difficult buyer advice please

[nickstmoritz]

I sold a jacket almost 3 weeks ago. It was a brand new jacket still with the plastic on all the zips so I know it was in perfect condition. The details were on the description and measurements. Buyer also messaged me about size and all measurements given again. It was an expensive leather jacket. I packaged it very carefully and sent straight away. Buyer was in Greece so the postage (& my 10% to ebay of said P&P) is quite high. Buyer has now started sending me messages to ask about whether my "returns policy" is 14 days from receiving item or from date of sale. She says the jacket has arrived (her parents house) but she hasn't seen it yet as she is away. I am a private seller not a shop. I am not sure what to say. There really would be no reason to return this jacket that could be my fault - it's new & all details given. What should I say? I am not happy for it to be returned esp if I would have to refund the initial P&P which was probably about £15 (I would be down that amount). It is actually now 19 days since I sent it & that would be about 14 days after received by buyer if post took 5 days. I am not sure what to say to her. Why is she asking me about returns before she has even seen the jacket? Any advice would be gratefully received. I am an experienced ebayer but not sure what to say in this case.

[SavoyCabbage]

Did you put a returns policy in your listing? If not I would say she. Can't return it and suggest she sells it if she doesn't want it.

[nickstmoritz]

I am not sure but doesn't everyone have to offer 14 day returns? or is this just for BINs? I did sell this jacket as a BIN from when there was a free listing for BINS & auctions.

I'm really not 100% sure on what the rules are if anyone else knows could you give me the low down please. I'm not a business seller just a private seller. What do you all do about returns?

Usually I do actually let people return items for a change of mind and refund if they pay to post back (it does leave me out of pocket on initial P&P) but not many people do it so I don't really mind & feel it is worth protecting my DSRs and feedback by doing it. It is just that this is abroad and a fairly heavy item which I know will cost around £15 in postage. Plus there cannot be any reason other than simply changing mind or not taking any notice of measurements given specifically to the buyer before the sale.

[LavenderGreen14]

a buyer has 30 days to return if not as described - anything you write on a listing is irrelevant tbh.

You cannot refuse a return - a seller did with me last week, ebay gave me a free return label and apparently took action against her.

Either way she would have to return it tracked, most probably at her expense.

[nickstmoritz]

but what if the item is exactly as described? with all the measurements accurately given and new? buyer says she hasn't seen yet but worried it won't fit? arrggh why ask for measurements as well as them being on description anyway then buy and THEN start changing mind?

[LavenderGreen14]

the buyer can just lie in the case though can't they - your word against theirs.

[nickstmoritz]

I guess you are right. And no way to record a buyer as a pain in feedback.

Why do ebay suggest a 14 day return policy if a buyer has 30 days? Is 30 days a legal thing? or an ebay/paypal thing?

[HolidayCriminal]

Try not to fret, OP. It's out of your hands now, anyway. I doubt she'll want to return, but if she does then be ultra professional about it. She has to pay both lots of postage, btw, unless she's claiming it's faulty.

[HopefulHamster]

Assuming there's no fault, even if she returns it will have to be at her cost so don't stress too much.

[LavenderGreen14]

30 days is a paypal/ebay rule - used to be 45.

And if she does return it you do have to give full refund including the postage you paid - ie, all the money she gave you, not just the item cost. She will have to pay return costs though. She doesn't have to pay both lots of postage.

[nickstmoritz]

Ok I didn't know that about both lots of postage. It's that I was fed up about tbh. If she did post back carefully and I am not out of pocket then no harm done I guess apart from all the messing about with posting/messages/relisting etc I just was bloody annoyed about losing money on the P&P when I have done everything possible for a buyer. Also it is a big amount to refund too - over £100 :(

[HolidayCriminal]

That's why she wants to be sure she likes it, a lot of money for her to spend, too.

[LavenderGreen14]

and if she does return you want to send a cancellation request to get your fees back too.

This is the trouble with sending abroad, expensive postage to lose if they do want to return.

[nickstmoritz]

oh just read Lavender's post. Bugger! who is right about initial P&P? So I have to refund initial postage too? Totally annoying and unfair then - I charged £12 P&P but ended up paying more than that for signed for. I knew this buyer would be a pain with all the questions before buying. I just thought maybe they were being careful as it was quite a lot of money for the jacket (but still a third of what one costs from the store/website for this make).

[LavenderGreen14]

sorry - but I am right about the postage, Holidaycriminal is wrong.

[HolidayCriminal]

So if the buyer returns just because she doesn't like it, not because it's faulty, no Not as described, but just because she wants a refund, OP has to refund postage, even though OP is a private not a business seller?

[nickstmoritz]

Oh boo. Thanks LG14.

[nickstmoritz]

So if I said I was happy to refund only cost of item they could take it up with ebay but might not should they feel they have messed me about?

[LavenderGreen14]

yes - buyer is entitled to all of her money back. And if you say you will only refund item cost they can just open a case - and prob neg and trash your stars too.

[expatinscotland]

Next time, restrict the auction to UK only and block any buyer who does this.

But what Lavender said, she has to turn it, then you refund her.

[nickstmoritz]

Yes I should have done UK only. I will for anything else which is heavier/more expensive. Just not worth the hassle.

It really is a buyer's marketplace for sure. Even if you are a perfectionist as a seller you still can't avoid issues.

[HopefulHamster]

Lavender, out of curiosity when did it change that you had to refund buyer full amount if they change their mind? I know in ye olde days it was only for the item itself.

Certainly if I buy something online from Uniqlo say, and pay for postage, then return all the items, I don't get the postage back. So why does this happen on eBay?

I returned something today (to a seller who specifically stated returns are okay) and paid for the postage back - I am expecting the cost of the item to be refunded, but not the postage to me. Do you mean if the seller doesn't refund the postage I can ask for it anyway? Even though I have cost them money and they haven't done anything wrong?

It just seems really illogical to me. I've been using eBay for a long time but mostly as a seller, so any change like this could've easily passed me by. But I want to sell more again so need to get up to date!

Thanks in advance.

[LavenderGreen14]

I have never known a buyer not to be entitled to a full refund and I have been ebaying for 15 years now. I don't think it ever changed.

And yes, the seller has to give you all your money back. They can't decide to keep part of it.

[HopefulHamster]

Hmm, just seems odd but there you go. Maybe I've just been generous when I've returned stuff before, I don't think I've ever expected postage to come back unless an item has been faulty.

Was counting up the other day and I think I've been on eBay around 15 years too. Maybe since 98, though back then I was ordering tat from the US :)

[HopefulHamster]

Don't mean to sound disbelieving btw, I've always been more of a buyer than a seller!

[BreakOutTheKaraoke]

Hopeful, just to point out, with any online shop (UK anyway), if you return all items you've ordered you are entitled to a postage refund. If you contact them requesting a refund under the Distance Selling Regulations, you are entitled to a full refund of postage costs. They are only allowed to charge you return postage if it states in the original terms and conditions too. Shops very rarely offer you the postage back though.