do "we" have the right to say what benefit claimants spend the money on?

(329 Posts)
DizzyHoneyBee Tue 02-Oct-12 21:01:59

In the news today, a think tank suggests that many would support restrictions on what benefit claimants can spend the money on.

www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-19792066

What do you think?

usualsuspect3 Tue 02-Oct-12 22:57:38

I'm sure some posters will come along to tell us about the family up the road with 3 cars and 4 holidays a year who haven't worked for 20 years.

Leithlurker Tue 02-Oct-12 22:59:53

Sorry predictive text is such a pain

Tressy Tue 02-Oct-12 23:01:34

Not saying I agree with it, but that I've been told it happens in other countries. The models of which, the tories inspire to.

It does break my heart when I hear of children going hungry, in this day and age, in Britain when state benefits provide at least enough money to feed your family, tight but doable.

garlicbutty Tue 02-Oct-12 23:01:38

Marking place ... using the internet some over-privileged twerp probably thinks I shouldn't have.

Whitecherry Tue 02-Oct-12 23:02:27

Thing is, the system is set up so you don't have the option of not working... Unless

You are a:

Pensioner
Disabled
Lone parent with an under 5

Those are the groups not required to actively seek work

Is that ok with everyone?

Whitecherry Tue 02-Oct-12 23:02:43

Have I missed a group?

ParsingFancy Tue 02-Oct-12 23:06:27

Vouchers worked so badly last time they don't even do this to asylum seekers any more (except those who have failed in their asylum application and are being made deliberately almost destitute to persuade them to leave).

The vouchers could only be spent at participating supermarkets. So not on the bus fare to the supermarket, then, which might be in the next town. And not on laundrettes. Not on phone calls, or toilet roll from the corner shop.

And asylum seekers have no vote and are already treated as the lowest of the low. Things have to pretty bad to be considered not good enough for asylum seekers.

Besides, I'd specify your child benefit was paid in vouchers for organic veg. You might not like that.wink

tittytittyhanghang Tue 02-Oct-12 23:06:30

yes, those on jobseekers who usually (a) dont want to work and make this possible by (b) becoming completely unemployable. Thats not saying everyone on jobseekers is like this, far from it, but your bloody niave if you don't think they exist.

LineRunner Tue 02-Oct-12 23:07:00

I think that where there are systems of welfare vouchers, eg the USA, there are also black markets where they are sold on at a loss for cash. Often on a 'doorstep shark' basis.

Not helpful.

LadySybildeChocolate Tue 02-Oct-12 23:14:11

The Nazis spread their hatred by convincing normal people that the 'unwanted' are evil in some way, that they don't deserve to live the way they do. The 'unwanted' become ostracised as more and more people are brainwashed into thinking that they are scum. Their jobs, their way of supporting their families, are taken away or rationed, then they are moved into gheto's. Hatred is building all the time until, finally, no one bated an eyelid when those poor people were murdered. This Government have reduced benefits, causing hardship and stress for those who are already vulnerable. Now they want you to think that this is OK, that they can dictate to the poorer members of our society by telling them how to spend their benefits. You can judge a society on how it treats its most vulnerable. The UK is shit!

IneedAsockamnesty Tue 02-Oct-12 23:17:49

im wondering where and how they found the 2000 who took part in the survey.

its just a bad idea

LineRunner Tue 02-Oct-12 23:19:34

The best voucher invention ever was probably money.

Whitecherry Tue 02-Oct-12 23:22:46

titty so you are talking about a minority group there then? You know.... A few workshy wasters! Yet a voucher system needs to be brought in for everyone else because of the odd one or two??

Ha ha... Good luck with that

BertieBotts Tue 02-Oct-12 23:28:51

And what happens when you've spent your allocated money on your allocated food and you have a child or family member with an allergy, so they can't eat half of it. And you can't buy more, because you don't have any actual money, just the card. Best case scenario, everyone ends up with a skewed rather than balanced diet.

LOL at the idea of getting a diagnosis for an allergy just so you can get an exception on the card, BTW. They can't even sort out their disability criteria properly so good luck with that one.

Or let's say you have mental health problems (10% of adults suffer from depression) and on a down, struggling day it's all you can manage to open the freezer and chuck something in the microwave/oven for the kids. Which is fine, until it goes on for three days and all the food in the fridge goes out of date meaning your family can't eat until the next allocated food date comes in. I'm sure that makes you feel great and helps you see the bright side of life.

Plus all the excellent points made by others.

tittytittyhanghang Tue 02-Oct-12 23:32:37

Well perhaps a minority proportionally, but i dont think speaking in figures its just one or two people like this as many on mn would like to believe, but rather a figure that runs into thousands.

UdderlyBanal Tue 02-Oct-12 23:33:39

No, no, no. It is absolutely not the job of the state (or church, or whatever) to tell individuals how to live.

Not dissing the details above though ;).

LineRunner Tue 02-Oct-12 23:34:07

I can believe a couple of thousand out of 60 million. But I wouldn't to form policy on the basis of that.

LineRunner Tue 02-Oct-12 23:34:24

wouldn't want to

garlicbutty Tue 02-Oct-12 23:35:20

Umm, I smoke on benefits. Since that takes up too much money, I don't buy any other 'treats' like coffees out or going anywhere. Would this voucher scheme allow for any discretionary spending at all, or be exclusively redeemable at Tesco as Leith very astutely predicts?

I'm also not heating my home yet, despite being sedentary due to illness. It would be jolly interesting to see how official busybodies would like to apportion other people's spending without knowing anything about their lives ... apart from the fact that we're all workshy scroungers, obv.

tittytittyhanghang Tue 02-Oct-12 23:35:37

Actually if you had read what i had written, you would have seen that I don't actually agree with a vouchers system.

garlicbutty Tue 02-Oct-12 23:36:00

redeemable at Tesco - of which my nearest is 11 miles away.

tittytittyhanghang Tue 02-Oct-12 23:47:00

IS there 60 million on jobseekers allowance? I think 1.5 million is more the accurate figure. And i dont think there are any official statistics on how many of these people on jobseekers view it as a 'lifestyle choice' so to put it but personally i think between 5-10% of this figure is my guess.

CommunistMoon Wed 03-Oct-12 00:44:14

ah, a guess, always a good basis on which to form policy, as the Omnishambles clearly shows. No, there are approximately 60 million people in the UK, not 60 million on JSA. I think LineRunner might have been talking about, um, the nation ^as a whole - y'know? Rather than just focusing on people on benefits like they are some kind of sub-species?

Ah, forget it.

LadySybile, it is horrifying how true your post is.

Darkesteyeswithflecksofgold Wed 03-Oct-12 01:28:09

Ahh that well known Tory mouthpiece the BBC again.

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