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Household income

(169 Posts)
GuernseyTeddy Mon 16-Dec-13 11:14:54

Just spent the morning cancelling mobile contract, car insurance, contact lenses and any other monthly expenses, ahead of my maternity allowance ending in Feb.

As of 16 feb I will have 0 money at all. All because DP is a higher rate tax payer. No child benefit, no tax credit. Nothing. Similarly because of DPs wage, I can't afford to go back to work as it would cost me money after childcare deductions due to not being eligible for tax credits.

Insane position where I'm being assessed on money that isn't mine.

vickibee Mon 16-Dec-13 11:17:36

are you entitled to childcare vouchers from your employer?

Going back part time to gove you some sanity even though you end up with little net income?

JanePurdy Mon 16-Dec-13 11:19:12

Er, so you don't have joint incomes? Suggest you start billing DP for childcare then.

GuernseyTeddy Mon 16-Dec-13 11:21:44

Tried the billing for childcare conversation but there is no money apparently - once CSA payments and season ticket deducted from salary, we only have enough to

GuernseyTeddy Mon 16-Dec-13 11:23:55

cover mortgage and bills, then just enough left for food and petrol.

So I'm somehow meant to clothe and feed the baby out of nowhere.

TheGhostOfPortoPast Mon 16-Dec-13 11:25:32

Did you not discuss this with him before?

GuernseyTeddy Mon 16-Dec-13 11:28:51

We did, but the money that was allocated to me for the children has now gone in CSA payments each month. 50/50 arrangement now changed to alternate weekends.

AnotherWorld Mon 16-Dec-13 11:28:58

Just about to post that Porto. Surely you'd have talked through your financial plans before deciding to start a family with your DP? Or at least in the 9 months you were pregnant for?

I don't know what to say. But I hope you find an answer.

JanePurdy Mon 16-Dec-13 11:29:12

So do you have joint finances and there is simply not enough money? Or is there enough money in his wage packet but he refuses to share it with you/the new baby & thinks you are responsible for your own costs?

Its not insane.

The fault here is how your household finances are set up into his and hers. If you live with and have children with a higher rate tax payer then you can't expect help off the state because 'his money is not yours'. When you have a child with someone the money is household money even if its not all in the same account.

You only say 'higher rate tax payer' but not by how much. He could be earning £200k for all we know.

How many children do you have yourself? Unless you are earning less than min wage, you will be better off after paying childcare, than not going back to work at all.

In the longrun you will be far better off going back to work rather than making yourself financially dependent on someone who wants to keep all his money for himself.

PeterParkerSays Mon 16-Dec-13 11:30:37

If he's a higher rate tax payer, I'm not sure I'd believe him, sorry. Aren't CSA payments meant to reduce for other children when a new baby is born?

ChasingSquirrels Mon 16-Dec-13 11:30:42

You ARE entitled to child benefit, but if your partner earns more than £50k then part, or all depending on income, of it will be recovered through his tax liability.
This doesn't stop you from claiming it.

Clearly though there is more of an issue here, which you need to address together.

Why has the childcare arrangement for his children changed so drastically?

This seems to be the biggest issue of why your finances have changed.

comemulledwinewithmoi Mon 16-Dec-13 11:34:45

It sounds as if H doesnt see it as a joint problem. That is not how it works. You are going to need to get an evening or weekend job, childmind, start own business etc.

comemulledwinewithmoi Mon 16-Dec-13 11:36:10

Tbh, youre biggest problem is your Hs attitude to money.

wannabestressfree Mon 16-Dec-13 11:39:21

I don't mean this to sound nasty but why did you not talk about this pre having children?
Its a horrendous position to be in for you, beholden to someone who doesn't want you to be beholden to them. I would be going back to work and telling him what his half share of childcare is.
I don't envy you

You have split up? Doesn't that change things

jojane Mon 16-Dec-13 11:42:54

I just don't understand how people can have children but have separate finances? How do you decide who pays for what?
We have a joint account and had a joint account since way before we had children. All our money is joint and I spend whatever is needed on the family. Dh never spends anything!
His petrol is on company credit card and then personal miles are deducted from his salary each month, things like his gym and marvel graphic novels are on direct debit, I buy all food etc and whatever is needed for kids, soft pay , parties Xmas etc!
I work part time and bring home about a sixth of what he does after tax. But he recognises that I do the majority of childcare and housework and that is just a valuable contribution To the family as his financial contribution.

ShanghaiDiva Mon 16-Dec-13 11:46:27

the money is all household money and your dp as the current sole earner needs to provide for the entire family.

What monthly payments is your dp cancelling to pay for the most recent addition to his family?

alemci Mon 16-Dec-13 12:00:35

why don't you claim the CB and then he could pay the tax on it but at least you would have it in your bank account.

My DH and I have separate accounts and always have done but if I wanted anything I would put it on the credit card and then pay for part of it etc. we also have a joint account for bills.

also could you ebay some stuff and have a pay pal account.

wonkylegs Mon 16-Dec-13 12:08:38

My DH is a higher rate taxpayer, my new business currently earns nothing but the money that comes in is our money despite it currently only coming from one source.
If there isn't enough money coming in at the end of the day you need to look at the finances together. Look at outgoings, look at budgets and see what can be trimmed/juggled around.
If you have children together then it is clear that the household income pays for them even if at the moment that income only comes from one source.
If your DH can't see that then you need to discuss your relationship as that, I'm afraid rather than finances is what is wrong.

plus3 Mon 16-Dec-13 12:19:37

Sorry but it's you and a 'D' are you & your child going to be penniless??
How are you in a relationship that allows him to pay for everything he needs, but leaves you with nothing?

