TTC or pregnancy on prednisolone or similar part 10

(1000 Posts)
roseandroli Thu 14-Feb-13 10:17:57

We are now on part 10 of this thread! I hope you can all find this. This is a positive thread for all those diagnosed with High or Very High NK Cells and looking to start TTC or already pregnant on Prednisolone and/or Intralipid treatment.

Newcomers very much welcome!

Links to earlier threads:

Part 9:

Part 8:

Part 7

Part 6

Part 5

Part 4

Part 3

Part 2 here

Part 1 here

found you!

Arianrhod Thu 14-Feb-13 11:05:35

Marking my place.

Lawlee Thu 14-Feb-13 12:16:21

Thank you Rose I wasn't sure how to do that from my phone!

Cartoon thanks, don't know about you but I've got to have something to worry about lol. For example my current paranoia is that because they didn't see anything on the scan yesterday this will turn out to be ectopic, even though logically i know that at less than 4 weeks its probably just not possible to see anything yet! I think it's a natural reaction to what we've been through to worry.
Yes I have a clearblue digi in reserve for Tues next week when AF would normally be due, till then I'm going to keep using the Superdrug ones and see how I get on. I know it's obsessive but I did a second test this morning and line still there though faint, so yay not an evap!
I don't know if we would have seen each other because I see Mr S under the NHS so my scan was at St Helier in the general gynae place and not with him personally. Was that where you were? I was there for a 2:15 appnt but they were running quite late. If we were there together I was the one looking like a zombie lol (literally not a wink of sleep in the last 2 days!) and had a red jumper on carrying a white coat. X

oh right no then. I see him at New life in Epsom. always wonder though when I'm there if anyone else from this thread is there too. was it difficult to get on the NHS?
my dh says I'm not happy unless I have something to worry about!

GreenOlives Thu 14-Feb-13 12:46:42

Place marking!

Lawlee Thu 14-Feb-13 12:47:03

Not too bad but I think I was just lucky in where I lived. I have only actually seen him once myself, I think on the NHS you get referred to his clinic as a whole an then see whoever is free when you need the appointment rather than just to him personally. Fine by me as long as the treatment is the same! I don't think intralipids are usually included in the NHS treatment though so looking into whether its worth me going private for those, but my main contact at the clinic I away till Tues so will have to wait till then to find out.
Lol maybe we should all have secret hand signals or something to identify ourselves when we r there! X

haha lawlee brilliant we so should! your so lucky. this is costing a fortune! totally worth it so far though obvs but wow its expensive.
mollie sorry I forgot to say that I'm really pleased your doing ok and that your feeling fairly positive about things. onwards and upwards!smile

Lawlee Thu 14-Feb-13 13:16:16

I know and believe me I am grateful every day. I would and will pay for whatever is needed to make this work though even if I have to scrape together pennies from the back of the sofa to do it, I don't expect it's going to be a cheap ride all the way regardless! I did hear before that some of the ladies on here managed to get their drs to convert their prescription to NHS ones, so might that be worth looking into for you to save a bit on the cost side? Xx

mollieboo Thu 14-Feb-13 13:18:03

Thursday 14 February 2013
30 November 2012

The babies are arriving!
Stogan - V high NKC - cycle#2, DC#1, Baby girl Ellyson (DC1) born Sunday (EMCS) 11/03/12 7lb13.5.
Digitalgirl - High NKC - BFP cycle#2, Baby boy Franco (DS2) born at 39+0 on Easter Monday, 9/04/12, 8 lbs 12
Coconutfeet - V High NKC, Factor II gene mutation, underactive thyroid - BFP pre-pred, started at 6 weeks, Baby boy Arthur born at 40+6 13/05/12 3.66kg
Comedy - V High NKC - BFP cycle#2, baby girl Matilda born DC#2 – 39 weeks (CS) 14/5/12 7lbs.
Igggi - High NKC & Hypothyroidism - BFP cycle#2, DC#2- Baby boy Thomas born (CS) at 38+6 16/5/12
BrownieGecko - High NKC, Hypothyroidism, & Glucose Intolerant. BFP Clomid cycle#3, DC#1 40+0 - baby girl Amelia born 7/06/12 (CS) 7lbs
Freelance - TTC#1 V High NKC Thyroid/hashimotos - 4mcs (4th on 1st Pred cycle), Hydroxy, Pred, Intralipids, Cyclogest, . DC#1 - Baby boy Sebastian (ELCS) at 39 weeks 17/07/12 8.11 lbs.
Cheerfulcharlie - TTC#1 V High NKC, MTHFR, DC#2/ (metformin, intralipids, no pred). 40+1 wks EDD 24/07/12 Baby boy born 26th July, 7lbs 5. EMCS
batteryhen - High NKC, factor v leiden. DC#1 BFP cycle 3. 38+4
coleyoz - V High NKC. DC#2, BFP cycle2, 41+1 - Baby born??!
FrozenNorthPole - RMC, NKC status unknown, Cyclogest, aspirin. Baby boy James born 29/08/12, 6lb and 6oz at 36+5
PQ77 - DC#2, 2 mcs, then DS, followed by 4 mcs - 6-8 weeks. V High NKC (BFP cycle one but mc) Jonty (Jonathan) Edward arrived by c section 10/09/12 4lb 15 / 2.23 kg 33+1 wks
Mercator - DC#2 V High NKC, (Pred, Intralipids, Cyclogest) 4mcs (1 pre dd, 3 post - all at 6-8 wks) DD arrived by ELCS 14/09/12 7lb 2oz
Hopefulfor2nd - High NKC - TTC#2. – baby here name?
Dunnit - V High NKC - , IVIG, Cyclogest and Clexane. baby here name?
HelterSkelter (IVF and immune therapy) - baby name here?

3rd Trimester
Bertha337 - High NKC, 1 ectopic, 2 mcs, est 39wks
GreenOlives - TTC#2 DS followed by 2mcs, 1 ec, 1 chem. High NKC, Pred from BFP. 38+5
Delta10 - High VNKC, 5 mcs followed by DS Pred baby, 1 further mc. Est 37+5
sarahs999 - DC1 followed by 5 mcs, high NKC (Pred), plus clexane twice daily for Factor V Leiden and Prothrombin, aspirin, cyclogest, intralipids. 37 wks
Jemimapuddleduk (33). 3 prev mc's over last 2.5 years between 7-11. Not tested for NK but prescribed 20mg pred, fragmin, asprin and cyclogest on NHS. 34+5 wks
HavingKittens, 4mcs, 2 TOP TS21, 7th pg, 5th SO Cycle, VHNKC, 40mg Pred, Hydroxy, Intralipids, etc. 33+1,
Buster - 4 mc. VHKC (pred 40mg, lipids, clexane, cyclogest,aspirin) 29+4
Cate - DD followed by 6 mc, VHNKC 40mg pred, intralipids, 28+4w

2nd Trimester
Abney (44), TTC#2, SO 2, 6 MC No pred (2 chromosome, 4 unexplained), 1 DS Pred Cycle 1 & fragmin, 4 MC on Pred (1 fragmin),- super ov. 27+3

1st Trimester

1st Trimester Awaiting Scans

TTC – ASSISTANCE - TTC 2nd or more
Pinkdragon - High NKC. Pred Daughter (after 4 mcs) TTC #2, super ov.
Arianrhod - TTC#2 DD then 6 mcs 5-9 wks (3 on treatment), V High NKC, MTHFR homo, hypothyroid, TTC#2 (Pred & Hydroxy) – super ov
Brownstag - High NKC, 3 yo DS is a Pred Baby! TTC #2 on Hydroxy, -super ov and DHEA
LJ71 - two older DCs, 7 mcs, 3 on treatment. SO, pred, hydroxy

Iloveblue - under Prof Quenby for HNKC. 2 healthy boys, followed by 20 week loss, 2 early mcs, 15 week loss.
Willitbe - TTC#4 DS, DD, 1 mc, DS2, followed by 11mcs, (5-11 weeks). NKC not tested, TTC #4 (after m/c 12) Fertility cons prescribed pred.
Holldoll - TTC #2 High NKC - Pred, Cyclogest & aspirin. DS followed by 4 mcs, heart stopped around 5-6wk. Mc in March 2012 on treatment. Pred started at BFP.
ScooterChaser - V High NKC - TTC#2 (Pred & Hydroxychloroquine)
Mollieboo - 1 DS (lost my little angel at 5 months old), 7 mcs (2 on treatment), high NKC - pred, hydroxy, intralipids, aspirin, clexane, cyclogest
Suemays - TTC#2. DD, followed by 6mcs all 6-8 weeks, one loss @ 22 weeks. V High NKC. (Pred & Hydroxychloroquine)

Pebbles - TTC#1 High NKC, PCOS, super ov cycle 1 (post IVF - 1 chemical, 1 mc, 2nd chemical on treatment/IVF - SO
duggs1976 - TTC#1 -4 mcs all 7-12 weeks. - TTC #1 – last chemical on treatment/IVF in April. SO
BellyD - V High NKC, MTHFR homo, TTC#1, 5mcs, SO, hydroxychloroquine
Carebear1 - V high NKC
Coopde -TTC 3 years - thyroid issues, High NKC, ivf #1 Bfp m/c 5 weeks, ivf #2 Bfn. Seeing Dr G for more tests before trying frozen embryo. Meanwhile still 'unexplained' infertility.

ChoccyPud - V High NKC - TTC#1 (Pred & Hydroxychloroquine). April - mc on treatment.
EchoJuliet, awaiting diagnosis, Preg 1 -MC 10 weeks (heartbeat stopped at 6w), mc 20w, mc at 8 weeks (heartbeat stopped at 6.5w)eurochick - TTC#1 High NKC, pred cycle 6, had 3 cycles of Super Ov, now on 2nd cycle of IUI No BFP in 20+ cycles of trying
London - High NKC, April - mc on treatment.
picolina - TTC#1 4 mcs, all around 6 weeks. V High NKC MC on treatment
Lemonsherbet - TTC#1 v high/high NK, Mthfr, thyroid issues, pred 1st trim & Intralipids 2nd on bfp
buster76 -V High NKC, Factor V Leiden.
Gransol - Seven mcs - all losses between 6 & 7 weeks
SWLondonnanny - 8 early losses hydroxy, thyroid issues, family history of autoimmune disorders
ConeyIslandBaby - 5 mc around 6 weeks, normal NKC but on Pred, progesterone and intralipids on bfp

mollieboo Thu 14-Feb-13 13:23:51

Hi girls, I've just updated the list, it was last updated on 30 November, just realised I mistakenly left 30 November on top of list. Anyway I have no idea if its accurate now so can you all please let me know of any amendments and I'll amend whatever's needed. cartoon, rose and lawlee can you please let me know your history, treatment and weeks and days pregnant for me to add? Or feel free to do it yourselves of course but just thought it might be easier for me to amend lots in one go. Sorry if my maths is all over the place.

Just hope I get to the top one day, doesn't feel like it at the moment. Am starting to worry that there's something seriously wrong with me as I've had 2 mcs since seeing Mr Shehata.

lawlee that's great news about your bfp. Superdrug tests are lots more sensitive than ics imo so don't worry that they're not showing up as bfp yet.

Hope everyone else ok too x

lawlee that's good to know. although my local Tesco seems to price it fairly reasonably cheaper than boots anyway. and there's been a couple of times when I've only needed pred and its only cost around £3. I pharmacists can charge what they like for private prescriptions.
what I want to know is why preg multi vits are so pricey. I know there usually 3 for 2 but still!
thanks for the list mollie!

x post mollie has Mr s said where you go from here?
umm I'm 9wks today with my first.
after 2 mmcs (not on treatment) conceived on first cycle with Mr s.
thanks I can't do it from my phone.

BellyD Thu 14-Feb-13 13:49:51

Thanks for starting the new thread and updating the list Mollie - I am sadly up to mc no. 6 now (including 2 under Mr S, like you.)

Free the 10th thread - amazing, but such an unbelievably brilliant source of support, advice and knowledge, although I obvs wish that none of us had any need for it whatsoever.

Lawlee sounding good about the bfp and if AF not due until Tues then it is still early days. Keeping everything crossed for you.

Ari thanks for advice about checking on FF website for gcsf info - will take a look. Does HTH stand for happy to help?! Really appreciate your wealth of knowledge, as always. Dr Ndukwe was so refreshing in that unfortunately he has experienced a miscarriage himself. Such a relief to speak to a Dr who actually knows what it is like. Makes you feel so much more human and less like a scientific experiment, or jigsaw with a missing piece. Having to wait until May for ivf, which feels like an eternity away but will give me time to get my body/mind in shape. Will keep you all updated on gcsf... which is apparently something normally given to cancer patients after chemo to boost their white blood cells.

roseandroli Thu 14-Feb-13 14:26:04

mollie thank you so much for updating the list!

Here are my stats: roseandroli (37) TTC #1 High NKC, 2 mcs, 11+4

cartoon I am so happy to hear that your scan went well. What a relief. When I saw Mr. Shehata on Monday, he said, "you're not losing this baby, not on my watch" which was such a lovely thing for him to say, but I'm still riddled with anxiety, and can't quite believe there may be a baby at the end of this story.

So I totally understand what you and lawlee mean about having something to worry about. I have my 12 week nuchal scan on Monday, and have no idea what to expect. Been reading all sorts of stuff online about chromosomal abnormalities. Also, because I was away for so long, I still haven't even had my booking in appointment with the gp or midwife, so the scan is the first "official" thing I'm doing.

I just wanted to also say hello to accidental. I read your post and I'm sorry I don't know anything about Hydroxy treatment, so I can't help. I wonder if you could speak with Louise about it, she may be able to tell you about others who have tried the treatment without pred?

rose I find him quite reassuring but I know what you mean it is hard. I'm off to sort out booking in with the NHS later. that feels a bit more real.
mollie forgot too add I'm on the treatment for very high nk cells.

Clabbage Thu 14-Feb-13 14:59:17

Hi all.
Mollie..I'm so sorry that your most recent pregnancy didn't work out.

abney I am thrilled to hear this is working out for you after so many losses, likewise, kittens. Massive congrats to all newly pregnant ladies.

Well I got a bfp and immediately went to ground (very much my way). Had a scan at 6, 2. Measured 5w 5 days, no embryo. Went back on Monday (7 w 1 by adjusted date) and had an embryo with hb but tiny (6, 2). The sonographer said she was 'concerned'..that's never good eh? Anyway, this seems to be what happens every time now, sac appears, hb momentarily, always measuring behind and I miscarry at about 9 weeks (by lmp). I think this will be the fifth time out of what I suspect will now be 8 mc's.
So I am rescanned next wed. I know all is not lost but with that history, I have to be realistic. I desperately don't want to mc naturally. My partner is away next week and I just want to have some control over the circumstances. Isn't it ridiculous what our goals become!
Wondering how Duggs, Choccy, Scooterchaser and other absent friends are?

TheAccidentalExhibitionist Thu 14-Feb-13 15:44:13

Thanks roseandroli I'm going to email Louise now and hopefully get some reassurance. I would prefer to be on the Prednisolone. When I get pregnant it will be my 8th pregnancy, with one child so I'm keen to throw everything at it.

mollieboo Thu 14-Feb-13 15:48:36

accidental sorry that you're going through so much uncertainty about your treatment plan. It is all such a worry, I hope you get some advice so that you can go into a pregnancy with some confidence and reassurance.

clabbage I really feel for you, I'm so sorry that you're going through all of this. I just went through weeks of uncertainty and horrible scans and can totally relate to how tough and stressful it is. Yes it is bizarre what our goals become, choosing how we miscarry so that we have some control, I feel like I live in a parallel universe to my friends and colleagues. All is not lost as you say, all you can do is wait which is so difficult when you're worried. I really hope it works out for you this time. Are you on the steroids treatment plan for high nk cells if you don't mind me asking?

mollieboo Thu 14-Feb-13 15:53:35

Thursday 14 February 2013

The babies are arriving!
Stogan - V high NKC - cycle#2, DC#1, Baby girl Ellyson (DC1) born Sunday (EMCS) 11/03/12 7lb13.5.
Digitalgirl - High NKC - BFP cycle#2, Baby boy Franco (DS2) born at 39+0 on Easter Monday, 9/04/12, 8 lbs 12
Coconutfeet - V High NKC, Factor II gene mutation, underactive thyroid - BFP pre-pred, started at 6 weeks, Baby boy Arthur born at 40+6 13/05/12 3.66kg
Comedy - V High NKC - BFP cycle#2, baby girl Matilda born DC#2 – 39 weeks (CS) 14/5/12 7lbs.
Igggi - High NKC & Hypothyroidism - BFP cycle#2, DC#2- Baby boy Thomas born (CS) at 38+6 16/5/12
BrownieGecko - High NKC, Hypothyroidism, & Glucose Intolerant. BFP Clomid cycle#3, DC#1 40+0 - baby girl Amelia born 7/06/12 (CS) 7lbs
Freelance - TTC#1 V High NKC Thyroid/hashimotos - 4mcs (4th on 1st Pred cycle), Hydroxy, Pred, Intralipids, Cyclogest, . DC#1 - Baby boy Sebastian (ELCS) at 39 weeks 17/07/12 8.11 lbs.
Cheerfulcharlie - TTC#1 V High NKC, MTHFR, DC#2/ (metformin, intralipids, no pred). 40+1 wks EDD 24/07/12 Baby boy born 26th July, 7lbs 5. EMCS
batteryhen - High NKC, factor v leiden. DC#1 BFP cycle 3. 38+4
coleyoz - V High NKC. DC#2, BFP cycle2, 41+1 - Baby born??!
FrozenNorthPole - RMC, NKC status unknown, Cyclogest, aspirin. Baby boy James born 29/08/12, 6lb and 6oz at 36+5
PQ77 - DC#2, 2 mcs, then DS, followed by 4 mcs - 6-8 weeks. V High NKC (BFP cycle one but mc) Jonty (Jonathan) Edward arrived by c section 10/09/12 4lb 15 / 2.23 kg 33+1 wks
Mercator - DC#2 V High NKC, (Pred, Intralipids, Cyclogest) 4mcs (1 pre dd, 3 post - all at 6-8 wks) DD arrived by ELCS 14/09/12 7lb 2oz
Hopefulfor2nd - High NKC - TTC#2 – baby here name?
Dunnit - V High NKC - , IVIG, Cyclogest and Clexane. baby here name?
HelterSkelter - IVF and immune therapy - baby name here?

3rd Trimester
Bertha337 - High NKC, 1 ectopic, 2 mcs, est 39w
GreenOlives - TTC#2 DS followed by 2mcs, 1 ec, 1 chem. High NKC, Pred from BFP, 38+5w
Delta10 - High VNKC, 5 mcs followed by DS Pred baby, 1 further mc. Est 37+5w
sarahs999 - DC1 followed by 5 mcs, high NKC (Pred), plus clexane twice daily for Factor V Leiden and Prothrombin, aspirin, cyclogest, intralipids. 37 wks
Jemimapuddleduk - (33) 3 prev mc's over last 2.5 years between 7-11. Not tested for NK but prescribed 20mg pred, fragmin, asprin and cyclogest on NHS. 34+5 wks
HavingKittens, 4mcs, 2 TOP TS21, 7th pg, 5th SO Cycle, VHNKC, 40mg Pred, Hydroxy, Intralipids, etc. 33+1,
Buster - 4 mc. VHKC (pred 40mg, lipids, clexane, cyclogest,aspirin) 29+4
Cate - DD followed by 6 mc, VHNKC 40mg pred, intralipids, 28+4w

2nd Trimester
Abney - (44), TTC#2, SO 2, 6 MC No pred (2 chromosome, 4 unexplained), 1 DS Pred Cycle 1 & fragmin, 4 MC on Pred (1 fragmin),- super ov. 27+3

1st Trimester
cartoonface - 2 mmcs, v high NKC, 9w
roseandroli - (37) TTC #1 High NKC, 2 mcs, 11+4w

1st Trimester Awaiting Scans

TTC – ASSISTANCE - TTC 2nd or more
Pinkdragon - High NKC. Pred Daughter (after 4 mcs) TTC #2, super ov.
Arianrhod - TTC#2 DD then 6 mcs 5-9 wks (3 on treatment), V High NKC, MTHFR homo, hypothyroid, TTC#2 (Pred & Hydroxy) – super ov
Brownstag - High NKC, 3 yo DS is a Pred Baby! TTC #2 on Hydroxy, -super ov and DHEA
LJ71 - two older DCs, 7 mcs, 3 on treatment. SO, pred, hydroxy

Iloveblue - under Prof Quenby for HNKC. 2 healthy boys, followed by 20 week loss, 2 early mcs, 15 week loss.
Willitbe - TTC#4 DS, DD, 1 mc, DS2, followed by 11mcs, (5-11 weeks). NKC not tested, TTC #4 (after m/c 12) Fertility cons prescribed pred.
Holldoll - TTC #2 High NKC - Pred, Cyclogest & aspirin. DS followed by 4 mcs, heart stopped around 5-6wk. Mc in March 2012 on treatment. Pred started at BFP.
ScooterChaser - V High NKC - TTC#2 (Pred & Hydroxychloroquine)
Mollieboo - 1 DS (lost my little angel at 5 months old), 7 mcs (2 on treatment), high NKC - pred, hydroxy, intralipids, aspirin, clexane, cyclogest
Suemays - TTC#2. DD, followed by 6mcs all 6-8 weeks, one loss @ 22 weeks. V High NKC. (Pred & Hydroxychloroquine)

Pebbles - TTC#1 High NKC, PCOS, super ov cycle 1 (post IVF - 1 chemical, 1 mc, 2nd chemical on treatment/IVF - SO
duggs1976 - TTC#1 -4 mcs all 7-12 weeks. - TTC #1 – last chemical on treatment/IVF in April. SO
BellyD - V High NKC, MTHFR homo, TTC#1, 5mcs, SO, hydroxychloroquine
Carebear1 - V high NKC
Coopde -TTC 3 years - thyroid issues, High NKC, ivf #1 Bfp m/c 5 weeks, ivf #2 Bfn. Seeing Dr G for more tests before trying frozen embryo. Meanwhile still 'unexplained' infertility.

ChoccyPud - V High NKC - TTC#1 (Pred & Hydroxychloroquine). April - mc on treatment.
EchoJuliet, awaiting diagnosis, Preg 1 -MC 10 weeks (heartbeat stopped at 6w), mc 20w, mc at 8 weeks (heartbeat stopped at 6.5w)eurochick - TTC#1 High NKC, pred cycle 6, had 3 cycles of Super Ov, now on 2nd cycle of IUI No BFP in 20+ cycles of trying
London - High NKC, April - mc on treatment.
picolina - TTC#1 4 mcs, all around 6 weeks. V High NKC MC on treatment
Lemonsherbet - TTC#1 v high/high NK, Mthfr, thyroid issues, pred 1st trim & Intralipids 2nd on bfp
buster76 -V High NKC, Factor V Leiden.
Gransol - Seven mcs - all losses between 6 & 7 weeks
SWLondonnanny - 8 early losses hydroxy, thyroid issues, family history of autoimmune disorders
ConeyIslandBaby - 5 mc around 6 weeks, normal NKC but on Pred, progesterone and intralipids on bfp

TheAccidentalExhibitionist Thu 14-Feb-13 15:57:34

Anyone got an email address for Louise, I haven't spoken to her before and only have the email for making appointments.

mollieboo Thu 14-Feb-13 15:58:55

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

TheAccidentalExhibitionist Thu 14-Feb-13 16:01:55

Thanks Mollieboo

Lawlee Thu 14-Feb-13 17:28:26

Hi all, wow Mollie that's quite a list, thanks for doing that! Here's me:
Lawlee (32) TTC #1 very high nk cells, high activation 1 mmc at 8/9 wks (erpc at 11) & 2 early mc all since Jun 2012 now on cycle 1 on prednisolone, (very faint) bfp today

BellyD so sorry to hear what you've been through but glad you seem to have a great consultant and that he is looking after you. Fingers crossed for the treatment, and the IVF, hope the time goes quick and May is here before you know it!

Rose will be thinking of you on Monday, hope it goes really well. Dr Google never helps does it! After they said I had a bit of adenomyosis yesterday I've been looking it up and google seems to be suggesting the recommended treatment in severe cases is hysterectomy! Ha thanks google! I know it's hard but I guess we can only try not to read too much into what we find on google. Hope you are doing ok.

Clabbage I'm so sorry to hear what you are going through, it's so hard and just not fair, the wait is horrid. I totally get the feeling of wanting to wrest some control back, I felt that way with my mmc. I hope so much you get some good news and it works out, we will all be here thinking of you

Cartoon hope you are still feeling on a high from your scan! Yes preg vits are ridiculously pricey aren't they, am tempted by amazon sometimes but scared to buy online like that.

Accidental hope Louise is able to help you! Fingers crossed for you they can give you some advice

Big waves and sorry if I missed anyone out, hard to keep up on the phone sometimes!

TheAccidentalExhibitionist Thu 14-Feb-13 18:21:02

mollieboo can you add me?
TheAccidentalExhibitionist (39) TTC #2, 5MC diagnosed High NKC, Hydroxy, Intralipids and hopefully Pred.

mollieboo Thu 14-Feb-13 19:19:10

Thursday 14 February 2013

The babies are arriving!
Stogan - V high NKC - cycle#2, DC#1, Baby girl Ellyson (DC1) born Sunday (EMCS) 11/03/12 7lb13.5.
Digitalgirl - High NKC - BFP cycle#2, Baby boy Franco (DS2) born at 39+0 on Easter Monday, 9/04/12, 8 lbs 12
Coconutfeet - V High NKC, Factor II gene mutation, underactive thyroid - BFP pre-pred, started at 6 weeks, Baby boy Arthur born at 40+6 13/05/12 3.66kg
Comedy - V High NKC - BFP cycle#2, baby girl Matilda born DC#2 – 39 weeks (CS) 14/5/12 7lbs.
Igggi - High NKC & Hypothyroidism - BFP cycle#2, DC#2- Baby boy Thomas born (CS) at 38+6 16/5/12
BrownieGecko - High NKC, Hypothyroidism, & Glucose Intolerant. BFP Clomid cycle#3, DC#1 40+0 - baby girl Amelia born 7/06/12 (CS) 7lbs
Freelance - TTC#1 V High NKC Thyroid/hashimotos - 4mcs (4th on 1st Pred cycle), Hydroxy, Pred, Intralipids, Cyclogest, . DC#1 - Baby boy Sebastian (ELCS) at 39 weeks 17/07/12 8.11 lbs.
Cheerfulcharlie - TTC#1 V High NKC, MTHFR, DC#2/ (metformin, intralipids, no pred). 40+1 wks EDD 24/07/12 Baby boy born 26th July, 7lbs 5. EMCS
batteryhen - High NKC, factor v leiden. DC#1 BFP cycle 3. 38+4
coleyoz - V High NKC. DC#2, BFP cycle2, 41+1 - Baby born??!
FrozenNorthPole - RMC, NKC status unknown, Cyclogest, aspirin. Baby boy James born 29/08/12, 6lb and 6oz at 36+5
PQ77 - DC#2, 2 mcs, then DS, followed by 4 mcs - 6-8 weeks. V High NKC (BFP cycle one but mc) Jonty (Jonathan) Edward arrived by c section 10/09/12 4lb 15 / 2.23 kg 33+1 wks
Mercator - DC#2 V High NKC, (Pred, Intralipids, Cyclogest) 4mcs (1 pre dd, 3 post - all at 6-8 wks) DD arrived by ELCS 14/09/12 7lb 2oz
Hopefulfor2nd - High NKC - TTC#2 – baby here name?
Dunnit - V High NKC - , IVIG, Cyclogest and Clexane. baby here name?
HelterSkelter - IVF and immune therapy - baby name here?

3rd Trimester
Bertha337 - High NKC, 1 ectopic, 2 mcs, est 39w
GreenOlives - TTC#2 DS followed by 2mcs, 1 ec, 1 chem. High NKC, Pred from BFP, 38+5w
Delta10 - High VNKC, 5 mcs followed by DS Pred baby, 1 further mc. Est 37+5w
sarahs999 - DC1 followed by 5 mcs, high NKC (Pred), plus clexane twice daily for Factor V Leiden and Prothrombin, aspirin, cyclogest, intralipids. 37 wks
Jemimapuddleduk - (33) 3 prev mc's over last 2.5 years between 7-11. Not tested for NK but prescribed 20mg pred, fragmin, asprin and cyclogest on NHS. 34+5 wks
HavingKittens, 4mcs, 2 TOP TS21, 7th pg, 5th SO Cycle, VHNKC, 40mg Pred, Hydroxy, Intralipids, etc. 33+1,
Buster - 4 mc. VHKC (pred 40mg, lipids, clexane, cyclogest,aspirin) 29+4
Cate - DD followed by 6 mc, VHNKC 40mg pred, intralipids, 28+4w

2nd Trimester
Abney - (44), TTC#2, SO 2, 6 MC No pred (2 chromosome, 4 unexplained), 1 DS Pred Cycle 1 & fragmin, 4 MC on Pred (1 fragmin),- super ov. 27+3

1st Trimester
cartoonface - 2 mmcs, v high NKC, 9w
roseandroli - (37) TTC #1 High NKC, 2 mcs, 11+4w

1st Trimester Awaiting Scans
Lawlee (32) TTC #1 V high NK cells, high activation 1 mmc at 8/9 wks (erpc at 11) & 2 early mc all since Jun 2012 now on cycle 1 on prednisolone, (very faint) bfp today

TTC – ASSISTANCE - TTC 2nd or more
Pinkdragon - High NKC. Pred Daughter (after 4 mcs) TTC #2, super ov.
Arianrhod - TTC#2 DD then 6 mcs 5-9 wks (3 on treatment), V High NKC, MTHFR homo, hypothyroid, TTC#2 (Pred & Hydroxy) – super ov
Brownstag - High NKC, 3 yo DS is a Pred Baby! TTC #2 on Hydroxy, -super ov and DHEA
LJ71 - two older DCs, 7 mcs, 3 on treatment. SO, pred, hydroxy

Iloveblue - under Prof Quenby for HNKC. 2 healthy boys, followed by 20 week loss, 2 early mcs, 15 week loss.
Willitbe - TTC#4 DS, DD, 1 mc, DS2, followed by 11mcs, (5-11 weeks). NKC not tested, TTC #4 (after m/c 12) Fertility cons prescribed pred.
Holldoll - TTC #2 High NKC - Pred, Cyclogest & aspirin. DS followed by 4 mcs, heart stopped around 5-6wk. Mc in March 2012 on treatment. Pred started at BFP.
ScooterChaser - V High NKC - TTC#2 (Pred & Hydroxychloroquine)
Mollieboo (36) - 1 DS (lost my little angel at 5 months old), 7 mcs (2 on treatment), high NKC - pred, hydroxy, intralipids, aspirin, clexane, cyclogest
Suemays - TTC#2. DD, followed by 6mcs all 6-8 weeks, one loss @ 22 weeks. V High NKC. (Pred & Hydroxychloroquine)
TheAccidentalExhibitionist (39) TTC #2, 5MC diagnosed High NKC, Hydroxy, Intralipids and hopefully Pred

Pebbles - TTC#1 High NKC, PCOS, super ov cycle 1 (post IVF - 1 chemical, 1 mc, 2nd chemical on treatment/IVF - SO
duggs1976 - TTC#1 -4 mcs all 7-12 weeks. - TTC #1 – last chemical on treatment/IVF in April. SO
BellyD - V High NKC, MTHFR homo, TTC#1, 5mcs, SO, hydroxychloroquine
Carebear1 - V high NKC
Coopde -TTC 3 years - thyroid issues, High NKC, ivf #1 Bfp m/c 5 weeks, ivf #2 Bfn. Seeing Dr G for more tests before trying frozen embryo. Meanwhile still 'unexplained' infertility.

