I was right the first time

(96 Posts)
FanjoForTheMammaries Wed 06-Mar-13 22:33:25

Yet another thread about not sitting your kids beside the children with SN in school.

I left after the panto thread and was much happier in general but missed a few people so came back.

Wrong decision.

Don't flame me..this is not attention seeking or wanting to be persuaded to stay. I won't. mN is not for me.

Just wanted to say bye to the nice folks, who will know who they are.

And explain why I'm off, in case anyone wonders later.

Adieu thanks

FanjoForTheMammaries Wed 06-Mar-13 22:42:03

This post says it all.

"How can it be 'hateful' for a parent to want their child moved away from another child that is disruptive? The child I asked my son to be moved well away from climbs on the table, regularly screams for no apparent reason and gets right up into the faces of other children and screatches. This is her SEN. But you would have to be insane to want your child to be sat anywhere near her."

ThePathanKhansAmnesiac Wed 06-Mar-13 22:45:45

I hid that one fanjo sad. Fucking depressing is all I can say.
There's still more non-cunts than cunts, don,t go.

That's vile! Sorry you feel you have to go.

BIWI Wed 06-Mar-13 22:47:56

Sorry, Fanjo, to see you go sad

foxache Wed 06-Mar-13 22:50:00

There's a lot of intolerance around in general, here and RL. I've learned loads from reading MN, about different types of people, dc and situations I've never experienced, because real people have posted an insightful point of view.

I'm sorry you've reached your limit with intolerant posts and am sad you're leaving - I hope you'll eventually reconsider.

dothraki Wed 06-Mar-13 22:57:51

Fanjo - that is dreadful, here have wine before you go. There are some people on here who are so selfish they simply do not know they are being rude. I know someone else on here who has just left fot the same reasons. Its awful for mums who really need support to get crappy shit.

Sunnywithshowers Wed 06-Mar-13 23:03:38

Sorry Fanjo. There are some cunts on here.

amillionyears Wed 06-Mar-13 23:09:33

After reading the AIBU thread today about a SN child, who's parent has trouble getting her to school on time every day,
YANBU.
It has been a real eye opener.

Also there was a subsequent thread[yes I know MN that it was a thread about a thread], but that one was an eye opener too.

It has transpiried that there are indeed posters who just read an OP. That is it. They have no interest whatsoever in reading an ops subsequent posts, let alone anyone elses.
To them MN is just entertainment.
I was going to ask them further questions, but MN deleted that thread.
And some of the posters on that thread have been on MN for a long time.

I have no idea why they act and behave the way that they do.
I was hoping to find out a bit more, and perhaps understand a bit more about their behaviour.

I assume their behaviour like that also spills into rl as well.

thanks

amillionyears Wed 06-Mar-13 23:11:47

I actually do wonder, whether further down the line, that people who behave well will no longer chat on the internet.

FanjoForTheMammaries Wed 06-Mar-13 23:38:01

Thanks, to you all, means a lot.

Take care

smile

FamiliesShareGerms Wed 06-Mar-13 23:44:59

amillionyears, I think there will be little ghettos of reasonableness on the Internet (there are plenty on MN but I'm not going to out them here!) where rational, non-bigoted people can hang out but the majority of interaction will be by those less, um, "balanced".

Best thing about anonymous Internet fora =being able to say things out loud that you would never dare say in real life

Worst thing = see above.

Fanjo, I'm really sorry to see you go. Maybe just give it a break and come back but ignore AIBU?

FanjoForTheMammaries Thu 07-Mar-13 00:08:41

Have tried that. Thanks for trying though.

Basically that thread makes me feel ill.

Don't need that.

Thanks lots though x

Sunnywithshowers Thu 07-Mar-13 00:08:48

Hope to see you again Fanjo x

I saw that thread and wanted to write something but the rational sometimes just gets lost in the noise. Which is why you should stay.

FanjoForTheMammaries Thu 07-Mar-13 00:23:55

If every decent person posted the vileness would be lost amongst the sense.

But no one does.

I just get flamed and hurt while everyone ignores it.

It's like the poem about not speaking up until they came for me when there was no one left to speak up.

