DW wants to leave me

[sireni1]

I have been with DW 23 years, married 13. After another huge row the other day she has told me that she does not think she loves me anymore and that she has to think about what is best for DC and probably go.
Never done this before but i need another perspective especially female.
I love her more than i can explain and her leaving will break my heart.
It appears i am to blame as i do not fully engage in family life, i work long hours am the only bread winner, we have large family commitments, i run a business employing others..all this leads to massive stress on my part, find it difficult to switch off and calm down at home and head is not where it should be. Having said that i do do things with kids at weekend, take them places etc and love them dearly. I am not an abusive husband, not emotionally controlling or financially i earn it and hand it all over to a joint account and spend none on myself.
To summerise. apparently i don;t think of the family as i have missed some family engagements. My wife swares blind that she reminded me but did not, i can do not right i am always being critised i work 60 hour weeks then get berated for cleaning at the weekend as i am trying to make a point...point is our house is a mess and i cannot tell her this as critisim is not tolerated

What do i do?
sorry for grammar and sp.

[Rainbowqueeen]

Would you be willing to go to counselling?

If so, it needs to be you who organises it. Words are easy to say but if you want to say your marriage then action is required.

[Rainbowqueeen]

Save, not say

[sireni1]

organised and shortly to begin. have been here before a number of years ago which i found fantastic and theraputic. i also think DW realised that not everything was down to me. i hope its the same this time.

[sireni1]

organised and shortly to begin. have been here before a number of years ago which i found fantastic and theraputic. i also think DW realised that not everything was down to me. i hope its the same this time.

[Nearlyhadenough]

I have been married for nearly 24 years, 2 DC who are now grown up. Our situation is different as H has been emotionally abusive - it is me who wants to leave but like you, my H, wants to 'do whatever he can to save his marriage' (his words).

As RainbowQueen said - words ARE easy, actions are needed.

I don't know the ins and outs of your marriage, but after my H said he would do anything I expected something..... I got nothing. It appears you have taken the initiative and booked some counselling - that is a really good start.

Communication is another important aspect, keep talking.

[sireni1]

Thanks nearly I thought I was getting nowhere with this.
Sadly I did not book it, however I am a willing participant.
I would be the first to admit that I have contributed to how she feels toward me. However I would add in my defence that many of the things I am critisised for, mainly not doing enough with the kids I could equally lay at her door.
I agree that saying you are going to change is pointless, actually understanding what the problem is then doing something to address those issues is the key. I have already begun doing this..seeing doctor etc about my mental state and how this effects those around me.
What gets me though is I always say sorry, I never win an argument and its always a spiral down blamed upon me which is the route of our problems. I can forgive and forget..she sadly cannot, and that's not limited to me.
I am not deeply worried that she has travelled too far from me and am frankly shit scared that she will go without really understanding what is happening.

[sireni1]

sorry last sentence should not have NOT in it URGH FAT FINGERS!

[Nearlyhadenough]

Book a counselling appointment.

Or at least let DW know that you want to book an appointment if she's willing.

[sireni1]

we have booked an appointment. i have told her that i will do anything that will bring us back together. I just feel that what happened to her parents has resulted in an awful predesination with our own relationship that she is determined to fullfill regardless of anything i do..Its just the worst thing you can imagine that no matter what you do you watch the person you love being pulled from you by a ghost from another life. i know that sounds odd but trust me from where i sit it is not odd but sole destroying

[MindSweeper]

You talked about spending time with the kids but have you been able to spend much time with just your wife, have you been able to have a relationship with just her as a husband, instead of being the father and the breadwinner?

You work hard, and it is difficult to find a balance, I have the same problem. It's something you really have to think about sometimes and make the effort. It sounds like she could have some resentment, and I am not saying thats you're fault at all so please don't think I'm having a go, I think it's probably both of you who maybe have neglected each other and need time to come together again.

It must be so hard for you and I feel for you, couples counselling would be a really good step so I'm glad you're sorting that out, what was her reaction to that?

[sireni1]

mindsweeper

cannot disagree with anything you say. However i do have this underlying guilt that i know who i am and she has never really known who she is and that its my job to step up to the mark and look after her. All my friends have always thought that she treats me badly and that is very loyal of them but they perhaps dont know what it is too really love some one have to put them before you!

Or does that just sound a bit navel gazing and shit/ I dont know?

[MindSweeper]

I think that's an unhealthy mindset to have if I'm being honest. You're not supposed to look after her, you're supposed to look after each other. You BOTH need to step up to the mark. A relationship works both ways and it's cliche but it takes two.

Are there examples of why your friends think she treats you badly, sorry to be intrusive and don't feel like you need to answer - but it might be helpful to get a better picture.

Just a note though, love doesn't mean you put their needs over your own or that you allow them to treat you badly. It just means you now share needs and both need to be met

[PiSeas]

From your first few posts all I can see is the word "I".
That might be where the problem lies.
Why didn'tyou book a counselling session? You admitted that you don't engage in family life. You've admitted that you find it difficult to switch off.
Perhaps you respect your wife for raising your kids and making a home? You admitted not spending enough time with your kids.


Maybe you talk to her and actually listen.
It sounds like she's checked out.and I don't blame her.
Read your posts again.

You're the problem. Not her.

[sireni1]

Sorry i did not answer your last sentence. This is the real nub of the matter. she wants to have counselling but i think it is to reinforce how she feels. I wan t it to tell her that i love her and that its not my fault, but i dont care whose fault it is i just want her back and i am moving heaven and earth so it works. However i cannot even get out of her on the phone that she misses me. And this is the head fuck.. itell her how i feel she just clams up and says she will try her best. Reading this back i have to admit that this does not sound good!

[sireni1]

piseas

Yes maybe you are right.

