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Partial blood results for knackered Mum - thyroid...

(37 Posts)
knackeredoutmum Mon 14-Jan-13 19:20:54

Well, I have got partial results back and awaiting the rest later this week or next.

Vitamin D was 36 which is rather low as you already know

B12 was in normal range and quite a bit over threshhold

Ferritin still waiting

T3 & T4 still waiting

TSH - still waiting but a year ago was 4.8

antithyroid peroxidase antibodies - positive - result stated as 1 in 6400 but no range/threshhold or interpretation available until I get results from the rest of the thyroid screen

Anyone know how significant this figure is? What bis the range and what is a clinical level considered to be? I have no idea of the scale used but it is UK.

knackeredoutmum Mon 14-Jan-13 19:26:41

plus 1 in 6400 is an odd way of expressing this type of test I would think?

digerd Tue 15-Jan-13 17:34:34

I have never had such a thorough blood test for my Thyroid. GP just goes on the TSH value, and all my growing problems are put down to general ageing.
Will follow your thread with interest.

knackeredoutmum Tue 15-Jan-13 21:56:24

I have been feeling dreadful for about two years and its getting worse. My gp tested my thyroid TSH for another reason and although it was fairly high at 4.8 it was classified as "normal".

MN persuaded me to investigate further so I ordered private blood tests for a full thyroid screen.

Am still waiting for the rest of the results and a full gps interpretation. Sadly even if it shows conclusively that I have a thyroid issue, it doesnt mean my nhs trust will agree to medicate.

digerd Wed 16-Jan-13 16:00:51

Why not? They should.

knackeredoutmum Thu 17-Jan-13 18:48:23

apparently the UK has a rather high threshold before medication is automatic, below this you might have bad symptoms but it is entirely at the gps discretion whether they medicate or not

sipper Thu 17-Jan-13 22:19:55

If thyroid is under active Iodine is worth investigating. Have a google of iodine for thyroid and see what you can find. Also, you can do the barnes test (do it yourself using a thermometer) to see if thyroid under active. Look up Barnes Test for instructions.

Lonecatwithkitten Thu 17-Jan-13 22:57:33

Anti-thyroid antibodies can be present for a considerable length of time before you become hypothyroid. The 1 in levels are used for certain tests to express at what dilution the antibodies are found.

knackeredoutmum Fri 18-Jan-13 06:15:44

Thank you both for that, will look it up.

What do you mean by 'before you becomehypothyroid"

Also d you have any idea how significant 1:6400 is for peroxidase antibodies?

Lonecatwithkitten Fri 18-Jan-13 06:45:57

You only become hypothyroid when the antibodies have damaged the thyroid sufficiently it can take a considerable length of time for this damage to occur. So you become hypothyroid.
Dilution factor significance varies from test to test and lab to lab and can only be interpreted with an individual labs normal ranges. In fact each machine will have it's own normals.

knackeredoutmum Fri 18-Jan-13 08:07:38

what would you mean by hypothyroid though? A certain TSH level? Or displaying certain symptoms of a certain severity?

Lonecatwithkitten Fri 18-Jan-13 08:57:42

Hypothyroidism is diagnosed by a combination of factors if you have low T4 and antibodies, low T4 and high TSH and a variety of other combinations. There isn't a one number that fits all.

digerd Fri 18-Jan-13 13:07:03

My sister was diagnosed as Hypo Thyroidism - an underactive Thyroid which produces too little Thyroxine. She had no symptoms other than her periods stopped. They told her she was very underactive, but had none of the other symptoms.

susanalbumparty Fri 18-Jan-13 13:45:43

Where I live a TSH of 4.8 would be at the top of the normal reference range (0.5-5.5) and as I have had a my thyroid removed already my Endo would increase my levothyroxine to bring my TSH to the lower end of the range, below 2 is the goal.

I think it will depend on the normal reference range applied where you live plus the results of your FT3 and FT4 results. Depending on those you may be diagnosed hypothyroid or borderline/subclinical or even within the normal range.

Have a look at this link for info about results and referenc ranges:

Good luck with it.

susanalbumparty Fri 18-Jan-13 13:48:08

Sorry here is link again.

A TSH of 2 is the goal for most people diagnosed as hypothyroid. I must admit I feel 'normal' at around 2. I have felt OK at around 5 but not everybody does.

susanalbumparty Fri 18-Jan-13 14:17:29

Oops sorry. I just re-read and notice you are asking about TPO results. Sorry!

