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Spiritual practice ENDED 7 years of mental illness...

(73 Posts)
flakecake Sun 17-Mar-13 11:35:26

Hi all,
I used to talk on here many moons ago (2005-2007), as I was very very mentally disturbed and found every day a struggle. After 7 years of suffering I found out the cause of my pain was spiritual. Daily prayer and listening to Qur'an bought me out of it in 6 months. Bare in mind I did the drugs thing for 7 years and in a cyclical pattern had times when I felt I would not survive one more day without tranquilizers e.g diazepam. The cause, for me, was negative spirits... I am just throwing it out there for you all to consider, as now I have not been on medication for a year and feel like ME again, I feel normal. (grin)

coxspippin Sat 23-Mar-13 16:36:06

flakecake- how did you come to know that you were possessed by evil spirits? and can you tell me which prayers and parts of the qu'ran you used/ use?

working9while5 Sat 23-Mar-13 15:55:14

One of the issues I have with mh forums is the intolerance of difference. Psychiatry is one of the few medical disciplines where if people are well it is because of their medication and if they are unwell it is because of their own irresponsibility/noncompliance Tec.

I think it is tricky. I have lived with and around mental illness my whole life. I have very rarely heard anyone convey a delusion that isn't somehow symbolic of their intense suffering if you view it laterally. And I am talking about extreme delusions like putting tinfoil on your forehead because you believe there are federal agents listening to your thoughts. The OP' s posts speak of intense suffering and pain. That is what I hear. I don't see that anyone else has a greater right on these boards to judge that sharing that pain is not okay because others also suffer.

I know some people find talk of spirits painful...but the fact that others suffer doesn't change the suffering of believing you have been possessed because you are weak due to traumatic events you have experienced, even if the op now feels well. Mental health professionals can be life saving and very helpful but others may have had extremely negative and even abusive experiences with them and unfortunately from a position of vulnerability or difference it can be very hard to communicate this or find an alternative route to wellness without sounding very unwell.

I don't know if op is well or not but her post was made as a genuine one and I can't see how it is irresponsible to share your genuine beliefs. It is surely just what she believes.. but yes, agree to disagree.

TrampyPanterNoster Sat 23-Mar-13 15:38:08

While it may not be helpful to call someone batshit etc, I am more concerned about the posters reading this. I dont dispute that religion, etc can be helpful to some people, but claiming that you were possessed by evil spirits and so on, ON a MH board is far from helpful. It's downright irresponsible. However, agree to disagree.

working9while5 Sat 23-Mar-13 15:32:28

I do agree about pming being unfair but I don't think that an mh forum is an appropriate place to be talking about people's views being 'batshit' or being sarcastic etc.

Juggling' s post upthread hit the right note I think.

working9while5 Sat 23-Mar-13 15:24:10

And if someone is considered unwell is it helpful to be critical?

Either a) the OP is unwell, in which case being critical of symptoms is not fair or b) she is well and reporting the route to wellness as it worked for her. In Islam, faith is seen as highly powerful which runs counter to current mainstream thinking but there are many around the world who subscribe to beliefs of spirits and demons. That is just a fact.

If a vulnerable poster reads the post and is triggered by it, that is part of their illness not due to the op posting her beliefs about her life here. If she had come on to say 'do you think...' and was randomly discussing this as a cause of mental issues and suggesting others stop taking medication I would agree but the op has a right to view her experience as valid.

I sometimes think half our suffering is down to being told our minds are disordered/defunct/broken. I am coming to the conclusion that set of beliefs is as damaging as believing in spirits etc. What is important is how you function internally and externally and how you live, what you believe gets you there.

I am highly sceptical about faith healing but if it is supportive of some people living the lives they want to without suffering I don't think that should be discounted or reacted aggressively to because others don't agree. Many people have mixed feelings about meds etc and there should be room for discussion of alternatives.

TrampyPanterNoster Sat 23-Mar-13 15:01:49

what TheAccidental said. I stand by my belief that this thread is in a totally inappropriate place. had she posted this in S+P, fair enough. But this board is used by vulnerable posters who resent taking their meds, who hate having MH issues and in many cases suffer paranoia and delusions. suggesting that evil spirits and possession is to blame is not only counterproductive but also downright dangerous and irresponsible.