Again too much navel gazing at me and my problems. However it does not seem what i do is enough as she always sees it through the prisim of what happened to her parents, which was not good!

The point i am trying to make is that all the things she holds against me she has a point...i agree with. The issue i think maybe is that my issues with her are not addressed in the same way. This leads to me feeling resntful as i am always the one that says sorry.

[MindSweeper]

PiSeas I don't think we have enough information to make that assumption at all, you're being unnecessarily harsh on the basis of OP using the word 'I'. Odd. Not spending enough time at home and raising children is something a lot of us struggle with every single day, it does not mean we are bad partners, or bad parents, and it certainly does not make us 'the problem'. It means that people have to work harder at relationships. But they need communication to do so.

siren I 100% think you should go to couples counselling and as the saying goes 'it'll all come out in the wash'. A good counselor will not simply reinforce what she feels because they'll allow you both to talk about your feelings and work through them properly, in a controlled environment. To be honest, it doesn't sound good, but you need to take one step at a time and the counselling is a good step. You accept there's a problem, that's an important thing, you both talk about how the problem affects you, and you then talk about how you both can make changes to fix it - if thats what you both want.

[sireni1]

mind

mindsweeper
Yes you are right. However i am of course a proto feminist. But my wife has had a lot of awful shit happen to her and i really want to protect her from anymore. I want her to see that i am someone that has her back and she can tottally trust. The troubl is it does not work that way. I'm not sure what way it works. Al i know is that all my girlfriends and they are just friends fucking hate her because they think i am an ok bloke and she treats me like shit..... thats if iam really honest....perhaps???

[MindSweeper]

One quote springs to mind here: don't set yourself on fire to keep others warm. Your wife is an adult and whilst she needs a supportive husband and father to her children, she does not need someone forgoing their own health to 'protect' her. Feminism isn't about backing us and supporting us 100%, it's about us being equal and that equality means we also fuck up and we're also shit at times. It doesn't mean that we have to be supported and protected even when we are wrong.

It's difficult to judge really because you haven't given examples how your friends think she treats you like shit.

Could you give an example of your basic day?

[PiSeas]

Siren you're agreeing to what I said so you have two choices:
Marriage counselling and you actually listen to DW
or
Cut your losses and walk away.
But , she's told you what she wants already and you clearly didn't hear her.
Navel gazing is just another excuse for laziness.
If you want your wife and children then I suggest you listen very carefully to her words or you'll end up in a shitty situation where you see your kids EOW.

Mind I'm going on all the info that siren provided.

[PiSeas]

I do hope you stand up for your wife when your girlfriends slate her.
Some how though, I don't think you do otherwise they wouldn't "hate her', because if you really loved your DW, instead of acting so hard done by', then you would've stood up for the woman you made vows to and the woman you had children with.
You are coming across as a lazy victim.

[MindSweeper]

I think it's quite clear that siren is potentially a person who MAY be being emotionally abused and/or gaslighted. Just because he is 'agreeing' with your scathing comment doesn't mean it is true, people with low self esteem who have been worn down oft will do that. Just like abused women will often find a way to make it their own fault. All I am saying it you're assuming an awful lot and being harsh in your replies instead of looking at the bigger picture and considering more.

Could you imagine a woman working 60 hour weeks, coming home to a house thats a mess but not being able to communicate her feelings because 'criticism is not tolerated', does that not ring alarm bells for you?

I am not saying OP is blameless here, as I have said it takes two to make a relationship so it's very likely there's fault on both sides, so for you to be so harsh and state op 'is the problem' end of is ridiculous.

[MindSweeper]

Oh and now he's a lazy victim.

Have you thought he could actually just be a regular victim?

[sireni1]

mindsweeper

I cannot think of specific examples of why my friends did not like her. Its like at uni would tell them that i had upset her and they would look at me like i was some sort of fool. The thing is that i was (sounds very arrogant) the kind of guy that girls liked from afar...however i never got involved because i was looking for the one. Trouble is this lead to rumours that i was gay. Did not help that my best friend at uni turned out to be gay. This kind of fed the fervour. Even in my DW mind i think she thought there was something in it. Which i have always found amusing as you will never meet a man that is more in love with women. howevever this was just another confusing thing to throw into the mix with a vulnerable person.

Gosh lots coming out here i have never talked to any one. Mumsnets certainly earnings its money tonight.

[sireni1]

its intersting to read your debate. The thing is you are both right. I look at what i have been like as a husband and i am ashamed of my actions. Regardless of how she reacted to those i was a selfish tosser. But do yo know what i have grown up.

There has been a situation in my life where i could have gone down a road that was fantastic and hedonistic. But i stopped myself because what i really realised is that all i have ever wanted is my children my wife and to mae them happy....that is the sole and only purpose in my life to which i flog my guts out every day... and then to be told i amnot doing enough is crushing!!!!

Again sorry for the spelling and grammar but i am very dyslexi. Who the fuck though t up a word that complicated for poeple whi cant spell ARGHHHH

[sireni1]

mindsweeper

Thank you for your support.

I'm no victim.. I earn all the money, i hold all the cards but it is something that i would NEVER hold against her. I would walk away from it all, give it all to her just so i could look her and my children in the eye and say i did the right thing. My father is a wonderful man.... if i did anything different i could never look him in the eye again..

Sounds very old fashioned. The point i am trying to make is that its not the financial consequence of what may happen that scares me its the emotional.
after our first DC a silly thing happend and the only thing i think of was that i wold not bring him up....i would not be there everyday for him....ANd i glad we worked that out as the last 10 years have been amazing....there is nothing better than a bueatiful boy coming into your room at 6am telling you he has cock puss and farting in your face. To everyone who is ever thinking of procruating just think on that!