeks-months to come out of it so the plan is to take things very gently for a while and see what happens. I just love this woe already, I don't want to have to give up all the lovely fats!

Dried sweet potato sounds amazing. I just bought some ground almond and coconut flour so that if inspiration strikes I can do some baking. Saw an amazing recipe for sweet potato brownies that I must try sometime!

snowlie Wed 14-Aug-13 11:50:12

Itstarts it doesn't sound to me that you are eating low carb enough to go into ketosis for any period of time, so must be something else. I think it's suggested that people who have very high activity levels can tolerate white rice and maybe potatoes, I don't think it will be easy to lose weight if they are a regular feature in your diet.

And remember Paleo treats like the sweet potato brownies are better because they are more nutritionally dense than the regular kind but eating them will have the same effect on your waistline as the regular kind because they are still high in sugar and should only be eaten very occasionally.

RawCoconutMacaroon Wed 14-Aug-13 13:05:50

Potatoes- the thing to remember about them is they are a gut irritant to many people, although skinless ones, and baby new potato tend to be better tolerated.

I am one of those potato sensitives, and the major effect is overwhelming fatigue within a couple of hours of eating them, and muscle and joint pains a few hours after that, which last a couple of days. I also get the same with other nightshades such as chilli, sweet peppers and tomato but limited amounts are ok now and again.

I never would have realised that (and other food sensitivities), if I hadn't removed absolutely ALL grains, and starchy veg for a couple of months - with reintroductions of foods after that it was a lot easier to see which foods were causing problems. On a standard diet, I was so fatigued, pained and ill all the that it was difficult to point the finger at any individual food with much certainty, other than my obvious egg yolk allergy and the strong conviction that gluten grains were causing me more problems than anything else (which was true).

Unfortunately, after a period of "clean" eating, if you get a little lax and eat something that you react to, potato, gluten, whatever, you could get a much stronger reaction than before - the trick is to try and remember what you've eaten (or eaten a lot more of) in the 1-2 days before. There are an awful lot of people who never know gluten (for example) is making them ill until they stop eating it for a few weeks for something like "whole30".

White rice is regarded a quite benign, ie not actually good for you, potatoes less so, you need to be sure you are not reacting to them. Try this little experiment, eat a simple dinner with only a couple of ingredients - a large portion of potato, and some grilled chicken breast, maybe a few salad leaves with no dressing.
If you feel bloated/lead weight in your stomach, very sleepy after a couple of hours, joint or muscle pain within about 18 hours, then potatoes are not a good choice for you!

A useful indicator of which foods you may be allergic/intolerant to, are cheaply available (less than £50) online blood tests (easy to do, but several steps to follow). These test for antibodies for common food allergens.
I did one of these tests several week after starting grain free, paleo eating. I showed a strong antibody response to all of the grains including maize and rice, and potatoes, egg, and small reaction to pepper, cashews and shellfish... A reaction does not mean you should never eat that food again, but that you should remove and reintroduce after a few week to see what happens, and that maybe you can eat that food occasional but daily - it's trial and error.
I found the antibody tests to be a very useful pointer and tool for finding which things were making me feel bloody awful! I'd recommend one that's testing at least 50 common food reactions.

With paleo and primal woe, it is very important to remember that the adding back in of more carbohydrate to the diet is for AFTER weight loss and metabolic issues have been resolved, and in line with the activity levels of the individual. Eating too many now will slow weight loss but also slow any health gains you may get from eating this way.

After initial carb flu, lack of carbs should not make you feel fatigued, if you are eating plenty of fat and protein, I think it's more likely to be illness or a food reaction - but of course some people do better on a little bit more carb, some on less. It is likely that for most people, they should not be going over 50-70g carb per day for weight loss. Many are happiest at between 20-50g per day- which should give good weight loss but is not very very low carb.

giraffeseatpineapples Wed 14-Aug-13 19:02:26

Wow, interesting post Raw - I am guilty of relaxing before I have lost all the weight I need to. Food for thought smile

Snowlie yes beetroot was raw! They ended up with pink teeth. I put it on the plate but didn't really expect it to get eaten so was a surprise.