TheAccidentalEgghibitionist Sat 23-Mar-13 14:58:10

I disagree working9while5 a great many of us have offered constructive advice and voiced our concerns. The OP was saying she had been possessed. Many people would say that is not the voice of good mental health.
She messaged several of us which was intimidating and unpleasant and she was reported for that reason.
I take you have read the thread in its entirety?

working9while5 Sat 23-Mar-13 14:48:51

I think it might be worthwhile remembering that for many years and in many cultures and traditions, acute human suffering was fully believed to be spiritual by the whole community. Were generations of people totally 'batshit crazy' for having these beliefs?

I am not a believer in any religion but I do know someone who claims to have been faith healed. She is asymptomatic. Depression is described in terms that are spiritual: feeling hopeless, empty, despondent etc. These days we call it illness but in the end of the day it is acute human suffering and there are people who look to faith to alleviate that suffering. This is not a disorder, it is just a different way of looking at the world.

What you think doesn't make you crazy, it is what you do with your thinking that disables you. Anyone can think of anything but if you are getting on with day to day life and functioning, you are not ill because you think differently to others.

What an unsupportive thread.

ReallyTired Wed 20-Mar-13 14:01:27

Over prescription of anti depressants happens for understandable reasons.

www.guardian.co.uk/science/2004/mar/30/drugs.sciencenews

www.psychologytoday.com/blog/side-effects/200905/overprescribing-antidepressants

The problem is that the waiting lists for theraphy are far too long. If nothing is done then the patient can become very ill. GPs often have very little time to assess whether someone is clinically depressed or just intensely unhappy as appointments are so short.

ReallyTired Wed 20-Mar-13 13:54:25

HotCrossNaanAndResurrectOn

Depression is real and can be a serious illness. It is a whole spectrum and plenty of doctors believe that anti depressants are only appriopate for moderate to severe depression. At the mild end, the side affects of anti depressants outweigh the benefits.

www.nhs.uk/conditions/Antidepressant-drugs/Pages/Introduction.aspx

"The Royal College of Psychiatry estimates that between 50 and 65% of people treated with an antidepressant for depression will benefit."

I believe that priests in the past did a good job of stopping MILD depression becoming something far worse. In a community where people talk to each other, depressed people get support before they realise that they are depressed. Familes and villages look after each other.

Its interesting to wonder why the incidence of both severe and mild mental illness has dramatically increased in recent years. Why do some communities have less incidence of depression than others?

www.clinical-depression.co.uk/dlp/depression-information/major-depression-facts/

TrampyPants Wed 20-Mar-13 13:54:06

What hotcross said. And I have never heard of a gp prescribing meds for "unhappiness". fgs.

Bloo, my concern is for the vulnerable users of this board. Many mners suffer delusions, paranoia, anxiety and hallucinations. Accepting that you have a mental illness is hard enough without the suggestion that its actually caused by demonic influences.

HotCrossNaanAndResurrectOn Wed 20-Mar-13 13:41:54

"common cold of mental illness" indeed.

yes, talking therapies can be very effective - similar to talking to a priest, but research (you know, actual scientific studies that can be proved and all of that stuff) shows that its much more effective when both medical and counselling are combined.

BLOO3Z Wed 20-Mar-13 13:40:49

I am shocked by the nasty reaction flakecake as got on here, what happend to support, and listening to someone who may not have the same opions as you.

HotCrossNaanAndResurrectOn Wed 20-Mar-13 13:39:14

Oh Yay for the good old days before meds.

Much rather be medicated than be blasted with water, dropped through floors and put in rooms to be mocked or have the spirits beaten out of you. hmm

ReallyTired Wed 20-Mar-13 13:02:26

Religion helps people build networks and communities. If Islam is helping the OP to be well then don't knock it. I am pleased for her even if I don't share her beliefs.

I think that mental illness has become overly medicalised. In the past the treatment of all mental illness was deemed the department of the church. This changed with King George III having full blown pychocis caused by porphyria. The arch bishop of canterbury was unable to cure the king. The king needed drugs and doctors which did not exist.

