Week 6 - Low Carb Bootcamp - We're Past the Halfway Point!

(509 Posts)
BIWI Mon 17-Feb-14 06:47:17

Morning! In a rush, so not much time to post - off to Leeds today so have to go for my train.

Spreadsheet of Fabulousness

Weight Tracker

Talk later ...

Lighthousekeeping Mon 17-Feb-14 06:49:42

1.5llb down. Over the moon. Up north this weekend. Mother will surely be gobsmacked.

RatherBeOnThePiste Mon 17-Feb-14 06:54:28

<waves BIWI off like scene of Railway children>

MrsHughJarse Mon 17-Feb-14 06:56:20

Good morning team . Woke up early for a wee - so have managed to read the whole of the weekends ramblings .... Have had every minute occupied with DD x3 - work will be a rest !
Am a Tuesday weigher - but good luck all . Back at lunch time ....

RatherBeOnThePiste Mon 17-Feb-14 07:02:08

Morning. brew

I've weighed now. Another pound gone. Huzzah.

My aim for the week is to eat LC meals not just LC ingredients and to keep on keeping on.

Good luck all.

cardoon Mon 17-Feb-14 07:03:32

AAaaargh, the weight tracker shows a picture of a biscuit! hmm

PseudoBadger Mon 17-Feb-14 07:14:19

1.8 off this week so i'm now 12 stone exactly smile Well done everyone!

StuntNun Mon 17-Feb-14 07:29:07

One pound off thank you ubercamp. I think my appetite has decreased so I may be eating too much out of habit.

teaandthorazine Mon 17-Feb-14 07:32:18

Haha, wtf with the picture of the biscuit where the weight tracker should be?! MNHQ's idea of a joke, perchance?

Anyway, after my mini tantrum yesterday I am 152lbs or 10st 12. So, going down, just. My stomach is well flat, though!

StuntNun Mon 17-Feb-14 07:33:41
MrsMaryCooper Mon 17-Feb-14 07:35:18

Stayed the same. But I"m not doing it properly because I am away from home. Just building the habit, really.

DurhamDurham Mon 17-Feb-14 07:38:38

Stayed the same but ok with that as I am aware that my cheating on Valentines Day ( and I'd like other minor indiscretions to be taken into consideration) will have had an impact.
I have 5 lbs more that I would like to loose between now and the end of bootcamp, I will do it I will! grin

GermanGirlinLondon Mon 17-Feb-14 07:39:01

I am down 2lbs this week, 14.4lbs in total so just over a stone. Feeling very happy and looking forward to summer. I 'only' have to lose another 30lbs to lose until the middle-end of June.

Well done to everybody.

arselikekylie Mon 17-Feb-14 07:42:54

The whoosh fairy visited just in time for weigh in. Total loss 15lb.

Very pleased with myself.

sybilfaulty Mon 17-Feb-14 07:57:24

Only one word for me this week. Oink. Sorry everyone.

5 weeks left. I shall make them count. In a good way

Well done losers and manly back pats yo all who have STS or gone in the wrong direction.

BIWI Mon 17-Feb-14 08:10:05

Oh my goodness! Sorry about the biscuit ... grin

zgaze Mon 17-Feb-14 08:22:25

Wow 16.2lb down in total. This is momentous - it's the first time I've been under 11 stone since before I had children. A really good loss of 3.4lb this week which is fairly surprising given that I had battered fish and chips on the beach in Whitstable at the weekend and some wine on Valentines day. I've also discovered fat bombs this week which are delicious and I've probably been eating too much of (have been making them with butter, cream cheese, coconut oil, pure cacao and a tiny bit of sweetener). I do wonder whether I should up my carbs a bit given that I'm breastfeeding, haven't really been counting but I think I'm generally at bootcamp levels with the odd transgression.

sueh95 Mon 17-Feb-14 08:32:29

STS - oh bugger - was 2lbs down on Friday and I so wanted to be a loser today!!! Well I'm not giving up - so there!!! I am definitely going to be a loser next week smile

SayraT Mon 17-Feb-14 08:34:22

Well done zgaze that is fantastic.

I've not done very well this week, had some unavoidable carbs and some avoidable ones and have put on 3lbs. I have one occasion this week on Thursday which will involve unavoidable carbs again but apart from that I will be back on track from today.

B: Coffee with cream

Rest of today's meals not decided but I have large mushrooms, a courgette and a aubergine in the fridge and lots of eggs so sure I'll be able to think of something.

ElBombero Mon 17-Feb-14 08:37:53

Still the effin friggin bastard same.

Ubercamp started this morning, can't say my green tea is anything near as satisfying as my strong creamy coffee sad

MyPreciousRing Mon 17-Feb-14 08:42:32

Well done to all you losers!
I'm .06 up... Not to worry, it was expected.
Will keep at it.
TRASHCAN shall try your water routine see if that helps.
Happy LCing everybody

Bugsylugs Mon 17-Feb-14 08:44:01

Morning all 1lb down slow but steady. Message to self leave the cheese in the fridge.
Gentle reminder to everyone who struggles remember to include all food and drink that goes into our mouths so many forget the little snacks at the fridge door ie chunks of cheese etc.
hope everyone has a great week

ChesterDrawers Mon 17-Feb-14 09:05:47

Didn't WI this morning, so used my weight from yesterday as couldn't face another disappointment. So that's 2.5 on this week.

Seriously debating ditching the scales fro good - have done this in the past with some success, but it was also behind the gain of a stone since the summer when I resolutely buried my head in the sand and refused to get on the scales.

Sigh sad

Hardcore BC this week:

B: Scrambled eggs, butter
L: broccoli and stilton soup
S: BPC
D: salmon, celeriac chips, courgetti in butter

Plus at least three litres of water.

Pleaseandthankyou Mon 17-Feb-14 09:05:57

Fell so badly off the wagon this weekend I may have concussion. Decided not to weigh for a few days. I just could not resist the temptation in front of me. I don't want to lose a lot but a don't want to get on an upward staircase. My size 12 jeans are loose in the waist but well filled in the hips. The size 14s have been removed. I don't want to go there again. Bmi is in the normal range but only just. I am really doing this now for health reasons. I have a health issue and it will help to get my weight down . I'm enjoying life at the minute. I think I just need a vision of biwi's big stick

Lovecat Mon 17-Feb-14 09:12:27

0.7 of a lb off, which is jeffing miraculous in spite of me being the carbiest twat of carby twatdom this weekend. It started Friday, had a slight recovery Saturday, then fell off the wagon into a vat of wine, hula hoops and party rings at DD's 9th birthday party. I suspect as soon as I drink any water I will gain a stone...

morning

Seri77 Mon 17-Feb-14 09:36:24

0.2lb off this week but pleased it's downwards. Hope whoosh fairy is due to visit me soon as muffin top melting away.

Waist and largest measurement round thighs are the same for last 2 weeks but muffin top disappearing fast. Trousers that were tight before Christmas are now hanging down my hips. Yay for droopy crotch trousers!

Seri77 Mon 17-Feb-14 09:38:33

Oh and I haven't drunk nearly enough water this week which will have contributed to the tiny loss, won't it? Anyway, will aim for 4 litres today as I'm at home. 3.5 to go....

HumphreyCobbler Mon 17-Feb-14 09:53:52

Hello
started the day with a BPC and some smoked salmon. Also have come down with vile lurgy the children kindly shared with me. I think the baby also has it as I was up all night feeding him. ho hum

AmayaBuzzbee Mon 17-Feb-14 10:01:22

0.4lbs off, which I am very happy with as it is TOTM for me smile

I am only 5 lbs off target, so going slow is fine. I am feeling great as pre-babies clothes fit quite nicely already! Happy to just enjoy this way of eating now as I love all the food and do not miss the sugar/bread at all.

BIWI I did your Spanish chicken (with addition of chilli flakes) and chocolate pots (with addition of whipped cream with drop of vanilla essence on top) on Valentine's day. All I can say is WOW! Loved all of it! The chocolate pots were just perfect, I can't believe how nice they were with such simple ingredients and no sugar at all! Thank you for the recipes! thanks

BIWI Mon 17-Feb-14 10:10:29

My pleasure! Glad you enjoyed them

TossedSaladsAndScrambledEggs Mon 17-Feb-14 10:14:23

Hi all.

It was my first weigh-in today. I have lost 4.75lbs! I'm pleased with that, as whilst i tried to be good, i did have a few treats, like a glass or two of fizz and a low carb chocolate mousse on friday.

I am also vegetarian so i thought i might struggle to keep it low carb enough, and i have been eating lots of dairy. But so far so good! I hope it never gets to the point where i have to cut back on cheese! smile

teaandthorazine Mon 17-Feb-14 10:14:54

Sorry to be a total dooley but where is the recipe thread? My parents are coming round for dinner tonight and I want to do the famed berry crumble!

SteeleyeStan Mon 17-Feb-14 10:18:35

Morning all and well done losers! grin

I've STS again. Once again I know I was 2lb lighter earlier in the week, though. I think it's the wine and chocolate and probably too much cream too this weekend. It's DH's birthday today, but I think I'll have a look into ubercamping tomorrow.

thenightsky Mon 17-Feb-14 10:18:38

1lb down. Happy with that given I've had cava over the weekend and a tiny chocolate brownie made by DS last night.

teaandthorazine Mon 17-Feb-14 10:21:53

Don't worry, found crabby's blog - yay!

theQuibbler Mon 17-Feb-14 11:04:59

3lbs down. Which is good as I was feeling a bit disheartened, but yay for the whoosh fairy, even though I know it's just water retention from PM bloat

LittleMissDisorganized Mon 17-Feb-14 11:46:05

Just quickly as am whizzing out (ha, hobbling out) but with my weigh in day of Sunday, I have justifiably put a couple of lbs back on, given my off track meals whilst away. But after a trip or two to the toilet yesterday (TMI) I decided to reweigh this morning and the whoosh fairy has taken 4lb off yesterdays weight (and means I am 14 something which is a bit of a milestone). Am being good and putting yesterdays total as it would be embarrassing to not maintain the new weight this week.

I am going out for lunch, I got to choose the place so we are going somewhere that does awesome omelettes and americano with cream. grin My kind of lunch out!

Ambassadoryouarespoilingme Mon 17-Feb-14 11:55:53

only 0.5lbs off but its still off. I did go out on Sat to a Brazilian restaurant which was very carb friendly until I realised the salad was covered in a sweetish dressing, which was annoying.
I needed wine just to self medicate during the MIL visit so I felt in the circs 0.5lbs is fair enough. Aiming to up the weight loss now so going to be stricter.
Hope you are all having a good day.

Lovecat Mon 17-Feb-14 11:58:01

Does anybody remember I posted how very grumpy I was at the very end of wk 4? TOM had finished 3rd Feb, so I was all but certain that it couldn't be period related. Well, guess what happened yesterday...?hmm That's right, I am having a 21 day cycle, nine days of which were spent bleeding like something out of a slasher movie... <mutter mutter no fecking wonder I'm grumpy mutter mutter>

I've actually got a Drs appointment on Wednesday for an unrelated thing so I may ask about it then, as it's doing my head in. Really hoping he doesn't tell me it's my age and there's nowt to be done about it...

CrabbyWinterBottom Mon 17-Feb-14 12:15:01

Well done everyone on your losses. flowers

tea that's awful about your DS's dad letting him down like that. You must be raging! angry

Can't bring myself to step on the scales today as expecting a gain after the amount of wine consumed over the weekend. Also the food I made for Saturday and also hoovered up leftovers of yesterday is not bootcamp light. When I fried the rest of the vegetable crisps on Sunday they tasted too sweet (beetroot and carrot) and the salad was lovely but also very sweet (roasted butternut squash, oven dried tomatoes and pomegranate seeds).

God I could murder a bowl of pasta with pesto right now. sad

Suzymoo9 Mon 17-Feb-14 12:16:40

Lovecat have you heard about tranexamic acid tablets (not as bad as they sound)? I take them during tom and they have transformed my life - ask your doc. good luck.

Lovecat Mon 17-Feb-14 12:49:00

I haven't, Suzymoo, but thanks for the tip, I will definitely ask about them.

Piscivorus Mon 17-Feb-14 12:57:29

Lovecat I am 53 so periods are very hit and miss but I have had very unexpected ones usually a month or two after start low carbing. So I've gone for months, think Woohoo this is it! Never again!, start a bootcamp then 4-5 weeks in its like the Texas Chainsaw Massacre. I put it down to oestrogen coming out of fat cells or something technical...

I thought I had STS this week which is a bit of a bummer but one of those things then I looked at the spreadsheet and realised that, on my weighing day last week I was up from the day before and what I'd hoped for. That means I am down 3 this week and a total of 12 this bootcamp. Yippee! By coincidence it is exactly 3 1/2stone down from my first start weight and is the lowest I have been for years (still at least 5 stone to go but a good start!)

daisychicken Mon 17-Feb-14 13:09:09

Elbom mousse recipe is:

Pack of sf jelly - I use Hartley's, it's a double pack and I use both sachets
Cream cheese
1 pint boiling water

Dissolve the jelly in 1 pint of water
Soften the cream cheese in a bowl and then pour on the jelly liquid and stir/whisk till combined
Pour into containers and leave to set

I use poundland baby food square containers and fill them about 1/2 way and I get 14 pots. I've found that you only need a little to make it feel like a treat. It works out at 7.1g carbs for the whole lot so when divided into tiny portions, it's really low. You can also serve with cream - whipped or runny and/or with a few berries.

I got the recipe from a low carb forum years ago and it was a very popular recipe!

SnowieBear Mon 17-Feb-14 13:10:43

Well done to all you losers!

Now... tell me what I am doing wrong, please!

I had a lovely 3lbs whoosh on the Sat before last week's weigh in. By Monday, it was only 1lb. Tried this Sat, stayed the same. Tried today for the tracker - 1lb up!

I have been good! Had all my water, eschewed all carbiness from my life. I even had two days last week when I had to eat out and managed to do so LC.

Happy about all the health benefits, but I really, really would like to lose a bit more before the Easter holidays as I will be in Spain with family and a) want to look good; b) strict LC may be difficult to sustain.

Is it a question of "keep on keeping on"? I'm on week 7, I started one week before most of you.

ChesterDrawers Mon 17-Feb-14 13:28:19

Anyone combined fasting with LC? I know Briffa mentions it and I wondered if it might be worth a try to get things moving.

I've done 5:2 in the past but always end up bingeing on crap on my off days. I wonder if that will be better now I am (hopefully) fat adapted?

Thoughts anyone? Am tempted to give it a go tomorrow.

SteeleyeStan Mon 17-Feb-14 13:54:06

Didn't Dr Briffa recommend things like skipping breakfast, if you're not hungry in the morning, and thereby extending your nighttime fast? That sounds very valid to me, but I think you have a form of 5:2 causing binge eating, anything similar would be a bad idea.

SteeleyeStan Mon 17-Feb-14 13:54:37

^^ if you have form...

i think a lot of people doing 5:2 tend towards low carb anyway because it keeps blood sugar levels on an even keel and means that fast days are easier. so combining the two is not unnatural.

that said, i have a history of eating disorders and won't go near it - just hearing about people feeling high/elated on their fast days triggers urges for me so i have to hide the threads on here. so as steeleyestan says be very careful with it if you have a tendency towards disordered eating.

as i have been low carbing for a long time i do sometimes miss meals or eat at different times if i'm just not hungry - e.g. at weekends i often eat a late breakfast and then don't need anything until the evening. but it is not good for me to intentionally fast iyswim. so maybe as steeleyestan suggests re briffa think about skipping a meal if you don't feel ready for food anyway?

Ilisten2thesoundofdrums Mon 17-Feb-14 14:03:41

Typed loads and lost the message, so just marking my place now.
1lb off this week - which is fab considering my descent into chocolate last night blush.
So feeling v tired today as I get back into strict low carb mode again.

Havent weighed today as I have a sickness bug.
Its horrid, havent kept anything down since 6am, excepta packet of caramel snack a jacks <carby twat>.

Can I be let off though, as its all I could managed, and a pack is 25g carbs so I will just make the rest of the day water and meat.

God I feel like shite nothing to do with the bottle of wine in the pub last night

Well done everybody on your losses x

teaandthorazine Mon 17-Feb-14 15:07:30

chester, I've combined LC with fasting in the past, though not a specific 5:2 program, more like, as steeleye says, just extending not-eating-breakfast until lunchtime or later! It means that I quite frequently have a 15-16 hour window (sometimes more) of not eating and as long as I'm fat-burning it's no problem at all. I couldn't do it if I wasn't LCing though, would be hell imo.

Personally, I think the 'eat whatever you want on your non fast days' aspect of 5:2 would spell disaster for me. I prefer an 'eating window' approach because it helps me tune into whether I am genuinely hungry or not. If I am, I eat. If I'm not, I don't!

Thanks crabby re ds's dad - sadly we're used to it angry.

QueenofallIsee Mon 17-Feb-14 15:58:21

Haven't updated the spreadsheet yet, am on my phone but after my little gain last week I am delighted! I wooshed at last! 6lbs off!

prettybird Mon 17-Feb-14 16:25:39

1lb off for me which. given the amount of alcohol I drank on Vanetine's Day and Saturday blush I treated myslelf on Valentine's Day and the next day (lunch out on Friday and then the M&S £20 meal deal on Saturday) wink, I'm actually pretty happy with smile

Plus last night we had supper at my dad's which involved a roast potato and some apple charlotte. grin

.....drank lots of water yesterday (and today).

Thumbwitch Mon 17-Feb-14 16:39:59

Oops, same as last week. Which is totally unsurprising to me as I have eaten chocolate 4 nights in a row now blush. Been good in everything else except STILL not drinking enough water; but avoiding all other carbs as much as possible. Just the chocolate got the better of me sad
Is also TOTM - started today - so that could be another excuse reason.

Once again - tomorrow is another day, this is the start of another week, the Tassie cherries are nearly all gone and DS2 is doing a sterling job of getting through them as well, so I'll be back to doing proper bootcamp again I think when they're finished. Am determined to drop below 12st, and am currently stuck on it!

I am pleased to note that my "love handles" hmm have definitely reduced though, my waistbands are looser, and my muffining has gone down considerably. Hurrah!

Congratulations to all losers, commiserations to all cheaters - we'll get through!

SarahBeenysBumblingApprentice Mon 17-Feb-14 16:54:27

Hi everyone.

I'm up a pound, which I didn't ought to be cross with given the amount of chocolate consumed on the 14. But actually I am a bit annoyed because I weighed less yesterday and that was after 500ml of coffee! Hmmpphh.

thanks to everyone starting ubercamp.

chester 5:2 just make me hungry all the flaming time and stopped me exercising as I was knackered all the time with it. I've no idea if it might be better on LC as there's less blood sugar fluctuation. What about doing 16:8, which I think is a clever way of saying skip breakfast and don't eatl ate at night grin?

Notsoskinnyminny Mon 17-Feb-14 17:10:57

Gutted, STS and I didn't have any wine all weekend as its half term and I've got a couple of lunches planned and DHs birthday and I've come on, very heavy, even though I've been on HRT for 2 months so trying to decide what's worse flooding or night sweats. I've tried tranxemic acid, which does stop the bleeding, but the cramps were horrendous sad I wish I was a man.

anyway this is what I've has since friday, I'm not hungry and if I wasn't cooking for DH could easily miss dinner, I'm adding butter to everything and went through 1lb of lurpak last week, any suggestions?

B - BPC
L - leftover chicken breast in creamy sauce (about 100g) and buttered cabbage, 100g ff yog
S - BPC
D - 100g sirloin steak, portabello mushroom stuffed with cream cheese, cheddar, more buttered cabbage
S - square 85% chocolate
W - 3l

Sat
B - cheese topped bacon & fried egg
L - not hungry
S - BPC, 100g ff yog & extra thick dc
D - lamb shank, roasted broccoli
w 3l

Sun
B - BPC
L - egg in a cup, ff yog
S - buttered ham rolls
D - pork carnitas, celeriac chips, fried mushrooms
S - square of 85% chocolate
W - 3l

Today
B - BPC
L - scrambled eggs with butter and cheese
S - BPC
D - salmon, asparagus and celeriac chips
W - 2l so far.

spookySwitched Mon 17-Feb-14 17:19:05

Another week of sts here too sad which is probaby due to the fact i got a huge box of Thorntons chocolates for valentines day. They weren't even that bloody nice, I just felt I had to look appreciative of them.

CrabbyWinterBottom Mon 17-Feb-14 17:32:24

notsoskinnyminny your meals look fine, the STS is almost certainly your period. i'm sorry it's so ghastly thanks

interesting crabby, thanks

that phrase used by the sugar industry '...as part of a balanced diet' is so non-specific isn't it? it's the same as 'everything in moderation'. well it really depends on your idea of the balance and what moderation is. MIL comes out with the 'moderation' thing as a thinly veiled criticism of my WOE, but she eat four biscuits with her tea at 6am before she has breakfast an hour later! my idea of sugar in 'moderation' is a handful of times a year. the balance of macronutrients that works for me is a relatively small amount of carbs derived from non-starchy veg, a moderate amount of protein and a good proportion of fat.

Lavenderhoney Mon 17-Feb-14 17:50:55

Still lurkingsmile am keeping to my weight of just under 9 stone which is me pre dc and pre dh weightsmile

Its amazingsmile

Thanks to BIWI and well done all the loserssmile

EwanHoozami Mon 17-Feb-14 17:51:23

2lb up here. but considering I was 4lb up in the middle of last week shock and have since consumed a heroic amount of mojitos, it's not all bad blush

As a long term LC'er returning to strictness after a couple of months of being slack I know that I'm not likely to get any whooshes and as I've not much to lose I'm not concerned.

Notsoskinnyminny Your meal plans look fine, were you LCing when you got your last period and did it affect your loss then?

today:

B - spinach and ham omelette
L - avocado and tinned sardines in mayo
D - A bloody lovely looking bresaola and feta salad which I MUST stop picking at before I put the DCs to bed...
S - a bit of lidl yog and some leftover roast broccoli (not together)

did you make the bresaola ewan? i've always wanted to do that

AthelstaneTheUnready Mon 17-Feb-14 18:13:17

Evening. Not read the thread, sorry... blush just reporting a 2lb loss that I attribute to drinking ALL my water, and not eating ALL the cheese. Will catch up in a bit.

Notsoskinnyminny Mon 17-Feb-14 18:18:42

Thanks Willie and Ewan, I am losing inches (9 so far) so aren't planning to jack it all in but would like to see some movement on the scales. Last time I lc'd properly my start weight was lower than this time and I'd lost 10lbs by this stage but not as many inches confused

My last period was in October and before that August but I wasn't lc'ing then. I started HRT at xmas to stop the night sweats as I hadn't slept for over 6 weeks and DH was threatening to move to the spare room as he was fed up waking up in a soaking wet bed at 2am.

notsoskinnyminny this may be no help at all but my mum is a gp and she recommends LC to her patients at various stages of the menopause, so hopefully it will help in some way for you too as well as the HRT. fingers crossed it all settles down soon

also pain (cramps) and lack of sleep can reduce the amount of weight you lose because they are stressful for the body. that could well account for the lack of lb, but if the inches are going down that's a really positive thing.

SarahBeenysBumblingApprentice Mon 17-Feb-14 18:54:53

Crabby really enjoyed that article, thanks!

Off spinning again in a bit. I blame spinning for my lb upwards; it's muscle and water wink

Today:
B: 2 eggs, butter, cheese
L: sardine salad which had red pepper in due to online cock up, mascarpone and vanilla
D: 2 pork belly slices, leeks and kale in Philly and cream.
S: 2 coffees with cream
Will probably have a BPC after spinning

Haven't properly read the thread, will check in later, hiya everybody, I am fucking ecstatic FOUR POUNDS DOWN it's a bloody miracle except it's fucking not because I have really had to work at it, what with the no dairy and the reduced veg and the fat eating, oh and did I mention the five bastard litres of bastard water a bastard day phew. off to walk the trash hounds, back soon grin

GatoradeMeBitch Mon 17-Feb-14 20:27:38

Bad night last night due to TOTM cramps. I only got a couple of hours sleep, and then I fell into a packet of chocolate digestives at lunchtime. They weren't even as nice as I thought they would be. But I just kept feeding them in and went through half the packet. And now I want more sugar.

75% of the problem is a bad TOTM this month, and the other 25% is that I'm away and my usual routines and resources aren't there.