I know it is written on here so many times, but I will never understand this.

LadyLapsang Mon 16-Dec-13 12:20:39

OP, you need to sit down together and go through your finances. Obviously your partner had existing financial commitments in the form of his children before you planned a child together and it's right he manages those commitments properly. As other say, in the long run you will be better off if you return to work, especially if he refuses to give you access to his earnings. Tell him you will need to claim child benefit unless he discusses this with you.

Anyexcuse Tue 17-Dec-13 06:42:40

Aside from all the previous good advice, why have you cancelled your car insurance? - I hope this means you've sold your car!

GuernseyTeddy Tue 17-Dec-13 14:45:16

I can't drive - the insurance was learner insurance and I haven't been able to have any lessons since my son was born. So no, not driving around without insurance! shock And yes, my car is now on the drive waiting to be sold.

SoonToBeSix Tue 17-Dec-13 20:42:31

Of course you have money you have fifty percent if the household income. Your dp is a high earner why on earth would you need your own tax credits?

TheGhostOfPortoPast Tue 17-Dec-13 21:18:08

You need to have a serious talk OP. How did he THINK this was going to work. How did you?

TheGhostOfPortoPast Tue 17-Dec-13 21:20:18

When you have children together, then earned money should be shared IMHO. Yes, he needs to make provision for his other children first of course. But you should have discussed this, or looked at the CSA level payments.

TheGhostOfPortoPast Tue 17-Dec-13 21:21:37

How old are you Teddy? And what has your DH done to reduce household income to meet the new responsibilities?

TheGhostOfPortoPast Tue 17-Dec-13 21:22:05

Household expenses I mean blush

NatashaBee Tue 17-Dec-13 21:22:52

The CSA payment will be adjusted to take into account your new child (I think some of his income will be 'protected'), has that been done? I agree with the poster who said that you should claim the CB and he should repay it on his tax return.
If he's being unhelpful and just saying 'there is no money' then I would plan to go back to work. He can't just say 'there's no money', he needs to think of creative solutions. He will have to look after the kid(s) on evenings/weekends/his nonwork days whilst you work, or find some extra hours.

tribpot Tue 17-Dec-13 21:24:45

So I'm somehow meant to clothe and feed the baby out of nowhere.

Surely that's his problem, since he's the one earning?

RandomMess Tue 17-Dec-13 21:25:39

I think you need to look at household expenses very closely together. Can your mortage payments be changed by increasing the term or going part interest only?

Fairylea Tue 17-Dec-13 21:25:56

You share incomes and have the same spending money after all bills are paid. Anything else is unfair.

Unless you have some ridiculously high mortgage or rent you should be able to afford your contact lenses! Dh earns £16k and we have two dc and I am a sahm and we manage to have about £100 each to spend on whatever we like a month (our mortgage payment is 390 on a 3 bed though as I used to be a high earner so we have some equity).

If your dh earns so much there is no way you should have zero!

RandomMess Tue 17-Dec-13 21:27:37

Also the first £10k you earn is tax free so worth trying to work at least part time.

Why can't your dp reduce his hours and work a 4 day week and look after baby so you can work one day whilst he does the childcare - his CSA payments would go down accordingly plus that is income that is fully NI'd and taxed.

TheGhostOfPortoPast Tue 17-Dec-13 21:40:49

Do you get to keep the money from the car sale? Though to be honest, it would be much better if you got to pass your test and weren't reliant on hi to drive you everywhere, eh?

PrincessFlirtyPants Tue 17-Dec-13 21:44:37

Is he only marginally a high rate tax payer?

GuernseyTeddy Wed 18-Dec-13 23:57:39

He earns 60k including bonus. But take home each month after season ticket and CSA payments deducted is only about £2000.

He refuses to alter his working pattern, and this would be the only way we'd be able to make any money from my working. Quality childcare here is ridiculously expensive.

I won't get to keep any money from the car sale, as he bought the car.

Will soon be in the position where if he fails to get anything when leaving the country on business, could very likely have to go without food etc for several days as I'll have no funds of my own.

LittleBearPad Thu 19-Dec-13 00:10:29

You need a joint account with him and equal access to his income.

How on earth can £60k gross turn into £24k net. Something is not adding up there. Unless his bonus is paid once a year and his monthly income is much lower than £5k.

Even so you should have discussed this before now.

notapizzaeater Thu 19-Dec-13 00:24:35

If you are. Sahm you need access to the joint account. It isn't his money it's family money. Alternatively go back to work and charge him 50 % of the childcare costs.

Sarahplane Thu 19-Dec-13 00:24:54

If he earns £60k then that works out at nearly £3500 per month after tax and ni. How much is his season ticket and csa?

JanePurdy Thu 19-Dec-13 06:51:37

Your issue is that you are being financially controlled not the figures. £2k a month is okay but you have to have access to it! Have you discussed this?

ithaka Thu 19-Dec-13 07:12:38

£2K a month is highly do-able for family with one child. Your DP leaving you without money is your problem.

Although in fairness, this was the reason CB was not income related and went to the mum - to ensure their was money for her and the child. However, society has moved on from the days when the man controlled the wage packet & your DP (& you) need to move with it.

Splatt34 Thu 19-Dec-13 07:20:38

You should claim child benefit. If he earns 60k you will probably keep some of it. He presumably pays into a pension. This is deducted before the CB calculations IYSWIM, so to have to repay all cb you need 60k after pension and other similar deductions. Similarly if he claimed childcare vouchers that would also come off First.

Can you look at evening / weekend work when he will look after baby? Ultimately he needs to share the money though. If he's prepared to leave you & his child with no clothes and food why are you with him?