ChoccyPud - V High NKC - TTC#1 (Pred & Hydroxychloroquine). April - mc on treatment.
EchoJuliet, awaiting diagnosis, Preg 1 -MC 10 weeks (heartbeat stopped at 6w), mc 20w, mc at 8 weeks (heartbeat stopped at 6.5w)eurochick - TTC#1 High NKC, pred cycle 6, had 3 cycles of Super Ov, now on 2nd cycle of IUI No BFP in 20+ cycles of trying
London - High NKC, April - mc on treatment.
picolina - TTC#1 4 mcs, all around 6 weeks. V High NKC MC on treatment
Lemonsherbet - TTC#1 v high/high NK, Mthfr, thyroid issues, pred 1st trim & Intralipids 2nd on bfp
buster76 -V High NKC, Factor V Leiden.
Gransol - Seven mcs - all losses between 6 & 7 weeks
SWLondonnanny - 8 early losses hydroxy, thyroid issues, family history of autoimmune disorders
ConeyIslandBaby - 5 mc around 6 weeks, normal NKC but on Pred, progesterone and intralipids on bfp

mollieboo Thu 14-Feb-13 19:28:33

List updated, no worries. Will just be on my phone next few days now and can't update from there sorry but today I was on a laptop so was no problem to update. Free will be pleased if she sees the list updated!!

cartoon the plan going forward for me is when I get pregnant to go onto 40mg of pred instead of 25mg per day, and possibly take two Hydroxy per day instead of one. I've only got high NKC but am to go on pred, Clexane, Hydroxy and intralipids to 32 weeks. Which is all fine, whatever it takes as long as it works, just please work next time.

bellyd good luck with the ivf and treatment plan, its great to have a plan in place and an understanding doctor. Its hard waiting but I'm sure May will come really quickly.

freelancegirl Thu 14-Feb-13 20:06:25

Marking place and so pleased youre all carrying on and with a list update too! Sorry about scan stress clabbage, I hope this one has a better outcome for you.

Great to hear of your BFP lawlee! And the other good scans too,

Who asked about the hydroxy? I was on it / only the second person I think. Was also on the Pred - 40mg.

Hope everyone is doing ok xx

freelancegirl Thu 14-Feb-13 20:08:34

Wow look at all the third trimesters!

Lawlee Thu 14-Feb-13 22:01:44

Thanks for adding me to the list mollie

Thanks Free fingers crossed it sticks! Hope your little one is good too smile
Night all x

Havingkittens Thu 14-Feb-13 22:22:58

Clabbage, I'm sorry to hear you're going through the same horrible experience again. I know how that feels, I had that happen 3 times in the last year of TTC before seeing Mr S. I hope this one turns out to be your miracle.

Mollie, thanks for updating the list, although you've put me a week ahead. I'm 32+1 now, so 8 weeks to go. I had a scan last week and the baby was breech so I'm hoping it will have turned by the time I have my next scan in another week!

Accidental, I was on both Hydroxy and Pred so can't answer your question but there was someone on here that was just on intralipids and not pred and they had a successful pregnancy, so perhaps that approach will work for you. If you can get Louise's number (I've not got it handy) it may be worth giving her a call. She really takes time to listen to your concerns and explains stuff in a very reassuring way. She's talked me down off the ceiling many a time!

Lawlee, I started off seeing Mr S on the NHS. I don't know if things have changed but it used to be possible to ask to be referred to a hospital out of your area if there was a particular reason. I live in North London and I still got to see him at St Helier. I did go on to see him privately in the end as I was also having fertility issues and he doesn't cover that at St Helier and the NHS don't give fertility treatment to people as old as me! I did continue to get my prescriptions made out at St Helier though as I was in their system. They are fine about you seeing him both on the NHS and privately. You could call Cheryl at his private practice and have a chat with her about having Intralipids privately alongside your NHS treatment. Good luck with testing. All sounds promising to me! I wouldn't worry about the vigorous trans-vaginal scan. They can be pretty vigorous when looking around at an early scan when things are very small and they don't seem concerned whilst doing it so I'm sure there's no risk.

The only person I know of that have had their baby delivered by Mr S was Free. I'm not sure whether that was privately or at St Helier, as I seem to remember a conversation on here about the fact that she was in the catchment area to give birth at St Helier. I'm not considering it. I'm planning to give birth at UCH who have given me excellent care since I left the charge of Mr S at 16 weeks.

Sorry about not writing more personals, it's been busy on here and I can't quite keep up!

Always thinking of Sue, Ari, Choccy, Scooter, Duggs, Pebbles et al. Hope you're all doing OK and that this year your luck will change. xx

freelancegirl Thu 14-Feb-13 22:40:38

I also managed to see mr s on the nhs at st helier but by that time I'd already got impatient and booked to see him privately. I just wanted to get tested for nkc as soon as possible, after finding out about them on these threads.

DS was lifted out by Mr S himself at Epsom General, back to the nhs. There were no issues with this as far as the hospital : my GP goes. Mr S was bemused when I was surprised he actually does births himself, he said just because he wears a suit people think he doesnt get his hands dirty! A euphemism, the latter, of course.

Cheerful Charlie was only on intralipids I think.

sarahs999 Fri 15-Feb-13 02:39:44

Thanks so much for updating the list mollie - free will be ecstatic that we're not all list refusers! I am having my c section on Thursday. Am v nervous but excited to meet my baby boy. Suspect I will spend quite a while on a state of disbelief that he's finally here after all we've been through...

Hope everyone else is doing ok. I post more on antenatal now but do watch over this thread to see how everyone is. Good luck all. Will update when the baby is here...

duggs1976 Fri 15-Feb-13 06:58:27

Thanks for thinking of us long timers kittens still lurking from time to time.

Being in the 15% where the nk cells treatment made no difference (18 mths on dr s programme is pretty conclusive to me) I luckily saw dr Gorgy last summer and would like to share with some of you.

He found hidden infections ( despite all standard urine etc tests bein normal) and high sperm DNA fragmentation in DH. After a mth of hardcore anti biotics ( and I mean hard core) we both re tested ok. My nk cells were in normal parameters by last June.

A 33% DNA fragmentation level gave a 1% chance of live birth. This was despite all other sperm tests being excellent - 140million count, good motility, even a karyotyping test to check genetics.

Sperm is reproduced every 90 days but I got impatient and asked DH to re test in September -22% it had gone down.
He re tested last month a d was down to 15.1% which is normal. He takes anti oxidants etc and it has taken almost 9 mths to get here but I think we may have had our reason for 3 miscarriages, 2 chemical pregnancies, a failed IUI, failed frozen embryo transfer and 6 failed super ovulation cycles over 42 months of trying.

Here is the link to the test which costs £300.

I'm not successfully pregnant as yet and when I do get a bfp again I shall pop some pred and hydroxy just in case as I have a drawer full of them, and makes me feel safer, but I do want to highlight that there may be other reasons if pregnancy isn't happening.

Some of me thinks this is just another false hope journey but 33% to 15% has to be a good thing.

Now I'm just trying to pretend we r on a new journey. I will keep you posted.
Btw a red herring after my cGH chromosonally tested embryos were put back at 3 days - egg is tested here as sper, failure usually happens after 3 days so I'd advise anyone to spend £300 before embarking on any ART that costs thousands.

Good luck to those due to give birth soon.
Still think of you a lot ladies x

Arianrhod Fri 15-Feb-13 09:42:49

Thanks for updating the list mollie, and good to see updates from duggs and kittens. Thinking of sue, choccy, pebbles and scooter, give us a wave if you're still around.

clabbage So sorry you feel you may be facing the same nightmare situation again, and hope that it's not the case this time. Crossing fingers and toes for you.

I'd second duggs about the extra testing. OH had the same DNA fragmentation test done (as well as SA testing) and although his results seem to indicate he has super-sperm, I feel it was absolutely right to be tested and I was a little frustrated it wasn't tested by routine right at the start of the RMC tests with Mr S. Ok so it turns out all the problems are apparently down to me, but they might not have been - if you haven't tested all possibilities then you're only working with half a picture, to my mind. Ditto to the hidden infection testing - we did the same hardcore anti-bs as duggs and although I didn't ever get retested, I'm glad we did the treatment.

Actually that's triggered a thought. duggs you mentioned your NK cells were down to normal levels - was this due to clearing up the hidden infections, do you think? I've only had my NK cells retested after the first MC I had under Mr S, which was 7 months before I did the anti-bs for hidden infections. I wonder if that might have made a difference? Guess I won't know, I'm not about to pay £££ for NK cells to be tested again just in case. I will only take pred (and hydroxy) now from BFP anyway, so I guess it makes no difference. I am very aware that your immune system can be oversuppressed, which in itself can cause failures in implantation (you need a certain amount of inflammatory ability for implantation to happen, apparently), and I just wonder. This is why I would far rather thecause of high NK cells could be determined and sorted out, rather than just treating the symptoms - the high NK cells. If you can eliminate the cause (which I appreciate can't always happen) and bring NK cells down to more normal levels, surely that would be a better approach?

Anyway, I'm not a doctor, and like duggs says I'm not successfully pregnant yet, so it's all speculation as to whether any of this is going to work for me anyway.

/waves to everyone

Lawlee Fri 15-Feb-13 11:17:53

Thanks Kittens good to know that if I need to I can run the two alongside each other. Hope you are doing well, gosh only 8 weeks to go, how exciting! Bet you are really starting to look forwards to having your bubba in your arms! You too Sarah do keep us posted, so pleased to hear of imminent births and new babes, it's uplifting!

Thanks for the info Duggs and Ari it's great to know that there are are other routes out there if this doesn't work. I really hope it's successful for you both, and interesting too because Mr. S definitely said to me they don't test for infections, even though its in their leaflet. Strange and annoying that there are so many conflicting approaches out there. Actually I do wonder, have either of you ever had long-term antibiotics before? I had a course of them when I was younger (probably not as hard-core or targeted as what you've had) for a bit of a bug that wouldn't go away so I sometimes wonder if hidden infections might still be a possibility. Anyway such a shame that this kind of info is not more readily available, which makes this resource so very valuable as well as a place for support! So when are you going to write that book Rose?! smile

Free always great to hear from you, amazing that your thread has got to part 10!

Arianrhod Fri 15-Feb-13 11:35:28

lawlee Mr S doesn't test for infections - duggs had hers tested via Dr Gorgy, while I had ours done directly with the clinic in Athens. I did inform Mr S at the time I was doing them, and I sent him our results, but he told me when I raised it with him that labs over here believe these tests are not recognised as worth doing, and believes they have no effect on miscarriages/pregnancies. I'd never had long-term anti-bs before and certainly nothing as hard-core as this, but I did suffer from about a year-long recurrent UTI 3 or 4 years ago and wonder if it wasn't related.

duggs1976 Fri 15-Feb-13 11:45:24

Yes Ari- frustrating and perhaps slightly arrogant of dr s to dismiss hidden infections and sperm DNA fragmentation out of the picture when there is plenty of evidence and logic that both could be a miscarriage contributor! confused Anyway - deep sigh - suemays pointed out to me and I'm very glad she did. Yes zita west also mentions this theory ari as your NK cells are usually inflamed for a reason!

Lawlee Fri 15-Feb-13 12:27:17

That is interesting Ari because the antibiotics I had when I was younger were also for recurrent uti! Wonder if there is a link, I'm not convinced they would have got rid of everything. I developed a horrible reaction to those anti-b's in the end, they gave me a nasty rash on my neck that made me look like I had a permanent set of hickys lol! Yet more evidence of my crazy immune system I suppose.
Yes sorry I think my post wasn't worded well, when i said about Mr S. not testing for infections I just meant its weird isn't it how each consultant seems to give conflicting advice and treatment options. I suppose it's just that not enough is known about it all and it's too cutting edge, but it would be nice if there could be a bit more consensus sometimes.
Really really hope it all works out for you both soon, and for all of us!

mollie that's quite a cocktail! smile. I really hope it works out for you next time. I guess its kind of trial and error unfortunately with these treatment plans. I fully expected it not work first time for me. but touch wood seems to be so far. when will you start TTC or are you going to have a break?
I wish that miscarriage in general was talked about more as well as what causes it especially some of these newer theorys like the nk cells. I would not have known about any of this had I not joined mn which is a scary thought. I hate to think how much more heartbreak we couldve had if I hadnt had the nk testing.

TheAccidentalExhibitionist Fri 15-Feb-13 16:52:52

I emailed Louise this morning, about not feeling confident on the Hydroxy and that I've developed very sore eyes with light sensitivity and nausea on the Hydroxy. That alone worries me.

Mr S said that he would send a script for Prednisolone but that if I took it, it was my responsibility if I got problems on it.
I guess he doesn't want any come back, I've got a suspected stomach ulcer from taking anti inflammatories for back pain (auto immune related). That didn't worry Mr S the first time I saw him but now he seems sure that Hydroxy alone is the answer for me and that Pred could cause me problems.
He emailed to say he used Hydroxy on a patient who had 20 MC, three of them on Pred and now she's half at through her pregnancy.

Not sure what to do now, I'm not sure my eyes could cope with continuing on the Hydroxy and the Pred could be dangerous. Feckin hell.

Lawlee Fri 15-Feb-13 20:40:45

Accidental so sorry you are having such a tough decision to make. How long have you been taking the hydroxy for? Just a thought but might your eyes acclimatise do you think? First 8 or 9 days on the pred I had terrible insomnia and just felt really weird all the time but (fingers crossed) it seems to be easing up now and I think my system is getting used to it. Hope you find some answers soon. I guess at least you know now there are people who have had success on both treatment plans, whatever you decide to do.

Cartoon I agree, I wish I had known more about miscarriage in general. Even just some basics might have helped cope with it the first time around, I was so unprepared and I think the general shock of it all was almost as bad as anything else. I'm sure they never told us anything about it at school. Thank goodness for MN and this thread, I've learned so much in the past few days that I feel almost like I've become a fertility expert myself lol!

Delta10 Sat 16-Feb-13 03:57:58

Hello all
Just letting you all know that our little bundle has arrived! We were due on 18th feb (list slightly out of date for me) but due to very high protein in urine at routine appt on Monday, I was booked in for a c-section on Tuesday 12th (at 39+1). Our beautiful baby girl arrived safe & sound weighing in at 7lb 4oz & 55cm long & just perfect. We didn't know what we were having but are so delighted to have a baby sister for our son, another pred baby, who turns 3 at the end of April. It has taken us 7 years to get here but had we not met mr s in 2009, I am sure we would never have achieved our wonderful family. Good luck to you all & I shall be popping by to see how everyone is getting on & sending good luck & best wishes to everyone on your journey to motherhood xx

PQ77 Sat 16-Feb-13 07:30:17

Many congrats Delta, wonderful news xx

Havingkittens Sat 16-Feb-13 09:12:21

Fantastic news Delta, Congratulations!

Well, I never thought I'd get this far, but I'm just off to my antenatal classes now grin

Lawlee Sat 16-Feb-13 09:14:05

Congratulations Delta that's wonderful news, so exciting! So pleased to hear you are all doing well! After 7 years I'm so glad it has all worked out for you x

Can I please ask a quick question about Cyclogest? Did any of you find it gave you cramps? I've used it for two nights now and both times noticed that within about 5 minutes of lying down I got mild period type pain that eased off after about half an hour. I'm wondering if there is a connection with the cyclogest or if it's just coincidence? Anyone else get that and should I be worried? Still a positive line today although no darker than yesterday, but keep reminding myself that AF not even due till Tues so still too early to be worrying about that! Hope you are all well and have nice weekend ahead of you especially Mollie and your night out with DH!

Lawlee Sat 16-Feb-13 09:16:45

Yay Kittens happy for you smile

yes lawlee it gives me cramps. Louise said it does. so don't worry!
lovely to here of babies arriving! congrats.

freelancegirl Sat 16-Feb-13 14:12:41

Delta that brought tears to my eyes, am so bloody happy for you. And kittens and your antenatal classes too! Hope you make some nice 'mummy friends'. Mine have been a lifeline,

Cheerfulcharlie Sat 16-Feb-13 16:06:28

Ah Delta, congratulations! That made me goosebumpy.
Just a quick one from me as DS needs a bath but Accidental I had / have (?) v high NKC and I only had intralipids (no pred or hydroxy) and I had a really great pregnancy. I did only have 2 MCs before that though.

Did Stogan report back and tell us what her results for re-testing of NKCs before TTC again?

kittens - hello! great to read it's all still going well!

roseandroli Sat 16-Feb-13 16:11:17

Congratulations delta--I just love your story, and so so happy that your family is now complete. Warmest felicitations to you!

And to kittens on your antenatal classes. What a milestone.

I'm off to have my nuchal scan on Monday. Eeeks. Has anyone had them done at UCLH (maybe sarah?). Do you know how long they wait before telling you the result of the scan and blood test? I know if I did it privately at the FMC they would give me the result in 2 hours, but we are so broke after all the Shehata visits...

By the way lawlee I absolutely loathe cyclogest. If anything bad is happening to me--cramps, spotting, constipation, acne--I just blame the pessaries!

Buster76 Sat 16-Feb-13 16:28:53

Congratulations delta smile


GreenOlives Sat 16-Feb-13 17:18:14

Congratulations Delta! thanks Lovely news! grin

Havingkittens Sat 16-Feb-13 18:04:18

Lawlee, I had cramps around the same stage as you are now. I think they were implantation cramps. Great sign that you're line still appearing. All looks promising!

rose, I had my Nuchal and CVS at FMC this time because of my history but I'm under UCH. I don't know how quickly you get the results at UCH but one thing I do know, which is really reassuring about UCH is that they have the same scanning equipment and even some of the same staff as at FMC as I think Prof Nicolaides has a team there too so you will have a super thorough scan. I have a feeling you get the results back pretty quickly. Best of luck with it.

roseandroli Sat 16-Feb-13 21:48:48

Thanks kittens--I'd love to hear more about your experience at UCH as I'm about to have my first antenatal appointment there. I live in Hackney and most people here go to the Homerton, but I've had and excellent experiences at the UCH early pregnancy unit (where I have been scanned countless times with every mc). But don't know anything about the rest of the maternity service--any thoughts you have would be much appreciated.

Lawlee Sat 16-Feb-13 22:01:07

Thanks Cartoon, Rose and Kittens for putting my mind at rest. Ironically it's stopped doing it now, lol. Just typical isn't it!

Good luck for your scan on Monday Rose I'm sure all will be fine, but will be thinking of you. Hope UCH get your results back to you quickly.

13Iggis Sat 16-Feb-13 23:49:19

Can't believe this is the tenth thread! I wonder where it was I first heard of this treatment for rmc, and Mr S's name? I often think I waste too much time on mumsnet, but in this case it was an absolute godsend.
Ds2 is 9 months today, which seems symbolic to me as 9 months before that I must've been about to get pregnant, and start off this whole worrying cycle for the last time. Everyone on this thread is very much in my thoughts, whatever stage of the journey you are on. thanks

Clabbage Sun 17-Feb-13 10:12:21

Thanks for kind words and thoughts. mollie.. Yes I'm on high nkc plan with fragmin (thrown in by lovely nhs consultant). I'm not seeing Dr S anymore though. I'm afraid I'm in the 'not so sure' camp where he is concerned. He's too convinced that everyone he sees has Nk cell issues and am shocked by duggs hearing how dismissive he is of other theories.. Inevitably, for people for whom his treatment has worked, he is a hero and I guess he would be to me, had his treatment worked. I thought twice about posting this as I know this board has a lot of love for him but I feel it's important to those struggling to keep an open mind.

Anyway, I started to miscarry overnight. I suspect it will all be over by the end of the day. I'm numb in truth. 8 times is just ridiculous. I know you have all been there, so further expression of my feelings isn't necessary.

Positive healthy vibes to all those with fabulous bfp's, scans etc.

GreenOlives Sun 17-Feb-13 11:45:19

clabbage Im so sorry to hear that sad And please don't worry about speaking your feelings about Dr S - I for one completely agree with you and that's speaking as someone who has had success on the plan (39 weeks today!) I think his approach is far too blinkered and I think that's lazy - a good doctor should always be looking for other causes and new ideas to investigate/research. Thankfully my nhs consultant (although past retirement age) is very keen to explore new avenues and was happy to support the treatment plan despite the lack of good research/evidence which is why the nk tests are not yet available on the nhs. If Im honest I really don't know whether its the treatment that sustained this pregnancy or whether this one was just "meant to be", and obviously I will never know for sure. I think my nursing background makes me more skeptical about all treatments really! Either way I am very happy to be finally on the home straight of pregnancy and I hope so much that all the ladies on this thread are able to achieve their family dreams too - whether that be with Dr S or exploring other avenues. Take care of yourself clabbage

Hoophopes Sun 17-Feb-13 14:37:20

Hi - can I join here? I am ttc#2, after conceiving my first dc after 7yrs naturally ttc, failed ICSI and after seeing Mr Nduwke when he was still at Care, having L1 and L2 Immune tests to discover I had: raised thyroid level, factor V Leiden, 2 other thrombophilia factors, Th1:Th2 cytokeine issues and high NK levels. I managed to conceive naturally just before got these results and was put on levothyroxine, clexane, 3 intralipids, prednisilone and cyclogest.

However, Dr Nduwke is no longer at Care, we don't wish to go down IVF again as now know problem is implantation/miscarriage (I had a miscarriage in Jan as had no medication to support pregnancy) so the clinic will not support us.

Not sure how to get the medication we need to get our much longed for 2nd child (am nearing 38), without having to go through IVF clinic for IVF treatment. Been to Gp for help, his answer was to email a gynaecologist at local hospital - so not expecting much from that (and indeed haven't heard) so until local gynae that I have never met says yes he will not prescribe the pred or cyclogest I requested after my miscarriage. I am on the thyroxine and aspirin now for life.

Ideally would like not to have to pay for tests to be done again.

Have read quite a lot of these threads, so encouraged to see people are having babies with treatment!!

13Iggis Sun 17-Feb-13 14:58:39

Clabbage, so sorry to read what is happening, I hope it goes as easily as possible for you today. I think you are quite right to explore any avenues you can, and no-one could criticise you for that.

GreenOlives Sun 17-Feb-13 15:19:54

Welcome hoop smile What a journey you had to get to the root of your issues! As I said in my post further up my NHS consultant did support and prescribe my treatment after I had private testing for NK cells and then my gp was happy to.continue with repeat prescriptions. I would think the best course of action would be to ask gp to refer you to gynae consultant and then hope they are supportive. Good luck! smile

Hoophopes Sun 17-Feb-13 17:01:18

Thanks - apparently my gp can email consultants, so that is what he has done and is now "waiting" a response. Seems like a way to add weeks/months delay to my impatient self right now but I can't ask for referral until they have responded. Great to hear you supported by NHS consultant. I don't expect to get treatment until I get a bfp, which I have only every had twice in 7yrs - but am taking aspirin every day now (due to a stroke in last 2yrs) which may help.

Lawlee Sun 17-Feb-13 20:42:59

Hi all and welcome Hoop!

Clabbage I am so so sorry to hear what you are going through. I wish there was something I could do to help make you feel better, it's just all so unfair. ((((Hugs)))) hope you re doing ok as much as possible. I totally get what you were saying about Mr. S's treatment, I think it's amazing that for some lucky people it is almost a cure-all as it were but i don't by any means think any treatment will be one size fits all! I know you will just be thinking about getting through this right now, but I thought I should mention, there is a private group called nk cells and immunology on babycentre where a few people have posted some info about the Greek clinic that Ari mentioned amongst other things. If you are going to be exploring other avenues at another time you might want to have a look, just in case that helps as well as any info Ari or Duggs might give you of course. Thinking of you anyway and hope it is over as easily as possible for you.

Hoop just a thought but could your gp maybe email Mr S himself? You can be referred to his clinic on the NHS for NK cells if you have had 3 consecutive losses and I'm sure he or someone in the clinic could give your doc some info?
Great to have new people joining, although sad that so many of us find ourselves here but must admit to being a tiny bit addicted to MN myself!

Well, I have found a new thing to worry about, as I have developed a rash of red spots on my tummy. I've had a very little rash like it at certain times in my cycle but this is worse than before so I am wondering if it could b a reaction to the progesterone. Will be calling the clinic on Monday to bend their ear about it! Sigh, has to be something eh! All ok otherwise, test this morning was still positive so just taking it one day at a time and trying not to worry too much. I realise I must be sounding fairly paranoid by now! Thanks all for listening anyway and giving me an outlet for it, such a lovely bunch of people on here! thanks

Lawlee Mon 18-Feb-13 07:23:13

Erg some dark hours last night as I discovered that I was spotting when I went to bed and still a little bit this morning. It's not a lot but in combination with the rash and the period type pain I was convinced it was all over! CB digi this morning though says pregnant 1-2 so feeling a bit better about things today, and guess all I can do is keep my fingers crossed. I guess I could go to EPU, but it's too early to scan so not sure they'd be much help, and think I'm just going to have to wait it out and see how the week pans out. Hope you ladies (and do we have any gents?) are all ok? Thank goodness for my DH he's a bit of a rock at times like this. Xx

lawlee sorry ur struggling with spotting to. mine keeps fooling me clears up for a couple of days then returns but never lasts long.
maybe its the meds? I don't know but its really annoying because you can't help but panic.
sorry to hear your news clabbage

Lawlee Mon 18-Feb-13 08:10:22

Thanks Cartoon thats really kind and sorry you struggle with it too. it does make me feel better that it obviously doesn't immediately mean the end though! You're right its so hard not to panic, and I'm over-sensitive to it I think because spotting is how both my nmc's started. Thanks for making me feel better xx

lawlee is it ur cyclogest? that can cause spotting. that's why I use the tradesmans! so I can rule out that possiblity.

Lawlee Mon 18-Feb-13 10:01:21

Guess it could be but would it have an effect that quickly? I've only been using the Cyclogest for 4 days? Been avoiding tradesmans just because I get ibs that is worse when pregnant, and wasn't sure if it might affect it, but maybe I will have to try that way tonight and see how I get on. Worth a try anyway! Xx

lawlee yes because its easy to kind of nick yourself with the pessary. your more sensitive and more likely to bleed if you catch yourself in there during pregnancy.

roseandroli Mon 18-Feb-13 14:17:11

Hey everyone!
lawlee I second what cartoon said, don't worry about a little spotting, cyclogest can irritate the cervix and cause all sorts of worries.

So sorry to hear about what you're going through clabbage. I trust you are looking after yourself through this very difficult time. I can completely understand wanting to explore all possible avenues and accepting the limitations of doctors. Before I saw Mr. Shehata, I spent a year doing acupuncture, regulating my cycle, and getting rid of constant UTIs that had plagued me since my 20s. If I hadn't done all of that, I'm not sure this treatment would have been successful, or if I would've gotten pregnant in the first place. I guess what I'm trying to say is that for some people pregnancy comes so easily, and for others, like some of us on this thread, our bodies just need more help, and we have to find the best course for ourselves. Thinking of you.

I had my 12 week scan today. We got there and were seen right away. They spend ages checking everything, and though the doctor didn't say much, he sort of murmured that he thought everything looked okay. Then they took some bloods and gave us the results after an hour--a combination of the scan and the blood test. Everything looks good so far, the risk of Downs etc is quite low so we won't take the risk of doing further invasive tests (or spend the 500 pounds to do the Harmony Test). It's hard to believe things have progressed to this stage, and I am so grateful and happy.

Best wishes to everyone and many grateful thanks for holding my hand through the first few weeks.

Lawlee Mon 18-Feb-13 14:37:56

Thanks Cartoon and Rose for keeping me sane! Massive huge yay and a big hug for your great scan Rose that's brilliant and amazing you must be so relieved. What a huge weight off your mind that must be! So happy for you.

Interesting though that's at least 3 of us so far with a history of recurrent UTI, thinking I might buy a massive carton of cranberry juice on the way home later!

mollieboo Mon 18-Feb-13 18:46:23

Hi everyone

Huge congrats to delta on your new arrival, wonderful news.

Welcome to the thread hoop and sorry you find yourself on here.

rose fab news about your scan.

clabbage so very sorry to hear your news. Hope you start to heal soon.

As I've just had my 7th mc and lost my darling baby boy in the middle of it all, I'm starting to lose my mind. We're thinking of giving it one more bash on Mr S's plan and if it doesn't work then go down the adoption route. Its so hard to give up, but also I've run out of confidence in my body's ability to carry a baby to term. Not sure if I'm being too negative as the last two mcs on Mr S's programme were due to a blighted ovum and a chemical type pregnancy.

Very interesting to hear about other tests for hidden infections and sperm dna fragmentation etc, I wouldn't have known about any of that and it does make me wonder if we should be doing more testing before trying again, but money and impatience are factors. Its hard to know where to draw the line isn't it.

Hope everyone ok, wishing everyone lots of strength and positive vibes, goodness knows we need it on here xx

BellyD Mon 18-Feb-13 19:36:56

Many congratulations, Delta. Wonderful, heartwarming news.

Great news about your scan too Rose.

Welcome Hoop I am sure you will find this thread as supportive and helpful as the rest of use do.

Lawlee sorry to hear about the spotting, it is always a real worry, but it is more than likely to be implantation bleeding at this stage, so hang on in there.

Mollieboo and Clabbage thinking of you both and so sorry you are suffering.

Olives and Sarah looking forward to your LO's putting in an appearance iminently. Good luck with everything. Nearly there, yay!

BellyD Mon 18-Feb-13 19:39:04

Sorry, I forgot to mention Kittens antenatal classes. How are they going? Another milestone achieved, brilliant!

Waves to everyone else, lurkers and otherwise.

