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So desperate

(729 Posts)
GracieLoo Fri 03-May-13 23:54:14

I wouldn't be posting this if I didn't care or wasn't scared but I am, and i don't know whats happening to me. I've started taking an od and I can't stop taking them, I don't care anymore, i'm tired of this, disappointing people and letting them down.

Ariel21 Fri 03-May-13 23:57:51

Hi GracieLoo. It's clear that as you are posting, you don't want to disappear completely. Which is good - we don't want you to either. Hang on in there - is there anyone with you? Anyone you can call?

Elderflowergranita Sat 04-May-13 00:01:15

Gracie just posted on your other thread. WE care, please hang on there - is there anyone in RL you can contact? Samaritans?

Think of your gorgeous dd, she needs you to be strong for her

GracieLoo Sat 04-May-13 00:14:45

I'm on my own. Messed up, feel so ill, I can't do this and live an normal life. I want dd to have a normal life which she won't get with me

Ariel21 Sat 04-May-13 00:18:37

Sorry that I don't know much about your situation Gracie, but it seems clear that your daughter means a lot to you, so I hope you understand that she needs you, and whatever this 'normal' life is that you think she needs, the life she needs is with you in it. Stay with us, and call an ambulance if you need to. Have you taken anything? Xx

GracieLoo Sat 04-May-13 00:24:52

A few, my heads pounding. I shouldnt be posting this. I don't need an ambulance

UnicornCentaur Sat 04-May-13 00:25:23

I have found samaritans helpful in this situation. if you want to have a rant why no phone? Or phone the crisis team and ask for help.

your little girl needs you and you just can't see that now because you aren't well. Let someone help you

GracieLoo Sat 04-May-13 00:52:15

Ambulance is coming. Never been so terrified and ashamed

UnicornCentaur Sat 04-May-13 00:56:12

well done for getting help. you have absolutely nothing to be ashamed of

let us know how you are when you can

DevonCiderPunk Sat 04-May-13 01:04:39

GracieLou, well done for trusting & asking for help.

GracieLoo Sat 04-May-13 01:06:24

I feel such a failure. Don't think they're going to turn up, I want my dd

AgentZigzag Sat 04-May-13 01:41:06

I'm so glad the ambulance is coming, let them help you.

AgentZigzag Sat 04-May-13 01:41:39

Is your DD in bed?

Can you get someone to come over to watch her if she is?

GracieLoo Sat 04-May-13 03:06:38

In a bay, I'm being nice but trying to make as I'm so tired.feel dizzy, weird and slow. Kind of scared, kind of don't care now. Going to pass out

GracieLoo Sat 04-May-13 03:08:13

Ddi is at her dads so happy there x

cafecito Sat 04-May-13 03:24:33

you're stronger and braver than you give yourself credit for. well done for getting the care you need. use this as a clean slate moment. your DD will never be better without you. Remember that. Never ever ever. She will be much worse off. even if you feel like a bad mum, or whatever, to her - a bad but present, 'half mum' is far less damaging to a child than a mum who has ended her own life- that's unthinkably sad for her and would never ever be okay for her, she'd never have normality as a child or even into adulthood with that hanging over her. she needs you, whatever you think at the moment. I know it's really hard to see that, but hang on in there we are here, behind you every step.

dogsandcats Sat 04-May-13 07:49:44


DevonCiderPunk Sat 04-May-13 08:19:52

Morning GracieLoo. How are you feeling?

GracieLoo Sat 04-May-13 09:19:44

In hospital, they said I can go home but I'm very shaky and walking really unsteadily, but don't know to say about not feeling right. Keep nodding off, forgetting where I am, thought I was dd's hand. Blurry world. Saw crisis team and I've got to ring them when I get home.

Hoophopes Sat 04-May-13 10:33:43

They would not discharge you if you were not well enough. When will your dd leave her day's? You may feel a bit woozy for a few days so worth asking the nurse when you will be medically ok to care for your dd?Hope crisis team help you plan out how to keep saf at home. Glad you are ok.

GracieLoo Sat 04-May-13 12:21:43

Home now, hospital paid for taxi, I do feel woozy and shaky. I started having hallucinations, thought there was smoke swirling around the room, then the floor looked like water flowing and a bed looked like it was moving. Nurse said it might be all the different meds causing it. Never had that so was scary.

Feeling very vulnerable, emotional and tired. Going to sleep now and crisis team are coming which for once I'm pleased about, I would been admitted if they suggested it. Horrible thing is I feel numb and regret not taking enough.

DevonCiderPunk Sat 04-May-13 12:55:18

Glad you're back in familiar surroundings. Sleep is good. Can you show crisis team this thread?

GracieLoo Sat 04-May-13 15:01:09

Feeling bit scared as unsure what is reality or not?! Having trouble thinking if something actually happened or didn't. Had to really think about what day of the week it was, and where dd is?! What is going on? Been asleep, now going back to sleep. That's all I can do right now.

Hoophopes Sat 04-May-13 17:54:47

Do tell them how you are. ~Perhaps your dd could stay an extra night or too with her dad or your family until the effects of the meds has gone? Hope you can sleep and rest and eat enough for energyl.

GracieLoo Sat 04-May-13 18:37:00

Crisis team have been, can't remember much that was said. Think they're coming again in the morning. I don't feel like I'm really here.

dogsandcats Sat 04-May-13 18:51:18

Does your mum know what has happened?
Have you told any friends?

GracieLoo Sat 04-May-13 18:55:12

No I really can't. Mums away for the weekend, going to have dinner at a friends as they're worried but don't know anything. Everytime I stand my heart pounds.

Slainte Sat 04-May-13 18:58:39

Please, please tell your friends and family what's happening. There's nothing wrong with asking for support.

I really don't know anything about your situation but please don't think you're alone.

gracie hi I've read some of your posts before and know you've been having a really rubbish time for a while. But I really wanted to say you did brilliantly calling the ambulance and I'm so glad you're still here. I have been suicidal and thought my kids would be better off without me, but now I am doing better (it does happen) I can see that was my poorly head not actually me. I really hope you get the support you need from the crisis team and please try and contact one friend or family member. They really won't mind. hang in there x

GracieLoo Sun 05-May-13 00:04:18

Feel all over the place, and not sure if things are real or not. Thought I saw a black cat but nothing there, and getting flahbacks of last night of being put in a room on my own. I'm getting really scared.

dogsandcats Sun 05-May-13 00:12:58

I am up late, which is unusual for me.
I should imagine, that there are still medicines in your system?

I would go to A &E if you are hallucinating. As you have been recently discharged I am sure they will take you seriously and not let you go home too early this time.

GracieLoo Sun 05-May-13 00:19:50

It was probably just a shadow, but it looks the the ceilings moving and swirling. Think I'm tired but I'm scared to sleep.

dogsandcats Sun 05-May-13 00:22:23

Rest with your eyes closed?

GracieLoo Sun 05-May-13 07:45:04

Didn't sleep well, about 5 hours I think, woke up with not a clue what day it is, what's been happening and have I got to collect dd later. Took a while to sort it all out in my head. Woke in the night fully dressed, didn't even manage to get ready for bed last night. I hadn't been drinking either. Spoke to a friend about stuff, they know about work and being signed off. I'm trying to open up. This is so hard. Even typing this has taken me so long.

dogsandcats Sun 05-May-13 07:55:48

Well done.

I have been having a think.
I like to work out what is essentially at the root of peoples problems.

I think yours is self esteem.
You are afraid of this and that, because you are afraid of being judged.
Because you judge yourself.
You think you are worthless, no on should bother with you etc.

But you are definitely not worthless.

What do you think?
I think you have said on another thread that your self esteem is not good.
Would you be interested in trying to improve it, and see if that helps you with probably everything?

DevonCiderPunk Sun 05-May-13 08:00:14

Morning GracieLoo. I am so pleased that you're opening up a bit. Are crisis team coming again today?

GracieLoo Sun 05-May-13 08:43:40

I do have self esteem issues, and a whole lot of other issues!

CT are coming this morning, but I want to go back to sleep. I got up, brushed my teeth, and got back in bed. So tired, physically and mentally. Also, got this horrible feeling social services are going to be involved.

dogsandcats Sun 05-May-13 08:58:12

I doubt social services will get involved.
If they did, I think it is normally said that if you involve yourself with the MH services, then that satisfies them that things are ok in that respect.

dogsandcats Sun 05-May-13 08:59:43

Would you mind saying what people have said your other issues are, You dont have to if you dont want to.
[It is easier than trying to work it out from the other end of a screen!]

Slainte Sun 05-May-13 09:03:55

Gracie , well done you've managed to get through two awful nights. I agree that engaging with the MH services will serve you well. Try to sleep until the CT arrive.

You are in our thoughts.

Hoophopes Sun 05-May-13 09:27:20

Even if the hospital or Social Care do get involved it will be looking at how to support you as you are struggling. The hospital or crisis team will do the risk assessment about if they feel the need to refer. Where I live every time I go to A and E due to self harm the hospital contacts automatically my health visitor.

Great you got through the night ok. Resting is helpful.

GracieLoo Sun 05-May-13 09:32:40

I feel so tired but my brain won't let me sleep. I know I should try eat/drink something. God this is so difficult. Been looking on internet at what to od on, I know this isn't right. Nothing I'm doing is right at the moment. Going to make a cup of tea, I will make myself do it!

GracieLoo Sun 05-May-13 09:44:31

Ok now I'm annoyed. CT just phoned and said 'we know you're getting your dd today so do you need to see us or can it wait til tomorrow as you'll be getting ready for dd'. Wtf?! I didn't know what to say, she didn't even ask how my night was or how I'm feeling, but I told her anyway, said I slept badly, was seeing stuff and having flashbacks, and hadn't managed to get up yet. She said 'well get up and see how you feel, and we'll give you a call later'. I said actually I'd like someone this am as I'm really not feeling right. She said they're doing an assessment for someone then come round. Well now I feel worse, and when they come I'll know they won't want to be there. Wish I had just left it now, as I was talking I was getting more and more panicky.

GracieLoo Sun 05-May-13 10:41:09

Don't know whether to ring them back and say don't bother about today. I don't see what they'll do anyway, and i'm getting really anxious about who's going to turn up. Really jumpy and agitated.

No, don't think they don't want to be there. There were just double checking that you did need to see them today and now you've told them that you do, they will be happy to visit.

GracieLoo Sun 05-May-13 11:08:18

She didn't sound happy. Got stomach pains now. Maybe they think that when dd is here I'm safe so they don't need to see me?

Slainte Sun 05-May-13 15:16:55

Hope the CT have visited you Gracie.

GracieLoo Sun 05-May-13 18:50:10

They did come, bit uncomfortable again with a bloke sat there taking notes, but I tried to pretend he wasn't there. I broke down a bit, shaking and crying. I feel so desperate, I want someone to just take me some place where I can just sleep, make me cups of tea and not ask me loads of questions. And I don't have to think about anything, they can drug me up all they like. But that's not going to happen and somehow I've got to get out of this.

Spoke to my mum as I need her to have dd when I see ct tomorrow, I played it down a lot, didn't mention Friday night. She blames the new meds. Dd just climbed onto my lap for a cuddle. I know she needs me so why am I still planning to od again, want to make it look accidental. I don't feel I'm meant to be here, life shouldn't be like this. I'm not being fair on those around me.

Ilikethebreeze Sun 05-May-13 19:16:53

Why do you play it down again to your mum?
Is it because of low self esteem, so feel you are not worth it or something else?

GracieLoo Sun 05-May-13 19:21:59

It took a lot for me to say anything, find talking to close people really hard. I don't like opening up. I feel like an attention seeker and I hate worrying people. I don't think people understand when they haven't been through it.

Ilikethebreeze Sun 05-May-13 19:28:05

You are not an atention seeker. I have seen your posts to know that.
And true that people will not entirely understand if they have not been through it.

The worrying people bit.
I know someone who didnt want to worry his family about what was wrong with him, And he left going to the GP too late because of it.
His family would much much much rather still have him around.
Please think about that.

Hoophopes Sun 05-May-13 20:11:58

Hi - you say you want to be somewhere where not asked lots of questions, made cups of tea etc ..... could you go and stay with a friend or a family member for a few days and get some tlc? Easier to say than do I know.

Crisis Team will always check whether you want them to visit -some people don't want them, or it is a bad time to be visited etc. And sometimes they get delayed and have to come at a different time as they travel around an area etc (roadworks here cause problems right now!)

Hope you have a good night and have managed to eat and drink so you have energy for tomorrow.

GracieLoo Sun 05-May-13 21:48:25

I don't think there's anywhere I could go and not be questioned constantly about stuff. Oh I just want all this to stop. I don't know who I am anymore. I've eaten a sandwich today, still feeling spaced out and weird. Want to od again but fighting urges as dd's here.

Ilikethebreeze Sun 05-May-13 21:56:20

Could you go to a B&B or say a travelodge.
A travelodge for example often have places to eat in them. So you could be in your room or not. And food on tap.
You can go even for just one night.

GracieLoo Sun 05-May-13 22:42:28

If I went away I wouldn't want to come back. Feel so alone. Trying to sleep but keep getting flashbacks of Friday night and there are big chunks missing. I can't remember what happened.

Hoophopes Sun 05-May-13 23:07:00

Hi, you are not likely to remember all of fri. But remember you chose to call for that ambulance, you want to get better. it is tough right now but hopefully things will improve very soon for you. Why not think about tomorrow and try to focus on planning the day... Meals for dd, what activities you might do?

I find writing a short list, a structure helps me. Just focusing on one chunk of time, one thing to do. Sometimes just going and sitting in a coffee shop helps me, with a paper and drink, makes me feel less alone. Or go to library to get out of house, but easy activity with a dc.

GracieLoo Mon 06-May-13 06:51:33

Another bad night, kept waking up, night sweats, bad dreams, urgh. I wake up physically shaking. I'm going to take it hour by hour today. Dd wants to go to a fair later, but my first task is to actually get up and have a shower. I'm so exhausted.

GracieLoo Mon 06-May-13 07:47:27

I can't do this sad

Badvoc Mon 06-May-13 07:53:56

Yes you can.
Divide the hours into 15 min chunks.
Get through them and before you now it it will be bedtime.
So..shower, that's your first 15 mins.
Sort out your dd, that's another gone.
Breakfast, another one.
Am so sorry you are so low x

Slainte Mon 06-May-13 10:45:05

You can do this Gracie, you really can.

Listen to the advice from Badvoc and Hoophopes, break the day into small portions and just concentrate on doing small tasks.

Don't worry about not remembering some of Friday, that's gone now.

Think about getting through today, hour by hour, and don't look any further than that.

I really wish I could give you loads more advice but I'm sure others will be along shortly with much more wisdom than me.

GracieLoo Mon 06-May-13 16:34:41

Saw the ct this morning, got an appt tomorrow to talk about day hospital. Then took dd out, was hot, she was whingey, and taking it out on me. Wish I hadn't bothered, now got a splitting headache and don't want to see anyone.

Ilikethebreeze Mon 06-May-13 16:42:33

This is what I think you should do.
Take a break in say a Travelodge. Leave your DD with your exp or your mum, or even a friend. I know you say you would want to stay there. But lets deal with one day at a time.

Ilikethebreeze Mon 06-May-13 16:43:35

Can you tell me why you could not live with your mum for the time being.
You may have said why not before.

GracieLoo Mon 06-May-13 16:54:21

There are lot's of reasons I can't stay at my mums, one being I think that would make me feel worse and taking a step backwards, and I would hate it. Re staying away, I don't think I could afford it and i'd be on my own. They want me to go to day hospital anyway so I couldn't.

DD is being horrible to me which makes me feel even worse, especially when it took all my energy to take her out today. Not her fault though.

freyapoppy Mon 06-May-13 17:05:35

You poor thing!sad, bless you, I have been where you are now & it is very scary & unreal at the time, most importantly give yourself a break & huge pat on the back for asking for help & getting this far ok!?Big hugs xxx
Next just rest,rest & more rest,.leave housework,make up etc,.let family & friends take over & don't feel guilty about it!You are not well & have possibly had a breakdown sweetie. Be completely honest with your GP, crisis team & anyone else who comes along, they can only help you if they get the true picture, they wont judge you, just get you the right support.
You have been incredibly brave so far & I Know you love your baby with all your heart, so hold on to that feeling and never let go...she will get you through this, having her their needing you is what will help you rebuild yourself!You can do it, but it wont be overnight, just take each day at a time & be nice to youself, you deserve to be looked after too you know, us Mums are super special & our kids would be totally lost & devestated without us!!
Sending you love GracieLoo, here if you need to talk xxx

GracieLoo Mon 06-May-13 18:05:51

Dd is having a tantrum, not like her, she's too old for this. I have no energy to deal with it. This is why I shouldn't be here, it's starting to affect her. I knew it would. Putting her to bed early then try to sleep myself.

Ilikethebreeze Mon 06-May-13 18:18:13

To me the merry go round of chmt, crisis team, hospital isnt making you any better.
I think you need a rethink about things such as staying with your mum, or a friend.

GracieLoo Mon 06-May-13 18:28:46

This is the worst I've ever felt, and only 2nd/3rd time with crisis team. It's not easy for me to just go to my mums. I'm opening up more and will accept support in other ways. Also family/friends aren't trained to deal with these things, and might not always say/do the right things.

Ilikethebreeze Mon 06-May-13 18:43:55

Glad you are opening up more, I think that will help you.

Hoophopes Mon 06-May-13 19:03:26

Hi - hope appointment for day hospital goes well. I spent a week at day hospital, for me it wasn't right - so hope it helps you. What will you do with your dd when you are there? I know you say family and friends are not trained, but the advantage is they are there all the time and can help out with your dd and they can help out with practical things at home that you may struggle with. Hospitals and CT etc don't do cooking, cleaning, shopping, nursery runs etc - which is why it is helpful to be a bit open to people to help with those things. Could you ask for referral to home start if your dd is under five - you may get someone come round to be with you for 2 hours a week, that is not family, to help you at home?

GracieLoo Mon 06-May-13 19:40:23

How did you find day hospital then Hoophopes? I've been before, got mixed feelings about it. Family/friends know enough that I can ask them to do nursery drop off, cleaning etc. That's ok, the practical stuff is fine. I'm just not the type of person to go crying to family or friends, never have been and don't think that will change.

Hoophopes Mon 06-May-13 22:32:09

Hi. Asking family and friends does not always mean crying or asking them to have deep talks. It can be just having somewhere to to make sure you and your dd are safe. It is often, for me, not being alone, having distractions that help.

For my I found the day hospital did not work. Am sure they are all different and everyone has different needs. I was there 5 hours a day for one week. Some people just go for a few half days a week after that. I stopped as they agreed that it was not helpful for me. I did not enjoy being with other people that were not well, for me that did not help distract me or help me move forward. Hard to explain but for me it was not right. Perhaps I was too well as spent most of my time reading the paper. Little to do. Few word games, walking group once a week and an art group.

Hope meeting tomorrow goes well for you.

GracieLoo Tue 07-May-13 07:57:47

I'm really nervous, not sure if they'll make me stay at the day hospital today. I've started to realise i'm going to have to address all these issues and emotions, instead of being allowed to hide away in bed pretending none of this is happening.

I know I need help getting out of this as the bad thoughts are there, and i'm thinking when can I plan to do it. I can't stand this pain anymore. Was just shaking with anxiety making dd's packed lunch, got absolutely no food left so will have to go to shop later. Mum offered to get stuff but I feel like I should be able to do these simple things, and it's hard accepting help.

Ilikethebreeze Tue 07-May-13 08:18:34

Most of us have help. In fact, I am of the opinion that all of us need help.
You are trying to do everything yourself. That is not really how life needs to work. We all rely on others from time to time. Nothing wrong with that. In fact, I would say that it is absolutely essential.
Let your mum help. x

GracieLoo Tue 07-May-13 09:26:20

Feel like i'm going to have a panic attack!

Ilikethebreeze Tue 07-May-13 09:41:29

I dont know much about this sort of thing so am bumping.
Will it be bad if you have a stay at day hospital, or is it more a case of you dont know what is coming next?
See, this where it would be helpful for you to have someone in rl with you.

GracieLoo Tue 07-May-13 12:03:39

But people work or have their own families to deal with, can't expect people to drop everything, plus I didn't know how long i'd be there. Starting tomorrow a.m and seeing cpn too, but feel I've really let her down. I don't know if I want to go or not, but not sure I have a choice.

GracieLoo Tue 07-May-13 17:59:26

Shouldn't read certain threads on here but I do, and didn't realise what a trigger they can be. Also it scares me how much people don't understand mh. I think if I dropped dd off at nursery tomorrow and said 'bye, mummy's off to a mental hospital for the day' I would get avoided and dd would lose some playmates. Of course there are those who try to understand, but it's being brave enough to find out.

My anxiety is so bad, so jumpy, just thought someone was in my garden, and keep thinking something bad's going to happen. Wish they would give me some pills for it. Bought wine for tonight, not a good thing I know blush

Ilikethebreeze Tue 07-May-13 18:26:30

I was just going to see if you were ok.
I am aware from having read the MH board, that they can indeed be triggering.
Yes, unfortunately she might lose some playmates. But you would know that the ones she got and the parents were on your side and understanding and helpful.

Some people unfortuneately seem to be unable to see and empathise with what others can see. It may not be their fault.

Hoophopes Tue 07-May-13 19:09:58

asking or accepting help is ok. People wouldn't offer if they didn't mean it. And when somene breaks an arm and cannot manage things so well friends offer to help - it is no different. It is not as if this needing help will continue forever, it is for now. And I have realised that people do help each other, it is part of having relationships with each other. And if people do not accept, then people cannot offer - and people like to give.

Hope it goes ok. Its not about letting down your cpn - your cpn is your care co-ordinator adn she will be helping you have the care that you need right now, which is more intensive than seeing her weekly right now. The cpn will be there,as think they have the joy of all the paperwork!!

GracieLoo Tue 07-May-13 22:19:06

Thing is, some close friends/family knew about an od a couple of years ago, and know i'm under cmht, have appts etc, but no one offers help, or knows what to say, that's why it's hard to ask. And I did break my arm a couple of months ago, quite badly, and people rallied around and I accepted help, as it was an obvious problem.

Anyway, I feel quite on a high today, feel very strange, Like my mind is buzzing. Went to shops and bought dd a few bits as feel so guilty i'm her mum! I don't know who I am anymore, doing things that are impulsive, out of character, then I crash and can't get out of bed. Suicdal thoughts are too constant, they've become normal iykwim. Then it builds up and urges get too bad. Quite grateful i'm going to day hospital and getting help, for dd's sake, but i'll be so gutted if I don't get out of this.

Hoophopes Tue 07-May-13 22:57:30

Your mum did offer to do your shopping and people do take your dd to nursery for you now, so it sounds like people are offering help, perhaps you cannot see that though? I know when I am very unwell I struggle to see what is really happening.

GracieLoo Tue 07-May-13 23:03:05

Yeah I think it's more about me not asking/accepting as it's not physical. Was easier to do with a broken arm. So, so tired but too wired to sleep.

TheSilveryPussycat Tue 07-May-13 23:17:14

Hi Gracie saw you on a couple of other threads, didn't realise things were so bad for you recently. I don't know what day hospital is like, but do know about being an in-patient, and also about drop in centres. Where I find the great thing is talking to other people with mh issues, cos we understand and help each other, and realise there is no shame in being ill.

Sending warm wishes and a brew

GracieLoo Wed 08-May-13 06:48:15

Horrible night, and now feel too exhausted, sick and shaky to go to a new place with new people. Think it might be a long day.

Ilikethebreeze Wed 08-May-13 07:02:52

I think that at some point you need to divide up your friends/family into categories as to who are the ones that know and dont do much,
those that know and are helpful and you can rely on.
And , maybe most crucially, those who dont know. I think, in these sorts of circumstances, it turns out to be surprising who ends up stepping up to the plate, and who starts to fade away for whatever reason. And some of the people you know, who you might not think will support you well, are the ones who can and do.

I hope it all goes well for you today Gracie x

GracieLoo Wed 08-May-13 08:47:43

I don't want to go. Feel like a zombie and want to spend the day in bed, but I suppose that's the point of going, so I can't lie there planning how to end it. Scared though.

Thanks for all the support and advice.

kerstina Wed 08-May-13 09:02:29

Just wanted to say thinking of you,hope it goes ok, let us know how you get on.

TheSilveryPussycat Wed 08-May-13 09:24:10

You are going to somewhere where they will understand. [hugs]

GracieLoo Wed 08-May-13 09:46:06

Feel so uncomfortable. Why am I here?!

TheSilveryPussycat Wed 08-May-13 09:56:36

Well, you aren't well, gracie love. There will be good staff at the hospital, hopefully, and perhaps you'll find someone who will help you feel more comfortable.

GracieLoo Wed 08-May-13 10:08:35

But I'm worried about my cpn coming and saying I shouldn't be here. She's going to be annoyed with me. I want to be at home, I can't believe this is all my fault. Poor dd, at nursery while I'm here, not a clue what's going on. I might as well just not be here, as i'm such a failure.

Staff are still in a meeting, waiting for first session to start.

TheSilveryPussycat Wed 08-May-13 10:18:47

Well, it's good DD is at nursery, not knowing what's going on. And it isn't all your fault, mental ill health is no-one's fault, although I do understand the feeling. But it is just a feeling, like the feeling that you are a failure. You are not a failure, you have a DD who loves you, you post on MN, you are doing what you have been advised in order to get better.

Can't see why the CPN should be annoyed with you? You mean about the od? That is over and done now, you are taking the first small steps to recovery.

GracieLoo Wed 08-May-13 12:34:56

Just been told my cpn is leaving, absolutely gutted, bawling my eyes out. Wasn't expecting it as only been seeing her for a couple of months and she was really good. I can't cope with stuff like this, I know it's pathetic but I feel so upset and alone.

Ilikethebreeze Wed 08-May-13 12:54:26

I know you find it very hard when medical staff leave. It has happened before hasn't it.
I realise and rememebr you said it brings back memories of someone else who left in your life.
Please remember it wont be anything to do with what you have done or said.
I suppose it is what happens. Staff leave sometimes.
You could do without that happening though.
Did she mention at all a new person? I realise that is not much of a consolation right now at all.

GracieLoo Wed 08-May-13 13:14:27

Yeah the one was there but didn't take to her. Feel so shit right now. Left for the day, going to two weeks then will be discharged. I don't know why I find it so hard when people leave and I turn into an emotional wreck, but I do, I really do. Got to pick up dd now with a blotchy face and no make up.

GracieLoo Wed 08-May-13 15:41:59

I just keep crying, can't cope with this right now.

Ilikethebreeze Wed 08-May-13 16:28:55

You said you found it so hard because of your dad.
Which is very understandable.

Are you home now?

