Neil Tweedie, for instance ...

(121 Posts)
WineBeforePearls Thu 19-Nov-09 09:19:35

is a prat

Anniemac must have got home from work early, obviously, to post at 1600 and really should be cleaning instead of wasting time online.

Kewcumber lives in Kew, therefore must be a bored City wife (oh boy)

prat prat prat

TheCrackFox Thu 19-Nov-09 09:29:57

"The cyber-mothers of England."

Erm, it isn't called the World Wide Web for nothing. You have to wonder about the whole article if he can't even work out how the internet works.

I love the fact he seems to think we should be doing housework all day. It has gone right over his head that a lot of Mumsnetters are at work. Has he never skived off and mooched about the internet when he should be working? Unlikely.

Still, it has to be the oldest insult in the World (and wearing thin) to describe all mothers as boring housewives. Yawn.

KeithTalent Thu 19-Nov-09 09:35:24

Kewcumber shock

Lazy lazy article

Who are the yummy mummies of Barnes?


cocolepew Thu 19-Nov-09 09:36:21

What a pile of shite.

Imagine posting online instead of cleaningshock! Bloody women don't know their place nowadays.

BTW I'm neither a "yummy mummy" <vomit>, middle class or live in England, should I leave now?

TheDevilWearsPrimark Thu 19-Nov-09 09:37:02

I was just about to link to this.

A tosser of the highest order

I do love the way he's also chosen quotes with spelling mistakes so he can be even more bloody SMUG.

WineBeforePearls Thu 19-Nov-09 09:39:05

Yes quite - obv. only people living in England can post grin And only from home, while CM looks after dcs and cleaner deals with house.

WineBeforePearls Thu 19-Nov-09 09:41:37

runaway, yes, 'And they can't spell either'

Whereas he has a sub to check his drivel.

NorkyButNice Thu 19-Nov-09 09:42:08

.... is a prime example of a twat.

What a crap article.

TheDevilWearsPrimark Thu 19-Nov-09 09:43:36

I wonder if mrs tweedie is a moldie (snurk)

Alibabaandthe40nappies Thu 19-Nov-09 09:44:38


What an utter knob.

Greensleeves Thu 19-Nov-09 09:46:18

lol, he's a talentless wanker


SkipToMyLou Thu 19-Nov-09 09:48:40

Flummoxed by how to spell the word 'flumoxed'. Tsk tsk.

Ignore ignore ignore, don't give him the satisfaction.

RnB Thu 19-Nov-09 09:50:04

He is a twat shock

cocolepew Thu 19-Nov-09 09:50:29

That was published at 7am, I hope he's tidied and cleaned since then. He's probably sitting in his jammies watching LK.

WineBeforePearls Thu 19-Nov-09 09:51:20

But it's the casual patronising misogynist crap that still appears daily in the press and is very depressing.

Hassled Thu 19-Nov-09 09:52:39

What a shining example of unprejudiced, fair reporting hmm.

AnnieMac, I hope you Know Your Place now. Posting at 4 in the afternoon when you should have been scrubbing the loo - honestly.

WineBeforePearls Thu 19-Nov-09 09:53:00

grin cocolepew

TheCrackFox Thu 19-Nov-09 09:53:10

He could have saved himself a lot of time and (not much) effort if he had just written "Woman, know your limits".

What an utter knob.

WineBeforePearls Thu 19-Nov-09 09:55:38

Yes, on no account attempt to have children, a job AND chat debates on MN. You Will Let Yourself Down.

ahundredtimes Thu 19-Nov-09 09:57:07

God, isn't it rude? 'These Einstein-Bohr discussions' shock

If only we discussed physics then we'd prove ourselves not to be vapid, dim, witless women without jobs or thoughts. Then we'll be allowed to vote! But right now, the future of the country is in the hands of middle-class sunday supplement aspirants who don't even clean their own houses and therefore shouldn't be trusted to vote alongside right thinking, sensible, considerably more intelligent men - such as himself, for instance. [david asquith emoticon]

He's got a column! He's an opinion former! Why isn't everyone listening to him! Who gave those daft dappy women any voice! Stop the rot!

Mr Tweedie. Tsk

LowLevelWhingeing Thu 19-Nov-09 09:57:47

patronising gobshite.

I'll get back to my suburban kitchen where I belong.