Clabbage Mon 18-Feb-13 21:16:42

Thank you all so much for kind words, support and advice. All so invaluable. I had a read re Greek testing on bc. Thank you for that. ari can you remind me how you went about getting tested and cost as I seem to remember you did it directly.
lawlee I truly hope that all is well.
mollie you are very much in my thoughts, I remember so clearly the overwhelming 'need' for a baby to pour all that stemmed flow of love you feel for your son. (sue too). I was so lucky to very quickly have my dd after Harry died, in truth all my mc's have made me realise just how lucky. I'm not sure how old you are but I hope you have time on your side to have that rainbow.
greenolives thank you for sharing a medical (and personal) viewpoint, it made me feel far less daft!
I'm not sure what my next move is..I guess a bit of healing and then take stock. I am incredibly lucky to have children and really wonder if it's just pure masochism to continue trying. I just cannot imagine giving up. Damn my bloody nature.

Clabbage Mon 18-Feb-13 22:20:23

Oh and massive congratulations to delta, wonderful news

Lawlee Mon 18-Feb-13 22:45:05

Hi all, Cartoon, Rose, Mollie, Belly and Clabbage and everyone thanks so much for thinking of me and for all your kind support especially with the really difficult times some of you are going through. Both of you are in my thoughts Mollie and Clabbage hope you feel a bit better after some time and healing and a chance to work through and find the path that suits each if you best. Mollie I am lucky in that I have a family member who adopted, so although I desperately want my own children, I do at the same have an example of how great that can be as an option and what a tight knit and loving family they are. Hoping it doesn't come to that for either of us though and fc for your take home baby very soon!

Well am hanging on in there. I had a bit of a panic this afternoon because I had actual cramping and the spotting went from (sorry if this is TMI) a little of brown to bright pink, and I really thought that was it. All seems to have eased off now though so got everything crossed that was it done and over with and I am focused on just getting through one day at a time. Don't think it's the cyclogest causing it because of the cramps, but I am trying the other way too (blush) so at least i can rule that out. Have a good evening ladies, tomorrow is another day! X

mollieboo Mon 18-Feb-13 22:53:18

lawlee yes I too hope all is well, spotting does make you worry so much but hopefully its nothing to worry about at all. Thank you for info as I joined the babycentre immunology forum too, head is now spinning after looking at that and looking on adoption websites.

clabbage thank you for understanding just how I feel. I hope you're bearing up ok. Its all such a nightmare isn't it. Good for you for not giving up. I can't help thinking that no matter what I say about stopping trying, as soon as I know I'm about to ovulate I won't be able to not try! I'm 36 so hopefully still time to get there, I guess its good that I get pregnant really quickly although that in itself makes me worry about the unfussy womb theory. I so hope that the treatment works for us both next time and you get your baby too after all of your heartbreaking losses.

greenolives thank you for posting the info and I hope you get your baby soon too. There is so much knowledge on here from all of you ladies.

mollieboo Mon 18-Feb-13 22:56:45

Sorry olives I got confused, it was duggs who posted the info about testing which Mr Shehata doesn't do. Its s busy thread at mo! X

duggs1976 Tue 19-Feb-13 05:42:11

Clabbage - after our last mc on dr s programme with 2 chrimosonalky tested IVF embryos that implanted then failed a week or so later we'd given up. But dr gorgy does the hidden infection testing & spermatozoa DNA fragmentation testing & prescribes treatmemt. If you go direct look up serum lotus clinic in Athens for infection screening and for DNA screening it is the doctors labatory in South Dakota USA.

Arianrhod Tue 19-Feb-13 15:27:58

clabbage The chlamydia test alone is 100 euros, if you add in the additional '7 in 1' infections testing it's an extra 170 euros. I chose to get tested for the lot, and I'm glad I did, even if it hasn't helped me get/stay pregnant. It's easy enough to get tested; you need one of those urine sample tubes (you can get one from most chemists I think; I had one left over from my GP from many, many times of getting tested for UTIs!) and some saline (I used saline drops from Boots). I think you just need a teaspoon of blood. I posted mine off via normal post (I think I sent it International Recorded, but you don't need to) and it got to Serum within about 5 days. When they've got the sample they email you for payment which you can do by bank transfer or Paypal - I used Paypal. Then they email you with the results and if you need it, a prescription for any medications necessary.

If you want to know, this is what they look for in the '7 in 1' tests:

an 'ordinary' test for Chlamydia Trachomatis;
a test of total bacterial load, which measures the level of 'good bugs' (lactobacillae) – a reduced population tends to indicate an abnormal vaginal environment caused by another, more hostile, bacteria, such as E-coli, Proteus etc.;
2 species of Mycoplasmas – Mycoplasma Genitalium and Mycoplasma Hominis;
2 other Bacterial Vaginosis species – Gardnerella Vaginalis and Atopobium Vaginae).

Hope that helps!

Arianrhod Tue 19-Feb-13 15:28:37

Oh, and OH got the sperm DNA and SA testing done via Mr S, so it was done at the Doctor's Lab.

mollieboo Tue 19-Feb-13 17:36:30

Hi everyone,

My reflexologist has recommended taking the following vitamins:

Lamberts Strongstart professional grade vitamins and minerals with omega 3 capsules
Co-enzyme Q10 100mg daily
Floradix - a herbal iron tablet that nurtures the blood

All sounds good but am a bit nervous of anything interfering with the steroids etc. Just wondering if anyone else has taken any or all of these? I think I'll get the Lamberts multi vits to take instead of Pregnacare and Floradix but not sure about the co-enzyme Q10.

Might check with the Miscarriage Clinic first that its ok to take them.

Thanks for any advice x

Clabbage Tue 19-Feb-13 20:25:32

Thank you duggs and ari. I really appreciate that.
mollie I've no idea on those vits but hope you get the answers.

lawlee how are you doing?

Arianrhod Tue 19-Feb-13 20:47:28

mollie Mr S told me to take Co-Q10 when I first saw him, an it has absolutely no reactions with steroids, so don't worry. I take LOTS of supplements, none of which has any effect on steroids. Don't worry smile

13Iggis Tue 19-Feb-13 20:50:23

Mollie just to echo what Ari has said - I took co-enzyme Q10, folic acid, pregnacare, spatone (like floradix, though only once pg), selenium, vit D, and god knows what else.

suemays Tue 19-Feb-13 21:21:10

Hi ladies, just thought I would add to the ivf with cgh discussion. We were told that even with paying extra for this if the pregnancy had not been natural we would still have had the development issues with scarlet as it wouldn't pick it up. This could be a reason why ivf didn't work for you duggs as it could just be bad luck twice for you with ivf in the respect that your body knew the eggs would have development probs. it doesn't necessarily mean that you do have other underlying issues. If only we could get a definite answer why we miscarry etc it would be easier to treat it. I know the bad luck thing sounds a bit far fetched but then look at my situation and also other ladies that have lost children and then had miscarriages.

mollieboo Tue 19-Feb-13 21:25:52

Thanks ari and iggi, will stock up on vits tomorrow smile x

duggs1976 Tue 19-Feb-13 21:48:02

Yes sue fair point. How are you doing? Also choccy and pebbles too?

Lawlee Tue 19-Feb-13 22:39:35

Hi all, Clabbage I'm ok ta, thought the spotting and cramping had stopped but it came back this afternoon, but am doing ok otherwise. Bit mental busy in the office so having to pull some longer hours which is really bad timing with the fatigue that usually kicks off in the first weeks for me, but at least it's keeping my from fretting 24 hours a day! How are you doing now? Hope you are feeling relatively ok? Mollie too? I'm glad the bc info was useful and interesting chat on here about ivf etc I am following it all but going to crash out in bed now as I am exhausted! More tomorrow I'm sure. Big waves and hugs to everyone, hope you are all doing ok x

ChoccyPud Wed 20-Feb-13 13:48:25

Just a quick hello from me... Nothing to report here at the moment except I had the hysteroscopy which was fine, no issues, and I now have some nice scoring in my uterine lining to help with implantation and release some good cytokines to try to balance out my bad ones.

Not much effort put in this month in terms of timing ttc nor ov sticks to time starting Pred (found I'd run out!) so if I got a BFP it would be a hell of a lucky strike. Tbh it's just been nice to feel human, allowed to swi/swoi and LIVE without stressing too much about when we do it. I'm taking the Pred though just in case - with my history I'd be silly not to.

I was put on to Floradix recently after bleeding for a month or so after my last mc. I'd felt exhausted the whole time and it really helped perk me up. No ill effects.

Waves to all who remember me and very belated welcomes and whispered congrats to the newly upduffed and those with new arrivals. Special hugs to Kittens going to ante natal class and being only a few weeks away from meeting your longed for little one, I'm all warm and fuzzy here!

If anyone is doing the list, please could you update me to say mc's April and November 2012. Thanks smile

Arianrhod Wed 20-Feb-13 14:20:14

Good to 'see' you choccy smile

mollieboo Wed 20-Feb-13 15:06:43

Hi choccy, I've just this minute bought a large pack of Floridix to help after my mc last week so its good to hear that it did you good. Hope you have some luck after your procedure and a bit of a rest.

Thanks lawlee am doing ok, v worried about future but will have another go soon, as you do!

Hi to everyone else too.

duggs1976 Wed 20-Feb-13 21:29:58

Hey choccy lovely to hear from you! Your are humira covered now aren't you?

ChoccyPud Thu 21-Feb-13 19:06:10

Duggs humira is supposed to stay in your system for 6-9 months so I've still got some time left on it. How's things with you?

CateN Thu 21-Feb-13 21:45:19

Just checking in as I see my name is still on the list. Am 31 weeks now with a little boy and everything seems fine. Wishing everybody on here the very best of luck and thank you to all who helped me during the first tough few months of this pregnancy

BellyD Thu 21-Feb-13 22:41:56

Hi Cate good to hear your pregnancy is progressing well.

Just lurking for news from Sarah. I think she was having her c-section today.

Havingkittens Sat 23-Feb-13 17:28:06

Not been on here for a while, it's been busy again!

Just posting quickly to answer rose - I have had excellent care from UCH. I am in a different area to you, in Islington, so not covered by the same midwife team but my midwife is lovely and really helpful. I have had a couple of extra appointments later in my pregnancy due to MC history, so that's reassuring too. In the last few weeks I've had a lot of back pain and now starting to get pelvic pain so my midwife referred me for physio and it only took 2 weeks to get an appointment. They seem pretty efficient. Although she also referred me for acupuncture to try and turn the baby, who is currently breech and I've just got my appointment through and it's not for a month which will be too late - but she may be able to chase it up and get something earlier. We'll see. I've been pretty impressed with them so far. Also, I've hardly spent any time at all in the waiting rooms. They are very prompt with their appointments. Not like the old days!

Hello to everyone else. Sorry, this is a bit of a fleeting visit!

Lawlee Sun 24-Feb-13 07:05:46

Morning all, yes 6:30 and I have been awake at least an hour, oh well smile Sorry I've been a bit AWOL this week, work has just been absorbing every hour of my time and then we have friends staying this weekend that has kept us busy! It's been a great way to get through the last few days though as I've had no time to worry. Got a date for my first early scan now, 13 March, which seems like a lifetime away, but hopefully the time will go quickly. I am trying not to obsess about all the things that can go wrong between now and then and just focus on feeling positive each day that I'm still pregnant. Easier said than done in the wee hours of the morning of course, especially as I don't seem to have my usual symptoms of sore boobs and nausea. On the plus side I did finally manage to get myself some omeprazole last week, which turns out they had just forgotten to prescribe me, and it has actually changed my life. I think it is amazing! I didn't realise how nagging the constant little digs of heartburn had become (had it ever since my first loss unfortunately) and how much it had affected me and my eating patterns until I was suddenly free of it! So glad I went back and asked, thankyou whoever it was that told me about it! KittensI think?
How are we all anyway? Kittens glad to hear you had good care from UCH, how was your antenatal class?
Hello Cate, always lovely to hear from someone further along that's doing well. At not 5 weeks myself yet its a long road so all the positive vibes and inspiritation I can get from seeing lovely ladies like yourself doing so well is great! How are you feeling these days, must be starting to get a bit excited?
Hi Choccy nice to meet u as it were, sounds great about the uterine scoring and the relaxed month, fingers crossed it does the trick! Sometimes being more relaxed for a bit is exactly what your body needs I think. For me this cycle that we got a positive we actually only swi three times in total(!) so you never know, but either way sometimes it's just nice anyway to not have to think about it all too hard isn't it.
Mollie and Clabbage Hope you are both doing ok and having nice weekends.
Big waves and hugs to everyone else, how are you all getting on? How are you doing Cartoon did the spotting ease off in the end? Xx

GreenOlives Sun 24-Feb-13 07:44:43

Good morning all, hope you are all having a relaxing weekend. Sorry you're up so early lawlee - hope you can squeeze in a nap later!
Well its my due date today! grin No sign of baby arriving anytime soon though! I've had 2 stretch & sweeps this past week which have done nothing! I have been getting lots of Braxton Hicks for weeks now but that's about it. They come when they're ready I suppose! It is mine and DHs wedding anniversary today too - not much planned, make go out for dinner with DH and DS. Will keep you posted on baby's arrival and will keep reading all your news! smile

morning all.
hope baby olives makes an appearance soon!
lawlee glad uve got the heartburn sorted. its so hard those first couple of weeks you just have to take a day at a time. my spotting still comes and goes every few days or so its never much nor do I have pains/ cramps with it so no ones too worried. I finally booked in with the NHS midwife on thurs. she booked me a reasurrance scan on tues morning. I also have a scan with Mr s on Fri then my NHS 12wk scan is the Wednesday after. so lots of chances to see my bean coming up! thanks for thinking of me. smile

TheAccidentalExhibitionist Sun 24-Feb-13 15:05:09

How exciting * GreenOlives* the very best of luck for an easy delivery.

I'm keeping fingers and toes crossed for you cartoontrickster

I've been mainly hovering around the thread. It's so wonderfully positive to hear good news story.
After trying the Hydroxy prescribed by Mr S and getting light sensitive eyes I've decided to try to the Prednisolone. I'm relieved he agreed eventually to prescribe it to me, even though he said it was my risk to take and he would take no responsibility for it (I have a suspected stomach ulcer, not confirmed though).
Fortunately, after taking the NKC results to my local French GP she is also happy to prescribe Pred. Between us and a sympathetic Gynae I've found down here, I think I'm going to try and get my next pregnancy managed locally. My french GP is amazingly supportive but a little baffled by everything!

In an ideal world I would fly monthly to see Mr S but the cost involved in that would limit us to only one 'try' by managing a pregnancy locally using his treatment plan, if the next pregnancy fails at least we will be able to afford to try again.
Has anyone else done this? I'm sure there are disadvantages..

So, we get to start TTC after the next period eek!
After making a conscious effort to not conceive for a year to let my body and mind rest and recover, I'm looking forward to some intensive SWI blush grin

Wigglewigglewoo Sun 24-Feb-13 18:27:15

Hi guys, first post here and wanted some advice. I've stopped seeing mr s for various reasons. Good to see so many BFPs on here. I'm currently 18 weeks with DC2 after 4 MCs. I'm still taking cyclogest as was too scared to stop. Can anyone advise on whether you just stopped at 16 weeks or weaned at 16 weeks?
Many many thanks

freelancegirl Sun 24-Feb-13 20:01:14

Hello all. I saw on FB that all had gone well with Sarah and that her little Pred baby was finally here smile I didn't want to say anything and steal the thunder from any announcements but she hasn't been on as I imagine she is rather thought I would just say.

Hi Wiggle! Congratulations on the pregnancy and welcome to the thread. I think the advice is that you can just stop the Cyclogest but I think I cut them down (literally) in half for a few days, just being a bit paranoid. You might want to try that if you are also in the paranoid camp - like a lot of us recurrent mc folk tend to be! But essentially I think the extra progesterone is just a back-up and actually is probably only helpful until the placenta has taken over anyway - so 18 weeks is fine to stop.

Nice to hear from Cate, Choccy and others we haven't heard from for a while. Great news about the pregnancy Cate! Really good to hear it is all going well.

Olives due date!! Wooooo! Keep us updated - we will all be looking out for you. Another Pred baby on the way.

Have fun TTC Accidental smile and good luck everyone else too xx

mollieboo Sun 24-Feb-13 20:37:43

Hi all,

free thanks for posting fab news about sarah's baby arriving.

olives keep us posted and look after yourself.

lawlee the pred plays havoc with your sleep doesn't it. Glad the Omaprezole has done you good.

accidental glad you've sorted out pred, must be a weight off your mind now, good luck ttc.

Good luck cartoon with your next scan.

I wondered if anyone has an opinion on the unfussy womb theory? I'm 36 and have had 8 pregnancies over the past 3 years. I conceived 6 of them on first cycle and 2 of them on third cycle. I worry that this isn't normal and my body is wrongly implanting any embryo instead of sorting the good from the bad. Obviously I'm hoping that I'm just lucky to be fertile and that the only problem is high nkc, but I'm not feeling confident in any way about going into another pregnancy. Has anyone else worried about this but then had a successful pregnancy? Thanks all x

Lawlee Sun 24-Feb-13 21:54:07

Gosh it's been busy on here today! Here goes:
Yay for Sarah and the lovely little baba, very exciting!

Ooh keep us posted Olives soo excited for you too smile Bet you can't wait!

Gl for your scan on Tues Cartoon and glad you aren't having troubles with the spotting, yay for lots of chances for piccies!

Accidental very happy for you that you got the outcome you wanted and yay for TTC again, have lots of fun wink

Hello Wiggle, hope all goes well with coming off the cyclogest, must feel fab to get far enough along to get some of the meds out of your system.

Hiya Free always great to hear from you again and thanks for telling us about Sarah! Hope all is well with you

Mollie thanks for thinking of me, yes it's a nightmare but hoping it will be totally worth it of course. I have often wondered about an unfussy womb myself, out of my four pregnancies (all over the last 8ish months), 3 have been in the first cycle of trying and one in the second. Fingers crossed this one is the good one but if not we will persevere! I hope you get to hear some good news stories too, I would be interested myself.

Phew! Ok i'm sorry to pester you all but quick question, anyone find the pred masks symptoms? I will be 4 + 6 tomorrow and i know its really early still but usually i get nausea pretty quick and really sore boobs straight away. This time though, nada, not even sore nipples, just ever so slightly sensitive and even that might be my imagination! Am maintaining the PMA and assuming all is well unless proven otherwise, but would be good to know if anyone else had the same. Thanks!

Ok, am off to bed now as I'm shattered from my early morning! Night night all x. Zzzzzzzz

mollieboo Sun 24-Feb-13 22:50:11

I forgot to say hello and welcome to wiggle, congrats on your pregnancy.

Also forgot to say 7 out of my 8 pregnancies were early mcs, any views on unfussy womb theory appreciated. But nothing I can do about it anyway but keep trying...


ChoccyPud Mon 25-Feb-13 07:21:58

Running but just to say, Mollie don't read anything into symptoms or lack of. Or rather try not to! Also each pg on Pred is different again so because you felt something or nothing previously don't expect the same next time. Waste of energy!

I get pg first or second try too, but there is a lot against the unfunny womb theory, eg if a sperm is good enough to fertilise an egg naturally, it's good enough full stop. Who knows. There's no way to find out when you mc very early on so I guess try not to worry about that either.

Right, running late as per usual so better go! Have a good day everyone, great news about Sarah. smile

thanks lawlee and mollie I'm slightly nervous for tomorrows scan but I think its more the fact that I'm going to my local hospital where I usually get bad news so I have bad memories of being there.
slight winge coming up (its a bit shallow I know) and i sort of wondered how everyone else got along if they didn't mind sharing. I have put on a lot of weight. trouble is I lost weight just dropped off before I got married in December. then I relaxed loads over Xmas (i had been going to the gym) I put on 6lbs, which I was planning on losing. then found out I was pregnant since then I've put on a further 5/6lbs. I think its a mix of the pred and no longer exercising. I'm too scared to go to the gym. but I'm only 10 and a half weeks and worried that this rapid weight gain is unhealthy. I thought you should only gain a couple of pounds in the first trimester?

TheAccidentalExhibitionist Mon 25-Feb-13 16:01:58

That weight gain sounds normal for during the first trimester. It actually slowed down for me during the second. Many women are showing noticeable bumps and weight gain within the first 12 weeks. I guess the Pred doesn't help.
Gentle exercising like a walk would still be fine if you're missing exercise.

roseandroli Mon 25-Feb-13 16:56:12

Good luck with your scan tomorrow, cartoon!

Don't worry about the weight gain. When I was last at Dr. Shehata's office, Louise patted my belly and said, "that's the steroids" (and not the biscuits, cupcakes, late night croissants I've been scoffing...?)

Great news about sarah's new arrival, and welcome wiggle and good luck ttc accidental and waves to everyone else! Lawlee I have no pregnancy symptoms, not a single one, except fierce hunger but I think that is down to pred. I had a dream of getting bigger boobs when I got pregnant, but that hasn't happened yet...

Sorry if I've forgotten anyone--this thread moves so fast!

thanks rose and accidentle for reassurance over my weight gain! its just I feel podgy and bloated I can't wait for it to look like a bump!
rose how funny Louise did that. not sure if I'd be offendedhmm
as for symptoms its funny how different everyone is. I'd read on here most people didn't get any due to the pred. so lawlee I wouldn't worry plus its early for symptoms I know u said u would normally have them but every pregnancy is different.
for me I have nausea most evenings and have done from around 6wks. I have slightly sore nipples but that's it. I have gained a cup size though, badly need to go bra shopping. I didn't have many that fit in the first place now I virtually have none.

TheAccidentalExhibitionist Mon 25-Feb-13 18:10:07

Good luck for tomorrow cartoontrickster

roseandroli Mon 25-Feb-13 18:29:12

Oh cartoon how I wish I had your bra dilemma!

I think Louise was just reassuring me because I was complaining about weight gain. I am starting to get what sometimes feels like a bump and other times just appears to be the result of a large meal I've consumed in a hurry.

Now that I don't have a scan scheduled till 20 weeks, and still can't feel anything moving down there, I'm just twiddling my thumbs and hoping everything is OK. Had a moment of paranoia over the weekend when I realized I had eaten raw-egg mayonnaise, feta cheese, and smoked salmon all in one go. Cue hours of googling Listeria and freaking myself out.

Lawlee Mon 25-Feb-13 20:37:07

Thanks Choccy Rose and Cartoon you ladies are all so kind and have put my mind at rest, even though I knew I was being paranoid. I had such terrible ms and constant vomiting with my mmc that definitely I won't be sad not to have those symptoms if the pred does mask it! grin
Cartoon hope all goes well again tomorrow, will be lurking for news. Oh and i'm a bit late to the party but i agree with the others, don't think thats too much weight gain bet it won't take long to become more of a bump either! Hope you manage to get some new bras too lol.
Rose I'm a fine one to talk given my constant paranoia, but I wouldn't worry about listeriosis from just that one meal, I think you would already be feeling really ill by now if you were going to get something from it anyway. Also I think it would probably hit the news if there was an outbreak of listeria poisoning wouldn't it? Just cos I vaguely remember something about it in Canada a few years back?
I would like Cartoon's dilemma too Rose but I do remember my friend complaining about the discomfort and terrible backache she had when she gained a lot of cup sizes after she had her baby, so trying to rationalise that as something I might not want if I had it lol!
Hope everyone is having a good start to the week.
Hugs and waves xx

rose I've got 3 scans over the next 2wks with NHS and Mr s. I've been wondering how ill cope when they are less frequent I'm such a worry.
I agree I think you would have become ill quite quickly! so don't worry I'm sure I've eaten things I probably shouldn't, runny yolks on my eggs being one of them. its so hard to remember all the rules.
glad I'm not the only one with a 'pred bump' surely it can't really be baby just yet for me but hopefully not too much longer.

hey scan today was good! my local epu does make me horribly nervous though. but all fine measurements correct, heartbeat still going strong etc etc. we even saw the baby move. grin

Lawlee Tue 26-Feb-13 13:57:32

Congrats Cartoon that's great news! So pleased for you!

Rose you are not alone as I only this morning realised that I ate a whole load of Brie & crackers on Saturday at the brother in-laws without even thinking about it. I'm normally so good about that sort of thing I don't know why I didn't clock it! Feel like a bit of an idiot for not even realising I'd had it, and now I have to listen to my own sage advice lol! Hope u r ok. Xx

TheAccidentalExhibitionist Tue 26-Feb-13 15:17:21

Brilliant news cartoontrickster I'm so pleased for you.

roseandroli Tue 26-Feb-13 16:38:07

Congratulations, cartoon!! What fantastic news!

Thanks for your advice lawlee. I sort of veer between thinking I should just eat whatever I want (within reason) because the odds of getting anything are so slim, and then scarfing the wrong thing and berating myself endlessly for being a glutton and only thinking about my stomach when I should be thinking about the baby. I'm sure your Brie was fine. I assume French people eat that sort of thing all the time!

thanks guys!
how are you getting on accidental?
I agree with rose, although I do feel bad if I'm a bit naught with eating something. but surely like you say French woman eat all those cheeses we're not ment to

Lawlee Tue 26-Feb-13 17:31:48

Thanks Rose and Cartoon yes I'm sure you're right! Plus plenty of people must have lots of those things before they know they are pregnant too without any ill effects anyways.

So pleased for you Cartoon hope they gave you a nice pic to take away, how many weeks are you now, I've lost track? Xx

they didn't actually! I asked but the consultant said no they dont do them at early scans. bit disappointing. but ill get one at my 12wk on the 6th. I'm 10+5 today, they measured the bean to be exactly what I thought date wise.

Lawlee Tue 26-Feb-13 17:47:20

Oh that's annoying! I just assumed you would get one, that seems a bit mean to me, its not like most women wouldn't be willing to pay for it. Oh well anyway, as you say you can get one soon, and massive yay for measuring right on date, that's brill!

I can't stop thinking about my first scan, I have to wait a whole two weeks yet (!) and all I keep doing is daydreaming about seeing a heartbeat - we have never seen one. But i don't want to get my hopes up too much at the same time. Don't think my boss is too impressed with my absentmindedness at the moment either lol.

its do hard. honestly I really struggled to het through to that first scan. so the best I've got to say is one day at a time and try not to obsess too much. I know you will though because I did. we had never seen a heartbeat before either. so I'm sure now that your on the treatment all will be fine. x

TheAccidentalExhibitionist Tue 26-Feb-13 18:55:58

Getting on fine thanks cartoontrickster just trying to cope with my son in the half term. He's a moody 9 year old with ASD, trying to peel him off the computer and get him out for exercise everyday is a frustrating challenge. We live close to the Pyrenees, all our friends are skiing at the moment but my son can't cope with the snow touching his skin. Such a shame.

Oh Lawlee I completely understand your dread about scans and daydreaming for a heartbeat. It's hard to believe its possible for us recurrent MC.

Just ordered a bunch of early pregnancy tests from eBay. Haven't received the Pred from the UK yet.
I'm really really nervous about taking it. Mr S tried to put me off having the Pred as I said I was sensitive to stimulants. I don't drink caffeine and have suffered a little from anxiety in the distant past. I think he's convinced I'll flip out on it.
How has everyone else been with it?

oh bless him what a shame. did you have him before your miscarriages? I found the pred ok actually, just found I was hungry but other than that I've been lucky and not been effected by it. I'm part way through weening off it at the moment.

Lawlee Tue 26-Feb-13 20:29:53

Thanks Cartoon and Accidental, yes impossible not to obsess haha, but as you say taking it one day at a time.

Aw Accidental that sounds like hard work but he is so lucky to have a mum like you who is willing and able to put the extra effort and support i to make all the difference. Bless him. With the pred, so far I have found the biggest side effect is insomnia, although I have had trouble sleeping in the past, so I'm not surprised about that when you combine it with all the natural worry as well. I'm a born worrier, in case you hadn't noticed! I take it with my breakfast as early as possible so as to limit the impact and I have totally cut out all caffeine. I also found the pred made my heartburn much worse until I got them to prescribe me some Omeprazole which fixed me right up even better than I was before! It doesn't seem to impact my mood any though I think it's natural to be a bit anxious on the journey we're on from time to time. Hope that helps xx

TheAccidentalExhibitionist Wed 27-Feb-13 08:18:45

Yes I had my DS then 5 MC.

One of the reasons we moved to France was that it would allow me and my DH to work much less (because of DHs job) and support my DS more. It's really tough though, France is 30 years behind in understanding Autism but that's a whole new thread!

Thanks for the reassurance about the Pred both of you. It really helps, I don't want to wind myself up about taking them then find its a self fulfilling prophesy. I'm not really a worrier but Mr S really put the fear into me about Pred. I think he painted it in its worst possible light in order to persuade me to have the Hydroxy instead.

Did you know you can ask for enteric coated Pred Lawlee. It should alleviate lots of the heartburn. Saying that though, heartburn is really common in pregnancy so you may have it regardless.

mollieboo Wed 27-Feb-13 17:11:58

cartoon congrats on your scan, great news.

Hello to everyone else too, only a fleeting visit xx

Lawlee Wed 27-Feb-13 18:09:24

Thanks Accidental I didn't know that, but actually the Omeprazole has fixed me right up anyway, and not getting any heartburn as a result anymore, yay! Good luck with the pred when it arrives, I'm sure you will be fine on it but perhaps you could ask your DH to keep a general eye on you while you are taking it, if that might give you a bit of reassurance?

Not much news from me except that today I have been getting a bit of mild nausea, which I am strangely relieved to have, so long as it doesn't get too bad! 5+1 from lmp today, so here's hoping it stays mild as the next two weeks go on smile Oh and I got my 3+ on a randomly leftover CB digi that I had, so that was nice! Incidentally, I've been booked in for a scan at 7+1 but that is from lmp not ovulation, so I'm now hoping that's not too early! When did you all have your first scans?

Hope everyone else is ok, any other updates or scans or anything coming up? Xx

accidental have you been managing to keep ds occupied? what's it like in general living in France? how long till your pred arrives.
lawlee I had a scan booked for I think the same dates as u by lmp. anyway I was actually 6+6 and that was fine. I don't think you need to worry that its too early. do you think u ovulated late then? glad you feel sick (in the nicest possible way)
11weeks tomorrow here. getting closer and closer to that magic 12week mark!

TheAccidentalExhibitionist Wed 27-Feb-13 19:07:54

Thanks Lawlee I spoke to my French doctor about any anxiety or insomnia and she will prescribe me some homeopathic remedies if I need them. Homeopathy is massive here. I'm a medic so was taught not to believe in it but it's worked really well for me regardless with other things so I'll take anything she gives me confused
Cartoontrickster DS has been a bit better today, he's either nose down in front of a computer and can't be distracted or he's hyperactive, jumping around the furniture. There is no inbetween, we tried to go swimming today and despite me trailing round after him making sure he had his bag, it still got Left behind. Still, we got out of the house!
We've thought long and hard about whether we can handle a second child with Autism. Strangely enough if we do go on to have a second child the age difference between them will make it easier to cope with. Not what we hoped for but you've got to think positively about things!