Snog Thu 19-Dec-13 07:33:26

go back to work full time and contribute 50% each to chikdcare and household expenses. then you will have your own money and financial security. if your dh wont agree ltb

bubblesausage Thu 19-Dec-13 08:42:07

I really don't want to sound too harsh, but I can't understand why you would be in a relationship with a man who would go out of the country and leave you with no money/access to any money to feed you and your (his too!) child. If that's how he wants to do things, I think you're better off returning to work and having him pay half the childcare costs, after all it's his child too.

ShanghaiDiva Thu 19-Dec-13 08:52:20

Will soon be in the position where if he fails to get anything when leaving the country on business, could very likely have to go without food etc for several days as I'll have no funds of my own.

Your husband would leave the country leaving you with no money and no food - and the reason you are with him is what exactly?
You are a partnership and have a child together and finances need to be shared to benefit the entire family.
This is so unbelievable - must be a wind up!

LIZS Thu 19-Dec-13 08:56:14

Why do you not have access to his account ? Sorry don't get the his/her/your/my money especially with children involved - the household income is each of yours. Is he prepared to make similar cut backs?

Childcare costs should not come directly from whatever you earn , nor to feed/clothe baby who presumably is your dp's too. Does his job have a childcare voucher scheme perhaps ? Is pt working more viable for you, use a CM instead of a nursery and if you have an older child (you mention children) make sure you get the EY funding once he/she is 3. Do you still have a job open for you or does claiming MA suggest you haven't now.

At 60k inc bonus he may yet qualify to keep some CB if he makes pension contributions etc from this. I hope at very least you have registered your baby so you get NI credits for your state pension , even if you elected not to receive payments.

MyMILisfromHELL Thu 19-Dec-13 08:58:08

Sorry op, but this is financial abuse. You're being controlled by your H. Tbh with you, he sounds like a selfish twat.

LIZS Thu 19-Dec-13 09:06:51

What were your arrangements before ML ?

AlwaysOneMissing Thu 19-Dec-13 09:07:56

You need an honest and frank discussion with him where you both sit down and discuss finances. (Surely he can do without his season ticket if it means you are struggling to buy food?!)

If he is unhelpful and controlling and you still have no access to money, I would be making plans to LTB.

If left as it is, this situation will only get worse.

OodKingWenceslas Thu 19-Dec-13 09:10:13

If you claim CB doesn't he repay it rather than you?

LIZS Thu 19-Dec-13 09:11:39

If a season ticket is his travel to /form work then I guess that is a priority . Just because he bought the car doesn't mean that the proceeds cannot be used to the mutual benefit .

Alanna1 Thu 19-Dec-13 09:26:03

OP, are you OK? I am quite worried about you and your DC from what you say in this post. I have a couple of friends whose husbands are just higher rate and the loss of CB has hit them hard. Childcare in London is expensive (am guessing you are the SE). I earn more than my husband so had to go back to work at 6 months, and basically childcare is all of his income and in cash terms its not worth him working. But work isn't just about income and it will be easier when the kids go to school. But that's ok, that leaves my income for everything else and we just about scrape by. But your DP needs to give you enough - or you need to go back to work and split childcare etc.

Fairylea Thu 19-Dec-13 09:27:08

You do realise how ridiculous this is don't you?

You are a family. The money is family money.

Taking this on face value he has £2000 a month coming in. So what the fuck is he doing with that? How much is your mortgage / rent?! Could you move somewhere cheaper?

I really fail to understand how a man earning 60k can have the balls to almost make anyone feel sorry for him for being poor! I want to slap him with a wet fish.

My dh earns 15. I used to earn a lot so we have a small mortgage - 390 a month. We have two dc and I am unable to work due to health problems so for now I am a sahm. We manage fine. We have a joint account, all money in, all money out. We split whatever is left equally to spend.

I think the main problem here is that you are with a selfish arse, not how much money you have.

Aquariusgirl86 Thu 19-Dec-13 09:37:01

£2000 is a perfectly reasonable amount to live off with a child. We have 2 children and £1800 a month after tax and also manage to save. If this literally leaves you with nothing then maybe your mortgage/ rent it too high and toy should consider moving to rectify this?

Creamycoolerwithcream Thu 19-Dec-13 09:53:13

You definitely need to get some control over the household income but for now I'd try and get a monthly allowance and then use it for food, baby stuff, clothes you both need etc. I doubt if he's going to go for joint finances at this point in time but suggesting an amount, say £300 a month and say you will buy all the food and baby stuff will at least give you a bit of control. I also second what the others have said about claiming child benefit and he pays the tax on it. Don't make a big debate of it just do it.

GuernseyTeddy Thu 19-Dec-13 13:20:29

Definitely not a wind-up. This is my financial situation honestly. I'm curtailed by the moment by not wanting to put my son in childcare, and definitely very averse to doing so when I'd be no better off. We're SE, so any jobs in my line of work - editing and digital media, are primarily London-based; which would mean a 12 hour day for my son in childcare. Added to that is that my experience is public sector and the salaries don't even cover the cost of childcare, let alone a £4k per annum commute.

I'm looking into freelance editing work, which would allow me to work from home - but don't really know where to start, and am not especially confident given my lack of freelance experience.

GuernseyTeddy Thu 19-Dec-13 13:22:46

And his mortgage is £800 a month. We can't move - no savings to fund costs of a move, and we need to live in this area for contact with his daughter.

