11+ being scrapped

(1000 Posts)
musu Sun 05-May-13 11:36:32

At one school in Essex here

Interesting development which follows on from Bucks CC overhauling their 11+ and trying to make it tutor proof (although everyone I know in Bucks is still employing tutors).

MomOfTomStubby Tue 14-May-13 14:39:54

Anyway, I have TomStubby to pick up. The thread will probably hit 1000 by the time I get back so until the next thread seeker.

Ilikethebreeze Tue 14-May-13 14:41:07

[sorry to everyone that I am unable to be at the computer all the time, so I have to somewhat backtrack on some of these conversations].

MomOfTomStubby Tue 14-May-13 14:42:09

My excuse? House is a bit boring and quiet when DCs are at school which isn't quite as sad as yours.

FadedSapphire Tue 14-May-13 14:43:22

Why so mean Stubby?

Verycold Tue 14-May-13 14:47:20

Seeker there is no need to be quite so snippy with me, have I attacked you in any way?

I learnt Latin for six years and by the end of that time we were translating Caesar. It takes years and years and years to reach a level of competency in Latin that allows you to discuss the great works of literature written in that language. If you want to have a mixed ability group appreciating the merits of the literary works I think the only way of doing so would be by reading translations. Which is fine and worthwhile, but it's not actually learning Latin.

TheOriginalSteamingNit Tue 14-May-13 14:47:21

Oh. I have been a bit slow to work that one out, haven't I? How tragic.

seeker Tue 14-May-13 14:52:05

Sorry, verycold- I didn't mean to be snippy.

But as you said it takes so long to be able to translate serious Latin that discussing the literature in translation seems to me to be anything but washy washy- and certainly something that can be done effectively in a mixed ability class.

Verycold Tue 14-May-13 14:54:08

Absolutely, I agree with you. But I think there are some who are able to and would enjoy actually getting stuck into the language, but that won't be possible in a mixed ability class IMO.

pickledsiblings Tue 14-May-13 14:54:23

I'm assuming you've read the research associated with this article Ilikethebreeze wink: http://www.tes.co.uk/article.aspx?storycode=77983

pickledsiblings Tue 14-May-13 14:56:01

here's a clickable link for pro mixed ability teaching article

TheOriginalSteamingNit Tue 14-May-13 15:08:14

Only a few posts to go, and I hope nobody spoils things by observing that anyone else is a venomous and not very bright name-changing coward with a vendetta and an obsession bordering on the insane. That would be a shame.

FadedSapphire Tue 14-May-13 15:10:44

I'm confused... but heh, does not take much to confuse me these days....

beatback Tue 14-May-13 15:30:31

Cecilyp. Page 37. I would like to say the answer was A. Trafford achieves an average across its schools of 72% A TO C including maths and english, Sutton achieves and average of75.9% english and maths. Trafford is a area of huge differences in social economic terms, some of the poorest people in the country, as well as some of the richest "PREMIER LEAGUE FOOTBALLERS" 7000 kids over 30% go to Grammar Schools in Trafford so is "TOTALLY" Selective not "SUPER" yet even its worse Secondary School in Probably one of the most Deprived areas of england, STRETFORD HIGH SCHOOL still achieved 49% A TO C including Maths and english, and for seekers benefit the F.S.M take up was 35% in any definition a "MODERN".

MomOfTomStubby Tue 14-May-13 15:34:58

pickled - I followed the link. The sample seemed very small, too small IMO to draw any meaningful conclusions.

I don't agree but I can understand why people make the case for mixed ability teaching in primary schools but for GCSE classes?? I don't understand the logic.

Ilikethebreeze Tue 14-May-13 15:50:19

1 or maybe 2 pieces of research by someone, invilving 2 comprehensives, is way too small a study. And form what I am able to read, as is makes it very dark on my screen, is that most pupils didnt like it and didnt get on with it.