KnottyLocks Thu 19-Nov-09 10:04:56

Arsehole grin

<returns to darning socks>

ahundredtimes Thu 19-Nov-09 10:06:02

My favourite bit is about how when Mrs Tweedie used to 'dip in and out' - uhuh - it was really good, really interesting and vital and worthwhile and full of class angst and proper Einstein-Bohr discussions, but now?

Well <shakes head>

Without Mrs Tweedie we have lapsed somewhat, now we're dull.


Bramshott Thu 19-Nov-09 10:11:38

Holy-mo, he is quoting me, quoting OrmIrian, talking about winter fields - to prove what exactly?!?

SydneyScarborough Thu 19-Nov-09 10:14:16

I love the comment posted at the end recommending Netmums:

"a better website, and was copied by Mumsnet who seem only to have a better publicity machine but not a better site"


Stretch Thu 19-Nov-09 10:15:40

What a twat.

<<has another cuppa and a biscuit, a hobknob if you must know!>>

Isn't Anniemac about eight-and-a-half months pregnant? He really favours the "barefoot and pregnant scrubbing the kitchen floor" model, then...

ahundredtimes Thu 19-Nov-09 10:21:44

I think Bramshott to show how utterly unengaged with the political process you are - how airy fairy, how fey, how twee, talking about fields and Christmas instead of wrestling with the Middle East question.

Because, of course, every conversation Mr Tweedie has, every moment of his day, is spent considering weighty and important issues. You see. You see how different you are to him? wink

I've sent link to the article to Kewcumber on FB <assumes will be able to hear explosion from several miles away when she reads it>

MarshaBrady Thu 19-Nov-09 10:24:33

And also Bramshott to prove that women's lives are small and insignificant.

That we are alone all day and muse on irrelevant fluffiness with our little minds.

Nob and tosser.

TheDevilWearsPrimark Thu 19-Nov-09 10:25:02

Ah I linked to it on that thread and she's seen it.

Commented too but doubt it will be published!

I want that mug: Virtual Mother

"Hence the Tory leader’s second hour-long foray into the world of the cyber-mummy, which will last an hour."

err, yes
they tend to
What an arsehole!

AND pmsl @ mumsnet becoming more middle class
Mrs T clearly missed quite a lot on here by only dipping in and out...

ArizonaBarker Thu 19-Nov-09 10:31:48

Please come back, Mrs Tweedy!

Come and elevate us from this dull, vapid life.

What a pile of stinking whale flesh that article is.

WouldYouCouldYouWithaGoat Thu 19-Nov-09 10:32:10

who is he - was he married to jade?

I am interested in how Mumsnet can have copied Netmums when
(a) Mumsnet started a couple of months earlier
(b) Mumsnet has been aimed nationally right from the start, while Netmums started as a local site and then grew

but I've used up my comment on ranting about Neil Tweedie so I didn't get to say that.

Stretch Thu 19-Nov-09 10:32:46

Ha! Missed that bit CD!

TheDevilWearsPrimark Thu 19-Nov-09 10:34:06

Ha they've published her response.

Go Kewcumber!

Bramshott Thu 19-Nov-09 10:35:13

Ah yes, because I can only spout crap on a website for mummies, whereas Mr Tweedie can spout crap in a national newspaper and get paid for it angry!

TheCrackFox Thu 19-Nov-09 10:35:17

Maybe we could invite Mrs Tweedie on for a web-chat? She could wax lyrically about the good old days and generally raise our game.

Stretch Thu 19-Nov-09 10:38:05

Have they TDWP? I can't see it.

Where's Kewcumber's response? I can't see it.

TheDevilWearsPrimark Thu 19-Nov-09 10:40:50

Very droll Mr Tweedie but if you hadn't relied on lazy journalism and lifting selected quotes from a single Mumsnet thread to earn your living but read a bit more widely across the site, you would realsie that I'm the antithesis of "underemployed Kew wife" being none of those things (except the Kew connection).

I guess you have an issue with people being valued by how good they are at their jobs not by their qualification? Can't think why.


Susan Jones
on November 19, 2009
at 10:08 AM
Report this comment
Oh and please do check with Mumsnet that I really am Kewcumber. Or would a tad of research be too much trouble to you?

