Flowery or anyone else - how should I handle this?

[employmentissue]

I'm on a year-long secondment to another department in my company. The secondment was at a grade lower than my substantive job, but I kept my same pay and conditions.

While I've been gone, there've been changes in my old department and they've brought in someone there - man A - who has taken over part of my former job.

It looks as though my new department where I'm on secondment doesn't have the money in its budget to keep me beyond the year - the post is a lower grade and salary than my substantive position.

But in an informal meeting to talk about joint projects with my old department, I was told my old post would be going because there wouldn't be enough work to justify it.

(Bear in mind that there was enough work until Man A was brought in for a separate project and was given some of my old work - ironically he's someone I was appointed over in my substantive position over five years ago and he's there on a secondment too).

In the meantime someone else - man B - was brought in to cover my old job and is still there and due to return to his old job at the end of my secondment. So they haven't done without me while I've been away.

I've emailed my boss in my original job asking for a meeting saying I intend to return to that post and could we have a chat about any changes etc before I return? He and I don't get on particularly well - he was appointed after I was in post.

I've also spoken in confidence to a union rep saying I'm flexible about the role I return to, but I would oppose compulsory redundancy.

The union rep advised me having a chat to my old boss and just seeing what he says first - I won't give my hand away by referring to what I've been told.

I suspect there's some gamesmanship going on here because the new department would like to keep me but can't afford me. I'm happy to compromise and work across both departments if necessary, which might be a good solution for all side.

I don't want to make waves, but neither am I prepared to be pushed around.

Thanks if you've stayed with me so far.

Does anyone have any advice on how best to handle the meeting, bearing in mind it could have far-reaching consequences?

The union rep says it's best for me if they don't follow correct procedure, so I'm inclined to play the innocent, see what my boss says. But what's the best response if he confirms what I've been told unofficially?

Thanks for your patience and any advice.

[flowerybeanbag]

Why would it be best for you if they don't follow correct procedure? Don't understand that at all!

So man B is in your job, due to finish when you return? You have heard unofficially that your old post is going to be made redundant.

Not sure what you mean by gamesmanship, maybe you need to explain a bit more. What gamesmanship would mean you could stay in your new department without them paying?

Sounds as though there are a lot of nuances and little bits of information giving a big picture which you are not able to convey to us. With that in mind, difficult to advise you how to behave.

Couple of points though. If your union rep thinks it is a good idea if your employer doesn't follow the correct procedure, I'd advise you to not take everything he/she says as gospel or to take their advice without questioning it and without a big pinch of salt. Sounds as though they are wanting you to be treated badly so that there is an excuse for fight. Not my kind of person, and not a constructive or helpful advisor.

Havind said that, I agree you should have the meeting with your old boss. As far as you are aware, man B is going back to where he comes from and you will be returning to your post. Go to the meeting on that assumption and see what he says. If there is a question of redundancy you will be entitled to a consultation meeting with union representation, so any discussion about that won't take place at an informal chat. If your role might be made redundant you must be written to and invited to a meeting to discuss it, accompanied by your union rep.

So if redundancy is raised, don't discuss it and request that written invitation if it's not mentioned or forthcoming.

If it's not raised at all and your boss continues discussion as though you are returning and everything's fine, you need to decide whether to tell him what you've heard. That depends on where you heard it, is it a reliable (if unprofessional) source, would the source be happy for you to bring it up, will he know where you found out, what will the consequences be for you and the person involved...? Lots of ifs and buts.

I'd be inclined to just go for the meeting with your boss, see what he says, then based on that, decide afterwards whether to raise the redundancy issue yourself, or what your reaction is to whatever he says.

[employmentissue]

Thanks flowery - wise advice as always.

My reference to gamesmanship is a hunch, I work in quite a cut-throat environment and I wonder if my new department just might ultimately be trying to get me to work there for less money. I could be wrong about that though.

The union rep did seem helpful and understood my position when I said I wanted to resolve it amicably and find a solution to suit everyone - when I said if they were trying to edge me out I wanted to make sure at least they followed correct procedure that's when he said it would be better if they didn't. It was more of an aside than actual advice on that point.

If my boss doesn't raise a redundancy issue then I won't mention it to him.

It did come from an official source, but I think the source (and my boss) were working on the assumption that I wasn't going back to my old job, or were trying to make me think that there wasn't a job to return to so I should stay in the new department (perhaps take a drop in pay)

It would clearly change the way they handle it if I am going back - closing the post if I'd decided to make a permanent move would have been straightforward for them.

What do you think about the fact that some of my responsibilities were handed over to man A while I was away, thus making part of my role redundant? Is that something the company is able to do without consultation?

[flowerybeanbag]

In terms of consultation about the content of your old job, depends on lots of things, but if there is man b there doing your job it sounds as though giving a bit of work to man a won't have resulted in redundancy of the post as such.

I wouldn't want to advise on that point without knowing more and seeing the t&cs of your secondment agreement/any policy in place. If it were me drafting those t&cs there'd be something in there about roles might change.

I think you just need to proceed straight down the line. As far as you are aware, and as far as (presumably) your secondment agreement or other paperwork says, you will be returning to your post on x date. If anyone, either your new department or old boss, want anything else to happen, then they must take the necessary and appropriate steps. You just keep working on the assumption all is continuing as planned unless and until anyone else makes any kind of move otherwise.

[employmentissue]

Thanks again Flowery.

There wasn't a formal ts and cs for my secondment - I went there voluntarily but haven't have anything in writing about how the original job might change while I was away.

A significant amount of my old job has been given to man A as far as I can tell, but I don't know if that was a temporary move while I was away because man B isn't trusted so much.

I was aware things might change while I was away even though I hadn't been told that - in fact I posted on MN about nine months ago wondering whether to take up the secondment knowing it might be a risk. The company is going through significant change and is definitely going to have to lose people to save money.

If that ends up being me, I wouldn't be thrilled, but I do want to make sure it's above board and my boss isn't bringing in man A instead of me simply because he prefers him in a subjective way rather than on our comparative abilities and track records.

It's a big organisation with robust and clear HR policies which is good all-round.

And I will keep working on the assumption that my secondment ends on the agreed date and I go back as normal.

As you advised, if my boss tells me anything different during our meeting, I'll politely ask to adjourn the meeting because there are big issues at stake and it would need to be formalised.