GracieLoo Wed 08-May-13 16:35:56

Yeah I am, just sat on my bed bawling while dd is watching a film. Just want to speak to cpn again, I know how needy that sounds, but that's what I struggle with, suddenly losing the contact with someone. I don't know what to do. I know I'm over reacting, not in a good frame of mind right now and not thinking rationally. Everything seems too much.

Ilikethebreeze Wed 08-May-13 17:03:58

I got a little confused by what you posted two or three posts ago.
Are you going to go to day hospital for the next two weeks?

TheSilveryPussycat Wed 08-May-13 17:05:34

It takes time to build up trust and rapport with someone, and for them to get to know your story. No wonder it is hard when they leave sad and then to have to start again with someone new. Crying can be good though. When you feel a bit better could you watch the film with DD? or is it something unbearably Shrek, in my case

GracieLoo Wed 08-May-13 17:31:42

Yeah I keep messing up my posts, can tell my brains not working properly. And it's taking me ages to type.

I'm going to the day hospital for two weeks, for no longer because of my attachment issues. Calmed down enough to do her tea and bath/bed, then I can fall apart again. Had some other news today too, dd has a half sister born 11 weeks early, so have to try explain that to her. God I wish i'd never woken up today.

Ilikethebreeze Wed 08-May-13 19:17:39

fwiw, I dont think your dd, at her age, will mind having a half sister.
But hard going for you today.

GracieLoo Wed 08-May-13 19:47:25

She's excited, it's just i've got to explain to her the baby is tiny, poorly and will be in hospital.

Really, really struggling this evening. Finding it hard to feel positive about anything. Think it was just a shock about my CPN leaving, as she said she wouldn't be leaving for a long time. I'm still crying, can't stop and feel sick.

cjel Wed 08-May-13 20:35:35

well done for doing bath and bed, that was amazing.I know how hard it can be to focus on dcs when you feel so crap. My cpn left in the middle of treatment but the replacement was very good and I managed to get well with their support. any chance that you can focus on this evening and try not to go through all the future possiblities when you are tired.?

TheSilveryPussycat Wed 08-May-13 20:58:13

Are you up to silly telly? The Apprentice started yesterday, and 2nd prog is just about to be on. And this year the candidates are very silly.

warm wishes x

GracieLoo Wed 08-May-13 21:46:46

Been on the phone to ct, just had to cry and talk to someone. Didn't think I could possibly feel worse. Thoughts aren't good, so, so low. Sorry to be so negative.

How are you doing now Gracie?

GracieLoo Wed 08-May-13 22:48:24

Like I don't want to be here, tired of feeling like this. Feel myself sinking into a dangerous place.

hugs I know it is so hard feeling like this for a long time, but please just keep going. It will get better and you will then realise how important you are to your DD. I know it doesn't feel like that now but it will come.

Are you off to bed soon? What can you do to distract your mind?

I'm sure you know but the Samaritans are really helpful in this situation. I know because I've called them when I was at my worst and they were kind. 08457 90 90 90. I have to go to bed now as I'm wiped by my day, but you have a lot of friends here and we'll be here for you tomorrow x

GracieLoo Thu 09-May-13 07:58:10

Tried reading a magazine last night to distract myself, found it hard to get to sleep then was awake at 2.30 crying. Feels like i'm getting all the support there is, I still feel crap and there's no hope now. I will engage in the activities at day hospital and talk to them, but worried about when I get discharged to new cpn, I'll have to get to know her and I don't see it working as the last one was so good. It's hard to admit, but I feel like giving up.

GracieLoo Thu 09-May-13 09:58:32

Tried ringing my cpn as think it would help to talk to her one last time. Don't know if it was the right thing to do, or if she'll call back. Crying already, at the day hospital. Feel like I've really lost it now.

violetsrblue Thu 09-May-13 10:56:51

Hang in there Gracie, I think the day hospital will help, it did me when I used to go, it's good to not be on your own too much when you feel so bad, (hugs).

cjel Thu 09-May-13 12:51:13

I'd like to say that it is alright to feel as you do now and that your mood will change. No low mood lasts forever. You sound as if you are frightened to go to the dark you know what frightens you about going there or even giving up? can you go with the flow and see where it leads you? accept your low mood and accept that it will always lift. don't be too hard on yourself for where you are now.It takes time. it is a process that you may have a small step forward then a step back.but you will be slowly moving in the right direction all the time. CPN will hopefully be knowledgable enough to be of help, could you take the risk of trusting her from the start to save time?

GracieLoo Thu 09-May-13 14:57:17

Back from day hospital, cried lots. It's a strange atmosphere but at least I know what to expect as 2nd time there.

Old cpn hasn't rung, so I'm guessing she didn't think it was a good idea. Might phone cmht to speak to new cpn, might be good for me to speak to her. Feel drained, such an emotional wreck.

cjel Thu 09-May-13 15:29:26

if you are drained , rest and then make calls whe you feel bit more refreshed. Sounds like it may be a good idea to phone CPN and then you may not worry so much about relationship once you've started it.xx

TheSilveryPussycat Thu 09-May-13 19:35:29

Gracie it is OK to keep on without hope for now. Just so long as you do keep on. You've done well: talking to CT, going to day hosp, doing lots of crying. And of course posting on MN!

warm wishes and brew

cjel Thu 09-May-13 19:53:56

have you got dd with you? how have you managed bath and bedtime today?

GracieLoo Thu 09-May-13 20:20:55

I am terrified of going to the 'dark place' as each time it gets worse, lasts for longer and I get very impulsive. Hope day hospital does help, it's quiet there right now, and what i'm finding hard, is I seem to be struggling the most, where as last time there were others obviously in a worse place. I know it's not a competition and everyone's illness is different, but I actually feel I belong there, and I don't really want to feel at home in a mental hospital sad

I rang cmht, the receptionist said once a CPN has signed over then that's it. The new CPN wasn't available. I hung up and burst into tears. Have got dd, didn't do bath, she had soup for tea (not great I know), then bed. Haven't got her tomorrow until saturday, and so I have not so good plans in place, although at day hospital all day so will try to talk to someone.

cjel Thu 09-May-13 20:51:04

Soups a lovely tea!! do you always get out of dark place? You do belong at the hospital at the moment and its ok that you feel safe there. Remember if you had cancer and felt at home on the cancer ward you wouldn't feel a failure would you? try not to beat yourself up because you are not well at the moment. I have been as low as you and now hardly remember the despair and fear. I'm sure you can get well it sounds as if you have impatience with how long your recovery is taking? thats quite a positive sign as well because it means that somewhere in you there is the desire to be well?

TheSilveryPussycat Thu 09-May-13 21:03:22

Bless you, one summer my DC had fish fingers, ham, bits of cheese, cucumber and bread and butter for tea most days, twas all I could manage to get together, and I wasn't much good at thinking or decding as I was in a down phase, so it took the pressure off a little. Soup is good. Be gentle on yourself [hug]

They are lovely young adults now, btw.

cjel Thu 09-May-13 21:07:23

My kids call that a pick and mix tea and they think its a treat!! They are 30 and 28 now and also lovely parents themselves who also give their dcs pick and mix and they aren't ill!!!

Hoophopes Thu 09-May-13 21:40:09

Soup sounds very nutritious!

Sorry you struggling with Cpn situation. Here if under day hospital they are in charge of your care (as referred as need more support than Cpn level for short time) so perhaps that is similar where you are which is why no Cpn involvement readily right now? Hope you get what you need from day hospital tomorrow.

GracieLoo Thu 09-May-13 21:55:05

I am struggling with it and i'm so frustrated with how upset I've been. I'm so gutted, feel like i've been left in the lurch, she was going to help me with job stuff and we'd started a mood diary and a list of stuff we were working through. I don't know what will happen when I get discharged back to the new CPN.

Crying again. Dd was so excited today talking about her new sister. I just felt this empty feeling that she's part of that family, and i'm not. I should be giving her a proper family and i'm not.

TheSilveryPussycat Thu 09-May-13 22:12:54

Gracie these days you should have a proper written care plan, so that you and the CPNs can provide as seamless care as is possible. You have some responsiblities too, in managing your condition. Calling for help is one, you've done that, complying with treatments is another, you're doing that. So carry on keeping your mood diary, and make sure you've got the list you made with the old CPN to show the new one.

One step at a time. For me, the next step is often a brew and a mindless chillout - just listening, and letting the thoughts, if any, flit through you mind like butterflies...

GracieLoo Thu 09-May-13 23:29:02

Tried distraction but nothing is really working. I want to sleep, but I cry. I think I've got real problems right now, I'm not good at all. I can't do this anymore.

TheSilveryPussycat Fri 10-May-13 00:12:40

Gracie lie down and get some physical rest, even if you can't sleep. Please don't worry about crying - it is a healthy reaction to the way you are feeling, rather like on vicar's thread, where we all understand about needing to hide under the duvet during the day.

kerstina Fri 10-May-13 07:53:00

Have you got any self help books in the house you could reread? These type of books really help me see a different way of thinking and reading would be a good distraction for you. Have you read the power of now ? Self help for your nerves? I also like don't sweat the small stuff.They make me feel a bit more positive and a bit more hopeful. Thinking of you Gracie I keep checking this thread to see how you are.

cjel Fri 10-May-13 08:24:16

Morning gracie. It seems as though you will never improve doesn't it? BUT you will my lovely, you will. Being sad about dds new family is normal, I expect it was the dream you had for her when she was born so it will be hard to think of her getting somewhere else. She isn't leaving you though and you are not losing her, her dads family is an extra to the love and life she has with you.I wish i could tell you that this time in your life isn't forever and that it is very possible to recover completely. When my cpn left it helped me to recognise how much I was able to do myself. You can still keep doing the things you planned together because it is you that is doing them, she was only an aide. I want to give you a big hug and say hhow fantastic you really are doing. I dont want to tell you too much of what I've been like in the past but getting up and going out, posting here,caring for dd ( even underselling yourself with the soup!!) are signs of living!!one thing I will say I moved once and dcs stayed somewhere else for a few days I only found out years later , I hadn't even noticed they weren't there!! We all have stories like that and the frustration of not doing and being what we think we should be is heartbreaking, you WILL get there youWILL feel better and your life WILL be better than it is today.
What time are you going to the hospitall today?x

GracieLoo Fri 10-May-13 09:40:53

I really want a big hug, can't remember the last time I got a hug not including dd, but that's my fault for not letting people get close.

Just about to go to day hospital, but sat in car crying. I don't want to walk in there crying. I want to stop all this. I'm taking the meds every day but not feeling any improvement, and it's really difficult.

GracieLoo Fri 10-May-13 09:42:16

And no I haven't tried self help books, been given lots of print outs etc in the past, I find it hard to put into practice when I'm already that low.

kerstina Fri 10-May-13 09:49:52

Gracie how long have you been taking meds? They can take a while to kick in ? You are going through a tough time with the birth of dds half sister and your change of support worker. I think I would feel the same but you will get through it and have happier times.
Is there any pattern to your mood diary? Certain times of the month I can feel completely flat and hopeless but then things pick up.
Sending you a big virtual hug xx

kerstina Fri 10-May-13 09:52:32

Yes I understand that completely.Keep talking on here you know yourself you are not alone there are other people who feel as low. I have noticed you have offered support to other people in the past which is lovely of you.

GracieLoo Fri 10-May-13 10:17:10

Before I came in here I phoned to speak to the new cpn, I can't connect to her, I can just tell, and that panics me. I was talking about how I felt on Monday, and I was sorry I was in a state and didn't get to say thanks and proper goodbye. She cut me off and said she'll see me next week. And go in to talk to staff here. They are short staffed today, with only 1 qualified, annoying support staff and students.

Fed up with putting negative stuff so sorry. Will try post something good if it happens.

Ilikethebreeze Fri 10-May-13 10:43:34

Can you ask for a different cpn?
That would not mean you are difficult. People all react differently to different people.

TheSilveryPussycat Fri 10-May-13 10:44:53

Gracie give your new cpn a chance at least. Sadly she is probably dealing with too many clients, and had to prioritise her time today sad - it doesn't mean you won't be able to connect, it just means that knowing you were going to the hospital today, she had to make the difficult decision to prioritise her other clients this morning. Hope you have been able to talk to staff at hosp today - that is what they are for, and that is the place where they should be prioritising you and the others who attend.

Sending my biggest virtual hug.

cjel Fri 10-May-13 12:36:21

we can take negative gracie - no worries!! have you manged to get out of the car and go in yet?

GracieLoo Fri 10-May-13 15:17:00

I talked to a doctor, now a bit worried as they've just said I'm going to talk to two more staff, and they've said they'll see if there's a space in their carpark for my car hmm Feeling a bit disorientated and shaky, kind of scared but feel a weird sense of calm. Don't know what's going on, want to be in my bed.

TheSilveryPussycat Fri 10-May-13 16:33:09

You are getting help, Gracie love. Don't fight it if you can help it, that weird sense of calm is good.

GracieLoo Fri 10-May-13 16:59:57

They started talking to me about admission over the weekend. I was trying to concentrate, it was such an effort to talk and focus. They said it was either that, or could I be with people and stay safe and promise to ring ct if I needed to. They said hospital isn't a nice place to be, with panic alarms going off etc, but they need to know I'm going to be safe. I said I'd text a friend to come over and had plans with dd over the weekend. They gave me three sleeping tablets and I've come home and got in bed. I feel disconnected from everything.

Hoophopes Fri 10-May-13 17:16:55

Hi, sorry so shaky but good you been able to ask for help and do ask friends and family to be around you this weekend. Much better to be at home than in hospital. Do not worry about asking people to be with you and dd, if you were in hospital people would have to have dd so much better they can support you right now. Well done for being honest with them.

Do not worry too much about new Cpn -as others said if lots of people nededing help she would not prioritise you as you have day hospital and others have only her right now. Hard to accept that, but Cpn support is limited and if they have lots of people struggling they have to make tough decisions. Does not mean new Cpn not helpful to you.

GracieLoo Fri 10-May-13 17:33:28

I'm in a strange place right now. Torn between taking an od or fighting through this weekend. Don't want to say which thought is winning. Think this week has taken it out of me. Just remembered something the doctor said earlier, he asked 'don't you care about your daughter?'. I do but I can't cope with what's going on in my head.

Ilikethebreeze Fri 10-May-13 17:41:28

That was a silly thing for your doctor to say.
We know you care about your DD very much indeed.

Have you texted a friend to come over?

GracieLoo Fri 10-May-13 17:50:06

No I'm too tired and I don't want to see anyone.

Ilikethebreeze Fri 10-May-13 17:52:54

Gracie, do you think you should admit yourself back to day hospital?
Is your DD with you all weekend now?

GracieLoo Fri 10-May-13 17:59:20

Day hospital ends at 3, just got crisis team for the weekend. Got dd tomorrow and Sunday. Feel like today didn't really happen, was the strangest, longest day ever. Got a headache but if I start taking tablets I might not stop. And if I get out of bed I might end up buying booze and pills. Do u know what they gave me to distract, word searches?! Are they having a laugh, I can barely write my name right now!

SnowyMouse Fri 10-May-13 18:14:53

Sounds like a good time to ring the crisis team.

TheSilveryPussycat Fri 10-May-13 18:33:19

Gracie please text a friend to come over. You don't need to talk to them, just let them be there. Keep posting.

nenevomito Fri 10-May-13 19:04:51

Maybe a weekend in hospital would have been OK, as you would have had on-tap support there. At the very least call a friend xx

GracieLoo Fri 10-May-13 20:11:03

Actually wishing I was in hospital now. Not making good decisions.

TheSilveryPussycat Fri 10-May-13 20:31:47

Then please ring Crisis Team.

GracieLoo Fri 10-May-13 21:02:04

Ok, had a bath with lavender - still don't feel good. This is not good. Might phone ct but scared of what they'll say, and don't want to mess up everyone's weekend.

SnowyMouse Fri 10-May-13 21:08:21

Better to ring now.

cjel Fri 10-May-13 22:18:57

oh my lovely. please ring for support. they have asked you to phone them tey are working, you are not a burden to them ,, you are the person they have come into work to help. Please can you just give them a quick call to see what they suggest?xx

Hoophopes Fri 10-May-13 23:07:15

Hope you can phone for help. They can talk to you, visit you whatever you need for support. Do you have any prn medication for times like this?

GracieLoo Fri 10-May-13 23:07:57

Phoned ct, waste of time. I should try to sleep.

Hoophopes Fri 10-May-13 23:11:14

On a lighter note, yep day hospitals seem to specialise in puzzles, word searches etc!!!! Think theory is looking at things can help(hence why tv on all day in hospitals) even if cannot do it!

cjel Fri 10-May-13 23:29:36

thinking of you tonight gracie, wishing you a long sleepxx

cjel Sat 11-May-13 08:56:19

morning gracie, how did the night go?

kerstina Sat 11-May-13 13:31:06

Hi Gracie hope you managed to sleep ? How are you today ?

GracieLoo Sat 11-May-13 14:37:41

I slept but not as well as I thought with a sleeping tablet, felt awful this morning, and really tired and out of it today. Finding it really hard trying to get on with it, finding this living business really hard.

SnowyMouse Sat 11-May-13 14:40:19

I'm glad you slept some Gracie Just take it one small step at a time.

GracieLoo Sat 11-May-13 17:28:30

Just want to cry. Thought I'd try to have a normal day but I can't, everything feels slow and distant. Being with dd is making me sad as I don't feel like a proper mum.

Ilikethebreeze Sat 11-May-13 17:32:32

You are a good mum to your daughter.

SnowyMouse Sat 11-May-13 17:33:44

Have you seen/had contact with the crisis team today?

cjel Sat 11-May-13 17:48:42

you are being hard and impatient with yourself again gracie> your dd loves you very much and you are a lovely mum to her , one who just isn't doing what she wants AT THE MOMENT. the change will come and you will be the mother you want to be, but for now accept that what you are for her is more than

GracieLoo Sat 11-May-13 18:44:03

Dd has just said something that has made me feel utterly crap. Driving around crying. I don't want to carry on, I can't, tried this week and hoped things would improve slightly but it hasn't and I can't see it happening. I'm taking the meds but what's the point if they're not working, I miss my cpn too much to carry on without her support, and I've been told I really need psychotherapy to get better but still on waiting list and what if it doesn't even work. Got dd but was thinking of getting someone to have her soon so I can do what I want to do. Do what is swarming around in my head making everything else impossible.

cjel Sat 11-May-13 18:45:37

what has upset you so much gracie?

Hoophopes Sat 11-May-13 18:49:53

Why not tell CT that you are with your dd and struggling? They may come and see you or at least talk with you.

It is sad when lose a good mental health worker, but ultimately a good mental health worker will help you to manage without their help, rather than want to have contact with them. So I am sure the new person will just be as skilled and may be able to help you in ways the other cpn didn't or couldn't. It is good you know what treatments you need to recover, although waiting is sadly part of the course as so many people need therapy there isn't enough resources (I know, I had 9 sessions last year, then therapist moved jobs and I didn't get any more help... the worse I got the more they said I wasn't stable enough to access help and as it was a scarce resource I had to wait until would make most use of it! Frustrating at the time, got given crisis team etc as that was what was best at that time too, even if I couldn't see it).

Can you phone crisis team and tell them honestly what you are thinking of? About needing to keep dd safe? they can help you and are very quick at reacting when children are involved, as long as you tell them everything,

Ilikethebreeze Sat 11-May-13 18:54:30

I think that psychotherapy will help you Gracie. I really do.
Is there any way that you could be put further up the waiting list.
Is there someone you can ask about that do you think?

GracieLoo Sat 11-May-13 18:55:39

Just something children say, but it hurt and confirms my fears about my depression affecting her. Last time I had psychotherapy I wasn't stable enough, it doesn't make sense. Nothing makes sense. Want to hurt myself so badly. I feel dead inside, I might ring ct later but if it's the same bloke as last night I'm hanging up.

Ilikethebreeze Sat 11-May-13 19:01:38

Ringing ct later is a good idea.
I think psychotherapy will work this time.

Children are not really mature enough to know what they are saying at her age. x

cjel Sat 11-May-13 19:02:17

could you see that if its 'just something children say' it may not be related to your depression? will hurting yourself help in some way? have you a friend in RL that you can call?xx

SnowyMouse Sat 11-May-13 19:07:04

It will probably be someone different tonight.

cjel Sat 11-May-13 19:12:14

You also managed very well last night with person you didi't like on the phone, I know its really draining and you feel as if you have nothing else to go on with but you will - every day you will have bad times and not so bad times - whatever happens you may feel like hell but you will get through it whether you find someone helpful on the phone or not. You have more reserves than you think and although you can't see it today you also have the strength to heal yourself with quite limited support. How are you now?


I've been having therapy, keeping a mood diary and had my ad's changed and am now in a much better place than I was a couple of months ago.

I thought about suicide all the time, as I had just had enough and didn't see a future for myself. But tbh I am scared of death and dying.

Exh committed suicide 12 years ago when ds1 was 5. The ripples of repercussions are still having an effect all these years later. Ds1 has had 2 lots of counselling with Cruise. Ds1 seems to be a bad place too atm. He doesn't answer his mobile or texts, doesn't come home at night sometimes. I sometimes think he blames me for leaving his dad and the resulting suicide. I don't blame myself at all. He was sectioned, and was very good at manipulating people into thinking he was ok, when he clearly wasn't.

You have the self awareness to know that your thinking and behaviour is skewed, and that you have the capacity to ask for help.

It will get better. I know it's difficult, and that sometimes what feels like the easiest option for you is just so final and will affect your dd in years to come. I am not trying to guilt trip you, but you need to find the resources within yourself to take a step back, to talk to your friends and family, to be honest with them. Let them help you. You deserve it, and your dd needs you.

The problem with depression is that it affects how you interpret other people's reactions, what they say, how they say it etc, putting a negative spin on everything.

You need to carry on communicating with the ct, with your cpn, and with the hospital. It isn't easy, but if you believe that this is just a phase, and that in a week, or 2 weeks, or a month you will feel differently, then that will give you the strength to carry on and not just give up.

I hope this helps, and just take it hour by hour, day by day. I actually found swimming really helps me, as I have to concentrate to swim the correct strokes which takes my mind off things, and also makes me tired enough to sleep. brew

GracieLoo Sat 11-May-13 21:13:38

I'm not doing well, even if people say I am, I know i'm not. I'm falling apart. Got it in my head i'm going to start making proper plans, get this sorted, make sure no one blames themselves. If i'm ill i'm allowed to not be here, if I could take the place of some poor person with cancer or some other illness, who doesn't want to die, I would, I really would. Sorry if that sounds disrespectful or selfish, I don't mean to be. I am in bits, dd needs stability.

cjel Sat 11-May-13 21:46:55

dd needs a healthy functioning mum and that wil lbe you in the future.I wish I could make you see how your future could be wonderful, have you discussed your suicide plans with anyone?

TheSilveryPussycat Sat 11-May-13 21:48:30

DD needs stability, yes, in that She Needs Her Mother To Be There. Don't worry about feeling crap, that has nothing to do with it, your job for the time being is just to keep on keeping on, remember pick and mix meals are a treat...

Are you able to listen to nice gentle music or something?

cjel Sat 11-May-13 21:51:02

i just had a thought that I'm only just starting to get to know you and don't feel like I'm ready to lose you from my life

GracieLoo Sat 11-May-13 21:55:14

Omg I just broke down crying and I can't stop. I feel so ill, I'm so sorry. This is getting harder. I am trying to listen to your advice, it's just so hard.

cjel Sat 11-May-13 21:56:19

oh bless you what has made you cry?

GracieLoo Sat 11-May-13 22:11:22

I don't know, everything! Feel so lost

GracieLoo Sat 11-May-13 22:19:26

It was the same man, I hung up. Getting so upset over stupid things, can't stand this.

cjel Sat 11-May-13 22:19:31

do you feel hopeless? can you feel safe or does everywhere feel unreal? I know that feeling, it is so scary nowhere on the planet felt as if it would be safe.You feel unable to catch a real thought. It really is a reaction to being absolutely exhausted. You feel as though you can't switch your mind off but you can't seem that it will be able to keep working any more. It will improve when you get the right medication and start to have more and more 'lucid' times in the day. I think the anxiety alliance I heard they had a phone helpline?

Ilikethebreeze Sat 11-May-13 22:24:25

gracie <hugs>
cjel, it may have been a word you used. I dont know if that is what has triggered her?

TheSilveryPussycat Sat 11-May-13 22:24:59

Could you google for pink noise or sounds of the sea or something, and listen to that, has worked for me to slowing down my thoughts...

cjel Sat 11-May-13 22:26:10

Ilike, Do you have anything in mind?

cjel Sat 11-May-13 22:32:46

have I put my foot in it again?

GracieLoo Sat 11-May-13 22:37:56

No you haven't. Don't want anyone to feel bad, it's all my doing. Actually thought ct might call back, don't know what I expected, I should go to bed but i'm scared of everythinh, mainly my thoughts and crying, and I don't want to wake up tomorrow.

cjel Sat 11-May-13 22:47:13

I was asking ilike as she said it may have been something I said.I am being confusing.
You are not making anyone feel bad. What you are going through is not catching and I am strong a stable enough to listen to whatever you say without it unbalancing or scaring me I promise.
Do you think that you could get some sleep, Have you tried what pussycat suggests? I had some favoutrite music I could fall asleep to - once I'd allow myself to! Can you cry yourself to sleep?
Try to think of now. tomorrow you may have had several hours sleep and may feel refreshed,
What time do you think you will be up? I get up at 7.30 so will check back in then if you want to chat?

Ilikethebreeze Sat 11-May-13 22:55:11

Has your DD got a teddy or furry toy that you could put into bed with you.
Sounds silly I know, but it can be comforting.

cjel Sat 11-May-13 22:58:52

I am having to go to bed gracie but hang on and try and get some rest.
goodnight, spk in the morning.xxxx

Ilikethebreeze Sat 11-May-13 23:03:28

GracieLoo, it is ok. You have not upset cjel. She does not feel bad. She is fine.

cjel Sat 11-May-13 23:10:08

Oh crap have I done it again. Iam fine , happy and content , I am not worried about anything . Gracie you have not upset me in any way. I can't think of any way that you could. I am not just saying this i mean it.Hope this reassures you? I function best if I go to bed at 11.!!


You will not feel like this forever. You will begin to feel better/differently. Maybe not tomorrow, or the day after that, but at some point you won't feel like you are feeling now, and you will be really glad that you didn't give up.

My suicidal though was that if it got too bad I could slit my wrists with a Stanley knife. But I knew that it would hurt physically. And I couldn't bear to inflict that much pain on dh, ds1, ds2, my sister etc. so it was my short term emotional pain versus their rest of life pain at losing me.

Some people just have more emotional resilience than others. Hang on in there Gracie, try to sleep or google deep breathing techniques , that may help you relax.

I read that crying is good as it helps your body expel the chemicals which make you feel bad, which is why it is cathartic.

cjel Sun 12-May-13 08:19:57

Morning gracie, Hope you got some sleep? How is this morning?

