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not suicidal=no help

(31 Posts)
Scruffalo Tue 05-Feb-13 02:15:29

I've spent years, in fact my whole adult life, asking for help but have got nowhere. It seems to me that unless I am suicidal or a danger to others, I'm not really important as far as mental health services go. I know they are stretched and about all the funding cuts etc. and I'm not saying people who are suicidal shouldn't be prioritised obviously. My problems do affect me everyday and seriously reduce the quality of my life though. If it were a physical illness, I'm sure somebody would have helped me by now, even if it was something I wasn't about to immediately drop down dead from. So why should I be expected to just carry on with no help, or worse be expected to cure myself?

Recently I have even considered lying to say I am suicidal, just so that someone might actually listen and do something for once. The problem with that would be because I know they already think my DC must be neglected/unhappy/in danger (so completely untrue) and would jump at the chance to send the SS in to our lives. They wouldn't even stop to think that it would do nothing to help solve my problems and quite likely would just make them worse.

So basically I am stuck in this position. I hate my life but have no way of changing it and no one to turn to for help. Does anyone else think like this or is it just my crazy brain thinking nonsense again?

Tortington Tue 05-Feb-13 02:18:14

you have medication?

why can't you change your life
what change would you want to see?

MechanicalTheatre Tue 05-Feb-13 02:18:30

I sympathise.

Even if you are suicidal, they're no help, you know. I tried to kill myself twice and both times I was sent home without any help. Been trying to get help for 15 years.

Scruffalo Tue 05-Feb-13 03:14:51

Yes I have medication. It changes nothing. I tell them this, they say take it for longer. It still doesn't work, they say increase dose/try a different one, it still makes no difference. They say stop taking medication then, but then I'm back where I started. So they suggest taking the same meds and the cycle starts again. Over and over for 16 years.

The changes I'd like to see, well truthfully there are so many I couldn't list them all but at the moment number 1 would be to do something about this crazy sleeping stuff, so I am not wasting so much of my time and I'm awake at the same times as normal human beings. That would be a good start at least if would give me more time to get control over my life.

Then number 2 would be to stop all the crazy obsessions with list making and planning and routines that take up around 75% of my waking hours. i can barely do any of the basics let alone live my life while that is still happening. I know it can be fixed because I was once given a drug that reduced it considerably but that got stop because I wasn't supposed to have been given it apparently.

For the third thing I can't choose but maybe it should be to be able to go out any place whenever I like without knowing that I'm not going to freak out at some point. or maybe even be able to have a conversation with a real person or make a phone call, that would be great. Also to get my brain to stop thinking all the nasty evil stuff, that's so sick I can't repeat it here. Even for 1 day would be great. Just 1 day after 30 years of non stop craziness, I'd settle for just that but I gave up on that ever happening years ago.

So why can't I just change my life. Well if it was that easy don't you think I would have done so by now? I don't choose to live this way out of choice. my brain doesn't have an off switch or a system restore function that will change it back to normal- if it ever was! It didn't come with a manual either so I don't know what I am supposed to be doing to fix it and nothing anyone has ever said to try works either.

Scruffalo Tue 05-Feb-13 09:35:13

And the stupid appointment system at GP surgery makes it even too difficult to ask for help. I can only get an appointment if I ring at 8.30am and I'm one of the chosen few who pass the interrogation by the receptionist. Well at 8.30 I was trying to carry a screaming and crying 5 year old into his classroom so I blew my chances for today. I will have to try my luck again tomorrow and watch my life fall apart in the meantime.

Scruffalo Wed 06-Feb-13 12:07:03

Luckily got an appointment in today's lottery. Unluckily it was with a doctor who didn't seem to (or want to) understand the problems.

Me: I keep sleeping too much, at inappropriate times, when I'm trying to do stuff and it is serious affecting my life
Dr:sounds like you need medication that helps you sleep at night?
Me: no. I just need to be able to stay awake during the day, like normal people do
Dr:Take these (amytryptaline) they will help you sleep at night
Me:I have no problem sleeping at night if I want to, its sleeping in the day thats the problem. Will the tablets help with that?
Dr: No. Are you suicidal? Do you have thoughts of harming yourself?
Me:No
Dr: Good. Come back in 2 weeks time

Why, why, why do I bother trying with these people. Why do I keep trying to change my life and make it better? Why won't anyone help me?

gingeroots Wed 06-Feb-13 17:06:39

Could you make another appointment with a different GP ?