Katz Thu 19-Nov-09 10:42:34

i can only see 2 comments but i concur this guy really doesn't have a clue

Prof - i will post your points as my comment if you like,

TheDevilWearsPrimark Thu 19-Nov-09 10:42:56

oooh looks like the first part has been removed, wonder why?

I still only get COMMENTS: 2. Do you have your own personal online edition of the Telegraph?

Merrylegs Thu 19-Nov-09 10:43:37

But you see, Neil Twaddle or Weedie or whoever you are, we cannot clean. For we are far too busy writing 'journalists'' articles for them.

Us 'cyber-mums', we're a bloody godsend to lazy twats like you.

CMOTdibbler Thu 19-Nov-09 10:44:05

See, right now, I am doing proper physics. But by the miracle of t'interweb I can work and have the odd chat.
The kitchen floor isn't getting clean, but hey, I'm not a perfect woman

Stretch Thu 19-Nov-09 10:45:50

Is that her real name? Might have to delete that post?

Opened in a new browser and I get five comments now. But yes, all the relevant part of Kew's comments have been cut now. Very odd.

TheOldestCat Thu 19-Nov-09 10:49:02

Brilliant response from Kewcumber.

Wonder what websites Mr Tweedie visits while at work? Obviously, he only logs on to forums to discuss theoretical physics for a bit of light relief from the journalistic whirl of his highbrow life?

Must be hard writing an average of 1,142 words a week.

*gets back to working on something as serious as physics' is that ok Mr T?*

WineBeforePearls Thu 19-Nov-09 10:49:29

But it's safe on this thread <mwhahahaha>

ahundredtimes Thu 19-Nov-09 10:50:58

So do we think that the answer to the article's headline is:


It must be, otherwise why would he feel the need to belittle us?

I suppose if you're a political print journalist, the idea that someone else might set the agenda, or you might be by-passed by politicians seeking 'direct access' is a worry. Do you think that's it?

I reckon the unfortunate Mrs Tweedie has to spend a lot of her time bolstering the ego, and soothing his prickles don't you? Perhaps that's why she has less time for MN? Because there's his ego maintenance to see to, not to mention cleaning the house etc. She probably doesn't have time to work <neil tweedie emoticon>

Katz Thu 19-Nov-09 10:52:37

prof - have added your post above in comments under katz Twix - in response to Wayne kitcat!

If Mrs Tweedie wants there to be more threads giving advice I'd be happy to suggest exactly what she could do with a mango in the Tweedie household. Although it would be better with a pineapple...

ahundredtimes Thu 19-Nov-09 10:56:55
brimfull Thu 19-Nov-09 10:58:01

what a misogynistic wanker

TheOldestCat Thu 19-Nov-09 10:59:10
morningpaper Thu 19-Nov-09 10:59:23

poor mrs tweedie!

epithet Thu 19-Nov-09 11:01:40

Is a sneering tone compulsory for all these kinds of articles? There must be some rule: 'Make it absolutely clear at all times that you consider yourself SO MUCH better and cleverer than your subject matter. People will love you for it. Oh, they really will.'

Not so clever, Neil, imo.

Swedes2Turnips0 Thu 19-Nov-09 11:03:59

How depressing. What a strange article. Someone needs to write to him and tell him GB wasn't in fact asked the biscuit question.

<bores self>
<makes mug of tea in suburban kitchen>

ahundredtimes Thu 19-Nov-09 11:04:39

Ah yes, now it falls into place with the Ashes to Ashes article. The guy's a THROW BACK. How sweet.

That's why he spends his time in bed reading motorway service menus, dreaming of days gone by, disturbed by the modern world, startled by change, thinking of times when men were men and drove fast, and women were - erm, well, his mother.

Swedes2Turnips0 Thu 19-Nov-09 11:05:42

ahundredtimes grin

Merrylegs Thu 19-Nov-09 11:06:40

Arf. I reckon there is no 'Mrs Tweedie'.


whoisasking Thu 19-Nov-09 11:09:45


Bitter much Mr Tweedie? I wish I were Mrs Tweedie, the evening must just fly by

morningpaper Thu 19-Nov-09 11:10:30

I would love to know if Mr Tweedie does his own cleaning

And if he is 8 months pregnant and has a full time job

I suspect the answer is NOT to all three questions

SkipToMyLou Thu 19-Nov-09 11:13:42

Bugger, I just posted a sarky comment about editing Kew's comment and now it's been restored. Going to look stupid now sad.