GracieLoo Sun 12-May-13 08:33:45

Thanks for last night, don't know how I'd get through this without posting here. I slept ok, but feel so tired this morning I can hardly keep my eyes open. Been having vivid dreams, one when I threw a mug at dd's face, that upset me a bit. sad Going to make myself have a shower, hoover and go get some food, they are my three tasks when I can actually get up off the sofa. Want dd to stay overnight somewhere tonight, but haven't asked anyone yet, then I plan to start writing notes. The first one will be to my old cpn, as I feel we didn't depart in a nice way, and it's playing on my mind.

cjel Sun 12-May-13 08:42:07

Try and recognise that you got through yesterday because you do have resources inside which you can always call on to support yourself. You know what is best for gracie and you took care of her yesterday very well. Glad you had some sleep, every little helps. three tasks sound like a good plan and writing is brilliant. I journal most days and find that I may start moaning and not able to cope and by the time I've written for half an hour or so have turned it round and I recognise loads of positive things I did.

GracieLoo Sun 12-May-13 16:18:26

Got what I needed to do done, but my god it was hard, and it feels like the longest day ever. I'm so tired all the time, and the bad/dark side of me has arranged for dd to stay at her grandma's, she wants to anyway. And i'm just so tired, i've tried to keep positive and interact with dd, but now i'm exhausted and I can't do it anymore. Think i've done ok with the time i've spent with her this weekend, just feel guilty I have to rely on other people to have her because i'm so hopeless.

I kind of had in my head, tonight is the end of this pain, but I also know I should phone ct if I start getting impulsive or in a real state, so i'm confused, can't make sense of my head. I keep getting waves of fogginess when my head gets all heavy and I can't think straight.

kerstina Sun 12-May-13 16:30:05

I must admit I was worried when you said you yesterday wanted DD to be elsewhere and you wanted to write letters. Definitely phone crisis team if you are thinking that way Gracie.
What do you think would make you happier in the short and long term? I know that you are unhappy at the mo because of birth of DD's half sibling and change of your support worker but can you tell us more about what has led you to feel low in the past? No problem if you do not want to talk about it I just wanted to see if we could suggest things.

Hoophopes Sun 12-May-13 18:39:18

As dd with grandma why not have take that sleeping tablet you were given and have a nice early night so hopefully you can have energy for day hospital tomorrow. Perhaps have a nice snack before bed, so have energy. Even put something nice on tv/film to help you relax before the sleeping tablet kicks in.

cjel Sun 12-May-13 18:44:30

gracie - well done you did what you wanted to, I think that is brilliant news. I am not being condescending, i genuinely understand the effort you have put into today. How are you doing now did you let fogginess drift or are you still trying to struggle? have you got tv you can put on and then you may have a break from thinking?xxx

GracieLoo Sun 12-May-13 19:53:32

Got tv on, will take sleeping tablet later but it didn't seem to have much effect. Nothing helps anymore. I can't get over this feeling of abandonment, I can't cope with not seeing people again, I can't do this. Think I really need help or something but scared of not getting it if I ask, and getting told I'm just like this because I've got bpd, and don't cope with stuff. Can't live like this.

cjel Sun 12-May-13 19:59:05

You are right that you can't live like this and you won't have to long term. Nothing helps at the moment, that doesn't mean it never will. Is it your X you feel abandoned by? or a non specific sense of being left?

GracieLoo Sun 12-May-13 20:45:56

Ok, i'm going to ramble on as it helps until I build up the courage to phone ct. DD isn't here, as I arranged for her to be somewhere, I know what I do/am doing is wrong and soesn't make sense to people. It doesn't make sense to me. I am troubled by stuff that happened in my childhood, not abuse or anything, but it's recently dawned on me that i've always found things hard, and things have been getting harder.

I know children need their mums, I know right now it's not sensible to be drinking, buying tablets to have in the house, lying to people so I can be on my own, giving up work, not accepting help. I know all this, but my head is not letting me behave rationally. I want to get drunk, I want to be on my own, and I want to get to that point when I can take an od. Because I feel like i'm going crazy, I want to be 'normal'.

I do enjoy seeing dd do funny things, but the negative stuff takes over. I feel alone, even when i'm with others. I feel like someones died re cpn leaving, which is ridiculous as I only knew her a few months. Think this has tipped me over the edge, but I have written her a note to tell her no one is to blame but myself.

Sorry this is long, should have written it down for new cpn, but what's the point. She doesn't know me. I don't even know me anymore. Sorry this doesn't make sense sad

SnowyMouse Sun 12-May-13 20:53:14

You have written it for your CPN. I hope you ring CT.

cjel Sun 12-May-13 21:13:19

YOu are not going crazy. It will not always be like this and you will be able to live alife that you feel is 'normal', I think writing it all down for new cpn is good idea, she may not know you yet but if you take the trouble to 'waffle' it all out as you say she may get to know the real you quicker. have you phoned the ct?

GracieLoo Sun 12-May-13 21:21:17

No I don't know what to say. I've got bpd, it's my personality, I'm not ill. They can't do anything.

TheSilveryPussycat Sun 12-May-13 21:38:24

First and foremost, they can help you manage it in the here and now. I once managed someone with BPD, who lived alone, we talked a lot and she had some troubled times, so I have an inkling of an understanding. (BTW I have been v seriously depressed, to the point where I could hardly bear another day, but I know I felt differently from her, and probably from you. - sorry, now I'm rambling.

What I'm partly saying is that service users stick together, I'll be checking the thread regularly for the next hour or two. brew [hug]

Gracie please hang in there. Try not to think about the past or the future so much of you possibly can. It's like you're running a marathon at the moment but one day you will get to the finish line and feel better. Hope you've managed to watch some tv and take your sleeping tab. I can only imagine how tough things are for you at the moment but believe me there are many people on mumsnet like me who are thinking of you and routing for you. Really hope you get some sleep tonight, take care x

GracieLoo Sun 12-May-13 22:02:29

Ok i've got the sleeping tablet infront of me, but also have packets of other pills. Poured myself a large vodka, sat with my head in my hands, watched a bit of tv, got dd's teddy, then thought I need to take these. I phoned CT and this is how the conversation went
me - 'i'm really struggling tonight'
him (nobhead) 'sorry?!'
mw - 'i'm finding it hard, tried distraction stuff but got the tablets in front of me, and I don't know..' didn't really know what to say
him 'I don't really understand, why have you got tablets out?' not in a nice manner.
I didn't feel I could continue, he spoke to me like I was stupid so I said 'guess i'll just speak to the staff at day hospital tomorrow then?'
him - 'yeah ok'
So, that's why I don't like phoning anyone, but now I feel I need to sad

GracieLoo Sun 12-May-13 22:07:18

Maybe I am in the wrong and took it the wrong way. I hate talking to men.

He doesn't sound remotely helpful gracie. It might be a bit clichéd but would you ring the samaritans? I found them v helpful when I was sat with a pile of pills in front of me... listened and helped me clear my head a bit. Worth a try?

GracieLoo Sun 12-May-13 22:26:59

I thought about the samaritans but to be honest i get more support here, and I think they would ask questions that might trigger things, I don't know. Put off ringing anyone now, think i'll take a load iykwim and see if I wake up in the morning. I feel too bad posting here like this so will stop now. My head is a mess

TheSilveryPussycat Sun 12-May-13 22:27:09

For some reason it seems we are obliged to spell it out at a time when we are afraid to say the words, before CT (or other care profs) get it. Not everyone by any means, but some of them don't seem to be able to take the hint <sigh> -they don't understand that you are keeping yourself together and need support.

TheSilveryPussycat Sun 12-May-13 22:29:55

PM'd you gracie

Gracie pick up the pills, put them in a high up cupboard and shut the door. The get into bed. Teeth brushing is optional. Stay with us and your dd for another day x

Ilikethebreeze Mon 13-May-13 07:46:57

Hi Gracie
I was out last night.
Sorry to see that you had a very bad evening.
Glad you find us helpful to talk to.
Are you going to day hospital today?

I know you find people leaving you very hard to take. That is understandable.
Please pm me when or if you want or need to x

kerstina Mon 13-May-13 08:59:25

Hi Gracie Hope you are ok ? Was thinking about you in the night and worrying.

GracieLoo Mon 13-May-13 09:12:13

Please don't worry. Woke about 6ish and still lying in bed. Don't want to move. It's too much effort and feeling quite dizzy and shaky. Got to be at hospital soon.

TheSilveryPussycat Mon 13-May-13 09:30:29

Morning, gracie. Do you think meds are having physical side effects?

GracieLoo Mon 13-May-13 09:41:51

I think so, I feel really sick. I don't expect sympathy though.

TheSilveryPussycat Mon 13-May-13 10:00:58

Well, the question is, are you physically well enough to go to day hosp? If not, perhaps ring in sick(!) to the day hospital.

nenevomito Mon 13-May-13 11:54:12

Go to the day hospital. Its obvious you need the support. Don't turn your back on it Gracie.

cjel Mon 13-May-13 12:52:49

Sory I haven't been back before Did you manage to get up and get to the hospital lovely?x

SnowyMouse Mon 13-May-13 13:31:11

I hope you got to the day hospital - they can check you out physically too.

GracieLoo Mon 13-May-13 14:13:40

Been to day hospital, left the day hospital. Feel like I'm banging my head against a brick wall. Spoke to a nurse, got asked again what I think would help. I don't know! Admission was mentioned again. Tired, fed up.

GracieLoo Mon 13-May-13 14:37:54

Don't know if that's the correct expression, but basically feel no ones listening to me. I said I didn't find ct helpful, they said to call them. Wonder if that bloke has had other complaints.

Hi gracie well done for getting up and out this morning. So does this mean you can call the day hospital now if you need support? Am hoping so. I hope you can put your feet up this pm, maybe watch some tv? Thinking of you, take care x

kerstina Mon 13-May-13 17:30:37

Yes well done for getting there. Have you got chatting with any of the other patients wondered if you could offer support to each other. Not sure how these places work.
That bloke sounds useless its better that you can call the hospital now.

Hoophopes Mon 13-May-13 17:42:07

Hi - do call the crisis team, if you feel you are in crisis before next can go to day hospital. The same guy will not be on repeatedly at nights, they do have shifts.

I phoned the cut when I was at my lowest. OK didn't find them at all helpful, and when I went to see my go 2 days later for more dad's there weren't any notes on the system to say I'd phoned them! utter pantsconfused

I phoned Samaritans and they were much easier to talk too.

Gracie, it does get easier, but you need to keep on communicating, through whatever helps you the most. maybe reading would help as a distraction? have you got anyone in rl who can give you a hug? you can borrow one of my cats if that would help. I have 2 fluffy cats who are both soppy and mad as a box of frogsgrin

stupid bloody autocorrectblush

crisis team not cut, and antidepressants not dad!

GracieLoo Mon 13-May-13 19:50:53

Sorry i'm not making much sense in my posts, and this is my third attempt at this one! They said i've still got to call the ct, said it won't be the same person. I'm still put off calling them though. Was told to take the extra meds and other stuff to the hospital tomorrow so I feel safer, but i'm not sure, in my messed up head, if I feel safer with those things here.

Admission was mentioned again.

I do talk to some of the other patients, but no one seems on my level. It's quiet there atm, not many to relate to.

SnowyMouse Mon 13-May-13 20:03:16

Just try to keep working with them, that's all you have to do,

cjel Mon 13-May-13 20:11:28

Well done gracie for getting out and keep on asking. I get the feeling that you feel not listened to and wonder are you getting any one to one counselling sessions wit a counsellor? What sort of things are they doing for you at the hospital. Could you say what you do from the time you get there?

GracieLoo Mon 13-May-13 20:50:38

It is so hard to get across how desperate I feel, but I don't hold back and say what I think and do, plans etc. I suppose when they mention admission I panic, and find myself agreeing to their suggestions even though I have no intention of doing them.

I don't get counselling there, they don't want to stir stuff up, but I have a different key worker every day, and can ask to speak to them if I need to. Or if i'm sat there bawling, someone will ask if I want to talk.

There's a bit of sitting around, there's a tv room, have teas/coffees, read paper etc. Then today was a session talking about recognising signs of becoming ill, and what we're like when we're well. Then relaxation/walks (I haven't done these yet), or pottery, baking and all that crap. We have lunch that they provide, then I kind of sit around and leave! Today I left the building, walked about, sat on a wall for about 10/15 minutes and don't think anyone noticed. I feel like just walking out sometimes, don't know what they would do.

cjel Mon 13-May-13 21:02:37

It sounds a bit mixed?some helpful for you some not?It can be hard when someone hasn't be there for then to understand. have you anyone that you do speak to for counselling? I have the impression you have felt that you are not being listened to and even just now you posted you didnt think they would notice if you left. Wondering if you would benefit from one hour a week of one to one counselling? has anyone suggested it to you?

GracieLoo Mon 13-May-13 21:10:39

I'm on the waiting list for psychology. Was seeing cpn weekly, so i'm not without support, it just feels like that sometimes.

It is mixed, and sometimes I just sit there thinking what is this about? How is it helping? But I should be grateful i'm there. Can tell they worry about some of the stuff I say, which has become normal thinking for me, but seeing their reaction scares me a bit, and brings it home that I do need serious help!

Hoophopes Mon 13-May-13 21:27:46

Hi, has DBT group therapy been suggested as that is meant to be the best treatment for bpd? Can take a while to get space on the course as it is not a short course but meant to be good. Might be worth asking about. Have to be stable to do it though, but with waiting lists worth getting on one. Forgot to mention it in my last post.

I found lots of waiting around in day hospital too. Because people are there who need gentle activities for, I struggled with it. I was told being frustrated with the day hospital was good sign, showed I was we'll enough not to be there and for me that was the case.

cjel Mon 13-May-13 21:27:55

if you get option try and see if you could get person centred counselling,gentle at your own pace and keep yourself safe at all times.I suppose if they are not qulified to listenat the day hospital they may find some of your things not normal but I haven't heard anything from you that has scared me. I can see that it may be of benefit if only as a way to fill your days, but feel that once you have counsellor and cpn the stuff they offer at day hospital will be of more benefit. It may be not what you need this week but you may find some of the doing things better as you improve. how long is the waiting list for counsellor

GracieLoo Tue 14-May-13 08:44:32

Fighting against these really strong urges this morning. This is not letting up. I don't know how to deal with anymore. Everyone must be getting fed up with me, I'm getting fed up with me. Hate urges that make you feel like it's the only way.

cjel Tue 14-May-13 09:20:13

Promise I am not getting fed up with you, only fed up that you still have to struggle. Hate urges on your behalf!! Have you got day hospital today? could you take offer of talking to someone there? and don't worry about upsetting them, they have probably heard it before.xx

TheSilveryPussycat Tue 14-May-13 09:27:42

No-one is getting fed up with you! There is a part of you that is trying to find peace, however it is going about it the wrong way. It sounds off the wall, but that peace might be found through baking, pottery or walking, when you are up to it, certainly I find baking v soothing.

cjel Tue 14-May-13 09:31:55

I'm know what you mean silver, but When i have been so down its been hard to get joy from anything,and even getting up and dressed can take all the energy i had so had to go back for a rest after my shower!! only after other help has got me quite 'up' again have i been able to concentrate on anything else.

TheSilveryPussycat Tue 14-May-13 09:39:20

yes, I know cjel that's why I put 'when you are up to it.' When I was really depressed (though not suicidal) I just sat, drank tea and smoked cigs. For six months sad

Even now I sometimes find it hard to get going (think it might be inattentive ADD) - and have to take baking step by little step, starting with getting out the ingredients, so when a baking moment comes, I am ready...

cjel Tue 14-May-13 09:42:36

love the idea of having 'a baking moment' turn up!!

Hi Gracie, those urges are horrible - I do sympathise. I had them for a while and know how wearing it is. But keep posting here. We sympathise and we're here for you. I hope there's someone at the day hospital you can talk to today. I end up reverting to the tv when have no motivation for anything else... so it's Matthew Wright this morning. Take care x

GracieLoo Tue 14-May-13 10:18:16

Really don't want to be here today. There's none of the staff here that I like. Getting used to coming here too which for me isn't a good thing, what with me having 'attachment' and 'abandonment' issues! As when it gets near the end my mood dips again. I get told I have too much insight so that makes it harder to understand why I do these things. Rambling again, sorry

TheSilveryPussycat Tue 14-May-13 10:39:13

gracie it's alright to get attached, it is part of being human, part of being well to be attached. And once you have that experience, no-one can take it away from you, if you keep it safe inside yourself.

BWT my best friend tragically died in her 20's, I still grieve for her and yet I still feel that I am so happy to have had those years when we knew each other like sisters.

GracieLoo Tue 14-May-13 12:06:57

Sorry to hear that silvery. I know I'm not the only person to lose someone, people go through horrible times.

I've walked out of the day hospital, as I felt like I shouldn't be there. I felt calm, blank, no emotion. There were too many men there, one kept following me, and there are workmen there that I felt uncomfortable with. I said I had a headache so I wanted to go. The nurse asked if I had that stuff for her, I said no I left it at home, and they let me go!

Just sat in my car now. Only person I want to speak to is my cpn, and I can't. Feel like she hates me and everyone's talking about me.

Can you call your CPN Gracie ?
Or possibly go back into day hospital and talk to someone there ?

GracieLoo Tue 14-May-13 13:37:23

I don't feel like I know what I'm doing anymore! Urges are so strong and real. Phoned new cpn but made me want to speak to old one more. She told me to phone ct. I don't know what to do, feel torn.

TheSilveryPussycat Tue 14-May-13 14:42:17

My point, gracie love, is that with attachment there is always the risk of loss. And yet, even if that loss happens, the risk was still worth it. You are in a dark place, and I am old gimmer and too used to loss, so my point was prob not appropriate atm.

Meanwhile, if hosp is still open, please go back to day hospital and ask someone to ring the CT for you.

SnowyMouse Tue 14-May-13 14:50:24

Do phone CT...

TheSilveryPussycat Tue 14-May-13 14:55:03

gracie you could even go to GP and ask them to ring for you...

cjel Tue 14-May-13 15:03:44

YOu are in a dilema gracie, can you think what may help ? ring GP or CT, can you go back to hospital or is that closed now?

GracieLoo Tue 14-May-13 15:07:28

I fell asleep, was nice to have some respite from the crap stuff. But then woke up sad Feel really sick, but haven't even taken anything. Ate some toast earlier so can't be hunger. Think I just feel rubbish all over. I know I should phone ct, but I don't know what to say, plus I have to pick dd up in a while. Keep telling myself she's waiting for me. So will get through the next couple of hours, then see how this evening goes. Kept the pills close to me all day like a security blanket! This mental pain is killing me, literally.

cjel Tue 14-May-13 15:12:50

glad you had tiny respite. could still be hunger the adrenalin you are using will mean you need to eat loads, so try a bit of something else. I take certain things out with me as a security blanket.(drink, food!) security blanket is cosy!! This mental torture will not kill you, you may feel that but every time you manage a sleep or talk with dd or watch tv you are giving your exhausted mind time to rest, like a respite. will check back in a bit.xx

Glad you're looking forward to seeing DD Gracie
How old is she ? When do you pick her up ?
I think you should phone someone and get some more RL support, even if it's just talking things through with someone.
Who do you feel would be the best person to call for some support this evening ?

cjel Tue 14-May-13 18:40:00

How you doing?

GracieLoo Tue 14-May-13 20:41:46

My health visitor came round this afternoon, she knows me well, supported me lots in the past four years. I had a long chat with her, it's like I don't care what I say or what happens now. She wants to speak to my cpn to see if I'm well enough to care for dd. I think I am some of the time, she's not being neglected in any way. Had two missed calls, maybe from day hospital as it was blocked and they didn't leave a message.

I feel so confused, and I'm not crying much now but I don't know if that's good or bad.

cjel Tue 14-May-13 20:58:35

Glad you had someone to talk to gracie, you may at last get the support you deserve.

SnowyMouse Tue 14-May-13 21:06:26

I'm glad you got to talk to your HV, gracie. Hope things progress in the right way for you.

GracieLoo Tue 14-May-13 21:11:21

Just feel things are escalating a bit, can now see social services getting involved, dreading tomorrow. Tempted to hide away in bed to avoid all the phone calls, day hospital, meeting new cpn etc. It's relentless, want a hug.

cjel Tue 14-May-13 21:14:12

do you think it could be a good thing that maybe you won't go round and roung in circles now? Don't hide i'll miss you!!

Ilikethebreeze Tue 14-May-13 21:21:32

<hugs> to Gracie.
No, social services are not like to be involved, as we have discussed before.

Hoophopes Tue 14-May-13 21:33:25

Glad you have support of HV. I was told when I was very ill it is normal for them to risk assess and refer to Social Care. Then up to SC to assess and see if extra support needed. That is the way it was explained to me when I was very upset about referral. I can see their point, they are responsible for welfare of children and if someone is struggling to care for self then it is natural to ensure enough support is in place. It could be just making sure you have people to phone to take dd when you struggling. Also because you needed the ambulance the hospital always contacts hv's.

Just like you are needing extra support right now, sometimes the whole family needs it. Hope if referral happens you can get some extra support right now. Just keep being honest to get the help available if you want it. (I was not offered any extra help, so it was bit frustrating, but)

Hoophopes Tue 14-May-13 21:34:17

Hugs xxx

cjel Wed 15-May-13 08:10:31

Hello, HOw are you today?

GracieLoo Wed 15-May-13 08:31:41

Ok, not particularly looking forward to today, but I know if I don't turn up it will just cause more problems. Feel I don't belong anywhere anymore. I'm not like the other patients, and I'm not like all the other mums or friends. Feel less alone here.

kerstina Wed 15-May-13 08:53:20

Don't be daft we are all very different in life anyway!It is easier said than done I know but I am not trying to fit in anymore. I am my own person they can fit in with me smile Glad it helps to be on here I think its wonderful this board in particular how everyone is so supportive so you know there will always be someone there for you Gracie on here.
Good luck for today will be thinking of you xx

cjel Wed 15-May-13 10:08:45

you will realise one day it is your state of mind that makes you feel like you don't fit anywhere you probably don't feel like you know who you are at the moment, good idea to go today so they arent worried, but if you feel like doing something else could you ask them if you could do that instead? It so hard for me to say these things as its seems so impossible for you to believe but it really is true that youwill feel different at some point in the future and one day you will look back and notice that you are one of those people who do fit in.xx

cjel Wed 15-May-13 13:12:45

what did you decide gracie did you stay or did you go?

GracieLoo Wed 15-May-13 14:50:47

I went to the day hospital, had a meeting with the new cpn, they said they'd had a call from my concerned HV, so a meeting needs to be arranged. Can't remember much from this morning, feel strange today. Feel nothing, don't care what happens anymore. I didn't feel anything when they were telling me stuff.

TheSilveryPussycat Wed 15-May-13 15:57:14

Feeling nothing is just self-preservation. The support system is coming, keep going minute by minute, hour by hour. brew [hug]

cjel Wed 15-May-13 18:03:05

hopefully they will support you without you having to make the decisions.get som e food and see if you can distract with tv for a bit. Help is on its way at

SnowyMouse Wed 15-May-13 18:20:56

Look after yourself as much as you can, Gracie

GracieLoo Wed 15-May-13 19:03:04

But what kind of help? Keep thinking I should be scared, but i'm tired, so tired and fed up of these thoughts. I have been a bit irritable with dd, she's tired and tearful. I'm then being soft with her, she's just getting mixed signals, but I don't know what to do for the best. Getting urges to ask her if she wants to live with someone else, or would she be sad if I wasn't here anymore. But I keep these inside my head as it would wrong to ask her those things, even though I really want to.

Got a friend coming round for a couple of hours, really can't be bothered, feel too pissed off to see anyone, and can't force a happy front this eve.

Why should I look after myself, it's not worth it. I don't think i'll be here next week, the urges and thoughts, and confusion and all that bad stuff is at the front of everything, feel like i'm not in control anymore. Don't know what the professionals are saying or planning. I can't cry anymore, and I think people take that as a good sign, I actually think it's worse as it's all staying inside messing me up.

kerstina Wed 15-May-13 19:17:58

I think the word is disconnecting ? Part of the depression. Your friend might cheer you up a bit and take your mind off things? Perhaps open up to her if you have not already.
I have just been on the other thread reading what makes you happy on chat. Have a look at it if you can. Made me a bit teary some of the replies but in a nice way.

Hoophopes Wed 15-May-13 19:44:17

Help = well you have daily help to ensure you are safe at day hospital. You have access to CT, plus a new cpn (and believe me to have one lost and one replaced straight away is amazing.) You have your hv. You have the people you can phone to come round, help you, help with dd (have her for the night). You are on a list for appropriate therapy (but need to be more stable before you can start I guess). There is the option of inpatient hospital if you are not safe for yourself.

GracieLoo Wed 15-May-13 19:46:48

Ok now I feel ungrateful, sorry

Hoophopes Wed 15-May-13 19:54:25

No that was not the intention. Just sometimes when not well it is easy to think alone and no one there to help. Just wanted to remind you of the people and services you are engaging with. Also you can phone or email Samaritans or other mental health phone lines. You could visit your gp or even a&e if you want to see someone urgently and ct not available. Trying to think what else. You could ask health visitor to refer you to home start? Ask what groups you could go to if not at work that are friendly. Can't think what else right now. What would you like?

cjel Wed 15-May-13 20:27:27

the sort of help you may get could be to have someone to spend time with you and assess what will be best. It could be that you get occupational help - with day to day chores, they may finally get you some regular counselling with the same person at regular times a couple of times a week, I think that the very fact they are looking to help you is a positive thing for you to look forward to, it could be the start of the end of your nightmare and the start of a happy life.xxxxxxxxxxx

GracieLoo Wed 15-May-13 22:12:09

I've decided to let my closest friends know, so that if (when) something happens it won't be a big shock, and I want dd and family to understand it's an illness that did it, not just me being selfish. I feel I'm completely losing it!

Hoophopes Wed 15-May-13 22:17:45

Cjel makes a good point there, you could get a support worker to visit you several times a week to help you care for yourself and dd at home.

Great you been able to tell people you are ill. Hope that gives you bit more support for you at home if you feel you need it. Can you ask them to review your medications, as they might be able to offer you other things to help you. Having a medication review with a psychiatrist can be really helpful.

cjel Wed 15-May-13 22:29:53

thats a really brave decision gracie, Do you know which friend you will tell? is it the one thats coming over tonight? Are you going to tell more than one?

TheSilveryPussycat Wed 15-May-13 22:35:01

gracie the support of friends is inestimable. (Have to say, am not too happy about some of your reasoning though).

Stay safe.

GracieLoo Wed 15-May-13 22:49:20

The only reason i'm telling people is so it won't come out of the blue and they can support each other. I don't want sympathy or whatever. This seems logical to me, does it sound wrong to others? I don't know what's rational and what's not anymore. I'm preparing people.

kerstina Wed 15-May-13 22:59:05

Your choice of words is worrying me Gracie do you think you might be better staying at hospital Gracie till you are not feeling and talking like this . Really good that you have opened up though was your friend helpful ?