NatashaBee Thu 19-Dec-13 13:52:52

You could try peopleperhour to bid on graphic design/editing jobs you can do from home. I still think you need to start by claiming the child benefit though - you cannot live on thin air and you need access to emergency cash at the very least. You could get a credit card, use it expenses throughout the month and then pay it from the next month's paycheque. Something needs to give here.

poorbuthappy Thu 19-Dec-13 13:56:58

You need to explain how £3.5k per month turns into £2k per month after CSA and season ticket.

Creamycoolerwithcream Thu 19-Dec-13 14:03:10

The problem isn't that DP is a higher tax earner but that you two haven't got a financial plan for when your maternity pay ends.

I think you are just looking at all the negatives.

You don't want to put your son in childcare (well plenty of us do), you have already decided there won't be any jobs more locally, and you are saying you earn the same or less than the cost of putting one child in childcare?

You mention HIS mortgage. If this is the case and you are not married to a man who has the house in his sole name then you need to get back to work and not be financially dependent on him.

Also, you mention he has a daughter. How much csa is he paying? Is it just for one child? It sounds like he has his own plans for his money and is prioritising his previous child over the one you have with him. Honestly OP, you need to get your head round the fact that you need to look after yourself financially, because he certainly isn't going to (by the sound of it). its very melodramatic to say that you might have to go without food if he leaves the country on business. He is on £60k. The issue is not that you don't get child benefit but that HE needs to be more open with his earnings and treat you as an equal in the relationship.

Unless there are other underlying issues? How long have you been with him?

Alibabaandthe40nappies Thu 19-Dec-13 14:22:25

His mortgage? Are you on the deeds of the house? Please tell me you are?

What is your P's proposal then OP? How does he plan to provide for his new baby as well as his older child?

Alibabaandthe40nappies Thu 19-Dec-13 14:24:32

Out of interest OP, why did his first marriage/relationship break down?

GuernseyTeddy Thu 19-Dec-13 14:27:56

I can't put him in childcare, not without there being some benefit for him. At the moment it just doesn't make any sense, I would just be working to pay someone to look after him. Same with leaving, I wouldn't put him in the same kind of poverty I grew up into as a kid. Worse case scenario I guess I would leave him here: don't see why he needs to pay the price for my stupid decisions.

NatashaBee Thu 19-Dec-13 14:32:53

If you don't even have access to money to buy food when your partner is away, then don't you think that's poverty?

Fairylea Thu 19-Dec-13 14:33:39

If your dp won't give you any money to support your dc then you're in worse poverty than if you up and leave and manage on benefits. There is nothing wrong with being on benefits - within a couple of years you will be entitled to free nursery and can try and find work, and on a low income (without your selfish prick of a dp) you will be entitled to lots of help from tax credits towards childcare. Please do some research and know your options. This sort of financially abusive situation is exactly what the benefits system was devised for.

Aquariusgirl86 Thu 19-Dec-13 14:51:49

So after tax, CSA and season ticket you have. £2000
- £800 mortgage..... Where does the other £1200 go?
I'm a bit perplexed as after tax and student loans ect we have £1800 but our mortgage is £620...... So you basically have the same as us and we pay bills for and feed and clothe 4 of us and have a bit left.......
Am I missing something?

If your partner is awful enough to leave you without food and money you LEAVE him and set up on your own.

This is a no brainer.

Very sorry for you.

The benefit of you working is that you are not financially dependent on a man who you think is capable of leaving you with no money for yourself and/or leaving you with nothing to buy food if he goes out of the country!

Why did his first marriage breakdown? Was it due to finances? It doesn't sound like he is particularly stingy with the children/child from it if he is paying major sums in csa. And can you tell us why the switch from 50/50 to every other weekend. There must have been some big reason for this if its having such a negative impact on your finances.

Your last post is starting to make you sound a bit bitter. If you leave your child with his father then YOU will have to pay csa.

poorbuthappy Thu 19-Dec-13 15:31:38

£1500 on csa and season ticket - I think there is probably pension contributions here somewhere too, but really?? fconfused

Have you ever seen a breakdown of your outgoings?

JoinYourPlayfellows Thu 19-Dec-13 15:38:14

You really must go back to work.

You would be absolutely crazy to leave yourself financially dependent on a man who pays for fucking SEASON TICKETS before he buys essentials for his child.

Also - go and claim your child benefit.

He can sort out his taxes. Not your problem.

But don't leave yourself short of that money.

Creamycoolerwithcream Thu 19-Dec-13 15:53:20

Season ticket to get to work.

JoinYourPlayfellows Thu 19-Dec-13 15:54:46

Oh right, of course!

I thought it was a sports season ticket and I was confused

LIZS Thu 19-Dec-13 16:02:35

If you can't go back to your previous career, look for an alternative . Plenty of jobs can pay more than the £50 per day or so nursery/cm costs especially in the SE. Why is he paying £1k+ pm CSA towards only one child , that seems an awful lot hmm. Not sure you're being given the whole picture

TheNumberfaker Thu 19-Dec-13 16:03:19

You need to claim your CB and have a frank conversation about your finances.

SantasLittleMonkeyButler Thu 19-Dec-13 16:27:36

OP, how many other children does your DP have? Is there just one daughter & your son?

How much is paying to the CSA each month? From the rough figures you have given, it would seem to be around £1000 (allowing £500 for travel costs). Is this just for one child? Is he paying some sort of spousal support to his ex too?

As others have said, the figures don't really add up. Unless your DP is servicing a large amount of debt, I can't honestly see why he cannot afford to pay at least 50% of childcare costs OR transfer a monthly amount to your account, whilst you are a SAHM and not earning.

Our household income is roughly £2000 per month & we have three DCs. We manage.

