Full-time hours in four days?

[Verso]

I'm due to go back to work in October, four days a week until Christmas, full-time next year. We could just about manage on me doing four days a week longer-term but as I'm the main earner it would be very very tight, so I'm investigating other ways of doing full-time hours.

From January, my work would let me do five days' worth of hours in four days if I want to (they suggested it in fact) but I'm not sure if this would work for me. Does anyone have experience of doing this?

The choice is: work five days and get home slightly earlier (around 6pm) every night, or work the four-day pattern and get home really late, but have a whole day to spend with DD once a week.

I'd be interested to hear anyone's experiences. Thanks!

[Verso]

P.S. DH isn't very keen on me doing the four-day pattern (either part-time or full-time hours with a day off). I think he's jealous that I would get DD to myself for a whole day!

[Fennel]

I have done it and friends do it. it does make for a very long working day which can be hard in terms of not seeing your DD much during those days - really it depends on how long your commute is and wht your DH's working hours are. do you have to do all your hours in the office? can you sometimes do a bit at home, cos that is one way of doing full time hours but not making those 4 days too long?

[hercules]

Personally I would go for 4 days. I went back to work fulltime at first, then 3 days and now 4 days. I really really appreciated having an extra day/s with dd and to do mundane things so my weekend was less rushing around.

[Verso]

My commute is quite long, but DH is a teacher so he would be home around 5:30ish. He would also be spending time with DD during holidays (I am assuming he's not going to leave her in nursery all the time!)

After I'd posted my original message, I realised that one of the four-day options is what I really want to do. I would also see DD every morning before work as DH leaves at 6:30am, and nursery doesn't start til 8am... but the evenings will be a bit rubbish, agreed. Hmm...

[Verso]

P.S. Working from home isn't an option, unfortunately, as my boss has a real thing about people needing to be in the office. (I tried to negotiate this for one of my staff but he wasn't having any of it.) Thing is, I'm a manager, so I daresay he has a point!

[Fennel]

maybe you could suggest taking work home a couple of evenings and do it after dd is in bed, just so you don't not see her at all for 4 evenings?

can you choose which day you have off? if you have Wednesday off, say, then 2 long days before and after might be easier to cope with than 4 long days?

[bootsmonkey]

Hi Verso, I work Mon-Fri 8.00 - 5.15 and it works very well for me, although I originally only had a 15min commute and now work from home/remotely. I am very lucky in that my boss is very family/work balance oriented and flexible with hours. So I may cut days short/ work extra as needed especially as I have overnight stays a couple of times a month.

I like the Mon-Thurs option as you get a long weekend, doing the washing/cleaning/drudge stuff on the Friday and still have a weekend to enjoy as a family. Don't whatever you do take Monday as your day off as you will lose out on Bank Holidays in the long run!

DD starts 5 sessions of pre-school next week and I am REALLY looking forward to 2 hours to myself to do whatever I want on Fridays, but I may re-jig my hours when she starts school proper to be home early afternoons. I realise I am lucky to have the flexibility to do this though.

I would definately go for full time hours in 4 days if you can, plus see if you can negotiate to be able to do a certain amount of paperwork at home to cut your late leaving time one or two days/week. It is a pain doing it in the evenings, but depends what works for you best??

Good luck in your decision!

[Yorkiegirl]

Message withdrawn

[Verso]

Thanks for your responses. Very helpful! I do have a long commute, which I need to factor into the equation, but on the whole from what you're all saying, the five days' hours in four looks like quite an attractive proposition!

[Verso]

Except... spoke to HR today and they were VERY negative about it "We need people to be present in the office" blah blah. Nothing set in stone of course until I go back, but it was made very clear this is unlikely to happen.

The irony of it is the lady I was speaking to is also a manager... and works 4 days a week - not even full-time hours - part-time!!

[Whizzz]

I tried to do somthing simil;ar a while back - work 5 days (ie full time hours) in 4.5 days. They agreed but changed the terms of my holidays such that it meant I took hours of holiday rather than days. Since my days were longer than 'nromal' full time workers, it meant that I actually had less days holiday than they did if i took individual days off rather than a whole week. Told them to stick it !

[mumtoone]

I went back to work full time for 5 months and then requested to go down to 4 days. I now work 34 hours a week rather than 37. I'm no worse off because I only pay for childcare on 4 days rather than 5. I am really glad I asked to go down to 4 days as I was feeling really guilty about the time I spent away from ds and I didn't feel like a proper mum. My dh was not keen on me going part time as I earn more income than he does so working 34 hours over 4 days was the best option.

[Verso]

I'm going to have to see how things go I think. I have at least got them to agree to me starting back at four days a week (my GP and postnatal counsellor - long story - think I should be doing less than that, but bills have to be paid!) The problem is that from January work want me back full time, and aren't prepared to compromise. I'll have to look into how to make a formal request for flexible working etc (luckily one of our departments is a team of employment law specialists ) and see how we go from there.

Have to say, I was and am exceedingly disappointed by the initial negative response. Have even been starting to wonder about going freelance, but I'm not sure my nerves could take it!

Thanks for the input, everyone.

[oooggs]

I was going to do it, but didn't cos changed job and department.

Anyway my point is that I was going to do Tues to Fri because my employer added the Monday Bank Holidays to my leave as I wasn't getting them as an extra day off. Therefore you still worked 4 days a week but had more leave.

Hope that makes sense

[PoopyNappy]

Hi Verso,

I had to try to hit a happy medium of time with DS and time at work.

I work full time in the City in a senior management role. Thankfully my manager at the time was very supportive and allowed me to go back full time but work from home 2 days a week.

So I only go in the office Tues Wed & Thur and Mon & Fri I work from home.
So DS only goes into Nursery 3 days but he loves it.