GracieLoo Wed 15-May-13 23:08:33

Well actually, it wasn't helpful. I texted a friend, and yeah she was nice, but now keeps texting, she's really worried and not gone to bed yet, so I feel worse that someone else is suffering now because of me. This is why I don't want to tell people, was going to tell other friends but I won't, expect this friend will though, and they'll all be talking about me.

Why can't I cry anymore? Very agitated

Gracie hi, I'm pleased to hear you're planning on telling friends how ill you are, and I really hope you get some more support. The way you are talking now though is worrying me a bit. Please try and hold in your head that this illness is Temporary. Please dont do anything permanent. It sounds like your conversation with your hv was really open and will hopefully mean you get some more support and that could be the beginning of recovery and a step towards a positive way forward for you and your lovely dd. Take care.

Hoophopes Wed 15-May-13 23:13:16

You told a friend who is now offering support in the way lots of people do now we have technology like mobiles. She is not suffering Gracie just showing care.

GracieLoo Wed 15-May-13 23:32:06

I keep reading back what i've posted and it all makes so much sense to me, and I don't understand why it's worrying people. I feel kind of at peace now, don't worry, it's the right thing. Think it is meant to happen like this. Not tonight, got to keep dd safe. Asked her dad to have her two nights this weekend but he can't so I don't know what to do yet. Feel I will talk to someone tomorrow but only to let them know. I'll get up, take dd to nursery and go to dreaded day hosp, just as normal, maybe i'll write stuff down for them. getting tired now, so brain is even foggier than usual, can't sleep though.

Stay safe gracie. Try and rest tonight and we'll all be here for you in the morning.

TheSilveryPussycat Wed 15-May-13 23:50:28

gracie logic is only as good as its premises. You are assuming that somehow people can be prepared for the worst. Believe me, they can't. One of my bf did what you had been contemplating, her DDs were devastated, I went into a severe depression for 6 months. You just cannot inflict that agony on people.

I am talking v straight, I know, I am here for a while yet, if you need support more one-to-one pm me.

TheSilveryPussycat Thu 16-May-13 00:50:21

Still here, hoping you are sleeping...

GracieLoo Thu 16-May-13 08:21:58

I was asleep I think, feel like I haven't slept though. Keep dealing with dd, breakfast, getting her dressed, and going back to bed inbetween. I need to get dressed, but I don't want to move. Thinking about what to put on is too hard. I don't really like the nurse that is taking over my care at the day hospital so don't really feel like going today.

kerstina Thu 16-May-13 08:50:44

You have been brilliant this week Gracie to have gone in to the hospital when it is such an effort, so you can do it today. Keep being honest with the staff. Your thinking is skewed at the moment, part of the illness. I know you know that. Thinking of you xxx

cjel Thu 16-May-13 10:13:34

morning gracie, what is it you don't like about the nurse? did you go ?

GracieLoo Thu 16-May-13 11:31:22

I've just walked out, didn't tell anyone, the receptionist didn't see. I'm not sectioned so I don't have to be there. Driven to my dads cemetery. Feel like I'm in control and feel calm, but not really sure what I'm doing? Thought about getting dd and driving off far away, but I'm here instead.

Ilikethebreeze Thu 16-May-13 11:39:18

Dont worry about other people being burdened.
I did that once, but once I had told them something horrid that had happened to me, they were perfectly able to cope. And I felt a whole lot better.
I know people dont react necessarily in the very best way for you sometimes, but telling is good for you, and I think, necessary for you.

TheSilveryPussycat Thu 16-May-13 11:40:16

gracie talk things over with your DF for a little while. Cemetries can be v healing places.

If you can, let the day hosp know you have gone, as they need to know who is there in case of fire or other such emergency.

Ilikethebreeze Thu 16-May-13 11:41:20

What Ithink you need is to find a real life friend or relation who you can regularly unburden too, who does react in the way you need them too. It may even not be the person who you expect it to be iyswim.

GracieLoo Thu 16-May-13 12:16:46

They kept ringing but I didn't want to speak to them, so I rang cpn to tell her to ring them. She was asking me stuff but I don't know what she was getting at, I don't think she gets me at all! I can say anything and it doesn't matter, she doesn't know me!

nenevomito Thu 16-May-13 12:37:49

Gracie - you need to engage with the people at the day hospital and your new CPN. You need the help and if you keep rejecting it, then you are not helping yourself at all.

You need to think hard about this. If you decide that you won't engage with the services then they will have to consider their resources and whether they should be directed to someone who will accept the help OR whether to section you.

I know how bad you are feeling and how difficult you find it to engage with new people before you know them, but they are obviously concerned for you and want to help you or they wouldn't be calling.

Being on a section is waaaaay different to being informal. You can be refused leave and grounds leave. They can treat you against your will with depo medications. For goodness sake engage informally before they take the choice away from you one way or another.

Sorry that this isn't sugar coated or hand patting, but I know that you don't expect that from me anyway.

Speak to your CPN. Speak to the hospital. You need the help.

TheSilveryPussycat Thu 16-May-13 13:00:57

gracie what bh just said. Your new CPN can't get to know you if you don't give her the chance.

SnowyMouse Thu 16-May-13 13:29:29

I second bh and TSP, if they feel you're not engaging, they may withdraw their support, or make risk assessments around you not engaging.

You really need to try to engage, they will support you through it if you do

SnowyMouse Thu 16-May-13 13:31:23

PS sectioning is not all it's cracked up to be, being a voluntary patient is far better. I've been sectioned twice in 2 years, it's very disempowering and means you stay in hospital longer.

kerstina Thu 16-May-13 14:13:17

Agree with above Gracie you need to accept the help.Bi polar is about episodes and mood swings is it ?If so how you feel now will pass you should start to feel better soon accept the help for yours and your daughters sake. Please Gracie xxx

Hoophopes Thu 16-May-13 19:26:03

Gracie - are you wanting to be in hospital 24/7 - is that why you are walking out of the day hospital, to try and tell them to give you inpatient care? Just wondering.

If you continue to behave in this way then several things may happen, like other people have suggested. They may have to contact social services (any health professionals can do this) as they may be concerned for your safety and that of your dd. If you want social care involved quickly you can always contact them yourself and ask for an assessment of more support. People do not always realise this. Or you may have a MHA performed, taking away a lot of choices.

And having no choice but to be under a section (either in a police cell or in a hospital) is really no fun. There is no talking therapy in a hospital. Often little activity at all - definitely much less than at a day hospital from my experience of being at both. If you are classed as not complying to treatment then you may have little choice. Is this what you want?

Can you ask your Mum to have your dd for you again? Tell her that you are struggling to even go to the day hospital so need her to stay with her so you can have a few days of rest and no responsibility.

Hoophopes Thu 16-May-13 19:33:12

Hi, they will either ask you to leave the day hospital if you keep doing this (as other people need their resources and if someone is wasting it they will not keep offering it) and you will be transferred back to one hour a week with your CPN and that is it each week. Or they will risk assess you, probably do a MHA and referral to SC to consider if your child is a child in need or a child at risk, due to you not been able to comply with treatment and you saying you are suicidal etc.

Do you want that? What do you want? How can you get what you want - bearing in mind this is the NHS so can only be what people can get on the NHS? What other needs can be met for you by other people? I had great advice from someone once, which was not to rely on NHS people as they work set hours and are not there for you forever, but to build up a support network of family and friends as ultimatley they are the only ones who can be there 24/7 and meet other needs, such as hugs and compassion. Real compassion, that is not professional standards.

Gracie please please listen to the great advice you are getting here.

Being sectioned is just shit and you have no say in it, once they have decided that is that and it is just awful. And your behaviour could lead to a MHA or a reduction in support and both of those are not what you want. Please try to engage. I know it is hard.

Also be aware that while you are informal, if you present at risk and do risky things they can (and will) contact the police or crisis. Don't assume that being informal means you can do whatever you want, you have responsibilities within that.

What do you want to happen?

When I read your posts I feel like I understand what you are saying, that unbareable feeling inside is so difficult to manage. And I guess I don't know what the solution is but I do know that going from crisis to crisis gets you nowhere fast. There has to be a shift (in you and me!!) to move forward and working with your new CPN (maybe a new perspective?) and the day hospital could help you find that shift.

Have you done the recovery star? It is a tool they use in MH and I find it a helpful model.

Look after yourself.

Hoophopes Thu 16-May-13 20:15:27

Hi yes, Fluffy makes a good point. If day hospital doesn't see you and is concerned they can phone the police to deal with you - ie you don't return calls, walk out of hospital, have given them cause for concern. Mental health services do use the police, and if they are called they can issue a specific short term section, which usually means taking you to a police cell for your own safety. That will trigger off risk assessments with SC, lots of assessments with people who will see you just once and reports etc. Mental health workers will not just keep phoning, they can and will use the police who work 24/7 and have powers to detain if mental health is the issue.

Or they can withold services. This is what actually happened to me. They can say you are not stable for talking treatments and just increase the medication until one is a robot. And offer CT as only source of support, even taking away a cpn!! Oh I got a social worker instead!! Not trained and not helpful, just a risk assessor which is all they tend to do when one is a risk. In my experience.

nenevomito Thu 16-May-13 21:21:20

What Hoop says too. I spent a shitty time in the back of a police van under a section 136 until they could take me somewhere. Being loaded into a van in public - when they caught up with me - and driven off like a criminal and even having a policewoman go to the toilet with me was a horrible experience.

I care about you. You know that. Engage fully with services.

Ilikethebreeze Thu 16-May-13 23:19:39

Hi GracieLoo. I wonder if the last few posts have somewhat alarmed you.
You have been engaging with medical people for a long while now, so I am sure they know you very well indeed.

I dont think that you are in danger of some of what the last posts are saying.

I do think you are not getting on with the new cpn.
Would you be able to have a new one?

GracieLoo Fri 17-May-13 07:57:47

I'm scared, and now I can't go today due to childcare issues, but i'll ring them to tell them and i'll go monday. But because I know i'm getting discharged wednesday i'm scared of not coping there for my last couple of days, if that makes sense.

I'm scared of the weekend, my mum has other commitments this weekend, dd is at her dads for one night, and i'm scared of how impulsive I feel. Scared of ringing today to say I can't go, what will they do? Send the police round?!

Maybe a part of me wants to be admitted so I can feel safe, but then I think I can do this and try to carry on as normal, then it all goes tits up.

I don't mean to waste their time, i'm grateful for the support, just don't always feel i'm being listened to, and I feel uncomfortable and need to get out of there. Others haven't turned up all week, it's not just me.

I'll see how it goes with the cpn, maybe it's better I don't like her as much, then I won't get so attached.

I don't know what's going to happen today, got to be a mum! So bloody hard. I don't want this anymore.

Hoophopes Fri 17-May-13 08:32:14

If you cannot go because of childcare issues, and you phone to tell them they will not do anything. That is taking responsibility. They will hope you can go another day, I guess that is all.

Can you take dd out to places that make it easier - I find baby playgroups help break the day up a big.

Hoophopes Fri 17-May-13 08:35:40

for what it is worth inpatient hospital in an adult psych worse does keep you safe, as you are watched a lot, but in my opinion you are not listened to and it is boring.So if you can keep at home with support of CT, HV and cpn and family you will benefit so much more.

You don't have to like the cpn and it is very hard to get to know them when you under CT and day hospital as they are not in charge of your care then. It may improve when she can see you face to face on her own.

nenevomito Fri 17-May-13 09:12:15

What Hoops said - if you have childcare issues, then you call and explain that to them and you either speak to your CPN and explain this is the case and ask for extra help at home or you take responsibility for keeping yourself safe today and possibly over the weekend.

While I'm posting, I strongly disagree Ilikethebreeze and dressing down what has been said is not helpful.

I've seen people kicked out of inpatient care for self-harming or attempting suicide - the thinking goes that if being in hospital doesn't stop you then nothing will. I also know that as resources are so limited, that they assess whether their services can actually help you. You can't just get a new CPN. They have huge caseloads and new people come onto their 'books' all the time.

I know people discharged from the crisis team for refusing to engage and I know people who have been drugged to the eyeballs in the commuity as they won't follow the advice given. I also know people who have been sectioned then given depo as they won't comply with advice informally.

I've been an inpatient and I do voluntary work with people with MH issues in the community as well.

I really care about Gracie. I've chatted to her a lot over the past weeks here and elsewhere and I would be doing her a real disservice if I didn't tell the truth.

TheSilveryPussycat Fri 17-May-13 09:36:05

These days it is all about co-managing one's condition, the aim is for you to be in recovery dear gracie, and we are all 100% behind you.

Ilikethebreeze Fri 17-May-13 09:58:06

GracieLoo doesnt have to go to day hospital if she doesnt want to.
She goes there because she wants to and chooses to, as she thinks that is the best for her right now.
So she isnt going to be sectioned is she?
GracieLoo is in charge of things. [GracieLoo, you can correct me if I am wrong, I wont mind].

Hoophopes Fri 17-May-13 11:29:24

Hope today is going well. If you have to be with your dd today, then you have to be with her. Hope you can make it a nice day.

Ilikethebreeze - no Gracie doesn't have to go to the hospital, it is an offer of support for her. But if she has childcare issues and tells them that they will understand.

SnowyMouse Fri 17-May-13 13:35:40

Hope you and DD are ok enough. hugs

GracieLoo Fri 17-May-13 13:39:48

Ok, spoke to nurse from the day hospital, she wanted to make sure I was ok, asked what had happened yesterday. I said I shouldn't have done it. My mind is so blank at the moment, I don't even know what to say. She said to call ct if needed over the weekend and she'll see me on Monday, but as I know the supports ending wed and then I won't be under the ct anymore, it makes me feel I have to be better. There's no point in saying how I really feel as it won't make any difference.

The nurse asked if I've felt the day hospital has been helpful. For some reason this makes me feel they all think it hasn't helped so I shouldn't be there. Oh god, I don't know what to do anymore. I keep forgetting things and feel so low, but I can't say anything when I'm here with dd as today there's no one to have her so it would just cause panic. I think they see me as attention seeking and I'll always be like this so I might as well just get on with it, not much fun living every day with head full of dark thoughts though! Want to give up, I really do.

TheSilveryPussycat Fri 17-May-13 13:48:56

gracie why not print out your last post (13:39) and show it to your HCPs. You can edit anything you really don't want them to see, however, it gives a v clear picture of your state of mind. Which is: you don't know your state of mind, and who can blame you with all the possibilites floating around?

nenevomito Fri 17-May-13 13:48:59

Ilike You're right, she doesn't have to go to day hospital, but I am concerned. Its clear from her posts that she's very poorly and if she decides not to engage it can go one way or the other in terms of the help she gets. If she is considered to be high risk and she gets more poorly then her choice may be taken from her and that is what I'm concerned about. I'm not going to get into a row with you on here as its not appropriate, but I have her best interests at heart.

nenevomito Fri 17-May-13 13:51:57

Hi Gracie - thanks for calling and talking to them. Has day hospital helped you, do you think? They don't think your're attention seeking, they think you're poorly. If they thought you were after attention, they wouldn't offer the services that they are going.

You do need to say how you are feeling - honesty really is the best policy. They won't discarge you from the CT if it is helping you and you tell them that its helping you.

Ilikethebreeze Fri 17-May-13 14:49:44

You have engaged with medical people for so long, that they should understand you by now, and know that you do not do things to attention seek.

Hoophopes Fri 17-May-13 15:59:55

Glad you got to talk to the nurse at the day hospital. You will not necessarily be discharged from the CT on Wed though. CT works with people up to a few weeks - a source of support for people who need extra help than a CMHT can give. So if you feel the CT is helpful to you, then tell them that.

Is your dd normally in day nursery each day of the week? Some places have charity groups run by mind or rethink, where you can go to and do activities, voluntarily. Can you ask your CPN when you next see them if there is anything like that you can go to if it would be helpful for you and your dd is in childcare?

Do phone the CT if you need extra support over the weekend. Do you have any nice, simple plans?

GracieLoo Fri 17-May-13 19:22:00

I feel so, so crap. Had a difficult day with dd, she hates me. Had dinner with family but I was impatient and lazy. My mum didn't want us there, could tell, and she made comments about always having to do stuff. Could tell she thought I was being horrible, and that's hard for me to deal with when she knows I'm struggling at the moment but being off with me doesn't help. Glad dd's at her dads tomorrow, I don't deserve to have her.

As far as plans go, not got good ones I'm afraid. Can't wait to be alone to be able to deal with these thoughts, and act on them. It's actually a relief to know I can. Maybe I'll think differently tomorrow, but I tried hard today, and couldn't have a good day with nice stuff in my head. Just want to be alone and away from everyone, especially those who don't understand or I'm making suffer.

Ilikethebreeze Fri 17-May-13 19:30:02

One difficult say does not make a child hate their parent.
If you look on some threads on here, it takes many years before a daughter may hate their parent.
You may well have been impatient and lazy. You dont feel well, so that is not unexpected.
Yes, your mum may feel grumpy,overworked or whatever today. We all have days like that.

nenevomito Fri 17-May-13 21:00:10

When I was poorly Gracie, my DD didn't want much to do with me either, but I found it difficult to want to spend time with her anyway. Believe me, when you're better your relationship with your DD will get back to how it was. Now DD wants to be with me all the time instead of being scared of how I was.

You love her. You know you do, its just hard to show it at the moment as you're so depressed. this isn't how its always going to be.

Keep going Gracie - enjoy the break from DD tomorrow, but get some more support over the weekend if you need it. Or maybe go and see someone, or do something nice with your free day ? Hope you have a good weekend x

Hoophopes Fri 17-May-13 23:22:49

If you were planning a nice, child free day, before this episode of ill health, what would you plan? What would it look like? Can you describe it to us, the things you would do or like to do? Then perhaps we can help you plan a safe day with rest and nice bits to it?

GracieLoo Sat 18-May-13 08:21:45

I feel like two people at the moment. Woke up and could hear dd was up and walking around playing, but I couldn't physically get up. Just waited until she came in, and I feel guilty i'm not happy to see her. Sometimes I feel nothing for her, then I get an overwhelming feeling of love, guilt and sadness that she's so innocent and doesn't deserve all this. Then I go back to feeling nothing but resentment and don't want to be around her.

Before I was this bad, I would spend a child free day shopping, sorting the house out, going out with friends. But anxiety is stopping me, and the feeling of whats the point, everything feels pointless. Now dd is shouting at me because I won't let her stick selotape everywhere, I want to curl up and cry! I don't feel like the adult. I'm trying to be patient and nice, but she's really playing up.

When it's like this, it is easier to think about not being here, because i'm making everyone unhappy. Wondering if there's any point in calling ct today, or if it will make me feel worse.

Ilikethebreeze Sat 18-May-13 08:42:28

Your DD sounds like a very normal little girl to me.
I expect she sees you as a normal mother too.

I remember my childrens' looong sellotape phase.
I used to resent quite how much sellotape they got through. Then eventually realised that it is cheap form of childrens' entertainment, and brought them a lot of fun.
Can you provide her with some things she can sellotape, such as pretty paper, a cardboard box, toilet roll tubes etc?

Ilikethebreeze Sat 18-May-13 08:43:22

Can I ask how long you have been this bad for?

GracieLoo Sat 18-May-13 08:56:16

Now I'm questioning why didn't I think of letting her do it with things she can tape up, I should be able to do these things without thinking about it, now I just seem to cause more upset than necessary. She's made a tent now, and I'm lying on my bed thinking about getting ready to drop her off. Should have bathed her but can't be bothered.

I'm losing track of time, but looking back at posts, been like this for about a month, so really I shouldn't still be this bad, and still having suicidal thoughts and finding every day a struggle. But got a confession, woke up in a panic as can't remember when I last took meds, think I've missed two days, completely unintentional. Another thing that I've started thinking, is my dad is saying come join him, it is for the best.

nenevomito Sat 18-May-13 09:15:16

If you're having thought thoughts Gracie then call the CT. That's what they're there for. Ring them up, tell them and take their advice.

Also take your meds now you've remembered. Forgetting is quite normal - do you have a phone you could set an alarm on, to help you remember? I have to do that and I'm well at the moment.

When I was poorly and found it hard to entertain DD I discovered two sorts of easy entertainment that you can try today- loads of paper, strips of stickers. Make sticker pictures. I was always amazed at how long I could entertain a 3yo with stickers. Stick them on each other, she'll enjoy it. Also the evil that is playdoh. All it takes if for you to make snakes and she will do the rest.

I'm sure that if your Dad could talk to you now, after seeing how much his death has hurt and damaged you, he would tell you to stay alive so you don't put your DD through the same.

If you need support today Gracie then please do call your CPN, or whoever is your best support. Hope you can have a nice break today, and do something relaxing to recharge your batteries a bit whilst DD with her father ?

GracieLoo Sat 18-May-13 10:51:06

Thank you, need advice on basic stuff right now, appreciate it but makes me feel useless. Sat outside a shop now, need to go in and get stuff, but I'm finding it so hard! Also I want to buy booze and pills, and I know I'm going to which is stupid. Keep thinking, right, dd needs a couple of things, I need some food etc, but then I think all I actually want to do is numb things today, not feel anything for a while. Oh crap!

SnowyMouse Sat 18-May-13 13:27:33

The crisis team could help you think thngs through Gracie

kerstina Sat 18-May-13 14:45:40

Go and get the food you need. Don't get booze or pills you do not need them in house. Instead get a nice treat for yourself, glossy mag, choc or other nice comfort food. What food do you like Gracie i love frerro rocche chocolates but cant spell it !

kerstina Sat 18-May-13 14:47:16

Sorry only just realised the time you posted.

GracieLoo Sat 18-May-13 16:03:06

Been asleep, so sleepy. Could sleep all day, just hate waking up.

Well done getting through the day. Good if you've got some rest.
Is DD back home later ? smile
I quite like an afternoon nap these days too blush

GracieLoo Sat 18-May-13 16:57:44

Things are getting hard, tried to ignore these feelings but can't. Should phone ct but scared, I will, I have to.

SnowyMouse Sat 18-May-13 17:04:52

You can phone them

Ilikethebreeze Sat 18-May-13 17:17:52

Yes phone them.

GracieLoo Sat 18-May-13 17:33:46

I have, they are going to call back as no one was in the office. But if I want to od then I shouldn't really call them should I? Just want it to look like I care and want to help myself, so others will not think so badly of me. I don't know what i'm on about.

Texted dd's dad to check she's happy and to tell her I love her. She's better there, eating better, he's playing games with her etc.

TheSilveryPussycat Sat 18-May-13 18:09:49

Good that you have phoned them. I'll be here for a bit, checking fairly regularly.

GracieLoo Sat 18-May-13 18:32:33

Just got off the phone to them, seeing them in ten minutes hmm

TheSilveryPussycat Sat 18-May-13 18:34:27

Just tell them what you have told us, and you may have to trust their judgement is better than yours atm. [gentle hug]

SnowyMouse Sat 18-May-13 18:42:13

I hope their visit goes well.

GracieLoo Sat 18-May-13 18:47:42

Change of plan, it's all gone wrong. I'm an absolute tit sad

SnowyMouse Sat 18-May-13 18:49:24

What's up?

Hoophopes Sat 18-May-13 18:55:11

Oh dear, what is happening for you? While you wait to see CT you can always try phoning the Samaritans, it is free from a landline phone and you can always end the call if it is not helpful for you. Sometimes just having someone to offload to can be helpful.

Are you OK Gracie ?
How are things now ?

Thurlow Sat 18-May-13 19:55:29

Hi Gracie, what's gone wrong? Were the crisis team helpful? Please let us know what is happening and what you are thinking at the moment.

Your love for your DD shines through your posts, it really does. And it sounds like she loves you and needs you just as much.

Thinking of you Gracie.

Ilikethebreeze Sat 18-May-13 21:37:20

Do you need to go to A&E Gracie?

Ilikethebreeze Sat 18-May-13 21:53:01

My guess is that you have done or said something which you think is pretty awful.
My guess is that it is not as bad as you think it is.

My guess is that you may now have done something to yourself. Go to a&e if you need to. Look after yourself.x

kerstina Sat 18-May-13 22:14:11

Please come and talk to us Gracie so we know you are ok.

Ilikethebreeze Sat 18-May-13 22:21:15

kerstina. Please dont worry. I think last time you lost some sleep.
Gracie would not want you to worry.

kerstina Sat 18-May-13 22:30:54

Thanks I likethebreeze you don't need to worry about me I just want Gracie to know we are thinking about her.We all want Gracie to feel better but I guess she has to want it herself too.

GracieLoo Sat 18-May-13 22:39:51

Omg, I started to take some tablets and a couple of vodkas, but then spoke to ct and they say to go to their place. I rang back and said I can't drive as it's not safe, she asked how many I'd taken and she said she needs to hang up and call an ambulance.

It came quickly, I thought I was in the local one, but been brought to another. Feel distant, scared, want to cry. They seem more concerned about dd, then a doctor who obviously didn't like me/the situation, talked to me, rolling her eyes and sighing, and said dd is at risk now so ss will be contacted, then left me. I have ruined dd's life, what the fuck have I done? I'm hurting so much emotionally, and people are treating me like the selfish cow I am. This is what happens when you are honest sad

Ilikethebreeze Sat 18-May-13 22:40:03

She does want to feel better kerstina. She just struggles to know how sometimes.
I hope her appointment comes through soon.

Ilikethebreeze Sat 18-May-13 22:42:20

x post.

TheSilveryPussycat Sat 18-May-13 22:52:06

gracie you have filters in your thinking atm that make you think the worst, when all that is happening is that help has come, really it has. Take care, I'll be thinking of you All The Time.

GracieLoo Sat 18-May-13 23:04:32

All I'm thinking is the worse, that I'll never see her again. I don't even know what's happening, if I'm going home, how I'll get home. Getting dizzy, need a drink but don't want to annoy them more. My poor dd, I don't deserve her. I'm so sorry.

kerstina Sat 18-May-13 23:07:08

So glad to see you back here Gracie. Take no notice of anyone who tries to guilt trip to it is not your fault. So many doctors have studied mental illness but no way do they actually understand it . One day they might when they go through it themselves . Will they keep you in hospital overnight hope so ! X x

TheSilveryPussycat Sat 18-May-13 23:09:24

Of course you deserve her gracie, and she loves you with all her heart. All that is happening is that you are being looked after, so can't look after her yourself. So someone else will look after her, if that continues. But if it happens, it will only be until you are getting well again.

If you need a drink, jus ask, or maybe there is one of those water dispensers?

Oh Gracie, I am so sorry things are so difficult.

Can you see crisis at the hospital? I think you should and I think you need to ask them to consider an informal hospital admission for you. I think you need a break from all of this.

Have they done your bloods yet? Do drink lots of water, it will help flush things through.

SnowyMouse Sun 19-May-13 08:09:24

Thinking of you Gracie, I hope things are improving.