itstarts here I am guessing you probably take supplements to help with CF but there was some mention of magnesium earlier on the thread and that most people are deficient in magnesium. I have found it to be a really helpful supplement . I think chromiun is supposed to be good for controlling carb cravings.

goodasitgets Wed 14-Aug-13 20:20:04

I did some updated photos today. The top ones are just as I started paleo and exercise, the bottom two are from today smile

snowlie Wed 14-Aug-13 21:07:10

That's amazing Asgood well done!! How long has that taken?

goodasitgets Wed 14-Aug-13 21:18:02

I think that first photo was February this year. Intercepted with a few falls off the wagon and a hefty dose of sciatica

snowlie Thu 15-Aug-13 07:52:18

Interesting raw that you report a decrease in joint pain. It just occurred to me recently that I no longer feel joint pain in the morning going down the stairs - I blamed the pain on my running and age but the pain has stopped in the last few weeks and my running continues, I now wonder whether my aches were diet related, they disappeared when I went completely sugar/fruit free.

Asgood it's an amazing difference, very inspiring, you must be thrilled. I think cheats are to some extent inevitable, even need a break from rules occasionally but I have found the longer I do this the less I cheat because I have become very used to eating this way, so I don't miss the old foods as much and when I cheat my body reacts badly.

RawCoconutMacaroon Thu 15-Aug-13 13:12:58

My joint pain- worse in the hand and feet, was agony in the mornings, some days it would take ages to get out of bed as the pain on putting the feet on the floor (or moving the fingers to hold anything), was excruciating. Often at night I would wake with the pain burning in hands, feet, elbow and shoulders.

Looking back I can hardly believe how ill I was, how much discomfort every day (dozens of things, joint and muscle pain, migraine, headache, balance issues, rashes... The list goes on!). And yet, I accepted this as "normal"!!! Normal, getting older...

Now I get NONE of the above unless I eat something I shouldn't.

goodasitgets Thu 15-Aug-13 13:41:34

I'm noticing the difference now. Even though I haven't changed dress size or seen much weight change, my body shape is definitely changing

RawCoconutMacaroon Thu 15-Aug-13 15:27:30

Goodssitgets, wheatbelly disappearing? Or beer belly, carb belly, whatever you want to call it!

With lower carb (therefore generally lower, more stable blood sugar), the visceral fat (belly) starts to drop off... smile

Roger that.
Waist gone from 36 inches to 30 since starting this 9 July

smile smile

goodasitgets Thu 15-Aug-13 15:50:34

Yup carb belly grin


158 lb
Waist 36- 38 with bloat. Size 14 tight.
Daily food before:
B:Brown buttered toast with marmite and cheese
Ham and cheese sandwich for lunch
Snacks - Toddler food leftovers, more toast
Home made cookie a few times a week
Dinner - pasta and meat sauce/ meat and veg
No exercise regime

Skip breakfast til after Shred and swim
Coconut oil
Eggs or chicken and avocado salad late morning

Lunch: big salad or chicken drumsticks with greens

Dinner: fish or meat with green veg or salad

Now 144 lbs and waist 30 inches. Size 12 loose.

Oh yeah, used to drink 2 bottles beer every night [ face palm]

RawCoconutMacaroon Thu 15-Aug-13 20:36:25

Fantastic result Trucks! A large reduction in waist size relative to weight lose (I'm not in anyway minimising your success by saying that), and belly fat loss is a great marker for improved health.

I have no idea what my waist size was 26/28 jeans 6.5 stones ago, now a 12 (fairly tight), very hourglass rather than almost round blush

snowlie Thu 15-Aug-13 22:03:13

What a change trucks you must be feeling amazing!

Had a really lovely dinner tonight, just by using up the scraps in the fridge. I made a smoked chicken, chorizo and fresh tomato stew and served it with roasted carrots....and despite dd being in a slight sulk because she had requested curry, it was declared an all out winner.

Last nights went down well too - General Tso's chicken served with broccoli and rice(for the dcs). Our trip to the Chinese supermarket yielded some interesting dried sweet potato which just tasted like jelly sweets - only additive was 10% sugar - I can live with that! Dcs also currently obsessed with crystalised ginger.

Tomorrow night I will attempt another version of Paleo pizza this time it's made win Tapioca flour <rolls eyes> well you never know when you are going to hit upon a Friday night classic.