Could the HV help ?

Really sorry it's like this for you .

kizzie Wed 06-Feb-13 17:18:29

Your 2nd mssage on this thread - where you describe what youd like to happen...

Id print that out and take it to the dr and say 'no one appears to been able to understand what ive been trying to say - can you read this please...'

And if youre worried about their response re your children - take out the line' 'i cant manage the basics'.

Really hope you get some decent help.

Cailleach Wed 06-Feb-13 18:06:55

Can you tell us what you mean by "crazy sleeping stuff" - do you mean you suddenly fall asleep in the day when you don't mean to or want to, such as when you're actually in the middle of doing something else (as in narcolepsy)? Or do you consciously go for a lie down in the middle of the day?

You say you don't have problems sleeping at night, or is there more to it than that? Is your sleep at night poor? Do you wake many times in the night?

Then number 2 would be to stop all the crazy obsessions with list making and planning and routines that take up around 75% of my waking hours
Can you give me an example of what you mean by routines?

I know it can be fixed because I was once given a drug that reduced it considerably but that got stop because I wasn't supposed to have been given it apparently.
Can you remember what this was?

Scruffalo Wed 06-Feb-13 20:43:54

I've seen all (4) the GPs at this surgery plus others where I previously lived and always get the same response. I've also tried writing everything down before I go, either to read out or just hand to the GP.

The sleep stuff I had another thread on here about. Its daytime sleeping but not through choice and for too long. I can go to sleep at night if I want to, but because most of my day is wasted sleeping I am having to stay up most nights now to catch up on work. I find it no problem to make myself stay awake during the night but don't have as much control during the day regardless of whether I slept the night before.

By routines I mean having to do certain things always the same way and at the same times. All tasks are ordered and organised and the worst part is I have to write them out in full before I can start any. I know people don't understand this at all but I have always had to do things this way, only the amount I do changes depending on how stressed I am- so it has got more as I get older. But like I said it did get a lot better (but never went away) especially not needing to write things down. The medicine that did that was called risperdone and it was prescribed by a locum. When the normal GP came back he stopped it because my hair was falling out and he sent me to counselling instead.

springpotatoe Wed 06-Feb-13 21:34:31

Have you ever kept a diary of sleeping habbits? Maybe you don't sleep enough each night? Write down the hours you sleep each night and day. Also, mention if you wake up during the night. You can then so this to your doctor and he/she might see what is the problem.

Scruffalo Wed 06-Feb-13 23:24:43

last few days of sleep

monday- awake at 7.30am (went to sleep around 1am) asleep again approx 10am until 12.30 aslepp 8.00pm ish until 10pm then bed at 4am

tuesday- awake at 7.30am, asleep by around 10.30am until 12 then asleep 8.20-10.45pm went to bed at 3am

wednesday- awake at 6.15am (woken by DS) slept 9.30-10.20am in car at doctors surgery will be going to bed shortly as very tired now and been out nearly all day. also nearly fell asleep leaning on counter while waiting at chemists for prescription approx 2.30pm

doesn't really show true picture though because those times where I have slept early evening I could have easily just gone straight to bed and slept right through, but I made myself stay up to catch up on work I have missed due to sleeping for blocks during day/early evening. So this looks like I sleep in day because I don't at night but its actually the other way round if that makes sense. I have only been doing this for the last week or so in an effort to try to take back some control over my life whereas the sleeping problems have been going on much longer. Before I was forcing myself to stay up at night I was averaging 16 hours sleep per day and only 8 hours awake!

Cailleach Thu 07-Feb-13 01:12:53

I really think you need to be referred to a specialist: the question is for what.

What do you feel would happen to you if you didn't make your lists before doing jobs: something bad, or can you literally not start a job without making a list?

Have you ever been diagnosed with any disorder at all, physical or psychological?

Personally I would be asking for a referral to a psychologist or neurologist, over your sleep issues alone.

Scruffalo Thu 07-Feb-13 11:22:07

If I didn't write lists most things wouldn't get done and others would just take a very long time. Even stuff like getting dressed/washed has to be on it because even though I know I need to do those things, when they are just in my head it feels like they are all jumbled up. I have to write it down so I can see which things to do first, second etc in a logical way and not just do them as they pop to the front of my brain.