GracieLoo Sun 19-May-13 08:17:10

Had a massive wake up call. Actually petrified of what might happen. Thought I hadn't taken many but got liver damage. So I'm on a drip for 24hours to repair the damage. So now that means I'll be in here until tomorrow, and I've got the ct to look forward to, with talk of child at risk meetings, and what's going to happen when I leave here.

Sat in 'majors' hooked up to loads of monitors, getting ignored by most of the nurses, don't blame them really. Got to sit here all day and another night, I suppose it's my punishment.

Texted dd's dad and praying he'll have her another night, didn't say what I'd done but said I was in hospital. Don't know what I'll do if he can't.

Actually just want to see dd and be the best mum, and actually scared of dying. What if I get liver failure now? Serves me right, but I'm more scared than I thought i'd be.

Sorry to have let you all down sad

SnowyMouse Sun 19-May-13 08:23:11

You haven't let us down Gracie . Hopefully they'll move you to a ward. I hope you get the support you need, from family and professionals.

\thinking of you.

TheSilveryPussycat Sun 19-May-13 08:23:40

You haven't let anyone down, thank goodness you are still here. You are ill, you will get better, hang on to the knowlege of what you really want, which is to be here and to care for DD. All love x

Thurlow Sun 19-May-13 08:27:15

Oh, Gracie, you haven't let anyone down.

Please focus on how much you want to see your DD and be a mum to her. As silvery says, you have filters on your thinking right now which are altering the way you see things. Try and take things one hour at a time, and take the help they are offering you.

I hope you start to feel a bit better. Please come back and tell us how you are getting on.

Glad you're OK Gracie.
And that you know you just want to be the best mum you can to dd x
Nurses are probably more busy than judgemental - I was once a student nurse myself and we never had as much time to talk with patients as I would have liked.
I'm sure dd can stay at her dad's until you're feeling better.
Hope all goes well with repairing any damage to your liver.
All the best to you Gracie.
I think perhaps you should have been an in-patient a bit sooner, but I'm sure it's tricky for community health teams to make those judgements.
We all just have to keep trying to do our best hey, Gracie ?

violetsrblue Sun 19-May-13 10:48:27

Thinking of you Gracie ((hug))

Hoophopes Sun 19-May-13 13:37:22

Good to hear you are safe.
You say you are being ignored by the nurses but it sounds like you are struggling to think logically... They have given you the tests and treatment you need and in the nhs they are so so busy they cannot just sit and be with you. So sounds like you got good medical treatment.

Equally with referral to SS it is good they have told you what is happening. If they were really concerned about you they would not even tell you. They have duty of care for your dd so it would be standard practise to make a referral after two ambulance trips in recent times. They are treating you like everyone else, you are showing people you are suicidal, therefore they need SS to assess whether your dd is a child in need. It is not the dr's job to decide but SS when they see you. You may get allocated a support worker, respite care, special groups etc to help you ... Whatever they think you may need. It is your chance to ask for extra help. If you were admitted into hospital SS would also be contacted, it is standard practise so please do not worry about it. You are struggling and they need to check your dd is ok, just like they are trying to make sure there is no damage to you.

Hope you can get some sleep.

GracieLoo Sun 19-May-13 14:23:26

On a ward with nicer, calmer staff now, just feel other patients are judging me as people aren't discreet when they are discussing me. Don't want to say much else now, just sorry.

TheSilveryPussycat Sun 19-May-13 14:27:23

Well if you're in general hospital, many other patients won't understand sad - though maybe some of them do - mh problems are widespread.

Where I am, there is a MH Liason Officer in the general hospitals - you could ask, if you feel up to it. Or the Chaplains are usually v nice, again you could ask to see one.

SnowyMouse Sun 19-May-13 14:27:29

Take care Gracie, thinking of you, you'll get through this

Glad you're a bit happier with the new ward Gracie.
Most people just want to help I'm sure.
Have you got anything to do there ?
How are things ?

I am pleased you are on a nicer ward. The other patients will be too wrapped up in their own problems to worry about yours, honestly.

The crisis team will probably see you soon and discuss what happens next, they want you to be safe and feel better.

Does your Mum know you are in hospital?

Try to sleep and relax, you are somewhere you are safe and being looked after.

Ilikethebreeze Sun 19-May-13 16:20:03

[hugs] Gracie.

GracieLoo Sun 19-May-13 18:45:36

Family know I'm here but not the full extent. But enough.

Been hooked up to a drip the while time, and still got a few hours to go. But they've just done the bloods so fingers crossed. Still a bit worried that I feel emotionless and not tired considering I've hardly slept. A nice nurse gave me a hug, think I needed it. Still haven't seen crisis team so got all that to deal with, plus HV and lots of explaining to do tomorrow. Think the suicidal thoughts have lessoned, but think this is going to be a hard journey to recover.

SnowyMouse Sun 19-May-13 18:50:19

((((( Gracie ))))) I hope your blood tests come back ok. It sounds like you're communicating with them, which is good. It must be very difficult for you at the moment, hang on in there and it will get better, small steps.

Hope your bloods are fine.

I think it is normal to feel a bit shell shocked after a serious overdose. I think the antidote drip makes you feel grim as well.

Take care of yourself, glad the nurse was lovely, try to get some sleep tonight. x

GracieLoo Mon 20-May-13 09:57:21

First lot of bloods weren't good, so had another bag of fluid and waiting for the next set of results. Didn't sleep well, broke down crying so was given a sleeping tablet. But had hallucinations again, so weird, seeing things move around and change shape, thought there were little people on the wall, and baby faces that are actually cardboard bowls piled up. Things seem to be normal again now but does that happen, they can come and go?!

TheSilveryPussycat Mon 20-May-13 10:04:22

You are v tired, apart from all the rest of it. Tiredness can cause our perceptions to play tricks on us, even without all the rest of it. So I wouldn't worry too much about 'seeing things', but notice whether it continues or not. And if it does, then mention it to your MH HCPs when you next see them.

SnowyMouse Mon 20-May-13 10:09:20

Silvery has good advice. I hope your next blood test results are better, take care.

Hoophopes Mon 20-May-13 14:39:51

Hi perhaps the overdose and medication to counter it is affecting you. Hope the fluid and sleep help right now.

GracieLoo Mon 20-May-13 17:13:40

In a taxi on my way home. Need to change, I really do. This is not good for anyone.

SnowyMouse Mon 20-May-13 17:22:38

Have they offered you any ongoing support? I hope so

Glad to hear you're well enough to go home Gracie.
Keep on getting all the support you need to look after yourself and dd x

GracieLoo Mon 20-May-13 18:07:11

It's nice to be home, and looking forward to seeing dd, so that's a positive thing to come out of this horrible experience. My head is full of worries, so going to write it all down to show at the day hospital tomorrow.

Feeling emotional, exhausted and vulnerable, but I want to get better. If I had been told my liver was so damaged and I was definitely going to die, I think I would actually be devastated. I just hope and pray I start to enjoy things a bit, and not find every single day a struggle.

The support hasn't changed yet, back to day hospital and crisis team, then cpn, but i'm going to ask if I can come to the day hospital for a bit longer.

Thanks everyone for being there, you don't know how much you've helped recently. Glad to be home, that hospital gown and bed socks wasn't the best look!

You're sounding good Gracie - a bit of humour is always nice to see smile
And so glad you're looking forward to seeing dd,
and also going to ask for a little more support via the day hospital.
Good luck to you from here on in !

Oh Gracie. At least you don't appear to have done any long term damage.

But at least you are ok now. I broke my leg just over 2 years ago. In the next bed to me on the ward was a woman who had tried to commit suicide by jumping from the top of a multi storey carpark. Obviously she didn't die, but she had hundreds of broken bones and was in constant physical pain. She was going to be in a wheelchair for the rest of her life, and spend 12 months in hospital. I really felt for her, but especially for her dh and her 3 teenage children. She didn't appear to be in a dark place any more.

Sometime when you reach rock bottom the only way is back up again. I hope you can have the strength to keep pushing for the help you so desperately need.

Honestly, when someone dies it leaves a hole in people lives which can't be filled. Can you imagine how your daughter would feel if you had succeeded? That you chose death rather than fighting to be there for her?

I'm sorry if this sounds harsh, but the reality is that once you die there is no coming back, and it may seem to you sometimes that the emptiness and release of death is something that you would welcome, however the way you felt, and the way you feel isn't going to last forever. It's finding the balance between the right meds and the right support for you.

You have so much to look forward to, seeing your dd grow up, becoming a complete pita as a teenager hmm etc. she needs you.

I hope that you keep posting on your thread, and know that we are all here for you, and that we all want you to improve and feel well again.

I reached rock bottom mentally earlier this year. Not to the extent that you have, but my gp was brilliant, changing my ad's, but only giving me a week at a time so that I had to go and see him, arranging therapy etc. and I now feel totally different to 3 months ago (thank goodness).

Look after yourself. Hugs.

GracieLoo Mon 20-May-13 19:41:59

Thank u, think it has taken me to hit rock bottom, I didn't want it to be like this though. Guess I've just gone about things in the wrong way.

Not on such a high anymore, I know I'm really tired, fuzzy headed and the rest. Also been completely rejected by dd sad My fault, I know, and probably a normal reaction, but feel I've been stabbed in the heart and ruined our bond forever.


How old is your dd?

GracieLoo Mon 20-May-13 19:45:05

4 and a bit.

She must be so mixed up. And not understand what's going on.

She just needs you to be there, and for you to be stable. even though you ended up in hospital at least you phoned the ct and then an ambulance. so that sense of self preservation must have kicked in. That sense of wanting a future.

You need to regain her trust, to stop pushing her away. To try to be consistent.

You owe it to yourself. Have faith in yourself. Push those negative thoughts and voices away. Try not to listen to them. Do something that will make you happy. Make tentative plans for the future. Anything, even if it is to speak to a friend, or take your dd to the park.

Try to remind yourself of all the good things you've done, and will do again.

I tell myself, I have a family who all love me. Friends who have been there for me for years, sometimes even decades. A job I hate. But at least it's a job. And it pays ok. I want to get a dog (I know this sounds heartless, but I can't get a dog until my elderly cat dies. It wouldn't be fair on her. She's 16, and she's had a lovely healthy life). And at some point I might even be able to retire (hopefully before I'm 80wink). Great. The cat has just snotted on my iPad. The joys of elderly catsgrin

Baby steps. Don't try to do too much too soon. Take care.

Thurlow Mon 20-May-13 20:12:44

Gracie, you sound so positive. It's fantastic to hear, after the past few weeks, that you feel as though you can see a way forward. I'm so sorry that you had to hit so far down to get this turnaround, but it's so positive that you do feel slightly better today.

You haven't been rejected by your DD. Kids do this, they decide to have nothing to do with one parent for no reason at all - yesterday DD refused to have anything to do with DP and wailed whenever I left the room. She's had a long weekend with her dad and is a bit focused on him, that is all.

Come back and tell us how things are going over the next few days.

Hoophopes Mon 20-May-13 21:02:51

Children get used to routines. With you being in hospital and at day hospital recently she has had changes to her normal routines from when you worked so she is probably confused. Young children cannot understand their routines changing and who is looking after them so easily as older children. If you can try not to catastrophise and say it is permanent. I doubt it is, she just needs extra reassurance from you right now that you are still there, just like you have needed extra support from CT recently etc.

GracieLoo Mon 20-May-13 21:13:56

Her routine hasn't really changed, her childcare arrangements have stayed the same, day hospital has fit around nursery or my mum has her which she's used to. This weekend was just an extra night with her dad so that shouldn't traumatise her.

I think it's more the emotional side of stuff. No matter how much I try, I don't always feel that close to her. I cuddle her, give kisses, read stories, but I think she senses I'm not feeling it deep inside. I was sobbing at the hospital earlier as I wanted to see her, but just went into her room to kiss her but feel nothing inside. The psychiatrist picked up that I'm unable to express emotion, I can put on a front but maybe dd senses I'm miles away when I should be so, so close. This is what I find so hard.

Hoophopes Mon 20-May-13 21:22:38

But the extra, unplanned night, may have unsettled her. As her father may have displayed emotional about it that she picked up on. And although your mum had her for day hospital unless she would normally have her all that time it may be enough with your distress recently to have unsettled her? Why not ask your HV if there are any support groups you can go to which help with bonding/parenting etc. know our sure start centre runs out you have to be invited to go to for instance. May help, worth an ask.

I was told it is all about "good enough" parenting and I found it helpful having professionals repeatedly reassure me I was doing a good enough job with my dc and they kept reinforcing that. SS told me that too, but can offer extra support due to illness etc which helped.

I think you're right. It's hard to be emotionally available to others, even your own dd, when you feel so emotionally vacant and bleak inside.

Just give it time. Be patient. The feeling will come back. That sense of 'detachment' will fade. But you have to work hard at trying to get better, trying to get your old self back.

I hope you are ok today Gracie.


SnowyMouse Tue 21-May-13 11:47:31

Hope day hospital is going ok, Gracie

TheSilveryPussycat Tue 21-May-13 12:40:10

gracie as I said upthread, your DD loves you with all her heart. And of course she missed you...

Not quite the same, perhaps, but with my own DD, then aged 20, we fell out during my divorce a year back, several times. We didn't stop loving each other though. Just because you don't think you are feeling it deep inside, does not mean it isn't there. And just because your DD has temporarily acted in a rejecting way, does Not mean that she does not love you with all her heart.

kerstina Tue 21-May-13 13:54:34

Gracie so glad to see you are back home smile Do you tell your daughter you love her and have missed her? Tell her it might be hard at first but worth it.
Why don't you write all your emotions,thoughts and feelings on a blog or write a book. You have clearly described on here what you have been through lately and I think it would really help other people experiencing similar difficulties and to help medical professionals understand what people go through. You are really good at writing and expressing yourself on here. Perhaps write a lovely letter to your dd telling her how much you love her and are looking forward to spending time with her through the summer.

GracieLoo Tue 21-May-13 17:38:43

Feel like so much has happened today and it's too much to take in. Went to day hospital, was told I'd have a chat with the nurse. She knew I had to leave at 1.30 so at 1.20 she came and found me. Said I'm still being discharged tomorrow from ct too. I said I was going to ask if I could stay a few more days, but she said she didn't think it would help. I knew this would happen, and I said I knew I shouldn't have been referred. They say they'll put lots of support in place and be there to talk, then they say they're not there to provide therapy and I've got to take responsibility for myself.

I know I've got to help myself, but the whole point of being under cmht or ct is because I'm not thinking straight and not looking after myself, and I don't know why. One minute they say I'm ill, then they say I'm a responsible adult, basically snap out of it! Feel when I'm in need the most they turn their backs.

Anyway, I've made an effort with dd, we've been to a cafe, to the library and now she's painting. But I've always had a call from social services. The hospital referred me. I was shaking, but the lady was lovely and instead of being scared I feel relieved I'm going to get help. She said they can help with the mh side of stuff too. The only thing worrying me is if they contact dd's dad, as he won't understand and will use it against me.

Also today, without my knowledge, my HV has arranged a meeting with my mum and I think, my cpn. I phoned HV to talk to her, that's how I found out, she asked if I wanted to be there but I don't. Also have to inform dd's nursery that they'll get a call the ss.

So, not sure how I feel, exhausted, confused, pissed off, relieved, worried and scared. Not a clue what's going to happen. Already feeling very paranoid. Going to get fish and chips as a treat for tea, but feel things like that will go against me. What if dd hurts herself, or someone sees me telling her off?! Can't deal with all this on top of everything else, but I know it's all my fault in the first place.

Could write a book! Theres an idea! Been turned down for ESA so need money from somewhere.

GracieLoo Tue 21-May-13 17:44:49

God sorry for essay! Also wanted to add, I do tell dd I love her and miss her all the time. And I feel bit funny today, physically, it's probably to be expected, but keep feeling really lightheaded and got pins and needles in my hands. Been eating and drinking but feel quite ill. Do I need to be worried, I am a bit about the pins and needles?

Hoophopes Tue 21-May-13 17:46:02

So glad you able to do some nice things with dd and that there is hope of support from the nice lady from SS.

SnowyMouse Tue 21-May-13 17:52:33

You can always ask if the pins and needles and lightheadedness could be side effects if you are worried about it.

I hope SS prove helpful, sounds like you've done some nice things with DD.

I'm surprised that they're arranging a meeting without you knowing, hope it works out.

GracieLoo Tue 21-May-13 17:55:56

They mentioned it a while ago and would I be ok with it. But I didn't know she was going to ring her today, and no one rang me to tell me it had been arranged. Hope things don't get worse.

SnowyMouse Tue 21-May-13 18:14:48

Ahhh, that's ok then.

Are you on any meds Gracie?

GracieLoo Tue 21-May-13 19:12:52

Yeah, but because of Saturday, I ran out and haven't taken any since, but picking them up in the morning. I'm trying not to think about things as I know I'm going to panic. Wish i'd never ever told anyone in the first place.

TheSilveryPussycat Tue 21-May-13 19:36:20

I understand your wish, but we on here beg to differ grin

One day at a time, sadly there is no magic wand or ruby slippers, there is a yellow brick road though, for you to trudge, walk, skip and then dance along.

Hoophopes Tue 21-May-13 19:37:31

If you struggle when discharged from CT you can always call your CMHT during office hours and ask to talk to the duty worker as obviously your own cpn may be seeing other people, but they should have someone there on duty all day.

You say that "They say they'll put lots of support in place and be there to talk, then they say they're not there to provide therapy and I've got to take responsibility for myself." It might be worth asking people what they mean as if people are not specific it may not be helping and giving you unrealistic expectations. They could have meant "talk" as in asking for advice about how to get through the day, medication support etc. Day centres and CT's don't do therapy, that is the role of CMHT's etc.

When you meet with the SS lady do talk to her about money concerns as well, they may be able to help. Such as funding for nursery care if you cannot have your dd on your own. Also I made the mistake of trying to persuade them I did so much for my dc that they said, oh you do so much we can't offer anymore!!

GracieLoo Tue 21-May-13 20:06:13

This has been my biggest fear for four years than ss are involved. It confirms I'm failing as a mum. I think it's all going to go wrong.

On a positive note dd has been good, and we've had a nice day.

SnowyMouse Tue 21-May-13 20:37:11

You might think differently if you take your meds more regularly, they take time to start working for you.

TheSilveryPussycat Tue 21-May-13 20:43:50

If you've been turned down for ESA you can appeal (must be within a month (I think) of decision - you will need the help of a professional though, like the CAB, and some evidence (which CAB can ask for on your behalf), the best would be a letter from your consultant psych, I actually think you may have good grounds for getting into the Support Group on the grounds that even seeking work would be detrimental to your mh.

I used to work for CAB (have I said that before, not sure), am out of date but have more advice via PM if it would help.

Hoophopes Tue 21-May-13 20:54:06

Taking meds regularly will help your moods.

SS being involved is not because you are failing. If you think about it logically you have been telling people you want to end your life, you have taken two OD's and are asking and needing more help. It is not about failing. You have been trying to communicate to people that you need more help and you cannot cope alone.

People have heard you.

It happens to be that help comes in different ways. One will be the meeting with your next of kin (your mother). Having been in a+e twice they need to know what the plan is if you are not able to care for your dd. Another way is through assessment with SC. As I was told by my cpn, SC have much more budgets as they can provide care.

It may be worth having a financial check as well, to ensure your ex is paying enough, for any benefits you are entitled to. Whilst you can still claim sick pay it is worth being signed off work and not resign.

Remember you are asking for help and this is how help is provided if you involve services, rather than asking friends and family. Although scary it is what you have been wanting. It may take some time (paperwork always does!)

In the next few days why not ask friends to be with you or your family?

Hoophopes Tue 21-May-13 21:04:38

Just been reading your last posts to see if can help you with some of what you have been told.

"They say they'll put lots of support in place and be there to talk, then they say they're not there to provide therapy and I've got to take responsibility for myself.I know I've got to help myself, but the whole point of being under cmht or ct is because I'm not thinking straight and not looking after myself, and I don't know why. One minute they say I'm ill, then they say I'm a responsible adult, basically snap out of it! Feel when I'm in need the most they turn their backs."

- what I think they are trying to say is that because you took an OD whilst under the Day Hospital it did not work for you so there is no point continuing it, as it didn't help you. Day Hospitals and indeed inpatient psych hospitals are not places that provide therapy at all. You are still under the CMHT because you have mental ill health. The CT is a short term treatment offered, to monitor safety and risk asses, which the CMHT will use as and when they think it is of use to you. It can never be long term. The CMHT offers a care plan and may now work with SC to provide support for your family. You can be ill and a responsible adult. All CMHT's are helping people towards recovery - some have renamed themselves recovery teams in fact. They are not turning their back. However, you have shown that you are not very stable and have not benefitted much from the Day Hospital due to what you said and did when under them, so they are not going to offer you something that has made you worse.
- When they say take responsibility for yourself, that means take medications, eat, drink, good sleep hygiene etc. Keep safe. If you cannot take responsibility for yourself then they will not think you can take care of a young child, so they are wanting you to keep responsible to keep your family unit together. The aim of CMHT's is to give people support to be independent. They will want you to find support from friends and family - if you say you haven't enough, that is when they will look what else is available throught the SC system (perhaps through adult or children's services depending on whether they class you as a vulnerable adult or not)

Feel free to ignore what I have written, I was just trying to help you as you sound very confused. I may be totally wrong - just ask your professionals. Do not think that because you may only see someone one hour a week that they don't care. Use your support system around you as much as possible, rather than relying on Mh professionals so you do not have to fear professionals letting you down.

SnowyMouse Tue 21-May-13 21:11:23

Very well written post

GracieLoo Tue 21-May-13 23:01:48

I need to sleep but I can't, I'm too worried about everything. Your posts make me see things from another perspective. I think I'm in my own messed up bubble, and not thinking logically about things. I need to tell myself I want to get better, I need to use the techniques, it's just hard, was sat in a 'coping skills' group today, we had to set ourselves a task, and how we can achieve it etc. I found it hard, mind went blank, I wanted to but couldn't so felt really stupid.

I want to take dd and run away somewhere far away, somewhere where family aren't phoning each other up worrying, crying and discussing me, where there aren't people who don't know me are deciding whether I'm being a good enough mum or not, where I'm not 'mental' and don't get judged by anyone. It will be hot and sunny and we don't have to see anyone, we can start a new life.

I'm so fed up of pills, appts, crying, feeling like shut all of the time. I've made things so much worse, I am starting to wish I had succeeded at the weekend, but a small part of me wants to fight this for dd. If I lose her then that's it. I'm going to be so careful what I say now, think I've been too honest. This is going to effect a lot, it will be on lots of records, her new school will be informed - this is not how I has imagined life would turn out.

GracieLoo Tue 21-May-13 23:04:35

Ha obviously shut was meant to be shit! And the pins and needles are getting worse?! Wish I could switch my brain off for the night.

Hoophopes Wed 22-May-13 00:02:21

Hope you been able to sleep now. Keep being honest to get the support you need. What you have done is written down, yes but you may as well use that to get the help and extra support you want.

When you are managing better yourself, not asking for extra help etc the appointments will be less because you will need less. You know, deep down, I think, that you want to be ok otherwise you would not have called an ambulance or told the CT about the od. Remember that although you may not have gone about things in the easiest of ways and yes people are going to know things that you would rather not know, you are ill and need help. Be honest with your HV and SC lady, that is where real help and support is found - in some ways more than MH people who have limited resources as you have found already.

This is a phase, an episode, things may settle down really much quicker than you can possibly imagine and you may even be back at work.

The next few weeks may be hard, you may not like hearing what people say about you. But you can change, their words will change. Accept if you can you need MH, SC and family involved now but with support that will change.

Hoophopes Wed 22-May-13 00:05:43

By the way the last post you wrote was the most logical you have been for a while, which is encouraging. You know you need to have those meetings, get the support in place for your dd. you are right, you have to take responsibility, use the techniques and not want others to do it for you as otherwise you will continue how you have been. But let your ex, your mum, your friends help as well as services whilst you need extra help. This episode will not last forever!

GracieLoo Wed 22-May-13 08:56:28

So tired I feel ill. Not in a good mood today, feeling defensive and angry, not good really, I don't think that's the real me. But I feel so angry about everything, want to blame others, but deep down I'm angry and hateful towards myself.

TheSilveryPussycat Wed 22-May-13 09:33:41

Take it slow and gentle. There is no blame. Have a nap if you need it. Early days on the road to recovery.

kerstina Wed 22-May-13 09:53:19

Perhaps write it down if you are angry all about what is making you feel it. Don't think you are not allowed to feel anger, you are and it will not hurt anybody writing it down. It will be therapeutic for you I think you need to let it out. Correct me if I am wrong but I read somewhere that depression can be caused by repressed anger?

GracieLoo Wed 22-May-13 09:59:09

Crying and I don't know why. Can't have a nap as last day at day hospital then picking up dd and her friend. Will take them to a park. Just feel so sad, what if I've already damaged dd now and she's going to be like me? Really worried about her, can feel paranoia and panic setting in. Will give the pills a chance to work, didn't notice a difference when I was taking them properly for a good while, but maybe it can be increased.

TheSilveryPussycat Wed 22-May-13 10:14:51

Can you somehow see the panic and paranoia as separate from you? Acknowledge they are there: however, act as if they are not. You have a plan for the day, it sounds like a good one.

Ilikethebreeze Wed 22-May-13 12:22:01

I think you need to get the anger out.
kerstina, I have seen that written somewhere too.
I do think that is right, in some cases of depression.
I think it is probably right in Gracie Loo's case.
I think pills can help people like Gracie Loo cope, but it doesnt cure the problem, just sort of covers it over.

SnowyMouse Wed 22-May-13 16:25:08

Been thinking of you today Gracie

GracieLoo Wed 22-May-13 18:41:23

Not a good day, not a lot has happened with regards to ss etc, but just a hard day.

SnowyMouse Wed 22-May-13 18:44:39

What was hard?

cjel Wed 22-May-13 19:04:22

gracie, have had no laptop for a week and now only have this for an hour before another week with out. Just want to say i'm sorry you are having a tough week and although i can't ppost, i am thinking of you and hope you will have a better week this week,xxxxxxxxx

GracieLoo Wed 22-May-13 22:00:55

cjel are you an inpatient somewhere? Or on a nice holiday? Hopefully the latter, come and let me know how you are when you can. Thanks for your lovely post.

Had my meeting with cpn and nurse at day hospital. Was handed a leaflet for an alchohol support group confused Don't think i'm an alchoholic. My cpn said she is going to push for psychology to be sooner rather than later, will refer me for drop in clinics/groups in the meantime, seeing consultant pyschiatrist next week who really wants to see me to sort this out apparently, and cpn will be twice a week for a while. She said I am her priority patient at the moment - not sure if she's allowed to say that?! We also agreed that I maybe should have been admitted last week, and if I can recognise the signs next time ie stockpiling, isolating myself, ignoring advice and not able to keep myself safe, or don't want to be safe - to ask for an admission.

