Trying to fall pregnant after sadly terminating a pregnancy diagnosed woth downs syndrome

(55 Posts)
juelgaz Sun 13-Apr-03 21:02:41

Hi, I am new to mumsnet, any one out there who can advise me after terminating a pregnancy last december due to diagnosis of downs syndrome.i now would like to try again, but am very nervous.

sobernow Sun 13-Apr-03 23:05:25

Hello, juelgaz - I'm not posting with direct advice but having read your post, I didn't want to ignore it. Are you asking about the probability of conceiving another baby with Downs Syndrome? Are you worried that having a termination will affect your chances of conceiving? I have no direct experience of Downs Syndrome but am very familiar with the fear that, having had a termination, you may not feel you 'deserve' a healthy baby. I hope someone else on mumsnet can be more use to you, I don't know what the statistical likelihood may be. But I do wish you the confidence to go ahead and try for another baby

SoupDragon Mon 14-Apr-03 07:32:03

Sorry, I can't help either but there is someone on the board who's terminated because of downs. They've not posted since the beginning of April - may be away?

Hopefully they'll see this thread anyway.

Tinker Mon 14-Apr-03 08:23:53

Yes, would just like to echo sobernow's comments. Perhaps you could tell us a little more? But many (most?) people who have had a termination then go on to have a healthy baby.

oxocube Mon 14-Apr-03 08:55:32

Hi Juelgaz, Are you an older mum? Is this why you are worried about a future pregnancy? No direct experience of Downs but my cousin had a termination for this reason about 9 years ago and the doctors she spoke to said it was simply a fluke of nature that her baby had this condition as she was very low risk given her age (24) and family history. She went on to have two sons with no problems in her pregnancies or with the babies. Hope someone else can give you more specific advice and good luck.

zebra Mon 14-Apr-03 10:01:00

I'm pretty sure Juelgaz will have a slightly elevated risk of another DS baby. Maybe because something like 5% of DS are genetic (ie., *not* chromosonal accidents).

But the elevated risk of another Down's (or similar) baby is still quite small, something like 5% higher than otherwise would be for age. The odds are probably at least 90% in Juelgaz's case that the baby will be ok this time.

One thing to consider is whether to get CVS (chorionic villnus sampling?) at 12 weeks, which is nearly as accurate & safe as amnio, but tends to give faster results & much earlier.

Rosy Mon 14-Apr-03 10:02:03

Hi Juelgaz - I terminated a pregnancy for Downs about 18 months ago now. (If you use "search board" you'll be able to find out what I posted.) I was also very nervous about conceiving again, and about something else happening to me, but that's all normal. As other people have said, conceiving a baby with a trisomy is usually just a fluke, and you'll probably go on to have a trouble-free pregnancy. I had an amnio in my next pregnancy anyway, just to put my mind at rest. In fact, the care I got from the hospital was great, which made things alot easier.
I could talk about this for a long time, but the upshot is, I now have a 7 week old son who is wonderful in every way. If there's anything specific you'd like to know, please ask, otherwise you can contact me through Mumsnet. Good luck.

NQWWW Mon 14-Apr-03 11:03:11

My sister had 2 top's in successive pregnancies - one was for Edwards syndrome, the other for another chromosomal abnormality (very rare and didn't have a name). The doctors were astonished when she had her 2nd diagnosis, as they said the two were absolutely and totally unconnected and that the chances of anyone having this happen were very very small. She was still worried, and almost decided not to try another time, but in the end was persuaded by the doctors that her chances of a normal pregnancy were just as good as anyone else her age, tried again and had a very healthy baby daughter. HTH.

juelgaz Mon 14-Apr-03 19:34:13

Thankyou to everyone who has left me a messeage. I am an older mum, I already have two DDs, 7 & 9, I am now with a new partner, and would love to be able to have a child with him. I am 36 years old so I do relise that my chances of having a dowms baby are alot higher than normal. My heart and support goes out to all of those parents who love and bring up children with downs syndrome, but I did not feel that I could do so. I had a nuchal scan at 13 weeks, this showed a problem, I then has a CVS which confirmed that my baby had downs. Making the final decision was the hardest thing I have ever had to do in my life. I had brilliant support from my partner, family, friends and the hospital, and now feel that I want to start thinking about trying for another baby.
Rosy, your message touched me so much,I would like to know a little more, if that is not too personal. How old are you? How long did it take before your cycle got back to normal? Did you worry lots with your next pregnancy? etc. etc. I am going to read your other messages now.