Does everyone intend to go public with their pregnancies at the magic 12 week mark?

glad you got out even if it wasn't a particularily successful trip accidental! sounds like you do brilliantly.
at 12weeks we plan to tell dhs brother and fiance and maybe a couple of close friends. other than that I won't be going out of my way to announce it. I don't have facebook, which seems to be what most people use for sharing there news. ill be more as and when I see people I think. I only have a couple of close friends but have a few others I'm just not as close to, its those people who won't be receiving a text from me next week! dh is very cautious so wants to avoid telling people for as long as poss.

Lawlee Wed 27-Feb-13 21:19:54

Hiya, Cartoon I'll be 5 weeks +3 from ovulation when I have my scan, but 7+1 from start of my lmp and I was just checking really that I hadn't given her the wrong date when she said my scan should be around 7 weeks IYKWIM. Sounds ok though, hopefully they'll b able to c something!
Accidental glad too that you got out, and I probably will tell people after 12 weeks too, think it would be a struggle to keep it quiet longer than that - am a bit of a talker! grin

Ok so paranoia of the day is fear of ectopic today after I had twinges in my left side on and off over the last week. No cure for this fear until I get to the scan I'm afraid. It's at least in part psychological I'm sure because a friend of mine had to have surgery for an ectopic recently, but that doesn't seem to stop me being a basket case lol! Honestly I really am normally a sane person haha. I feel like such an idiot for worrying all the time sometimes blush

lawlee you nuttergrin I think you worry more than me, which is quite an achievement. I'm sure your not having an eptopic. twinges are normal I've had loads. in fact about half the symptoms I've had when Googled could mean some sort of problem. but obviously I'm all fine. its so confusing. please try not too worry.

freelancegirl Thu 28-Feb-13 12:13:07

Twinges are probably the corpus luteum cyst (sp?). I had
Loads with DS. Gotta run xx

mollieboo Thu 28-Feb-13 14:07:39

Hi girls, lawlee I had lots of twinges when pregnant, I worry when I have them and then I worry when they stop, that's the nature of this crazy game! Hope you're ok.

I've always followed doctors advice re waiting to ttc after an mc. I've waited one cycle or two depending on advice and I've still mc'd. So I'm wondering whether to wait at all this time or just get on with it. Has anyone else tried straight after an mc?

mollie my gp told me after my first mc. to go right on ahead and try and that they only say to wait to make dating easier. he even said that your odds should be better getting pregnant again quicker. I got preg 2nd cycle after 1st mc and had a blighted ovum. so who knows maybe bad luck maybe my gp wad wrong.
this time we waited not on anyones advice just because we were getting married. I had a 5month break. who knows whether that helped or wouldn't have made a difference. sorry that's not much help! I guess what I mean is I've heard lots of theorys but I just think what will be will be. what has Mr s said? how to you feel about TTC again? I think your feelings of being ready or not count for a lot to.

mollieboo Thu 28-Feb-13 16:05:29

Thanks cartoon, seems every doctor's opinion is different. Mr S said to wait a cycle as I'm at more risk of mc if I don't wait. I agree with you though, if it's meant to be it'll work out. I always want to try asap, just the way I am, feel so desperate to be pregnant all of the time!

I understand. but I would try and follow Mr s's advice.

Lawlee Thu 28-Feb-13 17:20:43

Hi ladies,

Yep, nutter and I know it Cartoon haha, I like that I can take it as a personal achievement though lol grin thanks for the advice tho. You too Free, makes me feel loads better!

Mollie we have tried both ways, the mmc took a while to get over so we had a break of a couple of cycles after that but one of my mc was really early so we felt ready to TTC straight away after. Only thing was I didn't actually ovulate the cycle right after as far as I could tell, so obvs my body wasn't really ready. After that we waited one cycle before trying but then we mc again. This time because I was waiting for results it was actually 4 cycles before we tried and it did feel nice in a way to be able to relax and not think about it for a bit. Don't know if that has made a difference. Different people recover at different rates I think tho so it's got to be what's right for you. Did Mr S say why he thought the risk was higher?Have you had your nk cells re-tested i can't remember? It's so hard I know, that desperate urge to be pregnant again is pretty hard to ignore. Hope you come to a decision that works for you xx

GreenOlives Thu 28-Feb-13 17:25:10

Hello all.
Just popping in to say that my lovely pred baby arrived on 26.2.13. It turns out he is a DS2 so I am blessed with 2 lovely boys after a lot of heartache! We have called him Thomas Edward and he weighed in at a whopping 10lbs 15oz! shock Managed a normal delivery just with gas & air although I did need an episiotomy to fit his head out! shock It is knackering but we are all elated that finally we are a family of 4! grin grin grin
Good luck to each and every one of you - miracles really do happen smile

Lawlee Thu 28-Feb-13 17:52:57

Olives congratulations sooooo pleased for you !!! Hurrah! What a lovely name too smile

13Iggis Thu 28-Feb-13 18:13:21

Olives, congratulations, so happy for you grin
And I take my hat off to you for delivering him, he is a lovely healthy size!

TheAccidentalExhibitionist Thu 28-Feb-13 19:00:14

Huge congratulations greenolives it gives us all hope.

mollieboo Thu 28-Feb-13 20:12:53

Huge congrats olives, wonderful news, yet another boy on the thread. Lovely name, what a healthy weight, and gas and air only, what a woman! Yes it does give us all hope x

Havingkittens Thu 28-Feb-13 23:40:39

Oh my, Olives, well done on coping with just gas and air! Congratulations, that's wonderful news. x

sarahs999 Fri 01-Mar-13 08:15:34

Olives, congrats! I too have good news - pred baby Inigo Henry smith was born on 21 feb weighing 6lb 4oz. We've had a rough start as he was readmitted to hospital after discharge, with jaundice and dehydration, but we are now back home and settling into family life as a group of four. Cannot believe we finally got here. Hoping this gives hope to those of you still waiting for your miracles, just as I had hope when racing this thread for the first time a little over a year ago.

GreenOlives Fri 01-Mar-13 09:10:23

Massive congrats Sarah! grin Glad all is well now and he is back at home thanks

Just have to say that the gas & air only was purely because DS2 decided to make a fairly quick arrival - after a slow start to labour when I was seriously considering an epidural I suddenly went from 4cm to pushing in about 1.5 hours - no time for any serious painkillers!! smile

freelancegirl Fri 01-Mar-13 09:22:53

Woooo to the two new thread babies! So happy for you both. Although sorry to hear you had a stressful start Sarah but had it is all ok now. Must arrange a meet up when you out and about. Fancy baby cinema?

Lots of love to all. How many babies have been born since the thread started? And does that mean kittens is next?

Arianrhod Fri 01-Mar-13 09:51:19

olives HUGE congratulations on the safe birth of your whopping DS2!! So very pleased to hear your news smile

And to sarah too, big congrats for the safe arrival of your bundle of joy smile

lovely news of babies arriving! thanks thanks just had my scan and am currently plugged into my drip. scan perfect again! although I couldn't see much didn't think it was very clear today. although it was moving a lot and seems to be in a completely different position to last time.
I'm finding now I'm weaning off the pred that my moods are very up and down and I'm quite tearful. anyone else found this?

Havingkittens Fri 01-Mar-13 10:06:49

Ahh, congratulations to you as well Sarah! Glad to hear all is now well after a stressful start.

Good to hear of the positive scans and lovely that we now have a few of you in the first trimester.

Cartoon, I can't remember what my moods were like weaning off the Pred as it was an emotional time for me anyway so hard to determine which is which. I had some pretty stonking headaches though which were quite unpleasant. If that happens to you, consider weaning off even more slowly than originally recommended. Mr S told me that would've been a good idea when I told him about the headaches after the event. Ooops!

I think Jemimapuddleduck is next, then me (because babies always stick to schedule don't they?). Still breech at 34+2 and feels quite wedged considering the pressure under my right ribcage and in my crotch so may end up having an ELCS. We'll see. Anyway, less than 6 weeks now. Can hardly believe it!

freelancegirl Fri 01-Mar-13 12:42:56

Great news about the scan cartoon! How surreal it is being wired up to the untralipids isn't it. Weaning off the Pred gsve me all sorts of symptoms and I slowed down a bit too - I hovered for an extra week at 25mg down from 40. No reason really except being used to having the medication as a mental crutch.

ChoccyPud Fri 01-Mar-13 13:07:12

Lovely news all round.

Bfn's for me this month though no surprise. Also no AF which should be here today. And a bit emotional and tired from not sleeping properly with the Pred. All in all I'm a bit grumpy!!

So - if the lady who's here at NLC right now with her gorgeous baby is reading this I am truly sorry if I seemed a bit off when faced with a baby (here of all places!) as I came through to reception for acupuncture.. Bad timing.

roseandroli Fri 01-Mar-13 18:36:27

Congratulations olives and sarah on the arrival of your pred babies! So wonderful to hear all this positive news!

Cartoon great to hear your scan went well. I just took my last dose of pred today--hoorah!--and I'm hoping this means I will sleep better and lose the chipmunk cheeks (wishful thinking...).

Lawlee I know your post was a few days ago, but just to reassure you--if you don't have shoulder tip pain or watery brown cm, I wouldn't worry about an ectopic!

Abney Sat 02-Mar-13 08:14:06

Good morning everyone

Olives and Sarah a very big congratulations on the birth of your boys. I am sure it gives everyone else hope that they will get there in the end. Havingkittens looking forward to hearing your news. I am 4 weeks behind you so not long.

Well done with all of the 1st trimestors. I have been keeping up to date with this thread and keeping up with the news. Keeping my fingers crossed for further BFP’s on this thread.

Accidental a while back you asked if I had VHKC when I said that pred on it’s own had failed on 4 occassions. Well the strange thing is before DS1 I had 6 mc (1 molar, 1 chromosone and 4 straight mc’s) and I was not diagnosed with any NKC issues but DR S gave me a low dose steriod just in case. After DS and after 2 mc I was retested and told that I had VHKC so the pred was upped but I had a further 2 mc's. The strange thng is that the first time I had pred it appeared to work and then the 2nd time i.e. this time (29 wks pg)intralipids and hydroxy were thrown in. Also I know it is a boy. What is a bit suspicious is that both times new treatment was added it appears to have been a success. Could this just be a coincidence? Also it has been raised before about the number of boys being born. This is also a bit strange.

Ari in answer to your question this pg was the first on hydroxy and intralipds. I was on hydroxy for over 4 months before BFP. Still thinking of you and keeping my fingers cross for you.

teaandchoc Sat 02-Mar-13 08:29:04

Hi all, I posted on here a couple of months ago after I'd just had my 4th MC. I very rudely didn't post again but wanted to say a belated thank you for everyone's kind and encouraging comments. We reluctantly waited one cycle (on the advice of Louise) and I am now very nervously 4 + 5 weeks preg. Argh! Cue daily panics and negativity! I can't even bring myself to book my 7 week scan - way too early... Anyway, it's so lovely to read of so many successes on this thread. It's really keeping me going.

Lawlee Sat 02-Mar-13 10:37:04


Congratulations Sarah that's fab news! So pleased for you. Congrats also to teaandchoc on your bfp, you are only a little behind me I'm 5+4 today.

Good news on the good scan Cartoon glad you had another good one smile

Rose good to hear from you and thanks for easing my worries, no none of those symptoms thank goodness, just horrible nausea, some vomiting and daily paranoia! Hoping it doesn't get any worse else I'm going to be laid up for the next few weeks!

Did AF turn up Choccy? Hoping you are doing ok?

Hi to everyone else, hope you are all doing well and sorry this is a bit of a flying post! Xx

just a quick one from me. rose are you in maternity clothes yet? well jeans?

TheAccidentalExhibitionist Sat 02-Mar-13 15:23:26

Hi teaandchoc whispered congratulations. I'll be keeping my fingers crossed for you.

So wonderful to hear about all the gorgeous Pred baby boys being born. Wonder if Pred has anything to do with them being boys or if that is even possible?

Abney thanks for the reassurance about Hydoxy. I stopped taking it in the end as it made my eyes so sore. Interesting to hear about your successes with new tx.

Great news cartoontrickster I'm so so pleased for you. It must be incredibly reassuring to see your baby wiggling around happily.

HavingKittens ohh I hope your baby moves into a better position soon. It sounds very uncomfortable at the moment. You must be very excited, you are so close now.

roseandroli Sun 03-Mar-13 18:11:22

Hiya cartoon--nope not in maternity clothes yet, but wearing a belly band, which means I can unbutton my jeans and cover the top of the zip. Also I like the way the belly band keeps me warm, I always get so cold in the gap between jumper and jeans!

Whispered congrats tea and choc! And kittens best of luck as you enter the final lap...

Havingkittens Sun 03-Mar-13 22:48:34

choccy, sorry to hear you're feeling so fed up. Totally understandable and coming face to face with a baby at Mr S's clinic, so no what you needed sad.

Great to hear the first trimesters are all making good progress. I remember all too well what a nerve wracking time that was! Congratulations to teaandchocolate, and welcome back to the thread. Plenty of hands to hold here!

I have managed to avoid buying much in the way of maternity clothes, I'm pleased to say! I had a few jersey dresses which seem to have stretched with me (and will hopefully not end up being baggy and misshapen after pregnancy). I bought maternity skinny black under bump jeans quite early on but found I hated the feel of the waistband under my bump once I got to a certain size. Uniqulo heat tech long sleeved tops have been a godsend. They are really stretchy and meant I could wear a lot of baggy T shirts or short sleeved jersey dresses through the winter. Also the Top Shop maternity black jersey pencil skirt has proved extremely useful at only £25. I actually think it's going to be hard for me to stop wearing head to toe jersey once I'm not pregnant. It's like wearing pyjamas all day, but not as sad looking! Anyone who has a moulting pet, avoid buying Noppies black jeans from Pretty Pregnant. My cat is 50% white and I could only put them on if I was literally just about to leave the house. They are an absolute cat hair magnet!

Abney, time feels like it's suddenly spiralling! We have so much to do in the flat still, and I am not quite as agile as I used to be! So, your time will also come before you know it. I still can't believe it's really happening. Even with all the kicks and the huffing and puffing and the appointments, I still can't totally equate it with having an actual baby!

I've grown out of my last pair of jeans now and seem to live in leggins. I'm considering a pair of maternity jeans but feel its probably a bit early though! I can't wait for the warmer weather finding things to wear will be so much easier. I'm always cold at the moment. I don't have much in the way of warm stuff that fits. diesnt help that I'm so far behind with my washing!
congrats tea grin
rose do you still spot? I do. Mr s was rather blunt on Friday and said that the blood was obviously coming from me or the baby would be dead by now.

Clabbage Mon 04-Mar-13 16:18:07

Massive congrats to sarah and greenolives and so pleased that both kittens and abney are both so near to the goalpost.
I am so very very pleased for you. As is the way, it is difficult to not reflect on my own history as I would have been due between the two of you. I know that you have been in my shoes before, such is the nature of the board. I have so many 'lost' edd's (I try not to focus on a due date when I fall pg but the many scans usually produce a date) it's a bit pitiful.
I'm still not sure where I am going after my last miscarriage. My head repeatedly tells me to count my blessings and focus on what I have. My heart is a traitor though and refuses to listen
Loads of luck to those of you with scans coming up and congrats to those of you who have passed some crucial dates xx
mollie hope you are ok, think of you quite a bit, actually xx

Havingkittens Mon 04-Mar-13 22:55:49

Hi Clabbage, thanks for your words of encouragement. I'm sorry though that these approaching due dates are a reminder of where you should be right now. I know that feeling oh so well, and like you, try not to take in or think about due dates in the early stages. When my GP got his due date calculating wheel out this time I told him I didn't want to know.

I so hope this year brings good things to all of you "long termers", I was very much in your shoes and almost gave up hope on quite a few occasions. I know how hopeless and despondent you can end up feeling. I am always worried about sounding so trite and patronising posting this sort of thing now, but I hope you know it comes from the heart. x

BellyD Mon 04-Mar-13 23:16:36

What a lovely message, Kittens. The brilliant/tragic thing about this thread is that we all have something hideous in common and also a shared dream. For those of us still struggling with the nightmare, without sounding too cheesy, it is inspiring to see others, like you, persevere and now be so close to meeting your lo. It keeps the hope and belief alive.

Sorry for the late congrats to Sarah and Greenolives wonderful news and 'ouch', Green! Glad your lo is all ok now Sarah, it must have been a worry.

Lawlee Tue 05-Mar-13 13:48:45

Hi all,

I am so sorry to hear of the difficult time you are going through Clabbage those dates are so hard. I hope you are doing ok.

Apologies in advance if this post is tmi, but I think i might have stumbled onto something and I felt I ought to share it.

Since my 20's I have suffered with what I have always thought was a mild form of ibs. My tummy is usually really dodgy first thing in the morning and then fine later in the day once it's out of my system. In recent years it has gotten a bit worse, and especially exacerbated whenever i was pregnant, but not enough for me to say it was impacting my health as such, I'm a curvy size 12 with a healthy appetite and no special fondness for exercise, not exactly malnourished! However, because I was fed up with it, I started experimenting with cutting out different things to see if I could work out a cause. Lactose made no difference but then I tried going gluten free and oh my what a difference it's made, one minor slip up yesterday and all the symptoms are back today. I've since found out that gluten intolerance is connected with recurrent miscarriage, and now it's set me to wondering, could this be the allergen that has been kicking off my immune system and my nk cells? When i think back to all the crackers, bread and pasta i ate to try and combat the nausea, i wonder about what impact they had on my earlier losses. Since I've been mostly gluten free for the past few weeks, could that be why I have managed to reach 6 weeks today? I don't know the answers to these questions and it may even all just be coincidence, who knows if this pregnancy will work out any better than the others, but it occurs to me that if even for one person out there the answer to avoiding these heartbreaking losses is just to cut out gluten then this might be of help to them!

Anyway hope all are doing ok otherwise. I thought that was a lovely post of yours too Kittens and you must be starting to get so excited!

I am counting down the days now, one week tomorrow to my first scan, I so desperately want this to be our take home baby and some days I wonder if it will ever happen for us! Just got to grit the teeth and get through it.

Hugs to all xx

Havingkittens Tue 05-Mar-13 14:28:42

That's fascinating Lawlee. I too have had IBS since my early 20s (god, that's a loooong time sad ). I have never been disciplined enough to cut stuff out of my diet though! Definitely food for thought though, if you'll excuse the pun.

Yes, I'm tipping over the cusp of being shit scared to being excited now! I am just waiting for my midwife to get me a scan appointment to see if the baby has turned yet as it's been breech for a while. We have so much to do in the flat still, with time running out rapidly. My OH did say to me some months ago, "Don't leave it 'til the last minute because you won't be very agile", hmmmm, he was right! But also, in true male nesting style he has decided, at the 11th hour, that it's time to rip up all the downstairs carpets and install under floor heating and a wooden floor, and re-plaster the ceiling (from where I flooded the bathroom blush a few years ago). So I hope that's all finished before the baby makes and appearance. I suspect that anecdotally, a very high percentage babies spend their first weeks in a home which is in the middle of renovation, decoration or just having moved in.

Clabbage Tue 05-Mar-13 14:30:10

kittens...thank you. I know you understand (read all the threads!!!). You never sound trite and I think it's incredibly important to hear from those enjoying success!! You and abney in particular give me great hope as you are both at the higher end in terms of number of mc's so I feel sure (like many others on here) must have come close to giving up.
I think it's probably a good thing to reflect too. I am relentless as a personality, never give myself any recovery time, physically or emotionally. Much of it is driven by the most primary of my losses, the cot death of my first born. I am very hard on myself! So I celebrate wholeheartedly for you whilst taking a bit of time to be kind to myself..xx

Clabbage Tue 05-Mar-13 14:41:35

lawlee thank you!
I do have a couple of things to say re diet but I'm at work, I'll try and post tonight x

BellyD Tue 05-Mar-13 14:55:02

Lawlee very interesting about going gluten free. I read that it can be a factor in rmc too and so followed a gluten free diet (although not religiously) for 4th and 6th pregnancies which was encouraged by both Prof Regan and Mr S. Although it hasn't worked yet for me I do feel much healthier being gluten free. I have given it up fairly reluctantly as I have a restricted diet due to other allergies. There is quite a lot of info online about it. Whatever it takes, right? Good luck for your scan next week.

Clabbage and Choccy sorry you are having a tough time. X

ChoccyPud Tue 05-Mar-13 16:33:50

Just on food intolerance. Very interesting. I have become lactose intolerant since having norovirus in December. Lets just say I too had awful mornings then better afterwards. And have lost LOTS of bloat since changing my diet. Look forward to more from clabbage later! Whether this will have any effect next time I'm pg we shall have to see but unlike Lawlee it wasn't pre-existing, is new since my last mc.

Hugs to clabbage nice to see you back. I'm on 7 mc's now and wondering how many more I can take. But am back on it now. As we do. CD 4 today so thinking I'd better try to remember to buy some ov sticks and do things properly this month!

TheAccidentalExhibitionist Tue 05-Mar-13 17:35:40

Interesting about IBS type symptoms. I have had them for many years, even been tested for coeliac s (negative).
I've been gluten free since the new year, mainly because I'm on a low carb diet but it has made me feel better.
Normally we are a carb heavy family. My DS has ASD and struggles to eat anything other than white food. It has meant us eating a lot of pasta and bread. It's taken a determined effort to reduce his carb overloading but he has just polished off some chicken, beans and mash, so it seems to be working!
I'm going to try and stick with the gluten free even if I can't be carb free during pregnancy.
I've just got to get pregnant now!

Lawlee Tue 05-Mar-13 17:40:10

Hi all, glad it was interesting, you never know right, it's worth trying these things.

Kittens ooh I hope baby has turned, will have my fingers crossed for you. Funny you should say that about rennovation, I know several of my friends seemed to manage to time theirs with the birth of their baby, either that or actually moving house!

Clabbage thinking of you, absolutely sounds like time to be kind to yourself for a bit! I will be interested to hear your thoughts on diet.

BellyD glad you feel better on gluten free although sorry it wasn't a fix for you. I am so surprised by how strictly some people have to take it, and did not know for example that even crumbs in the butter or off the kitchen side-board can be enough to trigger a response! I had just assumed that since I was relatively healthy it couldn't be having that much impact. I'm still not sure if it is helping or not but figure it doesn't hurt to try! Although its been really tough cutting it out, gluten seems to be in absolutely everything! Got caught out yesterday by supposedly corn nachos that turned out to be made of wheat tortillas. But even soup and crazy things like soy sauce have it in!

Choccy sorry to hear about your lactose troubles but glad that you feel better cutting it out. I wonder if it is somehow linked to the immune/nk issues, they do seem to say that many coeliacs develop lactose intolerance as well so I wonder if there is something immune there. Hope you are doing ok anyway and thinking of you as well.

Sorry this is a bit of a flying reply, on the packed commute home! Xx

Lawlee Tue 05-Mar-13 17:48:07

Oops sorry Accidental, crossed posts! Wow that sounds like hard work, but well done for persevering and for some success today. It's tough cutting out carbs, they are my favourite food type too so I've found gluten free really difficult, thank goodness for potatoes and gluten free bread, haha. Although saying that I have been quite nauseous on and off recently so it's been a bit of a struggle to force much of anything down myself lol! Hope it helps you anyway, I think you can have a wheat or gluten allergy without being a full blown coeliac, so perhaps that is coming into play here, certainly my symptoms have always been what I would class as relatively mild anyway. Fingers crossed for you anyway xx

Clabbage Tue 05-Mar-13 21:50:27

Hi to choccy...really hope to see you on the 'list' soon. Thanks for the hug, gratefully received.
On the diet front. I have been on a no carb diet, since nov. I did it to lose a few pounds. I wasn't really overweight, just a bit of control freak, needing to get a grip of something in my life post mc no 7. Anyway, I suffer with both chronic allergies and a touch of fybromyalgia (auto immune of course), both of which have all but disappeared. I have eaten a few more carbs since mc8 (comfort eating) and sure enough both have flared.
In terms of how this impacts on my mc's, I don't know but if not eating carbs improves my body's auto immune responses, that has to be good. I suspect that my most recent mc will prove to be chromosomal so no among of diet changes would have helped but it really is food for thought.

Lawlee Tue 05-Mar-13 22:15:40

Definitely worth considering I think Clabbage at least I figure it can't hurt as long as I'm still eating a healthy and balanced diet. If you suspect gluten allergy though, it might be worth watching out for ingredients because it is in literally everything, and it's the non-obvious non-wheat things (like soy sauce, salad dressing, tomato soup, lots of things with flavourings some cereals even though they aren't wheat based and ordinary crisps) that have caught me out! Hard to say whether its had any impact or not I know, I have no idea if it will help me, but I'm grateful for a relief of some of the ibs symptoms anyway even if there is no other result. Hope that you are doing ok anyway, thinking of you xx

roseandroli Wed 06-Mar-13 15:05:31

I wonder if there's a relationship between gluten allergies/frequent UTI's/NK cells, and recurrent MC's? It seems like many of us have similar health issues, whether it's stomach or kidney related. Makes me wish I was a medic so I could do a long-term study.

Hellos to everyone, and hope your baby has turned, kittens!

digitalgirl Sat 09-Mar-13 20:18:32

Hello pred threaders! It's been a while since I logged onto MN. Never thought I'd be able to break my addiction, but time has flown. Tenth thread!

Can believe Kittens is so close now! Must be very excited and nesting like crazy.

Nice to see other graduates lurking still, being supportive during what is a bloody difficult time. This thread was a lifeline for me. I feel slightly ashamed that I fell out of habit with checking in. It's amazing how quickly you can put the past behind you when you finally get to hold your baby.

DS2 is 11 months today. Crawling, feeding himself, desperate to catch up with his big brother. Even though I'm still breastfeeding, my cycles have settled down and I'm beginning to notice the run up to ovulation. After spending so long ttc, being pregnant, waiting to ttc and ttc again I am finding it difficult to ignore the maternal clang in my ovaries. It's been nearly two years since my last miscarriage so I guess time has healed some of the hurt and the idea of trying the get pregnant seems like a simple one. Even though it isn't. And we absolutely can't afford it. But I can't seem to close the book on it yet. So for now our little family is complete.

duggs1976 Sun 10-Mar-13 09:17:03

Hey digital! Some of us old timers started a spin off super ovulation thread but that doesn't seem to have proven itself for many of us ( perhaps only kittens who would prob have fallen naturally anyway) so most of us on there are now considering or in amongst IVF first or second rounds. We really don't know what treatment if any will work for us as immunes is probably only one part of the puzzle. Would be very interesting to follow how you successful ladies get on second time around as we still wonder if it is just that good egg, timing and luck that matters or if in fact there is more to it than that. Glad to hear news from you! smile

Jemimapuddleduk Sun 10-Mar-13 12:11:09

Hi all, sorry I haven't posted for ages, have been lurking and trying to keep up with everyone's news.
Happy Mother's Day to the pred mummies. Not such an easy day for others, thinking of you all and in particular sue.
I am due to be induced on my due date (a week on Tuesday) but have a sweep and induction acupuncture scheduled in next week. Will keep you posted. Still can't actually believe that a baby is imminent (have had 3 years to get my head round this but still don't feel mentally prepared!).

freelancegirl Sun 10-Mar-13 19:22:03

Hey digi! Great to hear from you. So good to hear ds2 is doing so well. Ooo to the clanging of ovaries! You never know... I would love a period just to feel that everything was working again. Ds will be 8 months in a week. He wants to chew everything but no teeth yet. Well done on giving up the mn habit. I think if I'd stop lurking on lots of sections as i do, I'd have so much more time smile

I always thought that too duggs after I has that one further miscarriage on the treatment - wondering if it was just a case of that one good egg for other people and why did everyone else seem to take the meds and stay pregnant first time and I didn't, but since that time weve obviously had more losses on the treatment here. Sorry you long timers are still struggling.

Jemima - woo! Here you go! I've forgotten - is this your first child? If so I expect you to disappear shortly into the feeding and sleeping threads in shell shock for a few weeks soon! Do come and tell us and keep us updated. It's a crazy, wonderful, emotional time.

Jemimapuddleduk Sun 10-Mar-13 19:49:51

Thanks free. Yes this will be a long awaited first. Still can't believe it! Will keep you posted. Good luck to any others with due dates coming up and even more so to those still going through the process.

freelancegirl Mon 11-Mar-13 10:06:56

So excited for you. Enjoy every minute. Yes even those ones when you're up all night thinking what on earth do I DO with this baby now?! smile

Havingkittens Mon 11-Mar-13 13:48:56

Good to hear from you Digi. Well, I'm not the most domestic type you could hope to meet so my nesting is mostly consisting of me looking round the flat thinking "Oh my god, where the f* am I going to put all this stuff to make space for the baby?" As you can probably imagine, I have boxes and boxes worth of make up, beauty products etc. All the admin stuff that goes with being self employed, stacks of fashion mags that I'm trying to cull. My OH has ripped up half the downstairs carpet and we're having a new floor put down so he is well into the nesting frenzy! I am knackered and uncomfortable with the worst heartburn in the world so I'm making much slower progress than he is. I'm also, suddenly, very hormonal and keep bursting into tears which is good fun.

How's your nesting going Jemima? I can relate very well to your comment about having 3 years to prepare and still not feeling ready. I started TTC almost 6 years ago and I have to admit I'm crapping myself a bit about the HUGE change in my life and how I'm going to deal with a baby. Best of luck on Tuesday. You never know, you could go into labour naturally before then! I will have a scheduled induction on my due date too if nothing happens before. They seem to do that as a matter of course for the over 40s now.

I'm pleased to say that the baby has decided to turn around so that's good news. It's now happily kicking me in the ribs all day and night grin.

Lawlee, good to hear of your nausea. I hope you're not suffering too badly but I'm guessing it's strangely reassuring! I found sour things helped quite a lot. Tangerines and that sort of thing. Oh, and Extra Strong Mints. I didn't have it this time but have in most of my other pregnancies.

Hello to everyone else. I hope you're all doing OK. I know yesterday must've been hard on a lot of you. It was a struggle for me too, for different reasons. The hormones didn't help, but I got very overwhelmed by the fact that I was finally going to become a mother and that my own mum is now not here to support me or share the experience.

Sorry for the fleeting visit and lack of personals. So much to do here!

Jemimapuddleduk Mon 11-Mar-13 13:59:58

Hi kittens, how much longer for you now? Will let you know how induction gos unless it kicks off naturally before then! I was quite nervous about the whole process but have heard lots of positive induction stories on here and from friends. Brill news that your baby has turned.
I havn't really had crazy nesting instincts yet- I was expecting to be frantically cleaning and tidying but quite content with being a lazy beached whale and scoffing cake.
Hello to everyone else.