Anyway I felt so tired and emotionless by this point, I was a bit abrupt, and said I wished i'd never said anything, appreciate and will accept the support, but really would love to run away from it all. Maybe shouldn't be saying that stuff now!

Dd was awful again this afternoon, big temper tantrums and lot's of attitude and anger. I stayed patient, offered hugs, don't have a clue how to handle it really. Spoke to her nursery though and they said they had no concerns and will support us through this. But when she's like this, and asking to go to grandma's, I feel the negative stuff again. sad

kerstina Wed 22-May-13 22:18:48

What sets off her temper tantrums ? Just remember children can be difficult regardless.It sounds like you are being very patient and handling it well to me.It could be unconnected to you, she might be coming down with something or just be really tired and if she did not enjoy her day at nursery could be venting on you. My DS always wants to go to nannys as she spoils him!

Hoophopes Wed 22-May-13 22:20:25

Hey although things not been great you got good outcomes. A Cpn replaced straight away and two slots a week is rare I think. Plus up the list for psychology. Offer of support groups. And allowed to ask for inpatient admission if you think it will help. ( some places guard their beds as well and not sure how many people would be able to ask for inpatient and be listened to). So hope that helps reassure you that people are listening to you right now and the help is there to move you forwards.

I would think your dd's behaviour was normal for her age. I was told to meet with other mums in groups etc as by meeting and sharing with others you can find out what is normal. Am afraid mine not at talking stage yet.

Could you ask your nice HV for help with dd, or reassurance if this behaviour continues? Also many children see grandparents and ask to see them, does not mean rejecting you perhaps just they missing other important people in their life.

TheSilveryPussycat Wed 22-May-13 22:27:19

gracie good thing you couldn't help being honest... It sounds like the cavalry are arriving anyway, and that they have a much better idea of how bad things got for you, and how much support you need.

You've done well with DD, both with the calm and hugs, and with keeping nursery in the loop.

We all of us, all we parents I mean, feel negative stuff from time to time. It's just that you are noticing that it's a little like the other, ill health, negative stuff. Don't make the mistake of thinking that being in recovery means always being calm and sussed!

GracieLoo Wed 22-May-13 22:29:52

She gets really tired, and not getting on with a little friend from nursery which I know is upsetting her. I just feel I'm not able to comfort her, or say the right things. Think all I do is make things worse. I don't even know if she does love me.

I'm trying, I really am. Got some books to try to read as a distraction, too tired tonight though. I didn't watch a programme that can trigger emotions and urges. I've cleaned a bit, but get getting a bit muddled and distracted, then feel agitated it's not clean enough and there's other stuff to be doing. My brain needs to give me a break sometimes. Also I haven't drunk, as I wasn't sure if I could anyway after what happened. Scared of feeling so bad, so pretending it never happened but I know inside the bad thoughts are so near the surface, and they can't take over again otherwise I'll lose everything. Need to sleep now.

Hoophopes Wed 22-May-13 22:47:09

Sleep well x

SnowyMouse Thu 23-May-13 16:36:32

Hi Gracie, how's it going?

GracieLoo Thu 23-May-13 18:29:06

A bit down, negative feelings resurfacing again. Don't feel like myself today, so tired all the time.

Went to the children's centre this morning for some advice, but feel like i'm talking about someone else. They said there's lot's of support they can offer too, but there was a meeting today with hv, my mum, cpn and social worker. I was asked to attend but not made to, and I declined. Don't feel strong enough at the moment. Have to attend the next one though. I just feel there's so much happening at once, and I can't make sense of it all.

SnowyMouse Thu 23-May-13 18:42:24

It probably helps if you can go, it might even reassure you that people want to work with you. It must be tough for you.

GracieLoo Thu 23-May-13 19:05:07

It wasn't until after it took place, I thought it probably looked bad I didn't go. But feel things are too raw for me to sit for two hours listening to people talking about my issues etc.

Just got this tight knot in my stomach, don't know if it's fear, regret, embarrassment? Maybe all those things and more. I think I'm scared nothing will/can help. How can anything help? I don't get it. If I feel such emptiness and sadness then how can anyone, including me, fix that? I've had a lot of help in the past, and seen others move on and get better. Maybe this is just me, and now I'm in a bigger mess that I can't get out of.

Hoophopes Thu 23-May-13 19:13:54

Great you were able to go to the children's centre and them offer help as well. Perhaps seeing the psychiatrist for medication review will really help too, to help make you feel more able to use the help.

Ilikethebreeze Thu 23-May-13 20:37:58

You do need to go if you can. Even for half an hour.
They may all be able to help you.

I know your brain seems to play tricks on you, and it is very good at turning positives into negatives.
So your brain starts to think, "help, panic,shame" etc etc.
Instead of ,"thank you, relief,they care about me, I may get help" etc.
You need to see that your brain is wrong [and no that does not mean it will be wrong for ever and ever], and basically do the opposite when your brain starts to panic.

SnowyMouse Thu 23-May-13 21:09:26

They will be likely to talk about things to help the here and now, not very indebth if that helps.

GracieLoo Fri 24-May-13 08:41:42

Feeling really angry about everything again, going to lose it at the slightest thing. Got no motivation, this is rubbish!

Ilikethebreeze Fri 24-May-13 09:04:05

I think you need to sort out the anger.
You need to seperate out the stuff you should feel angry about,from other stuff.
I think you would find it helpful to literally list all the things you feel angry about, in the first instance.

SnowyMouse Fri 24-May-13 12:06:36

Just keep communicating with people

GracieLoo Fri 24-May-13 12:58:43

Seeing cpn in a bit, don't know how I feel really, just nothing. Everything seems unreal, and I've got this pain in my head, not like a normal headache, like a pressure that makes me feel a bit spaced out. Maybe it's the meds getting back into my system, don't know.

Now people know a lot more and there's lots of talk about what support can be provided, I don't feel like I want it all. I know the main priority is dd, so this all needs to happen. I had a day or so last weekend when I thought I didn't want to end it and was scared about what I did, but I'm having those thoughts again. Haven't got as far as planning or anything but if I do, I'll have to say something, everyone will know, and I'll probably end up in hospital for a long time. My head hurts so much.

Ilikethebreeze Fri 24-May-13 13:06:09

Why dont you want the support?

SnowyMouse Fri 24-May-13 13:07:03

Some people are only in hospital for a few nights. Ask about ways to help with the things you are struggling with at the moment, e.g. DD's care, care of yourself, suicidal thoughts/ideation, intrusive thoughts, feeling things aren't real etc. - it might help to make a list. Good luck with CPN

kerstina Fri 24-May-13 13:07:50

What support don't you want ?
I think I know what you mean about the pressure in head feeling. I get that when I am stressed like I can feel the tension. I sometimes worry my blood pressure could be up.

GracieLoo Fri 24-May-13 13:12:03

I don't know what support will be offered, that's why I'm not sure of things. Maybe I will make a list. All I want to do is sleep for a week.

Hoophopes Fri 24-May-13 17:26:11

Well why not list all the support you have so far and can use.What you have told us, if I remember right is:
CPN twice a week
DD in nursery some of the time
Mum now more aware
HV aware and supportive person and knows you from before
Social Care becoming involved
Some friends help with practical things like collecting dd from nursery
Some childcare from your Mum
DD's dad has her some nights a month

Then think about what other support is needed, and I mean practical support day to day to help you and your dd be safe and move forwards. Do you want some support from Children's Centre - such as groups to go to, a support worker. Ask Social Worker when you meet what help they can provide with dd in particular. why not list what help you may need on a day to day basis.

Would a care plan be helpful - ie one that says if struggling what you should do with your dd.... take her to your mum's or her dad's or a friends etc. Phone certain people who can visit you, such as Mum or a friend etc. Have you nominated anyone to have your dd if you cannot cope or are seen as not coping at any time? Would it be your dm or your ex? Might be worth putting it in writing if it is not agreed so you get what you want for dd if you end up in hospital or deteriorate and are not seen as being able to make decisions.

What activiy groups or drop in centres could you acces. What groups was your CPN going to suggest. Do you need help with childcare to access those groups?

GracieLoo Fri 24-May-13 20:51:24

Getting reluctant to keep posting on here, even though it helps to get it out and listen to advice and experiences. It's just I feel as though i'm coming across as selfish and stubborn. I don't want to be like that, I am confused right now, and sometimes when I think i'm doing the right thing, it's obviously not judging by people's reactions.

Saw cpn, didn't really feel like talking much today, felt too tired and heady. But then found out she rang my mum after to let her know how the appt went, and also to give her carer info. Now I know at the moment, there is concern about dd, and there are a lot of people now involved, but I feel I can't say anything now. As anything will be shared with others. I feel I have no control, independence or privacy. This makes to want to retract further, and hide how I am really feeling. I also don't like having a 'carer', makes me feel crap, and I hate all the stress and worry i'm putting people through. Feel like it would be better for everyone if I wasn't here. It doesn't matter how many times i'm told i'm loved and I will get better, I don't believe it and I don't know why.

GracieLoo Fri 24-May-13 21:43:31

Everything's just hit me and I can't stop crying. Got all this support yet never felt more alone.

Ilikethebreeze Fri 24-May-13 21:57:19


kerstina Sat 25-May-13 09:37:44

Gracie you are being far to hard on yourself. You are not coming across as selfish or stubborn at all. We are all just trying to make suggestions. I can understand how you feel I am sure I would feel the same but try and remember how you felt last sunday/monday. Try and remember as I think that was the real you. Now the illness and negative talking is trying to take over. Don't let it.

kerstina Sat 25-May-13 09:40:21

I dont know why they have to put labels like carer either. They should change that word.

SnowyMouse Sat 25-May-13 15:31:49

You're not coming across as selfish and stubborn.

GracieLoo Sat 25-May-13 18:46:56

Feel so uncomfortable that everything's out in the open. I feel like the crazy one in the family. I'm so used to having secrets and leading two lives, I don't know how to handle this situation. I find myself putting on more of a front to try and reassure people. But it's exhausting.

Coping right at this moment with keeping suicidal stuff under control, but if it gets the slightest bit worse I'm going to ask for crisis team, and admission if it gets like last week. Right now trying to convince others, and myself, I'm ok. Although I do lie awake at night wishing there was a considerate way to end this. Head is so muddled still, and really want a drink, but fighting the urge.

Ilikethebreeze Sat 25-May-13 22:15:03

When a person has depression, it is not always possible to rely on what your brain thinks.
In the past you have been trying to think your way out of things, but it is not really possible to do that.

GracieLoo Sun 26-May-13 11:56:30

Feeling anxious today, scared to see anyone. This nice weather should help, but it actually makes things worse as I should be enjoying it but I just want to go to bed. I'm not though, going out for lunch. To those who say I'm not trying to help myself, I am! It's just fucking hard and I hate who I've become. Missing dd this weekend too.

SnowyMouse Sun 26-May-13 13:30:36

It can help if you set yourself small tasks, maybe starting with 'be nice to yourself' goals, or distraction. How about a nice 15-30 minute walk somewhere after lunch? Lunch is a good start.

SugarandSpice126 Sun 26-May-13 14:47:32

I've just read this whole thread, and I've never talked to you, but I don't think you are selfish or an outsider point of view, I think you're doing the best you can right now, and that's all anyone can ask.. You're still here, despite everything, and still fighting. I think a lot of people in your situation would hate asking for help etc, so I think that's normal (certainly is for me, and I don't feel as bad as you). You're not a bad person. You are doing everything you can and you will make it through this. I'm immensely proud of you, and like I said, I've only just read all this! Every day you're here is a victory, and a sign you can do this - each time you wake up (no matter how crap you feel) is a mark of your strength. Sorry if this all sounds so cheesy, but had to say it.. One day you'll be able to look back on this time and feel pride that you managed to fight through it, despite everything. So please keep going, it's such a cliche but things WILL get better

TheSilveryPussycat Sun 26-May-13 22:46:39

I too am not happy with the word 'carer' which somehow manages to imply that one cannot look after oneself at all! Helper, or caring supporter, might be better.

And to care for someone can mean just the emotion of caring about them, which further confuses the issue. You are surrounded by caring people, and we on the thread care about you.

This is your thread to say what you like, including talking about your feelings in whatever way you want. Many understand the ambivalence and, dare I say it, shame, of receiving help, but actually it is nothing to be ashamed of, and is, I would say, something to accept in the spirit in which it is offered. Sometime in the future, I dare say you yourself will in turn be supporting others who need it.

Take it easy, take it slow. Hope you had a nice lunch smile

SnowyMouse Mon 27-May-13 15:24:43

Hope your day is going ok, been thinking of you Gracie

GracieLoo Mon 27-May-13 16:34:27

Just thinking what is the point? Feel completely fed up and stressed. Hate, hate, hate bank holidays.

GracieLoo Mon 27-May-13 16:37:50

And thank you for the reassurance that I don't always come across as selfish and ungrateful, I'm aware sometimes I probably am, but don't want to be. Got lots of appts this week so hoping things will be put in place, will ask about some of the things suggested to me, where dd will go if things get worse, when psychology will start, what others groups can happen in the meantime and help with finances.

SnowyMouse Mon 27-May-13 19:45:32

I hope your appointments all help you work out what you need to.

TheSilveryPussycat Mon 27-May-13 20:07:24

gracie feelings are complex and not cut and dried, aren't they. I'm remembering that I have felt simultaneously thankful and resentful at having to accept help.

As I am retired, Bank Holidays mean little to me. And am having a little life glitch, nothing serious, so spent most of today in bed anyway!

Hoophopes Mon 27-May-13 22:42:05

Hi, if you can try and ignore the labels... They have to use something so everyone in the NHS knows what they are referring to and avoiding confusion. Not ideal word though.

Great you have lots of appointments, hope not too stressful and you can say what you want. Would taking a pen and notebook help you, even if it is to make a few bullet point notes before hand if you need to refer to them or for writing down afterwards what's was agreed or is happening next, to avoid confusion? Sorry for a badly worded sentence!!

Hoophopes Mon 27-May-13 22:47:34

Oh if it helps all people under a Cpn should have a career identified and they should be offered a carer's info pack and a carer's assessment if they request one. It is not unusual and should be done as good practice so perhaps the fact you just changed Cpn has made the Cpn realise this not done for you? Often the person is a partner or husband or nearest relative.

I was in hospital recently for physical ill health and one of the first questions they asked me was who was my named next of kin, who should they contact.

GracieLoo Tue 28-May-13 12:04:10

Waiting to see psych, feeling tearful today but not been able to cry. Scared, the bad feelings have been coming back but I'm too worried to say anything now as it will be shared with family and that makes me uncomfortable. Plus those feelings make me feel so guilty as dd is being clingy, so I've got all these conflicting thoughts in my head and I don't know what to do.

Doesn't help, the clinic is opposite a train station so I always think about it, iykwim. I don't know what it would be like to have nice thoughts and have a normal day, maybe it is my fault I'm not like my friends.

SnowyMouse Tue 28-May-13 12:58:09

Be thinking of you, Gracie. I hope your appointment goes well, when you're feeling a bit better you can always draw back a little on what your family know.

Ilikethebreeze Tue 28-May-13 13:01:39

Depression is not your fault.
The depression is what makes thoughts go wonky.

So you know that the real you does not want to do anything, but the depression makes your brain sometimes think you do.

It becomes a matter of stepping back from your depressive thoughts iykwim. Disowning them.

GracieLoo Tue 28-May-13 13:07:01

The appt felt like a waste of time, the psychiatrist heard the sandwich van so rushed to finish it after 20 mins! Cpn then asked if I wanted to say anything else to her but I just felt stupid and in the way so I said I just wanted to go home and cry, and I am. Sobbing in my bed and I don't know why. Miss my old cpn, I could have been more honest with her, so annoyed with myself I can't open up to new people.

Anyway, the meds were increased, she asked if I wanted psychology, she was told I'm on waiting list (doesn't she read notes!). Felt all the decisions and suggestions cpn had were dismissed by the psych so that's left me a bit confused and less confident about the cpn.

Feel I've got backwards again. So angry with myself. Want to speak to someone but even with all the support, haven't a clue who to ring who I feel comfortable with. HV is coming round, but to see dd so can't talk infront of dd. Not in a good frame of mind now.

Ilikethebreeze Tue 28-May-13 13:11:13

I cant quite make out from this whether you have told the cpn and the psych everything. Whether you hold back information?

Ilikethebreeze Tue 28-May-13 13:12:20

And please forgive my ignorance, but is pshchology the same as psychotherapy?
And have you had either of them before at all?

GracieLoo Tue 28-May-13 13:18:08

They know everything, there's nothing more I can tell them now. The only thing I don't say is I miss my old cpn and can't open up to the new one as I don't want to hurt her feelings.

Has psychology before, waiting for it again. Not sure if it's the same as psychotherapy actually? My minds all muddled at the moment, think I used to know the difference.

Want to ask my mum to keep dd for the afternoon and ask HV to postpone, but this will worry them more.

Ilikethebreeze Tue 28-May-13 13:24:39

Can you have a sleep before your DD arrives?
A couple of times you have said on here that you want to sleep for a week.
Sleep is important and helpful.

Hoophopes Tue 28-May-13 13:31:50

Hi a 20min appointment is actually how much time here psychiatrists allocate per appointment, so you did have your whole appointment. A psych diagnoses and does medication, they do not do talking therapy so sounds like an ok appointment even though you may have hoped for more. The CMHT are the ones that can suggest another things, but all things often have waiting lists.

Your HV may have some suggestions for you for day to day help, so hope you can ask.

Hoophopes Tue 28-May-13 13:33:16

Can you ask HV for a follow up appointment for just you and her to talk?

GracieLoo Tue 28-May-13 13:41:47

Maybe I did expect too much from the appt, probably because it's been booked for a couple of months, and I kept getting told, 'wait until your psych appt' or 'at least you've got that appt to talk things through and things can get sorted'. There seemed to be a lot expected from it (especially from family, they want quick fix and answers and I'm not finding it helpful at all), so I feel a bit disappointed.

Haven't got long enough for a sleep now, but I better stop moaning and sounding ungrateful now.

Hoophopes Tue 28-May-13 13:54:43

I have done the same Gracie, waited 4 months for an appointment to be told what medication do you want then, it is up to you?! You are not being ungrateful at all you are just finding out how useless psych appointments can be, or rather they cannot be a quick cure. I now never see a psych as the psych said once diagnosed they do not tend to do much, which is what I learnt too. Medication increase may help and they can change meds if not working or add things in etc.

I think as psych is in overall charge of care purely as dr it is good for them to see you but does not mean a magic wand can be waved.

I think you will get more practical help in day to day activities through HV and social care. My consultant referred me to social care as she said they Were the only ones with budget, resources or ability to refer for funding for things like support workers etc.

TheSilveryPussycat Tue 28-May-13 14:06:44

Yy to the coming out of psych appt and feeling frustrated after getting hopes up somewhat. But as Hoop says, there's a team of people all dealing with different aspects.

How long do your CPN home visits tend to be? Mine were an hour each time, I felt my CPN knew scads more about me and my situation than the psych. Of course it's hard with a new person, I say again, give her a chance, and actually you were v honest with her after the psych appt.

Well done for going ahead with your afternoon as planned, it also sounds like you understand more than your family does, of course they long for a quick fix, they love you smile

SnowyMouse Tue 28-May-13 14:41:36

Good luck with the HV, hopefully they'll talk about support for you and DD. psych appointments can be anti-climactic.

GracieLoo Tue 28-May-13 19:10:07

HV came round, was fine, don't think she went away with any more concerns, just said she has to keep an eye on when maybe i'm not well enough to care for dd. That scares me a bit, but understand why it has to be done.

She also mentioned again about dd not being my carer and people have to be aware of that. I don't get what she means by this, as dd doesn't do anything different from other children. The only thing is she is my protective factor, but she doesn't know this, and that the thought of her is enough to stop me ending it, most of the time anyway sad Other times, the thought that she's be better without me takes over.

Hoophopes Tue 28-May-13 19:40:25

Hi - sounds like you have a lovely hv there, who is prepared to see you and look out for you. Hope that reassures you, that right now she thinks you are well enough to care for your dd.

Why not ask the hv what she meant next time you see her? totally agree that having a child for me is a protective factor also.

GracieLoo Tue 28-May-13 21:38:10

Can feel myself slipping and I don't like it but can't control it. Been sleeping, eating and keeping busy but can feel i'm going to the same place again, and I don't know what to do!

Ilikethebreeze Tue 28-May-13 21:44:20

Do you think you have triggers?

GracieLoo Tue 28-May-13 22:08:10

Not that I can think of, and that's what hard, I don't know why. I've seen people, haven't stayed in bed, been thinking about jobs, but it all feels fake and I know really I don't want to be here anymore. It feels normal to me to have these thoughts, even though it's horrible and I know it's wrong, especially where dd's concerned.

Hoophopes Tue 28-May-13 22:21:28

Do you know what helps you when you are like this? Or what can help you not get to acting in what your brain is saying?

For me keeping busy and active helps, for others resting may help. I find having the tv on helps, even if I cannot focus on it. Having a structure for the day helps. So tonight I have just written out what foods my dc is going to eat tomorrow, what I am roughly doing every 2hr slot (breakfast and play, play group, lunch, shops and library) to help me. I do not need to be seeing mental health professionals but just seeing people at playgroupmto say hello to, changing library books and saying hello to librarian will help me get through tomorrow and feel more grounded.

Sorry just thought would share what I have learnt can help. Everyone is different.

Hope you can sleep well and that tomorrow is better than you expected.

TheSilveryPussycat Wed 29-May-13 10:53:53

Morning gracie. Hope you are feeling a bit better.

GracieLoo Wed 29-May-13 17:05:54

Have taken dd to childrens centre then the cinema, but i've got this feeling like i'm about to lose it. Not so much getting irritated (although getting there!) but more like i'm not coping very well. I feel so muddled, and hate having to really think about what i've got to do next.

Keep finding myself planning to be on my own this weekend again, as it's getting too difficult again. I'm scared seeing cpn on friday but i'm worried i'm not going to be able to say what I need to say.

Realised a trigger today, seeing stories in the news about suicides.

SnowyMouse Wed 29-May-13 17:30:04

That sounds like a good day with DD, Gracie. Do keep talking with people.

SugarandSpice126 Thu 30-May-13 01:26:10

Keep going Gracie, stay active and plan your days so you have things to keep you going. You are coping, and you're still here. Those thoughts don't have to be actions. Keep going and keep posting here..we're all here to help you

GracieLoo Thu 30-May-13 08:32:33

Feel yuck, slept loads last night but kept waking up and have a headache. Got plans to keep dd amused today, and feeling less detached which is a good sign. But I feel I'm not doing her any good staying here and I'm worried loads about her-overly anxious now!

And have made plans to be alone sat, know it's not a good decision but get an overwhelming urge to be alone, maybe I just need to rest, but the urges to not be here are strong. I actually feel more selfish staying here and causing all this stress and hurt for everyone.

SugarandSpice126 Thu 30-May-13 11:25:06

Really glad you've got plans with dd, and that you're feeling less detached. It's not true to say you're not doing her any good. You're there for her and she knows you love her - that security will be the most important thing for her and nothing can replace it. Don't be anxious about her...children really don't need a lot - some food, attention, love....she's fine I promise. It's natural to worry.

I think you have to really fight those urges to be alone. You don't have to give into them - you can fight them. You might want something, but that does not mean you have to do it. Put some safeguards in place - maybe plan something to do on the Saturday. You can change that decision and make it a positive one.

I think sometimes you have to realise that those feelings you're having that it 's selfish to be here are not real. You're feeling them because you're so low, and you'd know they weren't really true if you felt better. Look at your daughter smiling - she needs her mum to be around and not leave her. In that dark place I know you think it's best for her, but she would grow up not understanding why her mother didn't stay for her. I'm not trying to guilt trip you here, I'm just trying to be truthful. She needs you to be around when she comes home from school, when she has her first job, when she marries, when she has her own children.. She needs you to support her through all that. If you're not there, who knows where her life might go.

I also have a friend who's mother committed suicide when she was 8. Her mother undoubtedly felt a lot of the things you did - a feeling that her daughter would be better off without her, that she was too much of a burden. All my friend feels is grief and confusion, and I don't think she's ever understood how her mother could leave her. I went to university with her, and whilst both my parents were there at graduation, she only had one. Please please don't let this be your daughter.

The stress and hurt for other people is nothing compared to what it would feel like if you kill yourself. You wouldn't feel anything, but everyone else would be in terrible pain, no matter what you think. People are trying to help because they care about you - the only thing you can do to help them is to keep on going, day by day, staying alive.

Sorry this is so ridiculously long - hope you manage to get through it. But if it helps even a tiny bit, it's worth it.

GracieLoo Thu 30-May-13 16:13:18

It does help thank you. I understand what you're saying, it just doesn't seem true to me that it's better to stay. It's so much harder to keep fighting, would be the easy way out to end it. I know people would be hurt, but I think it'll be forgotten in a couple of years and they'll move on. I want to be forgotten.

So, so tired, wanted to go to bed this afternoon but got dragged out, now feel so tired to deal with tea and bedtime, I feel like crying. Hate the fact I find everything hard work when others have so much more to deal with.

SugarandSpice126 Thu 30-May-13 18:30:51

I know...fighting is a hell of a lot harder than just giving up, but the results are so so worth it. I think you just have to have faith that things will get better. Easier said than done, and I'm rubbish at following my own advice, but keep saying it to yourself - 'things will get better and I will continue to fight this'.
Your daughter wouldn't forget you - and it's her you have to live for.

I am very familiar with the frustration/anger that everyone else can do things so much more easily and those who have bigger problems. Again, I'm so bad at believing this myself, but each person has their own struggles, and to you this is significant. That's all that matters. You don't need to compare your difficulties with others, it's just yours. Hope that makes sense.

Do you write mini lists of a few things you want to accomplish each day? Even really simple things. And make a list of what coping mechanisms you can turn to when things get bad. I can give you some m

SugarandSpice126 Thu 30-May-13 18:35:36

I know...fighting is a hell of a lot harder than just giving up, but the results are so so worth it. I think you just have to have faith that things will get better. Easier said than done, and I'm rubbish at following my own advice, but keep saying it to yourself - 'things will get better and I will continue to fight this'.
Your daughter wouldn't forget you - and it's her you have to live for.

I am very familiar with the frustration/anger that everyone else can do things so much more easily and those who have bigger problems have way more to deal with. Again, I'm so bad at believing this myself, but each person has their own struggles, and to you this is significant. That's all that matters. You don't need to compare your difficulties with others, it's just yours. Hope that makes sense.

Do you write mini lists of a few things you want to accomplish each day? Even really simple things. And make a list of what coping mechanisms you can turn to when things get bad. I can give you some more ideas if you'd find them helpful.

You're not alone in this and you are important. Wish I could make you realise that. Just keep going for now... It sounds as though you've been out today, which is really good, even if you're exhausted now.. Have you been able to think of any things you could do/people you could see on Saturday?