I feel miserable. I don't know if I should write this week off and start again next week when I'm home. I'll try not to eat through a skipfull of crap, but at this moment none of my BC favourites seem appealing sad

GatoradeMeBitch Mon 17-Feb-14 20:30:20

Oh, and I did still have a loss this week. I feel rotten because I know some people have struggled with this WOE, and (maybe because of my size) I've lost over 2lbs every week. So I know it does work for me. And I was fine last TOTM. I don't know what has gone wrong at the moment.

BIWI Mon 17-Feb-14 20:46:21

Gatorade get back on the wagon now! If you write this week off you will end up eating a huge amount of carbs and will really undo all the good you have done so far. Whereas if you get back on the wagon now, drink lots of water and are super strict for the next day or so, the damage will be minimal

Don't let the carbs win!

Lookslikerain Mon 17-Feb-14 20:55:28

Hello again. I couldn't keep up with the thread last week and had DS home as it was half term here. The DC really eat into MN time, don't they? wink

I forgot to weigh today so that joy can wait until the morning. I didn't fall off the wagon but have come to some realisations:
- even tiny amounts of wine give me a headache when LCing
- supermarkets need to start selling butter in bigger blocks. 250g is just way too small. I'm thinking at least half a kilo per block.
- I really don't think chocolate agrees with me (have thought this for a while but it seems clearer now there's no crap in my diet)
- ate a half slice of homemade malt loaf (I know, I know) and had really bad indigestion/upset tummy. Wondering if it was the wheat?

Could it be that foods that I've always eaten, and thought agreed with me, actually don't but now I'm noticing because I've been "clean" for 5 weeks?

Lighthousekeeping Mon 17-Feb-14 21:04:55

I've had two periods since we started BC. What's all that about?

TossedSaladsAndScrambledEggs Mon 17-Feb-14 21:18:06

Looks like - in farmfoods they are selling 1lb blocks of butter for £2...

DurhamDurham Mon 17-Feb-14 21:38:40

Oooh BIWI I love it when you are being all strict and discipliney!! gringrin

goodasitgets Mon 17-Feb-14 21:48:42

Someone posted about making cauli cheese with Boursin.. Help?! I've never made normal cauli cheese so if anyone has a good recipe? grin

GatoradeMeBitch Mon 17-Feb-14 22:00:20

Yes you're right BIWI! I found a place that sells Total, so yogurt for breakfast and loads of water! Thanks

goodasitgets Mon 17-Feb-14 22:09:16

I made a meatball thing which might be good (could be too carby)
Made with reduced price steak meatballs! I baked them in the oven, then made a tomato/garlic type sauce with wilted spinach and goats cheese stirred in

EvaTheOptimist Mon 17-Feb-14 22:32:58

Snowie I don't know why you've slightly gained... do you want to list out your meals in time-honoured fashion?

I've been away for long weekend so weigh in for me tomorrow.

Big family occasion involved me getting some hostile comments about this WOE, which I wasn't quite expecting but I should have known, should have been on my guard. My immediate response was to just clam up, think I'm just not going to say anything and then this will be over as quickly as possible. Then I spent the next day being cross at myself for not sticking up for myself. On the other hand, least said soonest mended and all my rellys go away smugly thinking they're right? what do I care you can tell I'm really over this can't you

Especially as 24 hours later I had all the answers that I wished I'd said, pat and ready. Instead of tackling any individual point, I should have just said "This way of eating is not dangerous or unhealthy". Gaahhhhh

I AM over it - reading all your news since last Saturday has helped.

B - scrambled egg and mushrooms
L - salade nicoise (took the potatoes out) and grilled artichokes in oil, both from Waitrose at a service station, plus mayonnaise sachets.
D - leeks, mushrooms and boursin; with salad
S - small amount nuts and cheese

BillyJoel Mon 17-Feb-14 22:40:02

2 pounds off for me! My goal of moving from obese to just merely happily overweight is getting closer and looking achievable.
I am deeeelighted.....

congratulations zgaze that's awesome grin

<<strokes *elbomberos head>>

feeling for you lovecat and all others with TOTM issues - mine were so heavy, I used to have to take a towel with me whenever I went out to sit on, because it just got embarrasing/annoying when bleeding on friends sofas. I am delighted that at the tender age of 36 I haven't had a period in three years, and won't ever again grin (hysterectomy due to cc)

eve am so angry on your behalf. Family are such entitled bastards when they get going. I actually think clamming up is the best thing to do. Your health and vitality will speak for themselves over the years [smug emoticon]

hi five billy grin grin

todays grub

B - Bacon and scrambled eggs

L - three slices of cornbeef and some olives

D - beef and baby spinach

4 litres water 2x herb tea with coconut oil

thekitchenfairy Tue 18-Feb-14 05:51:01

Hello everyone! Will try harder to keep up with thread this week!

Last year the Feb month of birthdays, celebrations and wet half term at home threw me seriously off track. I am NOT doing that this year!! I have had no cake in fact surprised could not face it, but I have had wine and the odd accidental croissant -- DH purchase as I am 'always saying but high fat is good' confused and chugging the water and eating masses of green veg.

I have a milestone birthday this weekend and there will be all kind of wine indulgences, but the menu is lo carb and I am having a giant cheese tower instead of cake!

For the first time in 8 yrs I do not look 4 months pregnant and aside from menstrual flood hell I feel fab. Inches gone not lbs, so keeping on keeping on.

Made the most fab recipe...quick and even DCs loved it

Roast green beans in oil with a couple of cherry toms and olives for 30 mins
Top with grilled halloumi
Serve with leftover belly pork... Delicious!

thekitchenfairy Tue 18-Feb-14 05:52:29

Before the big stick comes out grin the beans are a bit carby but broccoli also works... As do a few pine nuts added in right at the end!

MrsHughJarse Tue 18-Feb-14 07:03:00

Sts this week . It might be my new gym going like willie said . I haven't cheated at all - and have cut down on cream . I am 5'10 and 11st 7 , so I think am a stone off goal although that goal was dictated by weightwatchers 20 years ago haven't been at 'goal ' since then
biwi any wise words about whether my goal is realistic ?

MrsHughJarse Tue 18-Feb-14 07:06:08

<waves to cider, a coffee in RL would be fab >

SarahBeenysBumblingApprentice Tue 18-Feb-14 07:47:01

Morning everyone!

Hope everyone has a good day.

SayraT Tue 18-Feb-14 08:02:52

I am back on track properly today. One of your visiting professors left yesterday to head back to Brazil. He has been with us for a year now and we are all going to miss him. We had cake yesterday for him and I had a bit, I enjoyed eating it but I didn't enjoy after. I have discovered, through my cheating ways, that:

Chocolate gives me a sore head
Cake gives me indigestion
Bread gives me indigestion (this one one of my unavoidable carbs)

I am happy to never eat them again now this is probably similar to saying "I'm never drinking again" so please don't remind me I said this grin

Last night dinner was giant mushrooms chopped and fried in butter and garlic with cream then ground almonds, linseeds and cheese on top and under the grill.

Today

B: Coffee with cream
L: Roasted veg (aubergine, courgette, tomato and shallots) with feta cheese
S: FF yoghurt
D: Sausages with left over roasted veg from lunch

mrshughjarse i think you're now within the range of 'healthy' weight? so that last stone might take longer to shift than before. that may account for the STS this week as well as the exercise. your 'goal' weight sounds realistic in terms of numbers, but obviously only you know your body type/shape/frame etc.

just make sure you don't get too fixated on the number on the scales though - your body doesn't care about that and it might decide it prefers a few lb heavier, especially if the 10st 7 was from 20 years ago and your physique may well have changed in that time. if you do find that you're having to really restrict your eating in an unsustainable way to reach the 'magic number' then it might be a better idea to look at toning/shaping exercises (and it sounds like you're doing that anyway) and thinking about how your clothes fit instead

teaandthorazine Tue 18-Feb-14 08:20:38

Morning losers!

Sorry to hear you had a hard time from you order family Eva. There is SO much misinformation out there about low carb eating, and people just take in in unthinkingly. My parents came round for dinner last night so I cooked spicy chicken thighs in white wine and thyme with lots of whole garlic cloves to squash into the 'sauce', with roasted broccoli/peppers/courgettes, followed by the famed berry crumble. I mixed cranberry and blueberry linseeds into the almond topping. My mum loved the crumble, my dad (king of stodgy puddings) was slightly less enamoured and suggested that a good sprinkling of Demerara sugar on top would've sorted it grin.

They are both overweight, my dad's on statins, my mum has long-term health issues including severe anxiety and depression - they both eat pretty badly with loads of sugar and white carbs. Lots of puddings, very little veg, 'low-fat spread' (Drs orders). When my mum is going through a bad spell she survives on cigarettes, tea and white toast. When she's feeling better you can tell because she takes more interest in food - unfortunately that means buying tins of ambrosia rice pudding and layering the jam on top! I would LOVE to get them eating better, and we've talked about low carb a lot, but they are set in their ways and will never change.

All we can do is show how this WOE benefits us, and let others make their own choices I guess. But it's tough when people you love insist on eating shite, and you can see it reflecting in their bodies and minds...

MyPreciousRing Tue 18-Feb-14 08:31:06

Looks like my shout of shit didn't post again...
Lost the .6 I had put on so back to 137 again.
Think I've ended up 'maintaining' rather than losing weight now.
Will cut out the prosecco completely until the end of bootcamp and see if can shift a few more pounds.
Have lost over 12 since the start which is great but I've still over a stone to shift so unhappy to keep gaining and losing the same three pounds over and over.
Happy LCing everybody

GrumpyCrossPatch Tue 18-Feb-14 08:48:54

I had a really busy week work wise last week and haven't kept up with the thread very well. Have skim read some of it on and off and wanted to echo all the good thoughts and wishes to Helium if she's around.

I have lost a pound this week which is fine as I have had a week of carby twatdom. Sushi takeaway on Friday, small slice of cake for a colleague's birthday on Saturday (work was so mental it was the only thing I ate in 13 hours!) and bread and butter pudding made with brioche on Sunday. It's the first time I have really gone of piste in a major way and I enjoyed the food but want to get back on track. Going to run hard today to help get rid of the glycogen!

MrsHughJarse your target sounds sensible and I was aiming to get to my pre-DC weight too. However, as we've gone on I've realised that Willie is right and that I seem to weigh considerably more even as I shrink. I've adjusted my goal to pre-DC size now as that seems more realistic.

i find that with this WOE i look much better at a given weight than i did when i was the same weight but eating carbs. because i don't feel/look bloated, my face isn't puffy (i literally seem to swell up when i eat more than a small amount of carbs), i feel lighter and more energetic, which shows physically too, and my skin looks better

LittleMissDisorganized Tue 18-Feb-14 10:12:54

Hi everyone,
Sayra I do think that your GP should know about your heartburn...
and Eva I'm so sorry you went through that. I'm meeting a friend this afternoon with her little boy who even by text was very negative whilst arranging it. It probably doesn't help that I was already feeling hurt as I heard nothing from her all through my convalescence. I'm now thinking WHY did I mention it - it was just to be honest about not meeting for lunch tbh, rather than making excuses. I got a series of fairly aggressive texts and I just stopped answering in the end, texts, is a ridiculous way of talking about anything. I haven't slept very well, with it on my mind, and I'm dreading it...
Sigh. tea your post was really helpful too. You could be describing close relatives of mine.
What was mentioned a couple of weeks back (I think it was trashcan "under fire" then...) about how when we (I) take control of our food issues it threatens others, because of their own.
Anyway, need to get moving. Will check back in later on.

CrabbyWinterBottom Tue 18-Feb-14 10:28:28

1lb on this week, which is unsurprising, especially as yesterday I had that bowl of pasta pesto I was craving, and then had beef stroganoff with rice in the evening. And chocolate. hmm

It's all gone a bit wrong. sad

PseudoBadger Tue 18-Feb-14 10:34:50

Don't worry Crabby! Oops my phone thinks we should call you Carby grin <smacks phone>
Today is a new day, don't give up flowers

GatoradeMeBitch Tue 18-Feb-14 10:39:54

I've woken up with a headache. The damage yesterday was about half a packet of chocolate digestives, then I started on a tub of caramel icecream. The thing was - and I'm genuinely not trying to convince myself - neither was satisfying. The biscuits tasted greasy, and the icecream was sickly.

I'm going to make another berry crumble today, to mop up the last of my sweet cravings, but I am happily back on the wagon smile

HumphreyCobbler Tue 18-Feb-14 11:11:35

MrsHughJarse, I always retain water massively at the beginning of exercising.

I have come down with the terribly vile virus the dc have been suffering from. How kind of them to share.

Still, have stayed on the straight and narrow, measured my thighs again and have now lost three inches. Hurrah. My stomach has stayed the same but it is more squishy, I can fold it into my jeans really easily (tmi). Does this mean I have lost some visceral fat do you think?

HumphreyCobbler Tue 18-Feb-14 11:13:04

forgot to say I listened to my self hypnosis cd by Paul McKenna. I find it really helpful to stop the emotional eating/self loathing combo that is so damaging to eating well. I also like the visualisation exercises, they are great.

EvaTheOptimist Tue 18-Feb-14 12:59:14

Thanks Trashcan and LittleMiss and Tea. Sorry to hear about your parents. I think I felt similar in that almost everyone sitting round the table was overweight - so of course I feel that if they ate like this it would really help. But I have to realise that that is nothing to do with me, I can't influence it. (Would be nice if they all realised similarly... instead of everyone there having an opinion on what I eat!). What I do now realise is that my mum IS worried and this IS something we can and should talk about. Surely I can allay her worries if we talk sensibly. (Ha!)

LittleMiss really good luck with your friend this afternoon. Its stressful being on the defensive.

MrsHugh at 5 ft 10 and 11 stone 7 you are already in normal BMI range - well done! BMI of 23 according to NHS online BMI calculator. That says a healthy weight range for your height is 9 stone 3 to 12 stone 7. I'd say your "target weight" is now rather down to you - whether you have a large or small frame; if you feel comfortable, how do your clothes fit; how Hugh you'd like your Jarse to be?! I believe this WOE won't allow you to go underweight as such.

Crabby at just 1lb on with all the treats etc, I think you have lucked in, surely! Sounds like you might be triggering your carb cravings though, letting that Wild Elephant out. Time to quote your own advice to you, can you plan your favourite meals so you have something to look forward to? Also, look after yourself, take care.

SnowieBear Tue 18-Feb-14 13:22:42

Hi Eva, sorry about your experience, and thanks for answering my post, I felt I was SMSing in the dark...

Chanced the scales today, don't ask me what prompted me... 2lbs down from yesterday, I give up trying to understand what's going on with my body!

Food intake yesterday is fairly representative of a normal day:

B - coffee with a dash of cream, ramekin-sized bowl of Total, cream and a sprinkle of milled linseed for texture.

L - green salad (lettuce & cucumber) with some feta cubes, ham and olives, dressed with homemade dijon/olive oil/white vinegar dressing.

D - steak and asparagus cooked in butter, with a homemade mushroom sauce made up with even more butter, dijon mustard and a splash of cream.

3.5lts of water yesterday, umpteen cups of black coffee during the day, 1 flute of low-alcohol fizz.

I'm 5ft 8in and I currently stand at 10st 6lbs. My sensible target for my age is 9st 6lbs, my not very sensible but feel great with it is 9st all. So far this BC I've lost 9lbs in 7 weeks without straying. Am I wrong to feel a bit sorry for myself today?

Sorry about the mega-whinge, but if not with you lot who understand, who with? sad

HumphreyCobbler Tue 18-Feb-14 13:31:14

SnowyBear, you are already in a healthy bmi range at your current weight. I know it can feel hard not to lose a bit quicker, but my experience is that the closer you are to your target the less likely you are to be seeing more than a pound a week loss.

hang on in there. 9lbs is a good loss.

BIWI Tue 18-Feb-14 13:32:18

But that's still 9lbs ...

Are you enjoying your food?
Do you feel deprived?
Do you feel like you're on a diet?

SnowieBear Tue 18-Feb-14 13:35:04

Thanks, Humphrey, I know I am whingeing, but cannot really stop myself today. Healthy BMI on the one hand, feeling flabby on the other... I don't think I'd feel under so much pressure if I weren't nipping off to Spain for Easter. At least I won't have to go to the beach or the pool... that form of torture is awaiting me this summer. Pleeenty of time to get rid off a stone <hopeful emoticon>.

SnowieBear Tue 18-Feb-14 13:35:58

BIWI:

Yes
No
No

Shall I shut up now? I am an idiot.

HumphreyCobbler Tue 18-Feb-14 13:37:18

I am going to focus on what I want to feel like in four weeks if I stick to bootcamp, as opposed to what I will feel like if I don't. The first way I will feel well, be thinner and feel focused. The second way I will have descended into binge eating sugar. Because that seems to be my only other option..

BIWI Tue 18-Feb-14 13:39:29

This is what albs of fat looks like. You have lost almost double this!

BIWI Tue 18-Feb-14 13:40:05

albs?! 9lbs, obviously!

HumphreyCobbler Tue 18-Feb-14 13:40:37

as far as feeling flabby goes, I am going to start shred again as soon as this illness departs.

I have had to take co-codomol so I know I will be retaining water.

BIWI Tue 18-Feb-14 13:41:29

And it's another 8 or so weeks until Easter, so every opportunity to lose a sizeable amount more by your holiday.

flowers

snowiebear do you exercise? it may be that you need to look at strength/fitness/toning rather than weight if you feel you are still 'flabby' at a healthy weight? that said, i don't know your frame. at 9lb down over seven weeks that is a sustainable loss given that you can't have been very overweight at all to start with. just keep on keeping on, because it's clearly working even if not at the speed you would ideally like, and because as others have said, what is the alternative?

x-post with humph there

HumphreyCobbler Tue 18-Feb-14 13:47:49

do you know, when I first did shred I dropped a skirt size in six days? It can make a massive difference v quickly. You have time to do the whole 30 days before easter!

I will commit to do it too if you fancy a shred buddy?

EvaTheOptimist Tue 18-Feb-14 14:11:59

Snowie I think your food looks great, as long as you're not hungry (breakfast and lunch could be a bit light but if they satisfy your appetite then that is the thing to go by). If you consider 1lb a week loss to be a normal rate of weight loss, your 9lbs is brilliant. I think you were just caught by an upward fluctuation yesterday.

Humph I've been warily eyeing up the concept of exercise and everyone seems to mention the shred. I realise that changing your way of eating basically doesn't take extra time - after all I prepared and ate meals before bootcamp - but adding exercise to your life does mean you have to schedule in time for it. I'm making my way over those mental hurdles at the moment.

MrsHughJarse Tue 18-Feb-14 14:17:09

Gosh - thanks all. I love this thread thanks I am starting to think about you all when I am not on MN grin

willie the voice of calm and reason as ever ! I am going to concentrate on my ' test' best jeans and get into them. I have discovered I have lost TWO INCHES off my waist - which is amazing and TWO off my rather voluptuous bottom !

humphrey I hope you vile cold is bearable - can you mainline daynurse or something, it always gets me though. I am hopeful that my muscles are retaining water and one day, maybe one day the whoosh bugle will sound for me !

lovecat - my cycle has gone very strange too - I bled for 16 days straight....and I have a mirena , so i don't usually have more than a couple of days of not very much...... twas a shock to the system !

trashy well done on the 4 lbs - thats fab.... worth putting up with the blue cheese/avocado debate....maybe its Karma that I have stayed the same - its for my lack of sensitivity ! Cheese free for a week for me sad if you can post more of your menus trashy, I will copy you !

to whoever posted about the butter not being big enough.... my DC keep slathering my posh grass fed, salt encrusted gorgeousness on their toast....... its mine !< selfishly hides it>

crabby 1lb is pretty good considering what you have hinted at that you may have eaten ! I am sure it will melt away this week !

<waves to all>

Have a good week everyone !

MrsHughJarse Tue 18-Feb-14 14:20:04

Goodness a whole page has gone on in the time it took me to write that post.... !
<mega x-post > grin

HumphreyCobbler Tue 18-Feb-14 14:22:32

Eva, shred only takes 20 minutes if you don't do the cool down

it is definitely exercise for those who hate exercise

also Jillian shouts at your, it is like a big stick on DVD

ladygagoo Tue 18-Feb-14 14:25:23

de-lurking to address Snowie. I too am 5'8 and very similarly weigh 10st4. I've lost only 4lbs since the start however the post DS flabby belly is almost gone plus at least one of the chins and collar bones are getting very prominent.
If I weighed a stone less I think my DH might force feed me some haribo. So maybe its time to not weigh. Instead, choose something you'll wear on holiday and try it on once a week. See it fitting better and better.

Last summer I lost 2 stone with SW. But my double chin (caused by a whopping 4 st gain whilst pregnant) did not budge.
This WOE works but you need to be realistic when nearing your target that the numbers won't move much or quickly.

EvaTheOptimist Tue 18-Feb-14 14:40:39

Hmm only 20 minutes...

HumphreyCobbler Tue 18-Feb-14 14:42:01

I am not going to lie to you though, you WILL be in pain after day one

but it works

SteeleyeStan Tue 18-Feb-14 14:42:02

Sorry to not too a "proper" post - but hey all. Busy day here and a very early start. Birthday behind us, I'm measuring my water again and doing a few very low carb days to hopefully get things shifting again. (Not proper ubercamp, as I've got too much dairy in the house to stick to that anyway).

B: Nothing.
L: Fried eggs, avocado, BPC.
D: Pork loin steaks with philly and mushrooms with salad.

Woolfey Tue 18-Feb-14 15:53:37

Afternoon brew

I went shopping this morning and for some reason bought brussel sprouts. I hate brussel sprouts. I'm getting a bit bored of my usual veg (cauli, broc, mushrooms, spinach, lambs lettuce, swede) so thought I would branch out a bit and it seemed like a good idea at the time. I remember someone posting on here that they've suddenly found they like brussels now as they fry them up in butter. But I'm sure there was something else in with them and I can't remember what it was or find the post. Anyone any advice on them?

Also has anyone made cauli rice with frozen cauli before? Does it work? I don't have a microwave so can't defrost it quickly first.

TIA

woolfey can't comment on frozen cauli, sorry

sprouts fried up with bacon, shallots and butter is lovely (or just sprouts fried in butter)

the other day i did the creamy braised cabbage recipe with sprouts instead of cabbage (adjust quantities accordingly - it was much quicker to cook

and on the recipe thread there are:

sautéed sprouts with chorizo
sprouts as part of a veg bake using creme fraiche

ooh, for the creamy braised cabbage i cut the sprouts in half

BIWI Tue 18-Feb-14 16:05:16

I love sprouts just served simply - boiled till they're just going soft (I don't like them al dente), with lots of butter and salt/black pepper

someone said on here on an earlier bootcamp that their previously veg-avoiding dcs suddenly started loving veg with butter on it. presumably wouldn't work with everyone, but it does suggest that the simple addition of butter does something magical to veg that previously seemed bitter grin

toomuchicecream Tue 18-Feb-14 17:07:43

I'm afraid that I can report that cauli rice with frozen cauliflower doesn't work! Our Magimix gave it everything it could, but despite the blades being so sharp they regularly cut me when I'm wiping them clean, they made as good as no impact on the frozen cauliflower. We ended up using the bag for curried cauliflower soup from the recipe thread and then going back to buying fresh cauli for rice.

EwanHoozami Tue 18-Feb-14 17:14:31

frozen cauli is pre-cooked so no good for rice (sorry I'm too late for toomuch with that little nugget!) BUT you can freeze grated fresh cauli en masse and portion up for whenever you need it.

Tonight DH is working late so I'm having fried bacon and butter-tastic mashed swede for dinner. Chopped up together and eaten with a spoon in my pyjamas. Sexytimes.

Notsoskinnyminny Tue 18-Feb-14 17:17:01

I keep planning to restart the 30 day shred its quick to do but I come home, have a 'quick' on look on here and before you know it its time to walk psychopup, start cooking for the rabble and making packed lunches.

Sprouts are disgusting, put them in room 101 with mouldy blue cheese but I always cook them at Christmas. The first year DH had dinner with us I put a spoonful on his plate and told DCs to wait and watch. He hates all veg, never had to eat it growing up, and anything he doesn't like gets eaten first. The sprouts were quickly demolished and the kids fell about laughing telling him the deal is they only have to eat one - how evil am I wink

EwanHoozami Tue 18-Feb-14 17:18:34

Ah it was Woolfey asking about cauli sorry.