Nowadays GPs prescribe drugs for the common cold of mental illness ie. mild depression/ anxiety or even plain unhappiness.

However I think for low level depression and anxiety the listening ear of a kind priest probably did wonders. Being part of a community who attend church helped people make friends and gave structure to people's lives. I believe that prayer calms the mind and helps the person look outwards.

Stopping mild depression/ anxiety in its tracks prevent something simple turning into major depressive illness.

BuddyButters Wed 20-Mar-13 12:24:17

Oh that's right. Give her some other guff to worry about.

Honestly.

BLOO3Z Wed 20-Mar-13 11:29:35

flakecake I am really pleased that you are feeling well now and at peace, are you living in the same house now? The reason Im asking is because the place you live in can be the cause not you personally. I have lived in a few haunted houses and one in particular which really affected me, thankfully I dont live there now..

ReallyTired Mon 18-Mar-13 20:41:51

I can understand where they OP is coming from. Having a good spirtual life does help with mental illness. Going to church/ mosque helps you look outside yourself, it gives you a sense of community, purpose. Prayer can have a calming effect.

I suppose what the bible refers to as evil spirits is what muslims call ginns. I don't believe that people are pocessed by demons, but I do not think that people can be tormented by demons. However before you say I am completely and utterly mad, you have to decide on a definition of what a demon is. I use the term "demon" to describe conditions that affect our personality and the essence of who we are.

I don't think that demons are beings with horns and pointy sticks. I think that the terms "demons", "evil spirts", "ginns" were used to describe things that people did not understand. Ie epilesy, scisropenha, biopolar, autism or personality disorder. Certainly these conditions were a terrible cross for people to carry two thousand years ago as they are today. Mental illness attacks the soul and the essence of who people are. It is understandable why two thousand years ago people believed in demon pocession.

Descibing mental health conditions is a bit like comparing the story of creation with the big bang theory.

PilgrimFellowship Mon 18-Mar-13 00:54:27

Message deleted by Mumsnet for breaking our Talk Guidelines. Replies may also be deleted.

MarvellousYou Sun 17-Mar-13 16:25:13

I kind of 'get' what the OP is going on about and yes indeed it is 'batshit' and dangerous to suggest it is anything other than that.

FripperiesAndBollocks Sun 17-Mar-13 16:19:55

I think this board is actually the worst possible placxe you could post this crap.

You need medical help for your delusions and telling others that no meds and lots of prayer is a cure for mental health issues is dangerous, not to mention batshit.

MarvellousYou Sun 17-Mar-13 16:14:36

I believe there are evil spirits and I believe in demon possession. I also believe that you are harming people by coming on here and making such a sweeping statement about mental health and spirituality. I don't think you could have been more vague/unhelpful and it worries me that you don't actually 'know' what you're talking about. I'm glad you feel well but maybe a talk forum isn't the best place to share your new found 'freedom'.

TrampyPants Sun 17-Mar-13 15:58:33

babyheave, yes to all that.

TrampyPants Sun 17-Mar-13 15:58:01

fuzzpig, I totally agree. I agree with Beertrix that some people find a peace from spirituality and that CAN help. but, alongside regular contact with MHPs and the correct treatment, whether it's medication, CBT or a short stay.

And I also agree with Mary, pming posters who disagree with you is creepy and intimidating. I have blocked and reported the PM, I would urge anyone else to do the same.

nenevomito Sun 17-Mar-13 15:57:09

I'm all for people finding faith and spirituality helpful in difficult times, it's not something I turn to being an atheist, but each to their own.

Thinking your MH problems are down to possession by evil spirits is a whole different kettle of fish, mainly because there's no such thing as possession or evil spirits.

I've gone through periods of believing I was better and not taking meds. It works for a while, particularly when I'm hypomanic as I feel fantastic. The problem is that it doesn't last forever, and I'm concerned that next time you're ill, you'll think you're possessed instead of getting help.

As it is, the only people I've ever met who thought they were/ have been possessed, were the people I met as an inpatient.

I can't stop you from kidding yourself, but I'd urge anyone reading this utter bollocks too think twice before blaming your MH problems on possession.

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