SugarandSpice126 Thu 30-May-13 18:36:51

Sorry must have accidentally sent the first message without finishing!

GracieLoo Thu 30-May-13 19:24:59

I do make lists when I have a few things that need doing, and I have to use a diary or I'd forget everything. Coping mechanisms are hard to think of when feeling so negative, but I do have a list of things to try.

I haven't plans at all this weekend now, as just had another blow. Have been seeing someone for a couple of months, we didn't meet at a good time for me and so I've taken things really slow but we've had evenings together and I've been able to forget about things slightly whilst I was with him. He was keen and could feel my confidence starting to grow and we talked about doing stuff in the future. At the back of my mind I thought how am I doing this dating stuff one eve, then in a&e the next, but I was hoping it would make me feel better as things progressed and I got well again. Anyway, we had plans for Friday or Sunday but he's just texted saying we've both got issues at the moment and he needs some time etc.

I had only told him I was on ad's and wasn't feeling that great when we met but was feeling better, kept it as light and vague as possible. But maybe I just give off this vibe. No one wants me. I don't know what I do wrong. So I was feeling on the edge when things were going ok for me relationship wise, so imagine how I feel now sad

Sorry for self indulgent post, mind you they all are!

TheSilveryPussycat Thu 30-May-13 19:57:42

gracie accept his need for time, who knows how he has been minimising his own condition. Don't overthink this!

sugar has said all the other stuff I wanted to say, I think. You are loved and needed here in this world. Keep strong, you are doing well one day at a time, that is all that is required for the time being.

Ilikethebreeze Thu 30-May-13 20:25:28

Was this the man who was a drug dealer?

Ilikethebreeze Thu 30-May-13 22:01:03
GracieLoo Thu 30-May-13 22:19:20

No I saw the drug dealer for two dates until I found out what he was like, that was a few months ago. Anyway, obviously painting a worse picture of myself so will leave this now.

Ilikethebreeze Thu 30-May-13 22:23:03

Hope your new man comes back on the scene for you.
Glad the other one is no longer in the picture.

SugarandSpice126 Thu 30-May-13 23:53:12

Gracie you're not painting a worse picture of yourself..we're not here to judge you or to tell you off, we're here to support you when you need us. You're safe to say whatever you need to say here.

I'm really sorry things have been rocky with new man recently. He might be struggling as much as you are, as Pussycat said, and minimising what's going on with him. You said you'd felt better when you were with him, but maybe it might be safer for you to focus on you for now. I think trying to develop a new relationship, with all the challenges that that brings on its own, may be too much. Does that make sense? I'm only saying this from personal experience - managing myself is enough without trying to build a relationship which might cause insecurities. I'm not saying he doesn't want you, it might just be too hard for both of you right now. Does that make sense? That's not to say I'd judge you for trying to make it work with him..the support of a partner can be critical..but just personally for me I think it may be added stress right now.

You're not a bad person're a good mum and a good person. Please don't think the opposite. Just keep on, day at a time, or hour by hour if you need to.

SugarandSpice126 Fri 31-May-13 00:01:31

By the way, I've come across this website before and I think it's really good for when you're feeling at your worst.
Hope that link works. It's worth a read I think. It's a passage of writing, easy to read, and really helpful.

GracieLoo Fri 31-May-13 08:57:25

I had a look at that link, will save it to refer back to when I need to, as it is very insightful.

Had a restless night as a lot on my mind. Getting more anxious about going out again, taking dd to park with a friend but would do anything not to. Want to cry but can't, I know when I do I won't stop. Bit worried that will be when I see my cpn later then I'll have the weekend to try to get through. Scared and low.

Still not heard from ss, might chase them up myself today. Never thought I'd be saying that!

TheSilveryPussycat Fri 31-May-13 09:12:52

Unexpectedly, it is sunny here atm. Hope it is where you are. Park sounds good - perhaps thinking about it is worse than actually doing it? Don't worry about crying in front of CPN, she'll have seen it all, and it is part of her job after all. Sending strength and love.

SnowyMouse Fri 31-May-13 20:11:49

Hope you've had a good day Gracie

GracieLoo Fri 31-May-13 21:03:07

Horrible day, really struggling and getting really scared about social services being involved. Feel I have to be careful about everything I say, and I can't open up to the new cpn, i've tried and I can't, then I come out of the appt and cry for ages as feel I can't talk to anyone and it's horrible. I did phone HV but there's only so much she can do, also opened up to a friend but she started crying so that made me feel awful.

I can't do this and really want to SH this weekend, but if I end up in a&e again then dd will probably be taken away from me, so that makes me feel I have to do it properly so I don't stay here. But I don't think I can go that far, i'm just in so much pain emotionally and see no way out, but I don't want to mess up dd's life. God i'm not making sense to myself, I don't know what to do. Feel very torn and terrified.

TheSilveryPussycat Fri 31-May-13 21:09:54

Holding out a hand to you gracie. Does it help to breathe slowly into the stomach? I always think it isn't going to work, but it usually does for me.

No point thinking about SS till after the weekend, as for the CPN, could you write something to show her? instead of trying to say stuff.

GracieLoo Fri 31-May-13 22:05:01

I keep going to write stuff down but then my mind goes blank. I keep crying now, nothing makes sense anymore.

I told cpn I felt irritable about things, especially about people being involved even though I know it's for the best. She said if I say that then it will be assumed I'm being irritable at dd too and she'll be a 'child in danger' instead of a 'child in need' and drastic measures will happen. She also said it's damaging her to see me crying, even after me saying I never cry infront of dd. She seemed shocked that I've taken dd places this week. I feel people are making assumptions and judging me and they don't know me! Dd is happier, brighter and healthier than most kids I know, and I never meant for this to happen, I don't want her labelled as a child in need, with a team of people around her. She's fine, and I think I'm doing the best for her even if I'm thinking bad thoughts about myself, her happiness is always in my thoughts, even if they are ill thoughts at the moment. She's always safe and with people who love her, I wouldn't leave her with no one to care for her. I didn't mean for it to end up like this, I've messed up big time.

Ilikethebreeze Fri 31-May-13 22:16:59

You are a great mum. I am glad that you can see that too.
And you havent messed up. It is just that silly brain of yours!
[tries some humour to help cheer Gracie up. Not much good at humour, so you are honoured].

TheSilveryPussycat Fri 31-May-13 22:53:21

The blank mind often happens when people go to write. The trick is to start writing anything, even if it's just swearing invective, or even writing 'I don't know what to write' can start you off. You can always edit later.

No wonder you aren't getting on with CPN as she seems to a) not believe what you say b) expect you to lie, or at least minimise. <sigh> All we can hope is that SS are a bit more understanding.

Sounds like you are doing a brilliant job with DD. Both my DC saw me in tears, I just explained that I felt v sad and didn't know why, and would get better. Mine was depression though, and it did vary quite a bit even over the same day, so was able to have some 'better' time after the 'sad' time. You are managing to have some 'better' time with DD, despite all.

Hoophopes Fri 31-May-13 22:59:58

Sending you big, safe hugs Gracie.

Try if you can to just focus on each day, getting through it. Because you have had a bad month or so does not mean that this episode will last forever. I really believe that, things can lift and change. Different medication doses can make all the difference, you being more open with people shows you are reaching out etc.

It is good you are doing nice things with your dd, hope they help you too. Sometimes life can be just about doing things, even if cannot fully enjoy them. Keep going Gracie, this time will past( I say that having been there and now the other side), just keep being honest and open and use the support and your mum etc.

Can you plan some nice things for next week, to aim towards. Do not have to be big things. For me next week I want to go to the park and try and take some photos of my dc for example to use for thank you cards etc!!


SugarandSpice126 Sat 01-Jun-13 00:39:39

You're a fantastic mum Gracie, don't let anyone tell you otherwise. You care for her, you make sure she's happy, and you make sure she has her basic needs met. That is all you need to be a good mother. As you say, your daughter smiles and is happy - that tells you/ss all you/they need to know. There are so many children going through real hardship with parents who abuse them, ignore them, etc etc...those are the bad parents. As long as a child feels loved and cared for, that's all they need. And she needs you to be around, not disappear. I bet she'll be so strong when she's older, just like you. SS just need to see that you will always put her first and make sure above everything that she is safe and loved. You are doing that now. Children really are so resilient...she will be ok.

As Hoophopes said, planning some little things to do for next week would be a really good idea. Nothing big, just normal things. Have you got a calendar you could write things on? It might help to see it in front of you. Can you take photos of her happily playing with you and keep them around for when you're feeling desperate? Images like that don't lie - you'd see yourself what you'd be giving up and what your daughter would lose.

GracieLoo Sat 01-Jun-13 20:12:05

Had quite a productive day, not seen anyone but my choice. Made a list of what to do, didn't put too much on the list, left some jobs for tomorrow. Got housework done, and fridge is full. Social worker is coming on monday and i'm worried she's going to inspect the house, so wanted to make sure there's nothing she can fault.

Feeling paranoid and anxious though, and don't like it! Been locking gates and doors incase anyone comes round, feeling very self-concious like everyone talking about me - stupid! That's why i'm hiding away. Want to drink and sh do badly but don't want to do anything else to go against me. Still getting urges and images in my head of what I want to do, it's so hard. I feel so screwed up. Just about coping, just.

GracieLoo Sat 01-Jun-13 22:28:03

Feel so restless, not tired at all but want to sleep to block it all out. Got no wine as trying to be good, but feel I need it tonight to help me sleep.

This is what I hate, when I've spent a day trying so hard to carry on, but it's not worth it as my mind won't give me a break. Thinking about horrible things I want to do so badly, and all the things happening next week. Worrying about dd as well which is stupid as I'm used to her being at her dads.

Ilikethebreeze Sat 01-Jun-13 22:34:37

Personally I always think you struggle more when you have plenty of time on your hands.

Hoophopes Sun 02-Jun-13 00:31:53

Glad you got some things done and found a list helpful.

If it helps you I find social workers do want to look around and if you have nothing to hide then it is good to offer to show them round perhaps as a strategy!

I hope you can see the social worker as another strand of support for you. Remember they hold the keys to a budget that can provide support. Gp's and CMHT's do not have access to that budget, which is why they refer to SC. it is called social care for a reason, providing assessment and care for people. If you clam up and do not tell them what you are struggling with then if you get no support then things will remain how they are. They have to use forms and terms which you may not like but if you can see it as a means of getting what you need it may help. For instance if you cannot work and need financial support from the government then you may claim benefits. This is just another form if support for you and not one you will need forever. It can feel threatening and even business like as SW's sadly are very busy people and we live in a world of beaurocracy. Try if you can to not see it as a threat but as a chance for people to work together to help you right now.

Can you think about what extra help and support you would like before Monday?

Hope you get through your list of jobs on Sunday.

GracieLoo Sun 02-Jun-13 13:58:21

I haven't really had plenty of time on my hands, I've hardly stopped this wkend, got loads done. Made a list of things I want to mention to the social worker. Really hard to know what help I want when I don't know what they offer?

Anyway, been on the go, bit obsessive with the cleaning actually, done it all then want to do it again as feel I've missed bits. Was sorting out paperwork and have thrown away mood diary I kept for previous cpn, the new one hasn't made any indication she wants to carry on any work started, and I can't talk about it without crying so thought best to get rid of it. I then broke down in tears and retreated to my bed. Feel so lonely but my doing I know. Wish I didn't get attached, can't stop thinking I'll never see her again, and previous support I've had that moved on. Makes me so anxious and tearful (and pathetic).

So just going to stay here til I get dd. Appetites gone again, not a good sign, plus feeling confused about days/times, worried I'll forget to get dd, or I'll forget appts tomorrow. Memory keeps failing me and I don't like it.

Hoophopes Sun 02-Jun-13 19:57:31

It is hard when you do not know what is on offer so why not just be really honest with them, about what you struggle with and how it affects you. Let them know what MH workers you have been involved with you recently ( day hospital, crisis, a&e, Cpn) and what treatments you are waiting for. Tell them what you struggle doing at home, what you would like to help you do things with your dd. if they know what is really going on then they can assess your needs and see what they can offer.

Each area will have different resources so if you know something that would help then do say.

GracieLoo Sun 02-Jun-13 23:21:14

Scared, can't sleep. Getting detached again but making myself 'feel' so I can try to realise how serious this is. Worried I'm going to say the wrong thing and make everything worse, or won't say enough and be back to square one! If I'm completely honest they'll probably admit me and put dd in care of family! But I'm trying to struggle on, going to be a tough week, not sure if it's the right thing to do but I want to pretend things are normal - I didn't take od's in the past weeks, I'm not still getting thoughts and urges, I don't feel detached and numb, social services aren't involved, family are oblivious, I still have a job and no one thinks I'm a crap mum! But all that is real and I can't change what's happened sad

TheSilveryPussycat Sun 02-Jun-13 23:35:44

Hi gracie OK you are feeling somewhat detached, however, as you say, you are struggling on, and that is good. What meds are you on, and how long have you been on them for? (sorry, you've prob already said). The thing is to keep things together and give the meds a chance to work, and you seem to be doing that. If 'pretending things are normal' works for you, then that's not a bad strategy, provided you are still upfront with the help as it arrives.

GracieLoo Mon 03-Jun-13 17:32:05

Don't feel too great after the meeting, they're getting involved and things will happen that I'm uncomfortable with. She left and I just cried, I don't feel I know what's happening. It's like i'm in a dream, actually, a nightmare. I feel I've got something to prove and already putting myself under pressure and feeling exhausted.

All I understand so far is there will be visits from sw, meetings with all the professionals, and I've got to make progress! Different kinds of therapy may happen, although was told I'm not stable enough, yet it's getting pushed for soon. Everyone suddenly knows which is hard to deal with. I've met/talked to a few new people and had to tell them difficult stuff. I know it's all in dd and my best interest but a couple of weeks ago I could hardly cope with making a cup of tea, now all this!

I feel completely lost if I'm honest, I know it's all my fault, but I don't have a good feeling about what's going to happen. I feel invaded, but I've brought it on myself, and I feel so guilty about bringing dd into this situation. Going to cry again now, but can't as it'll 'damage' dd. Wanted it to stop, wish I had succeeded at one of my attempts but I know it's not fair for others. Want to scream, run away, anything but deal with the mess I've caused.

Hoophopes Mon 03-Jun-13 17:48:25

Sorry you feeling like this after your meeting. The professionals have to meet up to share information and to make sure the help you are getting is not contradicting or unhelpful.

Great theory are talking about different types of therapy. Hard to get on nhs and being involved with SC is a good way of getting it quicker.Though you may have to wait till you are more stable for therapy there may be other things they are putting in place before then.

The whole point about support and therapy is about making progress. So try not to take it critically.

Ilikethebreeze Mon 03-Jun-13 17:54:35

I think you need to cry. Heck, we all need to cry from time to time.

What happens if you do? Will they make you report it to them?

[I dont know what others on here think about this].

kerstina Mon 03-Jun-13 22:08:26

I think crying is therapeutic it releases endorphins doe it not ? Ridiculous to make you feel guilty about that, if it helps you it won't damage DD.

GracieLoo Tue 04-Jun-13 19:42:24

I really don't like my cpn! She's the first professional I've not got on with, and I feel awful about it as she means well, but I really don't gel with her! Right now I am missing my previous cpn's desperately, in this situation I'm in they would be a big help. But there's nothing that can be done so I need to be grateful and work with the support I've got. It's so hard though when I don't totally trust her and i have to be so careful at the moment. Just want someone at these meetings I trust.

Ilikethebreeze Tue 04-Jun-13 20:08:48

I dont like the sound of your cpn either. You get on with lots of people.
Can you say why you dont trust her ? [not saying that you should, just that I wonder what it is about her that you dont gel with]

TheSilveryPussycat Tue 04-Jun-13 20:56:33

You can ask for a different cpn - I know a couple of people who have done just that because they too couldn't 'gel'. Perhaps talk to Soc Services - I presume you'll be assigned a social worker, hopefully she'll be better than the cpn.

Ilikethebreeze Tue 04-Jun-13 21:01:44

Glad you wrote that, TheSilveryPussycat. I have been wanting to post that, but didnt know how easy it would be to change a cpn.

GracieLoo Tue 04-Jun-13 21:33:36

Ok, one example was today in the meeting with cpn, hv and sw. It was a looong meeting, so towards the end I started to open up a bit and ask questions, and talk about the recent od's and how I was feeling around that time. Cpn said it was important people knew so that I wasn't keeping secrets - fair enough. But I said family/friends knew a lot of what was going on, just not the private, bad thoughts/plans (obviously, most people don't go around shouting about it) but I had told my old cpn and then crisis team. I then said I had started telling people a bit more that particular week as I wanted to prepare them so that when I followed through with my plan, it wouldn't be a big shock to them.

She turned to the sw and said 'see?! this is how she is thinking, what she is saying!'. Then turned to me and said 'now that has made the risk factor higher now you've said that. What are you thinking now? This is the state of her mind, see...' and kept rambling on until I had to interupt as I could feel myself starting to panic, and said I didn't feel that bad now, I was trying to explain how bad I was. To be honest i'm feeling close to getting quite low again, and i'm scared but trying so hard to push those thoughts away. I'm scared of getting that bad and not being able to turn to the cpn, as she's who i'm supposed to tell, but I don't like the way she reacts. She panics me, and twists what I say.

Maybe i'm wrong in all this, and seeing things differently to others, and getting defensive. But I could sense the hv and sw weren't too comfortable sometimes with what she came out with. She kept interupting others too.

Sorry if that's rambly. Head feels a bit rambly tonight.

Ilikethebreeze Tue 04-Jun-13 21:41:19

That is not rambly at all. That is very clear indeed <hugs> sad

That must be overwhelming for you. I am so sorry.

She is too strong and over the top for you isnt she? Not what you need at all I would have thought.

Hoophopes Tue 04-Jun-13 22:09:10

You can request a different Cpn, depends on resources if you can get one but worth an ask. Hard though when you had someone good to know whether the current one can settle with you because she started seeing you when you struggling so much. Cannot be easy to get to know each other at such a time. Can you tell her how you feel about her and how she is upsetting you. She may change? If you are honest with her then you can say you would like to change cpn's?

Did you get on ok with the social worker? Sounds like she did not overreact which is good thing.

I hope you can contact the CMHT team if you struggling. Do they use a duty worker system or a second named worker system if your one not available as that might be easier than talking to yours?

GracieLoo Tue 04-Jun-13 22:41:35

I'd love to ask for a new one, but I think they'll say the same, I was struggling when we met so not a good start. Plus it hasn't been long, they'll say give it time. And I don't want to hurt her feelings! I could say to her she is coming across too harsh/opinionated, I don't really know the best way to describe her. But I do know I haven't felt like this with others, and I need someone I can be open with. I find myself withdrawing when I see her. Been told to speak to her supervisor if she's not in the office, but she's always been there when I've called unfortunately

Maybe I should just get on with it, go to the meetings and appts, not say much and see what happens. Easier said than done when your heads full of dark stuff and starting to fall apart again.

Hoophopes Tue 04-Jun-13 22:54:11

Why not tell her that you find her unproachable and can you both work on you feeling you can speak honestly to her? Shame she is always there otherwise you might find a different worker on the phone you click with!!!!

By saying nothing you maynlimitnthe help you get which would be a shame.

GracieLoo Tue 04-Jun-13 23:50:09

Think i'm looking too much into this, but I can't sleep, I'm so tired, but this is the second night I've just been lying here and I just can't sleep. This is how it all started about month ago, was the sign that worried me as sleep isn't usually a problem. Plus appetite has gone, but been eating small meals, and felt dizzy and shaky earlier. Oh god I can't reach rock bottom again, I can't!

TheSilveryPussycat Wed 05-Jun-13 01:00:55

Having a late night, gracie, if you are around.

The CPN seems to be making a very basic mistake if she takes your account of how you felt recently as an account of how you feel now. (What are the improvements, btw? can you describe them?)

SnowyMouse Wed 05-Jun-13 16:53:40

Can you ask for something to help you sleep? How are your meetings?

Hoophopes Wed 05-Jun-13 20:11:57

Do you have a few sleeping tablets? Can you ask Cpn to get you two nights worth. That can make all the difference. I have learnt that dealing with the early warning signs, such as food and sleep can stop things deteriorating.

GracieLoo Wed 05-Jun-13 21:38:43

I think i'll see how tonight goes and decide tomorrow if i need to say anything to anyone, although don't feel that inclined to call my cpn about anything, as I don't want to be made to feel wworse, or things taken out of proportion. Bit scared of her to be honest.

Found out this week that when I was at the day hospital, all the forms and arrangements were made for me to be admitted, and those at the cmht thought I had been. But I think it was my decision at the end of the day, although was slightly put off being an IP by the nurse. It makes me wonder how different things would have turned out if i'd got IP care. But probably best not to dwell on what didn't happen.

Feeling a bit dazed, bit slow in things i'm doing, then bit frantic the next. Got the need for everything to be in it's place. Bit worried ss are going to turn up unannounced too.

Hoophopes Thu 06-Jun-13 07:14:27

Hi if you had been IP your Cpn would still be the same. Your HV would be involved like she is now and you would be under SC the same. You would not have received any therapy in hospital and in all likelihood have been there for a few weeks with no access to dd. your ex or dm would know what they know now the same if not is not a great place, just a place of safety with drugs doled out to you, regular checks that it are ok ( and by that I mean a health care assistant seeing in but not talking to you and ticking her sheet) and sharing a room with other women. A lack of freedom and awful food!!

How was your night? Can you ask for a few sleeping tablets if not getting a sleep you need? Can you plan your meals today to help you? Not sure about sunshine but hopefully it will be sunny and help you do nice activities outdoors that help you ( my plan for today anyway!!)

SnowyMouse Thu 06-Jun-13 15:31:25

How is it going Gracie, get any more sleep?

GracieLoo Thu 06-Jun-13 23:20:33

Still finding it hard to go to sleep, tired all day then get to bed and just lie there!

I guess all this would still be happening if I had been admitted, but if I'd been in that weekend I would have taken the bigger od. But I might have felt worse surrounded by ill patients.

Taking it hour by hour, and staying out of the house a lot, easier to do with dd, get more anxious on my own. The weeks are going by and it seems like a long time ago all this happened, just need to get out of this dark place a bit more. Scared of having normal thoughts again, don't know what that's like anymore! Bought some alcohol today which is not good, but not drunk any which is good.

SnowyMouse Fri 07-Jun-13 19:00:15

Hope today went ok. Do you have any weekend plans?

GracieLoo Fri 07-Jun-13 22:45:26

Got a busy weekend planned, as it just so happens that a lot is on, plus have dd hence the plans. I feel more comfortable taking her places, then like to hide away when I'm on my own, as there's no point going anywhere myself as I just feel self-conscious, and don't get much enjoyment out of a lot right now. But if I take dd out, she enjoys it and that's the main thing.

Had a GP appt today, and talked about how I was finding it hard to talk to my new cpn, and I've not felt like that with other professionals. He's going to call the cmht and speak to someone about it. I feel a bit awkward now, I know she means well so I feel a bit bad now. Feel things are just plodding along at the moment, relieved to not be as suicidal as I was, but still anxious as I always seem to go back to that place at some point with no explanation or triggers. It makes me question if I can cope with the ups and downs, and how many more downs can I survive. As each time it seems to get harder.

Hoophopes Fri 07-Jun-13 23:05:10

Have they considered changing or adding to your medication to help you with the ups and downs? Sometimes a chemical imbalance needs readjusting for some people. Hope your plans work ok.

Sounds like you have a caring gp if they are going to contact CMHT for you. Hope it is helpful. Whilst no one can make someone be overly caring they can at least be made to behave professionally and appropriately which is what you need.

GracieLoo Sat 08-Jun-13 12:57:49

I'm hoping I'll get a new cpn, but I doubt that will happen. Struggling today, don't want to do the things I've got planned. Not coping with dd's bad attitude, everything I try to do that's 'fun' for her, goes wrong and I don't know why I bother. I get embarrassed, left somewhere early just now as didn't want to speak to people and just wanted to get home. But got another social thing this afternoon and dreading it. Not feeling that great really, fed up of trying and failing.

They've increased my meds so will wait and see. Got appts with HV, then sw, then an assessment then cpn this week. Makes my head spin. And I don't want to tell them I'm not coping, feel so crap about it.

Hoophopes Sat 08-Jun-13 17:19:36

Hi. Young children are so hard, aren't they. So try not to take things so personally with your dd. the advice I got from the sw I saw was to mix with other mums and go to baby groups etc. I was like, huh, what help is that to me and why not more mental health support. But they explained to me that meeting other mums with kids the same age and talking helps to normalise things. So for eg my ds is being a nightmare with food right now and my usual brain would tell me xyz negative things about myself. But the mum I met up with today was saying some similar things so it helped me realise it is not me being a bad mum but how children are at this stage. Perhaps you can ask the sw if there are any groups you can go to for talking about children etc as know when children are school age etc harder to find things like that.

Sounds a busy week with appointments. Try to be as honest as possible to get what you need.

SnowyMouse Sun 09-Jun-13 20:56:36

Just posting to say thinking of you for the busy, hopefully helpful coming week.

cjel Sun 09-Jun-13 22:56:57

hello lovely gracie, so glad i've found you again. I've missed you. I'm so please you were able to be honest with gp, try not to worry about how cpn feels, its just her job, if she isn't helping you you deserve so much better.dcs can be hard work when they get their off days, it won't be personal to you. I hope you have had a good day today, can you find enjoyment in the good weather? hope you get good rest tonight.flowersxxxxxx

GracieLoo Mon 10-Jun-13 12:18:25

Thanks cjel that's really nice. Think hv is just coming, so tired again and feel on edge. Not good today

SnowyMouse Mon 10-Jun-13 12:41:27

Good luck with HV

cjel Mon 10-Jun-13 15:12:12

hope you can be open with hv as you were with the dr.xx

GracieLoo Mon 10-Jun-13 20:51:08

Feeling irritable and rubbish today. Had a full on day, with appts and stuff for dd. Saw HV and SW, but didn't have a good chat as dd was here, and it was about her anyway. SW just had a report to fill out, then halfway through said a copy will be sent to dd's dad, so now worried I may have said something I may regret him seeing. Had a text from him saying he has loads of questions about all this, which has made me think he's talked to people and they've worried him more or said bad stuff about me. Worried sad

I mentioned briefly about what I had mentioned to gp about cpn, and I think both hv and sw think it's down to me not communicating or giving it time, so now I feel nothing will change. It sounds stupid and ungrateful but I actually feel I have no one to open up to and talk about my fears and feelings. I don't feel like seeing anyone this week, but cpn appt tomorrow. Not feeling too great and i'm thinking of ways out again.

cjel Mon 10-Jun-13 21:36:05

sorry y ou don't feel you had a good day my lovely. Try to remember you are looking after gracie and all these people cpn, sw, hv don't know wart is best for gracie only you do.Your gp understood what you meant enough to want to speak to cpn. DO NOT GIVE UP!!! You carry on saying what you want to them and if you don't fit with what they have learnt from a text book you can't change or help that, they will have to find a different booksmile Just because a few 'professional' people havent been that supportive this week doesn't mean that they won't help in the future. you are making all the right baby steps to get well but it is really tiny tiny steps to health. dds dad may be a support to you and dd so try not to worry that he will think yo are bad, he will be on your side as you are his dds mum. hope you can have a peaceful nights rest, remember to love gracie and forgive her for not being perfectxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx

Hoophopes Mon 10-Jun-13 21:41:18

Hi. Sounds really hard with all the necessary appointments for you right now. However they are part of your support so hopefully all the necessary admin helps. Can you get your dm to have dd next time ip with sw and HV if that helps?