Lookslikerain Tue 18-Feb-14 17:21:13

Okay, I admit defeat on getting my roast belly pork to go crispy in the oven. Please, someone, what am I doing wrong? I left it unwrapped in the fridge all day to dry, started it in a really hot oven for 20 minutes, then turned the temp down to slow cook. It smells good but there's no way it's going to produce proper crackling.

Woolfey do you have a food processor? If so, put on the attachments for slicing stuff and shred your Brussels sprouts. Then fry in lots of butter, add garlic, chilli, cream if you fancy. Very nice, even my 4 year old will eat them like that.

CrabbyWinterBottom Tue 18-Feb-14 17:25:28

Thanks Eva. My elephant has thrown the rider off completely this afternoon... as the rider, I am currently sitting on my arse in the dust watching it rampage into the distance to wreak havoc and trampling destruction with its hormental elephant rage. confused

There's a bottle of white chilling in the freezer right now, despite it being Tuesday. hmm I've made a ragu and eaten LC so far today but am seriously contemplating spaghetti instead of courgetti to go with it. Looked in the mirror after my bath today and this bootcamp all the weight seems to have gone off my bust instead of my arse. This is not good at all... I don't want them any saggier! sad That's then got a little voice going in my head saying 'well you probably shouldn't lose any more weight then in that case... so pasta would be fine'. hmm

I'm pretty sure this is hormonal - period is stop-starting and I am so full of fucking rage and anxiety (odd mix!) that I'm wound up like a spring. I also really miss DD but am simultaneously glad that she's not here so she doesn't have to witness my unhinged behaviour. hmm

Can someone hit me with the stick please?

CrabbyWinterBottom Tue 18-Feb-14 17:26:19

Sorry that was a massively self-absorbed shouting of my shit! blush

ah well i adore mouldy blue cheese grin

the mouldier and stinkier the better for me when it comes to cheese

i would probably try that one that comes with maggots in given the chance, but i think i would have to remove the maggots first

lookslikerain when it's done you could remove the skin and keep the meat warm, then whack the skin under a hot grill. you have to keep a close eye on it or it will burn

biwi has a way of doing it in the microwave i think though i might have made that up

CrabbyWinterBottom Tue 18-Feb-14 17:32:42

Yay Trashy on your 4lbs off! flowers

Gator I'm very much feeling your pain with the TOTM crap, as you can see.

Eva and LMiss you need that 'low carb medicalert' card I designed a few weeks ago. wink Seriously though it is not acceptable for friends and family to do this. LMiss I hope the lunch with your friend went better than you were expecting.

tea my non-low-carbing friend said the same thing about the berry crumble!

Pseudo I think your phone has me just about summed up this week! blush

crabby you know that carbs beget carbs <biblical>, so it's not surprising that having eaten some you want some more. you know that you have two options

give into the carbs
don't give into the carbs

while the cravings are difficult to resist, you do ultimately have control over what goes in your mouth. you know all the rational reasons why getting back on the wagon is a good thing

stop watching that elephant rampaging - go and get another elephant (is this too much of a stretch of the metaphor? grin)

CrabbyWinterBottom Tue 18-Feb-14 17:38:32

There you go...

For all of you who are having trouble with people sticking their uninformed beaks into your eating habits, I just had an idea. Trash you were saying that you can't remember the facts under pressure and I thought 'ooh she needs a leaflet or something' and then I thought of this: home educators can carry a little card around stating that you are a home educator, with the relevant legislation on it to wave at people who accuse your child of truanting. I've designed one for us lot. We can keep it in our wallets and just smilingly hand it over as soon as the person starts spouting the usual shit. And just think... if we're in an accident and go to hospital, they can read the card and know not to feed us IV cake or anything. wink

My name is _ and I am a low carber.

As there are a number of misconceptions about low carbing, some of which you've just shown that you currently subscribe to, let me clear a couple of things up...
1. We do eat carbs, plently of them in fact. We get them from vegetables, nuts and a variety of fruit.
2. Pasta, bread and rice are jolly nice, but they are not in any way essential. They are foodstuffs developed to feed vast numbers of people, cheaply. We don't need them to be healthy.
3. Sugar is not a food group. I know that's hard to believe, but any dietician, doctor or scientist, when pressed firmly, will have to admit it.

If you still want to know more about it (as I'm sure you wouldn't want to argue against this way of eating from a position of utter ignorance!) you could start with these scientists and doctors....

<insert links here>

grin

At least if you don't actually do it, you can imagine handing that to them and their resulting expressions, and it should give you a little inner smile. wink

EwanHoozami Tue 18-Feb-14 17:38:37

Crabby I shall pelt you into submission with pats of butter. Pasta will not increase the size of your bangers wink

CrabbyWinterBottom Tue 18-Feb-14 17:41:22

Willie I know you're right. I've gone a bit haywire.

Carbs beget carbs. They do, don't they. I need to think about that whilst I pour a glass of wine.

CrabbyWinterBottom Tue 18-Feb-14 17:41:59

Ewan! grin

good point ewan

pasta goes straight to tummy and thighs <trufact>

EwanHoozami Tue 18-Feb-14 17:49:38

I might as well sellotape linguine directly to my middle.

LittleMissDisorganized Tue 18-Feb-14 17:51:27

Hello all... I am home.
It went ok actually. It made me realise how rubbish texts are as a way of discussing something. Mostly we talked about her little boy and for today, I avoided having to have anything of a hard discussion, I am prepared to but once I know what I'm wanting to achieve by it and from a place of emotional strength. Cowardly perhaps, I don't know...
Thanks for the encouragement earlier, I really appreciate here.

Lookslikerain Tue 18-Feb-14 17:53:46

Willie yes, I'll have to do that. It has kind of crisped round the side but is a little flaccid in the middle. Does not look too appetising.

Crabby I'm seriously considering using your medicalert card this weekend when the inlaws descend for lunch. I'm cooking though and it'll be mainly LC with a loaf of bread for the carby twats. They will bring up our WOE because we do need some carbs (potatoes, pasta, rice, bread) in our diet, you know...

lookslikerain cut off any bits that actually have crackled (if any have) - kitchen scissors work quite well - as they would burn of course

i am a coward and avoid any discussions about this WOE if they are likely to be confrontational (i'm not a very good ambassador, sorry). any criticisms that come my way just get a non-committal 'indeed' or similar. nod, smile, ignore

Suzymoo9 Tue 18-Feb-14 18:10:25

Was sad today when I tested my BMI and realised I am a stone above the higher weight for my height.

I have lost half a stone so far and imagined I am much thinner than I really am. Although I'm pleased with my loss, have further to go than I thought. Funny how I have got used to being this size.

Anyway, will keep on keeping on, the food is so nice.

Just had omelette cooked in butter with garlic, mushrooms, goats cheese & chopped parsley - with dressed salad. Yum - best diet WOE I have ever done

LittleMissDisorganized Tue 18-Feb-14 18:14:03

Crabby as well as carbs begetting carbs, I suspect wine begets wine... smile might the one be connected to the other?

Someone upthread mention low alcohol wine - just wanted to point out that it has more sugar than normal wine (as they stop it mid fermentation so it doesn't turn so much sugar into ethanol

When I was in treatment they said that cravings attenuate. It's SO true, that if we don't feed them - true of carbs I think as well as the alcohol and drugs and eating disorders people were there for - they don't get worse, they get better. You still get waves but the peaks aren't as high. So when we cheat we reset the attenuation and have to start from the high, frequent peaks again.

It's true in my experience too... I don't crave or even think about alcohol hardly ever any more. I don't know that I'm considering lifelong abstinence of high-carb foods but I find it helpful to remember this truth.

Lighthousekeeping Tue 18-Feb-14 18:20:50

I need a treat. Tonight I'm having peri peri chicken and cheese coleslaw maybe with sine fake fries.

I've found a bottle of cider. I'm still boot camping. I want it poured over ice. Like now.

that is an excellent post LMD thanks

AthelstaneTheUnready Tue 18-Feb-14 18:40:43

shock at flaccid food.

I am feeling dreary, miserable, pathetic, morose, you name it. Don't know what's up with me. Was just going to skim and skulk off, but wanted to say to Crabby that boobs come back, i.e. once the weight has gone and you've stabilised at wherever you're going to be, they sort of fill out again.

<off to sit in the corner and rock>

MrsHughJarse Tue 18-Feb-14 19:35:13

crabby ..... I am sure you are reading this despite wine in hand
It's for the health benefits .... Not just the mirror benefits .... And it's a known fact that arsefat comes off last . Buy a push up bra in the right size lots of mad bra experts on Mn that changed my bangers for the better put the top back on the wine and wrestle that elephant ... Get a grip girl - you know you want too ...
Sending love too thanks

Seri77 Tue 18-Feb-14 20:00:44

Suzymoo I'm exactly the same state re BMI numbers. Makes me sad because it's going to take such a long time. But I've stopped the weight gain and I'm 8lbs or so lighter than I was she we started bootcamp. I used to be really slim and I'm not quite sure how this happened to me sad

I will keep on keeping on too. I feel healthier, less tired as I'm not lugging that extra weight about and even if I only loose 2lbs a month from now on, I'll be BMI 24.8 before Christmas.

Piscivorus Tue 18-Feb-14 20:17:46

Glad your day out was ok LittleMiss

For those of you worrying about flab, give it time. I went very flobby after my initial quick weight loss but have noticed things have firmed up in the intervening year despite me still having loads to go.

Arsey though this sounds, I just don't tolerate anybody getting at me about this way of eating. Firstly I never bring it up so only go into it if people ask me, I usually just say breezily "I've changed the way I eat, I'm NOT dieting but I am eating healthily where possible". If they push for details I just say I've cut back on sugars and starchy foods like bread, potatoes and pasta, which people can usually understand and it still sounds "healthy" to them. My final weapon in the arsenal is to say "I don't buy synthetic or processed foods" or "If my grandmother wouldn't know what it was, I won't buy it". All of those things sound sensible so tend to cover all eventualities other than people spoiling for a fight grin

The funniest one I have had was a relative who is diet-obsessed, has been for many years and should own Weight Watchers by now the amount she has paid them! She wasn't at all aggressive, genuinely interested but every answer I gave got a negative response. She just could not understand why skimmed milk, Flora and Mullerlights weren't vital. Eventually I told her that Einstein said it was madness to keep doing the same thing over and over expecting different results!

Suzymoo9 Tue 18-Feb-14 20:52:02

Seri77 nice to know I'm not alone.
Interesting chapter on BMI in Briffa's book.
I understand all you say - "how did this happen to me?" and when we add up the slow weight loss over a year it adds up to quite enough doesn't it?
thanks

BIWI Tue 18-Feb-14 21:12:59

For crispy belly pork, you can always put it under the grill - although you have to watch it like a hawk as it can burn very quickly.

Or - take the skin off, put it on a large plate and cover generously with kitchen towel - then microwave on high for 30 seconds at a time. It will crisp up that way (it carries on crisping after you've finished microwaving it, so be careful you don't overdo it.) The kitchen towel stops your microwave getting too messy as it will spit fat.

DENMAN03 Tue 18-Feb-14 21:20:10

Well done to everyone who has done so well smile I started a week before most of you and have lost a total of 21lbs to date. This week however, I have stayed the same which is rather annoying, but I am very in the zone and enjoying the food so much! Was at a business lunch today and the only thing offer were sandwiches so I had two quarters and just hope that doesn't derail everything!

Seri77 Tue 18-Feb-14 21:34:54

I will dig out my Briffa book again Suzymoo. Sadly my BMI issues are nothing to do with muscle. Feeling the need to start some exercises too, looking at yoga which I used to love and I'm reading Fast Exercise and contemplating my skipping rope.

Re pork belly I turn it to 220 for 10 mins then to 150 til it looks right. I still have to put all or parts of the crackling in the microwave. Be warned: it can make the most alarming exploding noises. I just use kitchen towel on the turntable as my plate cracked.

Lovecat Tue 18-Feb-14 21:52:10

Evening all smile Just popping on to SMS, will catch up with the thread in a minute.

Back on the LC wagon today, yesterday was very bitty and involved me hoovering up the leftovers from the party (although I did end up binning a lot of it and throwing it outside before I could change my mind!). No breakfast as we went swimming first thing, then did the big shop and had brunch in Morrisons' cafe. Sausages there are probably not low carb, but were very nice smile

Brunch - sausage, bacon & fried egg. Coffee with cream
Dinner - roast chicken, roast swede, garlicky courgettes (grated into butter and fried), buttered sprouts.

Not enough water - again... sad

I spent an hour this afternoon going through my tins and packets cupboard, and have chucked everything that was out of date, and bagged up everything in date that I'm not going to eat anymore (all those low fat instant pasta things I had on SW, pulses, tinned fruit, low fat custard and rice pudding) and am going to take it, along with the cakes and biscuits that didn't get opened at the party, to the local foodbank tomorrow. Hopefully someone can make use of them, but I feel slightly guilty about offloading all my horrible carbs onto people!

SnowieBear Tue 18-Feb-14 21:53:06

Ladies, you are all wonderful, thank you for indulging my tantrum today thanks.

Sorry I couldn't reply until now... work and RL have a terrible effect on my MNing.

Humphrey and BIWI, thanks for giving me some perspective again. Been here before and, yes, it does even out at 1lb a week, so still ahead of the game with 9lbs in 7weeks.

Humphrey and Willie, no chance of exercise, sorry sad. Many different and valid reasons, trust me, won't bore you with them. I do promise, though, to go for a brisk 30mins walk at lunch if conditions allow... I do feel it makes a difference and it definitely won't hurt.

Eva not hungry in the slightest! Breakfast is rich and enjoyable, lunch is humongous grin and varied... I love salads! Deprived? Not me!

ladygagoo what you said makes a lot of sense. I look my best at 9st 6lbs, and I don't look bad now, all about perceptions of self and hung-ups. My DH will never force-feed me Haribos, though, he's got a personal vendetta against them... they need smuggling in when bought!

Woolfey if you do your sprouts with bacon, shallots and fried in butter, try finishjng them off with a slosh of cream and some black pepper and grated nutmeg. They are delish!

Crabby I claim the self-absorbed title for today. Step away from the wine, get on with the cougetti and I'll pass my crown to you tomorrow if you really still want it grin.

LittleMiss re low alcohol fizz. Yes, it is more sugary, but I cannot afford to let it go to my head or be over the limit in the morning. Additionally, DH hates it and as my resident alcoholic it is reassuring to know he's unlikely to raid it sad.

DENMAN welcome to the mad house, what a great loss!

Right... off to curl up with my book for half an hour before catching up with my sleep. Thanks to ALL of you, you keep me sane, you do.

mrshughjarse grin thanks I would be honored if you copied my menu (although calling it a menu is sometimes debatable confused) also, I feel a name change may be in order for you very soon - MrsGreatlyDiminishedArse or some such?

Crabby cling by your fingernails to the bc wagon! <<runs wildy swinging BIWI'S stick in windmill type manner>> ON YOUR FEET SOLDIER! YOUR TIT SKIN WILL RECOVER IN TIME!! (mine resembled savoy cabbage leaves for a little while after I lost a lot of weight in the past, but they fixed)

eva I am loving your excellently optimistic posts. I would be interested in buddying up for the shred. <<disclaimer - I know very little about it>>

ewan I'm so hot for you right now in your swedey pj's grin

lookslikerain we do hot at the end too if it hasn't gone crispy. Plus salt -are you salting it? not sure if this is pertinent. I put them in skin side up, rub salt in, wack 'em in on pretty high, like gas mark nine. Then I turn them down to three, leave them for and hour or so, and if needed wack the temp back up at the end and keep a close eye - good luck, cos un crispy belly pork is rubbish sad

food today

B - scrambled eggs and butter

L - Sirloin steak with garlic butter mushrooms broccoli and cauli (one floret of each - I'm having to keep veg very low)

D - Belly pork and wilted spinach with a tiny few heads of sprouted broccoli

S - 2 x beef patties (homemade fried up in goosefat with half a shallot and some garam masala and turmeric and smoked paprika shoved in for good measure. Oh and salt)

4+ litres of water and a disgusting cup of ginger tea with coconut oil in. Rank.

On the general exercise front I do a brisk walk up hills and that, for approx 45 mins in heavy duty walking boots or a beach walk every day - sometimes longer. Getting stronger in the leg department, but won't be able to run (which is my number one exercise staple) again til I've had my operation and healed.

Bit of a rubbish afternoon. Lost one of my dogs (a bloody clients who's long term ill in hospital) today. It fucked off took fright on the beach and pissed right off. I had to call dp for back up <<helpless bint emoticon>> cos I had dcs and two other dogs to wrangle, and I knew it had bolted off for miles. We searched like professional trackers and poor dp ran four miles round the coastline - getting sightings from passers by/work colleagues and fishermen. Unbelievably we found it (still in shock at that) FIVE MILES AWAY in an industrial estate panicking like a twat and to cap it all, the damn thing came home and took a huge piss on one of my chairs in the front room in front of me! Utterly rubbish. We were considering keeping him if he needed re-homing, but i'm massively reconsidering. He's a small dog with barking at men/strangers issues and he's only barely house trained at almost two years old. Lots and lots of hard work!

Rant over. Keep on keeping on grin

Ah snowie excellent post grin

BIWI Tue 18-Feb-14 22:08:14

crabby I hope you haven't given in to the siren call of the carbs?!

HeirToTheIronThrone Tue 18-Feb-14 22:19:02

goodas that was me with the Boursin cauliflower cheese! No real recipe - chop a cauliflower into florets and boil or steam til tender. Slosh of double cream in a pan - about half a small pot? Melt in spoon of Boursin and spoon of normal cream cheese, add handful of grated cheddar. Put cauliflower in a dish, pour over cream/cheese mixture, top with a bit more grated cheddar and bake til brown and bubbly. Not good for non-dairy peeps but SOOO good.

I however am bad - STS again, possibly due to mass consumption of Lemsip/Strepsils. Combo of ill and fed up led to large quantity of biscuits and chocolate at work. Fuckity fuck fuck.

Job interview tomorrow so am going to try for a good sleep and hopefully all will be better sad

GatoradeMeBitch Tue 18-Feb-14 22:19:57

I'm making burgers, at 10:20. Apologies to my neighbour if she's a Mumsnetter! I only just got hungry though!!

PseudoBadger Tue 18-Feb-14 22:21:21

Has anyone got a quick reply to this:

Did you watch the programme that was on recently about sugar and fat? Really put me off low carb diets. A lot of the weight you lose is muscle when you cut back on carbs.

pseudo we all did, with gnashing teeth at it's unscientific nobfuckerryness. It was utter rubbish - ie not proper comparison, didn't drink the water - ate NO carbs whatsoever and didn't begin to examine long term sugar effects. Plus some of their science was properly flawed and the tests very unfair and not randomised. Plus the 'muscle loss' as judged by the 'bodpod' was also not factual. Another poster checked the bod pod website and it apparently can't actually measure that at all. Ultimately you must be true to yourself and do what feels best. This works for me and I'm in perfect health (according to myself and my doctor) apart from needing to lose weight.

SnowieBear Tue 18-Feb-14 22:31:34

pseudo my quick reply would be: "low carb? That wasn't low carb, it was NO carb!"

Expand as required.

PseudoBadger Tue 18-Feb-14 22:33:45

Thank you!

BIWI Tue 18-Feb-14 22:38:29

No, Pseudo, that isn't true. You burn fat when you cut the carbs - that's what we're doing, switching the body from burning carbs to burning fat.

I can really recommend two books, one called "The Art and Science of Low Carbohydrate Living" and another called "The Art and Science of Low Carbohydrate Performance" by Volek and Phinney (I think) They are two Americans who don't just write about low carbing, but they also do their own research to explore low carbing and how it works.

They are quite scientific books (the first one was written for medical practitioners), but they really make the case for low carbing very well/very clear.

That Horizon programme was absolute nonsense. How can you possibly make a scientific case for anything based on studying two people?

CrabbyWinterBottom Tue 18-Feb-14 22:39:57

Ok I'm here. Hugh I'm afraid I wasn't reading earlier - I was too busy being encouraged/enabled by DP. blush Thank you though and you are of course entirely right! xx

Ewan grin at may as well sellotape linguine directly to your middle! I know I'm much more bloated when I eat wheat.

LMiss yes the wine begets wine and the wine begets carbs and they both beget more carbs. No doubt about that at all. Normally I can resist the carbs pretty well and I don't have a problem sticking to the food. As I've said many times though, the wine is definitely my weakness. When I feel in that particularly strung up state that I get sometimes, I just want to stop feeling it for a bit. I know that using alcohol to do that is a slippery slope. If I'm feeling fine in myself then I don't seek that numbing, soothing sensation outside of myself. When I feel all strung out on a wire though, I really really do. I'm working on it. I'm just so desperate for a break from my head sometimes.

Athel bless you, come over here and rock in the crazy-corner with me! wink

Trashy as usual you have made me grin grin

<<grabs crown of self absorption from Snowie and runs away with it>>

<<hides from BIWI >>

________________________________________

^^ This is a line drawn underneath my carby twatdom. Tomorrow I shall be better.

PseudoBadger Tue 18-Feb-14 22:40:14

I'm not!! I believe in the WOE!! I love the WOE!! I've been asked on Facebook and wanted a proper reply which I can't pull together myself as I think I've got mastitis sad

PseudoBadger Tue 18-Feb-14 22:41:44

Sorry I read back my earlier post and it wasn't clear that someone had asked me the question....

RatherBeOnThePiste Tue 18-Feb-14 22:42:15

This will sound daft but is it possible to need to eat more to lose weight?

SnowieBear Tue 18-Feb-14 23:00:15

Yes! I think there's a correlation. If not enough food, body goes all protective of fat resources. Not daft at all, Piste!

ElBombero Wed 19-Feb-14 07:45:06

Hi everyone, day 3 of übercamp. No snacks, no diary n loosely following the menu but being super strict with 3 BLack Farmer sausages for breakfast, a piece of mackerel for dinner and some meat with allowed veg / salad for tea. It's very restrictive but the only thing I'm going to change is having creamy coffees again in the morning.

Here's the good news, after STS for over 3 weeks, I am at my lowest ever after losing 3pds since Monday grin

LittleMissDisorganized Wed 19-Feb-14 08:17:00

Snowiebear I'm really sorry, what was meant to be useful turned out to be very unhelpful. It must be a very difficult road to walk. I hope that, if I'd carried on drinking, my DH would have left me. He is a caring man with rescuing tendencies but I hope he would have protected himself. Our life in sobriety is wonderful, while I was drinking it was terrible, for both of us. I think I've seen him have a drink about 3 times ever! So I hope the LA wine has some benefits to you and that if I could ever be helpful you just have to ask.

Piste I'm sure that's true - that the "starvation mode" theory of why low cal low fat diets don't work long term would apply if you ate too little on this WOE. I'm still not all the way thru Volek and Phinney so maybe someone more knowledgeable will confirm or tell me I'm talking rubbish.

Another day, food for thought on the way I thought, felt and what of my behaviour got me into the defensive place I ended up yesterday. Going further on public transport than I've so far managed alone today, keeping up the little steps is making them build!

Woolfey Wed 19-Feb-14 08:45:18

Blimey you lot chat, I can't keep up at all! Apologies I haven't read all the thread.

BIWI, Willie, Lookslike & Snowie Thanks for the advice on the sprouts. Will be giving them a go later, shredded with bacon fried in butter I think for a first attempt. DH has said I'm not allowed to cook them when he's in the house because of the smell!

Toomuch & Ewan Thanks for the advice on the frozen cauli. Never mind. Good tip on the freezing of grated fresh cauli, might try that.

Littlemiss so glad your afternoon went ok. I was thinking of you meeting your friend.

Vague meal plan for the day is:
B Poached egg & ham (would normally have an egg fried in butter to keep up the fat level but just didn't fancy it this morning for some reason)
L Fried chicken & the aforementioned fried sprouts with bacon
T Bacon strips (my new snackie but v expensive crunchy treat)
D Steak with some kind of sauce & veg (not sprouts smile)

Off to down some water. Have a good day everyone smile

LittleMissDisorganized Wed 19-Feb-14 09:03:59

and meant to say, Crabby I'm also very sorry if it seemed like I was badgering you - I guess I wanted to say that that wanting to get out of your head feeling - and I've definitely been there - does lessen, it too attenuates over time.

