PhD as a single parent? madness? is it possible?

[MiniTheMinx]

Hi,

I am thinking ahead, in two respects but both linked. I plan to do my PhD and have no reason to think that it won't happen however I am worried about how I will cope financially.

At the moment DP and I live together and we have two dc, aged 10 and 14. I am studying full time and DP works. However we have drifted along now for 9 years, with me unhappy and knowing that ultimately I would like out of the relationship. I have tried to talk to him but he refuses to leave, he thinks saying that he "will support me to continue studying" is the carrot. And up until this point it has worked, I am committed to my dream to the extent that it seems easier to tolerate the relationship, than lose security and the chance to study.

So, I guess my question is this, is it possible to do the PhD as a single parent, not so much in terms of time, but will I cope financially? I have never claimed benefits and have no idea how any of it works. I am 42, so I don't think I want to work for a few years, I need to get on with it now. I know that it's possible to claim benefits as a lone parent student at undergrad, but what happens with MA and PhD?

Thank you in advance

[AliceInSandwichLand]

Not sure how much I can help - I'm 50 and doing an MA at the moment with a view to doing a PhD afterwards, but I am not single and my children are adult/near adult, so not the same position with regard to living expenses. But I just wanted to say - what's the likelihood you will get funding for the Master's fees? Mine is self funded and would be 9K full time for one year. Master's funding seems to be like hen's teeth, and I think especially so for mature applicants. Depending on your field, is this likely to be a deal breaker in itself? Good luck...

[PiratePanda]

I would think given the age of your DCs that yes, it would be possible. I'm not sure though that you get benefits, and you might be better off doing it part time (which can be done over five years usually) and working part time.

That being said, if you want to do it with the ambition of becoming an academic, don't. Age discrimination is absolutely rife in academia and the job market fo recent PhDs in now so horrendously competitive (900 applications for some positions) that they don't need any excuses just to leave you off the short list. Do NOT do a PhD in your 40s with the aim of a career change. Not even if you are absolutely brilliant.

[IfNotNowThenWhen]

If you are good, with high grades, you should be able to access funding I think?
As far as I know lone parents are not supposed to claim benefits if they are doing an undergraduate degree.
If you get paid for a PhD, that might count as working, and you could possible claim tax credits, but check with them.
I disagree with pirate panda, not that age discrimination isn't rife, but it is,for women, in every area. Do what you want to do, be the best, go after it if you really want it.

[IfNotNowThenWhen]

And any level of degree funding is not related to age. It really does just depend on how good you are. It's a numbers game. you have to be in it to win it!

[PiratePanda]

No, funding for a PhD is not rationed by age. I was talking about the job market afterward. I have seen far too many people in their 40s stake their livelihoods on a PhD being a ticket to better things only to be horribly disappointed - and rendered unemployable - because they are competing with equally brilliant twenty-somethings in a very over saturated market.

I know whereof I speak.

[PiratePanda]

PS nothing to do with being female either - older male PhD students find the job market even more bleak.

[DoctorDoctor]

Have you discussed applying for postgraduate funding with anyone? Do you know exactly what you want to do the research on and at which institution? Is it local to you, if so?

[MiniTheMinx]

Alice I'm very likely to get funding for MA, but that will be just the fees covered. What MA are you doing? I am studying PPE and I am interested in economic anthropology.

Panda please don't say that! I just know it will be fine, don't ask why, I just think it will be. I shall do the PhD regardless because I want to.

IfNotNow thank you, I am achieving a first overall, and I hope to continue. The course structure means we are continually assessed so no room for bad days. I am enjoying it and I think I have probably found myself where I need to be.

Doctor Yes local, so living at home. I think I am going to have to get some advice, maybe the uni can help, so I am going to find out who I can speak to.

I know others who are doing undergrad as single parents and they are fine. However I am not certain that I shall get help with any benefits to top up income at MA level. I have looked at PhD and feel that I will be fine at that point, so I have cleared that up. Now I need to know whether I can claim housing benefit/tax credits at a reasonable amount whilst I do MA.

[AlbrechtDurer]

I second Panda's assessment of the job market in academia. Are you prepared to move around the country to take up posts (often one short-term contract after another)? That's the reality of the situation (if one is lucky enough to get shortlisted at all, that is). I know people that have had to up sticks every single year for eight years in a row. And they're the lucky ones. If an academic job is the goal for you, you should go into it with open eyes. But if you want to do the PhD out of personal interest, without needing to worry about employment, then go for it.

[OllyBJolly]

You'll have to work out what your outgoings are, what any child support you get for your children might look like, the possibility of spousal maintenance and what benefits there might be. I think you might find the gap between income and outgoings might just be too wide not to be earning.

I self funded two masters as a single parent but I worked full time. I was the same age as you are now.

My earning capacity has increased substantially because of the studying, but there is no way I could have not earned for any period of time. Is part time study/part time work a possibility?

[MiniTheMinx]

AlbrechtDurer thank you,

I have been asking around for lots of advice. I am fairly certain though that the school I am in have this almost paternalistic interest in those of us that are prepared to put the work in, have any natural talent and the skills required, they are "training academics" and the MA will probably be funded provided I stay on course. I am also looking at what I would like to research at PhD and considering whether the school I am in could make use of someone with my interests. I would definitely be offering something related but different. The degrees in this school are cross-disciplinary but resident "Marxicologists" have the greatest workload and tend to be older. The faculty isn't about to dump a major strand of social theory either! so wish me luck ;) I shall do it though regardless because I have always wanted to. Even if I never work at the end of it, I shall be bloody shit hot at philosophical inquiry and be able to argue black is white :)


OllyBJolly Wow, go you, I don't think I could manage to work part time unless it is related to what I am studying, I am not very practical person and I couldn't get back into what I was doing before. I won't rule it out but I am certain I would struggle juggling too many disparate things.