ContentedSidewinder Thu 19-Dec-13 17:42:52

I've been a SAHM for 9 years, I have a credit card in DH's name (I am an affiliated card holder) if we need anything I use that.

We have a joint bank account for direct debits and I still claim child benefit for my NI stamp even though Dh is a higher rate tax payer and they tax it back. Plus we use this as a cash account, ie withdraw it as cash to use as and when.

You need a very frank discussion about your finances. You can't have separate finances at this point. He needs to pay toward the cost of his child with you.

RandomMess Thu 19-Dec-13 19:16:21

Does he have CSA arrears or something - it really doesn't add up I'm afraid!

lilyaldrin Thu 19-Dec-13 19:20:39

If your partner is really keeping money from you and refusing to feed or clothe you and your baby then he is abusive and you need to leave. You don't have a relationship here.

VivaLeBeaver Thu 19-Dec-13 19:28:04

You ought to think about going back to work even if you only break even after childcare. Look at the long term picture. The alternative is in five years time you can't get a job as you have no up to date experience. You then spend another 20 years not working or do a little shop work.

I spent three years doing unwaged training/degree while dd was little. So was out of pocket every month paying for childcare. Couldn't claim childcare tax credits as I wasn't working.

But now I have a well paid job. If I hadn't done that I'd be working in Tesco probably.

Wibblypiglikesbananas Thu 19-Dec-13 19:30:30

This makes no sense to me. I also don't understand how you've suddenly come to the conclusion that you have no money now your maternity allowance has stopped. Didn't you save to cover the shortfall whilst you were pregnant, knowing this would happen?!

When I was PG with DC1, DH and I looked at how much we needed each month as a minimum and saved accordingly (and like mad for 8 months) - it was the only way I could afford to have a year off. We drew down on the savings as the year went by, so didn't use much during the 6 weeks at 90% of salary period but did once SMP stopped. We had absolutely no slack so stuck to our monthly budget and our holiday that year was using airmiles for flights and staying in a relative's house in France. The alternative was going back to work sooner.

perrinelli Thu 19-Dec-13 19:42:06

If at all possible you should get him to get childcare vouchers through work, if he's a higher rate tax payee you'd effectively safe 40% on the cost of childcare (or the part paid by the vouchers anyway). My DH's company didn't offer them but he asked and they signed up to it, I don't think it costs the company much if anything

Sorry I know that clearly isn't the major issue here but might mean childcare is more affordable than you think.

tribpot Thu 19-Dec-13 19:43:32

Wibblypig, my understanding is that costs have unexpectedly risen outside the OP's control. The DH was originally (I presume) paying no CSA as care was shared 50:50 (although had the running costs of the kids associated with them - or is it her? - being there 50% of the time).

Care has changed dramatically so is now nearly full-time with the other parent. This has removed the surplus from the budget.

Despite being the parent of all the children involved in this situation, the DH appears to have no solution to offer. And appears to be intending to pocket the money from the sale of a vehicle which the OP did because she can't afford the running costs.

Since the DH would also have to make a CSA payment to you if you left him, OP, I can't really see the argument that you'd be worse off as a single parent.

MisForMumNotMaid Thu 19-Dec-13 19:49:23

You should still claim child benefit as this protects your pension (even though it may be clawed back through your DP's Tax). This is for your personal long term protection. Each year you're looking after young DC will still count as a year worked for your state pension calculation.

Your DP should be claiming maintenance relief to reduce his tax bill.

You need to seek proper tax advice as to whether child maintenance payments are 'allowable deductions' i.e. Taken off the gross salary like pension contributions for the purpose of establishing where income falls for the purpose of the child benefit calculation.

If your DP's wage is exactly £60k are there no pension contributions to bring the considered amount into the tapered area where you wont have all of it clawed back.

LightsPlease Thu 19-Dec-13 20:01:07

Im really shocked by what you are saying.

NatashaBee Thu 19-Dec-13 20:14:14

Seems like maintenance relief only applies if the poster's partner or his ex were born before 1935?

MarthasChin Thu 19-Dec-13 20:18:00

What a situation. Utter madness confused. You haven't answered why you don't have joint finances, why you didn't plan for this drop in income when pregnant or before getting pregnant. Has he always been like this with money or is it a new thing?

Sounds like you'd get more off him by CSA if you walked. Don't you dare give him any of that money from the sale of your car. Good luck OP.

Snog Thu 19-Dec-13 20:18:03

Your partner earns £60k but would happily see you and his baby starve whilst he is abroad.
Wake up OP.
LTB, get a full time job and support your child.

MisForMumNotMaid Thu 19-Dec-13 20:27:58

Sorry op the maintenance relief does appear to be for very old people only. (NatashaBee is a better proof reader than me). I've seen the boxes on the tax return and just googled the link.

clarinsgirl Thu 19-Dec-13 20:51:03

Childcare is not just your responsibility, its a joint responsibility. If your DP won't take his share then you need to make decisions without him. Get a job, sort child care and make sure you make use of childcare vouchers or any other benefits you can.

A number of your posts set alarm bells ringing. From the limited information you have provided, it sounds like you are being financially controlled.

Get out and good luck.

GuernseyTeddy Fri 20-Dec-13 19:19:29

Think we're going. He just spent the last half an hour shouting at me, sating how unreasonable I was expecting some 'diamond lifestyle', when I'd screwed my life up. Then disparaged the notion of me going home to 'freeload' off my parents. Hope my dad can pick me up Monday or I'll be spending my sons first Christmas alone here.

LIZS Fri 20-Dec-13 19:22:26

sad so sorry

tribpot Fri 20-Dec-13 19:24:43

How have you screwed your life up? By having a child? Well, he's got two!

