No French Old Masters?

[Cam]

I went to the Musee des Beaux Arts in Arras last week and saw some 16th C French/Flemish religious paintings onloan from the Louvre.

Although they were wonderful (technically) they did not move me like the Italian Old Masters of the 15th C.

Nor were they as impressive as the Dutch Old Masters of the 17th C.

I'm thinking that the most important French movement was the Impressionists of the late 19th C.

[Marina]

Not forgetting one of the finest illuminated manuscripts in the world, Cam...The Tres Riches Heures du Duc de Berri.
Impressionists - agreed. Fauvists also much liked chez nous.
Top French artists for me and dh are Dufy and Matisse.
Am I getting a feeling here that you have recently returned from a trip to the Pas de Calais area ?

[Tinker]

Oh, we stated overnight in Arras last year on way back home. Alas, saw no Art, just rode on the funfair. But what an underated town.

[Marina]

There has been quite a lot of chat on ks' and other threads about the unsung loveliness of this region Tinker. Arras IS great and so is St Omer. Lovely town. Mmmm, endive au gratin. Mmmm, Jenlain biere de garde...
How are you lot?

[Cam]

You're quick off the mark today Marina

Managed a short trip with dh while dd was staying with my parents - it was great (understatement!) to only do grown-up things

Those Flemish squares in Arras are quite beautiful and the joy of eating a long dinner a deux at a decently late hour is indescribable.

[Tinker]

We're all hunky dory marina - baby has (shh, don't tempt fate) slept through the night 2 nights' running

[Marina]

Tinker, that is fabulous (she whispers). I am almost as envious of you as I am of Cam...
Let's just say our highlight this weekend was dd widdling on the patio and announcing, uh-oh, I did a wee-wee. Fat chance of palming her off on the grandparents on this kind of form

[Tinker]

Just emailed some recent snaps to you Marina. [Indulgent emoticon]

[Marina]

Lovelier than even the finest Old Master, your Young Miss

[Cam]

Lol Marina
Glad you're getting on so brilliantly being a mother-of-two Tinker!

[Raspberry]

Cam, can I understand the point you are making, is it WHY are there no French Old Masters? or is it ARE there any French Old Masters?

My potted history of art is such that I understand 'modern' painting began in Italy, arguable with Giotto and was developed by the Renaissance artists, again from Italy, so there is unlikely to be any French painters of any great note before say 1650. I may be wrong.

Equally, early art was generally commissioned by the Church or Monarchs, so a quest for early French masters would probably best begin with the French Monarchy?

One must not forget that Paris was, from quite an early date, a great mecca for artists, so some of the painters we associate as from other countries are technically 'French' as well.

[Cam]

Hi Raspberry, I was really just talking around the subject and wondering why there appears to be no French Old Masters.

Agree entirely with your analysis - have been thinking along those lines myself.

[monkeytrousers]

Paris was the centre of modernity in the 19th century as modern art found it's stride there with Courbert, Manet, Cezanne et al and then later the Impressionsists, Expressionists, Fauves, representing a purposeful break with Classicism. They led the world in (modern) art until post WW2 when the Americans took centre stage, for various reasons.

David was a French neo-classicist circa 18c.

[OldieMum]

What about Poussin and Lorrain (C17), Watteau (C18), David, Ingres, Courbert, Millet and Delacroix (C19)?

[monkeytrousers]

Poussin and Claude too, of course! {I've taken a year off is my excuse)