My outgoings are not huge and I am prepared to forgo luxeries. I have everything I need in terms of material things, and a lovely home that doesn't require major works or anything. The car is fine as long as it has five wheels and moves. The Dcs are happy and by the time I have finished, the eldest will be boarding for sixth form and the youngest could live with his father. He would be 16 ish and I feel that would be a good compromise.

DP would pay everything he could in maintenance, I know he would he is a good man, just not the one I love :(

The only missing piece of the puzzle is whether I would receive loan/grant/bursary for MA and what other help I can claim.

Thank you everyone for helping, this thread is keeping me focused and I am more sure now than I was two days ok.

[JanineStHubbins]

You should listen to PiratePanda. You sound a bit naive about post-PhD life, to be honest.

[JeanneTheRabidFeminist]

Are you saying you're hoping you can get a job in the same university where you're hoping to do the MA?

That's a very, very, very long shot unless its Oxbridge. Even then, have you looked at postdoc salaries and how do you feel about them? Especially if you got a career development loan for the MA (which is what a lot of people do - you don't get the same kind of student loan as you might get for undergrad).

You're realistically looking at a year on the MA, 3-4 years PhD, then a series of short term postdocs. Say maybe ten years before you got a permanent job, if you did?

[cauchy]

That's a very, very, very long shot unless its Oxbridge.

It's a very, very, very long shot when it's Oxbridge. Not only do you have to be the best of the best, to knock out all competition, but the department has to have a job available in your research area around the time you want it.

I think the OP is being pretty unrealistic about life in academia. Only a tiny fraction of top rate students, with top firsts from top universities, top theses from top groups, top publication records, can actually end up getting jobs. And all academic jobs are heading in the direction of a 100% teaching load, 100% research load and 50% admin load, i.e. a 250% load and unachievable targets for all three areas.

[JeanneTheRabidFeminist]

True.

I meant, if you had just finished an Oxbridge PhD, you might possibly get a postdoc there because they have JRFs come up every year, but almost anywhere else, there are so few of them. But yes, getting to that point would be hard anyway.

[MiniTheMinx]

I have no intention of going back to what I was doing, I have no intention either of taking a job to which I am not suited. I could go back to what I was doing but that is really just a compromise.

One thing is certain, I will not give up. If there are only 2 jobs in the area in which I am researching I want one of them, and will keep going until I get hired. So the question isn' will I do the PhD, the question is do I need to live with this man in order to be able to afford to do it? Now I have to look into the issue with being able to live whilst I undertake MA.

I might sound naive, it isn't that I am being naive, it's more that I will not be swayed.

Thank you JeanneTheRabidFeminist I shall look into development loans, are these for living expenses?

[MiniTheMinx]

oh and before we get into redbricks or any form of elitism, I have no interest in the colour of the brickwork ;)

[cauchy]

My Cambridge college has hundreds of very strong applications across many fields for each JRF it offers. It is far easier to get a "regular" postdoc in your own field than a JRF, even in the humanities where postdocs are scarce. Most of the people who were JRFs with me were professors by their mid 30s and are now winning international prizes in their late 30s.

And a JRF is only for a few years - you would still need a permanent position to become available and beat out all the competition for it.

[JeanneTheRabidFeminist]

You'd have to ask your bank. Not brushing you off, just I know different people who were able to get really different amounts.

I get the not being swayed thing, I really do. I can understand feeling it's something you definitely want to do. It's just worth knowing what the pitfalls might be, because it will make them easier to negotiate. And my point is that the financial uncertainty comes at both ends of this, not just at the MA stage but also post-PhD.

Quite often there are no jobs coming up. I've very often looked through listings and there's literally nothing I can apply for - and I was looking across the UK and into Europe. So then you think, what will I do for a year until another batch comes up?

Say you do leave this bloke, do the MA, do the PhD - after that, can you live off a non-stipendiary lectureship that pays you 3k per year? Or a junior research fellowship that pays you 14k? Or will you try to cobble together enough from ad hoc teaching - bearing in mind it's competitive to get teaching and they'll probably only pay you for hours of contact time, not prep?

[JeanneTheRabidFeminist]

cauch - all I am saying is that I have only ever heard of one person in recent years who managed to do MA/PhD/postdoc/lecturer in the same place, and who wasn't at Oxbridge. I am not saying Oxbridge is 'easy' or JRFs are easy to get (god knows, they've rejected me plenty enough ). I'm just saying, that is really the only situation where I do notice people who manage to stay in the same university.

I'm saying it to make the point that almost everyone in academia moves around a lot, and you'd have to be fantastically good and exceptionally lucky to stay in one place the way the OP hopes to do.

[titchy]

Are you really considering staying in your marriage just so that your poor dh will bankroll your delusional dreams? Shame on you if so...

[niceandwarm]

titchy I was thinking the same....

[JeanneTheRabidFeminist]

Yep.

[Namelesswonder]

There was something in the budget yesterday about allowing PhD students to take loans in the same way undergrads can. I'm not sure what it was as its not relevant to me - I'm a final year PhD, funded but poor with pretty minimal job prospects in academia!

[jillyjollyjojo]

Poor bloke, you considering if you need to use him to fund your studies.....

I am single parent doing MSc, for me there are no funding/benefits and you can't get the student loans you get as undergrad