It took me months to be able to talk to my last Cpn and I guess if you can remember that you gained this one at a very difficult time for you, then it may be hard to be able to feel more open with her. Why not tell her that you are feeling overwhelmed right now and perhaps tell her what worked for you with last worker and what you want from her?

I found when I had MH meeting after MH meeting it made me feel worse and I needed to balance that with more everyday activities to ground myself. A walk to shop, a magazine, a recorded tv program, trip to the park etc.

You can talk more to your HV if I remember. Why not talk more with her? Or be honest with Cpn. It takes time to work with someone new and although you may not like her it sounds like she is at least giving you lots of time which is important.

Hoophopes Mon 10-Jun-13 21:45:57

Does dd's dad know about your od's? Perhaps if he knew how ill you were or how you are struggling that may help. Hard when someone not know much, guess its normal to ask questions, sounds supportive at least if interested. Could you talk to Cpn about how best to let dd's dad know what is going on, or would you prefer a professional to talk to him. Just thinking about what is easiest and less stressful for you.

GracieLoo Tue 11-Jun-13 10:49:44

Once again sat in car crying after appt with cpn. I haven't been able to cry for a while and now I can't stop. I don't really know why, but going to the same place brings back memories of last cpn and that's all I can think about. Sounds so obsessive and pathetic I know.

I said to her about the mood diary I used to do, I explained it's easier to write it down rather than try to remember my mood over the last week. She said we can carry on, but I'm so scared of being honest with her. Think it's the way she words things, has a way of making me feel guilty. She asked about my financial situation, I said I'm ok but need to phone job centre and it's on my list of things to do. She started going on about the negative impact on dd if she starts going without things she's used to. None of that is applicable.

She kept asking about if I've gone out and if I do it shows I've moved on. I said that's never really been an issue, apart from the odd day. Even at my lowest I've continued going out etc, it's just bloody hard.

I felt she wasn't getting what I was saying and who I really am. It's like she has a checklist and asks the same stuff each time, then spends ages writing everything j say down. I started crying and said I was finding it really hard with the change of cpn. She finished by saying if I continue being this tearful psychology won't take me on, and may have to be re-assessed. I now feel I can't cry. I need psychology, understand I need to be stable and not od'ing but surely they expect people to get tearful.

Feel worse than ever, had planned to go food shopping after but just want to go home and hide under my duvet. Look too much of a mess to go anywhere now anyway.

cjel Tue 11-Jun-13 12:48:54

she sounds like a nightmare for you gracie, although crying is ok and can be healing. a cpn asking about your financial situation and wanting you to get a job is weird. what was her reasoning for tearfulness meaning you are not suitable for psychology? can you record your sessions so that you can listen to them away from her incase she is saying helpful things but because she isn't your old cpn you don't pick them up? also on the other side if she really is that unhelpful you will be able to show your gp what you mean? I also go re,blotchy and swollen when cry and want to hide for ages after!!smile How do you feel now?

GracieLoo Tue 11-Jun-13 13:21:44

Everytime I see her she asks about my financial situation, have I been out, am I having suicidal thoughts, and she asked me twice if had thoughts of harming myself or had any tablets. I get this is her approach and is different from what I'm used to, but such direct questions can be difficult to answer truthfully, especially when she doesn't listen properly.

She said if I get so upset and keep crying, I will not be seen as stable enough for therapy. She looks so disappointed when I start crying, I try so hard not to. I cry out of frustration and I miss the care I used to receive. I feel so desperate. God I'm just going round in circles and so grateful to those following my boring and repetitive thread!

I came home and filled out an online form for job seekers. For the last month I've been asking people for advice on what to do and not got anywhere, so I thought I'd do it as wasn't sure what else to do.

I think I'm scared of the cpn and the consequences of each appt. She also mentions how dd is at risk and about her safety. Makes me feel like the worse mum ever.

In bed now, feel anxious, tense and really upset.

Also haven't told dd's dad about od's, not sure it's necessary at the moment. Maybe I'm wrong but doing what I'm comfortable with at the moment.

Ilikethebreeze Tue 11-Jun-13 13:36:55

Right. I think you need to box clever with her.
Cant remember if you ended up asking for a new one, as she is not good for you [not sure how many she would suit tbh].
Carry on with the crying. If you need it, do it. Just downplay about it to her.

I think you will get the psychology.

Ilikethebreeze Tue 11-Jun-13 13:40:14

Didnt see your last post before I posted mine. But I think it is all still relevant.

Wouldnt dds dad have already found out about the od from someone?

GracieLoo Tue 11-Jun-13 13:50:28

No he has only spoken to me. The sw agreed it would be too much to tell him everything at once. I'll just see how it goes and if he finds out or has to know I'll deal with it then. I didn't do anything when dd was here so I don't feel he has to know every detail. I don't know everything that goes on in his life, some of which may affect dd. As long as she's ok, we'll take each day as it comes.

Hope that makes sense and doesn't make me look bad.

Ilikethebreeze Tue 11-Jun-13 14:01:42

Normally I am all for important people knowing things. But on this occasion, so many people know, including ss, that I am not sure he necessarily needs to know that.
Though I hesitiate to write that a bit, as really, that issue is between you and him, not someone on the internet.

TheSilveryPussycat Tue 11-Jun-13 15:31:31

The CPN seems to be thinking aloud when there is no need to. I think she may think she is giving you factual information (e.g. you can't have psychology if you are tearful ((btw, surely this cannot be true??)), when what she says is, not surprisingly, merely upsetting you further.

Saying that about the crying seems not that far from telling you to pull yourself together sad

If you were in my area, I'd suggest mentioning it to our local service user and carer group, who would follow it up anonymously (though at the moment with all the changes they are not being v effective tbh)

Maybe grit your teeth (I don't mean pull yourself together hmm) for 2 weeks, and keep taking the meds.

GracieLoo Tue 11-Jun-13 17:04:17

I don't know of any groups like that around here, but I don't want to get her into trouble, I just don't want to come away from appts crying and feeling more anxious and down.

I've started writing it all down, logging certain things that have upset me. Then maybe at some point I can get another perspective.

I feel i'm in the wrong and to be blamed. Got so much going on, starting to feel all too much.

TheSilveryPussycat Tue 11-Jun-13 18:31:40

Nobody wants to get their CPN into trouble. That's why we do it anonymously. It's v difficult to get feedback into the system because we all know they are trying to do their best.

Writing it down sounds like a good idea, I find it shuts my head up a bit if I do that. You are not in the wrong, and are not to be blamed, I am certain she did not mean you to end up feeling like that.

There are measures in the latest guidance, No Health without Mental Health, which have, imho, led to MH Trusts having to use employment as one of the things they evaluate. <sigh> This is crap imho - if I had to go back to full time work, or maybe even p/t, I would be depressed and have lost control of the rest of my life in a few weeks. I do want to contribute tho, so volunteer - and in the olden days you wouldn't have had to seek work in your circs, and could focus on dd, yourself, and keeping things together, as looking after dc was viewed as making a contribution (of course, it still is, but no longer viewed as such so much).

cjel Tue 11-Jun-13 18:41:38

I didn't know that silver, surely if you are signed off sick by a gp you are not fit for work?
Gracie I know i keep saying it, but i would put yourself before an ineffective cpn. If it isn't working for you it isn't working.
I cried in my counselling and think she is negligent in telling you not to cry, its like it makes her uncomfortable and you are helping her.
I also never came out of a session with my counsellor or cpn feeling worse. they always left the session in a positive place.
Your treatment my feel worse because she is not your 1st choice cpn, but from what you say she isn't helping you at the moment.
Don't feel guilt for her feelings and don't blame yourself that you are not doing what she wants.
She is to be used by you to get better, you are not there for her benefit.

GracieLoo Tue 11-Jun-13 19:00:15

Thing is my sick note ran out about ten days ago, I have been made to feel bad for handing my notice in, but I'm glad I did. I feel I have no choice but to look for work now.

I did feel more positive when I had seen my last cpn, and the one before that. Also when I've seen HV, and even sw as I feel they are doing something to improve things, or are just there to listen. I feel awful this afternoon, hiding away from dd whenever possible, luckily she's happily playing by herself, then I'll read her stories then bed. Had another cry this afternoon, and want a glass of wine tonight, all of which are signs I'm not feeling great.

I don't know who to talk to. I could phone HV but it's not really her field, could see GP again but it's such an arse to get an appt. I'm scared and don't know where to turn to anymore. I don't ever want to ring out of hours or 111 again as I'm scared ss will get more involved and I don't want it becoming a child protection case.

Hoophopes Tue 11-Jun-13 19:13:55

Hi sorry you are struggling with the CPN. Encouraging you feel supported by hv and sw. Did you talk to sw and hv about struggling with the cpn and what she says? It may be true what she says, but you are not well enough to deal with it and perhaps she doesn't realise that. Can you tell the cpn what doesn't help?

Could the sw or hv help more, with the practical things?

You can always talk to the Samaritans in total confidence.

TheSilveryPussycat Tue 11-Jun-13 21:01:53

Gracie, I think you may have a good case for claiming Employment and Support Allowance, the support group for those whose mh would worsen if they had to seek work. You will need written support from your psych. Seek professional help for this - CAB or Welfare Rights, if poss. Or join Benefits and Work for about £20 and get someone to help go through how to do it yourself, if all else fails. (Did I pay a virtual visit, or was that someone else)

TheSilveryPussycat Tue 11-Jun-13 21:05:02

cjel it is not so long since single parents could claim Income Support, HB and CTB without having to sign on or seek work. They could do this till youngest was 16. And got Home Responsibility Protection, ie their years of childcare counted as years towards their State Retirement Pension.

GracieLoo Tue 11-Jun-13 21:27:51

I claimed ESA for the month I was signed off work as I wasn't eligible for sick pay. Then my sick note ran out and I thought I wasn't allowed ESA if unemployed (as handed my notice in also). I got a letter from ESA saying it would stop as sick note ran out, I didn't know what to do. Didn't think I could carry on getting ESA and feel people think i'm being lazy not working. I don't know, i'm so confused.

I have tried to say I am finding it hard with the cpn to hv and sw, but feel they are on her side. I feel like i'm making things difficult.

TheSilveryPussycat Tue 11-Jun-13 21:33:09

Get another sicknote, backdated to the end of your last one, and claim ESA with it. (I think this is right, no time to double check atm, sorry)

cjel Tue 11-Jun-13 22:50:13

I have no idea about all this as i was married and worked for own own company. If you don't know who to talk to ring the samaritans, they are there and would welcome your call even if you only wanted to waffle!!! I wonder if citizens advice bureau could advice on finances? sounds harsh when you are trying to be good to your employer and admit you are not able to carry on working for them.

SnowyMouse Wed 12-Jun-13 20:08:24

How's it going Gracie?

GracieLoo Thu 13-Jun-13 16:42:43

I feel like I can't think straight, so much going on and a lot to take in. Have been to children's centre and they are going to start an outreach program with me, an outreach worker will come round next week and I'll be able to talk about the issues I'm having with dd at the moment without being judged or reported. As that's how I feel now, that I can't tell anyone anything, even if it's a minor thing, or normal children's behaviour, it'll all be reported and if my cpn finds out, taken out of context. She's scared me so much about ss and risk.

I don't know if I can do this.

Hoophopes Thu 13-Jun-13 19:47:50

One of the main roles of a cpn is to risk assess. That is what I was told when under crisis team and a cpn - they bluntly told me that when children are involved and a parents behaviour has caused concern their first responsibility is to risk assess. Try not to take it personally, it is the way of the government and sadly shows that your cpn is doing her job. I imagine all cpn's do that, it is just yours is more open about it.

Great you got an outreach worker, that is the first real practical and extra support you have got. And the fact you know you will not be reported or judged should help you to get some support with you and your dd, and hopefully some reassurance you are doing a good enough job!!

You said you needed some extra support to help you and that is what the services are providing. Sadly it has to come through risk assessment, form filling in etc - as they have to ensure the resources go to those who need it. It doesn't mean it is forever, but for now hopefully you will have a bigger support network.

You can do it, you are doing it Gracie xx

GracieLoo Thu 13-Jun-13 22:17:06

Starting to feel like nothing matters anymore, if I'm struggling and making everyone's lives miserable and stressful it would better if I wasn't here. I don't want to be around anyone, don't see the point in it all. The outreach support is all my doing, I approached them, nothing to do with ss or cpn, I don't actually know what support they have put in place? I think I'm oblivious to it, maybe i've got loads of support, but I don't know what's going on or what the plan is.

I'm feeling muddled and just 'nothing'. Emotionless. Waiting for them to all get off my case, I'll make sure dd is safe and settled, then I can do what they're preventing me doing at the moment. Don't know why I'm bothering to pretend everything is going well, when I'm doing more harm being here. I don't need to explain again why I know it's for the best, and I know no ones interested. Just wanted to get it all out somewhere. It's helped, I think. Sorry.

Ilikethebreeze Thu 13-Jun-13 22:26:13

I cant answer your post porperly, as I dont know about this sort of thing.
But others like Hoophopes seem to know and understand what is happening.
So I will just hand hold for now.

Your depression seems to be worse today, so what you are saying is coming because of the depression.
Are you remembering to take the pills you are supposed to be taking?

TheSilveryPussycat Thu 13-Jun-13 22:57:20

gracie the one sure way to protect DD from misery and stress is just to keep going, weary step by weary step. It will get better, give yourself time. We will be here holding your hand every step, sending hugs and warm wishes.

cjel Thu 13-Jun-13 23:03:05

gracie, please remember that i am not feeling as you do, nor are outreach support etc. we do not find you hard work or stressful, we can take anything you throw at us, nothing is too bad for us to cope with that you can't tell us.we can't catch how you feel we are safe and you will be too one day. It is the way your mind works at the moment , temporarily, that tells you you are too much trouble for anyone to bother with. You are not too much trouble.some of us have been where you are and got well again and realise that what you see as reality is just your poor tired mind playing tricks. When you allow people to help you in the way you need you won't feel like you do now.Its so hard when you have no hope, but you have done really well in reaching out. You told your gp about the cpn, you were open with and got on with the hv and now you say you contacted the childrens centre for more support. You are doing amazing. You think you are faking it but remember the saying 'fake it until you make it',
try and get rest now and even sleep so your tired mind can have a chance to rest.<<<<hugs>>>>>>

GracieLoo Fri 14-Jun-13 08:46:15

Yeah I'm taking my pills, and not been drinking alcohol or missing meals. So why am I still not coping? Shouldn't be on here now as got to take dd to nursery in 10 mins and not even dressed. Feel like I can't do anything, everything is too much effort. Hate being so useless.

cjel Fri 14-Jun-13 10:04:00

Morning. Its taken me this long to get up and eat so you were ahead of me!! You FEEL like you are not coping you FEEL useless, but my lovely lovey gracie you are not. Not drinking and eating is a mega step in the direction to full wellness, overwhelmingly the future seems harder to get to than the past but think of it as a road that you need to travel but there is no u turn!! I don't think if you had a choice of not being here or of being well you would choose not being here? sometimes you feel as if you are going the wrong way but you really aren't. hope you werent too late for nurseryxx

GracieLoo Fri 14-Jun-13 17:14:34

I can't do this, I'm too tired. We weren't too late for nursery, I made some phone calls regarding benefits etc, but got a feeling I've messed it up. Took dd and her friend out, then brought them home for a play. Feel like I haven't sat down today and dd is still demanding my time and attention. Just want her to give me space for half an hour. Her friends dad picked her up and dd face said it all. She wants to be with her dad.

I can't be bothered to do anything, her tea or bath or stories. Just want to stay in bed. Can't ask anyone for help, it's too late in the day and I hate admitting I can't do it. Don't how how to carry on, feel so crap.

yamsareyammy Fri 14-Jun-13 17:20:41

You have had a busy day, and feel tired. Happens to us all.

But I dont think you can say that a look she may or may not have given to her friends dad, means that she would rather be with her own dad smile

Take it slow, whatever you have got left in the day that you need to do.

yamsareyammy Fri 14-Jun-13 17:21:53

Quick tea, such as beans on toast, no bath unless necessary, and maybe no story tonight would be my advice.

GracieLoo Fri 14-Jun-13 17:32:38

She looked really sad and then when they had gone she said she wanted to go to her dads. She said it this morning too.

I haven't had a really busy day, other people do loads more, all I did was normal mum stuff which shouldn't exhaust me. Just being over sensitive I think.

yamsareyammy Fri 14-Jun-13 17:44:48

I think you have been through a lot in the last few weeks and more. Physically and emotionally. Enough to exhaust anyone.

Children will sometimes want to be with the other parent, from time to time, for one reason or another. That is natural. Is she perhaps wanting to see the new baby?

GracieLoo Fri 14-Jun-13 17:58:11

I think so, she's made pictures for them all. At least she can go and be part of a proper family this weekend.

yamsareyammy Fri 14-Jun-13 18:18:42

Families are made up of 2 people or 10 or anything in between.

But either way, you dd comes across to me as a lovely, happy normal little girl.
And she will probably have a nice time this weekend at her dads.
That is not something to be afraid of or worried about. That is actiually something for you to feel proud about. That you have brought her up so well.

GracieLoo Fri 14-Jun-13 21:26:22

I've tried. I can't do this. Was stupid to think I could get better. I can't and i'm going to let people down. Scared. Just had the worst thought/image and I don't like it. I tried to stop it and couldn't. sad

yamsareyammy Fri 14-Jun-13 21:32:57

Has someone from your medical supporters advised you of coping mechanisms for this sort of situation?

Hoophopes Fri 14-Jun-13 21:52:44

You can always phone 111 to get an out of hours dr's apt and they can refer you to crisis team directly. Or phone Samaritans? Or do something nice just for you?

When I am really bad I just focus on getting through the next fifteen minutes, then the next fifteen and so on.

Do you have any prn medicine you can take, like a sleeping tablet?

GracieLoo Fri 14-Jun-13 22:07:59

I don't know what to do, but appreciate the suggestions. I don't want to admit to anyone that I feel a bit strange again, I know I shouldn't feel embarrassed but I do.

I've been taking it day by day, or hour by hour and will try to carry on doing that over the weekend. But I feel i'm going downwards a bit, after trying so hard the last couple of weeks. So why do I bother? Dd has been clingy and emotional, all my fault. I hate this!

I have no extra meds, don't think they would give me any. Feel like i don't care anymore and I should. The image I had was of dd, and I don't know why it entered my mind. I know no one asked what it was but had to get it off my chest. Sorry

TheSilveryPussycat Fri 14-Jun-13 22:14:40

don't be scared of images - I know it's hard not to be. I get hypnogic imagery sometimes as I am drifting off to sleep, apparently that's quite common and normal. I used to be a bit freaked but now I somehow blink my eyes open and seem to be assured that it's just a little trick of the mind, and nothing to be worried about.

Will check as often as I can, hold on gracie. I find Solitaire (on the computer) helps to just occupy my mind a bit and give me a bit of peace.

Hoophopes Fri 14-Jun-13 22:19:19

I only get two or three sleeping tablets prescribed at one time. You could ask your Cpn about a small amount of prn medication perhaps next week to help you when you really struggle if they think it would help?

I was told by a psych that images are just images and does not mean they will happen or we will act on them.

Sorry you are struggling. It has been a tough week with lots of tough appointments so I am not surprised your brain is not coping with it.

Sugar crush. Solitaire are both great distractions.

cjel Fri 14-Jun-13 22:20:36

Gracie, I have been so tired when depressed that i had to go back to bed after shower and breakfast. Feeling like you do can use as much energy as running a marathon. what you acheived today was soo huge.
My grandchildren don't always want to go home with their mum and dad, it doesnt mean they hate them or they are useless its just what children are like. She really will love things you do with her just as much as them. It is ONLY because of how low you feel that you are reading her wrongly.
get an early night and rest your mind and body. I wish you would start to believe what i am telling you. I have been in the despair you are and honestly as you start to get better it becomes clearer that it is the way you are feeling and not the world that is wrong.
Be kind to yourself, look at your successes and please believe me you are having huge success every day.xx

GracieLoo Fri 14-Jun-13 22:38:58

I want to believe what you tell me, and what people have been telling me for a long time but I don't, and I hate that I don't. I get into this zone that feels everyone is against me and nothing they say is true.

I thought that having a child would mean I would have someone to love and who loves me unconditionally and it doesn't feel like that. I'm failing at what I always wanted to be.

I think I'm kidding myself I'm doing ok, maybe I'm trying to prove to everyone I can do this, but I'm not sure I can. I keep thinking I need to do it before dd is older and more aware. Feel like I'm somewhere else right now, my mind has gone off on one! Scared to sleep but scared to stay awake with these thoughts. Don't even feel tired now.

Hoophopes Fri 14-Jun-13 22:49:16

I am sure if you asked a random group of parents and they were honest you would not be on your own!! Today my ds was cuddling his auntie and as we were due to leave clung to her and waved at me!!

Try to remember your HV and new support worker can help reassure you about you and dd. I was very upset when my ds was younger that I was a rubbish parent and I too had extra help for a few months. They kept telling me it was all about good enough parenting and that I was doing that! Also they told me bringing up a family is not just my responsibility and that children need other family members to share the load... It is not all down to one parent.

It also always feels worse at night when our brains almost have free reign as we are not having to "do" practical things.

Do you have nice things planned for tomorrow? Time for you and a treat? ( a treat for me is a paper and cup of tea in a coffee shop on my own, people watching!!)

cjel Fri 14-Jun-13 22:55:22

What a horrid hopeless place it seems to be, i can't remember a specific thing that helped me to start to listen and take on the positive messages and deflect the untrue negative ones but i think it was just constantly hearing good things. I journalled good stuff, even just listing what i'd accomplished every day and how bad i'd felt. it soon became clear that i didn't feel any worse than i had before, the worst had already happened, I'd acheived far more than i thought at the end of the day, the bad feelings always passed. I don't know what i can say that will really enable you to trust me!!!

GracieLoo Fri 14-Jun-13 23:06:51

Trouble is I don't feel reassured by the HV and cpn at the moment, feel like they're trying to prove i'm a rubbish mum. Sometimes I think i'm doing no worse than others, but the professionals seem to want to tell me how much risk i'm putting dd at, and how much it's affecting her, which is why I keep having thoughts I need to end it sooner rather than later, and the thoughts are getting stronger. I have plans to meet a friend tomorrow that I can't really get out of, but I will make it as brief as possib;e. Can't face anyone.

cjel Fri 14-Jun-13 23:16:52

its much easier to stay tucked in when you feel crap isn't it. i think one thing that helped me was having one person that i learned to trust and started slowly to take in that what they saidwas real and people who said the bad things weren't. can you think of one person that you could ? maybe your gp, or the hv if you build on that relationship?or even your new support on mn until you can trust someone in rl? do you have a personal counsellor? if not could you ask gp for one?

TheSilveryPussycat Fri 14-Jun-13 23:41:00

I think the HCPs may just mean that you are getting better, but not yet v far along the road to recovery, therefore you need meds and people to check you are doing OK. As someone upthread said, they have to check DD is alright, and the thing everyone wants is for you to carry on looking after her. You are her lovely DM smile sending hugs, warm wishes, and brew

cjel Sat 15-Jun-13 10:40:06

Morning gracie, hope you settled to sleep last night. Have you got a plan for today with your friend? i am just going to get grandchildren ages 7,3 and 18months. I took them home at 9 last night . they are in the middle of moving, so i have hectic day again. Funny how you want a quiet day when you haven't got it and then bored and lonely when nothing planned!!
One thing helped me was to focus on friends need of me when i had to go out and thinnk how i'd feel if i was looking forward to something and they cancelled me. Can you be honest and say you don't feel up to much could you just meet for a short while and then see how it goes?

GracieLoo Sat 15-Jun-13 11:25:42

Morning, I'm doing my usual stupid thing of sitting frozen in my car not wanting to get out and meet my friend. It's just a coffee sonewhere I've been millions of times before!

I'm knackered as only slept for 6 hours last night, so I feel drained and on edge. Also my head is really sore as over the last week or so I keep picking at patches on my scalp, making it bleed, then picking the scabs. There are quite a lot and it hurts and I can't stop doing it. Sounds gross I know. Why am I so screwed up? Anyway need to put on my 'normal' mask now, then will go home to bed or get drunk later to numb this shitty illness (yes I know it'll make things worse but not sure I care anymore, of course about dd but not myself).

GracieLoo Sat 15-Jun-13 11:28:08

Oh I don't want to sound irresponsible but it's just what I feel like doing even though I know it's wrong sad . Feeling like everyone around me is watching me, getting anxious and want to hide. They know everything about me, it's like they know what's in my mind.

TheSilveryPussycat Sat 15-Jun-13 15:10:15

gracie I have picked at my scalp for much of my life - think with me it is an Aspie trait. luckily I had a lot of dandruff so tended not to make it bleed One thing I used to do when I was about 10 was put a pinch of sugar in my hair, and then spend hours picking it out again. Yes I know it's weird, but wondered if it might be a way of doing this activity without hurting your head. Whatever gets you through the night! as John Lennon sang.

hugs and brew

GracieLoo Sat 15-Jun-13 18:34:32

Didn't last long, think I talked too much and too fast in an effort to hide what I feel like. Sometimes I feel like talking, today I didn't. Tried to have a nap but paranoia was keeping me awake. Need to go back out as have no milk or dinner, but I don't know if I can face it. I can't think straight.

cjel Sat 15-Jun-13 18:37:30

Glad you went. if you can't think straight can you think wobbly?xxx

cjel Sat 15-Jun-13 20:15:36

Hi gracie, did you go out? have you got food?x

GracieLoo Sat 15-Jun-13 20:22:22

No and no. Been stupid and typically bpd too and contacted a my first care co ordinator. I know she won't/can't reply, don't know why I do these things. Only make me feel worse. Getting stupid urges again, when will I get a break from this. The thought of not being here is such a relief.

cjel Sat 15-Jun-13 20:31:59

you are not stupid. don't worry about contacting care co ordinator , if she can't reply you won't have caused her a problem. Urges will stop, they will pass they are stupid you are right. I say again, what you want is to live happy life without feeling bad - not the false hope of the belief you have of not being here. try and get yourself some food - can you distract with tv or music for a bit?