MrsNeilTweedie Thu 19-Nov-09 11:13:57

I can't stop long. I have cleaning and ironing to do and must get Neil's hotpot on the slow cooker. I have to be very careful to serve his hotpot in the brown dish that belonged to his mother and leave the spoon just to the left of the dish, at a jaunty angle.

TheCrackFox Thu 19-Nov-09 11:17:01

Thank you Mrs Neil Tweedie for coming back to us. Mumsnet has really gone down the pan since you stopped dipping in. Perhaps when Mr Tweedie has his afternoon nap (IIRC he likes to snooze in the study with his favourite blanket that Mama knitted) you could come back and treat us to one of your infamous Einstein Bohr discussions? Assuming you have time.

whoisasking Thu 19-Nov-09 11:17:28

Oh dear MrsTweedie, you're going to be in TERRIBLE trouble when daddy gets home.

You're on a website that has an ovulation calandar. WORK OF THE DEVIL! Periods? DISGUSTING THINGS! Bloody WOMEN and their PUSHCHAIRS and spelling mistakes and LADIES THINGS.

You should be ashamed.

WineBeforePearls Thu 19-Nov-09 11:17:36

Don't worry Skip. We know The Truth wink

ahundredtimes Thu 19-Nov-09 11:20:32

LOL CF and Mrs Tweedie.

MmeLindt Thu 19-Nov-09 11:21:37

We really should invite The Tweedies in for a Web Chat.

I am sure they would enjoy it.

franke Thu 19-Nov-09 11:23:42

I've just read the comments at the bottom - I'm a little confused by Gareth - is he Neil Tweedie's alter ego? Is Neil Tweedie a nom de plume? <snort> It really is all rather snidey isn't it?

MrsNeilTweedie Thu 19-Nov-09 11:23:50

I haven't time to go the correct topic. But do any of you know how a wife might boost the self esteem of a husband with a teeensy, weeeeensy penis. For a friend. Obviously.

ahundredtimes Thu 19-Nov-09 11:24:47

grin at ovulation calendars being the work of the devil.

Well this has been most enjoyable. Sadly I now have to go to work clean my house.

Merrylegs Thu 19-Nov-09 11:26:25


(I wouldn't worry about the size, tbh - it's probably only 'dipped in and out')

TheCrackFox Thu 19-Nov-09 11:28:26

You would need to go to Relationships to advise your friend. However, I have heard that men lacking in the trouser department find that their self esteem goes through the roof if they have a wife who likes to do housework all day; ironing, toilet cleaning and dusting are all massive turn ons. If a cleaner was to enter the relationship it would make him feel less manly as it hints to the fact he is married to someone not entirely feminine.

TheOldestCat Thu 19-Nov-09 11:48:16

Highbrow journalism at its very best.

TheOldestCat Thu 19-Nov-09 11:51:09

Shall we set our mate Ali C on him? He only chatted to us mere mummies for an hour too.

cocolepew Thu 19-Nov-09 12:50:12

Oh they printed my comment. I'm so proud.

Do I get paid by the word?

Kewcumber Thu 19-Nov-09 12:53:53

Fame at last!

TheCrackFox Thu 19-Nov-09 12:55:53

Oi, shouldn't you be scrubbing a toilet or something equally worthwhile? wink


How incredibly mysogynistic.

Women are on the internet when they should be cleaning the house, appears to be its key message.

I know Westminster's a bit of a boy's club, but surely someone should have pointed out how this sounds?

Kewcumber Thu 19-Nov-09 14:18:11

sorry didn't respond earlier Crackfox - was hoovering the board room.

thumbwitch Thu 19-Nov-09 14:24:16

what a superly crap article. What an idiot. Although am still chuckling because I am picturing him and Mrs Tweedie as being them out of Chicken Run.

I can't believe someone thought netmums was a better site...

And is MN really only small bananas in comparison to it? Am shock at that.

Mind you, if we're all middle class yummy mummies from Barnes, that would make sense of course - there can't be that many women in Barnes. Or Kew.
<<am not even in UK, actually so definitely don't fall into that risible category>>

duchesse Thu 19-Nov-09 18:40:47

He's only jealous that the political leaders would rather talk to us than to him. And who wouldn't be interested interviewing someone with such well thought-out, cogently expressed opinions? Bet Mrs Tweedie (unless she is ex MrsTweedie) feels she got a real catch there...