Time to go back to your parents' and regroup, GuernseyTeddy. I think this issue would have manifested itself at some point, even without the change of contact arrangements which caused the CSA payments.

hotair Fri 20-Dec-13 19:25:42

You're making the right decision op, if your dad can't fetch you, maybe a localmums netter could help, where are you? He sounds like an abusive arse and you and your child will be better off without him

NatashaBee Fri 20-Dec-13 19:28:09

Good, I hope you can go through with it. Spend the next couple of days stashing copies of any bank, pension statements and payslips you might need for later. And whatever happens, even if you end up not leaving in time for this Christmas, your son's future Christmases will be far better for not living with this excuse for a father any more.

GuernseyTeddy Fri 20-Dec-13 19:33:12

I don't really have much that I need to take. Only my son's red book and certificates. Other than that I don't have anything.

The screwed your life up thing is a stick he likes to beat me with. I went to a really good university and would have a very high paying career by now, only I dropped out in my final year.

LIZS Fri 20-Dec-13 19:35:58

He'll feel it when CSA sting him for more maintenance, then whose life will be screwed up . Take passports, old payslips, bank statements etc(especially copies of his), certificates

GuernseyTeddy Fri 20-Dec-13 19:41:33

I'm just so frightened and scared. I know that there are loads of strong women out there, but I'm really not one of them. Am cacking myself at the thought of what the hell I'm going to do now.

Just can't stand him shouting at me every time I try to stand up for myself and question the status quo here.

Am now sobbing to myself in the dark next to my sons crib, as that's the only place in this house I can go. Will be sleeping on the floor here next to the crib as I'm not welcome downstairs, and really don't want to go in his bedroom tonight.

Sackedoff Fri 20-Dec-13 19:50:12

You can finish your degree on the open university when you are settled. Any study that you have done previously counts towards your degree including the points you have already gained from the time you have spent at uni already.

Just take things one step at a time. For tonight, find some bedding and make yourself a nest. Don't cry, you will get through this and have a lovely life with your son.
Tomorrow you can confirm a lift from your dad. Take things minute by minute if you have to.
I promise you will be fine. flowers

NatashaBee Fri 20-Dec-13 19:55:06

You may need his payslips at a later date for the CSA - he hasn't given you the full picture on his finances so I doubt he will give it to them either if they ask.

SamsGoldilocks Fri 20-Dec-13 19:58:52

I'm sorry love. He is a prize cock and you are not screwing things up if you leave him. He has done that with his controlling behaviour.

Seriously get details of hisbank accounts and statements. If he expects you to support yourself and your son you will need all the evidence of his income that you can find.

TheGhostOfPortoPast Fri 20-Dec-13 20:02:36

Can your dad not pick you up sooner? Your DP sounds like a right bastard.

Fairylea Fri 20-Dec-13 20:02:47

You are a strong woman, you just don't know it yet smile I promise.

Is there anywhere you can go tomorrow to stay? What are your plans? The quicker you are out the faster you can start to claim for things.

Don't be scared, be positive. You are going to be so much better off without him.

My ex dh left me for a girlfriend he'd had before me (after 7 years of marriage) and disappeared in all of 2 weeks leaving me with dd and 26k worth of debt. I posted a Facebook status that night saying my life was over, because I genuinely thought it was. I was scared and had no job, nothing.

5 years later I am remarried and life is good. I have a ds now too, 18 months old.

Please remember this is just a blip. It will be ok.

Sleepyhoglet Fri 20-Dec-13 20:05:29

This sounds a very difficult situation. I really do think going back to work is a good idea. Even if you can't see any short term benefits, long term you will be building your career and your future. Could you live with your parents for a year or two and commute from there or is that unfeasible?

GuernseyTeddy Fri 20-Dec-13 20:12:55

Would love to leave ASAP, and would probably be easier for my dad to collect me tomorrow but he's planned to take my son to his parents for Christmas, so the only way I'll be able to spend Christmas with my son is my leaving with him on monday. Sounds like a really crummy thing to do I know, but I've had such analysis awful year and sacrificed so much to have my son, that I don't really want to have to be away from him on his first Christmas.

LittleBearPad Fri 20-Dec-13 20:21:35

I don't understand what Christmas has to do with it or how leaving on Monday means you can spend Christmas with your son. Ask your dad to pick you up tomorrow. Go to your parents with your son and stay there, including for Christmas.

You deserve a lot more than this and it will all work out ok.

GuernseyTeddy Fri 20-Dec-13 20:28:51

Both our families live several hours drive away. The plan has been for us to drive up to his family on Christmas Eve and then spend a few days there. The plan is now for me to spend Christmas here on my own while he takes our son as planned. If my parents drive up to collect me tomorrow, I'm worried he won't let me take my son with me.

tribpot Fri 20-Dec-13 20:33:22

I don't believe he actually would take your son on his own, although because it would look spectacularly odd to his parents.

There isn't a massive amount he could do to stop you leaving if your dad is there too. I can see how it's easier to go whilst he's at work on Monday, but if he senses you are getting ready to run he will find a reason to be there on Monday. Please talk to your dad tomorrow and get your plan in place.

HaroldTheGoat Fri 20-Dec-13 20:33:48

Your letting him take DS to his parents whilst you stay there on your own? Is that right?

Fairylea Fri 20-Dec-13 20:35:18

I wouldn't let ds out of my sight right now. Either go with him and then leave when you come back or take ds with you. What's to say he wouldn't run off with ds? He's an abusive idiot. And I wouldn't trust him.

Ring women's aid for advice.