Havingkittens Mon 11-Mar-13 14:03:57

Yep, lazy beached whale scoffing cakes is pretty much where I'm at too!

I've got just over 4 weeks to go. 10th April is my due date.

sorry if i repeat my self or anything in this post.we have had some bad news today, our baby didnt make it past 12 and a half(ish) weeks. we had 2 early missed miscarriages last year. we saw mr shehata privately for tests and was told i had very high natural killer cells. i was on his treatment plan for this pregnancy. it got us further than ever before. we had several early scans and things seemed to be going well. i was just starting to relax and have faith that our baby was finally coming. at our nhs dating scan on wed we were told the baby had a raised nuchal measurement and there was other excess fluid. our nt results came back very quickly with a 1:40 risk. we had an appointment today with a fetal medicine consultant to find our more info and have a more detailed scan to start looking into what problems baby may have. but sometime over those last few days pebbles heart stopped beating. they found that there was no nasal bone and there was also a lump like a hernia in the stomach.
they have took bloods from us both for testing and will do testing on pebble. we have requested (hoping) that they will be able to tell us the sex.
i am booked in for an erpc first thing tommorrow. part of me is grateful i am still at a stage where they can do this. i am also grateful for the fact that nature decided this and it wasnt a decision we had to make, if you see what i mean.

Jemimapuddleduk Mon 11-Mar-13 17:34:39

cartoon, I am so sorry to hear your news. What an awful shock after getting to the 12 week stage and understandably starting to relax a bit.
I hope the Erpc go's as well as it can tomorrow (i have had 2 under local anaesthetic and didn't find recovery too bad physically). I also hope you get some answers from the testing that they will carry out.
Take care of yourself

FierceBadIggi Mon 11-Mar-13 18:33:53

Cartoon sad sad
I will say what I always say - this is just not bloody fair. Wishing you strength for the erpc and the days to come.<<>>

roseandroli Mon 11-Mar-13 18:46:49

Oh cartoon, I am ever so sorry to hear this news. How awful to get such news at this stage, and just as you were about to start enjoying your pregnancy. It seems so terribly unfair.

I hope the erpc goes smoothly tomorrow, and that, when you are ready, you can get some answers from Dr. Shehata and others as to why this happened.

I send you much affection. I will be thinking of you tomorrow morning and in the days to come.

ChoccyPud Mon 11-Mar-13 20:56:36

Oh Cartoon I'm so so sorry to hear your sad news. I hope the ERPC goes as well as these things can, and that you get some answers in due course. It's always heartbreaking when we get bad news on here, life is so cruel sometimes. Look after yourself, take whatever time you need to heal. We're here whenever you want to talk. <hugs>

Havingkittens Mon 11-Mar-13 21:05:40

I'm so sorry to hear of what you're going through cartoon, that truly is shitty sad. If it helps at all, I don't think there is anything you could've done to prevent what's happened, regardless of your NK Cell levels.

It sounds like you had a lot of markers for Downs Syndrome which often just happens as a random reaction of that one particular sperm and egg meeting and then the reaction that happens when the two fuse. Were you being seen at an NHS hospital yet or just under Mr Shehata's care? You should get a referral to the genetic counsellor at your local hospital so they can do a karyotype screening on the baby to check its chromosomal make up. That way they can tell you, definitively, whether it was a random occurrence or whether you and your partner need further investigations. If they are testing the chromosomes then they should be able to tell you the sex. We decided we didn't want to know when we had the tests, but it's a very personal choice.

The first thing you should do is to get your GP to prescribe you 5mg of Folic Acid and start taking that ASAP as it can help to prevent chromosome problems and birth defects. I had been taking it every day for about the last 4 years whilst TTC!

Shitty as it feels now, the one positive thing is that you didn't have to make a decision to end the pregnancy yourself due to conditions incompatible with life. I don't mean this in a nasty or dismissive way. I've experienced both situations. Although I was unfortunate enough to have two Downs Syndrome pregnancies, hopefully I can at least be proof that there is still hope.

freelancegirl Mon 11-Mar-13 21:55:21

Cartoon, I'm so so sorry to hear that. I have no personal experience or knowledge on the subject but I hope kittens' advice on testing etc helps and that it turns out it was just one of those awful but one off things. My thoughts are with you and I hope the ERPC goes as snootily as possible.

digitalgirl Mon 11-Mar-13 22:37:44

Cartoon that's such tragic news. I had the baby tested on my fourth miscarriage and they do tell you the sex. I wasn't expecting them to but it was just there on the notes they posted to me. I'm so sorry you've had to go through this again.

duggs1976 Tue 12-Mar-13 08:35:29

Cartoon, mirror what kittens and the others have said about feeling for you. My second mc got 12 wks 4 days and was all ok then 1 hr later heartbeat had gone when I went back for final nuchal measurement. A more experienced sonographer would have seen the excess fluid etc. my local epu sent off for karyotyping and as kittens said it was patu syndrome and a girl. DH and I were automatically tested to check it was a random and not carriers ( I doubt u would be or else you'd have probably had more of these by now?). I did take comfort in knowing I had got at least 1 baby past 12 wk mark and my body could at least do that. When I saw dr s after my following mc ( blighted ovum) he said " well u dont know if NK cells would have killed that baby anyway despite trisomy- I now question this 18 mths on as over 12 wks is supposed to be safe zone) cartoon life is unfair but pls remember you've got this far once, you can and will do it again and keep going. I think if we didn't believe this not many of us would still be on these boards. Keep strong.

freelancegirl Tue 12-Mar-13 08:56:39

I think untreated nkc are thought by Mr S to be able to cause losses later than 12 weeks Duggs but not treated ones. Who knows though. Like a lot of medicine it's all unfortunately trial and error. I remember you saying about that scan before - what an awful awful experience.

Lawlee Tue 12-Mar-13 08:58:02

Oh no Cartoon I'm so so sorry to read this. Haven't been online for a few days as I was feeling a bit rough and just been focusing on getting through the days, so I'm sorry not to have posted sooner. It's so unfair and cruel and what a terrible shock it must have been. I'm so sorry. I hope all goes as well as possible at the hospital and they are able to give you some answers afterwards. I wish I could be there to give you a massive hug sad Thinking of you xx

duggs1976 Tue 12-Mar-13 09:11:28

Really free ? i dont suppose untreated nk cells if an issue often allow a pregnancy get that far? well I guess the only thing about later losses is the chance to try to discover the cause I suppose... hmm I read somewhere online that the average 38 yr old will have on average 4 viable eggs per year. Leaves 8 duds. Made me feel slightly better. As kittens said I'm not sure if chromosonal issues fall into that group as is something to do with moment of conception and totally random. Unlikely to happen again. Look at kittens now imminent motherhood grin such a success story!

BellyD Tue 12-Mar-13 09:44:13

Cartoon so dreadfully sorry to hear your news. It is just so unfair. Thinking of you today and wishing you a speedy physical recovery. X

Arianrhod Tue 12-Mar-13 10:12:07

cartoon Just echoing what the others have said really, I'm so very sorry you're having to go through this. Better as kittens said that you didn't have the agonising choice to terminate a baby that was clearly unable to live, but I know that's not really a great comfort to you. Sadly NK cells or no NK cells, sometimes these random chromosomal problems do happen. Big hugs for you, take care of yourself.

TheAccidentalExhibitionist Tue 12-Mar-13 14:42:53

cartoon I don't really know what to say. I'm so sorry you're having to go through this, at this stage. It must just be dreadful for you.

Please know that you can come to any of us on this thread at any time and we will hold your hand and support you. We are uniquely placed to understand what you are going through.

I'm so, so sorry.

mollieboo Tue 12-Mar-13 21:31:19

cartoon I'm so sad to hear your news, its so very unfair. I'm really sorry and sending lots of love and hugs your way xx

mollieboo Tue 12-Mar-13 21:41:09

Hi duggs and free, just reading your posts. When pregnant with my son, Mr S thinks the problems I had were due to untreated high nk cells. I got to 29 weeks, the nk cells damaged the placenta but not enough to end the pregnancy in the first trimester.

freelancegirl Tue 12-Mar-13 21:58:30

That's interesting mollie. Sorry to bring up such a tragic thing for you again but was that the reason passed away at 5 months - and because he was so early? But yes, when I interviewed mr s he has said that about late losses if the pregnancy has been untreated. But if treated he seems to think getting to 9-10 weeks is a good sign the nk cells have been combatted.

duggs1976 Wed 13-Mar-13 07:04:00

Free when you interviewed him was it a while back or more recently?

Interestingly A few of us on the suoernovulation\ turning into an ivf thread have discovered differing info from dr s and wonder why he chooses to ignore infections and the Chicago/ dr beer protocol? The stats for recurrent miscarries show around 70% of women will eventually go on to have a baby ( they attribute to TLC but is obviously nature and the right combination etc.) according to st marys. dr s treatment programme claims 85% success so a marginally higher figure but not much.
I guess for people like myself, choccy especially, ari,belly d, breezy, who have either not conceived anymore or mc on his treatment plan and some over and over and then those of us who've moved on from him to try to identify if there are other issues and have found some it is difficult to believe in his entire approach. There is def some credibility in nk cells testing, but why so blinkered and channeled and why not open to the fact yhat those of us who aren't getting result after such a long long time then we may have other issues. The serum clinic in Athens, Sita west and dr Gorgy all look more towards cause of inflated nk cells and usually there is a hidden infection. These hidden infections caused abnormally high DNA fragmentation in my DH which back last summer gave a 1% chance of live birth. This is not a controversial area just new and US based. If only dr S had been a bit more open to these possibly related things I might still be religiously spending £300 with him each month on the super ovulation plan? With rubbish sperm. I did for 18 mths though and am a little disappointed I didn't see one of the other more open doctors sooner.
I do understand if a doctor gave me a pretty instant solution like he has done for so many of you I would think him a god, but the 15% it isn't happening for, I wish he would gracefully advise further exploration elsewhere or even better embrace these related areas himself. He will never get 100% as is against nature, but I cannot get out of my head the blanket approach he retains even when his plans aren't working.
I guess we will all see given time, and I hope those going onto have another child have equal successes but do keep us all posted as we need all the info we can gather as we are trooping on!

duggs1976 Wed 13-Mar-13 07:08:49

Apologies for iPhone typing. Hideous.

mollieboo Wed 13-Mar-13 09:18:25

Hi free, its ok, yes that's right. At 27 weeks doctors discovered that Oscar hadn't really grown past 20 weeks, and when he was born they could see that the placenta had blood clots in it which were preventing him from getting what he needed to grow. His only problem was that he was born so premature and so tiny. He is my little miracle to have got here and lived for 5 months, I feel so lucky that I had him for that time.

I was then advised to go onto Clexane in future pregnancies to stop blood clots forming but I continued to miscarry so I found Mr Shehata who thinks that the blood clots were due to high nk cells, so I'm hoping so much that the nk cells treatment works next time for me. duggs totally see your point re testing and treatment for other things. I never realised until finding this website how many other things there were to worry about. I've found a clinic near me which does dna fragmentation testing so that'll be our next stop if I mc on treatment again. So glad there is a wealth of information on here so we can all be well informed, but sorry that we all have to be in this position. Hope we all get our babies soon.

freelancegirl Wed 13-Mar-13 10:33:44

Thanks mollie, does make sense to a certain extent.

I think the thing is that with a lot of medicine there's a lot of trial and error Duggs. I certainly don't attribute any godlike characteristics to mr s though, just a clever man who has done a lot of research. But fallable of course. 85% is a good success rate considering the people who've ended up having treatment - lots of miscarriages, age inevitabley catching up as been trying a long time, history of other illnesses maybe... And yes who knows f without treatment it might have worked anyway! Although there are a lot of people who have multiple miscarriages and then with treatment have a baby - so there must be something in it!

Also I guess the difference is that he has (I'm just speculating really) concentrated on recurrent miscarriage rather than fertility problems - even though there are clearly going to be links between the two if nk cells are thought to attack early in some cases. And sadly, again because a lot of time can be 'wasted' with each unsuccessful pregnancy there are always going to be cases where people haven't started off with fertility problems, just recurrent mc, then start to struggle with getting pregnant. It's a head fucjk all round, I realise, when you're on that horrible treadmill.

freelancegirl Wed 13-Mar-13 10:36:26

Mollie is right too - I never realised either how many other issues there gould be! I hope this is a useful resource for people. I wouldn't have even heard of nk cells myself if it wasn't for the initial recurrent buns thread on here. Although maybe I would have got to it eventually considering my history with thyroid problems.

duggs1976 Wed 13-Mar-13 11:28:09

Yes as ari said in our other thread we all are where we are and there is little point in wishing you'd made different decisions in the past. Perhaps one day the ultimate goal of "having a healthy baby" is more commonly shared and these doctors with their specialisms are more open to each other. At least quite a few of us have subsequently discovered other issues via other doctors and clinics since being on these boards and that had been the most invaluable thing...

FierceBadIggi Wed 13-Mar-13 11:41:16

I don't believe I'd have my baby without the help of mumsnet, in fact I'm sure of that. I would have accepted the word of local RMC, who always said it was bad luck and/or age. Even if it wasn't the Shehata treatment that made the difference, without the treatment I would not have kept trying after a 4th unexplained mc.
But if he doesn't consider any issues beyond NKC, well that's just the same lack of open-mindedness that my local doctors had to the the idea that NKC could cause mcs. I don't really understand that viewpoint at all.
So I'm very glad those of you still struggling have access to other doctors and other tests. But as you say it's hard to see time being wasted. I personally wish I'd gone for tests after mc#2, I wish I'd saved myself the experience of further mcs as it has had such a lasting effect even after getting my "happy ending".
Hope Cartoon is doing ok. (())

Lawlee Wed 13-Mar-13 15:38:34

Hi ladies,

I think Mr. S's treatment is great but it is just one of many that might help, I don't by any means believe there are any magic bullets out there for these problems and what works for one is not neccessarily found to be right for another but I am so glad for this thread and mumsnet helping me get through it all and for all the info sharing and help it has given me! Like Iggi says if I had listened to my doctor I would never have been tested for anything at all. It's a shame we have to fight so hard to find out what is going on!

On the positive side though I had my first early scan today and we saw a heartbeat, so I'm really hoping I will be lucky enough for the treatment to work for me. It was the first time we ever saw a heartbeat, so I feel really blessed even though I know there are no guarantees, and we just have to wait out the next two weeks and see how it goes. She did put me at around 6 weeks which is a little behind my 7+1 but she wasn't worried about it so I'm trying not to be either. I know I ovulated more than a week after the start of my period so I'm sure it balances out somehow. I'm trying not to be excited about it and just see it as a positive first step. Fingers crossed it carries on in the right direction!

Still thinking of Cartoon and hoping you are doing alright.

L xx

TheAccidentalExhibitionist Wed 13-Mar-13 20:21:49

Great news Lawlee, I'm keeping my fingers crossed for you.

roseandroli Wed 13-Mar-13 22:57:51

Oh, congratulations, Lawlee. So thrilled for you, that's just wonderful.

Cartoon, I'm wondering how you are doing today. I hope the erpc was okay. I imagine you may not feel like posting, but perhaps when you feel a bit better you will come on here and know that we are all thinking of you and wishing you well.

mollieboo Thu 14-Mar-13 09:28:14

Congratulations lawlee that's wonderful news.

cartoon thinking of you lots, hope you're bearing up ok.

Hadn't been on for a bit so belated congratulations to sarah on the birth of your baby boy, hope he's well and you're all settling in well as a family.

Waves to all, hope everyone is ok.

brownstag Thu 14-Mar-13 11:46:25

Tentatively joining your thread, if I may. I'm 4 + 6, on pred and hydroxy. Finally pregnant after 2 years and 2 months of ttc # 2, with superovulation. Knackered, nervous and with blurry vision! Really trying not to mental too much about lines on tests, but failing.
Hallo all!

TheAccidentalExhibitionist Thu 14-Mar-13 12:41:24

Welcome Brownstag and congratulations.
It sounds like you've had quite a journey to get to this stage already.
This has been a hugely supportive thread for so many women. I hope you find it helpful.
cartoon I'm thinking of you and hoping that the dark days you must be experiment will soon pass. I'm sending you mental strength.

I'm on my first day of TTC with Pred. Bloody timing, I've started with a UTI too, DTD is really not fun with a UTI.
I've been trying to find someone who is willing to give me the Intralipids over here in France. So far it's been difficult. My GP is totally supportive of me trying the steroids and Intralipids in France instead of flying back every month but Intralipids are only given to inpatients by high dependancy unit anaesthetists here. I'm still researching my options.
One of the reasons why I'm struggling to find supportive medics over here is that I can't find any peer review research on the effectively of Pred or Intralipids. I can't find anything to support Mr S theory of the 80% success rate on Pred pregnancies either.
Anyone out there help with a link?

TheAccidentalExhibitionist Thu 14-Mar-13 12:42:40

Experiencing, not experiment, arsing iPad.

Havingkittens Thu 14-Mar-13 12:45:36

Brownstag! I just got goosebumps seeing your post. Everything feasible is crossed for you. I really really wish you all the luck in the world!

Great news on your scan lawlee!

Arianrhod Thu 14-Mar-13 13:00:14

Welcome over here brown grin. I shouldn't be here myself, I guess, since I'm nowhere near pg, but hey, I'm here anyway smile

accidental your post made me laugh, I have the exact same problem with the iPad, drives me mental!

Chasinrainbows Thu 14-Mar-13 13:44:59

Hi everyone , not been on here for ages , forgot my sign in details !!! Sorry to see some of you have had good news followed by bad. Good luck to all of you with BFP's and to those of you due soon. Big hugs to any of you still waiting for that bfp. I got my bfp back in sept and am pleased to say I'm holding onto this one at 28+3 . First time I've gotten this far , furthest before was 16 wks and twice at 6 wks. Counting down the weeks now and reading about some of the new arrivals is great to hear , very reassuring . Hoe you're all well ... Waves to all xx

Clabbage Thu 14-Mar-13 21:37:37

Apologies for lack of personals but couldn't read and run without saying how very sorry I am to hear of your news cartoon. Very cruel. Thinking of you.

kittens I was only seeing Mr s, privately.
since this is now my 3rd mc the NHS will start helping us with tests etc. they took bloods from me and dh.
tbh I was in such shock I didn't really listen to what they where for. the surgeon that performed my erpc said he used to run a recurrent mc clinic and suggested asprin and clexene next time. oh I remember the word histology?
duggs I couldn't believe it when I read ur post, 1 hour later, how awful.
this doesn't get any easier does it.
I keep wondering whether the pred etc just prolonged things. I didn't realise either that Mr s would not pick up on these things.
its gutting as I had never gotten that far before. we had 6 scans altogether so getting to see the heartbeat and wriggley baby that many times made it so real to us that our baby was there and we were getting excited. after weeks of trying not to.

duggs1976 Fri 15-Mar-13 07:51:39

Cartoon remind me what were your last 2 mc like ? Were they missed mc or blighted ovums perhaps? Only advice to you is yes neck the pred and aspirin etc. Cant really hurt. But take the nhs testing karyotype etc as can be expensive one but do have a look into more in-depth testing if you can afford to as there can be other factors at play. This does sound very like a chromosomal issue so no medicine could have helped so you will probably get your reason. Yes so cruel. And why do the chromosomal, natural failures happen to the women who have to contend with other medical issues?

Choccy are you out there?

I've been very much like 'it should have worked this time'.
my first was a missed mc second was a blighted ovum. we get preg very quickly and easily so maybe there is something in this unfussy womb theory.

ChoccyPud Fri 15-Mar-13 09:01:50

Yep I'm here... Smiley face on ov stick this morning and everything crossed for hitting target this month. Except legs, obviously wink

I wonder about unfussy womb, we get pg quickly too. Meh. You just keeping plugging away don't you?

Hugs to Cartoon. Waves to all smile

freelancegirl Fri 15-Mar-13 09:46:20

Chas - so great to hear you're doing well!

Brownstag - woo hoo! Welcome back. We have everything crossed for you. 

Accidental - there have been a couple of press articles if that helps? One about the girl who had 18 mc in the Mail online if you google. Also he was once on This Morning with Richard and Judy (or maybe their channel 4 programme). Must get my doc finished and out there. Just got a couple more i/vs to do before a rough edit. I realise it might be hard to get it broadcast but even to put it online might help. 

Choccy and the rest, good luck with the SWI! This thread is for both TTC and pregnancy and anything in between so you are all very included! I wasn't pregnant when I started it. 

Cartoon so sorry for what you're going through but glad you are going to get more help. Chances are this really was a one off chromosome issue. St Mary's were unable to do anything else for me that Mr S hadn't already done but like Duggs says there are other tests out there too.

Arianrhod Fri 15-Mar-13 13:50:54

cartoon So, so sorry for what you're going through - it's so cruel to see the h/b and then find out it's gone. Big hugs for you. Sadly no amount of meds in the world can allow for a chromosomal issue - did the surgeon who did your ERPC say they would test the foetus to see why it happened? (sorry if you already said, if you did I missed it). My third MC we would also have seen the h/b if we'd gone for a reassurance scan just one day earlier, the baby died at 8wks 6 days and we went for the scan at 9wks. I also had an ERPC for that one and I asked for it to be tested, but the surgeon who did my op told me that the lab would almost certainly refuse to test - and they did, I never heard anything back so will never know what happened. Look after yourself, and get all the testing done that you can possibly - you never know what else might be lurking (I'm a case in point, as is duggs!).

choccy That's spooky, you and I are in sync smile Although as we're now (fingers crossed) going for one cycle of DE IVF, I made the probably stupid decision not to trust my eggs any longer and actually avoided SWI this time. Felt really weird to be tracking OV as usual but this time to avoid doing anything about it. And wrong, if you know what I mean.

/waves to everyone, rainbows glad to hear you're doing so well smile

suemays Fri 15-Mar-13 15:20:52

Been lurking for a while but just wanted to offer a hug to cartoon. I know how crap you will feel but things do get easier. I wish that Scarlett had only got to 12 weeks as I can still remember her kicking inside me so I think if a pregnancy has to fail its better if its earlier plus you don't need to go into labour. It's just so disheartening going back to square one but at least you know the treatment worked this time. That's the only hope I cling on to.
My cycles are still not back to normal after 5 months so I have no hope of conceiving at the moment. I have decided I will go for ivf in June with the lister if not conceived by then. My acupuncturist is a believer in the unfussy womb theory as he says at my age (40) it's not normal to get preg as fast as I normally do. He says ivf will rule out my bad eggs so should work. Desperate now!

Will check back on the other posts later!

mollieboo Fri 15-Mar-13 17:30:11

Congrats brownstag on your bfp.

cartoon am thinking of you.

Good luck accidental with ttc'ing.

ari I know what you mean, I just ovulated and we didn't try as waiting after mc but it feels as if going against nature!

clabbage thank you for your kind words the other day, I think about you too and wish noone ever had to lose a child let alone go through countless miscarriages too. sue think about you too and I'm glad things are getting easier for you and hope your cycles settle down soon.

sue re your unfussy womb comment, I'm 36 and feel that I shouldn't get pregnant so easily either, its hard to know though for sure isn't it. I wondered if ivf would be a good idea for me too, but worry that I would still miscarry. Can they tell if the embryo is ok? I asked the consultant at my epu last week about ivf and she seemed to think if I had it they would need to test the embryos first which would be much more expensive. Am a total novice in ivf matters though sorry.

Waves to all x

roseandroli Sat 16-Mar-13 10:59:29

Hi All, thought you might find this link interesting, re unfussy womb theory:

suemays Sun 17-Mar-13 08:59:16

mollie they can eliminate the poor looking embryos with ivf which could be the ones that we potentially keep accepting. duggs is the expert on ivf with cgh where they grow the embryo for longer and then test it for chromosome problems. This is helpful for people who knowingly carry a defective gene or not had any children before so unaware if they do. Saying that there are still no guarantees as we have no genetic disorders, have a healthy 4 year old so know I can carry a child and yet still had to terminate at 23 weeks. Even with all the extra testing there can be a problem with development which can only be picked up at the 20 week scan. For me, having ivf could eliminate the bad eggs that I will now produce seeing as statistically they will be in the majority. I just don't want to waste another 3 years whilst waiting to catch the perfect egg where ivf increases the chances of finding it.
I asked my gp if I would be eligible for free ivf on the nhs and she said because of my history they would review their normal procedure of not allowing it for a 2nd child. Unfortunately they would not bend their rules. I thought it was a stab in the dark but thought I would give it a go!

brown congrats on the bfp and I hope this one works for you.

rose interesting reading and that they mention immune problems as at Mary's always deny the existence of killer cells. This just confirms my belief in the unfussy womb syndrome.

duggs1976 Sun 17-Mar-13 09:50:33

Hi Mollie yes as sue says my thought process after my trisomy made me terrified it would happen again. So we did ivf with CGH testing. So I did a short protocol round injections etc. Had 19 eggs retrieved which is a lot. 17 were good enough size to fertilise. They do ICSI so as to ensure only one sperm gets into each egg. There was 100% fertilisation rate. (which is high again). By end of day 13 embryos remained. (again a high number) By day 3 only 4 were still developing. They all looked good quality and would have been transferred based on visual appearance by the embryologist. This is where we were a little shocked as I didn't realise the drop off rate would be that high. So they took the polar body of each embryo and sent it to Oxford reprogenics. They test to ensure all 23 pairs of chromosomes are present. Of the 4 tested 3 were all normal and 1 was very abnormal indeed. They were graded 2 so very good ( not excellent). 2 were transferred and 1 frozen.
I got a positive pregnancy result and saw the 2 embryos on a scan with their little sacs. I was following dr s protocol for very high nk cells even though I only tested for high cells. I had had infra lipids before embryo transfer and again on bfp. I was on 40mg pred and clexane injections and cyclogest as standard for ivf. Both embryos failed to get past 5 wks despite all this.
We transferred the third embryo in September this time adding hydroxy and not even a bfp this time.
This is why for me the whole process outlined even with good embryos and all dr s treatment I knew something else wasn't right,
I saw dr Gorgy and he found the hidden infections and DH sperm DNA fragmentation.
When I had asked dr s why he felt things hadn't worked for me he just said was bad luck and one those things. I didn't bother to go back and ask after 3rd embryo failed.
As sue says the CGH testing £3k extra approx. Is great for initial stages but apparently there are still chromosomal and development issues that can happen further down the line at various stages. The egg energy and quality keeps the embryo going the initial few days which explains why older men can conceive with much younger women so easily. A young egg can "repair" DNA damage to a sperm in some cases. Rarely do you hear of a 70 yr old man making a 40 yr old woman pregnant. They are usually 25 yr olds wink
Anyway I hope that helps a little. I totally understand sue and mollies want to test these eggs and if nothing else it eliminates some possible bad eggs. The interesting thing about the good looking but very damaged 4th embryo was how the embryologist wouldn't have been able to differentiate but tbh with 4 embryos I would have had 2 transferred. And then another 2 transferred with the same results but that was just by chance.
Best of luck to you if you need anything more specific do let me know. At least I now know my eggs were ok ish although was a year ago. And at least weve sorted out hidden infections and damaged sperm.

suemays Sun 17-Mar-13 14:11:02

duggs have you tried ivf since having the hidden infections sorted? Sorry but I can't remember if you have.

The stats at my age are not good for having a quality egg so ivf will increase the chance of me catching it but I know its not guaranteed. I think at my age they transfer 3 embryos so even if 2 are bad at least 1 might work assuming they can collect that many. I feel that my body is so messed up with 9 failed pregnancies over the last 3 years that I want to avoid another miscarriage if my body will accept anything on top of any other underlying issues and high killer cells.

duggs1976 Sun 17-Mar-13 18:05:44

Hey sue - well it is thanks to you I even went to dr Gorgy! No haven't done ivf yet it takes such a long time to sort out - medication was is august then you need to wait 3 mths after that if sperm is involved so November was our first month trying again properly. Got bfp in December when in Australia but chemical in jan. Trying to think that was down to bad luck because I did neck the pred on bf just in case because I have a drawer full.
I should be having ivf in may at hammersmith on nhs as now in infertility camp ( lovely ) and am 36 no children and records show we're coming up to 4 yrs TTC. If it does fail we will try one final expensive round at ARGC privately again in the summer and if that fails the adoption plans that we put on hold will start up again and at least we will know we tried damn hard.
So sue where r u doing your ivf?

I still feel a bit lost and in shock. its horrible to be thrown back to the start line. I guess it will take longer this time for my cycle to get back to normal. I have no idea when we will be able to TTC again I will have to wait and some what the hospital comes back with as to whether there is a problem or if it was just a one off.
I only bleed for a few days I know with the erpc u don't get much but I sort of expected more being 12wks.
I've always felt that ive lost babies before. for me they're babies as soon as I get a bfp. but this time feels so much worse and was so much more of a real baby to me. I dread to think how much worse it would be if I'd been further along.

brownstag Tue 19-Mar-13 11:23:01

Cartoontrickster, I'm so sorry you're going through this. When I lost our baby at 12 weeks, I really thought I would never carry a baby full term. But within two years I was holding a baby in my arms, so please don't lose hope.

Thanks to everyone for your congratulations. Everything's still going okay here, as far as I know ... no scan until 8 + 3 because of the Easter hols, and that's 3 weeks' time. Interminable when you have nothing to go on but a line on a test.

SWLondonnanny, are you still on here? I lost all my contacts when I got a new phone and haven't been able to text you to ask how you are.

Duggs, of all the people on here I think I identify most with your endless search for answers. It's so hard to come to terms with what you're going through, or make appropriate plans, when you don't necessarily understand what the issue is. I think this year I got my answers: crap eggs, blocked tube, NK cells, and with that I achieved some kind of peace. And once I came to terms with it, somehow it happened. That's twice I've got pregnant just when I completely gave up. I even gave away all my DS's old clothes, toys, car seat, etc a month ago. Early days yet, of course, but to have got pregnant at all after over two years of nothing is a major step forward.

Clabbage Tue 19-Mar-13 13:50:34

Congratulations Brownstag. Lovely news.

I, too have had a 12 week loss. I think it's the fact that you sort of feel like you are in the safe zone that makes it so crushing. The cliche, falling at the last hurdle springs to mind. If I'm honest, each miscarriage has impacted on me slightly differently. My first is still in some ways the most shocking as you are so naive at that point and don't really get why the world isn't falling over itself to help you somehow. I also think the circumstances and care impact. Sadly, with a tally of 8mc, 6 in a row, my hope is all but evaporated and I guess I expect to miscarry which protects me to a degree. I do however feel that the grief is stored up for down the line. It's almost like whilst I am in the process, I cannot afford to confront the individual loss of that baby. Unfortunately, it's a coping mechanism I learnt following the death of Harry as I would not have functioned without developing it.

