My friend is about to die of secondary breast cancer. Does anyone have any experience? Can you talk me through...

[IHateStampysVoice]

...what happens at the end? They will call me when she is near the end but she is adamant that she doesn't want company before this as she just wants to sleep. She is very much in denial, and thinks the meds are making her this unwell.

Currently, she has triple negative breast cancer that's is now massive in her liver.

She just wants to sleep all the time, can barely stand for more than a few seconds. Can't eat because she feels 'full', is white as a sheet and gaunt. She has trouble focusing on what people are saying.

I just wondered if anyone had a friend or relative had been through this who wouldn't mind sharing with me their experience. Especially from this point onwards.

I drove her to the hospice this morning, it took me days to persuade her mum to visit - she thought she had months to live. I feel as though she'lol have days. It's been confirmed that she definitely doesn't have months..

I realise every person is different, and no one can give me a time frame - I don't expect it. But if anyone could give me their experiences I would be very very grateful. I just want to prepare myself as much as possible.

[IHateStampysVoice]

As well, because I'm told it can make a difference, she is in her early 30's.

[SaskiaRembrandtWasFramed]

My BIL died of cancer two years ago. At the end, he wasn't really aware of what was going on around him, partly because of his illness and partly because of medication. The hospital staff were wonderful, he was kept comfortable and pain free, and as far as I can tell he went to sleep and didn't wake up. It was very peaceful.

I don't know about time frames, I would guess it varies from person to person, and of course different types of cancers. In my BIL's case the end came very quickly and suddenly, but he had a very aggressive cancer, I would guess other cancers might not be so unpredictable.

[SaskiaRembrandtWasFramed]

Oh, and I'm really sorry you and your friend are going through this

[IHateStampysVoice]

Thank you. She has the most aggressive one, I wonder if your BIL had the same.

Can I ask, how long was it from him being very tired and occasionally awake, until he was at the very end?

Thank you so much for replying, it isn't an easy subject.

[karinmaria]

My mum passed away from an aggressive form of leukaemia a couple of years ago. She was very tired and didn't eat anything in her last days. She would also sway in and out of consciousness, and found it difficult to articulate what she was thinking or wanted.

It was a matter of days for her, and she didn't die peacefully (sorry). She had something called a syringe-driver, which would periodically dispense morphine and a sedative but she was still in a lot of pain. We were all with her at home when she died, gasping for air

She may say now she doesn't want anyone there but I just can't imagine going through that on my own. My mum at least was clutching onto my dad.

So sorry you are going through this xx

[IHateStampysVoice]

Thank you for being so honest. I really need this so I can prepare my brain. I don't want to be shocked, I want to be prepared and strong for her.

My friend is fiercely independent and is utterly convinced that she will get better so she can do a trial at Marsdens. Which is why she wants no visitors, so she can sleep to 'recover'.

[SirVixofVixHall]

My darling friend died six months ago of a very aggressive breast cancer, at 41. I called Macmillan several times, they have a helpline for friends and family, and they were completely brilliant. There were no questions that they didn't respond to in a really sensitive yet matter of fact way, and I felt I could really ask them anything at all and not be judged. My friend didn't accept that she was dying and that did make it really hard. There were lots of things I couldn't talk to her or her family about because of that.
Sleeping a lot happens closer to the end of life, so to me it sounds as though your friend may not have very long left to live, I am so sorry.
Do think about calling Macmillan, they will give you clear guidelines on what to expect.

[IHateStampysVoice]

I didn't know that. I didn't realise that they could be helpful in that way, I will call them now then, thank you.

And yes it IS making it very hard with her family. Yesterday, after the hospice called me to say she had a bed, I called my friend to let her know and that I'd take her this morning.

I called her mum and she told me to back off. Back off?! I'm doing her job, she hasn't seen her daughter in months!

Turns out, she too is in denial. She thought she has months to live. I said it may be more like days, and now she is arriving.

[IHateStampysVoice]

Also, I'm so very very sorry to all of you that have lost friends and family.

[Izzy24]

I think it is really important to let your friend do it her way.

If her way is to travel with the hope of a Marsden trial then so be it.

I would absolutely agree with the advice to contact Macmillan helpline. And I'm sure the hospice staff are supportive too.