MNSN posters have said people arguing gives them a bad name and they stay away, lovely women though they are. Their prerogative. I think they'd be quite relieved if I went though, which I have no hard feelings about but it hurts slightly.

I don't get support from MN, to be fair I don't seek it and usually post to chat or give advice to others. Or to try to defend what's right in my eyes.

So I pretty much gain just lots of tears when I read vile stuff about children like my DD, if I post here.

Would you stay?

Even starting to be embarrassed to post.

How bad is that?

Oh Fanjo I'm sorry you feel like that. I know if is incredibly tiring and horrible but one of the reasons MN is good is that the MNSN posters speak up and educate. I know there are people who have thought about their views and changed their minds after reading posts about children with SN.

You know what, even when the thread is long and horrible, in future I will post to support the OP if they are getting a kicking like that poor OP.

FanjoForTheMammaries Thu 07-Mar-13 00:35:47

It's the other thread about not sitting beside children with SN that really got me.

Anyway, sorry, can no longer educate at own expense.

FanjoForTheMammaries Thu 07-Mar-13 00:37:31

Especially not when that leads to me being shunned and ignored by many like I am some unstable weird person.

Not so rewarding.

FanjoForTheMammaries Thu 07-Mar-13 00:39:06

Anyway I'm gone. dD will be up any minute.

Take care thanks

ThatVikRinA22 Thu 07-Mar-13 00:41:33

fanjo - hide AIBU. just hide the whole fucking topic. dont educate at your own expense - just come here for light relief, chat and laughs. hide the shit.

and now i need to take own advice....
DS has AS.
and have you seen on me the police bashing threads? i may as well hit my head against a brick wall....i take things personally too.

but dont go eh? you probably do way more educating and good than you realise. dont let the bastards grind you down.
have a brew

hide AIBU

Can I just add SW threads as well? However, if it was about my DD rather than about me, I can only start to imagine how furious and impotent I would feel.

Take care Fanjo and Vicar for that matter. I like both of you on here.

FanjoForTheMammaries Thu 07-Mar-13 00:46:23

It's too late.

Am honestly embarrassed to post now.

The resolute ignoring while I get upset or flamed doesn't exactly make me feel like a welcome poster IYSWIM

Thanks though smile

ThatVikRinA22 Thu 07-Mar-13 01:19:17

oh fanjo - i didnt see you post but ive just posted. i havent been on here much today at all.

dont go over this eh? most people are decent. That majority just havent posted.

you know full well that kids with sen will always get these type of prejudices held against them - DS is 21 now. he hangs out with a russian student at uni....he accepts him as he is. they are like two little old men...they go for a pint and a pie at the pub at tea time and then go home....grin

our kids find their way. they negotiate through the idiots. its a skill we should learn! even on forums! smile

MissBlennerhassett Thu 07-Mar-13 01:20:44

What a shame that you've been made to feel so shitty. I'm afraid I'm quite the lurker normally but wanted to say I'm sad to see you go. I often wish i had your guts and that goes for you too Vicar and Mrs TP. Take care Fanjo thanks

akaemmafrost Thu 07-Mar-13 01:24:18

I wish you wouldn't go sad. If you do it's just one less voice to speak up for our kids.

amillionyears Thu 07-Mar-13 06:47:39

I dont or cant blame any parent of a SN child to hand around here.
There is only so much a person can take.

I dont mind ignorance of something ,so long as a person or parent is prepared to be educated.
So of them, unfortunately, have no intention of ever becoming educated about somethings.

Lostonthemoors Thu 07-Mar-13 06:52:32

Fanjo I also mostly lurk but I like reading your posts. Please don't go.

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

HecateWhoopass Thu 07-Mar-13 07:00:56

Haven't seen it. I would have had NO problem telling them exactly what I thought of them had I seen it.

It will be sad if you go. I wish you wouldn't let yourself be chased away, but I understand why you don't feel up to sharing space with arseholes.

but there are selfish people everywhere. We are never going to create a bubble where they don't exist. There are people everywhere who think everything from our children shouldn't cause them or theirs any inconvenience no matter how small to our children are a drain on society and should be killed. (and if anyone thinks that's an exaggeration I can only say -in the news - two cornish councilmen - to them!)