Lavenderhoney Wed 19-Feb-14 09:11:49

Deluding briefly - not running this week as its half term. And this morning the dc made me breakfast in bed of hot buttered toast. Haven't eaten that for a year nowsmile

I can feel a bit of a tummy bloat but that's ok, only to be expected this week. I miss running!

HumphreyCobbler Wed 19-Feb-14 09:14:50

Am still ill with this virus but DH has just brought me a bullet proof coffee in bed.

sueh95 Wed 19-Feb-14 09:16:58

Good luck with the interview Heir

MyPreciousRing Wed 19-Feb-14 09:26:48

Good luck with journey today little miss.
Climb back on crabby!
Well done el bombero!
Eat more piste.
Ok back to me wink
I have officially lost a STONE since we started. I'm the lightest I've been in years apart from when I've been ill..
So. Big smiles all around here and planning to eat and drink exactly the same as yesterday.
Boring but at least I know it works.
Thanks to whoever suggested the Boursin, egg and cream in a cup.
Very tasty.
Happy LCing everybody

Lighthousekeeping Wed 19-Feb-14 09:38:56

I've had the lidl yoghurt and large tea for breakfast. Moussaka and cheesy coleslaw will be for lunch. Evening I have a peperami. I really don't get hungry on this diet. I'm going on the train on Saturday. That's making me nervous. I really love the ritual of going to pret and buying breakfast to take with me.

EvaTheOptimist Wed 19-Feb-14 09:51:38

LittleMiss I know exactly what you mean, about talking about low-carbing once you know what you are trying to achieve. I tried to ask myself why I was so upset afterwards, and was it partly because I would like to persuade some of my relatives to eat like this - the evangelism thing. When I thought about it, I really have to let go of that. Then there is the correcting of annoying urban myths ("Dr Atkins died of a heart attack" is one I had last weekend (he didn't, I'm pretty sure)). I'd quite like to explain the fascinating body science behind it, I would have thought I'd have had a chance as my family are quite scientific... but no we got nowhere near that. Finally there is just the soothing of genuine concern, ie my mum is obviously distressed that I'm harming myself.

Crabby I like your card, but for my rellies - on point 3 "sugar is not a food group" I would have had a reply about "but what about wholegrains" or something. Also - its not just the carbs, its the fat too - people's panic about saturated fat.

Lookslikerain good luck with yours. With the benefit of hindsight, I would have led with "This Way of Eating is not dangerous or unhealthy". And then I would have talked about how, for ME (ie me, not you, not evangelising) I find carbs cause me to crave more carbs so much, that I can't do sensible portion sizes or low-cal or anything. That for ME, a breakfast of eggs and mushrooms is much better than one of muesli followed by toast followed by banana followed by fruit yogurt and finally managing to stop eating... just... for a couple of hours....

Suzymoo and Seri keep on, you WILL get to the BMI you want! Enjoy the trip down - I felt like it was all unchartered territory!

Trash what a nightmare with the dog! Pseudo my deep sympathies with the mastitis! Yuk, I remember that. Yes the answer is that the Bodypods they used can only measure Fat and not-fat. They can't measure muscle. So the non-fat he lost was probably water and glycogen. And I've never heard a physiological explanation of how muscle could be lost on a low-carb high-fat diet.

EvaTheOptimist Wed 19-Feb-14 09:56:12

Trashcan and Humph I really came on here to say I've just done a level 1 shred! Thanks for the inspiration. I don't have any weights though so I just did it without weights, I'll have to get organised. Water bottles perhaps.

I'm happy to buddy but trash you have an injury and humph you're ill? Is this wise?

I'm now going to hobble and creak to the shower....

HumphreyCobbler Wed 19-Feb-14 10:02:30

Eva, that is great. I am very up for doing shred, but not until the vile bug is gone. Everyone in our house is hanging sad

It makes SUCH a difference.

CrabbyWinteryBottom Wed 19-Feb-14 10:12:21

LittleMiss stop apologising!! grin If I hadn't wanted to answer your question/point then I wouldn't have - you weren't badgering at all. I'm very aware of the risks of using booze as a salve. My father was an alcoholic and it killed him. Alcoholism runs through his family and his brother is currently in end stage alcoholism - alcohol induced dementia, amongst other things. It's not pretty. My maternal grandmother was a pretty heavy drinker and my father ran a pub from when I was ten years old so I grew up surrounded by drinkers. It was incredibly normalised in my life, even my uncle's behaviour which was fucking outrageous (my dad was a pretty controlled alcoholic for much of his life, and a policeman for 25years where his drinking was nothing unusual at all!). hmm I'm very aware that I have a genetic makeup that disposes me to depression and addiction, so I do keep a close eye on myself, if that makes sense. I floundered when I was in my twenties, to be honest, but am in the best place now that I've ever been, mentally. I don't ever get out of my head drunk, nor want to - it's all much too middle-aged-civilised, naice wine, sharing a bottle in front of the telly with DP sort of thing. But that wonderful alleviation of anxiety and tension that I get when I've been feeling so wound up all day and those first few sips of chilled white hit the spot and it all just sort of dissolves... well I wish there was just a button I could press and have that happen! The person that could invent that without it involving a potentially addictive substance would make a fortune!

Well, there's a big splurge of too much information to start the bootcamping day! blush

Heir good luck with the interview.

Pseudo have you been to the doc about the mastitis? That can be excruciatingly painful! flowers

Lavender grin at 'deluding briefly'! (I know you meant delurking but it still made me grin).

Whoohoo for your stone loss Precious! flowers

Eva can you not just blind them with science? I find that when I get all technical people's eyes tend to glaze over and they change the subject... grin

ElBombero Wed 19-Feb-14 10:17:24

Is bootcamp 8 or 12 weeks?

PseudoBadger Wed 19-Feb-14 10:18:47

I'm off to the doc at 11.30 thanks Crabby and Eva
I haven't eaten yet, just 2 coffees with cream. I can't think of anything I want to eat, maybe because I'm feeling ill?

crabby i'm sorry those close to you have been so caught up in alcoholism, it must be horrible for you to have lived with and see now.

i have a relative who is a recovering alcoholic (5-6 years without alcohol now i think) and i have such admiration for him. on christmas day he runs a drop-in support group. he does now display addictive/impulsive behaviours with food though - his wife finds wrappers of sweets, chocolate, crisps, biscuits etc hidden behind furniture and stuffed under seats in his car. the behaviour is such a worry because it is secretive, and it is having an impact on his health, but it is of course felt to be better than the alcoholism for them as a family, which it definitely is. and anyway, in the same way as the alcoholism, what could they do if he weren't prepared to do anything himself?

CrabbyWinterBottom Wed 19-Feb-14 10:24:58

Oh and Trashy what a nightmare with the runaway pooch! I'd have been beside myself! He must have been terrified to go so far, too. We walk my friend's lurcher on a Sunday and he's a serial absconder - it does worry me that he's going to cause an accident or something. The good thing is he's so fast that he can find you without any problem at all once he decides to. Glad you got him back and angry (but grin !) at him pissing on your chair when you got home!

SteeleyeStan Wed 19-Feb-14 10:34:59

Good morning everyone.

Ugh, BMI. The only reason I now care about it is because doctors care about it, and it’s used as a criteria for allowing or not allowing certain treatments. And it’s damn hard to get a new doctor to listen to you about any health issue if your BMI is over some magic number. Like my back and my hormones. I’ve had problems with both since my perfectly slim teenage years – but as long as I’m overweight, it’s obviously only caused by my being overweight as far as many HCPs are concerned.

Piste I’m also convinced the “starvation mode” is true, and you sometimes need to eat more to lose more! Also I think it’s widely underestimated what an effect low energy diets can have on your thyroid, which then can really affect your ability to lose weight.

Humphrey Hope you feel better soon. That’s good service, though. smile

MyPrecious Well done on the stone lost! thanks

Lighthouse Pret has some decent things, luckily. They do different kinds of “protein pots” (at least egg and spinach) and some salad that aren’t actually full of pasta/rice.

LittleMiss & Eva Atkins death is an urban myth, yes. Robert Atkins died following slipping on ice and hitting his head. Must have been because of the lack of sugar in his brain, I’m sure… wink lowcarbdiets.about.com/od/atkinsdiet/a/dratkinsdeath.htm

Yesterday my energy ratio was 3% carbs, 13% protein and 84% fat. A bit over 4l of water drunk. I've peed a lot...

Today's plan is:
B: Fried eggs and coffee with coconut oil.
L: Green salad and tuna mayo.
D: I dunno... meat and veg... (must shop)

Everything's a bit crap at the moment. I'm really struggling with cravings, and weird and pointless cravings, too. Like plain white bread, which is hardly something I've ever really enjoyed. hmm I know it'll pass, though. Something very minor happened this weekend past, and it's still secretly upsetting me, though it's ridiculous, so I wonder if that's why.

CrabbyWinteryBottom Wed 19-Feb-14 10:35:55

Thanks Willie. I haven't seen my uncle for ages and feel really guilty because I know that my aunt wants me to go and see him. It just brings up a whole lot of stuff about my dad that I'm really not able to deal with, so I've taken the coward's way out and avoided the issue. sad

Great kudos to your relative for getting sober. I agree that's worrying about the continuing secretive behaviour but as you said, the self awareness and wanting to change has to come from him. We can't impose it on anyone, as I well know from my own experience. There's no one so selfish as the alcoholic, ime.

Anyway enough of this. I have to decide what to cook today to thoroughly erase the memory of those carbs!

Notsoskinnyminny Wed 19-Feb-14 10:42:23

Morning losers, I'm off to the pub with former colleagues, including 2 other escapees, for lunch. I haven't seen them for a year so it'll either be a good catch up or boring as I don't know what they're going on about and all we had in common was working in the same place but the menu looks ok I just need to ask if they'll change the chips for mushrooms.

Eva well done on day 1, I've dug mine out ready for tonight well that's the plan.

Trash dogs - who'd have them! Psychopup's recall is fantastic even though all the books say they can't be trusted of the lead but then all the local dogs run to me as I'm the mad lady with a bag of meaty/cheesy treats. My last dog was a dumb as fuck himbo of a retriever who never mastered anything. He thought his name was E R cos we'd stand in the middle of a field shouting "E R Dog" trying to get him to come back grin.

crabby thanks back on the wagon and be kind to yourself. Even though you know DDs having a lovely time you're bound to be missing her. Don't worry about the boobs they do grow back but in the meantime you can have some of mine cos I've got plenty to share smile

Elbomb that's a great result. I'm going to give it a go next week if I STS again.

LMD Glad the afternoon went ok, sometimes the imagining is worse than the reality.

Willie maggots and blue cheese - you really know how to tempt someone grin

Humph Get well soon. DH has manflu and is doing my head in. I'd put leftovers in the microwave to cool last night and instead of putting it in the fridge when he warmed his milk at bedtime the divvy left it on the counter and the cats have eaten it. He's now sulking because he's "not well" - well go to bed and die quietly like the rest of us do when we're sick the wine's calling see ya later wink

NotTwit Wed 19-Feb-14 10:44:37

warning, self absorbed whiney me me me post
I apologise in advance for being whiney and attention seeking, but I'm desperate.

I still haven't lost what was assumed to be PMT bloat and weight gain and I am now at that point of my cycle again.
I have not, at any point over the last six weeks cheated. I have been ultra careful, printouts of rules etc on fridge. I have increased my water to 4 litres instead of three to try and flush out the water weight, as recommended to other posters with PMT bloat.

I have lost 10 cm round my waist in those six weeks, which is good. I feel a bit healthier, which is good, these are the reasons I have carried on, but I need to lose at least 1 1/2 - 2 stone.

In the first 2 weeks of bootcamp I went from 11st 2 to 10st 6 ( I think, maybe 4) which was an incredible amount. I fully expected to gain a couple due to PMT, but then lose them.
I was completely ready to STS for a few weeks after the first two.
But, I then put on about 1/2 a stone the day before my period arrived, was shocked but confident it would go. I also felt more bloated and sluggish, which I figured would also go away with my TOTM.
But it hasn't. I have weighed in, since then at 10st 9/10 I think, and today I have put on a couple of pounds (TOTM) and am 10 st 12.

I'm getting a bit sad about it all now. I feel a bit 'what's the point?' TBH right now. I know there are a lot of posts for the experts to get through but can anyone help?
Pretty please with butter on top?

captainmummy Wed 19-Feb-14 11:03:48

Twit - list out your meals? Let's see if there is anything obvious.

Are you exercising? On medication? Half a stone overnight is not probably fat; much more likely to be water. What do you weigh? Sometimes the water does get held onto, so as to keep fatcells the same size (for later, when you put it back on angry) and that can be for a few weeks. Also, oestrogen is being released from the fatcells too, which can disrupt and confuse your cycle.
Don't give up - this WOE is not only best for weigh control, but for health too. And taste! Why anyone woul go back to eating carbs (pastries, chips, crisps, biscuits) when they are so bad for you is beyond me.

NotTwit Wed 19-Feb-14 11:54:46

Ok, my meals which are the same each week;
Breakfasts - BPC, decaf. Then when I get back from the school run, if I'm hungry, buttery eggs or yoghurt with cream and flax seeds (twice a week at most).
Lunch - belly pork slice(s) buttery spinach/ cheese and mushroom and leek omelette / roast chicken and swede / belly pork slice and dark salad leaves / fish and the leaves or spinach.
Tea - pasta sauce ( mince, leeks, mushrooms and a smidge of sauce for taste) cheese on top with courgette ( if I have any)/ one of the above lunches. Roast chicken with broccoli & cauliflower.
I add butter to everything and cook with butter etc. I might have a fry up at the weekend.

I eat when I'm hungry, which isn't often anymore and when Stop when I am not hungry anymore. I drink all my water and don't snack, except on a Saturday evening when I will have 4 Brazil nuts and 6 almonds.

I do a lot of walking, up and down hills and to shops etc, never drive. I am aiming to start up Callanetics when I feel better ( knackered all the time due to badly sleeping two year old) after having lost a bit as I feel physically tired due to being overweight too. I can't do running or anything more strenuous because my SPD hangover won't allow me. (I'm not pregnant or ill or on medication).
Today for example I'm not at all hungry having had a (caffeinated) BPC with added splash of cream.
Sometime later, I will have omelette and mushrooms, which some spinach mixed in, say 4 frozen bits, if you get me? Tea will be belly pork and cheesy broccoli / cauliflower with lots of butter.

I don't seem to have problems with dairy as I did three/four days no dairy which changed nothing, although I'm careful not to have too much.

Thank you for replying so quickly thanks

Thumbwitch Wed 19-Feb-14 12:14:20

NotTwit, is there any chance it's muscle gain that's causing your weight to increase? Other than that, I have no useful input, sorry. sad

Sorry to hear of people's relatives still being PITA about this WOE - this is nothing like Atkins etc., where no veg or fruit is allowed in the first phase. (I couldn't live with no veg - no fruit was bad enough but no veg would about kill me.) Trouble is that the BDA and various self-styled "quackbusters" have put about that eating anything other than BDA recommended style = faddy and therefore Bad For You, so people with limited analytical faculties will take that on board wholesale and just regurgitate it as gospel truth, which is bollocks.

I have not been posting my food because it's not changing much - still having 1-2 slices of cheese for breakfast on a weekday, not managing anything at the weekend; lunch is even more hit and miss than it used to be and my evening meals are meat or fish with veg and swede in some format.
I'm having the occasional glass of spritzed wine (1 a fortnight, roughly), and occasional chocolate when I can't bear it any more.

And despite that, I have finally broken the 12st barrier and weighed in this morning at 11st 12. Yay! Might be because I had my period, and it's just about finished now, but still - yay!

I'm still in a bad place moodwise though - even more snappy and irritable than normal - anyone else suffering like that or just me?

crabby I loved your bit of morning disclosure grin here's a bit of mine to help the situation... I'm from a long line of spliff smokers blush Both of my parents and several aunts and uncles were massive pot heads. My two brothers and I grew up thinking this was the norm and we all took a lot of drugs as teenagers, with my (incredibly neglectful) parents blessing.
Fast forward fifteen years and I have little to no contact with most members due to their discomfort at my choice to leave that lifestyle behind. One of the main reasons I don't drink is because it holds zero allure. I would at times however, give my right eye for a big fat spliff, but then one would never be enough..... queue massive addiction and general withdrawal from life. It's a funny old life eh? Sugar seems to be the latest 'addiction' I've had to kick replace with mn perhaps I could manifest me a cleaning addiction, it does threaten occasionally grin

steeleye so sorry you're feeling rubbish, I've had a few days of that, and I put it down to mental re-adjustment. We've nobbled the physical withdrawal, but the brain habits are tougher to crack I think. I felt bereft, like I was grieving but more mildly. It's passing slowly, but the supermarket was the worst on valentines day. I feel a bit silly now, saying that. It's not like the food won't still be there when I've reached my target weight, and I will allow myself an occasional treat. But it got to me, and I felt alone and sad

notso Ha ha yes, I too am a smelly cheese/meat lady grin I am also a proffessional dog walker so it was very poor form!! The little bugger had an e-collar on to boot! In his defense, I must say he has up to now done excellently. We've had him eight weeks and before us he had never been off lead in his life. He was the bounciest little thing ever. Overweight with zero muscle tone, and little coordination. He's actually usually very responsive blush it was a proper bolt. Another dog gave him a terrible fright and he took off!

ceedub Wed 19-Feb-14 12:38:53

Just read thumbwitch's post and flash of recognition at grumpiness! I have been soooo irritable on this woe. I assume it's all the extra oestrogen running riot as I'm also having a much shorter cycle...so feels like permanent pmt. Fun times. However, am taking all that to mean I must be losing fat as the oestrogen apparently comes from fat cells. Anyone else having a similar experience??

ElBombero Wed 19-Feb-14 12:39:45

I am thumbwitchhmm

My poor DC. I know I'm being really miserable to be around at the mo and I'm sure it's this diet. But don't understand why I don't feel that deprived (nothing like I did on SW or LF anyway) I am just generally pissed off.

I've just told DH we need a talk tonight, basically gonna tell him to pull his socks up. Don't know if it's me or I am pissed off with him.

Even wondered yesterday if I could have some delayed PND (DS 5 month old) but really don't think it's that.

I'm stopping on the 8th March and going back to a normal diet for me. This WOE has taught me so much re clean eating and about the low fat manufacturers that will never leave me but I need to see an end to it.

SnowieBear Wed 19-Feb-14 13:02:33

Morning/Afternoon all! Time for a mega-post me thinks...

LittleMissDisorganized you have nothing to apologise to me for! If I can draw from the good aspects of the situation, it's make my hide as thick as a rhino's and I don't go taking offense and personalising innocent and helpful comments. Your comments were very valid and welcome, mine were candid, sorry to have upset you thanks.

thanks also to Crabby and trashcan- my "line" is fully with regards to our lovely DS, growing up around the chaos that addicts leave in their wake is incredibly damaging.

Willie when alcoholics pack it in, they all discover an incredible sweet tooth... alcohol gets metabolised into sugars, as we know, and they sometimes over-compensate with sweets, biscuits and the like. As you say, it's the lesser of two evils.

NotTwit - thinking back to my self-absorbed behaviour yesterday, it's OK, that's what we are all here for. It DOES average out at 1lb a week in my previous experience - you are on week 6 and prior to yesterdays weigh-in with TOTM, you had lost 6lbs. Don't be despondent, it is working, keep on keeping on. C'mon, 10cms round your waist is AWESOME!

thumbwitch not in a bad, snappy mood, but very voluble. Look at me, in a pit of despondency yesterday lunch time, chirpy by evening time, jumping up and down and full of beans (not real beans, please note!) today. Does it make sense? Nope!

OK - so not so mega-post after all.

Ah! Yes, Dr Atkins brained himself slipping on an ice patch. If only his fall could have been cushioned by a box of KrispyCrem doughnuts, he'd still be with us hmm.

captainmummy Wed 19-Feb-14 13:05:08

Twit - your meals look Ok to me (and delicious!); I'm glad you don't have a problem with dairy, as there is a bit in your meals, just keep an eye on how much cheese/cream/yog you have per day. Flaxseed also stalls me if I have too much, so I have maybe 1tsp every week or so (good for bowel problems I find blush!
I note that you are exhausted - and it is a well documented fact that tiredness can hinder weightloss. Rats kept in a sleep-deprived state will put on weight more than happy rats. Not much you can do about that I think, other than be aware of the fact (and try to get as much sleep as poss) What about portions? Are you stuffed? Snacking? (Other than 4 brazils grin on a saturday - you sound very focussed!)
I don't think your exercise would result in muscle weight unless you are intensively walking; if its a normal walk, you should be good.

How much do you want to lose?

Sorry I can't pinpoint anything wrong, but I hope you carry on with it; it will happen, for sure.

captainmummy Wed 19-Feb-14 13:06:53

And as Snowie say - 10cm is 4inches off your middle. That's where the 'dangerous' fat is, so that's great. And the scales are only part ofthe picture.

Thumbwitch Wed 19-Feb-14 13:09:00

Snowie - did you mean volatile? as in, mood changing all the time? I could do with some of that, even - I just seem to be grumpy as fuck! sad

twit nothing screamingly obvious to me either, although, tiredness is a fucker for weightloss. Caffeine and dairy may be contributing, plus the size of/type of veg you're having. I've had to strip mine right back to dark green leafy, and really small amounts at each meal, plus no caffeine/dairy. It's frankly, been a bit of a bitch angry

SnowieBear Wed 19-Feb-14 13:17:34

Hi Thumb, that's exactly what I mean - voluble=volatile smile.

I don't know if you would be better off with the trade though... I'm starting to come across as rather unhinged, would settle for plain grumpy for a few days, at least everyone would know where they stand with me.

PseudoBadger Wed 19-Feb-14 13:21:41

Needed a pick me up so I've had bacon, egg and sausage for lunch. And water. Now i'm going to bed and hoping dd stays asleep...

SteeleyeStan Wed 19-Feb-14 13:28:48

NoTwit Sorry I can't really see anything to blame, either. But I think 10cm off your waist is brilliant! Something is going very right for you. smile

Thanks trash, and sorry you and it seems many are having all sorts of different kinds of rubbish feelings going on at the moment.

My morning crappiness turned into a panic attack in the supermarket, which was then followed by a bit of an emotional binge at home. sad This is definitely not helpful and won't help my cravings, and I will try my very hardest to leave it at that. Wheat was involved, so I'm sure my stomach will berate me enough, so no use doing so too much myself, as what's done is done.

I'm not letting this ruin the rest of my day! Dinner will be some lovely spicy chicken tighs and buttery green veggies.

prettybird Wed 19-Feb-14 13:50:07

Elbombero - are you breast feeding or have you recently stopped/cut back?

I'm sure the depression I was eventually diagnosed with when ds was about 18 months old was hormonally related. I breastfed him until he was 13 months old, having gone back to work ft when he was 4 months old (all the maternity leave you go back then, at least if you wanted to be sure of getting your "old" job back)(I expressed at work).

NotTwit Wed 19-Feb-14 13:51:33

Elbombero, would you ordinarily use, say, chocolate when you feel yourself getting a bit grumpy/ pissed off? Maybe it's because you don't have that as a help? I know that's why I sometimes feel like a wanker. Not chocolate necessarily, but a food or drink (wine?) that you know longer have?

No thumbwitch I don't reckon it's muscle, I would need to be working out for that lol. Just walking and keeping active with kids and monster toddler ATM.

NotTwit Wed 19-Feb-14 14:02:07

Oops, missed some posts. Thank you all.
I don't think it can be too much dairy, I have yoghurt with cream twice a week, which is the only time I have flaxseed (which helps keep me regular blush)and a splash of cream with a BPC in the morning and in my swede ( mainly mashed with butter though).
I drink decaf coffee for the BPC as well.
I wondered about the amounts of veg, so weighed out according to the sheet thingy to get an idea how much to have, so not too much. (I don't weigh it out normally, just wanted to know what it looked like)

I'd love to say, you know, maybe it's that sneaky bit of choc/wine etc, but I have been really careful, which is why I'm pissed off reading about people's cheats and the still lose. <narrows eyes>

I will keep going, I can't eat wheat etc anyway, I know that generally speaking I have been going downish, just wish I had re-lost that weird weight gain after my last TOTM.

gussiegrips Wed 19-Feb-14 14:08:03

Just checking in - I didn't weigh on Monday as it does funny things to my head.

