can I say ACAS are rubbish?

[carocaro]

6 months later and have been told today that no one has really been looking after DH's case, it has been floating between the London and Manchester office.

What is the point of them? Do they ever help anyone? Or is it just some front for f**king misery and frustration?

Anyone?

[flowerybeanbag]

Well I've said on here several times that far too often the advice they give on their helpline is contradictory and sometimes completely inaccurate, so I certainly wouldn't recommend the phone line as a reliable source of information.

I don't know about specific case management though, I guess you must speak as you find. Does your DH have a solicitor helping him?

[RibenaBerry]

Erm, well yes they can be.

But you do realise that no one at ACAS is ever really 'looking after' a case don't you? If either party starts using them (to make settlement offers) they will usually get an officer nominated pretty quickly. If neither side doesn't, they don't interfere, other than the note at the beginning of the process telling you that they are there.

What have they done? Sat on an offer and not passed it along?

[carocaro]

Done nothing at all.

No officer nominated so nothing regarded settlement has even been broached.

DH called them again today.

Arrgh.

[littleredsquirrel]

You need to call the office and give the case number. They will put you through to the officer. But they are not there to give you free legal advice. They are there to act as a liaison between the parties and effectively pass messages regarding potential settlement. If you've not made an approach re a settlement sum and neither has your employer then acas won't have had anything to do yet. Do you have a lawyer on the case?

[RibenaBerry]

Um, well LittleRed is right. ACAS don't broach settlement. They only act as an intermediary if either party does.

Sorry, it sounds like there has been a misunderstanding about their role. On what you've said, they've not actually done anything wrong.

They do sometimes only allocate an officer when things get active - I guess it can be hard to tell which claims will involve ACAS and which won't, so waiting might help spread their workload evenly.

[carocaro]

I must be thick as I don't get it?

DH has sent them all the details via his solicitor as he was advised to get ACAS involved before it goes to an employment tribunal.

So do you have to tell them to do something eg: ask they other side if they are prepared to settle?

If they don't broach settlement what do they do?

Am confused.

[flowerybeanbag]

They do lots of things, 'what we do' page, but this bit of what they do is probably the most relevant to you.

Has your DH actually told anyone at ACAS and/or his solicitor that he wants to settle? If the solicitor advising and representing him on his tribunal claim doesn't understand what ACAS do and isn't dealing with it for him I'd suggest he considers finding another one tbh.

[RibenaBerry]

What Flowery said!

ACAS don't broach settlement. They act as an intermediary if one of the parties does. Your husband has a solicitor and hasn't been told this?

[carocaro]

Right so if he wants to settle he has to ask ACAS to speak to the other side and ask if they want to settle?

So why have they been sitting in meetings with British Airways for days on end and not returning any of my husbands calls?

His solicitor is more concerned with sqeezing more than the £4,000 we've already spent every nano-second.

And just answer the question! RibenaBerry! Why been such an arse!

Stop being all superior with you exclamation marks and what has your solicitor said etc. This is why this board gets on my tits!

[llareggub]

I really don't think RibenaBerry was being superior. She was expressing surprise that your solicitor hasn't been more forthcoming about the role of ACAS. I know it is a stressful situation but everyone is only trying to help here.

[littleredsquirrel]

Ribenaberry wasn't being superior she was trying to help you, as we all have been. You have asked a question and those of us who are employment lawyers/HR professionals are offering you our advice for free (!!)

If your solicitor hasn't told acas that you want to settle and also how much you want then in all likelihood all the acas officer will have done is make an initial call to your solicitor to say that he/she has been allocated your case.

In any event you should keep in mind that your DH's employer/former employer might not want to settle and might simply have said right from the outset that settlement is not an option. If that is the case then there is nothing that acas can do anyway. It is then for you to decide whether you want to incur the time and expense in taking the case all the way to tribunal. In many cases it simply won't be worth your while.

If you are unhappy with the fees that have been incurred then you should speak to your solicitor or to their supervisor. It is not necessary to use a solicitor for employment cases and so if you cannot afford to incur further fees and you do not feel that your solicitor is adding value then it might be worth your husband progressing the case on his own.

[RibenaBerry]

Carocaro,

I wasn't being superior, I was trying to answer your question and expressing surprise that your husband's solicitor wasn't guiding him through this process clearly enough.

They have been sitting in meetings for days with BA because (i) industrial disputes are a different issue, and they do hold negotiation meetings; and (ii) either BA, the union, or both, asked them to come on board.

It's not particularly nice to insult people who are trying to help you, no matter how stressed you are.

I think I shall leave this thread alone now...

[flowerybeanbag]

Goodness you are rude to people who are trying to help you!

My last post on the subject as well.

I assume you are not actually confused as to why ACAS are meeting with BA and Unite, but it's in an attempt to avoid a huge strike that will disrupt hundreds of thousands of people's lives and cost the economy millions of pounds. Personally I'm fine with them doing that. As Ribena says, it's a different service anyway.

