I have finally reached the end of my tether and think I am going to stop DD from visiting her dad's family.

[AnarchyAunt]

And I am very torn over it, as I have done everything I can to stop it coming to this and to make sure they have a continuing relationship but I just can't stand it anymore

Background - Ex has 3 children (by 3 women) - a 7yo DD, my DD who is 5.6, and a 2yo DS. He left us in April 2005, immediately moved in with a 17 yr old (he was 33) and they had a DS a year later. She has now left him.

Since he left I have done what I can to get him to see my DD regularly - he does not see his 7yo DD at all, twice in the last 6 years I think, and is not currently seeing his DS.

At first I tried to get him to have her every other weekend - he refused as he didn't know what he'd be doing in advance (for which read, he liked to keep himself open to better offers)

I tried mediation, where we agreed to discuss all matters relating to DD's health and education, and that he'd have her one long weekend a month (I'd have liked more but he wanted this). He did it twice, then claimed it was too difficult/expensive/not worth it just for the weekend.

I then tried letting his parents come to collect her (we now live 60 miles away from him and his family) and take her to their house for the odd week in holidays, and her dad turns up to see her there, or takes her out or to his house when he can be arsed. This has worked ok for a couple of years, despite the bad relationship I have with them, but now I am not sure I want this to continue.

He does not support any of his DC at all, in any way and works cash in hand to avoid CSA payments. He blames the mothers of his DC for getting pregnant on purpose and has been known to deny paternity of at least one of them. He refuses to give me a contact number for him, and I have therefore not been able to speak to him for two years, so cannot stick to what we agreed at mediation much as I would like to.

I have thought for years that he is seriously mentally ill, however he refuses to accept or admit this and will not seek any kind of help whatsoever. It has reached a point where I am not happy for him to be in charge of DD, as he is drinking and using coke, and the few mutual friends who still see him are concerned as he is behaving very irrationally (eating raw roadkill for example ). I do not trust his parents to enforce my wishes when she is in their care - they think I am bonkers and they consistently enable his behaviour and make excuses for him. His mother thinks he is 'fine' and will not hear a word to the opposite effect, despite the fact that he is clearly not 'fine'.

I have come to think that they cannot see DD until such time as her father starts to behave like a father - including seeking help for his mental health issues as I feel he is not safe to be in charge of her, giving me a contact number for him, and sticking to the agreement reached at mediation. I am so upset to get to this though, I had hoped to avoid having to face this issue and don't know if I am right or not. All opinions and ideas are gratefully recieved.

[Grammaticus]

I think you're right. You definitely should have a contact number and your DD should have a routine.

How do you know for sure he is using coke?

And have you thought what you will say to DD, now and in the future?

[AnarchyAunt]

Well, he has always liked a dabble, but his last remaining close friend (who has remained on good terms with me) has been in touch recently to tell me he is worried about ex's behaviour - including excessive coke use that is making him behave like a twat.

Have to go to get DD but will answer 2nd bit in depth later - no, don't know what to say to her though, beyond 'daddy is not very well at the moment'.

[Grammaticus]

I don't think YABU. If he isn't safe then there should be someone else around, maybe his parents despite the difficulties. Or maybe you should stop it and see whether he will push for contact. Is he likely to take this to court do you think?

[TheNewsMongrel]

I feel for you. My x only has children by one mother, me, oh I am the lucky one but he shouts about his rights and will bulldoze over me, but is deaf and blind to his responsibilities or obligations.

I couldn't stop him seeing the children because he'd take me to court and charge me with abduction (I am not in UK) but if you feel that his comings and goings and antics are unsettling the stable environment YOU alone can provide for your dd, then I don't think you are BU at all.

People underestimate the importance of having a happy sane mother. People who haven't walked in our shoes will lecture about the importance of the presence of any old tosser in a child's life. Even if the presence of a tosser/bully leaves the stable reliable parent in a state of distress and anxiety. NOT to mention the child!!!

It makes NO sense.

Do what you have to do to make your daughter and you happy and secure.

[unavailable]

AA - You have bent over backwards to be accomodating to your ex, but the situation has changed and this is now about legitimate concerns regarding your daughters safety. I think your ex's behaviour sounds alarming, and until he starts to address his drug use/mental health issues you should not allow him access. I think you are also right about not being sure about his family - it sounds as if they have stuck their heads in the sand and therefore I wouldnt trust them not to collude with him.

Put the ball in their court by clearly explaining your reasons for stopping contact, and stating you have no wish for it to be a permanent thing, but you need them (ex especially) to address the issues before contact can resume.

[melimum]

i have battled with similar stuff and friends have wondered why i bothered.
i felt i guess i wanted him to love my ds the way i loved him.
he probably like mine does not know how to
so why force or try. i believe very strongly that i would be a happier person if i didnt have to deal with all the S**T that goes with sorting out arrangements for visits and being able to rely on that!!! he is away at moment (6th hol this year we had none!) but its bliss!!!
my ds only 4 but think about stopping it all now to save ds feelings of rejection
friends say let him see what his dad is really like but i would rather save his feelings?

[lulabellarama]

I think your decision is the right one.

My ex's family all just drifted away when it became clear that he wasn't going to bother with my DS at all. One of them sends me a facebook message on my DS's birthday each year, but that's it

Being a blood relative doesn't give anyone the right to put your child in a potentially harmful situation, and in my opinion, even if she is physically safe, this situation could be mentally traumatising for her.