bundle Mon 14-Apr-03 21:46:29

juelgaz, I do hope you take heart from people's positive experiences and hope that the 'odds' don't frighten you too much - I've had amnios with both my pregnancies (now 38) one because of higher than average Downs risk,the other for Edwards syndrome (I would have opted for termination if either had been positive) as I couldn't have coped with not knowing in either case. good luck.

mindy Mon 14-Apr-03 22:11:42

juelgaz
I also had a termination following a downs diagnosis - my situation was slightly different in that I was pregnant with twins following ivf, again, I have posted about this on a couple of other threads, one that rosy mentions and another titled amnio I think.
My thoughts and feelings at the time were v similar to yours - I did not see how I could manage with a 2 babies, one with downs and also ds. Added to this was the risk of losing both babies if I had a miscarriage later on. Again, much admiration for those who do, but it was too much for me to deal with.

At the time I was 34, we have not tried for another, partly because of the whole ivf/icsi cycle but also because I also am afraid of it happening again. I found both conceptions and pregnancies v stressful and though dp and I have talked about it, the urge for another is not so strong as to overcome these feelings.
I think the worry of it happening again is natural, has your hospital or midwives offered much info on ttc again?

If you want to talk about this offline I am happy to do so, ask tech for my email, though I know my own situation is slightly different now to you.

congrats rosy on your new son,
love mindy

juelgaz Mon 14-Apr-03 22:14:32

Thanks Bundle. Helps to know that given a similar situation you would have probably done the same. There is never a day goes by that I dont think of my litle cherub, and wonder whether I did the right thing, but then I remind myself that I made that decision for all of my family, and for my little cherub too.

juelgaz Mon 14-Apr-03 22:19:34

Thanks for your message Mindy, my heart goes out to you too, Its a horrible decision to make isnt it. I would love to talk more, its so good to find someone who has experienced a similar situation, sad though it may be. I am going on holiday for a couple of weeks, will contact you when I get back if that is still ok.

juelgaz Mon 14-Apr-03 22:21:26

Rosy, so sorry, I forgot to congratulate you on your new son, Hearing that gives me hope.

bundle Mon 14-Apr-03 22:21:45

juelgaz, I have no hesitation in saying that I would have gone ahead with termination - but that doesn't mean it would have been easy and I know like you I would have mulled it over forever. a dear friend of mine had a late top for another trisomy which meant she had to go through labour and even though she knows it was right I know it still hurts her and she's not managed to maintain a pregnancy since. heartbreaking for her, but the odds are better for most women, I'm sure. just make sure you ask lots of questions and don't let things fester, get the medics to explain what's possible/probably as much as they can, though they're not infallible either.

mindy Tue 15-Apr-03 09:25:15

It was a difficult decision, but thinking long term I know it was the right decision, I still find it very difficult to see newborn/baby twins and think about it often, it does not upset me in the way it did at the time but there will always be a sadness there I guess,
Have a good holiday, and talk to you when you get back, mindy

Rosy Wed 16-Apr-03 16:36:50

I was only 32 when I got pg for the second time - yes, you are in a "high-risk" category if you're over 35, but it's probably not nearly as high as you think. There are certainly plenty of mums on here who have had children after 35 without any problems.

As I said, I had an amnio this time round too, even though there were no other factors (eg. AFP results) that indicated I should. I was almost able to deny to myself that I was pregnant, and it was a bit like finding out I was pg at 17 weeks when I got the results, and the rest of the pregnancy seemed to go very quickly. We got a scan at 12 weeks - usually at about 16 weeks now in our hospital - and as everything seemed fine, we opted to wait until 16 weeks to have a less risky amnio rather than CVS. At least nowadays you get the results of an amnio very quickly. Once I'd got the favourable result, I didn't actually worry too much - looking back, I realise I was more concerned about an undiagnosed breech presentation!

On the subject of trying again: I think my periods returned quite quickly, and as we've not had any problems conceiving, I more or less chose when I wanted to have another baby. Personally, I don't think any time is "too soon". There's no doubt that being pregnant again & having my son have helped me get over the loss of my second child.