The thing is with solicitors, they do two things, they advise you about the situation you are in, and they represent you to a third party. You need to instruct them, though, so if your DH doesn't want to pursue his case any further and wants to settle, he would need to specifically instruct his solicitor to do that. Let's give your DH's solicitor the benefit of the doubt for a moment and assume he/she isn't actually completely thick but just a bit hopeless and that there is a communication issue rather than anything else.

I would advise your husband to request a meeting with his solicitor to review his case and ask the following questions if he hasn't already:

1. How likely do you think it is I would win at a tribunal?
2. How much compensation would I be likely to get if I did win?
3. Approximately how much will it cost me in legal fees to pursue the case all the way through a tribunal?
4. How likely is it the other side will offer a settlement and how much might it be?
5. If I offer to settle how much do you think I might get?

Once he's got the answers to all those questions, your DH should decide which avenue he wants to pursue and specifically instruct his solicitor accordingly, in writing to avoid doubt.

I would say though, if your DH does offer to settle, he is unlikely to get very much if anything, as his employer will take that to mean he's not keen to go to tribunal so either might drop the case anyway or isn't confident he'd win it.

If the employer thought they might lose or it might cost them a lot of money, they would have offered to settle, and your DH is always going to get more of a settlement if the employer approaches him rather than the other way around. As his employer hasn't offered to settle, it's likely they think they have a good case, they think your DH might drop it anyway and/or they are not concerned about how much it might cost them.

[carocaro]

I am very sorry.

I was just getting angry and upset that I could get no clarity from DH, the solicitor or ACAS. TBH DH and the solicitor both need a kick up the arse with it all.

He has spent £3,300 so far on a unfair dismissal claim of £25,000, he solicitors thinks it's very likely he will win, but wants another £1,000 to take it to tribunal, which we do not have and they have told us they have now dropped the case, at the 11th hour, case due end of next week.

His solicitor told him that he should approach ACAS as A - it looks good to the tribunal as he has tried to sort it beforehand and B - the other side are playing the wating game too.

So my question is what the fuck now? And you should all tell me to piss off after being rude, but DH has just stormed out the house yelling he can't handle it anymore and I am at at loss as to what to do.

[carocaro]

Meant to ass that ACAS are trying to broach a settlement this week after DH spoke to the today. But said it would take a week.

[carocaro]

meant to add, meant to add and no settlement has ever been discussed at any point.

[RibenaBerry]

Thank you for the apology. I know you were upset, and I'll give anyone another chance if they're nice to me, so here goes...

First, do ACAS know how soon the hearing is? If not, get DH to phone up and tell them, and that realistically he needs this settled by, say, the end of th week or he'll need to prep for the hearing.

Next, find out what stage the lawyers got to. Have they done witness statements yet? If they have, pretty much all the hard work should be done. If they haven't, let us know and we'll explain how it works.

What settlement offer have you made and what number do you hope to end up at (or have you not talked numbers yet?)

[carocaro]

Thanks, really appreciated. So stressfull. Yes a figure has been discussed with ACAS and they do know when the tribunal is.

Because we are finincially buggered and owe some £, his solicitors (understndably)came off the case yesturday. After much discussion we have the £ from family to pay the outstanding and give money for the final tribunal paperwork. However they did apologise for their lack of communication about ACAS and their swift decision to exit the case with no warning or discussion; a senior partner called DH to talk to all through.

So if ACAS cannot broach a settlement he will go to tribunal as planned next week. DH feels confidant and OK about the actual tribinal, he spoke with a barrister who told him he 100% he should win; but who knows right?!?

So we will just have to wait and see. Thanks again and sorry. Will keep you posted.

[DancingHippoOnAcid]

Surprised at barrister saying 100% will win.

IME legal bods will NEVER say a case has 100% chance, funny things can happen in court.

Perhaps he told your DH that had very high chance, that in itself is a big admission for a barrister and sounds like you have an extremely strong case, as they have to be VERY careful not to give any guarantees.

Anyway, all sounds good and should be good news next week.

Settlements are often broached by emploers rigt at the last minute, even right by the tribunal door, or even part way through the hearing. Most employers would be unwilling to take an iffy case right through the hearing without making an offer. They might be testing your nerve.

Good that your sols are now back on side. They should be able to deal with any offers to settle, either from you or from the other side.

Good luck.

[carocaro]

Woo Hoo!

The other side broached a settlement 5 mins before they were due to go in to the tribunal, despite saying no to any sort of settlement for weeks and saying they were going to 'slam him'

DH is so releived, it's not about the cash, although it helps, it's about right from wrong, standing up for yourself and putting an end to the disguting lies and behavior of others!

Thanks again for all your advice. You were so right!

[Grannie33]

Yes I agree that Acas are total rubbish , I rang and spoke to a girl on the 17/10/2014 she could not be bothered , she went through the motions of pretending to be interested in what i was saying but the only time she came to life was when she was saying bye. Don not bother ringing them