Your ex needs to get help and if his family aren't seeing that then they are not responsible enough to look after your daughter. Please don't feel guilty, you are doing a great job in a difficult situation from the sounds of things.

[AnarchyAunt]

Well tbh I stopped giving a flying feck about his rights years ago - he can go and find them if he wants, they are somewhere near his responsibilities.

All that matters to me is the rights of my DD, and until now I have felt that her right to a relationship with her dad has been paramount. I now think her right to be safe, to be looked after by people whose main concern is her wellbeing and who respect and communicate with each other, to be able to rely on those involved in her life, etc, are overriding that.

Its quite hard to come to terms with the fact that there is no more I can do - we all want the best for our children and I don't think this is it. But its the best I can do for her and I hope that in years to come she will understand that. I also hope it is a short term thing, but I do have to consider the possibility that he will never be a part of her life, and we just need to get on with it.

[gillybean2]

Cutting all ties seems harsh. Removing the issues and potential dangers to your child, while maintaining contact in a safe way would be preferable surely?

If the contact at the grandparents house is no longer suitable, perhaps suggest an alternative you are more happy with. Can they can come to your house? Or perhaps meet at another venue such as a library, zoo, park, pizza hut, bowling alley or similar. If they only currently see her in the holidays for a week at a time cutting all contact might upset your dd. Maybe suggest a more regular arrangement. They could see her once a month, or every holiday (half terms and xmas/easter/summer holiday). You could agree to go somewhere and have them join you there if you do not want them coming to your house.

Show willing, especially if you mean it when you say that stopping contact isn't a permanent situation. And instead of asking them to take sides (an impossible situation to choose between a child and a grandchild) just accept they are grandparents and your dd probably loves them very much too. Let them see tehir grandchild if at all possible and if they want it. Just not at their home and not with their son there until he sorts himself out. Of course they might side with their son and turn down the offer. I think it will depend on the relationship they have with your dd and how you handle it to be honest.

It's a difficult situation. But keeping your child safe is of course paramount.

Best wishes
Gilly

[AnarchyAunt]

I issued an open invitation when we first moved away for her GPs to visit for the day whenever they wish. I had forgotten about this idea when I posted but yes, I will reiterate the offer when I next speak to them. I would be quite happy for them come and take her out for the day once a month.

However they have consistently refused to take the offer up as it is 'too far' (4 hr round trip) and 'isnt worth the fuel costs' to make the journey just for the day

DD does love them very much and they love her too, and I know that. But they are basically stupid, blinkered people. They see nothing wrong in their son's behaviour, they continue to portray him as a innocent victim in his current situation, they enable and excuse his behaviour and then they reward him with a rent-free house and pay his bills! Yet begrudge spending fifty quid on coming to see their grandchild. I cannot trust them not to collude with him and allow him to take charge of DD, and I simply do not believe that to be safe at the moment. If I could trust them to only allow supervised contact between DD and ex I would not stop her visiting them.

I have spent nearly four years trying to make this work, compromising more and more in order that DD has the chance of a relationship with her father. I can do it no longer. He needs to change, to seek help and to start engaging with the world again. I'd be happy to return to mediation to sort this out - he refuses. I don't know where else to go from here and tbh am hoping that this will kick his parents into reality and get them to help him rather than enable him to continue on a downward spiral.

[TheNewsMongersGeansaiNollag]

I may steal that line on my x "if you've lost your rights, try looking for them beside your responsibilities".

He was writing to dc's school behind my back recently, demanding a meeting with teacher and dc's reports etc..

[AnarchyAunt]

Oh well this ex would never do anything so, erm, whats the word... effort involving? He'd sooner cut off his own arm than actually talk/write to anyone, make enquiries, try and get involved etc. I suppose it is a blessing on some ways as I don't have to worry about him interfering

He is the man whom a family mediator told to 'grow a backbone' as talking to him was like 'punching a blancmange'.

[frankbestfriend]

You have done all you can, and to be honest I admire you for persisting with this man on your daughters' behalf.

Your ex and his family must take hold of their own responsibilities now, you can't keep ploughing on when their hearts are clearly not in it.

Drinking, taking drugs and eating roadkill are not the types of behaviours to expose your daughter to.

You have done your very best to do what is right for your child, but imvho what is right for your child now is to be away from these people and safe with a loving parent.

Just peeked at your profile, btw, your dd is gorgeous, you must be very proud

[LittleJingleBellas]

I don't know what else you can do tbh.

My xp has only seen the DC's twice in six years, the last time being a few weeks ago after a gap of five and a half years. I facilitated that contact because I do think it's in the DC's best interests to have met their father and have contact with him, but there is simply no way I would allow them to go to his house (or rather his mother's house) because he is not capable of looking after them and they are not yet old enough to look after themselves. If they ask, that's what I will tell them (not quite so baldly, of course - I'll hum and ha about Daddy not really being suited to looking after young children, so it will be more fun for them when they're older and he can do stuff with them that's more suitable).

[AnarchyAunt]

Oh god the thought of him still being on the scene and behaving the same when she is 15 terrifies me - he'd be the type who let her experiment with drugs with him and have her spotty boyfriends to stay over He is basically still a 15yo himself, albeit a large and deranged one.

I'm glad it seems I am not being too unreasonable.

[AnarchyAunt]

And FBF - yes, ever so ever so burstingly proud

[frankbestfriend]

YANBU at all.

Maintaining contact with an absent parent is very important, of course, but at whatever cost to you and your daughter? Absolutely not.