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Awful stuff in Stockholm

27 replies
OP posts:
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SantanaBinLorry · 30/01/2016 19:58
OP posts:
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StealthPolarBear · 30/01/2016 19:59

Oh god that's awful. I hope they felt like big fucking men while they attacked children.

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StealthPolarBear · 30/01/2016 20:01

It's on the bbc but without the mention of children.

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PurportedFeminist · 30/01/2016 20:03

The age of a lot of the 'children' accepted by Sweden is disputed, I think.

But, yes, terrible.

I hope this back and forth of awfulness between the two thuggish extremes isn't want the future looks like.

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Holowiwi · 30/01/2016 20:39

Whether they were beating men or children is this acceptable in any way?

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dodgeballqueen · 30/01/2016 21:21

No. No it fucking isn't. No matter how many immigrants they've accepted (although I understand they're deporting half of them anyway).

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PurportedFeminist · 30/01/2016 21:52

I was just commenting on why BBC journalists might have left out the 'children' detail Holo. As I said; the events themselves are terrible.

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SoporificHobnob · 31/01/2016 09:08

I can't find any mention of it at all on the BBC now, it's all about Terry Wogan, Russia and Turkey and David Cameron.
It's awful, truly awful what happened in Stockholm. Governments want us to hate refugees don't they, they can use it to cover all kinds of things.

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TheNewStatesman · 31/01/2016 14:04

"back and forth of awfulness between the two thuggish extremes"

The pessimist in me is thinking "Welcome to the new normal."

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BungoWomble · 31/01/2016 15:34

Oh christ. The law and moderate voices need to get a grip now, or it'll all be lost.

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Veritat · 31/01/2016 15:44

Oh my God. That's terrifying. It's so close to a rerun of Germany in the 1930s.

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Veritat · 31/01/2016 15:47
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Veritat · 31/01/2016 15:47

Agh, wrong thread, sorry.

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OTheHugeManatee · 31/01/2016 16:02

It's nothing like Germany in the 1930s. Yes, it's pretty disturbing but facile and misleading comparisons just confuse the issue further.

In fact it's precisely the fear of seeing a rerun of Nazi Germany that has helped to bring about this situation in the first place, by leaving the Swedish authorities utterly unequipped to address any issues in the integration of the very large numbers of people from non-European cultures that they have invited to migrate to their nation.

Stockholm has a problem with North African street children around the central station. They gather in large groups, and target women for groping, assault and robbery. The Swedish police had more or less admitted they had lost control of the situation.

But Sweden's political elite is so in thrall to the fear of being seen as racist, inciting prejudice against migrants or in any other way violating the taboos of the New Left that they have been unable to do anything to address the problem.

As a result (and I am in no way excusing this) a growing proportion of Swedish society has been getting more and more frustrated. What you are seeing in this attack is ordinary people taking matters into their own hands, when they believe the authorities are unable or unwilling to help them. It is a profound breakdown in the social contract. But it has a background, and a context, and the Independent article is remarkably short on both, choosing instead of a clear-sighted analysis of what is happening to rehash exactly the same hand-wringing memes which have got Sweden into this mess in the first place.

What you are seeing here isn't a rerun of Nazi Germany. It's the first skirmishes in the oncoming civil war that I fear is now almost inevitable throughout Europe, thanks to the high-handed stupidity of European political elites and the incompetence of the EU.

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BungoWomble · 31/01/2016 16:07

Where do you get your info Manatee? You seem pretty clued up. I have a horrible feeling you're right about civil war, though I think it's going to be a mass law and order breakdown rather than a nice clean civil war (now there's a contradiction in terms).

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Orangeanddemons · 31/01/2016 16:12

Civil war?

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OTheHugeManatee · 31/01/2016 16:27

I guess mass breakdown of law and order is probably more likely than civil war as such. Though it doesn't take much imagination to picture a situation where a few migrants do something, the far right retaliates, some different migrants get angry and attack someone who isn't the far right, more people retaliate, and we end up with an all-out race war. I find the idea appalling but I can see how it could happen.

Bungo I follow far right and far left voices on social media, and read both as a gloss on the MSM. If the same facts turn up in the harrumphing right and the hand-wringing left you can probably assume they're mostly true Wink

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PurportedFeminist · 31/01/2016 16:33

It's not such a stretch.

We already have civil unrest in places, obviously.

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Orangeanddemons · 31/01/2016 17:20

But don't people always find the initial integration of different races difficult?

Brixton Riots or the Klu Klux Klan. I know they weren't necessarliy new integrations, but some people will always have a problem with the arrival of new and unknown people. Xenophobia I believe. However, it doesn't mean that it will dissolve into civil war. Some skirmishes and adjustment but not total war.

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PurportedFeminist · 31/01/2016 17:48

Well Brixton was more about the second gen community saying 'enough'.

KKK was complicated and came in three waves and none of them were taking issue with recent immigrants but with the descendants of slaves. (I think the technical term for that is 'colossal cheek from some deluded people'.)

So neither of those about recent immigrants or even first gen immigrants/slaves.

It's always hard to look into history and find a really good comparator for anything.

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Orangeanddemons · 31/01/2016 18:42

I know I know, I couldn't think of any suitable comparisons!

But, rather than a civil war, I think more of a period of readjustment.

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PurportedFeminist · 31/01/2016 18:45

Smile

I'm tempted by a thesis of 'people just love fighting' ATM, TBH.

It's probably pessimism talking.

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TheNewStatesman · 31/01/2016 23:37

"Bungo I follow far right and far left voices on social media, and read both as a gloss on the MSM. If the same facts turn up in the harrumphing right and the hand-wringing left you can probably assume they're mostly true"

yy to this.

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Orangeanddemons · 01/02/2016 07:48

Ha ha at thesis!😀
Isn't it actually men who enjoy fighting and wars? Women seem much less interested.

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januarybrown1998 · 01/02/2016 15:02

But don't people always find the initial integration of different races difficult

Well, it depends on the 'people.'

Sweden has had a very open immigration policy for over two decades.

The Swedes I know have been very welcoming and tolerant of other cultures, perhaps, you could argue, to the detriment of existing Swedish ways of life.

Some very draconian laws have come into place, which, while purporting to be for the good of the immigrant population, have alienated some Swedes and the feeling of resentment has been growing for some time now.

I talked to some Swedish friends at the weekend who are not at all surprised that the frustrations have taken a violent turn and they were astonished it took so long.

It's a terrible situation. But I don't think you can ascribe it to 'difficult initial integration of different races.'

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