If you let such people be the ones who decide if you stay somewhere or leave somewhere or you are happy or you are sad - you are giving them far more power over you than they deserve.

GetOrf Thu 07-Mar-13 07:15:23

I wish you didn't feel that you had to go.

I think mumsnet are far better now and take a line that we are NOT here to educated thick and offensive twats re SN.

There was a thread a few weeks ago - some shoocking crap posted. I reported the post amongst others and the thread was deleted. Some people said that the thread should have stayed and that it made people see how horrible some people's opinions were, but mnhq came on and said they took a line that they didn't think people should educate others at all and we should report and they would delete disablist stuff.

There are hideous people esp on aibu, but I still think they are outnumbered on here by the kind and wise. The thread about the woman with a dd with HFA and wanting the teachers to wait - yes very harsh and spiteful comments but also a LOT of kindness and advice.

I'm sorry though fanjo that you are hurt. I don't blame you at all for wanting to leave. I hope you do vcome back though, you will be missed.

SilentSplendidSun Thu 07-Mar-13 07:16:01

Fanjo, there will always be ignorant twats around who won't know the truth, if it "screeched in their faces". Idiots.

But you delude yourself if you expect other people to support you. Or stick up for you. This is not RL. Stay for your convictions. Or stay away if it is getting hostile. But don't go because you think no one is supporting you. It doesnt work that way

greenhill Thu 07-Mar-13 07:16:17

What a shame that a load of long standing posters are being driven away by trolls / goady f'ers and people who are just looking to be as obnoxious as possible.

None of these people have any interest in the supportive, informative and funny threads that are the mainstay of MN.

It must be very hard to put so much of your emotional energy into fighting the artificially created battles about SN in AIBU fanjo, I hope you feel better soon and feel able to come back.

amillionyears Thu 07-Mar-13 07:22:38

The trouble is that even if there are lots and lots of posters to help a SN parent, if there are say 6 or 12 others, the whole thing must end up being very hurtful [I speak as a parent who does not have a child with SN]

HotPinkWeaselWearingLederhosen Thu 07-Mar-13 07:31:26

Fanjo sad, haven't seen the thread. I'm so sorry you're going, and wish you weren't. But you have to protect yourself this crap as best you can x

FanjoForTheMammaries Thu 07-Mar-13 07:58:27

Thanks for the lovely posts.

Am mortified as I obviously had an excessively emotional moment last night (no wine had even been taken)

Feel a bit of an arse now.

But clearly I am not robust enough for MN at the moment..noone's fault really. Although certain posters don't exactly help.

Maybe one day I will be tough enough to rise above disablist posts.

Have just not reached that day yet. So best I back off.

blush

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

FanjoForTheMammaries Thu 07-Mar-13 08:01:41

grinblush

FanjoForTheMammaries Thu 07-Mar-13 08:03:47

Feels like the day after when I drank too much at Xmas party and cried on colleagues after DD regressed.

And without even drinking last night <crawls in hole>

MrsWolowitz Thu 07-Mar-13 08:06:54

So sorry you feel that way Fanjo.

There are some horrible people on AIBU. Sorry they hurt you sad

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

NoTimeForS Thu 07-Mar-13 08:38:05

The internet is a reflection of the real world. There are always going to be some giant fools.
But nice people too.

Sometimes the nice people make it worthwhile and everything seems easier, and sometimes the idiots seem too prolific and you want to hide away for a while to forget they all exist.

And if you feel that way, take the break and come back when you are in a different frame of mind. That is what I reckon.
You have to protect yourself from hurt but I think there are enough nice people to... make it worth not withdrawing forever. I hope so anyway.

Lostonthemoors Thu 07-Mar-13 09:18:09

I think the threads where people show their ignorance about SN are so annoying (just for the record my dc is NT AFAIK).

Don't feel guilty for feeling the way you did, it is upsetting and people should be challenged. I didn't read the thread but the poster who wrote that comment should be ashamed of themselves. It's disgusting.

But please don't go. You can't let the fuckers win. sad

FanjoForTheMammaries Thu 07-Mar-13 12:36:26

Have tried the break thing.

I think its best if I go.

Especially since MNHQ completely ignored the disablism in that thread and just deleted it because it was "identifying".