If it's down then I eat "just a wee bit, I deserve it", if it's not down enough then I console myself with something "as a treat".

So, I'm not going to weigh for a month, and, am instead, seeking out NonScaleVictories.

Delighted to share that I have definitely got ankle bones, that my collar bones have emerged right to my shoulders and that my friend gave me a hug this morning and said "bloody hell, you FEEL thinner".

<skip>

ElBombero Wed 19-Feb-14 14:15:49

Hi yes breastfeeding. I still provide all his milk so no change really. Wouldn't say I comfort ate. Think what clinches it for me is that on this diet you can have a day off. My WOE before pregnancy was healthy and controlled mon-fri with weekends being about nice teas in restaurants and a box of chocs at home. And I was about 9st then, I'm 9.10 now do just gotta loose that bit more of excess then I'm going back to it

MrsHughJarse Wed 19-Feb-14 14:35:59

Hello all - not time for a proper reply to all - as half term and have DC seemingly everywhere and needing me constantly for something !

but - I am sure I am retaining water , as I still have the indentation on my legs of the socks I wore in bed last night and its now half past 2 !( and we were up at 6 --love having a toddler--)So - sneaking a read up of water weight on my phone whenever DC's are occupied and I stumbled across this :

The best way to take water is to drink small amounts continuously throughout the day. Chugging a gallon of water doesn't provide your body with the water it needs because that "flood" of fluid gets passed on to your bladder and only a slight amount is absorbed by your body. [4]

I drink mine in big pint glass bursts though the day to get it in...... may try a different approach. ( and maybe compression socks gorgeous !)

Happy wednesday. I am reading and mentally hugging you all. xx

DurhamDurham Wed 19-Feb-14 15:49:17

In need of a huge kick up the arse!!

Took half day off work today to take 16 yr old dd out to lunch, she requested Pizza Hut so off we go, me with the intention of sticking to a bowl of salad. All going well, had a lovely bowl of salad while dd tucked in to pizza, pasta and salad buffet. She then offered me a slice of pizza, I didn't say yes but I didn't say no either.
For a split second I sat there thinking, eat it Durham and then you can be sick when you get home. Thought quickly passed and I had a bite of pizza and then went back to salad. But I'm gutted that I had that thought as that hasn't happened for over twenty years now. Used to have eating disorders as a teen and into my early twenties but I'm 43 now fgs.

Just a blip I'm sure and only mentioning it on here as could not admit in real life, dh went through hell at the beginning of our relationship because of my weird eating habits. Sorry to off load and am right back on the wagon, will have a very LC dinner to make up for bite of I pizza smile

HumphreyCobbler Wed 19-Feb-14 15:50:38

Elbombero, I think breastfeeding is hormonally getting in the way of the benefits of this WOE. Normally I am really calm on low carbing, not hungry, regular cycle, no urge to comfort eat before my period. None of this applies this time, which is sad, but I figure it will stand me in good stead when I cut down on the feeding.

captainmummy Wed 19-Feb-14 15:58:38

Gussie - great attitude! Try measuring insteaad of scales?
Durham - don't beat yourself up about it. I occasionally think about having a drag on a cigarette - I haven't smoked for 22 years! Sometimes I even dream that I've had a fag, then wake up feeling really guilty... grin It's like your habits live on and catch you unawares

NotTwit Wed 19-Feb-14 16:02:04

That's interesting about BF, I'm bfing babyTwit, although only at bedtime now and in the night. When I first time did bootcamp he was 6 m/o and my TOTM hadn't returned, once past the initial phase, I found it amazing. This time, with my TOTM and reduced feeding I'm worse mood wise.

I tend to drink throughout the day from a small glass using a jug to measure out my water. Are there any foods or teas or things that might help get rid of water do you know?

e durhamdurham on not throwing up, although you are worried that the thought came to you, I think ultimately you should feel reassured that you didn't, smile you are in control. I reckon throwing up wouldn't stop the sugary shit entering your system anyway, so if you think about it, it would be pointless.
Hope I haven't said the wrong thing, just didn't want you to go unanswered.

captainmummy Wed 19-Feb-14 16:08:58

Nottwit - if you are still BFing, your cycle/hormones wil probably not yet be stable. Once they are more stable, the water will fall away. It's prob not a good idea to take diuretics if BFing; you could ask your doc but I think they'll tell you to just wait till babyTwit has finished with you!

DurhamDurham Wed 19-Feb-14 16:10:27

Thanks for reassurance Captain and NotTwit smile

Captain you made me laugh about waking up feeling guilty for smoking in a dream!!

The feelings did pass very quick and I think it was because I was sat with my 16 year old and I would be devastated if she ever did what I used to do. Luckily I don't think it's likely as I tell her everyday that she is gorgeous so not self esteem issues with that one gringrin

SteeleyeStan Wed 19-Feb-14 16:23:32

Glad it passed quickly for you Durham.
Sucks that it can sneak up time after time...

SarahBeenysBumblingApprentice Wed 19-Feb-14 16:33:14

Not enough time for a full on post but Hi everyone!

Durham Well done for putting the thought to bed. Can I ask though - is there anything that you're doing that would make that thought more likely to pop to the surface? I find that if I overly restrict food the old patterns start creeping in and thoughts like that intrude. Basically I get desperate for food and desperate not to cock up and so my brain tries the same old same old... I'm also well aware how to flip the "not eating" switch.

You, of course are not me and your though patterns may work completely differently, but I wondered if there had been a trigger thanks

DurhamDurham Wed 19-Feb-14 16:39:31

Thanks Steeleye!

Sarah I think I may be panicking because I have my last 4 lbs to lose before I'm at my 'happy' weight and I just keep thinking, imagine if I didn't get there or just think if I ruined it all now. Not sure why I think this way, I actually have quite a good relationship with food these days. This WOE is great for me as I can't possibly starve myself to death eating copious amounts of fat.
I remember in my teens crying because I was so hungry and refusing a polo mint because of the calories in it (5!) . Luckily those days are far behind me now smile

SarahBeenysBumblingApprentice Wed 19-Feb-14 16:39:35

Gussie fab decision. Weighing does that to my head too. I keep thinking that weight ins should be Fridays (but then I'd have a weekend long chocolate and gin party).

SarahBeenysBumblingApprentice Wed 19-Feb-14 16:41:56

Durham keep on keeping on and you'll get there grin

SarahBeenysBumblingApprentice Wed 19-Feb-14 16:45:34

Just need to tell you all that while I spent half an hour reading two days worth of posts I was trying to cook dinner with the oven on... And dinner sitting on the hob on top of it. shock

DurhamDurham Wed 19-Feb-14 16:49:50

Aww Sarah that's is sad ( but kind of funny). You may have to have tonight's dinner tomorrow and have something quicker tonight!!

See that's what happens when you are busy being lovely and understanding on Mumsnet gringrin

CrabbyWinterBottom Wed 19-Feb-14 17:57:22

Steel sorry you're feeling rubbish. I think that emotional stuff and upset can manifest in some odd ways, and food and eating is so inextricably linked with comfort in our minds that I'm not surprised we get odd cravings. I've been very anxious too lately. Maybe it's not having our usual salves/props to deal with/supress our feelings, plus hormone release from the fat loss.

Notso and Trashy I make non-wheat livercake for crazy cocker every few months and take a handful from the freezer every walk. Some days I'm like the canine pied piper with a crowd of keen-nosed dogs around me. grin Labradors, particularly, regularly try to stick their noses in my pocket/bag because they can smell the livercake (not that it smells strong to me at all). The other day I had an enormous Leonburger who decided that I was her new best friend and that she'd be the world's best trained dog with the biggest pleading eyes for me. grin Poor little scaredy-dog Trashy. Luckily cowardly crazy cocker bolts to us when she's scared which is often.

NotTwit 10 cm off your waist is brilliant!!

Thumb flowers for breaking the 12 stone mark. And yes, as evidenced by my post yesterday, am definitely having mood difficulties at the moment!

<<lays out some cushions for all the psycho grumpy fuckers to congregate>> I'm including myself in that, obviously. wink

Trashy I used to be a regular dope smoker in my twenties and can't have it in the house otherwise I know I still would. It would just be calling to me! hmm I'm limited to the very rare occasions when a friend comes over who smokes and wouldn't even know where to buy it any more. It certainly wouldn't do any good for sticking to a sensible way of eating either! grin Did lots of other 'recreational' stuff too but that all seems rather inappropriate and risky since having DD. I too would love to channel my addictive tendencies towards organisation and cleanliness, but it never seems to manifest in quite that way, unfortunately. hmm

Snowie I read what you wrote and thought 'oh my dad's drinking wasn't chaotic' - he was quite controlled about it to an extent (unlike my uncle). But the unpredictability of the drunken rages and rows, the normalising of that behaviour, the worrying about his health in later years - all that was chaotic in its way I guess.

Durham that must have been a shock to catch yourself having that thought, but the important thing is that you did catch it, and you dismissed it. flowers

NotTwit there are herbs that you can take whilst breastfeeding which are diuretic, but be careful that you don't end up dehydrated - you may need to adjust your water intake upwards a bit. Fennel seeds (Foeniculum vulgare) are good for milk production, calming to the digestion of you and the baby (some compounds will pass through the milk), is traditionally used for breastfeeding mothers and is a diuretic so should help with water retention. If you want more info, let me know.

Sarah the dangers of mumsnet! I spend too much time on this thread (and haven't even started the dinner yet.

MyPreciousRing Wed 19-Feb-14 18:15:24

Who's was the cauliflower cheese with cream, Boursin and Cheddar on top??
Just had with pork chops, oh my god, HOW good??
Thanks gringringrin

StuntNun Wed 19-Feb-14 18:56:51

I've been trying to keep up but not doing too well as DS2 and DS3 are sick and not sleeping so I'm a bit frazzled. My weight is still going up and down all over the show so I'm going to go back on ubercamp tomorrow in the hope of at least getting to my pre-Christmas weight.

I have acquired a piece of rare breed pork belly and it is a LCHF dream - practically all fat! Does anyone have any suggestions for getting the best out of it please?

bettybigballs Wed 19-Feb-14 18:59:49

Urrrggghhh, on my way home so will read and post properly later, just to shout my dirty shit...

My name's Betty and I'm a carby twat. Total lack of planning and piss poor prep meant I fell into a mcdonalds this afternoon.

I genuinely feel poisoned, lethargic, headachey and omg the wind!

Tonight is about downing as much peppermint tea as poss and getting an early night, oh and catching up on all this weeks' posts!

ElBombero Wed 19-Feb-14 19:25:39

Aw I always fall into mcdonalds n ask for 2 double cheeseburgers with no bun. Really enjoy them grin

BIWI Wed 19-Feb-14 20:35:08

I'm humbled by some of the stories that you're sharing here. It just goes to show how life is so complicated.

When people talk about losing weight and they say "it's simple, all you need to do is eat less and move more" it makes me so cross. Not only because that's not true, but also because if it was that easy we would all be size 6!

Thinking of all of you who are struggling with whatever demons you have to deal with

flowers

AthelstaneTheUnready Wed 19-Feb-14 20:58:07

Grumpy, miserable, filthy tempered cowbag checking in. Evening.

What I really want to do is down a bottle of wine in under 30 seconds and then go out and twist someone's head off with my bare hands. Whilst roaring.

What I have actually done, is the washing up, and baked an auberginey/pestoey/mushroom and spinachy/cheesey thing. And in a moment I will be going to bed.

I need a violent hobby. <thoughtful>

HumphreyCobbler Wed 19-Feb-14 21:13:23

oh god i have been sick every ten minutes for the last two hours
never been this dehydrated and breastfeeding before. What should I do?

ElBombero Wed 19-Feb-14 21:31:30

Drink drink drink, I'd say eat eat eat too if it wasn't for this WOE. Just remember all those African women who live in starvation and feed their babies regardless

ElBombero Wed 19-Feb-14 21:35:20

Day 3 of übercamp n I've fucking failed miserably. hmm Just sick of this WOE consuming me, had a particularly bad week with DS not sleeping, I'm EBF so no let up and to top it off had an umdinger of a row with the D"H"'so I've caved and had a milky way.confusedconfused I feel crap within seconds and so regretful but now it's another 5 days to get back into ketosis. angryangryangryangry

HeirToTheIronThrone Wed 19-Feb-14 21:38:22

MyPrecious that was me - though DH thought it up to give him his dues. I shall tell him it's gone down well.

thanks to everyone who wished me luck with the interview, I was incredibly touched. I think it went ok, will know for sure by Friday so fingers crossed.

I spent a lovely afternoon snuggling with my friend's 5 week old DS (am secretly incredibly broody but terrified of the change it would mean to my life...) She very sweetly made me lunch too - home made fresh soda bread topped with avocado and tomato - not ideal but it was delicious! All good apart from that though, even turned down Malteasers - and somehow lost 2lbs overnight after yesterday's moan.

I echo BIWI - some of your stories are amazingly inspiring. Well done ladies, you are all fabulous.

PseudoBadger Wed 19-Feb-14 22:07:16

Humphrey drink as much water as you can even if you keep puking. Get DH/P to take baby and only bring him for feeds. I had this with my first and I rang nhs direct it was that bad, my mouth was so dry and I had a baby sucking the life blood out of me! I hope you feel better ASAP x

EvaTheOptimist Wed 19-Feb-14 22:09:45

Humph my lovely can you see a doctor in the morning? It doesn't sound good, especially with you needing to breastfeed and all.

ElBombero might not be 5 days!?

NotTwit your meals look perfect to me. I bet you get a whoosh soon.

thanks to all those with unaccountable rages and grumps, and those with addictive or food relationship issues lurking just below the surface. You ARE all doing brilliantly. Its not easy to keep the mental health on an even keel, even without these issues.

I've just done a nerdish survey of vitamins and minerals to prove this WOE isn't unhealthy. I can report that we get them ALL on this WOE! (Particularly if you eat spinach or leafy greens, it has to be said. And nuts seem to have loads of minerals in, if you're on bootcamp light).

MrsHughJarse Wed 19-Feb-14 22:12:01

On a lighter note ....
Maybe this is the way to lose weight grin

BIWI Wed 19-Feb-14 22:14:54

Oh Humphrey - that sounds awful.

I assume that you are resting, in bed?

This isn't a time to worry about carbs. You need water, but you also need sugar and salt. Dioralyte if you have any - if not, some flat lemonade/coke (not diet), or some hot water with lemon juice, some salt and added sugar in it will do at a pinch. Sip it rather than glug it back.

And I know you might not want to, but can you give the baby some ready made formula? Just to give you a break/let you rest/sleep?

Hope you're feeling better soon. flowers

SayraT Wed 19-Feb-14 22:41:50

Just coming on to SMS, I will try to do a Crabby Super Reply tomorrow at some point grin

Today

B: Coffee with cream and egg in a cup
L: Nothing, forgot to take it and played badminton over lunch so at 3pm (coffee break) there was only chocolate or cake
D: Parmesan and linseed coated salmon with asparagus and celeriac mash

One thing I love about the WOE is the different sort of hunger I get. After badminton today I was hungry but it passed and then came back again later at about 530 and away again. I had dinner at 630ish and wasn't ravenous. Before starting the WOE I would have been "starving" and incapable of driving home without eating something.

Tomorrow

I am not sure how eating will go tomorrow as we have a work dinner and ceilidh so I will have to eat what I am given! I will try to avoid things I can like potatoes/dessert etc but I have no idea what is on the menu. Looking forward to ceilidh because most of my group are going and quite a few of them are from abroad (and one from England) and have never been to a ceilidh so should be good fun. Also a nice excuse to get dressed up smile

B: Coffee with cream
L: Today's forgotten lunch - sausages with spinach and broccoli
D: Who knows

Piscivorus Wed 19-Feb-14 23:35:17

As part of my job I do some work with smoking cessation and with withdrawing from prescription medications and have been surprised how the addiction and feelings are just the same as I have for food

I am also aware I could easily develop addictions, I don't know if the idea of an addictive personality is proven, but if it is, I've got one! I don't drink that regularly as I can't have just one drink, I always have to have loads a few and that is at the root of my weight issue, I don't just eat, I overeat!

Anyway we are all in very similar boats from the sound of it and hopefully we are all improving, growing in personal terms while shrinking physically grin Has anyone read The Chimp Paradox? I am part way through and enjoying it, it's making sense to me

Lovecat Wed 19-Feb-14 23:45:36

Evening all smile

Quickly coming on to SMS, but Humphrey, I hope you're feeling better very soon, ElBom it may not be a whole 5 days to get into ketosis - milky ways are teeny tiny... Sayra I am jealous, I love a ceilidh!

Doctor's this morning for a mystery painful lump in the cushion of my hand that appeared over Christmas and will not bugger off. Apparently I have a nodule from tendonitis and need to take Ibuprofen 3 times a day to see if it reduces it any. Otherwise surgery sad

I also mentioned my never-ending period and without even having to mention it (ta though, Suzymoo !) I was prescribed some transamexic acid. And sent for a fasting blood test to test for just about everything known to man, which will be interesting. I think I had the World's Most Squeamish Doctor, though, I literally just said 'heavy periods' and he was wincing and squirming and began talking over me about peri-menopause; I persevered and actually saw him shudder when I said 'big livery clots'... I wouldn't mind, but he was at least in his mid-fifties, he must have had to deal with this before!

Today was a rubbish day in many ways, we all felt really tired for some reason and cba with doing much.
B - black coffee, total with cream and linseeds
L - 2 x babybels, 2 strawberries
D - steak with garlic courgettes, mushrooms & leeks in cream & mashed swede
And 2 cups of tea at tonight's rehearsals blush
And not enough water again. Gah.

Thumbwitch Thu 20-Feb-14 03:52:14

Humph - I second BIWI - lay off the low carbs and get yourself well first! Flat lucozade is a good option; I prefer ginger ale but it doesn't have the isotonic stuff in it. Flatten it by adding water - the more you add, the flatter it is. Sounds horrible, especially while bf'ing. sad

Durham - the point is, that even though you had that thought, you chose not to act on it and THAT is the important bit. Congratulations! you're still ok. smile

Crabby - happy to join the grumpy fuckers corner! Or I would be if I wasn't so grumpy... wink

Cheese for breakfast, cold salmon fillet for lunch, not enough water <sigh>, energy bar to stave off chocolate need. Dinner will be mince thing, possibly with konjac noodles.

MrsHugh - that pic made me properly snigger!

Elbomb and NotTwit(and any other bf'ers) - remember as well that bf'ing can severely affect your ability to lose weight - some people lose while bf'ing, others can't lose for love nor money while still doing it, but the weight falls off when you stop. I'm holding out for that to some extent (still doing morning, evening and night feeds and occasional daytime ones) but it wasn't the case for me with DS1, so probably won't be with Ds2 either - I'm just older and with slower metabolism this time around. Plus have no stairs in my house now (had 2 flights of stairs in the house with DS1).

Keep on keeping on - and remember that every day is a new one, and can be started afresh. smile

Woolfey Thu 20-Feb-14 07:46:28

Just thought I'd pop on to report back on sprouts. They are surprisingly nice. Now there's a sentence I never thought I'd be uttering. Shredded and fried them up with some ham, pepper boursin, cream and lots of butter and S&P. I finished off the bowl and actually considered going and making some more but then caught myself and realised that was just greed and not hunger. Will def make them again, possibly for lunch as I bought rather a few grin Thanks very much for the idea smile

I weighed myself this morning and my weight is just all over the place. Struggling with illness and emotions at the moment and it's showing in comfort eating and on the scales. Had a quick skim read of the thread and it seems I'm not the only one so thanks to everyone struggling at the moment.

Looking forward to the weekend when hopefully I'll be able to have a bit of down time and get myself back on track. Have a good day smile

ChesterDrawers Thu 20-Feb-14 08:03:57

<creeps onto thread>

I have been a twat of the carby variety. For three days I have eaten all manner of processed shite. I have raging indigestion, blisters on my tongue, I've lost half a tooth on a chocolate bar, I feel like the size of a house with a stomach like a football. I didn't enjoy any of the things I ate, they all tasted chemically and nasty but I ate them anyway. I am now back at my pre-BC weight and am thoroughly pissed off with myself.

So I am back I hope/think.

<creeps back into corner>

MyPreciousRing Thu 20-Feb-14 08:17:05

Awww poor Chester hmm
Was the binge triggered by anything in particular?
Offering a hand hold to pull you back up onto the wagon. You'll get there.
Start again, today, no cheating at the weekend? Post on here whenever you're tempted or pm me and I'll try and talk you down?
You do same for me - Friday and Saturday nights are so tough.

sybilfaulty Thu 20-Feb-14 08:34:27

Sorry for everyone who is struggling. Humph, I hope you are a bit better now. With D and V, you have to go with what you feel like, but with salt and sugar to get you back to normal. LC will be here for you when you are better. Hope you got some rest.

Chester, be kind to yourself. Today is a new day. Water, water, water. Butter, butter, butter. Have you got the IPD book? There is a lot in there about emotional eating. Well worth a read.

Am doing OK on the food but have had a bit of wine here and there in the evenings. Have got a strange period and a cold, neither of which is helping. HOWEVER, it's half term, I'm not working today, it's not raining and I am going out for lunch. Hurray. Life is good.

Have a good day everyone.

Woolfey Thu 20-Feb-14 08:37:51

Chester, the important thing is you are back on here posting thanks

Here's another hand to pull you gently back on the wagon <hands Chester a brew>

ElBombero Thu 20-Feb-14 08:38:17

Woke up this morning seriously wondering whether to chuck the towel in. Especially after last nights Milky Way, so days now to get back ketoadapted. hmm alot of people seem to be having some great success with 5:2 and think that would be so easy for me (cos I can eat choc!) but it's had some negative effects on BFing mums.

All that said I do believe in this WOE I just find it so difficult. So I've decided to keep on, im 2lb up after last nights slip. Yesterday was strange I was on day 3 of ubercamp and I swear food yesterday consumed me, sugar was all I thought about all day, made me short tempered and miserable. It was lovely when I gave in. Wondering whether uber and BF is just too much.

So onwards and downwards, I think ubercamp has shown me dairy is a staller for me so other than cream in 2 coffees in the morning I'm going to cut out cheese n yog. Do you think that will still work or has dairy got to be completely knocked on the head?

Today:
B: tuna mayo
D: corned beef n some spinach
T: 3 BF sausages
S: 2 BP coffees and 3 litres of water

PseudoBadger Thu 20-Feb-14 08:51:14

El - I think Uber and BF is too much personally. My baby is just slightly younger than yours and I am just about holding it together on BC lightish. I question whether you're eating enough at all, for you (as the milk will take what it needs regardless). Looking at your menu today is there enough veg?
I've missed quite a lot of the thread recently but I remember you seemed happy with general bootcamp but you've gone to Uber, what happened? I can read back if you prefer x

captainmummy Thu 20-Feb-14 08:52:24

El - you are having a tough time at the mo, and it is a fact that we eat for comfort (that's prob why you are craving sugar, as much as anything else). It doesn't take days to get back into ketosis, as your body is already ketoadapted. Please don't let one milky way derail your entire WOE. If you crave sugar, have you tried Liquorice tea? It's carb-free, but v sweet, somehow. I can't drink it, it's too sweet!
As you are bfing, I think you are allowed some extras! Your 2 coffee-with-creams sounds ok. Are you getting plenty of allowed veg?
Personally I find the 5:2 very restrictive - I so much prefer to eat what I want (LC of course) rather than feel hungry on 2 days a week! Esp if BFing. I hate feeling huingry!

ElBombero Thu 20-Feb-14 09:04:18

Pseudo - I went to ubercamp as I had stalled and not lost any weight for over 3 weeks. So after hearing uber could kick start gave it a try. Are you losing on BC light? I lost a stone in first 3 weeks then nothing after. Thanks for your advice, I'll add spins I to tuna mayo and maybe some celeriac chips with saus xx

ElBombero Thu 20-Feb-14 09:05:39

Captain - I will get some today grin thanks

disclaimer: i know nothign about breastfeeding

but i am sure that i have read on MN generally that some people have simply found it impossible to lose much weight if anything whilst breastfeeding (regardless of chosen diet) as that is the way the hormones affect them. conversely some people lose tonnes of weight while mainlining cake - your mileage may vary. so do be kind to yourself and your body which is doing a job that requires an enormous amount of energy and all sorts of hormones etc racing around

ChesterDrawers Thu 20-Feb-14 09:34:37

Thanks for all your kind words, guys, it really does mean a lot.

