So...is today the first day of the end the NHS?

[Badders123]

Just heard on the news that the govt will force the new junior dr contacts through on August 1st.
Is this It?
Are we sat here witnessing the end of the NHS?
:(

[Thecatisatwat]

I think the end of the NHS began years ago. Last week my mum went to the doctors with an achy arm and was prescribed 100 paracetamol tablets (free because she's an OAP). I had a slight go at her for taking the prescription when she can buy them for pennies in the supermarket. Before Christmas a nurse prescribed antibiotics for my dad despite saying that what he had was probably viral and they wouldn't work. At least he actually turned them down.

I think a combination of patients taking the piss and HCPs wasting resources means that the NHS is sadly buggered. God knows what will replace it - hopefully something more like the French/German system than the American system.

[SmallGreenBouncyBall]

I hope so!
it's broken and needs major reform.
atm there is shit service, too long waiting times and dangerous 'care' in hospitals

[DangerMouth]

I think a re-jig of the NHS wouldn't be a bad thing. Care per postcode is such a hit and miss that it's unfair for us all to pay the same and only some of us getting the 'advantage' of the NHS.

[ItMustBeBedtimeSurely]

Agree, the NHS needs major reform. And we need to pay more. At the moment, it's good value for money but how many people really want a no frills health service? I don't.

[slicedfinger]

I just heard Hunt on the radio, pretending the naughty doctors were making him sad, and there was no alternative. He truly deserves his nickname.

[Pannn]

small - the govt had made it's plan to end the NHS prior to the 2010 election, by underfunding so people will think just like you and blame the NHS itself rather than the govt, who is stripping it for handing out to private investors. Anyone who thinks a privatised NHS will be 'better' is utterly delusional.

[Pannn]

Hunt is indeed an smarmy lying cunt. And that's what his dad says about him.

[SmallGreenBouncyBall]

not blaming nhs per-se
but if I have to go private for treatment for dc so that they don't end up disabled it's not fit for purpose.

[FellOutOfBedTwice]

I'm sad to hear this but not surprised. Fuck this government. I still can't believe they got a majority all this time later. Shame on you, Hunt.

[prh47bridge]

the govt had made it's plan to end the NHS prior to the 2010 election, by underfunding

Perhaps you would care to point us to the announcement. Spending on the NHS rose in real terms every year under the coalition. Under the Conservatives spending is now rising twice as fast in real terms. Spending did, of course, rise faster under Blair with most of the increase going to higher salaries for doctors and nurses.

[Chipstick10]

have no sympathy with junior doctors. They need to get real.

[Sidge]

The NHS does need reform but this really isn't the way to do it.

The NHS of the 21st century does not and cannot treat the population it serves with the funding it receives. It is a vastly different beast to the NHS set up in 1948, as is the population. If people want the NHS they want and deserve they're going to have to pay for it, but society nowadays wants everything for nothing and they want it immediately. It's not realistic and it's not sustainable. And it really doesn't help that politicians keep buggering about with it - Hunt is an absolute idiot and appears to have no understanding of healthcare. He doesn't seem to realise that health can't be run purely as a business model - people aren't products.

The Government have been systematically destroying the NHS from the inside out for years now, this is just another nail in the coffin IMO.

[RortyCrankle]

No, of course it isn't. The NHS needs major reform in a variety of ways - it's nonsense and simply not true IMO to keep saying this Government is trying to destroy it.

[ItsAllGoingToBeFine]

The NHS in England has been in a downward slide for ages. This is just another nail in the coffin.

[Chipstick10]

Andy Burnham was great when he was health sec right?

[BreakingDad77]

Its just sad as the NHS budget could be covered by actually claiming back the smallest estimates that they have on corporation and personal tax evasion/avoidance.

But sorting this out wont happen as the UK establishment is tied to the banking sector in much the same way as the oil industry to the US government.

[Thecatisatwat]

Yes Chipstick, according to www.telegraph.co.uk/news/nhs/11748960/The-PFI-hospitals-costing-NHS-2bn-every-year.html 9 out of 10 PFIs were set up under the Labour government. I voted for Labour in 1997 and by god did they screw up the NHS.

[Badders123]

Well the NHS you sneer at saved both my mothers life in December last year and my 38 year old bil a year ago - he had a massive stroke and then a brain bleed.
They have saved my children's lives and mine on numerous occasions.
Only when it is gone will we realise what we had.

[Badders123]

I have seen first hand how understaffed the wards are.
How Drs beg managers to open more operating theatres.
There is a dementia and obesity time bomb in this country and we are all assiduously avoiding thinking about it.
My bils health issues were totally lifestyle related (high stress job, overweight, high blood pressure....)
Wards are full of bed blocking elderly patients with nowhere to go.
Do we really think this won't happen to us when it's our turn?

[DinosaursRoar]

OP - the NHS won't go and then be replaced with no healthcare system at all - there's no NHS in France or Germany, yet they have a health care system, it's just not the same model as the NHS. It is unlikely the care that your mother and BIL recieved would not have happened if they had the same illness in France or Germany, it's just the way that care was funded and organised would be different.

"the NHS" might be on it's way out, but that doesn't mean "the end of health care in the UK". Let's not be hysterical - we are the only country with a NHS, we are not the only country with hospitals.

[Thecatisatwat]

I don't sneer at the NHS. 10 years ago it cured my mum's cancer, it is treating my FIL's terminal lung disease. In fact I agree, only when it's gone will people realise its value - as I said I think a lot of people take the piss when it comes to the NHS, not turning up for appointments, making unnecessary GP appointments, getting unnecessary prescriptions etc. I think we just disagree on some of the reasons that are leading to its demise.

[peggyundercrackers]

chipstick your right - labour privatised more of the NHS than any tory govt. past or present has but some people just cant see it.

[merrygoround51]

The National Health Service is not on the way out but how its funded is.

A government are either going to have to set a specific NHS tax or start charging per visit.

Alternatively they can let it go to the dogs and let the private sector thrive and those that can afford better healthcare will get it.

Ultimately the NHS model cannot cater for the UK's population so its a case of having to pay more

[Badders123]

I agree it needs reorganisation.
But this govt seem hell bent on destroying it and following an American type system....lots of lovely contracts for their rich chums.
In 1945 when the welfare state was formed people rarely lived past 70 and if they did they didn't have the complex medical needs of today's elderly population (dementia etc)
So we have an ageing population, obesity epidemic, more immigration so more pressure on hospitals and GPS, huge substance abuse problems, big increase in mental health issues....it's a mess.
Things that aneurin bevan could not possibly have foreseen.
What's the answer I wonder?
Something like the French system? (Which I don't really understand....)

[Badders123]

Dinosaurs...I know that.
It's what it will be replaced with that frightens me :(
Asking to see your credit card before you are treated?
Losing your home to pay for cancer treatment?
Dying because you can't afford care?
All this happens in the US everyday.
Terrifying.