I see Mr and Mrs Tweedie rather like Christine And Neil Hamilton...notice the same first name? Hmmmm.

I hope Neil will be coming on for a webchat soon. What a merry time we could have. I'd have to take a day off work though hmm

It would be worth it.

WilfSell Thu 19-Nov-09 19:23:23

Oooh another Neil Twattie thread. I'm determined to post on them all just so I can follow the outrage.

Fucking Einstein-Bohr discussions.

Come back with that complaint, Twattie, when YOU have a PhD...

WilfSell Thu 19-Nov-09 19:25:39


I hadn't seen this thread but posted exactly the same Money Shot of him on one of the other threads. Mmmm. grin

JackBauer Thu 19-Nov-09 20:02:07

There's no escape as th interweb eats itself!
I wasn't going to MN for a bit, was catching up on news, and then got linked o this thread.
What a prize, his mummy must be so proud.

Theochris Thu 19-Nov-09 20:18:51

I lurk mostly but the article motivated me to comment. What a patronising cock! TBH though it does make him look not just like a misogynist but an internet novice.

Einstein-Bohr ha because he is so high brow!

theyoungvisiter Thu 19-Nov-09 21:06:59

Only just seen this one! I was busy venting on the CM thread.

Here's a cut and paste for you Neil:

A mumsnet user described Mr Tweedie's article as "the most patronising, paternalistic, sexist pile of lazy stereotyped journalism I've read in a long time".

How about, next time you want to do a bit of lazy cut-and-pasting to fill out your word count you venture out beyond Chat and AIBU, and visit some of the OTHER areas of the board. You know. The ones that don't fit in with your lazy preconceptions of yummy mummies with poor spelling yammering while their husband toils in the city?

How about you look at Special Needs? Why not highlight their campaign to get an allowance of more than 4 nappies a day for a doubly incontinent child?

Or take a look at bereavement - at the women (and men) supporting each other through the loss of babies and children?

Or pregnancy, children's health, breast and bottle - at posters quietly dispensing excellent support and advice to struggling new parents unable to get what they need from professionals but finding it for free online?

But somehow I doubt you'd find quite so much to laugh at there - and it might stray perilously close to real journalism. hmm

theyoungvisiter Thu 19-Nov-09 21:15:05

[re-inserts sense of humour chip]


HerBeatitude Thu 19-Nov-09 21:17:14

Is anyone really surprised by the fact that someone in the Telegraph thinks women should be cleaning if in doubt?

theyoungvisiter Thu 19-Nov-09 21:20:44

I am surprised that they're apparently so contemptuous of yummy mummies in the home counties.

It's the Telegraph ffs, not the Socialist Worker.

GrendelsMum Thu 19-Nov-09 21:27:39

Yes, I agree with YoungVisiter - I would have thought that the Telegraph Online was all for yummy mummies in the home counties. Is the Telegraph Online actually read predominantly by mysoginist men? (This is intended as a genuine question, btw) I had imagined that it was intended for people like my in-laws, well-off retired people in the home counties, who are not noticeably outraged to have a daughter-in-law such as myself who is pretty universally competent round the house and also has a prestigious job.

WilfSell Thu 19-Nov-09 21:30:58

I think we need the Official MN Telegraph reader Moondog perspective on this issue.

I imagine she will take kindly to being characterised as a lazy stay-at-home, brainless fool who never gets anything done grin

WilfSell Thu 19-Nov-09 21:31:53

Not [as Dave would say]

HerBeatitude Thu 19-Nov-09 21:33:46


Yes they're quite keen on respectable mothers but old habits die v. hard. And they will always provide a haven for the harumphing loons.

Kew - bloody well done.

I was shock x 10000 at his comments, and so, so glad that you were able to deal with it.

<links arms in solidarity>

Bramshott Thu 19-Nov-09 21:37:28

Why has "mother" become such a term of contempt? I mean everyone has one, and many women (don't know the stats, but 2/3 perhaps?) become one so that's quite a sizeable chunk of the population. Even Thatcher was a mother FFS <<shudder>>.

Merrylegs Thu 19-Nov-09 21:49:14

Exactly, Bramshott!