It is hard to come to terms with the fact that you've chosen to end the life of your own child - there are days when I can hardly believe I did such a terrible thing. I'm still convinced I did the right thing though, and that makes things easier to accept. I'm glad you're getting the support you need from those around you.

ThomCat Tue 29-Apr-03 17:44:43

I'm so sorry but I have to say how upset I was at reading this thread. I just want to let anyone reading this thread know about the special needs section on Mumsnet, if you're at all worried about your asy et unborn child. There are some very positive comments there, esp from me(!). I'm sorry for all the Mum's who terminated because they were told their baby was going to have DS, but my 16 month old daughter is truly amazing, healthy and so happy and it needn't be a terrible thing at all. I'm so sorry if I've now upset anyone with my comments, truly I am, I just needed to point out some positive feelings about DS incase any expectant mothers felt worried, sorry. To finish off if God or soemone(!) told me they would take Charlotte's DS away I would tell them to leave her alone and not change a single thing about her, she's perfect.

ThomCat Wed 30-Apr-03 12:07:44

What made you not want a child that would have Downs?

pie Wed 30-Apr-03 12:20:17

ThomCat

Without wanting to start a flame war..did you know your child had downs before birth?

jasper Wed 30-Apr-03 12:24:35

Thomcat I have no personal experience of this but wanted to say your posts are great and very educational for people like me who are completely ignorant of bringing up a baby who has downs.
Your daughter sounds amazing.

mum2toby Wed 30-Apr-03 12:26:22

Again - I'm not trying to inflame a situation here, but..... why would someone SO desperate for a child that they try IVF, who finally gets pregnant, why would you terminate because of Downs???? Just a bit confused here. I do not have a downs baby, but I feel that's a bit like saying..... We're really desperate for a baby...as long as it's genetically 'normal'.

mum2toby Wed 30-Apr-03 12:28:00

Great post Thomcat.

I work with a man with Downs. He is 36 and is the happiest person in here!! He lives in his own flat and makes his own way to and from work on the bus. He's worked here for years and everyone just loves ..... even though he talks too much.

pie Wed 30-Apr-03 12:35:27

As some of you know I am due to have an amnio tomorrow to check for Downs and Spina bifida. My husband I both feel that if the tests are positive we will seriously consider a termination. Not because we only want a perfect baby but because our circumstance would not be good to bring a child who needs life time care (to a greater extent than a 'normal' child). I have long term illnesses that have led to my becoming disabled. I have my own full time carer and have been indebted to my mother and social services for helping me to keep my DD and DH together. Our family life is happy, but with a lot of help and effort.

The bottom line is that my DH and I are unable to say with any confidence that we are equiped to cope in such circumstances. I know that a child with Downs can have a healthy happy life, but they can also have major heart, gland and brain problems.

As a teenager I was closely involved in the care of my cousin who was born with muscular dystrophy. Not once in her entire life did she hold her head, walk, talk or even move her own arms. For the last 3 years of life she had to be fed through a tube. She finally died of a heart attack at the age of 6. I've seen what this does to a family, I know that I couldn't function for almost a year afterwards. And to willingly go into such a situation frankly takes a lot stronger person than me.

elliott Wed 30-Apr-03 13:11:26

mum2toby, people who have IVF are really not so different from everyone else. I fail to see why we should meet some supposedly higher moral standard just because we've had to go through more than most to get pregnant.
I also think this is an inappropriate thread in which to criticise those who have made extremely difficult decisions to terminate. I don't think that is what the original poster was looking for.

seahorse Wed 30-Apr-03 13:16:51

I think that anyone who terminates a pregnancy deserves our support as this must be an extremely hard decision to take. This is such a personal and emotive issue and I just don't think anyone should question why juelgaz terminated her pregnancy, just give her the support she needs.

pie Wed 30-Apr-03 13:17:03

I agree elliot. If you want to discus the ethics of such a situation it may be best to start a new thread. Whatever you reasons for a termination I think you will find that there a very few women who NEVER have any regrets. I don't think its ever a black and white situation or any 'easy' decision to make.

pie Wed 30-Apr-03 13:18:49

I agree elliot. If you want to discus the ethics of such a situation it may be best to start a new thread. Whatever you reasons for a termination I think you will find that there a very few women who NEVER have any regrets. I don't think its ever a black and white situation or any 'easy' decision to make.

mum2toby Wed 30-Apr-03 13:20:40

I wasn't criticising Elliot!! It was a genuine query. I certainly didn't mean to offend anyone.