What's everyone else eating?

giraffeseatpineapples Fri 16-Aug-13 00:28:22

Have to agree on the joint thing, I don't get much knee pain now, also less achey when I get out of bed in the morning.

babylan welcome- missed your post before

Well done on inch loss trucks and goodas!

giraffeseatpineapples Sat 17-Aug-13 17:10:38

snow how did tapioca pizza go grin ? I have been looking for tapioca flour without luck, did you get yours online?

snowlie Sat 17-Aug-13 17:28:54

I didn't make it - too tired, had steak and chips instead - the real kind made with lard!

Bought primal girls magic dough recipe, cost $3.95 - I hope it's good for that price.....won't get to try it out for a few weeks as we have guests staying all week and then we're on hols. Don't like experimenting on fussy kids, would rather just feed them whatever it is they like and have their own parents educate their tastebuds.
Currently we have a child staying with us whose parents have brought his food - he's having crisps for lunch, sweets and chocolate for afternoon snack. Oreos and milk for dinner and a breakfast bar in the morning, I'm a bit shocked tbh, I knew he was fussy but that's shocking! So far he has eaten some cucumber and my homemade bread - the wheat kind! Not great but his parents were very pleased.

snowlie Sat 17-Aug-13 17:30:00

Tapioca flour can be bought at an Asian grocers, I got mine a while back online.

dementedma Sat 17-Aug-13 18:21:36

Only just heard about paleo and would like to give it a go if I can. I fail at diets because I hate being there a list somewhere for total beginners as to what one should and shouldn't eat on this programme?

Go look at Marks daily apple site for free shopping list and recipes smile I love that site. Ok he's selling vitamin supps but you don't have to buy and the newsletter is great, as is the Friday success stories

buildingmycorestrength Sat 17-Aug-13 20:21:12

Just back from two weeks in France. Had to try a bit of bread and croissants while there, and decided not to worry about it too much as I was on holiday.

BUT after two days I was actually visibly inflated round the middle, and sooo constipated with massive painful spots (sorry if TMI) that I had to revert back to avoiding wheat. It was a bit of a pain if we ate out but I felt better for it, and I could usually get a salad. I just made sure to have bananas and sweet potatoes back at the villa.

So. Not sure I'll bother again, but it is sometimes hard to believe it can have so much effect, so I might forget again. I found a hypnosis for helping to stick to a gluten-free diet at, but not sure if I need it.

buildingmycorestrength Sat 17-Aug-13 20:26:55

It starts I also have CFS. I followed advice on here about making sure I have enough carbs and it makes a big difference. I always have at least a banana and a sweet potato and some other fruit, as well as a bit of chocolate each day. My weight is admittedly dropping slowly but I'm okay with that as it definitely coming off. I have to try to maintain a minimal level of functioning so can't afford to do anything that takes me below that. HTH.

marzipananimal Sat 17-Aug-13 21:10:53

What do people think about cholesterol? My parents are thinking of trying low carb/paleo but my dad has had high cholesterol results, though he's not overweight or anything, and my mum is worried about him eating too much fat

giraffeseatpineapples Sun 18-Aug-13 02:18:18

building I think it would feel wrong to go to france and not taste croissants grin We are a bit wheaty at the mo and finding it hard to get back on track, I think you def made the right move in stopping when it was disagreeing with you even though you were on hol. Glad the weight is coming off and things are working

snow glad your your young guest had some cucumber. oreos bread and cucumber sounds like my dc's dream meal! Gluten free baking can be really stressful, time consuming and expensive - makes sense to wait. I had a disaster trying to make gluten free nann bread when we had children round - the whole meal suffered.

dementedma welcome - good description of paleo here

marzipanimal I think cholestrol is complicated some indicators might go up while others go down.

giraffeseatpineapples Wed 21-Aug-13 23:13:08

Oh no I killed the thread sad Hopefully everyone is off on hol and it will be resucitated soon!

I have started having coconut milk in my tea again but using a different brand (possibly creamier), anyway it seems to be giving me tummy ache but didn't before. Any ideas? On a brighter note I have discovered the yumminess of fried bananas sprinkled with mixed spice!