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Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you have any legal concerns we suggest you consult a solicitor.

Legal matters

Passport Issues

18 replies

balia · 23/02/2013 10:17

Hi all - have posted about the situation with my DSS before but basically DH now has a court order for half the holidays plus a two week block in the summer for our family holiday. Dss's mum is very anti-contact (there are MH issues). The Court order says she is to hand over Dss's passport not later than 28 days before we fly. Dss had a passport a couple of years ago as he went to France with his Mum, but we don't know if he has one currently. His Mum is refusing to discuss it and says she doesn't have to until 28 days before the holiday. That seems a bit late if she turns round at that point and says she has lost it/it is out of date.

Is there any way of checking if he has an in-date passport? Can DH apply for one for him?

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Lonecatwithkitten · 23/02/2013 13:10

With post office check and send the turn around is 14 days so even if our of date you would be able to get a new one.
Maybe just not arguing the issue and letting it go could help to improve the situation?

balia · 23/02/2013 14:13

Hmm...well, if by 'improve the situation' you mean that DSS doesn't get to go on holiday with his Dad, which he desparately wants to, then yes, DH could just let it go. If he'd done that when DSS was little and all contact was refused, I'm sure he would have had a much less stressful life altogether.

DH is concerned because the websites he has looked at don't give a 'turn around' time, except the online application says not to use it if you are travelling in less than 4 weeks. He's also unsure how 'straightforward' an application it would be given his PR is by court order.

But thank you for your help.

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Gigondas · 23/02/2013 14:29

Was dh married when dss was born to his ex? If so that counts as pr for getting a renewal. And you can pay more for a premium service here

Annoying for you (this is not an ex bashing thread here but I do have sympathy for tricky situations where the kids get hurt) but it is doable within 28 days.

KindleMum · 23/02/2013 14:55

It can often take up to 3 weeks to get an appointment for the Premium Service, I've done it! I would be tempted to book the appointment in advance (the appt for the day after the 28 days starts but book it 2-3 weeks before isywim) and then you can always cancel it. They don't charge if you cancel the appt. They should then turn it around the same day.

The helpline for that service is very good, if you phone up they might be able to tell you if you'd encounter problems applying for the same day service and what you can do to ease it - in terms of documents to supply etc.

balia · 23/02/2013 15:45

No, they were never married, but he has PR by court order. I'd seen the bit about the Premium Service, what a fantastic idea to book an appointment in advance! And the local one is really near so DH can get there easily. That's a relief - I had visions of waiting for the post on the day before we fly! Thanks so much.

As you say, not ex-bashing, just trying to cover all the bases. Ex has a hoarding problem (currently not living in her own house because of it) so may genuinely find it very difficult to find the passport - and as she doesn't want DSS to go anyway, there's not a lot of incentive for her to find it.

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KindleMum · 23/02/2013 16:21

Yes, if I were in your position, I'd feel that knowing I had the appointment in place and that I'd checked what documentation I'd had and had that all ready, would help me a lot. I'd feel prepared.

janek · 23/02/2013 16:25

Do you have his full birth certificate? Would it be worth getting a copy of that now, so you know you have it if you need to get a passport at short notice?

lulu2 · 23/02/2013 16:27

Would you need dss's birth certificate to get the passport sorted last minute? Also when I applied for my dd's passport I had to take her dads birth certificate to the post office to be checked.

balia · 23/02/2013 17:30

DH says he has a copy of DSS's birth certificate (will have to check if it is short or full) and when he makes the appt he'll check what doc's we need. I think he'll have to renew it (if out of date) or declare it lost if she can't find it. I suppose it would be a different scenario if she just refuses to hand it over but that's not her usual MO. Am keeping my fingers crossed that we don't actually have to do any of it but as you say, Kindle, we'll feel more in control if we know how to still get him on holiday in case there are problems. DSS has a hard time of it sometimes and he does really well.

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Lonecatwithkitten · 24/02/2013 01:04

Sorry if I upset you my point balia is it is relatively straight forward to get a new passport in under 4 weeks I know several people who have phoned in the last couple of months and got a next day appointment for a new passport where you go at 8am and collect your passport at 3 to 4 o'clock or post office check and send will achieve it. so yes he would get to go on holiday.
I am a lone parent and my DD's Dad messes me about in many different ways. I have just found that sometimes approaching things head on can be the worst possible way and so you have to come at it from a different angle.

balia · 24/02/2013 18:51

You didn't upset me, Lonecat, I'm sure your advice was well-meant. As my initial question was meant to indicate, we weren't sure if DH could apply for another passport given he may not be sure where the existing one is. We would also be appliying at the busiest time - the website says in July you will probably have to wait 3 weeks for an appointment. If any of the people who have got passports in 24 hours are NRP's with court-ordered PR applying for a child's passport without the co-operation of the RP, I'd be really relieved to hear about it!

I'm sorry your ex messes you about but DH has discovered, over a period of many years during which he has tried to approach the situation from every possible angle, that the ONLY way to move things forward in terms of contact has been to rely on his ex for as little as possible and to use the court system. We've had more than our fair share of being messed about, so I do understand what you are saying, but when you get to the point of having to get a court order for holidays you are probably beyond the point where 'just be nice to her' might be effective. I wish things were different but they are what they are.

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floatyjosmum · 24/02/2013 20:52

If you would need to replace a passport that was in theory lost I don't think you can do this on the same day service - a friend list his and had a slight panic about it!

Could your dh enquire at the passport office to see if there's a passport or not and then you would at least know the situation - is there one to hand over or 28 days prior to the holiday his ex says he doesn't have one you need to sort it! His pr order should cover everything

balia · 24/02/2013 22:11

There must have been a passport at some stage as DSS has been to France. If DH can ring the passport office that would be at least a starting point. Will check in the morning, thanks.

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noBSplease · 25/02/2013 11:35

Have had to contact passport office re: ex/passport issues of a different nature and they've been really helpful and very understanding. I'd try contacting them first as they might be able do advise if his passport is still valid and how to progress... If it continuing problems I think you can get a court order re: who holds his passport, know court process can be a horrible drag but sounds like you've experienced the fact that court orders can make a more peaceful and less stressful situation for everyone! (Sounds like you may well have grounds to argue that ex is not the most suitable person to hold his passport)

We used post office check and send recently for our daughter, came back well within 14 days. Hope it all sorts out ok.

balia · 27/02/2013 19:40

Thanks for everyone's advice - DH rang passport office and as you said, noBS, they were really helpful. If the passport is lost we can't use the premium (next day) service, the quickest we could do it would be fast track (one week) and although at the moment appointments are available almost immediately, they do get much busier towards the summer, so they recommended Kindlemum's suggestion of making an appointment in advance. DH would need to take the court order and DSS's birth certificate plus a filled in application and a declaration of lost passport form, but we can get all that sorted out nearer the time. Crossed fingers we won't need to go to all this effort, but at least we don't have to worry about it now!

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KindleMum · 27/02/2013 20:34

Great. Being prepared puts your mind at rest and takes away a lot of the confrontation too. Hopefully she'll just hand it over though, it would be easiest!

noBSplease · 27/02/2013 20:43

Aah good news. Happy holidays!

janek · 28/02/2013 11:39

One last thing - they ask for parents' passport numbers on a child's passport application, but i'm not sure why. If it's just to confirm the child is entitled to a british passport, then just your DH's number will do, you may wish to confirm you don't need his exW's number too...

Having said that, my DDs only have my number on their forms because my DP doesn't have a British passport.

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