Burkini banned in France

[LifeIsGoodish]

Instead of teaching people to behave with respect to each other.

Burkini banned in France

[tryingtobestronger]

I think after all the things that's gone on there lately, they are desperate and don't know what to do.
I think it's understandable.

[aaahhhBump]

Bloody reactionary and pointless. Feeding right wing trolls. Dictating what women can wear in an effort to what exactly? Would they ban wearing a wet or dry suit which does the same thing in covering a body from neck to ankle?

[RepRoyalty]

They actually banned a burkini ? What harm does a swim suit do? It didn't cover anyone's face and loads of non Muslim people I know use it. I think this will just stop a lot of Muslim woman going to the beach, which is the opposite of what they should be doing.

[prh47bridge]

The thread header is a little misleading. The ban is in a small resort in Corsica with a population of around 750, not a ban across all of France.

I think the mayor of Sisco has got this wrong. Banning a particular garment is an odd way of upholding liberal values.

[LifeIsGoodish]

prh47, the article goes on to say that Cannes also imposed a ban on burkini last week, and that the Hollande govt backed it.

[8angle]

The point they are trying to make is that the people wearing the Burkini's are not doing it through their own free choice - they are being forced by their religious, patriarchal culture to dress like this.

This is obviously an incredibly complex issue for liberals - is it liberal to allow people to express their religion however they want or is it liberal to outlaw parts an archaic, misogynistic, sexist where women are forced to dress a certain way and forgo many freedoms. And this doesn't even include the extremism and terrorism aspect...

[BreakWindandFire]

I actually saw someone wearing one on a beach in the UK a couple of weeks ago. Hardly different from a wetsuit and swimming cap. You aren't going to 'liberate' women by forcing them to wear fewer clothes.

[Bobochic]

Burkinis are a bit of a tasteless eyesore on a beautiful Mediterranean beach. That's the main issue the French have with them, IMVHO..

[BreakWindandFire]

I've also swum in the sea in a Muslim-majority country and seen women with full abaya getting into the sea, with a bouyancy-jacket over their clothes. If they aren't going to swim unless covered up, I rather they did it safely.

[LynetteScavo]

This is typical of the French attitude towards Muslims and why a minority are getting very angry in France.

[cdtaylornats]

A friend of mine wears one, she is a committed Christian but with 8 operations for skin cancer in the last year isn't very trustful of sun block.

[8angle]

This is typical of the French attitude towards Muslims and why a minority are getting very angry in France.

WOW

[peargrapes]

Burkinis are fine (don't like the Burka at all). They are made of swim suit material and women should be able to choose what to wear for swimming. Wearing revealing bikinis is cultural and makes many women feel quite self-conscious.

I prefer burkinis to people swimming in trousers and long skirts, more hygienic this way. banning the burkini really will not address the issue of terrorism in France, it's so daft.

[Lottapianos]

'You aren't going to 'liberate' women by forcing them to wear fewer clothes.'

Quite right. This sounds absolutely insane to me. I would stand up for the right of any woman to wear a tiny little bikini or to go topless on a beach, and the same has to go for any woman who decides to cover right up on a beach.

[peargrapes]

I agree lotta and if the woman in the bikini or who is topless gets any hassle from men, the men should be dealt with swiftly. women should absolutely wear what they like. I really do not feel comfortable about seeing women in burkas hiding away their faces but Burkinis are no different to wet suits.

[MindSweeper]

I'm sure I read that this is an extension of French laws that state religious signs and symbols shouldn't be imposed on other people, and that they can regulate anything religious that impede on public order.

I'm not sure how extending that to someone wearing a Birkini but I think it helps explain it a bit more.

[LifeIsGoodish]

Banning burkinis will not liberate women. They will simply not go to the beach, whether by their choice or someone else's.

How about teaching Muslims that taking photos in public places is acceptable, and teaching non-Muslims that just because people choose to be different that does not make them a side-show?

Surely accepting women in burkinis makes it more likely that their daughters will be able to take the next step in integrating into their Western society.

[Lottapianos]

I get that Mind, but some women do wear burkinis for other reasons, like feeling self-conscious or for protection from the sun. I really can't ever imagine wearing one myself but I can't see what's so offensive that they need banning

[LifeIsGoodish]

French laws that state religious signs and symbols shouldn't be imposed on other people

Yeah, that's the get-out that 'legitimises' this ban. Not sure how seeing somebody dressed differently imposes on me, whereas I'm quite clear how somebody attacking me because they don't like my clothes imposes on me.

[FabFiveFreddie]

That's Nigella fucked then.

[Monochromecat]

You need to consider the context here. France is secular in many respects and does not allow religious symbols in schools or public sector offices etc. The idea is that religion should be a personal and private matter. It's a different approach to equality and diversity. Let's not think that the English or British approach is the only one or 'right' one...

[LifeIsGoodish]

No, the British approach is not necessarily the only right one. However, as a naturalised British Citizen from a minority religion, I'm glad my parents chose to settle in the UK!

[Monochromecat]

Well that's good.... And other people prefer the French approach. I can see the merits of both.

[Lottapianos]

'The idea is that religion should be a personal and private matter'

I'm very much in favour of this approach myself but I do not get what the burkini has to do with it. The burqa yes, but not the burkini. It seems to me that they've turned a non-issue into a political point

[Monochromecat]

I find it strange too, very odd. But I do think that taking it out of the wider context is not helpful and encourages very xenophobic Daily Mail style anti-French comments and discussion.