It's hard sometimes working from home and looking after DS however I've been doing it a year now and I have to have a very structured routine with DS.

Good luck
PN

[Dophus]

Hi verso,

how are you finding the four days a week. I returned to work (phased return) two weeks ago.

ALready though I am struggling to do my job in the four days and findign that my hours are creeping up to full time ones. I am also nowhere near to my full workload. However I really wantt o keep my day off with DS so hope to do the 5 in 4 as off Jan. I know that my company aren't keen on it though.

How are you enjoying beign abck at work?

[Verso]

I'm not back yet! I go back on 3 November. Popping in tomorrow though as they got wind of the fact I'm seeing a colleague for lunch and have asked me to go in earlier "for a meeting about salary etc". Hmm.

It also looks like I won't be allowed to do the five-days-in-four option, so from January I will be goin back full-time (and probably looking for another job, but that's a different story!).

Sounds like you are finding the four days a bit of a struggle? How is it to be back at work apart from that? How old is your little one?

[Corrin]

Hi
A friend at work does 5 days hours in 4 days, suits her. Work have been flexible around this. Think you have to be quite strict with yourself and employer though. She's a tough character and I don't think would be messed about. Think its possible but needs careful managing by you.

[beansprout]

Hi again (!) You are entitled to ask for family friendly hours and they have to give you a good business case for refusing your request. They do have to seriously consider it. I looked at a lot of stuff on the DTI website before I requested part time hours. It was v helpful and I always think it is good if you show them you have done your homework. Makes it harder for them to say "no".

[nonstarter]

If you only want to work the equivalent of 4 days but they insist that they need a presence in the office every day could you just start later each day, say 10.30am instead of 9.00. (The only problem being if your childcare is charged on a half day basis rather than on a 2 1/2 hour session or hourly charge)

It could make for reduced stress in the mornings and it works well for me as my ds is generally a little ray of sunshine in the mornings compared to the evenings and he goes off to nursery in a happy mood and I turn up at work feeling happy. It also means that if you are simply not there until 10.30 am you can not be expected to squeeze in a little extra like you could be pressured to do if you left early each day (how many times do we hear "could you just finish this before you go" leading to staying a little longer and then being all in a rush on the homeward journey.

If you leave work at the same time as the other staff in the evening they also consider you to be less of a "part-timer" which although no-one should discriminate between full and part-time staff, can be a bit of a mental block for some colleagues ("Oh she's only part-time anyway").

Probably not a solution for everyone but it works a treat for us at the moment and I was very stressed when I first started back on 4 full days but with Fridays off. It also makes for an equitable arrangement of bank holiday pay between you and your employer. Obviously it won't work once kids reach school age as we'll have to fit in with school start times.

IME once HR departments get involved all sense of fairplay goes out of the window regardless of what you and a line manager may have agreed as reasonable(but that's another story and I am now fortunate enough to work in a smaller business with no HR jobsworths to contend with)

[mommie]

i would go for the four days. I do a five day week but one day is from home. It is invaluable. DD has an eye infection, so could take her to the doctors today. I had a dental appt, so could go to that. We went to the municipal dump with our household rubbish, booked the car in for its MOT, dd now sleeping - and i did a couple of hours work. A day 'off' - or working from home (I am normally busier with work, honest) in the week is fantastic.

[Verso]

Hi again (lol) my employer specialises in HR issues and employment law, so I have taken advice from the union on this so I don't shoot myself in the foot when dealing with them.

The fact that another manager at the company works four days a week, and that I will be allowed to do four days a week until Christmas, doesn't affect the five-day-hours-in-four request, apparently. To do four days a week is a request for part-time working, whereas changing my pattern of hours becomes a request for flexible working and is subject to certain restrictions (only one request a year etc).

Also, one of the legitimate reasons for rejecting a flexible working request is worded quite vaguely... something about "operational reasons" (I would have to look it up), which basically allows an employer a way out if they really really want to say no.

[Verso]

P.S. My employer is quite small, so we don't really have an HR department as such, just an Administration Director (who deals with these things) and the Managing Director (who is my boss). Not sure why I felt the need to explain this, but there you go!

[clary]

hello again verso
I kind of do this. I basically don't work Fridays although I sometimes do a late shift. I do a logn day Mon and Wed and shorter days Tues and Thurs to fit round school pick-ups. I then either take some work home (i'm lucky that I can) or do the odd Sunday evening shift (a bit grim).
Basically my boss lets me work my 35 hrs however I want to which is great.
I make myself feel less guilty about it by recalling that pre-DS2 I worked 8am to 6pm every weekday and never took off any lieu time so I reckon they owe me a bit.
My life is certainyl complex but I love the fact that I haev Fridays off with ds2 (and dd until she started school this month) and that I can pick up from school some days as well.
I hate the fact that I have to do all my chores after 7.30pm but you'll get used to that!!

[Dophus]

Hi Verso,

My little one is 8 months. I have now been back at work for three weeks. I found the first two hard and missed him dreadfully. I also felt a little lost. MY job changed (promotion) just before I went on maternity leave and so I have lot of learning to do and a lot of challenges ahead. However I was deading coming back and had we been able to afford it jacked my job in. I am now quite glad to be back. It is nice to switch off from DS (does that make me a horrible Mum?!) and to think about something other than babies. It is nice to see friends and colleages who don't want to talk about teething and weaning.

I fidn the hardest thing is trying to do my job in a permanent state of sleep deprivation. DS still wakes at night. If this is any time after 4 (which it usually is) I find it hard to get back to sleep as I get up at 5.45.

Enjoy your last few weeks and don;t worry to much. If you enjoyed your job before you'll be glad to be back.