The meeja seem to find it hilarious that politicians are courting MUMSnet. Remember Ian Hislop was sneery about it too on HIGNFY - and the audience tittered away.

If this site were called Parentsnet, or even Dadsnet, would it get so many laughs? No.

Because being a Mum is trivial and pointless. Obviously. hmm

theyoungvisiter Thu 19-Nov-09 22:18:32

It really is just a slightly dressed up version of "women, know your place".

Which, apparently, is pregnant, barefoot and chained to the kitchen sink, not fretting our silly little heads about [watch out - 3 syllable word coming up] POL-LY-TICS.

(Have I got the spelling right, girls?)

Come back Tim Dowling, all is forgiven - there is a new uber-twat of MN.

theyoungvisiter Thu 19-Nov-09 22:20:20

he he he can you imagine Thatcher on mumsnet? AIBU would be her heaven.

AIBU to want to crush those upstart miners?
AIBU to think that anyone on a bus over the age of 30 is a FAILURE?
AIBU to think that every Prime Minister needs a Willy?

WilfSell Thu 19-Nov-09 22:20:57

On one of the other Cameron threads, there's a link to Tim Dowling's write up of the webchat. Much more respectful actually...

theyoungvisiter Thu 19-Nov-09 22:25:50

actually I like Tim Dowling.

The man makes a living poking fun at himself, not others, which is a step up from most journos.

And he makes me larf, which is more important. smile

theyoungvisiter Thu 19-Nov-09 22:32:59

[slaps wrist] I must stop making rude generalisations about journalists - actually several friends are journos and I deeply respect the trade.

It's just so hard to take them seriously as a species when silly articles like this appear on a daily basis.

yangymac Fri 20-Nov-09 09:54:38

My alter-ego, Anniemac, was indeed posting from work!

I am fecked off with Tweedle (other than the fact that he is sooo off the mark on all his assumptions, almost choked on my coffee at the thought of Rhodri and his bonus having spent years as sole/main family breadwinner who is indeed working FT in the City and pregnant, thanks Lucy grin) as I was already within an inch of being outed in RL and being mentioned in the Telegraph was final straw for me so have had to ask for all posts to be pulled. Which is a hassle as MN is sort of like a virtual diary for me of things I have been doing over the last 6 years - now I am just going to have to try to remember them like a normal (ie, non MN) citizen would do. FECKER!

Down with Tweedle and his twaddle!

SkipToMyLou Fri 20-Nov-09 10:04:40

Is there no way Big Tech can just change the posting name on all your posts instead?

yangymac Fri 20-Nov-09 10:13:08

tis done and is fine. Today I start my new life as a citizen who has just discovered MN...

theyoungvisiter Fri 20-Nov-09 10:18:34

well yangy, let me get you up to speed.

The patron saint of MN is a lady called Gina Ford. You might like to buy all her books and then post a thread about how best to use controlled crying on your 5 week old.

We are all in favour of a good hearty spanking when children are being naughty, and agree that there's far too much fuss made about breastfeeding, which is a modern fad anyway. A spoonful of rusk in the bottle at 6 weeks is just the trick if you want your baby to sleep through.

I think that should get you started... oh, and if you have any sensitive issues you'd like to raise, the best place is a part of the board called AIBU? It's where we discuss high-level philosophical questions and particularly sensitive topics.

Have fun!

yangymac Fri 20-Nov-09 10:23:36

Cheers grin

ladylush Fri 20-Nov-09 10:32:54

Odd article. Gr8 response from Kewcumber. Mumsnet also featured in yesterday's Evening Standard - something about Gordon and Dave schmoozing cybermums.

WilfSell Fri 20-Nov-09 10:37:10

Welcome yangymac wink

You should sell your story to the Mirror though. You and Riven grin. Anonymously obv.

stuffitllllama Fri 20-Nov-09 10:44:40

oh yes, just read it, yes he is a twat

thanks for pointing it out

also probably a bit of a twat for reading this thread?


SausageRocket Fri 20-Nov-09 10:49:56

Ho ho ho

Tweedie must be ruing the day he thought taking lazy, ill-thought out potshots at MN would be an easy way to fill his word count for the week.

Not so witty now are we Mr T ?

LadyBlaBlah Fri 20-Nov-09 14:16:11


He clearly isn't getting any at home. <<not surprised emoticon>>

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