HaroldTheGoat Fri 20-Dec-13 20:35:23

Sorry I see your waiting and going with DS on Monday?,

OP he sounds absolutely horrible what a nasty controlling bully.

Get away from him thanks

sleeplessinderbyshire Fri 20-Dec-13 20:36:27

listen OP, I'm not normally one for wading in where I have no experience but with the dispassionate eye of a friendly stranger YOU NEED TO GET OUT. Tomorrow get your dad to come. Do not tell your OH anything. When your dad arrives make sure your bag with essentials (birth cert, passport, any special things) is ready - make it smallish - if you can stuff it all in the change bag all the better. When your dad arrives get baby in car seat. Put baby in car, get in car. Your dad drives off. You have left. Any suspicion from your partner either try and fob it off by making your dad a coffee and relaxing briefly and then setting off for some 3 generational last minute shopping or just get out with your dads physical help (+/- police)

Leave anything else behind. It's just stuff. you can get it later or buy it another time. Do not let this man make you doubt yourself any further and certainly do not let him have your son on his own at christmas.

LittleBearPad Fri 20-Dec-13 20:37:58

Well bugger that for a game of soldiers. Get your dad to pick you up and take your son with you tomorrow. If you don't have much stuff it shouldn't be difficult.

HaroldTheGoat Fri 20-Dec-13 20:38:48

Yes get out and to your parents ASAP. everything else can be sorted out later.

What sort of total arsehole thinks of leaving you on your own at Christmas whilst he swans around with DS anyway?

You absolutely are doing the right thing, imagine living with this man reliant on him for every penny.

TheGhostOfPortoPast Fri 20-Dec-13 20:40:07

What LittleBear said. Your dad collects you tomorrow and he can fuck right off.

GuernseyTeddy Fri 20-Dec-13 20:48:02

My dad has text saying he can do Mon, but also this weekend. Am now thinking I should just go tomorrow based on everyone's responses.

Fairylea Fri 20-Dec-13 20:49:38

Definitely tomorrow!!

Why wait? He's behaved absolutely appallingly

You don't owe him anything. And if he's prepared to leave his own son with no money for food then he can fuck off having him for Christmas. .

Definitely get out tomorrow with DS. Your P is unlikely to physically intervene if your Dad's there. And if he does, call the police. They take financial abuse very seriously these days - it's very much considered Domestic Abuse.

HaroldTheGoat Fri 20-Dec-13 20:51:22

Yes go. There is non point torturing yourself by staying there any longer than you have to.

You are not welcome downstairs.. Fuck him.

Alibabaandthe40nappies Fri 20-Dec-13 20:56:21

You should definitely go tomorrow.

The fact that your dad seems keen to get you out ASAP speaks volumes IMO.

As for not letting you take your son? Fuck that for a game of soldiers. You are primary carer, he is an abusive arsehole. End of discussion.

TheGhostOfPortoPast Fri 20-Dec-13 20:56:55

Gather your important stuff - birth certificates/passports/red book/bank cards and get your dad to collect you in the morning. Access can be sorted later. Go home, enjoy your first Xmas with your son and sort the crap out in the New Yearl

TheGhostOfPortoPast Fri 20-Dec-13 20:59:08

Don't tell the arse though.

Sleepyhoglet Fri 20-Dec-13 21:09:58

I'm confused, OP, when did you split up with your DP? Was it when you wrote the OP or were you together but just being treated appallingly?

tribpot Fri 20-Dec-13 21:10:23

Yes, just go. There's too much that could happen between now and Monday. You need some headspace.

LittleBearPad Fri 20-Dec-13 21:15:17

Good luck lovely. It will all be ok.

Elfina Fri 20-Dec-13 21:24:13

Oh love. What area of SE are you? I'm wondering if I can help sign post you to some help. You need to get out of there ASAP.

GuernseyTeddy Fri 20-Dec-13 21:31:22

I'm in a herts town that sounds a lot like bitching.

Elfina Fri 20-Dec-13 21:40:18

I don't know Herts at all hmm can you get a train to your parents first thing?

GuernseyTeddy Fri 20-Dec-13 21:45:45

Not really. I have a carrier for DS but I would need to get a train to KX, get across the underground to Paddington and then a two hour train journey from there. Ideally need to wait for my dad to take bottles, clothes, travel cot, car seat, pushchair etc for DS.

sleeplessinderbyshire Fri 20-Dec-13 21:50:37

Guernseyteddy, really just go on the train. your dad can get the stuff later (or whilst you're on the train heading the other way) If you can't get it, leave it. I know it cost a fortune but it is just stuff. Leave it, really just go

Elfina Fri 20-Dec-13 21:53:25

It might not be as bad as you think. How old is DS? It might be a good idea to get to your folks, then come back with your dad on Monday for the rest of your stuff. You just need a carrier and a rucksack. You'll feel a bit stronger with your dad with you.

I wish I was a bit closer. Do you have any friends at all nearer by?

GuernseyTeddy Sat 21-Dec-13 09:27:37

Just packing some stuff. He knows leaving but not that I'm planning to go on Monday. Got the 'why are you packing now? queries though.

Hiding, once again, in DS's room while he naps.

GuernseyTeddy Sat 21-Dec-13 09:33:41

DS is four months old. Reason I'm a bit 'meh' about the train, is that last time I tried to leave I got no further than Finsbury park due to stairs and pram (pre carrier), and then managed to fall getting off the train on the way back tipping DS forward in his pram. Thankfully he was strapped in, but it could easily have gone badly wrong. Hence why I'm worried about trying the train again.

tribpot Sat 21-Dec-13 09:58:32

You've left before, GuernseyTeddy? That's news I think.