I think the scales triggered it. I was doing great, then gained on Sunday, so had chocolate that night. Then I didn’t weigh on Monday but was worried because I’d had chocolate, so then I stopped for petrol on the way home and it all went belly up. I was shattered too as I’d had no sleep at all Sunday night (DS related) so that contributed too.

I’m sick of faffing round and getting nowhere. I know what I need to do but I just can’t seem to stop sabotaging my efforts. It’s like I go into a trance and there’s no stopping myself.

BUT – this used to happen a lot more regularly before I started LCing, so I suppose that’s a positive. I want miracles but maybe I will have to take the scenic route and stop being so hard on myself for every little slip.

I am really all or nothing too so once I deviate from the rules even a tiny but I go into full on fuckit mode and eat/drink everything in sight.

I do think I need to stay away from the scales for a bit as they do not do me any favours. I am not a measurer – if I lose inches I always tell myself it’s because I measuring in the wrong place but I do have LOTS of tight clothes I can use as a gauge.

Today's plan is:
B: two eggs, huge chunk of butter
L: Something from M&S - salmon or prawns with salad and olive oil?
S: BPC
D: Sausage (1.6g for two), celeriac mash with butter, maybe some roast broccoli or cauli with olive oil

At least three litres of water

Suzymoo9 Thu 20-Feb-14 09:40:03

El Bombero as you are Bfeeding please be kind with yourself - you may need to eat more for this reason. I know someone who dieted (was anorexic previously) while breastfeeding and their baby failed to thrive. Don't want to scare you but not sure fasting for a day and bfeeding would be compatible. Though I'm no expert. thanks

Suzymoo9 Thu 20-Feb-14 09:44:22

^ when I say they dieted I mean they hardly ate anything.

ElBombero Thu 20-Feb-14 09:53:08

Aw yes suzymoo, like I said wouldn't 5:2 whilst BF. My milk supply and his weight gain doesn't seem to be affected by this WOE but maybe uber wasn't my brightest idea. Just keep eyeing up my old clothes, I'm desperate to get out of the leggings!! Although jeans are back on this week grin

PseudoBadger Thu 20-Feb-14 10:17:53

El I have been losing on light. I'm not 'dieting' at all, I've just changed what I eat. The light bits that I do are berries with yoghurt (frozen blueberries or raspberries) and snacks of Brazils or pecans once a day if needed. I snack on a slice of cheddar, and this week I've included a teaspoon of peanut butter so I'll see what the damage is from that!
I cook everything in butter and use full fat milk and have cream in coffee.
However... After dc1 I tried to 'diet' (WW) at about 3 months and felt so ill and couldn't shift any weight. I stopped and started again when he was about 7 months.

I think my advice would be either try a week or two of BC or BC light, eat plenty but to the rules (to make sure that you're eating enough) and see what happens as a test, or stop completely and eat 'normally' for a while and see what happens. Thinking of you flowers

NotTwit Thu 20-Feb-14 10:31:34

Hi elbombero when I first did this bootcamp babyTwit was ebf. I found it harder at first I think (with carb flu) than any one else on that bootcamp, and I only lost a little at first, then stalled for weeks. I kept on being careful and at the final weigh in, I had lost about a stone.
I wasn't über strict as I was paranoid about my milk supply etc (although I already can't eat wheat based stuff anyway) and took BiWis advice and just focused on how I felt, looked, what my clothes looed like etc.

I realise after my enormous whine yesterday (sorry) anything I say is a bit hmm but still, hopefully it will encorourage you to keep going.
You have already lost a stone shock. And you are pissed off shock

In fact, in order to force my focus away from weight back onto how I feel I am going to put my scales away for two weeks. I am going to relax (ie do bootcamp/bootcamp lite) and try to just be.. Does anyone want to join me? chester?, elbombero? Anyone? grin

NotTwit Thu 20-Feb-14 10:37:29

Oh, sorry, just to add, I tried being ultra strict back then, and it made me break and eat a big cookie. I reckon our bodies, more so when BF take a while to relax into thinking, ok, I'm still getting what I need, I'll let go of this fat.

And encorourage? WTF? I spelt it right and it auto corrected it!

ElBombero Thu 20-Feb-14 10:47:05

Haha thanks twit thanksbrew

Errrrmmm the scales, I need them!!! I depend on them!!!! sad Ok I'm gonna move them out of the bathroom but think I might have to do the Monday weigh in, moving from daily weigh ins though will do me good.

SteeleyeStan Thu 20-Feb-14 11:07:06

Morning all! brew

Sarah- oh no! grin I hope you got dinner eventually!

Crabby I’m sorry you’re feeling anxious, too. Food (and in the past self-harm) have definitely been a kind of coping mechanism in my bad times, and really both should be behind me in that sense. But it’s been a stressful time lately, and the old feelings do crop up. Sigh. Still, they’ll go away too, luckily. In the meantime I’ll happily lounge in your psycho grumpy fuckers cushion circle!

Athel Well done acting so reasonable despite feeling so crappy. A violent hobby sounds good, actually… Let me know if you discover a good one!

Humprey I hope you feel better today, already. Drink loads and go see a dr if you won’t get better soon. thanks

Eva Yay for nerdish surveys! smile Not that I’d have doubted the nutrition, anyway. Grains and sugar etc are hardly packed with micronutrients.

Pisci That’s interesting. I can only speak for myself, of course, but I personally found it easier to quit smoking and benzos than to conquer the sugar head. hmm I think partly it’s because you can actually properly quit other things, but you can’t stop eating.

Lovecat I hope the ibuprofein works, hun, and you can avoid the surgery. thanks I’ll do a private eye roll at your squeamish doctor, though!

Welcome back on the wagon Chester, and sorry and thanks to everyone else struggling, too.

My yesterday’s twat attack scared the hell out of me, because I decided to see what it had done to my blood glucose. Holy mother of fuck! shock It climbed to 12 in two hours, and then took another three hours to come back to sort of normal. And of course I felt rubbish. Wheat is evil. If I absolutely must comfort eat, let it be cream and berries and dark chocolate!

But on a positive side – we’ve just exchanged on the house we’re buying this morning! [happy dance]

ElBombero I think your dairy plan is good. You can definitely have the 'it's harder for me' prize whilst breastfeeding - and any others who are too, I salute you all. I too think uber camp is terribly hard at the best of times, and maybe bc light is more for bf. Slowly and surely wins the race.

Willie am sniggering at 'mainlining cake' grin

Hello to everybody else, I feel so privileged to be part of this, thank you all for your continuing excellence in all quarters grin

Food yesterday

B - 2 boiled eggs in a cup with a slice of butter

L - Tuna mayo with handful of spinach leaves

S - 2 x pork scratchings

D - Takeaway from Lebanese place - grilled chicken (skin on) garlic mayo and spoonful of tabbouleh (chopped herbs? I think)

4 litres water

Today so far

B - Flat mushroom fried in butter, scrambled duck eggs (2) four strips streaky bacon

Cup of rooibos with 2 teaspns clotted cream

1.5 l water

Thumbwitch Thu 20-Feb-14 11:51:13

Am just mainlining a bar of G&B milk chocolate. In my defence, it's because I had a horrible shock when my baby had a non-breathing episode - he, like DS1, has always had an issue with breathing when they get too worked up, I have to poke them in the solar plexus to get them breathing again - only this time he did it lying on his tummy in the playpen, so I couldn't immediately get to his solar plexus. By the time I'd picked him up because he'd gone rigid, he was on the way to passing out - and then his eyes closed and he was out. At this point, the received opinion is that the baby will start to breathe again - only he didn't.
MIL was here - she said DH used to do the same, only he'd hold his breath until he passed out and then breathe - this isn't the same, and DH had never not started breathing again.
I had to pump his chest, MIL was flicking his ear and shaking his arm, I shook his body (gently!) and then he breathed, thank God! and then he came round slowly and OMFG it was scary.

So. Shock wearing off now, and the need for chocolate was too much for me. Can't have alcohol, it's absolutely counterproductive in this situation, but chocolate is a must.

I'll be good tomorrow.

Thumbwitch Thu 20-Feb-14 11:54:03

He's absolutely fine, btw! Forgot to mention that, sorry!

crabby I definitely think our grumpy misery has got to do with the removal of another crutch. I can almost feel my brain 'fishing' for emotional get outs at times. So yes, first thought would be - a spliff, although, I'm trained out of that now, second thought would be sweeties and crisps, or doughnuts and chocolate bread products, third would possibly be alcohol, but I'm rubbish at drinking so that would inevitably lead to greggs cheese pasties later, or possibly a kebab. My final thoughts, seem to then gravitate towards fury, sadness, and then anxiety.

Having moved through all of these fucking emotional temperatures, I am quite capable of starting the entire process again from scratch, and working on a kind of loop. Trigger points for me are mostly centred around the supermarket. I wonder what subliminal consumer programming we are having to fight off?

Right now I feel I've moved through that for the moment, and am currently treading water in a 'numb' period. My gut instinct tells me, that I'm 'processing' as it were, and that I will develop, mindfully, different coping strategies. This thread (BIWI am in your debt) is one of them. I guess the others are, having a tidy house, having a non chaotic balanced fulfilling life (which I take the credit for, I've worked really fucking hard at it) having a loving relaitionship with my partner/dcs/friends and actually, my lovely job, which gets me out of the house every single day to 'commune with nature' walk the dogs at the park or beach

oh thumbwitch how rotten for you all!

shitting hell thumbwitch. it's terrifying just reading that. i think sugar is supposed to help with shock? hope you're ok

trash interesting re emotional crutch... i'm not a shopaholic by any means but i do notice that there is a high for me associated with buying something new - i have to be careful with that

Thumbwitch Thu 20-Feb-14 12:16:54

Yeah, hot sweet tea is supposed to help, isn't it - never did much for me, but I think the sugar is the thing to counter the adrenalin.

Thanks - I'm getting there!

Trash, that's interesting about the triggers - I think mine involves subliminal self-hatred that I don't do the things I should but sit on the computer instead, thereby getting far too little done.
I have to say that I have been very good at the supermarket though! not even gone into the sweets/chocolate/crisps aisles. And I've never been a happy shopper, so don't get that high that Willie's talking about.

CrabbyWinterBottom Thu 20-Feb-14 12:47:34

Just catching up with thread whilst eating lunch and will do a proper reply later but just wanted to ask...

Thumb what do you mean exactly by pump his chest? How and how hard? How old is he? If you had to exert any pressure at all then I'd get him checked by a doctor.

How terrifying for you. flowers

willie yes me too. It's mainly beauty products (nail varnish/eyeliner) and I noticed I get a high from hearing a certain type of packet crinkle - like the one you get from wipes packets iyswim blush

thumbwitch I worked out a long time ago, that the scathing voice in my head, belonged to my mother even though it sounded/felt like me.

I have to fight the tendency to buy crap for the dcs when I'm not eating any. It's that same crinkle noise from packets of sweets. I love the sound as I'm picking up the packet, and putting it the trolley, or unpacking it at home and putting it away. I've been buying small packets off chocolate eggs, each time I see a different variety, and stashing them in a cupboard in preparation for easter hmm

bettybigballs Thu 20-Feb-14 13:24:57

Bleeeuugghhhhh still feeling grim from my slip last night. Had a bit of a fuck it moment and also drank a bottle of wine AND smoked two cigarettes so no wonder i feel so bloody awful today. I was craving salad so i've had a massive one drenched in olive oil with some pork rillette for lunch.

Here's some thanks and a brew for anyone else struggling this week whether with eating, emotions or downright bad-temperedness!

Crabby i read your post about drinking with interest. We have a very similar background, lots of alcohol problems in our house when i was growing up and if i'm very honest with myself I don't have the most healthy relationship with alcohol. I occasionally use it to numb and anesthesie and have to really watch myself with it. I'm very envious of people who can enjoy a glass of wine with dinner for what it is. I'm not sure i have ever / will ever be able to just have one glass. This WOE is good for me because it really makes me cut down and be super vigilant about my drinking. in my twenties i did weight watchers and would not eat anything for two days a week so i could drink two bottles of wine over the weekend. blush

MrsHughJarse thanks for posting the thought about water intake, i'm the same, i tend to glug a large amount at several times a day rather than sipping, sipping, sipping all the time. Reading that has just made me fill up my bottle and i'm sipping away.

chester i feel you're carby twat pain! Why do we do it to ourselves? we don't even really enjoy it, it makes us feel bad but it's to hard to stop.

Does anyone know of any good reading around the emotional connection with food / eating?

bettybigballs Thu 20-Feb-14 13:25:42

OMG thumb just read your post. Hope you're all ok.

CrabbyWinterBottom Thu 20-Feb-14 13:35:52

Stunt I'd slow roast the pork belly and get lovely crackling on top!

What I really want to do is down a bottle of wine in under 30 seconds and then go out and twist someone's head off with my bare hands. Whilst roaring.

Athel I'm so glad it's not just me who sometimes feels like that!! grin

Oh Humph hope you're feeling better now. envy <<<not envy

Heir glad the interview went well.

El it won't take 5 days to get back into ketosis. I really would advise against fasting whilst breastfeeding. It could affect the quality of your milk and leave you undernourished because your body will deprive you to put the best it can into milk production.

Eva tell us more about your nutrient investigation!

Hugh have you been photographing me in the bath again... wink

Love grin at lily-livered (geddit!) doctor. Prat.

Chester welcome back onto the wagon. smile

Thumb and Steel welcome to the grumpy fucker corner <<chucks cushions to lounge on>>

Thanks Steel, I'm a very anxious person so I'm used to it. grin It waxes and wanes. I'm feeling a bit better now because I've started planning the educational stuff I'm going to do with DD when she gets back, which is what I should have been doing for the last three weeks. hmm Instead, I've been faffing around on this thread mainly! and not getting enough done. I'm in a constant state of fluctuating anxiety about not being productive enough, then work myself into such a state of panic that I'm incapable of tackling the things I need to do. Bonkers! confused Sorry you still struggle with those destructive thoughts sometimes.

These coping mechanisms, however inappropriate they might be, are hard to get away from when we've used them in the past. It's as though we've worn a smooth pathway in our neural circuitry... I feel x therefore I'll do y and I'll feel temporarily better. Even though we know that the next step - z feels worse (ie after we've done y), it's still hard not to trundle off down that pathway again next time we feel x. Sorry, I'm not sure that all made sense outside of my own head... grin

Trashy that fits with what you're saying too... I've had spliff as a coping mechanism, cigarettes, sugary shit, wine... the pattern remains the same even though the substance varies. I'd love to be able to have internal/healthy ways of dealing with those feelings. Your current coping mechanisms sound great, and I think removing one unhealthy crutch (carby food) is going to have a knock on effect on your emotions for a while as you rewire the pathways towards other, better ways of coping. I agree that getting outside is hugely calming. For me, nature photography is really absorbing and calming too.

Steel that's scary about your blood sugars. Are you diabetic? Sorry can't remember.

BIWI Thu 20-Feb-14 13:44:45

Oh my goodness Thumb - that must have been absolutely terrifying. Glad he's OK, but also agree you should talk to your doctor about that.

ElBombero - I think you're being unnecessarily harsh with yourself. Remind yourself that you have lost a stone! That's 14lbs in less than 6 weeks! Most people on this thread would kill to lose that amount.

This is a marathon not a sprint that we're in (as one very clever person once remarked). Slow and steady will win you the race. Honestly!

flowers for everyone who is poorly/struggling/grumpy (delete as applicable)

Sorry I haven't posted much this week but it's really busy at work for me - and tomorrow I have to be up at around 5.30 to go to Leeds again, so will be out of contact for a lot of the time.

CrabbyWinterBottom Thu 20-Feb-14 14:00:47

Betty glad you found that interesting because I was feeling a bit hmm with myself for having over-disclosed as usual! Especially as I haven't made myself anonymous on here at all. blush I think those patterns set in childhood, and how we learn about coping mechanisms from those around us when we're young are really difficult to erase: whether we emulate them or vehemently reject them - they're sort of burned into our circuitry almost. I don't want to do that to DD, and despite how I feel in my darkest moments, I know that I am not my father... I don't behave as he did and he never really had self awareness of who he was and why, I don't think. I'm very different and over-analytical to that. However I do use alcohol as a crutch... shit day = nice glass of wine to relax whilst cooking dinner. Great day = well better have a nice glass of wine to celebrate! It's so ingrained in our culture and tbh, I'm never going to entirely get away from that because I love drinking! I do find it much easier to stick to no wine during the week, though, when I'm on this WOE. I'd love to be, but will never be, someone who is happy to have half a glass of red with dinner and leave the rest. I'll always have to watch myself, I know that. I wonder if that's true for all children of heavy drinking/alcoholic parents?

Anyway look this is what happens when I pop on to catch up with the thread at lunchtime - I get all involved and witter on for hours!

HumphreyCobbler Thu 20-Feb-14 14:05:29

Goodness Thumbwitch. how scary for you. so glad all is ok now

thanks for all advice and kind words. I had such a high temp that I didn't really remember posting! I was also confused as to how to get into bed hmm

had a lot of water but it only stays down if i drink tiny amounts, i did neck a glass of peach squash but that was not a success.

Hope your busy day goes well BIWI

Thumbwitch Thu 20-Feb-14 14:05:41

Crabby - he's 16mo, and I only had to push down a couple of times, not hard enough to crack anything, more I was just doing a more heel of the hand version of my usual solar plexus poke while I was holding him on my lap. I've spoken to the doctors before about both of them doing this inability to catch their breath thing, and they've never been worried - but I think I may make an appt to tell the GP about this one, because it does rather go against the whole "if they pass out they'll start breathing again" thing that they tell you. I have hyperventilation issues myself, always have had - but never to that extent.

trashcan - I have to admit that I've bought easter eggs. In Australia, they do more versions of the Cadbury's mini filled eggs - ones filled with Turkish Delight, and strawberry cream (Something that a friend and I imagined a tree in our playground was covered in when we were about 8) - they were on special offer the other day, at nearly half price if you bought 4 bags - I may have bought rather a lot some. grin

We are all ok - I need to check with DS1 tomorrow that he is really ok, as he was a bit bothered after the event, when he realised that it was a bit scary; but I think he'll be ok too. DS2 is fine. smile

CrabbyWinterBottom Thu 20-Feb-14 14:16:36

Thumb I expect you're in bed by now. Please don't think I was trying to panic you or anything!

If the pressure you applied to his chest was similar to the pressure you'd apply when doing chest compressions (CPR), then I would take him to the docs to get checked over. Babies have very pliable bones so their sternum and ribcage don't give as much protection to their thoracic organs as in an older child/adult. This would all depend on how old he is, too.

I'm sure you do it very gently, which is no problem, but similarly with abdominal or solar plexus pressure - if it requires anything like the pressure you'd use to do an abdominal thrust (the old heimlich manoeuvre) then he should be checked out afterwards (in fact abdo thrusts aren't done on babies under 1 yr old, chest compressions are used instead in cases of choking). I'm probably totally overreacting here and you just give them a tiny poke, so please forgive me if this is all redundant advice.

Have you ever tried giving them a little rescue breath when they stop breathing? Just a gentle one (airway open, pinching nose closed/mouth over nose and mouth in small baby, and a gentle 1 second blow into mouth) might stimulate the breathing reflex?

Right really must go now!

CrabbyWinterBottom Thu 20-Feb-14 14:17:15

Oh god cross posted, sorry!

captainmummy Thu 20-Feb-14 14:22:22

How awful Thumb! Def get him checked out. sad Chocolate is definitely advised in this case. (I always thought the chocolate 'prescribed' for Harry Potter et al was a damn good thing - you know, when they were terrified by the Dementors...)
Steel - congrats on house-exchange! And I agree about wheat-is-evil. My DP is wheat-intolerant, we found out whilst doing this WOE. His errrrrm 'digestive problems' have eased to the point of disappearing. TG!

Suzymoo9 Thu 20-Feb-14 14:33:42

Thumb - that was an ordeal, how awful. My ds used to have febrile convulsions & they were terrifying - we used to get him checked out after - different scenario from yours I know - your chocolate is very well deserved.

Lovecat hopefully the tranexamic pills will help lighten things up for you. Your doc sounds funny grin. I only just discovered those pills last year (I am 49 and suffered for years) when a new doctor who looked about 10 suggested them to me. I'd never heard of them before.

Thumbwitch Thu 20-Feb-14 14:53:47

Oh lord no, Crabby, I've done those chest compressions on a first aid course and it was nothing like as intense! nor as harsh as a heimlich manouevre, either.
No, never needed to try the mouth-breath until today, but while I was thinking about doing that I was doing the pushing on his chest and he started to breathe again before I needed to go further than think about it. Under normal circs, the solar plexus poke is more effective as he's usually thrashing his head around trying to breathe so trying to get him into a position to do that mouth breath would be very much harder and take much longer.

I'm sure it's a diaphragm thing. I shall investigate further though - DS1 seems to have grown out of it, but I haven't - still having troubles breathing normally now, a few hours later (hysterical hyperventilation ishoos).

DurhamDurham Thu 20-Feb-14 16:29:45

Thumbwitch glad all is well, here's a thanks and a brew and a large glass of wine to have with a big fat slice of cake

SteeleyeStan Thu 20-Feb-14 16:30:06

Thumb Oh no, how horrible! I’m so glad he’s okay now, but what a shock! I hope you’re all gradually relaxing. thanks

Crabby and Trash - all your talk about emotional crutches sounds very familiar. I’m often quite angry with myself that I don’t allow myself to have any sleeping pills or anything of the kind in the house anymore. I even made my GP write in my files that I shouldn’t be given any, because I’m an addiction twat at anything that comes by. Crabby’s explanation about following old pathways makes perfect sense to me at least. smile

I’m not diabetic, but I’m sure if I ever went to a GTT and got results like that, I’d soon get a diagnosis for it. The thing is, my blood sugars have been nice and low and very stable whenever I’m eating properly. This just goes to show that while there are people out there who can eat bread and other carby crap and be perfectly healthy, I’m not one of those people!

Betty I hope you feel better soon; at least the salad sounds nice. I’ve got Geneen Roth’s Breaking Free from Emotional Eating right next to me on my shelf, but I’m not sure if it’s good or not… I’ve read it, and it made a lot of sense, but it hasn’t been all that useful for me personally.

It’s a busy day organising stuff for the house-to-be, but I treated myself for much needed haircut. After yesterday I’m not even aiming for ubercamp-like low low carbs. I’m not in a great place mentally, so I’ll stick to what I can.

Foods today:
B: Fried eggs and coffee with coconut oil.
L: Smoked salmon with cream cheese, cherry tomatoes and green pepper.
S: Small amount of blueberries with double cream.
D: Lamb steak and fresh spinach.

i'm getting horrible heartburn at the moment and i don't know why, it's never happened before except for when i was eating carbs and even then not frequently. i wondered whether it was happening when i was eating later on the days i go into the office (about 20.45 - no way of eating earlier than this because i don't get home until about 20.15), but it's the same on the days i work from home and i eat earlier

i've got it now and i last ate tuna mayonnaise and salad at about midday. i've had a coffee though so it could be caffeine?? though i don't drink coffee when i get in from work in teh evenings...

has anyone else had this?

Notsoskinnyminny Thu 20-Feb-14 17:27:57

Thumb you must've been so frightened, glad he's ok now.

Elbomb be kind to yourself, when I bf DS I was advised by my MW I needed 3000+ calories a day and to snack all day on cold cuts of meat and add cheese to everything although we did have rice most nights - easy to eat with one hand whilst rocking the little cherub, who cried through every meal, with the other.

Humph hope you're feeling a bit better

Chester stop beating yourself up

Lovecat hope the TA works for you, I was never able to get on with it but it does stop the flooding.

BIWI I love Leeds for shopping - I think I was more upset than DD when she didn't get the grades to study there.

Had a piggy day today, went to Cafe Rouge for lunch with DH, courtesy of my tesco clubcard vouchers, and had steak drowned in garlic butter I now reek and salad but then succumbed to a pudding which was delicious so I don't care. I'll probably just have some ff yoghurt and a bpc later.

Off to pick DS up from the station. He set off at 7.15 this morning to walk the 2 miles so I could have a sleep in.