Sorry, that was all a bit self indulgent!

brownstag Tue 19-Mar-13 14:55:58

Not at all self-indulgent! If you can't talk about how you feel here, where can you talk about it?
I agree that the first is the worst. When I look back I realise how naive I was not to know that the loss of sickness after 8 weeks was a bad sign, not a good thing. And so I carried on for another 4 weeks carrying a dead baby round in me, while making all sorts of dreams and plans. All this time I 've thought there was a Shakespearean quote that said 'After the first death, there's no more dying then', which describes how I felt about recurrent miscarriage, but it turns out the quote is slightly different, and doesn't mean what I thought at all. But he ought to have said it! Fortunately for me the others were over before they'd hardly begun, so I didn't have time to get too hopeful.
But maybe I now have false hope with this pregnancy, because my last one ended in a live birth. But that was 5 years ago and I'm now nearly 42.
I took DHEA for 7 months before this pregnancy, so I'm hoping that has improved egg quality. After not conceiving at 39, 40, or 41, why else would I have got pregnant now?
That link to the unfussy womb theory looks very promising. But they need to get a move on with some research and treatments. ..

definitely the shock of the first is the worse, but I would say for us, at least the devastation this time matches the first. as we had never seen a heart beat before or gotten so far. I had fully expected this first time on Mr s' treatment not to work but then as every week went past I started to believe that we really were having this baby. then the dreams got shattered again.

TheAccidentalEgghibitionist Tue 19-Mar-13 17:22:25

I'm so sorry cartoon it's understandable that this time it is utterly devastating for you <squeeze>

gransol Tue 19-Mar-13 18:59:32

Hi I don't often post but always read
We saw dr s today marking a year with him I was lucky to fall this time last year first month taking steroids but unfortunately miscarried on treatment making it my seventh loss
Today he took blood for tnf alpha as haven't had a bfp since last march very unlike us this month I took letrozole for the first time and have three good size eggs. Have tried clomid with super ov for 5 months but nothing
If it comes back that in need humira injections do any of u know if u still have to take the steroids each month from ovulation ?

ChoccyPud Tue 19-Mar-13 19:55:38

Hi Gransol if you need humira it's two injections two weeks apart, then he likes to do another blood test two weeks after that to see what your level is. Then you can probably ttc, so it takes a cycle or two. You still do the usual with the Pred unless he tells you differently... Certainly in my case the humira was an addition rather than replacement and its obv for TNF alpha rather than NKCs. Hope that's helpful. Do watch for allergic reactions though, which can happen with humira - eg rash, very sensitive bumpy skin. I wasn't allowed the second injection as I reacted so badly to it. In the biggest ironic twist he told me to take Pred to calm down the allergic reaction!

I've just posted the following on the SO thread, where there's been some v interesting discussion about wider issues including endo scratching/scoring, testing for hidden infections... Sorry for blatant laziness but thought I may as well post it here too by way of update on where I'm at!

I'm in the 2ww at the moment.

I'm not saying never with testing for hidden infections but it'd feel like a total waste of the £1300 hysteroscopy to stop again and take a month or longer(?) out before June when the scoring and humira will have both definitely lost their effectiveness, to get tested and possibly do anti biotics. If the next one fails, then absolutely I'll look at it but as I said before I am getting to the point where to an extent no matter what other tests I could have, I feel I need to look at other options and surrogacy is the most "attractive" seeing as dh and I can obviously conceive and it seems to be a case of an inhospitable environment. Right now, I don't feel a desperate need to have a million more tests or be satisfied I have a definite explanation for it.

Maybe it's partly that I'm so drained I can't take on any more problems or reasons why... I'm trying to keep neutral/positive about getting upduffed again, whilst trying to live my life and not let this take over it completely, and certainly at this stage, when we're ttc and I'm possibly brewing an 8th pg right now, it's just not the time to get all het up about other issues and possibilities... I need to stay postive and remain confident that we will conceive again and remember that I'm entirely comfortable with what we are doing differently this time, ie hysteroscopy and scroring, and keep my fingers crossed and pecker up.

Does that all make sense to you guys?!

ChoccyPud Tue 19-Mar-13 19:59:08

cartoon what you're feeling is totally understandable. Big hugs to you, keep coming here and talking about it. I hope you also have some good support in RL too.

duggs1976 Tue 19-Mar-13 20:44:21

Total sense choccy! In quite intrigued by this "scoring" thing.
I think you are in a good position and can think back to this time last year and how far we've come mentally since then. Some good luck is due that's for sure smile

gransol Tue 19-Mar-13 21:30:32

Thank you that helps a lot
Should get result back on Friday so will see if I need the injections or not
Good luck to everyone this is such a tough journey

roseandroli Wed 20-Mar-13 12:22:34

cartoon I am so sorry, and totally understandable that you should be having all those feelings right now. Thank you for coming here and sharing with us, and like choccy said, I hope you are getting all the love and care you need right now in RL.

Just wanted to say hello to everyone and wish you all the best on this difficult journey.

I had my last appointment with Dr. S on Monday. Boy, it was like speed dating--he couldn't talk fast enough, and practically shoo'ed me out the door. I'm so grateful to him for getting me this far, but sometimes it's hard to feel like he's listening to the full story.

Hope everyone is staying warm in this grim weather.

mollieboo Wed 20-Mar-13 17:39:27

Hi everyone

cartoon big hugs to you, be good to yourself, I hope you start to feel better soon x

duggs and sue thank you for the ivf info, really useful. If I do decide to embark on ivf I will def get tested first for hidden infections and get dh's sperm dna tested after reading duggs' experience. Hope you both get lucky v soon.

Congrats rose on being discharged from Mr S, must feel like you've passed a milestone. Sorry you felt rushed out though!

Waves to everyone else.

TheAccidentalEgghibitionist Thu 21-Mar-13 21:29:02

How are you feeling cartoon? I've been thinking about you and hope you're OK.
RoseandRoli made me laugh that your last appt with Mr S was like speed dating. I can imagine him being like that.
Good luck Choccypud I'm in the 2WW too but very unlikely to be pregnant.
So I've been taking the Pred for 8 days now. Frustratingly, we haven't been able to DTD because of what I thought was a UTI. I've just had the urine culture back and it turns out urinary tract pain is a side effect of the Pred, not an infection.
Feels like a waste of a month. Stupidly we were waiting until I ovulated before DTD, which I realise know was a mistake anyway. We are trying for my 8th pregnancy so I should realise how this conception thing works by now confused
On the positive side I'm 40 in a couple of weeks so can celebrate at my party with a drink grin

Havingkittens Fri 22-Mar-13 10:51:27

Just wondering how jemima is doing? I remember she was being induced on Tuesday, so just lurking for her news.

I am booked for a sweep on 2 April and will get an appointment for induction at 39.5 wks, I think. In the meantime I've been told to get on the raspberry leaf tea, do some shagging ('cos I'm obviously feeling really frisky these days - not!). Flat refurbs almost finished so keeping legs crossed 'till then.

seem to be having my period ffs!

Jemimapuddleduk Fri 22-Mar-13 11:59:56

Hello, baby Iris arrived finally this morning! Quite an arduous 4 day induction ending in c section. All

Jemimapuddleduk Fri 22-Mar-13 12:00:14

Oops, exhausted! All

Jemimapuddleduk Fri 22-Mar-13 12:00:28

All ok though. X

FierceBadIggi Fri 22-Mar-13 13:03:39

Congratulations Jemima, and what a beautiful name smile Hope you can get some rest after that long process!

mollieboo Fri 22-Mar-13 13:22:52

Congrats Jemima, Iris is a gorgeous name. Glad all is well and hope you get some rest x

freelancegirl Fri 22-Mar-13 14:22:24

Oh my goodness Jemima! Congratulations. Can't wait to hear more about it including how you're spending all your time on the feeding and sleep threads asking what the feck do I do with this tiny little thing smile

Rose that's so good that you've reached that milestone. Sorry you felt rushed. It's funny isn't it - sometimes he really takes his time and other times you feel like he's already got his suitcase packed under the desk and a hawaiian shirt on under his sensible number, ready to leg it on holiday as soon as your seat is vacatedsmile

Kittens it is getting very very real now isn't it. Gulp! So wonderful that this is happening to you. Can't wait to see those photos with your little one. It will be one of those FINALLY moments am sure.

Accidental yes you think you'd have got the TTC bit down now smile How frustrating though - I had no idea that could be a side effect of the Pred. Another fun one to rank alongside Moon Face, aches, the shakes... Happy Birthday! 40, hey, I'm not 39 until end of July but I am aware that means I am 40 next year. Yikes - how does that happen?!

Sorry you're still going through the mill Cartoon. Do you think it might be residual bleeding - how long has it been now? If it IS a period it might be quite good as it means your body is settling back to normality again, but I know how exhausting it is to feel like you're bleeding all the damn time too.

Good luck and lots of positive thoughts to all xx

free I had my erpc on the 12th so very early to be a period I thought. I bleed lightly for like 3 days and stopped then on Wed more blood. heavier than spotting but light for a period. my doc is saying period, but that was on a phone appointment. I also have lower back pain and numbness/pins and needles in my leg/bum. any ideas?
congrats jemima, pretty name.

ChoccyPud Fri 22-Mar-13 14:51:41

Cartoon that sounds similar to what I had after ERPC. For 3 weeks. If there's no nasty smell or clots it's probably just one of those things... Some people have just a tiny bit of spotting- oh to be that lucky! Take some iron pills to help perk you up - its exhausting bleeding esp when you're already emotionally drained. Take care x

Congrats Jemima. Lovely news.

BellyD Fri 22-Mar-13 16:25:25

Congrats Jemima lovely news, and a new (much happier) journey begins.

Cartoon hoping your cycle is back to normal asap.

TheAccidentalEgghibitionist Fri 22-Mar-13 17:03:43

Congratulations Jemima such lovely news flowers

FierceBadIggi Fri 22-Mar-13 18:21:58

Isn't there a name for the first period post mc? (A thread name I mean, not a medical one!)
Hope the bleeding settles down soon, Cartoon, you want your body - at least - to be getting back to normal quickly.

mollieboo Fri 22-Mar-13 18:35:50

free haha your post re Mr S made me laugh! Yes it is so true too.

accidental hope you get upduffed soon. I'm back to my normal cycle now after last mc and am doing superov to take stress away of trying to know when I'm ovulating and start pred, esp as ov gets later and later when on the pred. Hopefully we'll both get good news v soon.

cartoon hope you're doing ok. I did medical management of my mc, I was almost 10 weeks, and it took 3 weeks to complete with lots of stopping and starting. Reflexology helped to get it all out I think. Hope that helps but I know your situation is different as you had an erpc.

ChoccyPud Fri 22-Mar-13 18:42:45

Iggi you're thinking of the WTF cycle I think smile

chocy is that real? I don't really believe that this is my period. but hey we will see. I'm going to poas in the morning to see if that still thinks I'm pregnant.

freelancegirl Fri 22-Mar-13 19:19:51

I'd forgotten about the 'WTF cycle'! Yes, it was always known as thus on the miscarriage boards.

Havingkittens Sun 24-Mar-13 01:08:10

Congratulations Jemima, what a gorgeous name! Wow, 4 day induction sounds arduous. I hope you managed to get a bit of rest!

Cartoon, I'm sure you're feeling utterly shell shocked. I have had 3 later losses, my first MMC at 11 weeks and then 2 terminations at 12-13 weeks and it really is a huge shock, just when you thought you'd reached the "safety point". Also, I think it takes a bit longer for your body to settle down hormonally. How are you feeling, along with your fresh bleeding? Are you having cramps at all? If your HPTs are still coming up positive it might be an idea to ask your GP to refer you back to the EPU for a scan just to check everything has come away alright. I still had a little "tissue" left attached to my uterus wall which was still receiving a blood supply and this was causing me to continue bleeding and cramping. Mind you, if I remember, the bleeding was a little longer lasting and intermittent after the later losses. With my early ERPCs there was very little bleeding at all. As far as returning periods go, mine have usually taken about 6 weeks to return each time.

Yes, Free, it's all getting very real now! I'm still trying to get my head around the reality of it all.

kittens I did a test yesterday which was positive. I've still got a little bleeding but usually Brown now, no cramps. I'm just putting it down to things needing longer to settle back to normal this time. but I think I may keep testing until its negative.
thanks to everyone thats asked after me and given me advice, I do appreciate it.

freelancegirl Sun 24-Mar-13 08:31:56

I had a loss over 12 weeks too Cartoon and it definitely felt like the fall out lasted a bit longer - clots etc for several weeks and then just as I'd stopped bleeding - a wtf cycle. But after that a normal cycle and then pregnant again quite quickly. It's not fun bleeding all that time - make sure you get your iron levels checked.

freelancegirl Sun 24-Mar-13 08:33:41

Kittens - I forgot to ask, do you know what flavour baby you're having or will it be a surprise? I hope your story and struggles are inspiration as something of a long-timer success story on here.

sarlat Sun 24-Mar-13 09:29:05

Hello Ladies

I normally hang out with the lovely girls on ttc 10+. But I wonder if I could trouble you for some advice.

I have been ttc for 3 years and I am 33. BFP first month of trying followed by early miscarriage. No pregnancy since. I was diagnosed with mild tubal damage with no reason other than the miscarriage as the cause and very mild endo too.

I had 1 round of IVF last year which was a BFN follwed by 2 further FET'S all BFN's despite high quality blastocysts. The Dr was sure I woud get a baby out of one of them. sad

I have just applied to CARE for possibly further IVF and for the chicago and other immue tests. I had a lap in January which removed some peritubal adhesions which I am hoping may have increased my natural chances slightly. However I am worried about immune issues affecting implantation. There has been many a month when I have thought I was feeling implantation.

I know I am a candidate based on Dr Beers book for immune treatment (multiple failed IVF transfers, miscarriage, endo, tubal damage) and I think these tests will be a good move. But I am having a hard time believing they will make a real difference because there is so little evidence out there.

So ladies, would you mind telling me about your experiences. Have there been more successes on this thread due to the pred or other treatments? Do you think I might have immune implantation issues? Is it possible to take immune meds during natural cycles rather than with IVF? Anyone here at Sheffield CARE?

Thank you for your time.

freelancegirl Sun 24-Mar-13 11:49:59

Hi sarlat, lovely to hear from you. Sorry for what you're going through, it's all very tough. Definitely sounds like you are a candidate for immune issues such as they've been found by those who believe! There certainly does seem to be a huge success rate with the treatment. When I found it, via Mr S, through the MN recurrent buns thread it seemedime every single person diagnosed went on the treatment and - bam - got pregnant, had a baby. Since then I know it's harder for some, I too had one further mc on the treatment followed by my DS, but it still certainly dose seem very successful. I'm pretty sure I wouldn't have had my DS without it. I do believe the success rate is about 85% and considering the types of people - history of recurring mc, time often getting on, other conditions...I think this is pretty great! Of course there are always going to be some cases it doesn't work for but the treatment in itself can be quick, relatively painless and cheap so it's well worth a go IMO! Mr s is now experimenting with other medications as well as steroids and that has worked well for a lot of us too. I've lost count but just on this thread here in the year and a half it's been going we've had at least 30 babies am sure. Ask away if you have any more questions!

brownstag Mon 25-Mar-13 10:03:58

Sarlat, I'm probably a good example of the treatment working. I'd had several miscarriages (and stage 4 endo) before I went to see Mr S, at which point I'd just discovered I was pregnant. He put me straight on the steroids without even waiting for the blood test results for NK cells (which turned out to be high). My son is now 4.
Since then I was trying for 2 years, and only very intermittently taking the steroids. I wasn't conceiving at all. I'd lost faith in the treatment a bit, after seeing from other people's experiences that it isn't always that straightforward. I had recommended Mr S to a friend of mine, for instance, and she hasn't been so lucky, having several more miscarriages despite treatment. Having said that, her NK cells are off the scale.
Recently I also discovered that my ovarian reserve was very low and that I had one possible blocked tube and I'd begun to give up (I'm nearly 42). But I decided to give it one last go with superovulation, and actually take the steroids properly, and anything else going. I conceived and am now 6 + 3. I wish I'd taken the steroids regularly before now. I also took DHEA for 7 months, which I'm sure helped too.

roseandroli Mon 25-Mar-13 14:47:40

Congratulations, jemima! What a beautiful name.

And brownstag, it's really great to hear your story of pred baby number 2.

cartoon I hope the bleeding eases off and you can start looking ahead to next steps.

Best wishes to sarlat and waves to everyone.

Buster76 Tue 26-Mar-13 12:10:24

Afternoon ladies!!
Just wanted to drop in to say hi.
Congratulations Jemima....a very lovely name indeed!
Count down for kittens - I will be lurking for news wink
I am 36 weeks now shock - still cant believe it!!! We are breech at the moment so its looking like a c section between 38-39 wks. If he/she has turned they will induce me at 38 wks because of my factor V leiden but will cover the baby with steroids.
We have continued to be scanned regularly - which has caused more worry I think!! Our 20 wk anomaly scan was fine but since then there has been concerns about baby's femur length - measuring below 5th centile. This can be a soft marker for downs - I had NT screening with came back low risk 1 in 5485. The last consultant we saw said they couldnt rule this out or any other chromosome abnormality?? Anyone else had issues or know anyone else who had similar problems? Hoping we are worrying for nothing!! Baby is measuring a little small but other than the short femur length everything else looks fine.
Fingers crossed to choccy
Congrats to brownstag

xxx D

brownstag Wed 27-Mar-13 14:11:32

Just had my scan 6 + 4. A heartbeat and 5.9mm CRL. Phew! Hurdle no. 1 over!
Buster, I did have worries about Downs with my DS for the same reason. At the 20 week scan his head was on the hundredth centile and his femur on the 25th. They weren't worried; it was me, Googler extraordinaire, and I found various academic papers with ratios, that whatever way I input our results, seemed to suggest Downs. And I hadn't had the nuchal scan, so at the last minute possible I had the blood test, which came back at 1 in 21,000. To be honest, I wasn't completely reassured until he was born, and he was fine, slightly small, at 6lb. He just has a large head presumably, though you wouldn't notice it. His father and grandmother have large hat sizes!

Havingkittens Wed 27-Mar-13 15:14:57

Yay! Good news Brownstag.

Buster, those look like pretty good odds to me. They are probably not able to say for sure because they can only give you odds, not a definitive yes or no unless you have invasive testing. They have to cover themselves for the fact you may be the 1 in 5485, but it's unlikely. Are you going to try anything to turn the baby, like an ECV or Acupuncture/Moxibustion? Mine turned just before the 36 week scan I think. I don't know if it was a coincidence but I spent a bit of time lying on my back with my bum raised on a few pillows and my legs up in the air (a bit like TTC, funnily enough!) and it was after that that I felt a lot of movement and 2 days later my scan showed it was head down. Looks like a good chance our babies will arrive in the same week then!

I'm a bit scared about the sweep, which I'm supposed to be having on Tuesday. I have heard from loads of people that it's really painful.

Buster76 Wed 27-Mar-13 16:55:26

Great news brownstag one step closer smile
Thanks for the reassurance brwonstag and kittens - I know its really unlikely but you cant help but think you might just be that 1! Like you said brownstag until he/she is born is only when I'll feel truly relaxed!

They have offered ecv kittens - really dont fancy that though. Have been going on all fours over my ball!! Dont feel like they have moved though yet. Might try the legs in the air business wink Although I have been thinking maybe a c/section would be best?!

A couple of friends have had sweep, they said it was uncomfortable, bit like a smear - still not nice though. All for a good cause though wink Keep us posted!


suemays Thu 28-Mar-13 14:46:55

Absolutely devastated as looks like my journey for my 2nd child will be coming to an end. I got a shocking AMH result of 0.57 today so it looks like I will find it hard to get pregnant again. I don't understand it as I have always got pregnant so easily, generally 1st or 2nd cycle of trying. I am guessing that's why I am miscarrying as the quality is so bad. Has anyone heard of anyone getting pregnant with an AMH so low as mine??? It makes me even more upset to lose Scarlet last year as she could have been my last chance.

brownstag Thu 28-Mar-13 14:59:25

Don't despair, Sue. My AMH was 1.14 and I had actually given up after that result, which conflicted with all other hormone results. I tried one last cycle of superovulation and am now pregnant. Obviously I don't know how it's going to turn out but this is the first time I've conceived in over two years. I'm starting to think AMH results are the work of the devil, because they are so profoundly depressing when bad. Louise says she hears of this often; one minute someone has a bad AMH result and then next cycle they're pregnant.
I did take DHEA for 7 months before conceiving so that's something to consider. I personally think I wouldn't have conceived without it.

suemays Thu 28-Mar-13 15:05:31

Brown what is DHEA and where can I get it? Does anyone take co0enzyme?? I am so shocked as I get pregnant really fast so was not expecting the amh result to be so low - mine is a lot lower than yours so I really have given up hope. I have conceived 9 times in 3 years so cant understand it.

BellyD Thu 28-Mar-13 15:29:27

Hi everyone. Sue I had the same AMH result as you after my last mc in Dec having previously conceived (albeit with SO) on two of our previous three ttc cycles, we are the same age, i believe. I think the AMH is not all its cracked up to be - a friend of mine with a similar history to us had her first child with a sub zero AMH and is now pregnant with her second. Dr Ndukwe seemed more to think my antral follicle count (10) was a more reliable fertility marker. Have you had a scan for this? It will prob reassure you.

Brown great news about your scan.

Buster try not to worry, it sounds as though you are being well looked after. Easier said than done, I''m sure.

Happy Easter to everyone x smile

suemays Thu 28-Mar-13 16:45:56

Thanks belly you have made me feel a lot better about things. No I haven't had a follicle count but I am guessing the lister will do that. Waiting to see if we can get an appointment for next week.

Breezyweezy Thu 28-Mar-13 18:39:01

Hi all, not been here for a very long time, but wanted to say sue another one here with rubbish AMH. Tested in June last year and came back at 0.63pmol. Total shock as I had only just turned 34. I have just been rejected for NHS IVF, as they decided my AMH and antral follicle count of 7 was useless and IVF would not work for me. They offered me 2-3 goes at useless IUI. Made an appointment straight away at the Lister and saw Dr Thum who specialises in low AMH and immunology for my VHNKCs and he was encouraging and crucially didn't mention DE once. The odds aren't as good as for someone my age with a higher AMH and better follicle count, but I seem to recall he said we had a 15-20% chance. Just went yesterday to have a whole load more tests done on the immunes side and sperm dna frag and aneuploidy and back to get results and discuss next steps at the end of April. They are very thorough. When are you heading there? I haven't tried DHEA yet as the Lister said to wait and see, but I am on 600mg of Co-q10 daily in the hope that it might improve egg quality. For the DHEA you need the micronised version and it is available only from America. Have a look on FF website as lots of ladies talk about where to get it there.

So happy to see so many people have had their babies since I was on here last it fills me with hope that I might get there one day!

Happy Easter to all.

pinkdragon Thu 28-Mar-13 19:49:27

Oh goodness. I have just stumbled back here and saw I am on your list as ttc baby 2. I went away for a long while - nearly a year I guess but am not sure I am a person you want to be hearing from again as havce got a story with NOT a happy outcome. I did get pregnant in May last year after over 12 months ttc - first month on super ovulation plan. Our daughter was sadly stillborn at full term last month. In total shock and just devastated that after mc's etc that this could happen to us. Not got post mortem results yet so we are not sure whether we have the courage to try again. Going to see Mr S next month to just have a chat about the future and if ttc would be even remotely sensible. Take me off the list for now as it makes me sad to see myself there x x

FierceBadIggi Thu 28-Mar-13 21:52:59

Pink I'm so sorry to hear about your daughter sad sad You must still be in shock. Wishing you lots of strength for the months ahead. X

suemays Thu 28-Mar-13 23:25:39

breezy I have got an appointment on wed eve so hopefully they will give me some hope. 15 to 20% chance is actually quite good. Remind me are you trying for your first or 2nd baby? Did the lister recommend the co-q10? I am wary of taking anything unless they advise me too as I feel my body is messed up enough already. Have you tested your amh since last June?

I feel like my nightmare will never end! Really fed up of this merry go round.

pink sad to hear your news. I can understand a little of what you are going through as I lost my daughter at nearly 24 weeks. We had to terminate the pregnancy as she had a fatal kidney defect and wouldn't survive once born. I had to give birth to her as a still born. It was the most traumatic thing that has ever happened to me. I hope that the pm results are ok and that you have the strength to keep going through the motions every day. It does get easier but even now I can still remember and miss her kicking inside me, that's the worse part.

MegMum25 Fri 29-Mar-13 06:59:45

Hi ladies - not been on here for a very long time. So pleased to hear the heartwarming stories. pink, so very sorry for your loss.

I need some words of wisdom from people who don't know me but know the struggle. My potted history is:
4 x miscarriages then dd born 25/12/08 with pred.
1x m/c then dd2 born 21/19/10 with led and intralipid.
3x m/c last year (2 chromosomal one unexplained) all with pred
Yesterday emergency surgery for ruptured ectopic, lost right tube
38 years old.

Previously my miscarriages have only affected me, so they've been sad but safe. This ectopic was so unexpected and terrifying and dangerous that I really feel the anti has been upped now. I could have died and left my kids behind. Everyone I know has said things to me like 'the universe is telling you something' 'it's selfish o try again' 'let it go' etc. I feel that it's just too soon to decide. Forty eight hours ago I was preparing or my next infusion and all was looking ok, now, I have been seriously ill, in terrible pain and am lucky to be alive. But I'm still mourning another pregnancy loss, and a baby desperately wanted. It's too soon to think of all that, but I am starting to wonder whether it is time for me to stop. I got two wonderful daughters once my treatment was sorted and I wonder whether I should let go of my dram of three... But I also feel people should mind their own business. That 'advice' always comes from those who've not struggled to have babies or wanted to prove their bodies wrong. I could never have known I'd have an ectopic, nobody has ever told me that I was at risk of one and all my other pregnancies have been could have happened to anyone and is nothing to do with rm. I'm just confused, angry, devastated, weirdly embarrassed and guilty and apart from my husband nobody else seems to understand yes of course I am upset I have been so ill etc etc but its the loss of another pregnancy which is so heartbreaking. Every single time I've lost a baby before, I've just go bak on the horse straightway and tried again, I don't know how else to be. I feel than now medically I cannot do that until i Am well And there is now such resistance from everyone I know, I feel my choice is being taken away from me and my right to grieve etc and I am sad and angry about yet another shit thing happening and in a right old state to be honest. Words of wisdom???

MegMum25 Fri 29-Mar-13 08:10:24

Hi sue
Just read your story. I'm
At lister too and my AMH is 2.4 so
Low. I get pg all the time too though. Anita at Zita west told me is not an indicator of quality per se, only quantity but if you're
older like me and have less quantity then the proportion of poorer eggs versus good eggs is higher so m/x chances higher. But remember, you only need one good egg xxxx

brownstag Fri 29-Mar-13 09:16:51

Pink, your story makes me shiver all over. So sorry to hear what you're going through. It's unimaginable.
MegMum, I would give yourself some time to let this sink in. There's always IVF of course if you want to avoid another ectopic. You're right; it could happen to anyone, and I understand what you're saying about people making judgments about who should be trying for another baby. As I already have one child (and was mentally ill after his birth) I'm always being told I should be grateful for I've got and get on with my life. Generally by people with numerous children.
Sue, DHEA is a naturally occurring hormone that is metabolised into testosterone and oestrogen. It improves egg quality and I also took coenzyme q10 for the same period and I don't think you've got anything to lose by taking the latter. I know Ari was told by Mr S to take it. I got my DHEA from Vitasunn and took 75mg at first. For the first months I had nothing but benefits (increased feeling of well-being, mental sharpness, increased sex drive, fertile mucous) but after 6 months I suddenly developed teenage boy boils that have scarred. I dropped it to 25mg and was about to give it up when I got pregnant.
I had my AMH tested 3 times during this period and the results were 1.5, 2.1 and 1.14, so no improvement but obviously something has changed. If you want to look up more about it, look at the website for the Center for Human Reproduction in Toronto, who really pioneered DHEA supplementation. My NHS consultant had an open mind when I told him I was taking it and I think he's secretly impressed now I've got pregnant. And I also took l-arginine for the first time the month I conceived. It improves blood flow.

brownstag Fri 29-Mar-13 09:24:02

P.S. My NHS consultant said that AMH results of 3, 2, 1 or less were all much of muchness, so I wouldn't say mine were any better than yours, Sue.

MegMum25 Fri 29-Mar-13 09:46:31

Thanks brownstag I've just had a good old cry and feel better. Only you know what to do and what feels right. You keep
On plugging away if that's the dream. I don't think I'd try IVF (low AMH) and all, id probably just roll the dice again, but as you say, too so to tell. Just going to hug my little ones and remind myself miracles do happen. Good luck to all x

MegMum25 Fri 29-Mar-13 09:50:37

Ps congrats on your 6+4 scan. First step done

jass43 Sun 31-Mar-13 14:43:07

Hello, everybody - a delurker here.
I have read all 10 pregnancy on pred threads. During a year. During a year in which I lost 6 pregnancies. After a year in which I had already lost 2 pregnancies (falling pregnant-wise I am your average hated instadiffer, to borrow MN wording). All very early, due to intense hpt-testing after the first 2 losses I now know all my pregnancies took nosedive at 14-15 DPO, never later. Pitiyfully, they then chose to continue in the form of dead trofoblast (a tissue attaching to the wall of uterus, no viable bud inside anymore). I always miscarried at 5-6 weeks.
I live in the part of Europe (rich, developed, rubbish on medical care) where nobody has offered me any testing, basic or immunology. All I get is talk of age (it is par tof my name tag). Even if I have 4 living children, youngest now almost 4, was already 39 I had him, and not a single MC in between all 4 of them - then 8 msicarriages in the row and they say I have suddenly lost 100% of capacity of producing a good egg in 8 tries. How much stupidity must one have to have such a position?
Luckily I come from country where this is done (one of the poorest in Europe, but terrific fertility and antenatal care), so I went back home, had tests done ,and nothing showed up.
But based on what I read from here I convinced my home country doc to try w Prednisolon. She was OK with it, and at my first try, I am today at 16DPO, my test line has got stronger everyday and today, instead of a nosedive, I witnessed a clear jump. Having had numerous (unhappy) opportunities to tie a pregnany test to a blood test number, I would say hcg around 400. It did get to 400 previously, but only after almost vanishing, i.e. baby dying. So, even if I am not yet out the woods - far far from it - I feel really Pred has done a lot of difference already.
I do not know why I googled prednisolone and pregnancy, that is how I found this thread. Probably had noted sth else in my endless searches somewhere else and thats why I googled. And I happened here. I have learned al lot, and I feel now forever grateful for freelancegirl for starting this thread. (I read all other strugglers`threads here as well, but have never posted. )But now I had to. If my baby really survives - it is a life saved. Thanks to this thread. I might stay here for a while, I feel I know you all and I apologize for long lurk - being in no way linked to GB I did not feel as I could just invite me. Am obviously not a native speaker neither, so apologies for an weird-sounding/looking grammar, too

sarlat Mon 01-Apr-13 15:42:53

Freelance - all that information was so helpful. Thank you

Brownstag - congratulations. Yes yours is a story which seems to suggest that there IS something to all of this.