I'm very sorry your friend is going through this.

[SirVixofVixHall]

Is she in the hospice full time now?

[Stinkersmum]

Macmillan are fabulous. I've had so much cancer tragedy in my family over the years. Currently my uncle has a grade 4 glioblastoma. It's terminal. He's currently doing trials at the Marsden alongside his palliative care. I've got no more advice for you than call macmillan. They are angels.

[SaskiaRembrandtWasFramed]

With my BIL it was a matter of days. Before that he was obviously very ill, but he deteriorated very quickly and died two days later.

I would second calling Macmillan, and speak to the hospice staff, they're trained to help family and friends as well.

[Finola1step]

Definitely speak to Macmillan.
My MIL had a very similar cancer to your friend. She went down hill very rapidly. On the Monday, she was still driving locally. By the Friday, she needed help to get out of her chair. A week later she went into a hospice and was mostly sleeping. Two days later she passed away very peacefully.

I know that you want the best for your friend, but let her just think what she wants to think. But do tell the hospice staff that her mum may not be fully up to speed with the situation. They will take it from there.

[IHateStampysVoice]

There's no way she is going to the Marsdens. And not because I would stop her, believe me. She can only stand for a few seconds, she can only keep her eyes open for a few minutes at a time. She has to be in 'tip top' condition to do the trial which she is far, far from.

She is in the hospice for 'symptom control'. Unfortunately, since that admission info was put through to them (Tuesday) she has deteriorated so much that it's clear that she won't be leaving.

[PestoSwimissimos]

So sorry about your friend

Just to say, my DH was sleeping a lot at the end. He also didn't want visitors apart from me & the DD's. I think the day before he died he didn't really wake up at all. So from what you've said, I don't think your friend has very long left. Sorry XX

[IHateStampysVoice]

Oh I'm definitely letting her think what she wants.

If I'm honest I feel that it's better for her to be in denial. Where there is denial, there is hope for her. I wouldn't dream of taking that from her.

Unfortunately that's exactly what her mother would do. As she has done before.

[Stinkersmum]

Even

[PestoSwimissimos]

I meant to add that, not eating is another sure sign that things are near the end.

[Wisteria1979]

Thee will be someone at the hospice you can talk to that can explain the stages for you. When my mum died (grade 4 glioblastoma) they asked how much I wanted to know and as I wanted to know everything they told me. Just be mindful of your friend and her family, for some it may be more comforting with denial rather than detail. But if you need to understand the process I am sure the doctors or nurses will talk you through it.

[Stinkersmum]

Oops. Even if there is no chance of her going to Marsdens, there's no need to tell her that. Let her think what she wants.

[Stinkersmum]

Wisteria1979 do you mind me asking how long your mum had from diagnosis til she passed?

[Wisteria1979]

Almost 5 years. We were incredibly lucky. She did a lot of charitable work with brain tumour organisations in that time and unfortunately many people she came across only had 6-12 months. Depends on treatment options mainly. I am so sorry about your uncle. Please send me a pm if you want to know more.

[tbtc]

My Mum died from cancer 5 years ago. From "the call" to her passing was nearly a week. I had NO idea it could be that long. When we arrived she was barely aware of us and I think made one last trip to the loo before she was given a catheter (she was barely aware of this).

From then, she slept mostly and when she was awake was clearly in a great deal of discomfort but unable to voice it.

She was moved to a side room in the last 24hrs and given a syringe pump.

A day before that I think, we had talked to Macmillan who had explained the Liverpool end of life pathway to us (the first time I saw my brother cry as an adult). They were amazing, as was the care and sensitivity shown towards her and us by the hospital staff.

I imagine your dear friend and her family know all to well what's happening but accepting it is too scary. That's not the same as denial IMO, but you need to follow their lead.

My Mum never talked about her death but she knew, we are sure of that.

[Stinkersmum]

Oh wow. That is lucky (relatively speaking...). My uncle was diagnosed a year ago. The (non operable) tumour actually got smaller to start with but recently the mix of medicines from his regular and trial treatment is causing fits. He looks well though. And if positive thinking helps at all, he'll be around for a while yet. Sorry to steal your thread OP.