An example is I couldn't just think I need to clean the kitchen and just start doing it. I need to write down each step like- washup plates, wipe worktops, take out bin etc. Then I need to work out timings for each part and sometimes break it down even more like take lid off bin, tie up bin bag, take outside, put new bin bag in, replace lid. It sounds stupid I knw, but I need to do it that way, not because I don't know how to take a bin bag out properly, but just so I can concentrate and get it done with out being distracted by my brain suddenly thinking of something else. If I have a list with it written down with timing I know what I supposed to be doing without having to rely on my brain too much.

The bad things that can happen is if I get the timings wrong and spend too much time on something or I get interupted or distracted. Then I either have to skip things out of my list which isn't good and makes me feel terrible or instead just start a new list instead. But if I am interupted normally, like if Someone calls round unexpectedly, and that makes me go off the routine then it does make me really angry with that person and then even when they are gone I am so angry I can't stop thinking about it to be able to concentrate on a new list so then nothing gets done.

Cailleach Thu 07-Feb-13 13:51:28

I really think you need to ask for a psychologist referral. In the meantime, my cousin has very similar symptoms to yours and was diagnosed a few years ago as having ADHD.

I wouldn't dream of diagnosing you over the internet; that's the psychologists job, but I think you should take a look at the following page, especially the symptoms and associated disorders bit (paying special attention to 'primary disorder of vigilance') and see if it rings any bells.

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Attention_deficit_hyperactivity_disorder

Scruffalo Thu 07-Feb-13 17:18:23

No sorry that doesn't sound anything like me and I'm not sure how falling asleep too much can be a symptom of of ADHD really. Also if I had ADHD then it would have been noticeable when I was younger, as I don't think its possible to just develop it as an adult.

your sleep routines can be very messed up when you have adhd. My Ds sleep routine is such that left to his own devices he stays awake all night and sleeps a lot the

sorry, meant to say sleeps a lot in the day

Cailleach Thu 07-Feb-13 17:58:03

My cousin is 34 and her ADHD was "missed" when she was a child, as such conditions were not well understood back then. She was thought of as fidgety, naughty, disorganised, messy etc. I am nearly 36 and have just been diagnosed ASD: again, such conditions were not as well understood when I was a child, even though looking back my symptoms were obvious when I was young.

From the Wiki article above, section on associated disorders:
"Primary disorder of vigilance, which is characterized by poor attention and concentration, as well as difficulties staying awake."

Perhaps you don't have ADHD, but I still think you would benefit from a referral to a specialist. If your GP won't refer you, change GPs.

Wishing you the best of luck,

C

CajaDeLaMemoria Thu 07-Feb-13 17:59:06

Being suicidal doesn't mean that they help you solve the problem, just that they will make sure you cannot commit suicide.

Having a physical illness that won't kill you doesn't mean you get help either.

I've got both.

MechanicalTheatre Thu 07-Feb-13 18:07:05

"they will make sure you cannot commit suicide"

I so wish that was true. I know so many people who are struggling badly, suicidal and yet are given so little help. They always tell you to go to A&E if you are suicidal but when you actually get there, they do nothing. I've been sitting there saying I'll kill myself and they've told me to go home.

Unfortunatlyanxious Thu 07-Feb-13 18:14:00

It sounds as if you have only ever been seen by GP's, is that right? because you need to see a specialist. I am afraid my knowledge of ADHD is scant though I do know one person who was diagnosed as an adult and got some kind of mind exercises and it helped her.

I can't offer insight on your issues but have you ever shown your GP the lists you have to write? The conversation you had with your GP was very brief. Are you not confident in explaining your issues? Could someone you trust go with you?

adhd is often missed in girls too. I believe it was missed with me. I have many symptoms of adhd but its so hard to get a diagnosis as an adult, my doctor has refused to refer me.

I wish you well and hope you get the answers you need.

Scruffalo Thu 07-Feb-13 19:54:12

thanks for all the advice but I really don't think I have ADHD. From that whole page on the link, 1 sentence fitted me, the rest didn't describe anything even close.