Lovecat Thu 20-Feb-14 18:00:34

Thumb, how terrifying! Deffo get him checked out (and enjoy the chocolate).

Notso and Suzymoo thanks - I've just realised he told me to take from day 1 of TOM but didn't tell me when to stop taking them! Do you just take them while you're bleeding?

Humph I hope you're feeling better now.

Notso, how lovely of your DS!

Right, I'm off to decorate a batch of cupcakes I just made with DD. We experimented with flavours and colours and made 2 each of lavender, rose, mint chop chip, strawberry, lemon and chocolate. The mint choc chip ones smell amazing and I am straining at the leash not to devour them in one gulp...

LittleMissDisorganized Thu 20-Feb-14 18:04:49

Crabby great posts and the neural pathways things is definitely right and shows why when you change the behaviour it takes a lot of repetitions before you lose your default setting.

and Trash and others that have mentioned this I absolutely agree about getting your feelings back when you give up your way of stuffing them down. And that "sitting with your feelings" things that therapists are so fond of mentioning is so hard. I manage to find other ways of dealing with it - I journal, and have started art-journalling intermittently with encouragement from my counsellor and they both help - but when I feel bad the motivation to actually do it is hard to find. The sitting with it I don't manage very well at all - a kind of acceptance that doesn't try to make the feelings change - but isn't it natural to try and cheer yourself up? Whether by creating something, or going out for some fresh air, or distracting yourself, etc... but I guess I am also getting better at saying it's ok... to grieve and hurt, without forcing it away, just trying to keep going while feeling it.

thumb how scary - glad you coped so well with it

ElBombero I also think you are giving yourself such a hard time. I know life is difficult just now, and maybe pre-children weight feels like something you can fix? You're doing amazingly well, but mostly I really hope you can get to enjoy food again.

Chester glad you are straight back on the wagon

So many other powerful posts yesterday. I think all addicts shapeshift tbh - food is an easy one to shift to, because it's encouraged in early sobriety. I think love/ sex is another big one too.

I think I've got dairy issues. I would have said before bootcamp I was sensitive to dairy and used soya milk and yogurt, although I had successfully reintroduced cheese shortly after withdrawing dairy 2 years ago. Starting bootcamp I increased my dairy massively, and ditched soya yogurt as I couldn't find one without polyols in, and so have dairy daily, sometimes quite a lot, in the form of yogurt and cream and cream cheese and cheese. My digestive issues aren't too bad, probably because of giving up wheat - but I had a cold with sinusitis for a couple of weeks and this week I just can't shift the sinus symptoms - which were what I had trouble with for years and years until I gave up dairy.
So. I probably need to withdraw it, the soya yogurt will have to do, it doesn't need cream in the same way (because of the polyols!), no cream in vegetables, or cream cheese, and probably withdraw cheese for a while too. A week isn't long enough - 2-3 is the minimum. But. My sinuses might get better anyway. And a bigger but, what if it makes this WOE unsustainable for me? I have kept to it like nothing before and I'm enjoying my food and I don't want to struggle with carby temptations just because I've made it too restrictive.

Sorry to witter on about relatively minor stuff - struggling with the right decision.

Oh, and I went swimming and it finally doesn't feel like swimming through jelly!! Slow ketoadaptation at the same time as post op recovery has meant that I've not picked it up nearly as fast and it's been a bit of a struggle rather than my usual enjoyment.

LittleMissDisorganized Thu 20-Feb-14 18:11:34

That took me so long to write it's crossed with half the world.
Lovecat yes just whilst you're bleeding
Willie coffee on an empty stomach does that to me too, it's a gastric irritatant, but I have had stomach issues for a while...

thanks LMD

the no dairy shouldn't make this WOE unsustainable unless you really really love it. can you cope with butter or is that a problem too?

Can I have a bit of advice?
Feels like I havent stopped eating today sad

B: Two fried eggs and bacon.
L: Two roast chicken drumsticks and a chicken thigh.
Snacks: Mincemeat patty (DH was making burgers), and some jelly and double cream.
D: Whole courgette with carbonara sauce made of butter, cream, cheese, egg, bacon.

Is this far too much food? I know this isnt calorie counting but Im all confused

Notsoskinnyminny Thu 20-Feb-14 18:51:57

Lovecat I used to take it days 2-4 as my first day was never heavy but it worked pretty quickly for me it was just a shame about the cramps. By day 5 I don't need to be as close to the loo all the time so didn't take it.

I love making cupcakes but hate cleaning the kitchen afterwards - icing sugar and black counters don't mix grin

CrabbyWinterBottom Thu 20-Feb-14 18:52:35

Monkey looks ok but where are your veg?? I think that so long as you are eating low carb, then if you're hungry... eat. But you need vegetables in there, that's where you're getting a lot of your nutrients. Your hunger could be because your body wants vitamins!

captainmummy Thu 20-Feb-14 18:54:42

Monkey - If you're hungry, eat! All looks LC so that's good. How's the water?

And no - no calorie counting!

CrabbyWinteryBottom Thu 20-Feb-14 19:15:44

LittleMiss your post really resonated with me...

I absolutely agree about getting your feelings back when you give up your way of stuffing them down. And that "sitting with your feelings" things that therapists are so fond of mentioning is so hard.

This is exactly it LittleMiss... all these compulsive coping mechanisms (overeating, overdrinking, smoking, most other recreational and some prescription drugs) are about stuffing down the feelings. I find sitting with my feelings when they're really overwhelming pretty much impossible.

I manage to find other ways of dealing with it - I journal, and have started art-journalling intermittently with encouragement from my counsellor and they both help

I can let it out in other ways, as you say; photography is my main one I guess, and just getting out in nature with crazy cocker as Trashy said earlier.

but when I feel bad the motivation to actually do it is hard to find.

This is the crux of it for me! When I am feeling 'normal', ie not depressed or temporarily deranged, then I know the things I need to do and I can find the wherewithall to do them. It might be hard, and I might find myself arguing a lot with my elephant, but ultimately I can do the stuff that I know will ultimately make me feel better than resorting to those familiar old short-term-relief neural pathways which do the trick at the time but end up causing more problems. But when I'm in that mad hormonal space or in a more long-lasting funk, then all that stuff is irrelevant because despite knowing what I need to do, it feels impossible.

The sitting with it I don't manage very well at all - a kind of acceptance that doesn't try to make the feelings change - but isn't it natural to try and cheer yourself up? Whether by creating something, or going out for some fresh air, or distracting yourself, etc...

I think that we are conditioned to look for a way to change our feelings/cheer ourselves up outside of ourselves. The short cut ones... food, cigs, booze, other drugs... they are a quick fix. Exercise is a healthy one but can be extreme. Compulsive behaviour, from self harm to OCD cleaning is on the same track.

I really wish I knew what the answer is, but I don't!!

but I guess I am also getting better at saying it's ok... to grieve and hurt, without forcing it away, just trying to keep going while feeling it.

I think you are right here, but I don't think I'm strong enough to do that. I feel that it would be so overwhelming that I couldn't continue with day to day normality, and I'm totally scared of that. I have massive admiration for you, being able to do that, I really do.

Must go because dinner's ready and I've splurged far too intimate stuff everywhere as usual. blush grin

BTW Steel so sorry totally missed earlier that you'd exchanged on the house. Congratulations! flowers

ElBombero Thu 20-Feb-14 19:24:21

Thanks everyone, do feel a lot better today. I was being far too critical and thinking I need uber was silly and it made me binge. Back on bootcamp lite today and feel quite relaxed. BF sausages and celeriac chips was yummy.

Again thanks, don't know what if do without you lot winethankswinethanks

willie I had the most shockingly bad heartburn last week, it was just awful. I have changed nothing but it's gone now - I wondered if it was an adjustment to the food making my juices tougher to break down harder food but am aware that I just made that up out of my head confused.

lovecat yes you just take them whilst bleeding. Are they still massive and do you take six a day? I had them years ago, but couldn't get it together enough to keep taking them.

littlemiss great post. I have not had much in the way of therapy, but I really get the idea of sitting with my feelings. I have described it as 'surfing the wave'

I guess routine has been the greatest of my saviours in dark times - which I struggle with so much less now I have a routine that is my own creation.

Also I discovered that flashbacks are not just momentary things. They can last for hours or days and can be emotional as opposed to things one sees or hears - so a mood can be understood as a flashback and this has helped me to accept the situation in my head and believe it will pass.

Lighthousekeeping Thu 20-Feb-14 20:15:56

Someone at wotk told me that I'm dissappear today!

Im having loads of water, 4-5l a day with lime cordial
I usually have lettuce/sprouts/asparagus etc but just not today. I struggle with veg at the best of times-vile stuff grin

What a compliment lighthouse!

LittleMissDisorganized Thu 20-Feb-14 20:33:31

Eek, Crabby that was impressive dissecting.
I wonder what couldn't continue with day to day normality looks like? I am grateful that I've been forced to have time to try and learn. Because as circumstances had it, when my life fell apart after my accident over a year and a half ago, that day to day normality got completely ripped apart without my consent. And so I've had time and though some of the pain hasn't lessened I've maybe learned to live and feel. I never imagined my life would turn out like this but I'm really grateful for the completely hidden blessings of it.

I think Willie it's just that I've become quite dependent on the dairy - yogurt as my breakfast staple (which is why I need to reinstate the soya substitute), probably cheese of some variety at at least 1 meal. If I dropped butter would I be best to switch to coconut oil? Not sure I fancy the sound of omelettes, spinach etc all in it. I think I have a very low opinion of my sticking ability as well!! - because I'm kind of thinking, well, some people sustain it but I'm a bit rubbish generally at eating changes and the emotional eating is lurking and waiting for me.

Lmd I know that knife edge feeling that you could so easily slip back into old habits. But Fgs you have given up alcohol so you do have evidence of your sticking ability! I know it's different but it still takes some of the same strength that you've already demonstrated.

Unless you're actually lactose/camp intolerant/allergy maybe butter would still be ok even if you give up the other dairy? I have to keep cheese and cream down of I want to lose weight and they do make me feel sort o stodgy

flucketycluck Thu 20-Feb-14 20:53:30

Just trying to catch up but to all the grumpy fuckers in need of a violent hobby I can thoroughly recommend body combat! 1hr of punching & kicking definitely relieves the stress & you're too knackered at the end to do any real harm to your nearest & dearest grin

BIWI Thu 20-Feb-14 20:59:31

monkeyface - the rule is, if you're hungry, then eat! Don't worry about calories.

As long as you're eating enough fat and drinking enough water, it should be fine.

But you aren't eating anywhere near enough veg! That's where your carbs are supposed to come from.

BIWI Thu 20-Feb-14 21:00:13

And please don't tell me you're really drinking lime cordial!

Seri77 Thu 20-Feb-14 21:01:28

Trashcan I totally agree about emotional flashback. It triggered a massive fall into carbs for me last autumn when something random on a day out triggered a flashback to the feeling of helpless terror I had during my child's birth. It lasted for days and coloured everything I did and thought. I'd never had that before and I had no defences. Hence the carbfest and the extra 6kg I have still not fully got rid of.

EvaTheOptimist Thu 20-Feb-14 21:09:46

Wow Chester losing half a tooth seems particularly unfair! ouch.

Thumbwitch how incredibly traumatic for you. Well done indeed for bringing him round.

LittleMiss if you have a dairy intolerence I think that has to come first. Can the soya yogurt etc can substitute in a way so you don't feel deprived? I have no idea of the carbiness or otherwise of soya yogurt/milk. Also I don't know what a polyol is! Perhaps the thing is to find substitutes for the way you use dairy, rather than the dairy itself. So can you plan your favourite non-dairy meals?; Is there a good sauce that can substitute for cheesy/creamy sauces? (The one with Crabby's fish stew might be worth investigating, seems to involve stock and alioli?) Can you line up a tempting easy snack option, instead of cheese?

Also - well done with the swimming! (I did shred for the second time today... I can barely walk now. A day off tomorrow!!)

EvaTheOptimist Thu 20-Feb-14 21:54:34

Crabby you made the mistake of asking about the vitamins and minerals! Nerdish alert.

This list is just for food allowed on this WOE. Fortunately there is something against each vitamin or mineral. A bit random, as I compiled this list from 4 different websites on the subject. Amazing how important leafy green veg (and nuts) are!

Vitamin A: Liver, crab, eggs, carrots, kale, spinach, broccoli, salmon, dairy products

Vitamin B1 (Thiamin):Pork, ham, beef, milk, nuts

Vitamin B2 (Riboflavin):Yogurt, cheese, pork, beef, liver, tuna, eggs, broccoli, spinach, nuts

Vitamin B3 (Niacin):Tuna, liver, turkey, chicken, salmon, beef, pork, haddock, scallops, asparagus, nuts, dairy

Vitamin B5:Eggs, mushrooms, avocados, yogurt

Vitamin B6:Liver, shellfish, fish, chicken, pork, beef, eggs, avocado, brussel sprouts, nuts, spinach

Vitamin B7:Salmon, eggs, avocados

Vitamin B12:Liver, trout, beef, crab, shellfish, fish, lamb, tuna, eggs, cheese, poultry

Vitamin C:Tomatoes, peppers, broccoli, cauliflower, brussel sprouts and other veg

Vitamin D: sun… and salmon, tuna, mackerel, beef liver, chicken liver, egg yolks, cheese, mushrooms

Vitamin E: Olive oil, nuts, avocados, spinach, asparagus, broccoli

Vitamin K: Broccoli, tuna, avocado, spinach

Calcium: Milk, yogurt, cheese, spinach, broccoli

Choline (a B vitamin):Eggs, milk, broccoli, sprouts

Chromium:Fats, oils, broccoli, green beans

Copper: Nuts, mushrooms, shellfish, shrimps

Folic Acid: Asparagus, spinach, brussel sprouts, lettuce, broccoli, nuts

Iodine: Cod, tuna, yogurt, cheese

Iron: Liver, beef, pork, tuna, leafy green veg, asparagus, nuts, poultry, shellfish

Magnesium:Nuts, spinach, yogurt, cheese, chicken, beef, pork

Manganese:Nuts, spinach

Molybdenum:Nuts, milk, spinach

Phosphorus:Yogurt, cheese, pork, beef, tuna, chicken, salmon, eggs, nuts

Potassium:Tomato, celery, artichokes, carrots, broccoli, avocado, fish, beef, pork, lamb, chicken, yogurt

Selenium: Tuna, shrimp, fish, liver, ham, beef, bacon, chicken, lamb, eggs

Zinc: Liver, beef, crab, lamb, turkey, pork, chicken, cheese, nuts

Lookslikerain Thu 20-Feb-14 22:13:21

I haven't managed to catch up with the thread but wanted to say thanks for the pork belly advice. I managed to crisp it enough under the grill but, let's just say, it's a good job DH and I have all our own teeth. It was a tad crunchier than I'd hoped! BIWI I may buy some pork rind from morrisons just to try it in the microwave!

Woolfey glad you enjoyed the sprouts. I've just added another kilo bag to my online shopping. DH was disappointed earlier when I said the sprout season ends soon. He didn't even eat them until we met!

Interesting what's been said about breastfeeding. I still feed 2yo DD. She only feeds bedtime and early morning and during the day if she can get away with it, but I wonder if that's affected my weight loss. I don't have much it lose so always assumed it'd go slowly but I bet bf hasn't helped.

I'm definitely losing inches though. I could probably get my trousers down now without undoing the button. <classy>

And sympathies to all the grumpy people out there. I share your grumpiness. I nearly lost it with a self service checkout the other day. Stupid machines.

Off to catch up...

daisychicken Thu 20-Feb-14 22:21:30

Eva - I wonder how much of a foodstuff against each vitamin/mineral you'd need over a week to get the vitamins and minerals you need? For example, for Vit D I have very low levels and take GP prescribed supplements (plus extra multivits and minerals) but if I was just relying on the foods listed for that item.. I eat very little fish and I don't like liver so I wonder how much cheese or mushrooms I would actually need to get my requirements?! My GP said we shouldn't rely on the sun in this country (& I figure my body proves this as I used to be outside daily for hours at a time...!) I also wonder if how you prepare the food affects the nutrient content - obviously it does but I wonder how well we could actually rely on that list if cooking the food reduces the nutrients - is that list based on the raw nutrient values?? Certainly interesting reading!

Had tea at Nandos tonight (ds1s prebirthday party)... plenty of low carb options and was yum!

SteeleyeStan Thu 20-Feb-14 22:36:08

Thank you Crabby. smile We've been stuck in a "temporary" flat for 8 and a half years so this is a big deal for us, and it's been fair few months since we made our offer, so it's a relief to have things moving, finally.

I'm finding a lot of this talk here quite triggering, actually. Hmm.

Thank you for the details, Eva. Very interesting!

Yep, lime, lemon, and vimto NAS squashes with my water. I swear, I have tried, I really have, to drink plain water but I CANT.

The good news is Ive given up my 8 cans/2l Pepsi Max a day. I now have just the one can with my dinner.

The squashes all say 0.3g carbs per 100ml.

And Ive lost 19lb since Jan 1st so cant be going too far wrong.

Today was bad on the veg front, but isnt usually. Tomorrow I will have shredded iceberg with fried eggs for breakfast, roast chicken salad for lunch, and a baked camembert with asparagus to dunk for dinner.

EvaTheOptimist Thu 20-Feb-14 22:51:50

Daisy that's beyond even my nerdish capabilities! I noticed for a few vitamins/minerals it is possible to have too much. And for others eg Molybdenum you only need a tiny tiny amount. I'd carry on taking the vitamin D supplements if I was you. (I think cheese and mushrooms are fairly minor sources of vitamin D, the mushrooms only appeared on one of the 4 websites I looked at too!) If you weren't eating low-carb, the only other source of vitamin D you'd encounter would be fortified breakfast cereals.

fyi daisy and eva mushrooms vitamin d content rises hugely if you put them in the sun/outside for half an hour before you cook them.

Ambassadoryouarespoilingme Fri 21-Feb-14 07:59:49

Hi all
Just checking in.
Am struggling a bit in keeping going because I seem to bobbing up and down the same three lbs over and over. Hand on heart I'm being fairly good, and I like the food so as long as I plan its OK. But when tiredness strikes, so do those food gremlins, telling me that chocolate and a pint of wine are the answer.

But I'm another one with historical eating issues, inc bulimia, so those demons are never far away. Part of why I'm doing this is to find a long term approach to eating which is sane and semi normal. I have two young daughters and I desperately want them to have normal relationships with food and body image, so I don't want them to witness me on any weird diets with shakes and bars for dinner. Its easier to have a family dinner and just not have the potatoes. So that ramble is to say to Crabby and others struggling with addictive feelings, that I get it. I also used to overindulge in drink and drugs, and still have no off-button with wine.
For Pseudo and ElBombero, I BFed for nearly a year with each and struggled to lose anything. Once I stopped the weight started to gradually reduce

I hope you all have a good day. I don't post every day but I do read the thread daily and I so appreciate all your support.

Suzymoo9 Fri 21-Feb-14 08:03:43

Lovecat - I usually take them for about 5-6 days - experiment with it. I find saving 2 to take just before bed really helps me throught the night. Hope they work for you.

captainmummy Fri 21-Feb-14 08:09:26

Eva and Daisy - when (if) we get any sun, that is the best, most easily accessible, and cheapest source of Vit D! Get outside. Get some sun on your skin.

Ambassador - lots of others have posted tha same; not losing as much as they'd like, bobbing up and down with the same lbs. Keep going. It is a marathon, not a sprint. The weight didn't go on overnight, it won't come off overnight (and other platitudes, sorry! ) Hand in there. It will come off, slowly, safely.

ChesterDrawers Fri 21-Feb-14 08:39:07

So glad I got through yesterday. Feeling much better physically and mentally already. Amazing what a difference a day makes.

Just had lovely breakfast - two poached eggs sprinkled with a tiny bit of cheddar, half a left over sausage sliced, left over mashed swede and celeriac patty and mushrooms all fried in lashings of butter. Feeling ready to face the day now.

Fridays are odd as I am off with DS and we generally meet with friends. Today we'll be out most of the day so not sure what food will be available when but I am fine to go without if there's nothing suitable.

Tea is belly pork strips, although I could do with a way of cooking them that won't see me lose any more teeth. Ideas?

SayraT Fri 21-Feb-14 08:57:54

Great night last night....thank goodness the boss said we could all just come in whenever we wanted! I'm going in for morning coffee at 10 grin

Dinner was good and I did manage to avoid some carbs but not all. Starter was a goats cheese tart which I ate the inside of, it had beetroot though so that was probably higher carbs. Main was chicken wrapped in bacon with mashed potatoes and veg, so I left the potato, luckily the guy next to me said "oh yeah you don't like mashed potato do you? I remember you saying that before". Dessert was a cheesecake with marshmallows in it, I had a spoonful but it was too sweet so left the rest.

I did consume calories in the form of red wine but I think I needed the instant energy from the wine to keep up with the dancing grin

Dancing was fab, the people who had never done it before picked it up quite quickly but with ceilidh dancing it doesn't matter at all if you do it wrong.

Today

B: Coffee with cream
L: ? got some vegetables to take but nothing else
D: Another night out tonight so again need to see what there is and avoid carbs

Avoiding wine tonight will be fine, I don't drink a lot anyway and normally drive cause I live miles away from the city. Last night people kept saying "are you drinking?!"

And I weighed myself yesterday and today and I am now a whole stone down, I will bear that in mind for Monday weigh in if three nights out in a row cause me problems. Got yet another night out on Saturday which i organised ages ago "because we don't do enough" hmm it just ended up being on the busiest week I've had for ages.

daisychicken Fri 21-Feb-14 09:23:14

trashcan that's really interesting! I shall make sure my mushrooms get sun in future!

eva I did animal nutrition at Uni.... we never touched on changes in nutrients from cooking veg/processing foodstuffs (it was animals rather than humans!) but I do find it all very intriguing...

captain I used to spend hours a day outside every day of the year! it made no difference to my Vit D levels, in fact my GP said we only have a very short window of time in the UK per year to get Vit D from the sun as the sun is only strong enough during the short summer months and if we have a bad summer, then we can't get enough full stop.. I still make sure I spend time outside in the sun but take supplements and my GP recommended I gave the rest of the family multivits as well as she feels everyone should take Vit D supplements and that boosting other levels won't hurt either.

LittleMissDisorganized Fri 21-Feb-14 11:00:49

Morning all,
Steeleye I'm sorry you're feeling triggered... I hope you are keeping safe and looking after yourself.
Eva " substitutes for the way you use dairy " - that's really wise. Soya milk is low carb. Soya yogurt has polyols which are the not-quite-artificial sweeteners that they put in Atkins bars and diabetic chocolate etc. But, carb wise it's a gram or so more per 100g than Total. That's ok. And I haven't found I've needed to snack and I'm like someone else said, I like cooked cheese in things but otherwise don't really eat it. I think when I initially gave up dairy, it seemed huge. Then when I started to think about it I realised it wasn't going to be all that terrible. Maybe I'm getting there now...
Thank you, and also to Willie, for helping me think all this through, I am really grateful smile

I've got a couple of days without commitments - going out on the bus to the shops (still a big deal for me), going to snuggle with some arty stuff in front of the curling and an evening where DH isn't going out so we can spend some time together - looking forward to it. smile

teaandthorazine Fri 21-Feb-14 11:49:26

Sorry everyone, will come back later to do a proper post - just SMS to say that I've been given a box of hotel chocolat pralines for something work-related (nice!) - and they are TOO SWEET! Will be going in the bin shock

Also...scales are sts BUT I realised this morning I can now remove my favourite black work trousers without even undoing the zip! Soooo....non-scale victories anyone?!

Hope everyone's ok, will try to catch up later flowers

MyPreciousRing Fri 21-Feb-14 12:25:34

I really can't keep up with the thread!
I'm so sorry.
So well done to the losers and to the non scale victories.
Big hugs and keep on keeping in to those who have STS or put on.
I'd like to change my weigh in day to Friday - always the best figure of the week! grin
Not to worry. Planning on being super strict this weekend so hopefully be down even a little more by Monday.
Happy LCing everybody

Lighthousekeeping Fri 21-Feb-14 12:26:02

I've got a 13th birthday tomorrow which is sure to include cup cakes. I don't mind that so much but I've said I'll take her to pizza Express/Nandos/GBK on Sunday. It's going to be challenging.

daisychicken Fri 21-Feb-14 12:34:39

light I took my ds and friends for birthday treat at Nandos last night... It's actually surprisingly friendly for low carb. I had butterflied chicken with ratouille there were other veg sides or 3-4 LC friendly salads. I have to say my meal was yum!