I originally came back because I thought they had toughened up on disablist posts but it seems not. So the place is not going to become a more SN friendly place any time soon.

Too much on plate IRL to deal with being upset on here. Just had a complaint from neighbour about DD disturbing them at night..we are at end of tether already trying to get her to sleep.

Feel in a bit of a precarious state just now.

Thanks for all your support
x

Sunnywithshowers Thu 07-Mar-13 13:05:33

Big hugs Fanjo xxx

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

FanjoForTheMammaries Thu 07-Mar-13 14:54:42

oh yes...i give you this post to explain why:

whogiveatoss Thu 07-Mar-13 14:48:13
clay that is bullshit. The only debilitating thing is the attude of some of the sen parents.
As a society we need to do our best for equality. some parents scream and shout about there child getting equal treatment and rightly so but then use the excuse 'but there sn and need special treatment.''

Stop blaming your own inadequacies on your child's sn.

I'll wait for the shout of cunt and such that this little gang is so fond of.

Jux Thu 07-Mar-13 15:07:27

Understand why, but sad you're going. I hope you come back some time, maybe when we're all very old women.....

Those threads were vile. Sometimes, you see a title in Active and know you have to say something because you know there are a lot of twats about these days.

Still hoping for a tolerant society.wine

Have a good life.

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

Lostonthemoors Thu 07-Mar-13 16:29:52

Awful angry

HecateWhoopass Thu 07-Mar-13 16:55:34

All that poster has shown is that they have no understanding whatsoever of equal opportunities and they think it is about giving people the same stuff/input.

It's not. It's about equality of outcome.

It is staggering the number of people who are unable to understand it. It's not a difficult concept hmm

I saw a brilliant cartoon. I wish I could find it. It showed 3 people looking over a fence. The fence was high and they were each given a box of exactly the same dimensions.

But they were massively different in height. Giving them all the same sized box meant one of them was able to lean on the fence and see comfortably. One of them could see over by standing on their tiptoes and the third was on the box but couldn't see over the fence. They were just staring at the wood.

Now, these 'treat them all the same' idiots would be the ones saying 'they were given the exact same box as everyone else, it was equal, what more do you want?'

They'll never get it no matter how many times you explain or how many ways you explain. To them, equal means putting in the exact same.

It doesn't. Not when you are talking about equality of outcome.

HelpOneAnother Thu 07-Mar-13 17:22:10

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

BrokenBritain Thu 07-Mar-13 18:18:08

I know you don't know me but I'll miss you! Well that might sound a bit intense, but I will miss your posts. You are articulate and you make very good points. I really hope you change your mind but if not I wish you lots of happiness.

lemonmuffin Thu 07-Mar-13 18:41:59

I don't get it, Im sorry.

In your second post on this thread, I would feel the same as that poster if that was my child.

Is that really so terrible?

akaemmafrost Thu 07-Mar-13 18:44:27

<<abandons all hope>>

FanjoForTheMammaries Thu 07-Mar-13 18:49:16

no, it's fine and dandy hmm (couldn't resist a last arsey post)

Yes Lemon, it really is.

FanjoForTheMammaries Thu 07-Mar-13 18:50:47

See ..there are posters here who post really insensitive posts about SN.

It's just their lack of intelligence.

But I'd rather pull my own toenails out with pliers than read any more of their shite.

FanjoForTheMammaries Thu 07-Mar-13 18:51:09

is that really so terrible? winkgrin

You should pull their tonails out instead. Much more cathartic wink

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

LadyIsabellaWrotham Thu 07-Mar-13 19:03:02

Oh fanjo, goodbye if it is goodbye, or preferably au revoir. Either way I wish you well thanks.

lemon are you taking the piss?

You must be, surely. Because you have just read through an entire thread, by a poster who is very upset at the insensitive comments directed at SN children. You have read how upsetting it is for a lot of people. People who battle every single day against attitudes like fanjo illustrated and worse.

And then you post that you agree with that comment?

I have had my eyes opened over the past few days.
I was not aware that there were that many people who lack empathy, consideration, decency. And that these people feel the need to direct insensitive, and frankly nasty comments towards SN children and their parents.

I find it upsetting to be honest and my DCs, AFAIK are NT.
I can only imagine the pain this causes to the parents of SN children.

