Academically Selective Education

(984 Posts)
HelpOneAnother Fri 07-Dec-12 15:16:02

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

TotallyBS Sun 23-Dec-12 18:54:17

'general statement'?

Putting aside official reports, some poster upthread somewhere was going on about kids ariving at her year 7 with a reading age 2 years behind their chronological age. Other MNetters have come on here to complain about their DC's teachers.

I am not saying that ALL teachers are incompetent but some certainly are.

What compelled me to post about teachers in a forum called 'Education'? Is that a trick question? confused

noblegiraffe Sun 23-Dec-12 20:26:00

It wasn't the fact that you posted about teachers on the education forum, but that you chose to follow up your opinion 'teachers aren't undervalued' with essentially 'they're a bit shit'. You're not saying that ALL teachers are incompetent (wow, thanks hmm), but you are choosing to focus solely on that which you think shows that as a 'bunch of professionals' they don't deserve a pay rise.

As for 'semi-literate kids', like I said, that is a huge statement to unpick, you can't simply conclude that teachers are incompetent. There are so many contributors here to the literacy system that teachers have very little control over. The kids. The parents. The latest teaching methods that must be followed. The curriculum. The measurement by which it is decided that a kid is literate. The suggestion that somehow literacy standards have fallen would also appear to be dubious.

As for people coming on here complaining about teachers - that's like saying holidays are crap, just look at trip advisor.

Why focus solely on the negatives then wonder why teachers feel undervalued?

TotallyBS Mon 24-Dec-12 00:07:45

Stop acting like the world is picking on little old you (or your profession).

Teachers are paid a reasonable salary IMO. You think you deserve more? So do train drivers, nurses, soldiers, me etc etc. What makes you so different or special?

As I said upthread, I consider cops, soldiers and firemen special because they risk their lives for a modest salary relative to the risk they take. Just because I regard teachers as just civil servants doesn't make me a teacher basher.

noblegiraffe Mon 24-Dec-12 08:20:56

No, it's because you use poorly thought-out arguments to suggest that we, as a group, are bad at our jobs that makes you a teacher basher.

I imagine if you'd said something like 'when you read all these reports of people dying in hospitals it doesn't paint nurses as a bunch of people deserving of a pay rise', nurses might feel a bit annoyed.

TotallyBS Mon 24-Dec-12 09:05:07

That is a silly analogy. People die in hospitals. It is a sad fact of life. It is not the same as a kid spending years at a school and emerging at the other end semi illerate. There are clearly schools that are failing and I am perplexed at a teacher getting all defensive merely because I've mentioned this as a subject for discussion.

And where do I make any comment on pay rises? If the teachers union negotiate a pay rise then good for them. All I am saying is that everyone else is either getting 0% or loose change rises becauseof the economy and I don't see the teachers as a special case.

You obviously see your profession as a special case. Why?

TotallyBS Mon 24-Dec-12 09:17:48

... and as for "teacher bashing" posts, I see a lot of selective education/tutoring bun fights but apart from MNetters posting anecdotes about their encounters with their teachers, I don't see any concerted efforts to 'bash' teachers in general. Having said that, you consider my comments as 'teacher bashing'.

noblegiraffe Mon 24-Dec-12 09:46:18

This is your comment I am specifically replying to, BS. I haven't really paid any attention to the rest of what you might have said, so focus on why exactly you said this:

However when people read about semi illerate kids graduating from the system etc etc it doesn't exactly paint a picture of a bunch of professionals that should be paid more.

Some kids will go through school and come out semi-literate. That is also a sad fact of life. Like I said, your comment is a huge statement to unpick without simply placing the blame at the feet of their teachers. That you can't see that suggests that you really don't know what you're talking about and just fancied a cheap shot.

TotallyBS Mon 24-Dec-12 10:14:43

You haven't paid any attention to my comments beyond the few sentences that rankle your chains and which you are now using as the basis as your anti teacher basher rant???

As a parent, that is a worrying thing to hear from a teacher. How do you expect to teach kids to listen to all the information before forming an opinion if this is your thinking in the Real World?

You aren't exactly making a case for teachers being a special exception compared to civil servants in general.

april1st Mon 24-Dec-12 14:35:41

I think this thread s gone on and on for too long just like the GSs - out of hand!

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