hello there.

i'm new to mumsnet, so having a look back at some older topics that catch my eye & read yours, about your ds. I have twin girls, nearly 4 months old, but i'm commenting more because i work with young people (usually 14yrs & up, but there's been some stuff in primary schools) in the area of gender & talking about its complexity.

in primary schools, it's worshops with whole classes about stereotypes and getting them to understand that gender is a spectrum, we can be girly boys etc, and that some people are assigned one gender at birth but choose to become another later.

and with older kids, they all feel they have a complex relationship to gender themselves and want to come & be with other young people. we usually do creative projects with them.

anyway, i wondered how your ds was doing and if things are ok for you!

Spidermama I can sort of relate.
I have a ds1 too who is 5, not into princess costumes but has started to say he is a girl or wants to be a girl, he is a very gentle character and out of the blue recently announced I will never marry a girl (usual for 5 yr old boys to dislike girls I know!) but he plans big time on marrying a boy (other boys laugh at this, but he lets it go over him, probably because he doesn't really understand, he said he'd marry me if he could he has some soft dolls that he adores and plays with in his bedroom and says he likes pink (though says he hates it around his friends)
I think it is a real shame that peer pressure/society curbs children's curiousity.
I am not sure what to think sometimes, for example a boy recently told him when two men marry you become 'agayed' and now he wants that as it is good.. I reply he has to wait until he is older before he can marry anyone! (as I don't want to plant negative ideas in him) He is the only lad in his dancing class after school and I admire him for not bottling out because of this.

As someone mentioned earlier, it is a shame that tomboys are accepted but when the other way around people raise eyebrows. I once worked with a 3 yr old who loved dresses, dolls etc, it really annoyed me because his dad was insistant he should not play with such things and turned a blind eye to the fact he could read like an 11yr old!! How sad was that? (btw, yes, we did argue with him that whilst at Nursery he was entitled to free play!!)

Hi, I'm new on here and just saw this thread. I thought I'd just add a few words as my brother in law was like this as a child. He always wanted to be Wonderwoman and then as a teenager wanted to be a nurse (when he thought they were all women!) He got teased a little, but not mercilessly, and when he went to Uni was often to be found wearing skirts and was never out without his eyeliner and nail polish. He's now 32 and a successful solicitor. He is a confident, effeminate, kind and caring chap, very very "British", who I believe has a tendency to wear his wife's pants to work underneath his 3 piece suit!!

Spider I think you should let him get on with it a certain amount as he seems to be comfortable himself with it and like anything different the more open he is the more people will eventually not even notice.Thank god he was sent to you and not some bigot who would have kept his feelings down only to explode in a loads of drugs and alcohol later(RObbie?)He sounds lovely

Spidermama, you sound like a fantastic mother. Many parents would be so embarrassed, but to let your ds be his own free person, regardless of who or what he is really makes me so proud of you (and I don't even know you).

It is very sad but true your ds will get teased at some point about this, but lets hope it won't change who he is and that he will mature into a strong, wonderful boy.

I have read a few posts on your ds flamboyancy and I really hope he doesn't stop on account of embarassment or other kids teasing him. I hope he enjoys his freedom of whoever he becomes. Carry on being the fabulous mummy you are and just go with whatever your lovely little ds feels like.

spider....want to pair them up - we could have an arranged civil partnership?! what proud MILs we will be!

Hi! Can't say anything better than some of the brilliant posts have already said, but just wanted to say your description of your dh has kept me smiling all day!

Your ds is very lucky to have such wonderful, supportive parents - what a lovely family to be part of!!

I suppose the obvious thing to say is that he is only 5 and it's still so young to know what his sexuality might be - or even if the girly/pink phase is going to last. And even if the girly stuff lasts, he still might be straight - look at Eddie Izzard!

Our ds1's favourite colour in the world was pink - up until about 6 months ago... (he's 5.3). For his 3rd birthday he had a Barbie party - Barbie cake, plates, cups, pink balloons etc. He had pink socks, vests, pyjamas, duvet set etc.etc.etc....!!

Now he denies it all, saying he was only joking - it's peer pressure, which is sad, but school's definitely making him a lot more boy-ish.

The message you're giving him is fantastic - that whatever he likes in terms of clothes, colours, and then in future whichever gender he might be attracted to is OK. That's the message we give both our ds's - we use examples of any type of combination when we're talking about stuff - although they both correct us and usually insist that there's a Mummy and a Daddy..! But as long as they know it's OK then we're happy.

Good luck and keep posting - I love the sound of your ds - and your dh too!!

I am Jaynerae. Thanks.

Spidermama, you are obviously a very caring loving mum. Continue to let your son be who he wants to be. He will no doubt experience teasing at some time, but then in all honesty who hasn't? and the reasons for teasing - well there's plenty of them! I was teased at school beacuse I was fat, my brother was teased because he wasn't very bright, my DS gets teased because he wears glasses and can't play football for very long because he gets out of breath (asthma). There will alsways be something the other little darlings will find to tease children about. The main point is the affect it has on DS. I boost my DS confidence in so many ways and he is very intelligent so I am able to explain to him that people who tease are just people who are so unsure of themselves and lack confidence in themselves that they try and turn the attention on others by making fun of them. I tell him not to react, just to say 'whatever' and walk away. However if any one hits you - hit back! He is 7 though so can understand this. Your DS is a little young for this.

There was a boy in my DS nursery who was exactly like your DS - he loved to dress up in his mom's nightdress and pretend to be a princess - she let him get on with it. You're DS seems to know his own mind - I think the fact that he has not let the teasing that has occured so far to bother him says he is a strong character and he will deal with it.

He can battle others easier than feelings inside himself. If he feels he wants to dress up as a princess it is easier to go ahead and do that than repress that urge. He will and can battle with teasing if he has to in order to continue to do what he wants to do.

Your DS is 5 - I don't know him - but lady - I admire him and you must be so proud of him.

Good luck.
With love
Jaynerae.

Awww SM you've made me feel all warm and fuzzy
What a fab mum you are.

FWIW, I have a distant cousin that was very much like your ds. I remember one particular xmas he really really wanted a certain barbie. Nothing else, just this Barbie. His dad was utterly mortified (stupid old farmer type, he's horrid) but his mum just went along with it.
Itw as great going to visit because he had things like Fashion Wheels and I have never seen as many doll and Barbie clothes in my life!

Anyway fast forward to now and hes studying fashion design and very very happy.