Someone will always help you with the pram, even in London. But can your dad not come and pick you up today? What does your DH know about you leaving on Monday? Does he think it's just you going to your parents for Christmas whilst he takes your ds to his parents'?

hotair Sat 21-Dec-13 10:05:35

I would call your dad and leave today.

OOAOML Sat 21-Dec-13 10:32:19

Seriously - call your Dad and get out now. I remember my Dad once saying to me that if I was really in trouble, all I had to do was call and he would get to me, it didn't matter what time it was or where I was. That's what good parents do - your Dad has told you he can do it today, take him up on it. Go.

LIZS Sat 21-Dec-13 10:35:58

Agree now he knows you're going , better to do so quickly before he puts obstacles in your way and potentially turns nasty, even perhaps taking ds while you are off guard to his parents. If ds is only 4 months , how come you lose Maternity Pay in Feb btw ?

nkf Sat 21-Dec-13 10:39:18

Does he not pay childcare?

nkf Sat 21-Dec-13 10:40:09

Sorry. Didn't read enough of the thread. Hope all goes well.

Sarahplane Sat 21-Dec-13 10:55:01

If I were you I would call your dad and ask him to get you today.

Elfina Sat 21-Dec-13 12:13:31

Poor love. I was shit scared of the train and tube in London when mine was that little. The way I got round it was asking someone specific for help - young men in gym gear, or those that look like mums are the best bet!

You don't need pushchair, you need to get out. Carrier and essential documents. Anything else cab be bought borrowed or begged once at your folks.

Please tell me you've gone and this is redundant. hmm

GuernseyTeddy Sat 21-Dec-13 13:18:56

Still here. He read my phone texts, so now knows I was planning on leaving Mon. Dad collecting me tomorrow now, but he's saying he won't allow it and will call the police?? Wtf?

So will see how that works out...hmm

OpheliasWeepingWillow Sat 21-Dec-13 13:28:03

He won't allow it? OK YOU call the police. Get out for a walk and use your mobile or find a phone box. Get to a neighbours house or wait until he is asleep and get out of there.

OpheliasWeepingWillow Sat 21-Dec-13 13:29:55

And don't leave him alone with your child.

Worried about you.

LIZS Sat 21-Dec-13 13:31:56

Is there a local Travelodge or even call Women's Aid to get out until your dad comes. Police won't stop you leaving and he'll look a prat.

tribpot Sat 21-Dec-13 13:34:55

Why was it possible for him to read your texts? You need to be much more wary than this.

Can your dad fetch you today? You're now in a state of war.

It's unlikely he could persuade the police that you were abducting your own child but the same is also true in reverse. I would phone Women's Aid today to talk about ways you can prevent him from leaving with your son.

Please take care of yourself. This is the riskiest time.

GuernseyTeddy Sat 21-Dec-13 13:40:12

I'm not letting my son out of my sight today, and I'll be sleeping on the floor in his room again tonight.

Am pretty scared but it's only one more night and then my dad will be here. Don't think he'll try and force him off me - work in finance so can't have any criminal record etc, and secondly he's going through family court proceedings for his daughter and an assault conviction would be flagged up by safeguarding.

clam Sat 21-Dec-13 13:49:24

Got to this thread too late. Was just about to say for God's sake hide your phone!
Hope you're safe.

clam Sat 21-Dec-13 13:50:02

Do you have any friends you could go to for today and overnight?

hotair Sat 21-Dec-13 14:52:33

call the police, tell them you are afraid of what he might do and that he is financially abusing you. get your dad to come now and the police to escort you out.

Wibblypiglikesbananas Sat 21-Dec-13 15:05:28

Is is no time to delay - just get out of there! You can do it.

Damnautocorrect Sat 21-Dec-13 16:34:37

Am I going bonkers in thinking the law changed recently to include financial abuse?

Elfina Sat 21-Dec-13 20:43:01

Please try and leave.

tribpot Sun 22-Dec-13 07:22:40

Hope you got through the night. Today you need just to go.

Can your dad not come today? It's an emergency

tribpot Sun 22-Dec-13 08:31:00

Stealth, I think the OP's dad is coming today. Early doors, I hope.

Ah yes good, I got confused

Hope your dad's on his way now, or maybe even there. Good luck.

finallydelurking Sun 22-Dec-13 09:40:24

How horrible, really hoping the op comes back to say her and her ds are safe with her Dad.

Cannot imagine why this charming man split from his previous wife and is having to go to court to see his daughter hmm

Viviennemary Sun 22-Dec-13 16:37:09

You are either a couple where both of you are responsible financially for each other and your children or single people. I just can't grasp how you think you have no money when your partner earns £60K per annum.

Sarahplane Sun 22-Dec-13 16:45:27

I hope you and your ds are now safely at your parents

Clargo55 Sun 22-Dec-13 16:57:30

Hope you are doing ok OP. Thinking of you and DS x

learnasyougo Sun 22-Dec-13 16:59:40

only 2k after tax and bills? that is more than our GROSS family income (2 adults, one toddler and one on the way. you need to have a serious word with him.

tribpot Sun 22-Dec-13 17:02:55

The 2K is after tax and CSA payments have been deducted, not after bills, learnasyougo. However, I suspect that even if there was 2 grand sloshing around in the family budget after bills had been paid the OP would still have no cash sad

Hermione123 Sun 22-Dec-13 17:16:22

Hope you got away from him op. He sounds appalling and agree csa, and a new plan away from him sounds great.

HaroldTheGoat Mon 23-Dec-13 11:55:50

Hope you are now with your dad OP thanks

BranchingOut Mon 23-Dec-13 12:06:19

Hope all is well.

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