Sue - sorry to hear about the low AMH. But this is not the end. You DO produce eggs and there is so much that can be done. Please don't lose hope.

Pink - I am so sorry for your loss.

Meg - sorry for your recent ectopic. This is noone's business but yours. Allow yourself to grieve and then heal and then decide what you might do next. There is no right or wrong.

Jass - wow what a story, you have inspired me to stick to my guns about what I think and not to e pushed around. Best of luck to you.

I have referred myself to Care and I am now waiting to go there and have the tests - we shall see. But I am certianly going to persue this route - thank you lovely ladies and wishing you all so much luck.

Buster76 Fri 05-Apr-13 21:10:20

Lurking for news from kittens smile


Iggi101 Mon 08-Apr-13 00:03:02

Thinking about Eurochick today, is she still posting (elsewhere, maybe?)
Jass you've had a struggle to get here, hope it all works out for you now.

Arianrhod Mon 08-Apr-13 08:23:54

Oooh is kittens due? I've rather lost track, since I'm not on here very much. Can't wait to see her good news!!

jass So, so sorry for everything you've gone through, and welcome to the thread!

iggi I love your name changes, I look forward to them smile

/waves to everyone, hope you're all doing ok!

Havingkittens Mon 08-Apr-13 10:01:29

No action so far ladies! Should be anytime this week though. So far I've had a second acupuncture session on Sat to try and get things going, but was unresponsive. She thought I may not be quite ready hormonally. I had a membrane sweep yesterday. Lots of tightening and twinges last night but baby still staying put for now. MILs birthday meal tonight so maybe it will choose it's moment then! If no action I then have another antenatal appt on Tues where I will have another sweep and make an appointment for induction. So, one way or another it should arrive by next weekend.

I was wondering about euro too actually. I spotted her over on the pregnancy board with a BFP a few weeks ago but not seen anything since. I hope all's ok.

Buster76 Mon 08-Apr-13 21:03:14

I'm getting induced tomorrow. Excited.......and very nervous!!

Inducing me at 38 weeks because of my factor V leiden.
Will let you know when he/she arrives.

Good luck kittens


Havingkittens Mon 08-Apr-13 22:30:46

Best of luck Buster, I won't be far behind you!

Iggi101 Mon 08-Apr-13 23:32:11

Good luck to you both! (())

roseandroli Tue 09-Apr-13 12:14:25

Good luck, kittens and buster!

BellyD Wed 10-Apr-13 13:21:26

Oooh, Good luck Buster and Kittens thinking of you both x

TheAccidentalExhibitionist Wed 10-Apr-13 15:13:02

<loitering for news>

freelancegirl Thu 11-Apr-13 00:18:22

Loitering for news too - took me ages to find the thread!

freelancegirl Sat 13-Apr-13 10:12:07

Where is everyone? Hope all is well. Am also bumping the thread as there was a poster in Chat who'd had several and just had another mc and I suggested we might be able to help and support in some way. Will send link to her now.

duggs1976 Sat 13-Apr-13 10:35:22

Hey free hope you and the little man are well?there are a big bunch of us on the super ovulation thread from here- most of us are are no longer trying SO and have moved onto IVF or other things as pred and nk cell treatment wasn't cutting it for us. We are going to rename the thread when this runs out but there are def 2 routes - pred etc works pretty quickly all the pred thread babies grin or else it doesn't and we are the second bunch who r trying to find and discover other related routes... It's quite nice us unsuccessful ones so far are helping each other with the more extensive testing and all the pit falls and discoveries we are facing. Not sure what we will re name it but there is def a link between the 2. Most of us read pred thread but is mainly for successful pred pregnancies and their development, most of us other lot can't get off the starting mark and as have been on the treatment plan so long has started to cause other potential issues etc. Anyway, when we've got the new name we'll post it over for any struggling ladies out therethanks

Havingkittens Sat 13-Apr-13 14:08:06

Hello there! I'm still in limbo at the moment. I was supposed to go in to UCH for induction at 10am this morning but they told me not to come in as they had no labour rooms free as a lot of women had been induced and were waiting to give birth, so I've been told to call them back in an hour and they will tell me when to come in.

So far I've had 4 sweeps and 3 acupuncture sessions but this little one is already taking after it's dad by being stubborn and running a bit late.

I guess I'm a bit of an anomaly as I fall between the two of duggs' classifications. Took me 18 months to get pregnant on the pred treatment but have been lucky to get to term first time.

lemonsherbet Sat 13-Apr-13 14:33:30

Hi Kittens hope you get some news soon.

I am also a complete anomaly. Had pred for just under 1 year but did not get pregnant, other than one chemical pregnancy. Mr S retested my NK cells and they had gone up despite the prednisolone (they were very high instead of being high). He suggested SO (since I was no longer getting pregnant), intralipids, pred, hydroxychloroquine and continue on the aspirin and vitamin D. We stopped all treatment and decided to push for a NHS referral to speak to another specialist. Anyway on stopping all treatment a couple of months later fell pregnant and am now 30 weeks. Never restarted treatment. So I guess the pred must be working on something other than the NK cells. Since my count was very high in the end.

I tend to be on the SO board with the other long timers.

duggs1976 Sat 13-Apr-13 16:34:40

Yes my NK count had come down to normal levels after intrallipids pred the works wirh ivf but I mc the chromosonally tested embies anyway so that told me. Haven't taken pred for over 8 mths as discovered the sperm DNA and other issues wirh dr G and sue had stopped pred too when she fell I think? But I reckon I'd neck a few for good measure if I ever get pg again as I've a drawer full of them. confused
So kittens how frustrating to wait ... We all thinking of you. How's buster too I wonder?

freelancegirl Sat 13-Apr-13 17:42:02

Very frustrating kittens! Wont be long now, in the scheme of things. But when you've had years of recurrent mc and several pregnancies in a row a standard length pregnancy, added in with a lot of past experience paranoia, sure can seem to drag.

Waiting for news of buster too!

So glad all is going well for you lemons.

Duggs - you're so resourceful. Lots of positive vibes to you all on the SO/more than SO thread.

lemonsherbet Sun 14-Apr-13 15:20:07

Just wondering if there was any news from Kittens

Stillcluelessat40 Mon 15-Apr-13 00:07:13

Has anyone heard anything from Buster ?

Stillcluelessat40 Mon 15-Apr-13 00:08:23

(Really should remember when I've name-changed, numpty)

freelancegirl Mon 15-Apr-13 08:55:12

I'm lurking for news of buster and kittens too. Yep to the name change but you've still neglected to say who you are! Who are you - namechange person ? smile

Havingkittens Mon 15-Apr-13 15:18:55

Hello, just a quickie from me as we've just got home from the hospital and I'm trying to return messages, get a bath in, have a nap etc before family visitors pop by.

Our little boy, Alfred (Alfie to his friends, or Fred if he fancies it) was born at 7.30 yesterday morning after a very fast and furious 4.4hr labour following induction. Not much pain relief to speak of, even though I really could've done with it. There just wasn't time! But, as the consultant who came to say hello this morning said "Labour is not really fun so you might as well get it done quick, like ripping off a plaster!"

I'm just taking it all in at the moment. I can't believe he's here!

Abney Mon 15-Apr-13 15:32:25

Havingkittens A huge congratations to you and your family on the birth of little Alfred. I have been eagerly waiting for your news. I only have 4 weeks to go now for baby lewis to arrive. Dh named him before he was even conceived.

Good luck to everyone else. I am still keeping up to date with this thread and the SO thread and am eagerly waiting for more good news.

TheAccidentalExhibitionist Mon 15-Apr-13 15:34:43

HavingKittens huge congratulations flowers flowers flowers
I hope you're not in too much pain?

ChoccyPud Mon 15-Apr-13 16:43:49

Oh Kittens I'm getting all weepy here whilst at the same time dancing with joy! Many many congratulations on the safe arrival of Alfie. I'm delighted for you that he's finally here after the last couple of years you've had. Love and hugs to you and oh xx

freelancegirl Mon 15-Apr-13 16:55:03

Kittens!!!! A baby!!!! At last!!! Ahhh I'm so very pleased for you. Enjoy every minute - and those crazy hormonal, anxious, awesome days.

Gorgeous name and so glad to hear it was a fast and furious labour if not quite pain free! Dont go leaving us now will you? We want regular updates!

So good it's going well too Abney. Now where is buster?

mollieboo Mon 15-Apr-13 17:31:08

Huge congrats kittens on the birth of baby Alfie, wonderful news xx

mollieboo Mon 15-Apr-13 17:34:08

I have a quick question, does anyone know if the intralipids at New Life are 20% 100mls? I guess its a standard dose, I'm booked in at a local clinic tomorrow and can't get hold of New Life to check if its the same. Thanks in advance if anyone knows...

mollieboo Mon 15-Apr-13 17:39:27

Actually it says on other websites its 20% intralipid infusion, I think I'm worrying over nothing, it all looks the same standard dose!

Breezyweezy Mon 15-Apr-13 17:59:10

kittens that's fantastic news. Many congratulations on the birth of little Alfie! Love the name!

BellyD Mon 15-Apr-13 19:16:55

Yeay Kittens congratulations to you and your DH. So very happy for you. LOVE the name. I can remember so clearly when you got your bfp during the olympics when you were working so hard, and now you have your little man, and pretty speedily by the sounds of things! You so deserve this happiness.

Quick post as on hols in wilds of Scotland. Good luck to Buster and Abney. Waves to everyone else.

PQ77 Mon 15-Apr-13 19:34:56

Kittens so thrilled to hear your news! I remember you looking "glowing" when you so kindly visited me in hospital last August and I am sure you are glowing with happiness now. A big kiss for Alfie and flowers for you xx

Arianrhod Mon 15-Apr-13 20:18:49

Oh kittens, so SO pleased to hear of the safe arrival of Alfie (which is actually what I'd love to call a boy if I ever have one!). choccy very kindly updated me as I'm out of the country at the mo. Absoluyrly thrilled to hear your wonderful news, much love to you both. xx

Buster76 Mon 15-Apr-13 20:24:46

Hello!!! Sorry for the late message. We only got home from hospital yesterday.

Ivy Mae was born on 10th April 20.19pm weighing a small but perfect 5lb 9oz smile

My induction sounds similar to yours and furious! We needed ventouse though so feeling a bit battered and bruised!! She is amazing though, still cant believe she's ours!! Had to stay in for a few days to establish breast feeding and gave Ivy IV antibiotics as I had group b strep.
p.s her femurs look perfect too!!!

Thanks to everyone for their support on this very long and tough journey! Especially free smile

Congratulations to kittens too!!!

xxxx D

freelancegirl Mon 15-Apr-13 20:41:50

Ahhh buster!! A baby for you too! This is all so lovely and miraculous, huge love to you and Ivy Mae. What a beautiful name. So very happy for you and kittens. It's inspiration for us all. Don't you disappear either! We would love to have updates xx

TheAccidentalExhibitionist Mon 15-Apr-13 20:44:26

Wonderful news Buster flowers flowers flowers
Ivy is a gorgeous name.
What a truly wonderful day for this thread smile

ChoccyPud Mon 15-Apr-13 21:23:04

Congratulations Buster what a lovely day of good news on here! What a gorgeous name too - we don't seem to get many girls on here for some reason! smile

mollieboo Mon 15-Apr-13 22:30:35

buster huge congrats to you too on the birth of Ivy Mae, very happy day on thread today smile xx

Iggi101 Mon 15-Apr-13 22:48:50

So happy I checked the thread today grin grin
Congratulations to you both, how lovely. Raising a wine to you!

duggs1976 Tue 16-Apr-13 07:09:27

Alfie & Ivy grin lovely news for you all!
Hope they settle in well - kittens & buster enjoy these days ahead - you deserve them x

Jemimapuddleduk Tue 16-Apr-13 09:03:48

Well done to Kittens and * Buster* on the safe arrival of your babies!
Fab news.
What gorgeous names too. Enjoy x

roseandroli Tue 16-Apr-13 11:25:43

Welcome to the world, Ivy and Alfie!
Thank you kittens and buster for sharing your lovely news.

Buster76 Tue 16-Apr-13 11:27:56

Thanks everyone smile Nearly got me crying, so happy!

Really hope those still trying for that precious little bundle will get there soon. We are all very determined on here!!

Will continue to lurk wink


suemays Tue 16-Apr-13 14:22:34

Congrats to you both on Ivy and Alfie (lovely names)!!!! Enjoy the next few weeks as they will fly by! xxx

BellyD Tue 16-Apr-13 15:26:52

Congratulations Buster, tremendous news on the birth of Ivy &#128144;. Lovely name and great to have another girl on the thread. Enjoy every minute of your little one.

BellyD Tue 16-Apr-13 15:28:13

Sorry the numbers were supposed to be a bunch of flowers! thanks

Clabbage Tue 16-Apr-13 16:00:35

Massive congratulations to you both. Gorgeous names. Enjoy every precious minute. Wonderful news x

Havingkittens Tue 16-Apr-13 17:37:28

Thank you everyone.

Big congrats to Buster too, Ivy is indeed a gorgeous name.

I will also be lurking. Tricky to post, one handed over the top of a feeding baby!


freelancegirl Tue 16-Apr-13 19:53:36

Might see you both on the Sleep threads. That's where I seem to spend most of my nights time at the moment smile

Arianrhod Wed 17-Apr-13 11:33:03

buster Huge congratulations on the safe birth of your wonderful DD. So pleased to see the good news on here! smile

mollieboo Thu 18-Apr-13 15:16:03

I got a bfp on weekend and am currently 4 weeks pregnant. Feeling very scared and alone so I thought I'd post on here for some moral support. Got pregnant straightaway again which worries me incase my body is implanting pregnancies which are doomed to fail. I'm on 40mg of pred for first time and have absolutely no pregnancy symptoms, again which worries me. But because I'm not as hopeful as last time there won't be as far to fall if it all goes wrong. I just can't imagine it going right for me, but I guess every success story on here must have felt like that. Am an emotional mess, haven't told close family or anyone at the moment to take away the pressure until at least the first scan but it feels so lonely as I'm so worried! But I'm also grateful to be pregnant and don't want to sound like I'm not.

Anyway enough about me. I hope everyone else is good and the new mothers and babies are doing well x

freelancegirl Thu 18-Apr-13 15:58:49

Ahh Mollie. Tentative congratulations from those of us who understand what you are going through. It's good that you are on a high dose. Are you also having intralipids? I know Mr S doesn't always recommend them for everyone. You are not alone, we have all been there one way or the other. Time drags though I know. Just take it day by day. I too get pregnant ever time (so far) and hey, it only takes one good one plus a shit load of drugs right?

We are here for hand holding! So please don't feel lonely. When is your scan?

mollieboo Thu 18-Apr-13 16:25:35

Thanks free, I'm really glad you said you get pregnant v quick too as it worked out for you and at around the same age I think (I'm 36), I used to love getting upduffed so quick but now it makes me panic but one egg has to be good at some point (or sperm?!). Yes I'm on intralipids until 32 weeks if I get there, don't care as long as it all works. Also on clexane, hydroxy & the usual stuff. It says to wean off pred at 9 weeks, that seems really early, was it the same for you? I'll worry about that if I get there, just getting through each day at mo, yes it drags soooo much esp before the first scan!

lemonsherbet Thu 18-Apr-13 16:41:19

Mollie congrats on the BFP. I think you just need to keep to the old saying PUPO (pregnant until proven otherwise.) Just take it one day at a time and hope this one is a sticky one for you.

Congrats to Buster and Kittens to

mollieboo Thu 18-Apr-13 16:47:45

Thanks Lemon, my hubby says pupo all the time now since I told him the term, it does help for some reason!

lemonsherbet Thu 18-Apr-13 16:53:14

Should point out we are always here for virtual handholding

roseandroli Fri 19-Apr-13 11:54:45

Dear Mollie, congratulations on the BFP, that's wonderful. I can understand how you feel, the days and weeks seem endless at the beginning. But hopefully you have a sticky little bean in there.

We had our 20 week scan yesterday, and in keeping with others, we're having a little boy. There must be some correlation between the steroids and gender, though buster you seemed to have bucked the trend!

mollieboo Fri 19-Apr-13 12:46:41

rose huge congrats on finding out you're having a little boy, how exciting! Yes there are definitely more boys than girls being born on here, hmm maybe it is the steroids, never thought of that. So glad everything is going well for you x

Thank you for the congrats, gosh I hope its a sticky one but only time will tell as we all know on here. Got my first scan on 6 May at 6w3d if I get there, hope its not too early to see anything. I've only ever had one good scan out of 9 pregnancies so will obviously be terrified but you just have to go with it don't you. I'm away on the weekend and feel desperate for a bottle of wine!

Waves to all, hope everyone is doing good x

freelancegirl Fri 19-Apr-13 13:28:54

Rose that's great news and congratulations on finding out it's a boy. Yes maybe there's something in the theory! I'm trying to remember who had had girls on here. Mind you, all my nct friends have boys too. Hope you manage to relax over the weekend mollie. Yes shame about the wine!

TheAccidentalExhibitionist Fri 19-Apr-13 13:58:18

Congratulations mollieboo I'm keeping my fingers crossed for a good first scan.
Wow Rose a boy, how wonderful. Are you feeling excited?

No news for me yet. I'm 9DPO and feeling some mild nausea but DH just phoned to say he has a stomach bug so that will explain the nausea then.

We are going to Italy for three weeks tomorrow. If I get my BFP I'll need to book a quick trip to London from Pisa to have the Intralipids. Sounds very flash but I'm not a good flyer, so would not enjoy it.

I had a great 40th birthday last week. Passing the 40 mark makes me suddenly feel there is even less chance for us which is stupid as I'm sure there are other factors involved not just the big 4oh.

mollieboo Fri 19-Apr-13 15:25:57

Thanks accidental, really hope your nausea is due to bfp, even if it means the mad dash to get intralipids, the things we have to do! I hate flying too but love exotic hols so needs must, just don't feel very safe up in the air! Glad u had a great 40th. A man in work's wife had her second child last year under Mr S at 43. Have a great hol, 3 weeks in Italy sounds amazing!

Iggi101 Sat 20-Apr-13 07:13:54

Happy to see some more bfps on here smile I think they seem to come in cycles!
Accidental, I was pg with what was to be mc2 on my 40th birthday, but since turning 40 I've gone on to have two other unsuccessful pgs, and one very successful one. You are not finished yet!

Abney Sun 21-Apr-13 10:00:01

Buster a huge congratulations on the birth of your baby girl. Really good news. Mollie congrats on your BFP. I have also got pg easily. Remember an egg is an egg. The more you get pg the more chance you have. You could just be waiting for that lucky one. I have been pg 11 times, 1 DS and another DS due in 3 weeks time. As Dr S said to me you have had more than your share of bad luck. I will keep everything crossed for you. Accidental my first DS was born when I was 41.5 years old with the 2nd one (due in 3 weeks time at 45) so you don't have to worry too much. Rose congrats on your 20 weeks scan. Another hurdle over and done with.

Good luck to all ttc's. The sun is shining let's hope some of it shines on you and that more BFP's are announced soon.

ChoccyPud Sun 21-Apr-13 15:51:22

Hi all. Well done Mollie - fingers crossed for you.

Apologies in advance for what will be a bit of a me-rant...

I've always got pg the first or second month or trying, not that that's done me any good, obv, aside from leading to me and dh joking that we can turn round a pg in 3 months from ttc to mc. Not any more it seems - AF arrived today with a vengeance and cramping worse than a mc, which is most unusual for me. Normally I'm 28 days, regular as clockwork and don't get painful periods. Had a positive ov stick last month, but no smiley ov stick this month. After 7 mc's, the bleeding of the last of which lasted for over a month, and cycles of 29, 27, and 25(!) days the last three months, I'm beginning to wonder what's changed...

I'm aware this will sound insensitive to those who have difficulty getting off the starting line, but irregular periods and possibly not ovulating is a whole new experience for me. I'm left wondering if all the drugs and failed pg's have left a mark, or nature is breaking something gently to me. I'm also aware that although this is different for me, it's by no means unusual to take six-plus months to conceive so its not like there's anything "legitimate" to worry about yet. And there is a good dose of pmt grr, hopelessness and frustration mixed in today as you can imagine!

On the upside I'm opening a guilt-free can of Guinness when I've typed this (plenty of iron you know, and tastier than Floradix). If anyone has any suggestions or thoughts, I'd be grateful. This can include shouts of "pull yourself together woman before I hit you with a wet fish"!

Waves to all smile

duggs1976 Sun 21-Apr-13 17:54:37

Hey choccy! Totally natural to feel this way. I always got pregnant within the first 3 to 6 cycles before all the steroid treatment. Now I havent been naturally pregnant for 15 mths. Then bfp and chemical in jan after stopping treatment for a while. The issue now seems to be my thyroid levels which have obviously been affected by all the drugs I've been on. Can't really win. I don't consider pred or dr s plan as having been any use for me personally and I've managed to find the main issue with DH, but I think we all know this for the bunch of us (his v unlucky 15% of women he sees who are mainly on the SO thread) that we have had to keep investigating. For you though choccy it sounds hormonal more than anything else. When was the last time you just had a normal hormone test? You aren't old enough for anything else to be going and you are also probably just now responding like a "normal" mid 30's female. What drugs r u on right now?

ChoccyPud Sun 21-Apr-13 20:18:07

Hey Duggs. How you doing?

I'm on Pred (and Omeprazole) from ov to AF (and continue @25 on BFP - he advised no point upping to 40mg as its obv not the defining factor for me), I take Hydroxy all the time (non stop since early October I think this time round), plus the usual multi vits, omega 3, 75mg aspirin, 50ug Vit D3, 500mg resveratrol. And drink 3 or so cups of decaf green tea a day. I also have acupuncture every week and reflexology most weeks.

It's just I haven't changed any of my drugs/acupuncture routine, so confused about what other variables there are that might explain these differences. It's hormones probably isn't it?! <sigh>

duggs1976 Mon 22-Apr-13 08:08:22

Yup! Sounds hormonal (such medical professionals that we've all become wink) so what is dr s theory with you then if pred isn't the defining factor ( easy to see) and hydroxy hasn't made any difference what is he suggesting is the issue if in fact he has a theory at all? I'm sure you did say a while back but can't remember ...

Arianrhod Mon 22-Apr-13 08:23:36

choccy Just my tuppence worth .. how long now have you been doing the pred from ov to AF routine, continuous months I mean? I'm no expert, obviously, but I still believe that pred messed with my cycles - they've been perfectly normal since about 2 months after I stopped taking them. Also I did a bit of research (you're surprised, right?) and it's well known in the body-building world that taking steroids can put a complete stop to a woman's fertility. Now perhaps they're talking about higher doses, I'm not sure - but certainly steroids are indicated in fertility issues amongst female body-builders (including completely stopping ovulation). They're advised to come off the steroids completely for a period of time (I forget how long) before wanting to start trying for a baby.

Obviously this may not be your issue at all. I know you have a problem with high TNFa, right? Was it ever determined why you have this problem - what's causing it - by the way? Not that that makes any difference to your dilemma now, I just wondered if the cause had been targetted. I assume you've had the LH/FSH/E2 testing done - although as duggs says, you're still very young smile

I'm sure I've not helped in the least!!, but just random thoughts.

/waves to everyone, and cautious grats to mollie smile

Iggi101 Mon 22-Apr-13 13:59:10

Has you tried agnus castar (sp?) Choccy - a low tech way of regulating cycles, so I believe. Didn't try it myself though, so can't vouch for it.

Arianrhod Mon 22-Apr-13 15:17:38

I take agnus castus iggi .. fab stuff, I swear by it.

Brennac Mon 22-Apr-13 16:36:02

Hi there

someone pointed me to this thread as somewhere that may give me a bit of reassurance. I'm under Dr S, diagnosed with high NK cells and on Letrozole and Pred. Only one my second cycle of this treatment with a BFN both times but putting all my hopes on this.

Weve been TTC for 2 years and only fallen preg once, and this resulted in a very early miscarriage. All positive success stories from anyone in the same boat and under Dr S will keep me going!

duggs1976 Mon 22-Apr-13 16:44:07

Hi brenac! There are lots of successes with dr s - they usually happen pretty quickly and some take a bit longer and then some have other issues on top so hopefully you will fall into camp one. But do be aware and vigilant dr s isn't the most extensive in this field but is the cheapest I believe so is usually first port of call for many. Best of luck there are people from all camps on here so any questions ask awaygrin

ChoccyPud Mon 22-Apr-13 19:20:12

This was month three Ari. Pred has never messed with my cycles before, but maybe the last mc, dreadful and long lasting as it was, has tweaked something. I don't know why my TNFa is raised. My parents both have/had immune issues - Dad was diabetic, mum has/had food allergies, skin allergies... That's probably landed with me I guess? But no I've not had any explanation, just "this is high". I haven't had tests for LH/FSH/E2 I don't think, unless they were part of Mr S's original tests... Will dig out the results I've got and see.

Will get some agnus castus - what's another supplement?! Thanks for the suggestion iggi.

Hi Brennac and welcome, though sorry you find yourself here obviously. You'll find a wealth of info on the previous threads but do ask any questions there's a LOT of knowledge and experience around here smile

freelancegirl Mon 22-Apr-13 19:23:18

Hello Brennac nice to hear from you - you've come to the right place for advice, support and shared experience of the not much fun business that can be recurrent mc. I really wish we still had a list going, at least of all the babies that had been born, as you would see just how many babies there have been here so far and hopefully with more to come. Granted, not everyone has yet got there but I think the success rate is aboit 85%, and when considering the people that find this treatment and some of our histories, ages etc etc that's pretty good going.

I had a further mc on the treatment and I remember feeling very unlucky to have been the only one (that I knew of back then) as everyone else seemed to have mcs, start the treatment then have a baby. But my DS was born after my second round of treatment. Following on from what Duggs said above it seems that if the problem is 'just' recurrent miscarriage then the treatment seems really to work exceptionally well. If however it turns out there are other things that need investigating such as your OH's sperm, other infections etc etc then this can cause additional problems. Of course sometimes you won't know about these things until you've tried this treatment and it hasn't worked! But I feel you have every reason to be positive.

Some of us get pregnant very easily (and then lose babies all the same) but there are people on here who haven't got pregnant easily and have still had babies on the treatment, so do take heart.

Brennac Tue 23-Apr-13 11:20:14

Hi freelancegirl, ChoccyPud and Duggs1976, thank you so much for your messages. It feels good to have found somewhere that I can get some support, see your experiences and ask questions!
It is reassuring to know that lots of you got there in the end, I just need to keep positive I think....just starting month 3 so here we go again.
Quick question, do any of you have any understanding or experience of the affect that any alcohol has on the success of this treatment? I am being 'sensible' and don't get me wrong I'm not going on any 'benders' but I do like a glass of wine or two with a meal at weekends and I'm trying to maintain some normality! I don't want to get too obsessed each month as it just makes it all the more painful but I want to also give us the best fighting chance. Thoughts???

freelancegirl Tue 23-Apr-13 12:48:17

I think I can speak for most of us here by saying eat, drink and be merry smile
I kept it down to a couple of nights a week and 'only' three drinks a night when TTC. Hey surely alcohol has a negative effect on nk cells and that can only be a good thing, but I'm not a doctor of course...

Brennac Tue 23-Apr-13 17:02:06

Now that's the kind of advice that I like! x

duggs1976 Tue 23-Apr-13 17:56:44

Ohh if wine had been banned there would be about 3 people on this thread wink

mollieboo Tue 23-Apr-13 17:59:04

Hi all, thanks for all your nice words re my bfp.

ari you do seem to be the font of all knowledge re supplements!

choccy I haven't a clue re your cycles sorry but it prob is due to steroid taking, they're not the most pleasant drugs to be on. Hope it all gets back to normal soon. I drink green tea but not decaf green tea. Do you think its best to use decaf even with green? Never thought about that until you said, I drink 2 or 3 cups a day.

abney I guess you're right, the more times you get pregnant surely the more chance of one of them going right. My 9th pregnancy so I'm desperately hoping its a lucky one. Bet you can't wait to meet your baby boy now.

Welcome brennac, really hope you have some luck on the treatment soon. I'm on 2nd pregnancy on the steroid treatment, its v early days and scary but lots of positive stories on here which keeps me going, hopefully it will give you lots of hope too. I have to say I've drunk my fair share of wine when ttc'ing, its hard enough going through all of this without cutting out all of life's little pleasures. Really hope the letrazole gets you your bfp v soon.

Waves to everyone else too x

duggs1976 Tue 23-Apr-13 17:59:04

..and cutting in on behalf of new mum kittens her little man is the result of a vodka sterilised needled at latitude festival so can safely say getting on with life is not an option but a necessity or else you'd go bonkers!

duggs1976 Tue 23-Apr-13 18:01:05

Just re read that - part of the super ovulation plan dr s offers ( not advocating hard drugs for festival goers shockshockopps!)

mollieboo Tue 23-Apr-13 18:09:48

I wondered what you meant haha, hi kittens if you're reading! Yes defo need alcohol to get along in this crazy game...

Brennac Wed 24-Apr-13 09:32:55

I had to re-read the vodka sterilised needle bit a few times before getting that one! thought this was some new way to get drunk!

I'm really glad I found you all, thanks for the advice. The sun is out and I am going to have a glass of vino this evening I think x

I will keep following you all and I wish you all the best of luck. Hopefully we will all be moving to forums about breast feeding and dealing with sleep deprivation soon!

freelancegirl Wed 24-Apr-13 11:33:32

Stay with us Brennac! It's a good place to mental about it all. And find out the all important things such as how to sterilise a needle with vodka at a festival smile

MrsChocken Wed 24-Apr-13 15:01:31

Hi everyone, I've been a lurker here for a few months, and Brennac I'm at the same stage as you - on third cycle of TTC under Mr S (PCOS and very high NKC so metformin, prednisolone, high Vit D, Omega 3 to start, followed by progesterone, intralipids if successful). I'm fortunate to have a DD born 2008 after 5 early miscarriages (was under Prof Brosens at Queen Charlotte's and given progesterone and clexane), but we've been trying again for 2 years - resulting ectopic August last Year, another early miscarriage December. In fact this thread directed me to Mr S in late December as Prof Brosens had moved, and I was back at the beginning again it seemed, with St Mary's this time, but without time on my side as I'm now 40. I just wanted to say what an incredibly inspirational lot of ladies are on here, and how much strength I've got from reading this. You are truly wonderful, towers of strength, and I really hope to be able to add a positive story here at some point. And many congratulations to the new additions! Thank you for giving me hope. And I'm with you on the wine!

mollieboo Wed 24-Apr-13 16:09:07

Welcome mrschocken, hope you get there soon xx

MrsChocken Wed 24-Apr-13 16:32:13

Thanks Mollie, crossing everything for you and good luck on the 6th xx

Brennac Wed 24-Apr-13 17:12:53

Hi MrsChocken, I will keep my fingers crossed for us both..third month lucky. It sounds like you and most people on here have been on a much longer and harder journey than I and it is great to have strength from everyone.