Whyriskit Thu 07-Mar-13 19:13:14

Fanjo, you don't know me, but MN will be a poorer place without you. Those of us who just lurk and think FFS when ignorant disabilist tripe is spouted do need to take a stand or the tossers will think they're right.

lemonmuffin Thu 07-Mar-13 19:19:01

I don't want to upset anyone and I appreciate that flouncers corner is probably not the best place to discuss this type of subject.

I just said that if my child (year 3, age 8) came home and described the scenario that Fanjo mentioned then I would be concerned. And would probably speak to the teacher.

Beatrix - yes I agree, how do you propose that would happen?

Sorry to hear you're going Fanjo.
That vile post you quoted from the 'being late' thread has been deleted, I reported it. I didn't see the other thread you mentioned.
Don't let the bastards get you down!

FanjoForTheMammaries Thu 07-Mar-13 19:27:08

I assume it was deleted as disablist.

Yet lemon is on here defending it. <despairs>

FanjoForTheMammaries Thu 07-Mar-13 19:27:50

Oh no..that was the other post. Both were disablist though.

lemonmuffin Thu 07-Mar-13 19:30:27

I'm not defending it <gives up>

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

FanjoForTheMammaries Thu 07-Mar-13 19:37:11

My DD is gentle. She is at special school. She has to sit beside children who hit. I don't demand she is moved and she has never been hit.

But not resuming this discussion. Going out for dinner with DH

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

PeneloPeePitstop Thu 07-Mar-13 19:47:10

Message deleted by Mumsnet for breaking our Talk Guidelines. Replies may also be deleted.

Fanjo I don't post much, but just wanted to say I'll miss your posts.

And I totally agree, there is some hideous anti-SN shit on here.

FanjoForTheMammaries Thu 07-Mar-13 21:36:05

Have to say..the reason why I am nit totally gone is the good guys are doing a totally sterling job on the late child thread. Very heartening. And you lot of course.

And this elastic on my leg wink

dothraki Thu 07-Mar-13 22:11:33

Fanjo - I hope you stay. Hecate - excellent post. I try to avoid reading some of those threads - but honestly - we should be challenging them - or at least reporting them. Whatever you decide good luck & watch that bloody elastic on your leg grin

RubyrooUK Thu 07-Mar-13 22:29:54

Sorry you're off Fanjo. I didn't see either of the threads you mention but I'm sad they made you feel so shit that you're off.

Because actually I've found some lovely supportive people posting on MN in my time here. And I like to think the kind of cocks who post horrible things about people with SN are the kind of people I'd hate in real life anyway, so I generally just feel sorry for them that they're so consumed with being small minded and prejudiced.

So it's a shame to see someone with sense leave rather than an idiot.
On the other hand, I've heard Mumsnet is non-compulsory so obviously you don't have to hang around.

Good luck. X

lougle Fri 08-Mar-13 00:01:02

Message deleted by Mumsnet for breaking our Talk Guidelines. Replies may also be deleted.

Maryz Fri 08-Mar-13 00:03:56

You won't go.

You can't go.

Things are improving. They might be slow but they are. The first bus pram/wheelchair I ever posted on had about half and half pram and wheelchair supporters. The last one only had two people determined that pram users had as much right to be there as the wheelchair.

It is changing. Slowly, but it is. And if everyone goes who is prepared to stand up it will be slower.

So hop off this thread, and go back to being arsy grin

FanjoForTheMammaries Fri 08-Mar-13 00:18:11

Lougle...someone said it yesterday on the general thread about issues with MNSN. (plentyofsomething? said people argue with AIBU posters and give MNSN a bad name, then whinge about it and flounce, so she ignores them). And others said it after the panto thread. I'm sorry, I didn't word it very well, I didn't mean to lump you all together n a homogenous mass and imply all posters on MNSN thought that..but it was hard to read and did seem to fit me.

I didn't see any dissenting voices, so being sensitive sort that I am I assumed people were in agreement, so I felt unwelcome. I didn't mean you though, definitely smile

Mary..how dare you call me arsey <squares up> winkgrin

FanjoForTheMammaries Fri 08-Mar-13 00:23:39

I went back to quote the post but it was deleted (it formed part of the controversial post about PDA). A few people said after panto thread that people getting too heated was giving MNSN posters a bad name too.