StuntNun Fri 21-Feb-14 13:06:57

Quick question peeps. I'm not well and haven't been eating or able to keep water down and I think it is affecting my breastmilk supply as DS3 is crying at the breast. Would it be okay to have some Coke mixed with water to sip to try and get my hydration and electrolyte levels up or is that completely stupid?

PseudoBadger Fri 21-Feb-14 14:02:16

Stunt - I think it's more important to rehydrate and balance your salts and sugars so go ahead. Hope you feel better soon!

BIWI Fri 21-Feb-14 14:03:12

StuntNun - no it's not stupid. Your hydration levels are more important at this point than worrying about carbs. Hope you're feeling better soon
flowers

HumphreyCobbler Fri 21-Feb-14 14:09:10

StuntNun, I am in the same postition and I have been drinking squash.

I must say, the illness inspired whoosh fairy has been, my stomach looks as if it has lost a few inches.

HeirToTheIronThrone Fri 21-Feb-14 14:21:54

Popping in to SMS, not about food really (babybels and spicy chicken broth today, not very hungry) but more to let you all know I am down to the last two for the job! They just called and asked me to go to a second interview next week.

Hooray! It was the pick me up I need, as have been slipping into carby twat-dom the last couple of days with biscuits and sweeties on hand at work due to general tiredness/illness/lethargy.

This weekend I plan to eat impressively well, go for a walk on the beach (if they have cleared the landslides up, eek!) and sort out our horribly untidy flat. PMA and all that grin

BIWI Fri 21-Feb-14 14:23:13

Woo hoo! Brilliant news, Heir! Fingers crossed that you are The One that they want flowers

Lighthousekeeping Fri 21-Feb-14 14:38:55

I'm just in a Mexican street food place. Hate eating on my own. The music is ace and I just want a margarita ! I've ordered Guacamole and fennel pork scratchings. God knows what they will be like.

sybilfaulty Fri 21-Feb-14 14:43:17

Lovely news, Heir. Fingers crossed it all comes good.

Stunt, I agree with BIWI that all bets are off when you are ill. If you are drinking coke, try putting a bit of water in it to make it flat (easier to get and keep down) and a pinch of salt to help your electrolyte balance. It's rotten being ill, but doubly so with a BF baby. Get better and let the carbs take care of themselves til you are feeling yourself again flowers

Someone linked to a lovely roasted broccoli recipe with garlic, parmesan, lemon and chilli. Oh my word. It is AMAZING. I'll never do boiled or steamed again.

Rubbish cold here with dripping nose so I've had some medicine as I am out to the opera tonight so cant sneeze through it. Now a DVD for the kids beckons as I have a wee snooze. Got to love half term.

Have a good evening everyone

Lighthousekeeping Fri 21-Feb-14 14:56:46

I can't testosterone these re fried beans set before me. I never even ordered thrm

StuntNun Fri 21-Feb-14 14:58:39

Thanks guys, I went for half apple juice half water in the end, just sipping at it not like my usual habit of downing pints of water but I'll need some sodium as well, maybe I'll suck a couple of salted almonds. I suppose lucozade is ideal but I can't stand the stuff. It's doubly bad as DS3 is just getting over the same thing so he wants to feed more than usual to sort his sore tummy.

Lighthousekeeping Fri 21-Feb-14 15:03:55

OMG spell check or what!!

Anyway, for the first time in my life I have left most of the refried beans, the pork scratchings that were really puffed up fancy crisps and both tortillas just ate the filling. Is this progress? It's very new to me.

LittleMissDisorganized Fri 21-Feb-14 15:08:57

Heir that's brilliant, I'm so pleased for you and glad it's given you a boost. Do you think the application I'm waiting to hear about at the moment might join you?!! Enjoy that positive feeling this weekend - you don't need biscuits to feel better, you can feel good about yourself anyway.

StuntNun : Whatever works when you're that poorly. If you feel like cheddars/ toast (just things I've managed when I've been that unwell) then have them. Oral Rehydration Solution (Dioralyte) is essentially made of a litre of water, 6 dessert spoons of sugar, and 1/2 teaspoon of salt. Those have the vital molecules to push the water through your small intestine, as you probably know with your other hat on. You can then flavour it as you like, a good slug of hi-juice type squash if you have any is a good thing to flavour it with and take away the taste of the salt (and not too awful on the way back up). Flat coke/ lemonade is fine if that's all you can manage but it is a bit short on salt.

Anyone else watching the curling? It's a bit one sided. DH and I watched the second half of the bronze match this morning and it was brilliant. I'm munching egg-in-a-bowl-instead-of-a-cup as explained by our (mostly) Scottish posters with the peppery version of boursin (which is 2-for-1 in Sainsbury's at the moment in case anyone is interested). I did lots of walking earlier, and was in M+S where I didn't buy anything not allowed, including clothes, as I agreed to get to a stone and a half with DH for that. 17.5lb as of this morning. Almost but not quite!!

MrsHughJarse Fri 21-Feb-14 15:19:46

goodness, what a lot I have missed., disclosures, sharing of addictive pasts, " addictive shape-shifters" , falling off wagons and arms outstretched to nurture back on. What an amazing bunch..... there must be a book in it <don't look at me...... am not a literary type.... maybe Biwi should publish her memoirs grin>

Gosh - what a lot - happy Friday everyone as we embark on another weekend. I have survived half term with despair or violence ( DD1 rather challenging at nearly 17, DD2 calm and the peacemaker, DD3 is aged 3...need I say more !)

going as far back as page 11......thumbwich echoing calls to get your little one checked out apnoeas always need to medic review.

chester.. you're back onboard your elephant - hold tight !

mpr I agree Fri/ Sat nights are killers - am around too for a pm tonight if anyone want a stick or handhold. I am going to try and keep away from Gin and absorb myself in TV

elbombero. All folk are different, but I virtually starved myself to death trying to lose weight whilst breastfeeding ( was desperate as put 5 stone son at each pregnancy) . I fed all of them for 9 months, and hardly a pound came off until I stopped. I do try and get DD1 to appreciate the sacrifice, but as you can imagine... saving my breath would be better ! I just keep to myself the smugness that she is a robust , intelligent healthy individual !

Steeley thanks congrats +++

trashy echoing your menu... but fell off at Lebanese...... not many of them down 'ere in somerset ! and grin at high on packet crinkling noises , but scarily I know exactly what you mean.... and can't remember if it was you , but double grin at putting mushrooms in the sun to improve Vit D !

willie killing heartburn here too some days - resolves with a glass of almond milk.

eva thankyou, you are such a star for listing all of this vits/minerals - its really helpful

stunt drink ANYTHING. 20 mls at a time only, every 10 mins. Poor you sound hideous. Breat milk should be ok - but at your detriment. Keep going, keep drinking

heir great news - although SECOND interview sounds scarey, Hugely well done !

I have just come on AGAIN.... I bled for 16 straight days ( mirena in - so normally only a couple of light days). I have only been blood free for 5 days and now am flooding again.... I can't stand this - maybe its coincidence with LCing and I actually need a hysterectomy or something..... always dramatic

humanordancer Fri 21-Feb-14 16:25:24

Oh god, I just woolfed a chocolate chip cookie. What can I do to limit the damage?

It was out of despair at the mess after having the ceilings plastered. I only bought them for the workmen blush

I glugged a pint of water and have got some sausages frying. This won't derail me too much, will it? <hopeful face>

MrsHughJarse Fri 21-Feb-14 18:01:34

Don't be crazy ....,it will be ok - don't panic , I reckon just be super low carby tonight / tomorrow . As my DDs would say "chill" x

humanordancer Fri 21-Feb-14 18:09:05

Thank you MrsHugh! x I think I was getting a bit overwraught from being too hungry with not being able to get into the kitchen - a bit of bad planning!

Sausages and buttery egg and I am fixed - phew!

Notsoskinnyminny Fri 21-Feb-14 18:11:41

stunt bananas are supposed to be very good when you've been vomiting as they're easy to digest and full of potassium and something else, try a couple of small slices and see how you get on but don't have any dairy as that will feed any remaining bugs - that was the advice we were given last year when 60% of the school was hit with the norovirus one week - god it was grim, I'd only been there 3 wks and there were kids vomiting everywhere.

heir fantastic news about the second interview.

lighthouse laughing at the testosterone fuelled beans grin

LMD I admire your retail restraint. DD's come home from uni and the shops were still open so we went for a mooch and a natter and I managed to come home with another pair of boots - they were reduced from £140 to £60 and I've only got about 30 pairs so I really did need them grin they're nearly as nice as the half price Vivienne Westwood's DD bought. Her excuse is she only take a 2.5 so whenever anything fits she buys it.

Sybil hope you're feeling better as well and enjoy your night.

MrsHughJarse A few of us have been suffering, I wonder if it is down to LCing. I'm on HRT and hadn't had anything for nearly 6 months so I was totally unprepared for last week and had to rummage through handbags yes I have a problem when it comes to shoes and bags I haven't used for years to find tampons.

DH's manflu has almost gone so we went to the beach with psychopup, 'park on Morrisons' said the wise wife adding 'I'll nip in for a few bits to get the ticket validated' 'that's wrong, I'll park on the street and pay' said honest hub. We came back to the car an hour later, cold and windswept, only to find a £25 ticket on the windscreen angry the ticket had blown over on the dashboard, probably when I got out and wasn't visible to the little hitler who did us 10 mins after we parked, the street was empty in both directions so the barsteward must've been hiding, and the moral of the tale is always listen to and obey wifey grin

Have a good evening everyone and remember if you can't be good then sip or suck it slowly and drink lots of water before bed grin

MyPreciousRing Fri 21-Feb-14 18:17:04

My turn mrs Hugh jarse!!
Please don't let me drink hmm
Luckily haven't bought any prosecco so would have to go to shop...
Also I'm having terrible cravings. Haven't experienced anything like this since start of bootcamp.
I literally can't stop thinking about and longing for haribo, dairy crunch chocolate and walkers ready salted crisps.
Smack me.
Hard!!!
I've been so good all week.

EvaTheOptimist Fri 21-Feb-14 18:19:52

Notso how annoying! Surely you can send the ticket you bought and not have to pay the fine? you'd hope so in an honest fair world but...

Good luck heir

Humanordancer the trick is to leave it at the one cookie. Do NOT think "I've blown it I might as well eat the packet"!!

Had to go food shopping today as we'd simultaneously run out of butter and mayonnaise. The new staples.

Notsoskinnyminny Fri 21-Feb-14 18:55:37

Eva we've challenged it in writing but the jobsworth I spoke to said if we hadn't displayed the ticket properly then we would be liable. He was named in the email along with a suggestion they issued tickets with sticky backs.

HeirToTheIronThrone Fri 21-Feb-14 19:29:05

Thanks everyone - and LittleMiss I'm sure the LC luck will be in for your application too smile

I am feeling utterly shattered so DH is ordering a takeaway - am pushing for Indian so can order lamb tikka pieces and broccoli paneer.

MrsHughJarse Fri 21-Feb-14 19:52:27

mpr .... I think biwi or willie told me to imagine Choccy was dog poo once and it really worked .
If you are low carbing to lose weight - tell yourself you can have it all if you stand naked In front of the mirror while you eat it !! It might work ...... ?!
Or - let yourself have a manageable small bit of the thing you are craving the most to make the craving go away ?

Don't undo your good work --- keep strong ! Get a film on the tv to take your mind off it ? Have a fab long bath ?

StuntNun Fri 21-Feb-14 20:05:28

Thanks for the oral rehydration solution recipe LittleMiss, I've made up some using dilute Ribena and salt and it doesn't taste bad at all. I'm following MrsHugh's 20 mls every 10 minutes advice as I have a raging thirst. Fortunately DS3 is in bed now so hopefully I won't need to feed him until the early hours. DH has come down with the same thing while DS1 and DS2 are blissfully unaffected.

I don't think I could manage any banana NotSo, maybe tomorrow. I don't think I've ever gone a whole day without eating anything before. I assume I'll be breaking down muscle so I'll need to get back on the protein ASAP. With regard to your parking ticket my dad wrote a heartfelt plea after I left his disabled parking pass the wrong way up and our car got ticketed and managed to get the fine cancelled.

HumphreyCobbler Fri 21-Feb-14 20:09:31

StuntNun - sorry you and your DH are down with it. It is so horrid when everyone is ill.

When I let a ticket blow off the dashboard so it wasn't visible the council remitted the fine and sent me a nifty little pocket thing to put the ticket in.

lc def out the window as I ate an apple and drank some ribena. It stayed down. Hurrah.

MrsHughJarse Fri 21-Feb-14 20:21:08

stunt if you are tolerating 20 Mls well you can begin to increase the amount ( by very small increments ) dependant on yr thirst until your urine is clear . I hope you all get a bit of sleep tonight - think you need to stick poor DH in spare room or downstairs .... You need some recuperative sleep and can't be running around helping him ( harsh I know - but you are feeding a baby )

MyPreciousRing Fri 21-Feb-14 20:46:06

Thanks mrs Hugh jarse
I've got a mini packet of haribo star mix.
It remains unopened.
I've just been floored by the intensity of the cravings. Actually been quite easy not to have prosecco. I'm not normally a sweets or chocolate person, very strange to be desperate for them like this.

MrsHughJarse Fri 21-Feb-14 21:22:21

mpr Have you had any caffeine ? That gives me raging sugar cravings I've discovered . Let's Put the kettle on and have a nice cuppa up here on this wagon ( caff free!) brew
DH is out with work mates , networking on the piss and I am watching Captain Phillips - am sure adrenaline from watching it should help me burn some fat !

ChesterDrawers Fri 21-Feb-14 21:28:05

Keep strong MPR - one minute at a time.

Day 2 back on it. Food wise great, but I have had three teas and one coffee all with milk which I don't usually have.

I have however NOT eaten biscuits, toast, brownies or any alcohol. Am sat with a camomile tea and looking forward to an early bed.

That's how I roll on a Friday night.

ElBombero Fri 21-Feb-14 21:33:47

Aw I loved captain Philips, fab film! X

StuntNun Fri 21-Feb-14 21:43:45

Thanks again MrsHugh I have managed to drink 600 ml of the oral rehydration wotsit over the course of the evening so my raging thirst has died down a bit. For a laugh I decided to log my day on MFP and it's 300 calories, all from carbs - 72g for the day.

prettybird Fri 21-Feb-14 21:44:58

Just made successful low carb chicken nuggets using flaxseed mixed with grated Parmesan (and generous salt and pepper) for the coating grin

Didn't tell dh I hadn't used breadcrumbs and just asked how the nuggets were: he said, "Very good" as did ds. Success. smile

HumphreyCobbler Fri 21-Feb-14 22:05:25

I am rather dreading tonight as baby Cobbler fed on the hour, every hour last night hmm he is poorly too I think sad

At least I am no longer dehydrated but drinking squash and feeling sick reminds me of having HG and it is freaking me out a bit.

aargh fuck sorry mrshugh - you can do the lebanese chicken at home, and have it with fresh herbs chopped up little on the side (basil/parsley/mint - whatever you fancy plus of course, baby spinach)

I get a baby chicken from the local halal butchery and get him to remove most of the bones, alternatively I just spatchcock/butterfly a small bird, and stick it on a tray/roasting dish (flat, skin side up) I blitz up butter/garlic/herbs/chilli flakes/salt/pepper/lemon juice and then rub it thickly across the chicken skin (slap it all on) into the oven on gas mark nine for about 45 minutes.

todays grub

B - 3 streaky bacon/1 flat mush/2 scramb duck eggs

S - 6 raspberries and two dessert spoons clotted cream

L - Tinned salmon and mayo (only a few spoonfulls as busy and unhungry)

D - (small handful) Baby sprouts and Kale fried in butter and garlic/pork steaks fried in butter (2.5 blush)

S - awfully posh pork scratchings/pickled egg

feels like a lot but I have exercised more yesterday and today (this week actually - bloody half-term plus work)

off to catch up with rest of thread

grin at heir for the interview mangnificence!

Suzymoo9 Sat 22-Feb-14 07:41:13

DS (11) proudly woke me up this morning, carrying a tray with toast, jam and butter - this is the first time he has ever done anything like this! I hadn't had bread in SIX WEEKS. What would you have done? hmm

Just sms.
Not sure if Im a carby twat or not.

Went out for a v.rare meal with DH last night, and we went to an Indian.

I had a poppadom, lamb meat and salad starter, and a chicken and cheese, almondy yoghurty curry, with spinach and garlic.

No idea of sugar content, but I didnt really know what I was doing confused

DurhamDurham Sat 22-Feb-14 08:49:30

Suzy, I would have eaten a slice,those times are too precious to spoil! Just be v good the rest of the day and drink an extra litre of water for penance smile

Monkey there's no telling how much sugar was hidden in the sauce but if it was sweet then probably a bit. BIWI may wave her stick about the popadom. If we go to an Indian place I usually stick to dry foods such as the mixed tikka platter as then there isn't any sauce to worry about. Hope you enjoyed it because it sounds delicious and we all deserve a treat smile

Oh I know the poppadom was bad, but I figured better than wine and a naan wink

And I requested a jug of tap water and drank the whole lot (just over a litre I reckon) during the meal <saintly>

I guess as this is a WOE not a diet, we need to be able to relax sometimes or I cant imagine any of us could do this for life.

On the plus side, according to the scales this morning Im 155lb, so thats TWENTY POUNDS DOWN!!

Suzymoo9 Sat 22-Feb-14 09:07:09

Thanks Durham I did and I will grin

DurhamDurham Sat 22-Feb-14 09:08:02

I agree Monkey, I've had several meals out and while I have tried to make good choices I haven't let it take over the evening. I think BIWI did say that as long as it was a planned meal and was eaten mindfully and you thoroughly enjoyed it then it's all good. Like you say this is a WOE not a diet and if we want to live with it long term we need and deserve to go off piste sometimes.

Lighthousekeeping Sat 22-Feb-14 09:12:36

The only time I treat myself and pay first class the bleeding underground isn't working. I'm so pissed off. It is a beautiful morning in West Hampstead though. Unfortunately I'll be running for the train which means a) I can't buy a newspaper and b) they will be feeding me loads of carbtastic food, those flap jacks you get in cellophane and bacon sandwiches etc. it's a nightmare.

i used to live there lighthousekeeping. technically kilburn but locals used to call it WH wink

MyPreciousRing Sat 22-Feb-14 09:33:44

Aw light house that's a shame. Hope you find a low carb gem to eat!

Crabby, well done at two days back on wagon - and can you believe the two of us had a dry night? Amazing.

Monkey. 20lbs? That's awesome. Don't think a poppadom will derail that weight loss.

Mrs Hugh jarse, thanks again for the hand hold. In the end I shared packet with husband - so that equated to five sweets. Not the end of the world. Today I've no cravings at all.
Conversely to what you would expect, I think it was LACK of caffeine that caused cravings - thinking back, I only had one coffee with cream first thing yesterday morning whereas I would normally have at least half a litre spread out up until about 2pm.

Heir. Well done on your second interview - hope it goes well.

That's all I can remember from the thread - but still a million times better than my usual self absorbed posts grin

Lighthousekeeping Sat 22-Feb-14 10:46:36

Bloody hell can this day get any worse? The train to up North was cancelled!!! So now I'm on a shoddy East Coast train in 1st class which is not as glamorous as I thought it would be. I've eaten a white bread beef sandwich and a muffin. I won't be weighing myself on Monday. I've done so well and now I'm going to put it all back on just through this journey and my mother wi think I've been lying.

HeirToTheIronThrone Sat 22-Feb-14 10:49:26

This morning's discovery is how nice proper coffee from our machine with a splosh of double cream is - I am late to this party I know grin

It is a beautiful day here by the sea so going to go out for a walk - coming back via Lidl for eggs, celeriac and the yogurt of dreams.

Morning all! <<grabs lighthouse by the shoulders and shakes vigorously>> One beef sandwich and muffin is not the end of the world! See above posts re WOE not diet grin and if you're hungry again, get another beef sandwich and eat the middle, and chuck away the bread. Water water water and cheese if you can lay your hands upon it. If your mother thinks you've been lying she can FROTFOSM grin and yes, the day can get worse - things can always get worse, but you are going to focus on all the good stuff. You made the trains despite all the shizwang stacked against you and you're alive and life is good! <<climbs down from motivational podium and executes low carb hakka>>

Lighthousekeeping Sat 22-Feb-14 11:14:11

I know and the man sat opposite me is easy on the eyegrin

teaandthorazine Sat 22-Feb-14 11:37:41

Awww, lighthouse - West Hampstead! My favourite part of London, miss it so much. I used to live on Ulysses road and then moved into a manky flat share in Gondar Gardens (have now completely outed myself probably) but I loved WH, it's such a fab place.

Anywaaaaay, this thread moves so fast, I can't keep up! Was out for dinner at a friend's last night and was a bit of a carby twat - rice, samosa and naan was consumed blush. Plus, of course, wine. And pudding. So, actually, I was a big old stupid carby twat. My defence is that she had made it all herself and was freaking out that it had all gone wrong and was going to be revolting, so not to eat it would have looked bad.

That's my story and I'm sticking to it, guv.

Today I will mostly be eating FAT.

Hope everyone has a fab weekend. Sorry I'm so useless on this thread, I feel as if I'm not really joining in properly.

supersalstrawberry Sat 22-Feb-14 11:58:23

Hello bootcampers smile I'm still going, 13lb down now, feeling pleased with that, looking forward to the magic 1 stone off.

Not really got the time to post or read the threads properly but skimming through its lovely to see all the support smile

Weekends are the hardest, am off shopping today but am going to London for a couple of days in the week, that's going to be tough hmm

Hope you all have a good low carb weekend, am booking a holiday today so big incentive for me to keep going!!

smile

MyPreciousRing Sat 22-Feb-14 12:26:00

TEA! I always feel the same - some of the others seem so good at name checking everybody and remembering all the details. I read three posts and then have forgotten the first one shock

Light house. You will be fine. As Trash can says (fine motivational speech and enjoyed the accompanying dance) this is a WOE not a diet! Climb back on the wagon, water, water, water. Good for the rest of today and tomorrow; weigh in on Monday.

Two weeks ago by the Wednesday I had put on almost FIVE pounds due to a carby work weekend away. Have lost it all again now plus four more pounds for good measure.

It's fine
Enjoy first class grin

Lighthousekeeping Sat 22-Feb-14 12:34:41

I'm so tense right now. I went to change trains and asked a group of Grown Ups in front of me if it was going to my tone and they said yes. Lying bastards gits. I'm now im a town near Liverpool and I have to go all the way back!!!

HumphreyCobbler Sat 22-Feb-14 12:36:49

oh no Lighthouse. What a pain

Lighthousekeeping Sat 22-Feb-14 12:42:06

I just want to sleep I'm exhausted before I've even got there

LittleMissDisorganized Sat 22-Feb-14 12:52:18

Morning ladies,
StuntNun hope you've started to keep some ORT or other liquids down overnight and that baby is feeding ok.
Humph I get those flashbacks whenever I'm sick still - I can only imagine they are quite a bit worse when it's so recent.
Hugh how long has the current Mirena been in for? - sometimes the period control wears off before the 5 years (the contraceptive effects still stands however) - my first one was changed just before 3 years because I was bleeding past it and I had been so happy with no periods! I don't bleed currently at all - I think mostly I don't ovulate - and the effect on my sense of wellbeing is enormous.

I was out again in the evening last night which is huge for me - we went to the cinema which is more DH's thing than mine, but saw the Monument Men and it was really good. Also ate at Frankie and Benny's where I had the steak salad. I would call it the steak-with-garnish, tbh, it was a bit disappointing. I did badly with veg yesterday, but usually do well so hoping one day is not the end of the world. Had to have some yogurt when we got home. But, though a little joy-less, I did eat LC, DH enjoyed his burger and cheesecake, and next time maybe something like chicken and ribs, or order vegetables (if they aren't sweetcorn and carrots etc) as extra?

Have a friend of DH's coming tonight and will do wedges for them as well as beef ribs and roasted (allowed) veg. Pondering a LC pudding but I know they are a little controversial. I need to get moving really and swimming today too.