And some mothers like me would run a mile from it, if it was routinely done. Private, home educated, different comprehensive, even consider moving house.

RussiansOnTheSpree Tue 14-May-13 15:56:04

The thing about getting the exams out of the way early has nothing to do with boasting (what a ridiculous comment, really) and nothing to do with maximising chances in the league tables (although there clearly are bonkers schools that make kids start sitting exams in Y8 or 9 and carry on till the end of Y11 and beyond). It's about the kids not being bored out of their skulls at a point in their development when it's quite common to go off the boil or, worse, off the rails (Y8 and Y9). It's about letting them work at a more congenial pace without overly pushing them. It's about giving them the opportunity to do more in the 6th form.

wordfactory Tue 14-May-13 16:38:25

Thank you russians

DC should sit exams early when they are ready and they need to be challenged!

RowanMumsnet (MNHQ) Tue 14-May-13 16:56:08

Hello

We can see that this is a heated debate, but we'd be grateful if you could all remember our Talk Guidelines, especially concerning personal attacks.

seeker Tue 14-May-13 17:07:12

Perish the thought Rowan!

RussiansOnTheSpree Tue 14-May-13 17:13:30

Well, it's informative to see that disagreeing with Seeker is apparently against the talk guidelines but swearing at other posters is not.

seeker Tue 14-May-13 17:18:33

I didn't swear at you, Russian, and I apologised if you thought I did. However, I will report the post if you like.

And if disagreeing with me was against talk guidelines, there would not be many posts left on this, and many other threads!

RussiansOnTheSpree Tue 14-May-13 17:32:32

You clearly did. I didn't and don't accept the apology because that's the refuge of the scoundrel, doing something you know full well is unacceptable but then saying 'oh I didn't do it but hey I'm sorry anyway'. But Mumsnet clearly think it's just fine (when it's you) so you can carry on behaving as you wish.

I realise that you have been subjected to a rather nasty vendetta from one particular many headed hydra of a poster but that doesn't give you the licence to behave the way you do to others who attempt to engage with you in good faith. I will not be engaging with you anymore on MN because I have (some) standards.

CecilyP Tue 14-May-13 17:34:17

Cecilyp. Page 37. I would like to say the answer was A.

I am sure you would, but is it true?

Trafford achieves an average across its schools of 72% A TO C including maths and english, Sutton achieves and average of75.9% english and maths. Trafford is a area of huge differences in social economic terms, some of the poorest people in the country, as well as some of the richest "PREMIER LEAGUE FOOTBALLERS" 7000 kids over 30% go to Grammar Schools in Trafford so is "TOTALLY" Selective not "SUPER" yet even its worse Secondary School in Probably one of the most Deprived areas of england, STRETFORD HIGH SCHOOL still achieved 49% A TO C including Maths and english, and for seekers benefit the F.S.M take up was 35% in any definition a "MODERN".

I think you will find that Trafford is very like Sutton in that 30% of secondary school places are selective places. However, they do not take children just from their own LEA. They will take the brightest children form non-selective Manchester, Salford, the north of Cheshire, even perhaps the east of Warrington and other Greater Manchester LEAs. Which leaves plenty of bright children to go to the non-selectives. Whereas the majority of selective schools in Kent are only accessible to people in who actually live in Kent.

teacherwith2kids Tue 14-May-13 17:49:20

Cecily, that is exactly what happens round here too - yes, we have some residual grammars but because they recruit from an area up to 100 miles in diameter the remaining schools are more 'comprehensive' than 'seconbdary modern', and many are very good indeed and have expectations of full top sets getting 10 As/ A*s.

One of the schools locally, in fact, is so selective (top 0.1% or so) that it functions very like a 'Special School' for the very able - all that I would wish for is that admission was by a balanced Ed Psych assessment / statementing process rather than a high stakes test of a single simension of 'cleverness' on a single day.

Verycold Tue 14-May-13 17:56:01

Yay can I be the one to do the last post? winkgrinsmile

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