ChoccyPud, the one thing I have learnt through all of this is our bodies are complex and sensitive things and I can see no rhyme or reason why my cycle behaves one way one month and a completely different way the next. However, perhaps whilst your cycles were more predictable they didn't give you the right end result. I believe that any medication can often take a while to have an impact and perhaps this is your body adjusting and getting into the right position to give you the right result. My DH put it well to me the other day, he said that maybe you've got to clear out the old nest and start again and it's just taking a while for us to find all the right materials to get the nest as comfy as it needs to be.

ChoccyPud Fri 26-Apr-13 08:17:18

Brennac I'm afraid I think it's the Pred messing with my cycles as it is well known to do. Several ladies on here have found this problem. No ovulation = no chance of getting upduffed = not going to get off the starting line. My body is if anything OVER used to all the drugs - I've been here for a while now and have had three mc's on treatment. My frustration is therefore the different reaction and changed cycle in recent months, not that my body is having trouble settling into the drug routine.

Mollie I choose decaf green tea due to avoiding caffeine. Twinings is the only make I've seen that do decaf. But yes, it's still tea so still has caffeine in it.

I think I'm going to skip the Pred this month, I'm on Hydroxy and will get some agnus castus today so along with the resveratrol etc... Well, we shall see what happens!

Happy Friday everyone smile

Arianrhod Fri 26-Apr-13 09:47:02

You'll end up on my list of supplements at this rate choccy ;) You're on high dose Omega 3 as well, right, to target your TNFa/NK cells? And a good dose of vitamin D?

On the tea front, you could consider Rooibos - it naturally has no caffeine (ie it's not been artificially decaffeinated with all of the problems that that can have). It has a very slightly different taste to 'normal' black tea but it's very nice, I drink it all the time (with milk) and prefer it to 'normal' tea. It's also high in antioxidants, although not quite as high as green tea. Not far off it though.

/waves to everyone

Arianrhod Fri 26-Apr-13 09:56:40

If anyone's interested, there's quite a lot of focus on links between low levels of vitamin D and miscarriage. This is a great site to look at, if you're interested: .

I think the first entry is a bit misleading, if you go on to read the rest of the entries they all seem to contradict that first-mentioned research paper. But I guess that's often the way with research!

ChoccyPud Fri 26-Apr-13 10:28:36

You're welcome to your Rooibos Ari I'm not a fan!!

Have pm'd you x

Arianrhod Fri 26-Apr-13 11:00:34

lol It can be an acquired taste to start with choccy, I'll grant you that smile But right back atcha with the green tea, I can't get on with that, much as I try! Is any one brand any better tasting than any other, would people say? Or is there a trick/additive (not sugar/honey since I've learned you should avoid sugar/salt when taking the pred to try to avoid some of the bloating) that makes it taste better? Always willing to try something new in the pursuit of healthiness! smile

freelancegirl Fri 26-Apr-13 13:53:03

Mrschocken a big welcome to the thread! Great that you found Mr S through this very place. So did I - on the recurrent miscarriage thread there once was. Congratulations on your daughter - although I realise she's four or five now of course! Do stick around, everyone is very lovely.

Yes I've seen that research on vitamin d. Very interesting. Such an important vitamin. Wonder if there's any research done into whether lower levels of vitamin d in countries like Australia where they've been so good on promoting the keep out the sun message in relation to increased fertility and pregnancy problems.

Ugh to roobos too although I know people who love it. I've always stuck with normal decaf tea but that's probably not great for us either!

freelancegirl Fri 26-Apr-13 13:54:30

Oh on the green tea subject try the ' green tea with lemon' it's actually really nice. Although not sure if there's a decaf version

mollieboo Fri 26-Apr-13 16:31:30

Yes happy friday, hope everyone is well.

I might give rooibos another go, does decaf tea and coffee have added chemicals in it? Am going a bit loopy on 40mg pred and caffeine!

Interesting vit d reading thanks ari. I'm on 2 tablets a day, hope it helps lots.

choccy sorry if this is a v stupid question but have you tried the superov plan? I've got pregnant on it twice now as it takes the stress away of working out when I o, as it gets later and later on pred...more chemicals though I guess, maybe you're wanting a break from so many meds?...

Has anyone weaned off pred at 9 weeks? I think its changed from 12 to 9 on v high nk cells plan, am a bit worried about weaning off that early, but might not get that far anyway!

Abney Fri 26-Apr-13 16:51:28

hi Mollie I have VHKC and I started weaning off them at 9 weeks. When i got to 9 weeks DR S said 'you won't lose it now' so it looks like 9 weeks is the main hurdle to beat although i know some on here have had later losses. Out of 12 pg only 3 have got over 9 weeks One chomosone issue, 1 DS and another DS due imminently. This time I made sure I had proper meals each day and i did have intralipids for the first time and I was on hydroxy also for the first time. I hope this helps.

ChoccyPud Fri 26-Apr-13 18:10:47

Fair question mollie! But no I don't want to try SO unless I find I've stopped ovulating or there's an actual problem with my cycle - rather than just the Pred has messed it up temporarily.

I'll skip Pred this month and see what happens. If things don't get back to normal this month or next, I'll go see him to get it checked out. If I get pg I'll start Pred straightaway then - I'm on Hydroxy etc so yes it's a risk for me to ttc without starting pred from ov, but I'm not totally without other chemical help. Frankly every pregnancy is a risk for me with my crappy enigmatic history and its not like the drugs have meant success for me previously, so I feel like I've little to lose. Worst case I mc again. But at least I'd have got pg and ATM I'm a little concerned to establish if there's something preventing that happening!

In the meantime I'm cracking open a rather nice bottle of red. Have a lovely weekend all smile

mollieboo Fri 26-Apr-13 19:42:50

Thanks abney that's v reassuring actually. I forgot that Mr S thinks 9 weeks is the magic mark for nk cells, here's to hoping I get there, its just the longest wait. Hope you're feeling well.

I see choccy. Some other docs start pred from bfp anyway, and you're on hydroxy so that should be sorting stuff out. Red wine, am v jealous as I'm craving it so much!

Have fab weekends all x

Havingkittens Fri 26-Apr-13 22:43:35

Hello, just having a quick catch up. Afraid I don't have much time for personals at the mo as my boy is quite demanding and I am not very good at juggling my laptop and a baby and typing with one hand! I just wanted to mention that I was on the treatment for 18 months before getting pregnant and the cycle that I finally fell pregnant was the one where I only took hydroxy and skipped the pred until my BFP. I asked Mr S if I could do this, not because of my cycles or lack of ability to fall pregnant (as he always contests this), I decided to take the approach that I had been on pred so long it was making me feel ropey and wanted to give myself a bit of a break to which he agreed and said to take the hydroxy instead. I do think the pred affected my cycles, my periods were very short and scant since taking it.

Sending love and best wishes and lots of luck to you all. Always thinking of you, just not getting much time online these days! x

freelancegirl Fri 26-Apr-13 23:19:21

Hello kittens! Time consuming aren't they! Hope you're coping ok with those first crazy weeks.

Mollie yes I felt nervous too about the advice to start tapering at 9 weeks, but I did and it was fine. It's nerve wracking though as the meds become a crutch I think. I remember staying an extra few days on 25mg having reduced from 40mg but only because of my own paranoia. Seems like only last month I was asking the same question on here.

mollieboo Mon 29-Apr-13 17:23:44

Hi all, hope everyone is well and you all had good weekends.

Good to hear from you kittens.

Thanks for the info free. I thought it was a new thing tapering off at 9 weeks but it seems that its always been that way for the vhnkc plan. I shouldn't think too far ahead anyway, got to get to a successful 6 week scan first, v scary stuff.

buzzybee123 Fri 03-May-13 22:02:13

hello ladies I hope you don't mind me coming on here, I am on Shehatas nk cell treatment,I have been on the hydroxy for about a year, I haven't been taking the pred as it didn't agree me, I now need to take it so my question is do you take the pred in the morning or the evening, thank you

freelancegirl Fri 03-May-13 22:06:32

Hey buzzybee! Welcome to the thread. How's it all going with you? Definitely take Pred in the morning as it can make some people wakeful at night.

Mollie hope you're ok? When is the scan. Will be thinking of you. Let us know how it goes. Quiet on here, everyone ok?

buzzybee123 Fri 03-May-13 22:22:10

thank you freelance it has been so long since I last took it, I just couldn't remember, I am going for IVF so thought I should take the pred from EC and give it the best chance possible

freelancegirl Fri 03-May-13 22:27:57

Indeed. Well, there are a few negative side effects but nothing too hideous and relatively short lived. Good luck!! Let us know how you get on.

buzzybee123 Fri 03-May-13 22:57:41

thank you smile

mollieboo Sat 04-May-13 12:50:27

Hi everyone, hope you're all well.

Welcome buzzybee, hope all goes well with your treatment. Yes def take pred as early as possible, it does keep me awake but its manageable.

I had my 6 week scan at new life today, baby had a strong healthy heartbeat and measured exactly right for days. Good start! Feel so relieved but I know its such early days so I'll still worry.

freelancegirl Sat 04-May-13 19:44:49

Mollie that's amazing! Great news! You must have been terrified and so relieved too. It's early days as you say but a great start.

mollieboo Sun 05-May-13 05:36:51

Hi free, I'm wide awake at 5.30am on the pred as usual! Thank you very much, yes it is amazing news. My dh is sooo excited but I'm being so cautious this time. Hope you're good and lo is doing good too.

Waves to all, hope you're all enjoying the bank holiday weekend x

Clabbage Mon 06-May-13 17:16:55

mollie what great news. Really reallly pleased for you.
Just thinking that abney must be next. How long now. You, along with kittens are great success stories for those of us who have been going for a while.
I am now close to 3 years of trying for just one more, with 8mcs along the journey Six since my ds was born and 2 of them on treatment. I have added high dose folic acid to my list and really hope to be pregnant again soon. I do have moments of questioning my sanity but I can't bring myself to give up, although the logical part of me says that would be the best decision.
Hope everyone is ok and the new mums are cherishing every moment x

mollieboo Tue 07-May-13 06:24:05

Hi clabbage, thanks. I really hope you're pregnant again soon and that it works out. Similarly I've been trying for three years too now, the craziness all started when I got pregnant on honeymoon, here I am seven miscarriages later and I had and lost Oscar in the middle of them all. I too have had two mcs on treatment but am hoping it was just bad luck as I stopped the pred with first one as didn't realise I was pregnant and the second one was a blighted ovum. Each time I feel like giving up but then I recover slightly and realise that I just can't give up yet. I totally understand why you are keeping going, logic just doesn't come into it does it?! Here's to hoping the treatment works third time lucky for us both. Yes it is inspiring to see other ladies getting their babies after fighting through so much, it gives me a lot of hope.

abney keep us posted!

roseandroli Tue 07-May-13 08:52:38

mollie that is such wonderful news, I'm so thrilled for you. Dr. Shehata says that 9 weeks is usually when he feels the pregnancy is on it's way, so only three more weeks to go! I'll be waiting to hear your news.

mollieboo Tue 07-May-13 09:54:26

Thank you rose, v kind. How are you doing, feeling ok?

Mel3062 Tue 07-May-13 10:46:34

Hi ladies help required please. Started mr s plan a year ago after 4th miscarriage and discovered I have high nk cells, been on superovulation and humira for high tnf alpha. I have just lost my bean after seeing heartbeat thurs and being past my usual loss date so thought treatment and intralipids were working. Went to mr s for scan he couldn't find fetus, it was my birthday I was thinking all sorts! Had scan today fetus but no heartbeat. I can have op tomorrow at hospital and obviously want it testing or I can go to mr s. have any of you had erpc with him? Does he do anymore tests than the hospital to warrant the travelling and cost?? Any experiences? Obviously I want to try again whilst humira is in system but I also need to know why this failed sad x

freelancegirl Tue 07-May-13 12:55:32

So sorry to hear that Mel sad so sad to have another loss. I too had a loss on the treatment but mr s was away and I went to my local hospital. I think others here have been to him for an ERPC and will hopefully be along soon to advise xx

Mel3062 Tue 07-May-13 13:05:48

Thanks for replying and sorry for your loss too. It's hard to understand as I really thought treatment was my answer and the hospital were giving me hcg and heperin too. Did you get any answers? Are you trying again?

freelancegirl Tue 07-May-13 13:17:07

That was in august 2011 and I was pregnant again two months later which resulted in my now almost 10 month old little boy. So a good outcome eventually! No answers though no. Perhaps 'just one of those things' you never know. I did ask the hospital to test but they didn't. After that mr s also added in hydroxychloroquine. Are you on that too?

Mel3062 Tue 07-May-13 13:32:54

I haven't been but maybe hel add that to the mix, what does that do? Pleased you had a good outcome. I had an erpc that showed nothing and I've had the Greek hidden tests too and just had antibiotics so had hoped it was all systems go this time. It's taken a year to concieve this time and was 18 months before that but maybe the humira will still help x

buzzybee123 Tue 07-May-13 16:57:33

mel so sorry sad

thank you for the welcomes, it very nice over here in Brno and the clinic is lovely, I like the way they are not pushing me to take lots of stuff or to have treatments that aren't really needed, my donor has produced 10 eggs and 7 were mature and have fertilised. hopefully ET will be on Saturday.

free can iask did you have intralipds with your pregnancy as well, I had one lot here as it is way cheaper only 100 euros, I was thinking about having it at nlc if this is results in a bfp, shehata said I could but was sure if he reallt thought I needed it, i'm on the hydroxy too, thanks again for all your help

mollieboo Tue 07-May-13 17:17:54

Hi mel, so sorry for all that you're going through at the moment. I had a blighted ovum on treatment a couple of months ago. Mr S recommended having an erpc with him, or otherwise at my local hospital. But I decided to do medical management at home as I just wanted it over with in the best possible way for me, and I thought the odds were that it was due to a chromosomal abnormality rather than an immunology problem. Sorry I can't be more help, big hugs at a horrible time.

Arianrhod Wed 08-May-13 09:41:15

mel Speaking to you on the other thread, but so very sorry for your loss and best of luck for today xx.

buzzy If your clinic will give you a prescription for ILs, you can take it to Independent Nursing Services (I have the contact details if you want them) which are just off Harley St and they will fill the prescription for I think it's something like £20 and administer it for you for £75. NLC charge £350 for ILs, so you can see that's a huge saving! I'm going to INS day after tomorrow for my first pre-ET ILs; in my case, Serum actually gave me the bag of ILs before I left Athens (charged something like €18 for it) along with the necessary tubing, so I will just take that along to INS for them to administer for me. The next lot I'll think I'll be having at Serum (also €100 like at your clinic) when I go over for ET I think a week Saturday(ish) and then probably ones after they'll give me a prescription and I'll get done at INS. Are your clinic prescribing you immunes meds as well, or are you just following Mr S's IVF immune protocol? Just wondered that you're still taking the hydroxy, so presume you're following Mr S's protocol?

/waves to everyone

lemonsherbet Wed 08-May-13 09:55:53

Mel just wanted to say am thinking of you today. Hope it gives you some answers.

I will wave to everyone else. Got to get on with homework.

buzzybee123 Wed 08-May-13 15:11:59

[smi ari thanks, yes I know some women who have bought back intrlipids from here, I do work with some nurses but not sure how keen they would be to administer so the place near harley street might be a goer. I can't believe how cheap things are here compared to the uk, I doubt my nk cells have changed much so will stick with the hydroxy and pred, they think i'm on a high dose of pred already so don't feel I need medrol which is good, I like the fact they are not trying to flog me everything, when do you fly out serum

Arianrhod Wed 08-May-13 15:45:19

Well shout if you want the details buzzy. I'm not sure exactly when I fly out, I should find out in the next couple of days or so I think.

I'm a bit nervous as I'm only on a low dose of pred now (under Mr S I was on 40mg from BFP) and no hydroxy, because I'm also now on neupogen/G-CSF, which works on your white blood cells. Praying it does the trick, but very glad not to be on a high dose of pred with all its lovely side effects, I have to say smile Btw girls, I found out recently that one way to avoid bloating/puffy face when taking pred is that you should avoid salt, sugar and refined carbs (so, white rice, bread, etc). Just thought it might be of interest.

Mel3062 Wed 08-May-13 17:10:30

Thanks ladies just been discharged as I was 2 hours in recovery as blood pressure went very low and I was shaking. Hopefully get some answers in 6 weeks. Got a sick note for next week too which I may just take advantage of x

mollieboo Wed 08-May-13 19:33:51

Glad its all over mel, you should def have next week off for some rest, you deserve it.

Thanks ari, I'm on 40mg of pred for first time, and def getting puffy face, yuk. It must be a bit nervewracking not being on lots of pred but the other drug is probably working lots of magic on you, and yes at least you haven't got minging side effects!

Mel3062 Thu 09-May-13 11:05:43

Thanks mollie, just debating whether its worth being tested by prof quenby to check womb or if that will just confuse treatment and should just stick with mr s. surely the intralipids would've helped any in the womb?

Mel3062 Thu 09-May-13 14:40:45

Penny's suggested I need a hysteroscopy any experiences? Do I have it here or Athens?

hi all. guess what, I'm pregnant again! just 4weeks now. a bit of an accident so I have started all my meds late. fingers massively crossed, it may already be too late.
mollie wonderful news too!
what time of day do people tend to take their pred?

freelancegirl Sat 11-May-13 08:45:22

Hi all! Wow that's great Cartoon! Hope it goes ok. Have you got a scan booked yet?

Hope you're ok Mel. Sorry I've no experience of that but I know people gave had it done in the uk.

Mollie how's it going - when is your next appointment?

Have to say the Athens stuff sounds fascinating Ari! Do keep us updated as to how it goes.

Hope kittens is doing well! Hope you have a good sleeper. My DS has been a terrible sleeper since 12 weeks, just when I thought we had cracked it. I was wondering whether it might be the steroids :/

yes thanks free its on the 29th with Mr s. I'm waiting to hear when I can go in for an intralipid, I'm a bit anxious about not having had it yet.
the NHS are also really going to look after us this time as I have now had 3 Mc's. they did tests on me and dh and on our little pebble so I phoned in a panic to get the results when I found out we were pregnant again we weren't due to get them until the 29th. massive sigh of relieve when they agreed to give them over the phone! they found no problem with me or dh. they would probably say this whole thing is a load of crap but I can't risk not trying Mr s again as I firmly believe it helps.
pebble was a boy and had a random chromosome issue. chromosome 4 she said. we are still planning to go to that appointment so we can talk in more depths. but she seems to think its highly unlikely to happen again.
just got to pry my killers don't get this one.

mollieboo Sat 11-May-13 10:06:30

Massive congrats cartoon, that's wonderful news. Thanks, here's hoping we both have success this time after such awful luck last time. I take pred straight after breakfast. I wake up in the early hours every night for about 2 hours as I'm on 40mg now, its hard work but if it works I don't care.

Hi free, wow that sounds tiring for you! Next scan is a week today, although I might go for one on Monday too as I don't know if I can wait another whole week to know if all is ok. Was anyone else like that?

mel hope you're feeling better. I have no experience of the procedure you asked about either sorry.

Hello to everyone else too.

Mel3062 Sat 11-May-13 11:21:58

Thanks ladies
Congrats on the pregnancy news cartoon- sorry I don't know your history but am I right in thinking the nk cell programme didnt work for you last time? It's just I'm finding comfort from others in the same position as its not worked first time for me so may get steroids upped abit.
Good luck to you all and I'm a terrible sleeper on the steroids!!

ah mel sorry! well I had one mmc then a blighted ovum. went to see Mr s privately and put me on treatment for very high nk cells. no heripin injections. but I was on 40mg of pred. I got pregnant on first go but lost the baby at 12.5weeks, the furthest we've ever got. they found a chromosome issue with baby so I don't think the treatment caused this nor could have prevented it. im sorry that this may not be helpful to you.
I'm taking everything in the evening this time, I find it easier but not sure if I really should be. hmm

mollieboo Sat 11-May-13 14:45:22

mel this is my 3rd pregnancy on treatment, I'm hoping the last one was due to a chromosomal issue too but I didn't get any testing done. If this one doesn't work I'm not sure where to go from there.

cartoon how is it going taking pred in the evening, do you find it better than taking in the morning? Am interested as insomnia is hardgoing!

I've booked a scan for Tuesday now. I find it so hard to go longer than a week without a scan, I worry too much.

mollie its only been a couple of days I've been back on it for. but I'm having a hard time sleeping. I'm not sure if its just worry or if its the pred. I wasn't too bad last time. I'm going to persevere for a bit and see if it gets better. I may end up going back to having it in the morning.
how many weeks are you?

Mel3062 Sat 11-May-13 15:30:55

Cartoon sorry to hear that I really hope this works out for you. I'm not sure if mine is implantation as my last 3 have been about 6 weeks hence the hysteo.
I don't mean to sound like I like others misfortune but I was so convinced treatment would work first time for me so it helps me look forward knowing others have been in my position.
Mollie best of luck to you too x

don't worry mel I understand what you mean. I was convinced it was working and had kinda forgotten that something else could cause things to go wrong.
it always helps to find people who are in the same position as you.

mollieboo Sat 11-May-13 16:23:09

Totally understand mel, I take comfort in knowing others have mc'd on treatment and then had success. It always helps to know you're not the only one.

Cartoon I'm 7w3d. Saw a heartbeat a week ago but still worry lots, that goes without saying I guess!

doubt we will ever stop worrying. I have my fingers firmly crossed you mollie

TheAccidentalExhibitionist Sun 12-May-13 20:13:43

Congrats MollieBoo on getting this far and seeing the precious heartbeat.
Wow cartoontrickster I'm so so pleased for you, I will keep my fingers crossed.
I imagine that ere must be so many mixed emotions for you both. It's such a roller coaster.

I'm yet again on my 2ww. I can read pregnancy symptoms into everything, fortunately after trying to concieve pretty much constantly for years I have a little voice of reason reminding me to not obsess too much. The delay in concieving has enabled me to have a lovely 40th and holiday in Italy without any worries so that's positive smile.
Testing on the 15th...

bless you accidental thank you.
glad youve been enjoying urself. I'd like to go to Italy one day.

mollieboo Mon 13-May-13 16:43:14

Thanks accidental. Hope you get your bfp soon. Glad you enjoyed Italy and your birthday.

I had a scan today, all is still well and I'm still measuring exactly to the day, so I'm very relieved, not used to good news these days and hope it lasts!

Waves to all, hope everyone is doing good.

I'd like a slight mental if I could ladies. how far along am? guesses welcome! I'm sure we are all familiar with the Wtf cycles experienced after mc/erpc. my last period was 13th April but spotted the day before. which was 33 days after erpc so a bit long for me. I usually have a 30 day cycle. but bearing in mind I tested on day 26 in the evening with a darker line than last times early testing in the morning makes me think I was having a shorter cycle. during other Wtf cycles I have had ones around 27 days. so am I only just 4 weeks or am I more. I'm worried that by having a scan on the 29th I could be only just 6wks which is hit and miss as far as a heart beat goes.
I'm hoping the darker postive is a good sign!
hope all this makes sense. will the md just date me according to a 28 day cycle?

freelancegirl Mon 13-May-13 22:22:10

Mollie that's brilliant news! Another good scan. The wait is horrible isn't it. I remember time dragging so slowly. Are you having them every two weeks?

Cartoon that's a tough one. I've no idea either. Maybe it's best to put the scan back a few days to make sure it would be closer to 7 weeks in the hope that by then something will definitely be there? It's awful to wait but doubly awful to have the stress of an inconclusive scan if it's too early.

mollieboo Tue 14-May-13 04:05:15

My nightly insomnia time! Thanks free. Was meant to be having fortnightly scans but have decided to have them weekly as I can't handle the wait. I keep expecting the worst every time I go, but so far its all good which is wonderful. Just trying not to get my hopes up too much.

Cartoon I second free's advice, could you book your scan for a few days or week later? Or if you do go on the date you've booked just be prepared for earlier dates and no heartbeat and then go back a week later? I know its difficult all the waiting and worrying...

helterskelter99 Tue 14-May-13 07:14:16

Hello lovely people in the haze of newborn stuff I haven't been on mums net for ever so have been catching up
Glad to hear some success stories and big hugs to those who aren't there yet.
If Penny thinks you need something whoever is on that dilemma I would do it, friends have found the Athens treatment v thorough (sorry can't remember who is seeing her at the mo
For those preg one day at a time is the way I survived wake up preg go to bed preg that's as far as you need to think xx

Baby boy arrived at the end of Dec he is an Ivf Hammersmith baby for those on that path. Mr Lavery there prescribed the pred & did my immune testing. Fingers crossed his cousin will arrive this Dec as a result of Ivf + immune treatment from care.

helter what lovely news. I so love to hear about the babies.
thanks free and mollie its a shame that date is so convenient as dh is already off work. the NHS are giving me an early scan too hopefully my letter should come in a few days and that will help me decide where to change the one with Mr s. I did another frer this morning, darkest line I've ever had which makes me think I must be nearer to 4.5wk than 4wk. don't you just love my logic! so then I'd be 6.5ish at the scan.

Mel3062 Tue 14-May-13 08:17:32

Thanks helter and congrats that's the news I needed to here ill def head to serum.
Cartoon I saw heartbeat at 6 weeks 4 days so you maybe lucky fingers crossed xx

duggs1976 Tue 14-May-13 08:24:57

Helter great to hear your IVF news. There are quite a number of us going down that route now. Mainly on the soon to be renamed super ov thread. We think that if dr s treatment isn't working within 3 to 6 cycles then more help is needed be that super ov, IVF or further testing. Most of us have struggled to even get pg since starting his treatment so we've either moved on or trying variations of things from the elusive bfp's we long for. I'm actually going down hammer smith route with NHS but I didn't bother to mention immunes at all so far as figured I'd just take some pred as a precaution as my nk cells were tested normal after my last IVF failure last April. Don't think they have been my main issue. Anyway do pop over or I will re post on there as we could do with some IVF success stories. Folk are going far and wide as far as Greece and checz republic. smile

duggs1976 Tue 14-May-13 08:26:43

Can I ask what was the immune treatment mr Lavery prescribed ?

Arianrhod Tue 14-May-13 11:27:22

helter what fantastic news, thanks so much for popping back to let us know! I'm under the care of Serum, had a hysto there towards end of April as Penny saw loads of scar tissue when doing an aqua scan, and now I'm heading off back to Serum tomorrow night for my egg transfer on Thursday. I'm on daily neupogen injections (to 12 weeks, if we get that far), ILs every two weeks, LIT, clexane and low-dose pred, so if this one doesn't work at least we will have thrown everything at it.

mel I'm already chatting to you on the other thread, but if I can help at all just shout.

Best of luck to you ladies with your BFPs, and I really hope it all works out perfectly this time. It's such a head-feck, this whole business, I think each and every one of us deserves to get our dream!

/waves to everyone

mollieboo Tue 14-May-13 17:26:57

helterskelter huge congrats on your baby boy.

freelancegirl Wed 15-May-13 10:41:40

Helterskelter that's great news!! So nice to hear of more babies. As soon as I have time I'll look back to find the list and update just the baby section! That way it's inspiration for everyone.

Waves to everyone, I'm on holiday xx

mollieboo Wed 15-May-13 13:17:54

Free thanks that will be fab. Enjoy your holiday! X

speaking of holidays. I must confess something I'm really worried about in the hope someone will tell me how ridiculous I'm being. we have a holiday booked at the end of June, well honeymoon really, nothing fancy though its just a week. ill be 10/11wks pregnant, if I make it till then. what I some thing happens while we are there? or I end up in hospital having an erpc when I should be in Spain. I guess insurance covers these things and it is only a holiday. surely I'd have to be quite unlucky to miscarry that week out of all the others it could happen in. I'm in such a panic. sad

duggs1976 Wed 15-May-13 16:02:29

Firstly cartoon lets be positivegrin secondly if we are being cautious I was in Egypt at 6wks pg (don't ask) but because of insurance u will get better private treatment ESP in Spain than you'd ever get on NHS. At 11 wks is still early so any mc will be bleeding and not much else so you will be given early scans, bloods taken and if u need ERPC they will do it. Please don't worry you will be fine and actually I went back to hotel afterwards and sunbathed next day and went scuba diving and rode a camel. Think I was in denial
And a bit OTT but better than eating 14 chocolate bars watching Jeremy Kyle in bed planning how many more cats I need to buy to fill the gaps that my infertility was causing ! ( was last April I've come a long way since then sort of!wink

thanks duggs I just completely feel like I've ruined our holiday. wouldn't have booked it had we known I'd be pregnant. I guess miserable in Ibiza is better than miserable at home! I know it may not happen it could all be fine. its so unfortunate we all have to be so cautious, I hate all the worry of early pregnancy and I haven't been through it as many time as some sadly have been. I just wish I could relax and enjoy.

duggs1976 Wed 15-May-13 18:20:43

Do relax and think of it this way- you'll be laying around in the sun doing not much just relaxing eating lovely fruit and juices rather than being at home working like a lunatic trying to hide the fact you are tired and pg and can't tell the world. Seriously it is booked, you are going and you can read books and relax because nothing you do or don't do when there will make a difference to the outcome which is determined already from moment of conception so please please do try to enjoy itgrin

ChoccyPud Wed 15-May-13 18:34:55

What Duggs said smile

thank you, I feel loads better now. I am looking forward to some sun and a good book. don't tend to do much else on holiday anyway! what will be will be. pregnancy doesn't have to stop you from doing things does it.

Mel3062 Thu 16-May-13 03:39:14

I agree with the ladies. I've put my life on hold many a time with "what ifs" and its no good just go with it.
I'm in a similar dilemma as decided to have hysterscopy in June and then after that I can ttc as I will have erpc results, seen mr s again and hopefully had a period but then I'm thinking about our hol to Mexico for 2 weeks end of July. If we're lucky to concieve in June because of the humira ( it took 18 months last year and 12 months this year) then ill be about 7/8 weeks preg on hol far away or if we concieve in July then ill find out on hol and prob panic that I've not been able to have my intralipids!! Vicious circle!! X