I can't remember what normal range is for TPO. If I remember I will post.

knackeredoutmum Sun 27-Jan-13 08:02:46

okay so full result set is:

tsh 4.52
total t4 - 74 (59-154)
free t3 3.6 (3.1-6.8)
free t4 12.8 (12-22)
microsomal/peroxidase antibodies - positive titre of 1:6400

Can anyone interpret these for me?
In summary, I feel rubbish, always tired, want to sleep in the afternoon, stiff on waking, very low immunity

The on line gp recommends annual monitoring of tsh levels hmm which I am pretty sure is a more agressive monitoring program than my own gp would be looking for hmmhmmhmm

AThingInYourLife Sun 27-Jan-13 08:14:04

They really are fuckers the way they refuse to treat women people with hypothyroid symptoms unless their TSH is really high.

I feel totally shite if my TSH goes higher than about 2.5

Your T4 levels are not looking great either.

You will probably need to be a total pain in the arse about this.

Go in to your GP with the printed list of symptoms with all the ones that apply to you ticked off and say you want a referral to an endo who will take your symptoms seriously.

Tell him that your exhaustion is affecting your ability to perform at work and that you are afraid of losing your job.

topsi Sun 27-Jan-13 08:50:42

I am no expert but the TSH is looking a bit high and the level of thyroid hormones on the low side, also presence of anti bodies.
Lik others have said Dr's in the UK love to look at their numbers and ranges and diagnosing on this basis.
The TSH level in this country is set so that your level needs to be over10 in some cases for the Dr to want to treat you.
As others have said write a list of symptoms and push for a trial of thyroxine.
If you don't get any where then seek a sympathetic Endo out either NHS or private.
I believe the best is Dr Skinner.
Look at the Thyroid UK web site and forum for further support

digerd Sun 27-Jan-13 09:01:12

My GP doesn't test T3, only TSH and T4. All my problems he attributes to ageing, arthritis and a heart valve problem. He keeps me on 50 mcg daily. Last year TSH was 4.8. I did try one day with 2 tablets but didn't notice any difference, but takes some time for the body to respond, I expect.
Having had a very bad overactive Thyroid decades ago, don't want it back as would be dangerous at my age. But might ask if I can up it to 75mcg as my brain seems to have become sluggish - again he will attribute that to ageing.

mercibucket Sun 27-Jan-13 09:40:16

In the us you would be treated but here you will have to either
Suffer until your tsh goes higher (don't do the test in spring, tsh is lower, and do it first thing in the morning)
See a private gp such as dr skinner
See a private naturopath
Buy your own medication over the internet
I'm not particularly recommending any course of action and I feel really sorry for you sad that you are in this situation. Ask on one of the thyroid boards if you want more info about options b, c or d, as there are people on there who have done those things. Obviously do the research first.

Your alternative is to tell your GP you are ttc, as it is recommended you have a tsh below 2 or 2.5 as miscarriage rates increase with a higher tsh, and it is harder to conceive.

I don't know about the antibodies test results, sorry.

topsi Mon 28-Jan-13 08:58:35

ThyroGold definately works and you can buy that over the internet, not that I can recommend self medication.

Fianccetto Mon 28-Jan-13 09:21:54

Did your doctor suggest a change of diet or make other suggestions? If you were prescribed medicine, your GP would need to know you are following a particular diet, to make sure you receive the correct dosage and type, so if the doc has suggested something and you've forgotten it, that might influence a decision to start you on medication before your results put you in a category of following a tried and tested course of action.

knackeredoutmum Mon 28-Jan-13 15:26:41

Well, what I have decided to do for now is see out the first 9 to 12 weeks with the vitamin D at 5000iu per day and then retest to see if levels are normal.

If they are normal and I still feel rubbish I think I will try the GP. I dont think I will get anywhere but am nervous about self medicating, especially with a dessicated thyroid product, and in any case I will need a vegetarian solution.

If anyone can suggest a tried and trusted vegetarian product than can provide real improvements with "subclinical" hypothyroid then I would love to know as there is no harm in trying.

mercibucket Mon 28-Jan-13 15:36:10

have you thought about celiac testing? apparently a cause of hypothyroidism in some people. gp might test

topsi Tue 29-Jan-13 09:04:47

nutri thyroid does not contain dessicated thyroid, not sure if it is vegetarian though

knackeredoutmum Tue 29-Jan-13 09:29:33

do you know if nutrithyroid is any good? what does it do?