I was heated on that thread (not swearing or personally attacking but upset) so felt a bit paranoid about that post.

That is what I meant. You and others have made me welcome before though so I am sorry I didn't word my post more clearly last night, I was extremely upset in general.

coff33pot Fri 08-Mar-13 00:26:07

dont go smile

I know its horrid and that post quote made horrid reading but all you can do is put your feelings accross and hope that it may hit a nerve of someone less ignorant

I dont go "out there" for this reason to much vile reading sometimes for someone to take in x

FanjoForTheMammaries Fri 08-Mar-13 00:27:56

Thanks, means a lot. I am certainly not feeling like going out there either!

Reading vile post after vile post is like getting a kicking sometimes

zzzzz Fri 08-Mar-13 00:32:56

I'd be sorry to see you go.

I found that thread hard too.

Children with sn are part of mainstream, not additional to. Comprehensive schools were built for all.

TheNebulousBoojum Fri 08-Mar-13 00:39:25

'people argue with AIBU posters and give MNSN a bad name'

That's always been a way that people have tried to shut down debate, and protest though. By telling those objecting that they are being rude or nasty or unladylike or upsetting applecarts.
I've upset a lot of applecarts in my time, and protested, from environmental issues, anti-apartheid to feminist to racism in schools to SN.
And every time we filled up trollies of SA goods and abandoned them in supermarkets, or nagged about multinationals and their policies, people always said that we were being stroppy and difficult and it was all so uncomfortable,
Bloody right, and I'm not going to stop being a PITA about issues I feel strongly about. grin
Even if it causes hoiking of bosoms and the need for smelling salts.

Maryz Fri 08-Mar-13 01:06:11

I posted this on the other thread.

"There can be some pretty awful stuff posted elsewhere on the board. If I'm feeling strong, I challenge it, if I'm feeling a bit down, I ignore and hide."

So it's ok to not react sometimes. You can't change the opinion of every poster on every thread. You (as in the general you, or we, or one) can only do as much as you can cope with. When I'm not coping well, those threads are lethal to my self-respect and my confidence, so it's counter-productive for me to even post on them.

If every one of those threads changes just one person's mind, then great. But it isn't a battle any one of us should even try to win on our own. Especially if it is upsetting you.

Attitudes to a lot of things are changing though, by the odd person sticking their head over the parapet. For example, a couple of years ago, had somone posted "my teenager is smoking dope and skipping school" every single poster on the board would have said "well, why don't you stop him, I wouldn't put up with it, it's all the parents' fault". That is changing, slowly, too.

Part of it is that there are more parents of children with SN (and teenagers) on here. Part of it is that society as a whole is changing very, very slowly.

But flouncing isn't the answer. That's cutting off your nose to spite your face. Just hide and do a bit of arsing around elsewhere on the board.

lougle Fri 08-Mar-13 06:29:00

Oh I see. Well I'm not that fussed about MNSN having a bad name if our children live in a better world as a result. Just as I assume Rosa Parks didn't much care about having a bad name when she refused to get off that bus.

SolomanDaisy Fri 08-Mar-13 08:14:06

The people saying they wouldn't want their child sitting next to a child with SN also seemed to object to ESOL children etc. i.e. anyone different. They = twats.

FanjoForTheMammaries Fri 08-Mar-13 08:26:47

"You = a twat " is a great put down!

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

FanjoForTheMammaries Fri 08-Mar-13 10:04:53

Cuntulus

HumphreyCobbler Fri 08-Mar-13 10:12:43

I generally just hide the thread when people are that shitty Fanjo but you have made me resolve to go in any say something now.

Noodled Fri 08-Mar-13 10:22:30

I didnt look, couldnt face it. However don't go over this. Most of us care, some are twats with no empathy but not most. You contribute to a positive shift in opinion.

giraffesCantDateDucks Fri 08-Mar-13 10:56:45

Didn't see the thread, is it deleted now? Will miss you take care

dothraki Fri 08-Mar-13 22:55:19

FANJO - go and see Pags lovely thread in chat. It will make you cry - because it is so luverly smile

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