What I mean about noticing when I was younger is that I would have noticed or had the sleeping problems then which I know I didn't. In fact I was the opposite as a child, my mum says I didn't sleep at night as a baby and didn't sleep through until I was way past school age. After that I can remember most nights staying up until 2/3/4am and obviously being tired in the morning at school but I never used to fall asleep in the day. i just used to catch up at weekends/holidays etc by staying in bed until lunchtime!

The sleeping problem I have now have only started in the past couple of years I think, and it would only usually last for a few days at a time. It has only been the last few months where it has happened every day.

Cailleach Thu 07-Feb-13 22:31:21

"What I mean about noticing when I was younger is that I would have noticed or had the sleeping problems then which I know I didn't. In fact I was the opposite as a child, my mum says I didn't sleep at night as a baby and didn't sleep through until I was way past school age. After that I can remember most nights staying up until 2/3/4am and obviously being tired in the morning at school but I never used to fall asleep in the day. i just used to catch up at weekends/holidays etc by staying in bed until lunchtime!"

I beg your pardon but you are contradicting yourself here. You just said that you did have sleep issues as a baby, that your mother told you so, and that you used to stay awake as a child until the wee small hours. And that you would compensate for that by sleeping in at weekends and holidays. How does that not constitute a sleep problem? That is not a normal sleep pattern for a child.

Of course you wouldn't fall asleep in the day as a child: you had fewer responsibilities then, plus no chores to do to run a household, no job either, no children to run around after, and also you could stay in bed at the weekend to compensate. You can't do that as a parent, so of course you are tired!

If you have always been a certain way - and I know this myself from being ASD - then it is less obvious to you personally that there is something "wrong" with you.

I really really would ask for a psychologist referral from your GP. I do hope you get the help you need; keep us posted on how you get on.

thunksheadontable Thu 07-Feb-13 22:37:29

Not a psychologist either but would you think maybe the list making is a bit OCD? Have you ever had any CBT or anything like it?

thunksheadontable Thu 07-Feb-13 22:39:05

Also 'crazy evil thoughts' can be OCD too.. intrusive thoughts...

thunksheadontable Thu 07-Feb-13 22:42:23

(And ASD and others share some features in common with ocd, but what you are describing and the anger at being interrupted and having to start again sounds v like ocd to me, which is my diagnosis).

MechanicalTheatre Thu 07-Feb-13 22:53:17

Yeah I was going to mention the intrusive thoughts as well. I get those (I have BPD) and although it's disturbing, I don't think you should judge yourself because of them.

Scruffalo Fri 08-Feb-13 00:15:35

I meant I didn't have the problem of sleeping too much as a child , it was the opposite and I didn't sleep enough and I coped fine with it. Even up to my 20s I was doing this because I usually worked the late shift (11am-7pm) so I would go to sleep 2-3am most nights and get up around 10am. I never felt tired doing that or needed to have extra sleep to catch up, unlike now. Obviously things change once DC were born with night feeds etc and now needing to be up to give them breakfast and go to school.

I will have a look at OCD as I only really now about the cleaning type of that, which I definitely don't have by the state my house is in most days!

Anyway, I took the new tablets (amytripyline) for the 1st time last night. I am slighty worried as I can't remember now if the GP said to stop taking the citalopram or carry on with those as well. In any case I haven't noticed either any withdrawls from stopping the citalopram or any effects so far from the amytripyline. Last night I went to sleep at 12.30am and woke at 7.45am (slept through alarms and nearly late for school) I think I then slept between 10-12 but not sure as I was at my desk that whole time (sat upright) but I have no memory of what happened in that time and there was certainly no evidence of work getting done in those 2 hours. I then had to go home to wait for an engineer call out between 3-6pm and slept from approx 3.15 until 4.50 when the engineer knocked on the door. Also had 5 missed calls that I had slept through (phone in pocket) while I was asleep.

Unfortunatlyanxious Fri 08-Feb-13 08:34:40

The emphasis on cleaning with OCD means few people really understand what OCD is because the cleaning being tidy information is always focused on. I have been diagnosed with OCD amongst other things. Mine kicks in when my other illness is bad.

I actually think you should not diagnose by Doctor Google, write down your issues and get a referral.

The lists you write

The intrusive thoughts and honestly the stuff I told my counsellor which is vile, they didn't flinch or lock me up

The falling sleep

The fears of going new places

I fall asleep when very stressed and feel incredibly tired, not to your extent but I have fallen asleep when sat upright

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