NanTheWiser Tue 29-Jan-13 10:02:06

Nutri Thyroid does contain dessicated thyroid, topsi. I have a bottle in front of me, and these are the ingredients:

Dicalcium phosphate (bulking agent)
microcrystalline cellulose (humectant)
Thyroid Gland Concentrate
Silicon Dioxide (anti-caking agent)
Stearic acid (emulsifier)
Coating (polyvinyl alcohol, talc, polyethylene glycol, polysorbate)

I decided to try this, as I am convinced my thyroid is underactive, but blood results are "within range", so no treatment <sigh>, but haven't been on it long enough to know whether it's made any difference.

I'm not aware of any vegetarian OTC products that would help thyroid problems, but welcome any suggestions!

digerd Tue 29-Jan-13 11:24:39

There seems to be uncertainty still with Thyroid problems.
When I was Overactive, and developed a goitre, was told it could be a lack of Iodine. 10 years after having the sub-total op and not needing any medication- my german Doc said perhaps I should have iodine supplements, BUT it could make me Underactive. So decided not to take them.
12 years later - after yearly blood tests for Thyroid-my blood test came back slightly underactive.

borninastorm Tue 29-Jan-13 11:43:44

I've just had lots of blood tests due to low immunity and terrible exhaustion. I am already being treated with B12 injections every 8 weeks.

My results showed I am insulin resistant and my thyroid is low but not treatable yet (first time it was 6.2 month later it was 4.8 GP won't treat it til it's 10 ?!) but I've to keep an eye on it. My ferritin is also low.

So my question is have you considered insulin resistance as a cause for tiredness? It goes hand in hand with thyroid problems as they're both hormones.

Thyroid uk has lots of info on test results.

mercibucket Tue 29-Jan-13 12:02:28

borninastorm - why not change gp or take in that book 'understanding your thyroid' as it says its worth treating once tsh is over 'normal' which yours was/is

topsi Tue 29-Jan-13 18:49:24

sorry I think maybe I got confused. Nutri thyroid is supposed to be hormone free but Thyroid Gold states it contains thyroid hormones

borninastorm Tue 29-Jan-13 19:40:48

merci cos I feel much better now I'm on low gi to deal with the insulin resistance.

But If/when I get the same symptoms again I will definitely make sure my GP treats my thyroid, but I'm happy right now to deal with the insulin resistance first and take it from there.

knackeredoutmum Tue 29-Jan-13 20:03:42

well, interestingly my body has a huge problem with sugars in the diet, I always have but it has increased and reached ridiculous proportions maybe 6 months before I started to be so utterly tired with a permanent cold.

If I eat a normal diet then I will get the shakes, nausea, and starving stomach pains within 2 hours of eating (and within 30 minutes of waking up in the mornign if I dont have breakfast quickly enough). But I believe my blood sugars still test normal at that time.

If I strip out all the normal carbs, including complex carbs (but still eating veg and dairy and quiche for example but no cereal, rice, roast potatoes etc) then after about a week I can go 4 hours between meals.

The problem is it is so hard to stick to.

Is this what insulin resistance is?

sipper Wed 30-Jan-13 22:01:36

Hi knackeredoutmum Way back somewhere or other I asked how you were when you drank alcohol. At least I think I did! Maybe I imagined it!! But it probably got buried somewhere as there have been lots of useful posts and info. What I was wondering was whether you have a gut fermentation issue as that can make you feel totally wiped out, verging on the M.E. type unable to stand up kind of exhaustion.

knackeredoutmum Wed 30-Jan-13 22:11:07

sorry sipper, missed your q, I am teetotal so I have no idea

sipper Wed 30-Jan-13 23:29:01

Oh well, that means alcohol can't be our guide!! If you have yeasts in your gut and certain bacteria that also shouldn't be there then you can be fermenting your foods each time you eat or drink anything that feeds these baddies. That could be all sorts of sugars including starches that become sugars (such as from white potatoes). If this fermentation is going on you'll end up with alcohol in your bloodstream and you can feel wiped out, totally fatigued, absolutely wasted. A gut fermentation profile (a bloodtest carried out after a glucose load is ingested) shows in black & white whether this is happening. Could be something to look at. Especially as you have mentioned the sugar connection.

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