I personally would not choose to terminate a pregnancy after a diagnosis of Downs. My situation, however is vastly different from Pie's for example.

I just wondered what the trigger was to terminate and where the line would get drawn at terminating for what is obviously seen as a 'less than perfect' foetus?

mum2toby Wed 30-Apr-03 13:21:59

I shall bow out of this discussion where certain queries don't seem to be welcomed.

ThomCat Wed 30-Apr-03 13:43:36

Hi girls
I actually rushed back from lunch about to retract my 2nd comment, (not the 1st,) asking why people came to their decision. I didn't intend to pry I was just genuinley interested, esp in what the doctors had told them it might be like; but while walking round Sainsbury's I thought it a bit unfair for me to ask so was going to apologise, in fact I do apologise for asking that particular question, i really didn't mean to offend. I didn't reasise how sensitive I was on the subject and in turn didn't take time to think deeply about the mothers feeling who terminated because of Downs. I do however stand by my first comments about it not having to be the case and just wanted to point it out to any expectant mothers going through what we have. It's a hard topic and difficult to be open & honest without upsetting each other.
I just felt I HAD to point out my feelings and that my daughter has no heart, or any health problems. she is incredibly bright and sure will be be slightly slower than some other kids but is healthy, happy etc.
So Pie, Elliot & Seahorse, sorry if I offened, really I am, I onlyu meant to point out the other side as I felt there was a negative vibe and I had to balance it out a bit
Jasper and Mum2Toby, thanks for your comments and support.
Lets all kiss and make up girls!

grommit Wed 30-Apr-03 13:44:30

I think this all boils down to freedom of choice and circumstance. There will always be strongly coflicting views on this subject - too complex and heated really to discuss in this arena - nothing will be achieved except offending people...IMO

mum2toby Wed 30-Apr-03 13:50:37

Thanks Thomcat.

bells2 Wed 30-Apr-03 13:56:46

Just wanted to say Thomcat how much I have enjoyed reading about Charlotte. It's just very nice to hear such positive things about children with DS (that goes for Eidsvold too). Two of my childhood friends had sisters with DS and they were lovely.

elliott Wed 30-Apr-03 13:59:23

I wasn't offended (well, only by the throwaway comment about IVF - I read Mindy's story in her previous postings, had found it very moving, and thought she was being challenged rather unfairly). There have been many interesting and thought provoking discussions about this topic elsewhere on mumsnet - I certainly don't think its too difficult for us to handle! I just didn't think this thread was the the place for querying individuals decisions, that's all.
No grudges lingering here

mum2toby Wed 30-Apr-03 14:01:46

I'm assume you mean MY comment Elliot??? If so, then it's my turn to be offended that any of my questions should be considered 'throw away'!

ThomCat Wed 30-Apr-03 14:17:57

Bells2, how lovely of you, you gave me a rush of goose pimples up my legs!!!
Mum2Toby - you and I shaould go off and have our own chats about stuff!! You sound fab as well!

As for the rest of this conversation, look negative-ish SOINDING comments sparked me to balance things up for other Mums just reading through and then it lead on to another debate. Sorry we'll go and start another thread and have out little say elsewhere!!

Like I said, let's kiss and make-up! It's a sensitive issue and I for one got all sensitive about it initially I have to admit.
If you could just see Lottie! The 7 pictures of her grinning out at me from around my desk made it difficult to read comments about terminating a child with DS. Obviously Pie's situation is completley different to mine and I wasn't judging. I just needed to do a bit of ying and yang, you know.

i'm worn out now! Must do some work, but have to say - Pie, good luck to you and your hubby, hope everything works out OK for you and if I haven't upset you I'd like to know how you get on and will try my best to be supportive if needs be.


Much love - to you ALL - thomcat xx

Right Mum2Toby, meet up with ypu on a different thread later!

pie Wed 30-Apr-03 14:46:15

I don't hold grudges either. Just as ThomCat was trying to say there is an alternative I just wanted to to support the mums on this thread who have made a hard decision; where nothing is what it seems.

I'm feeling really emotional anyway at the moment...have been having nightmares with long needles and getting about 4 hours sleep a day for the past 2 weeks!

I have to say that after being in hospital for most of this pregnancy and having had a miscarriage before I will not be trying for another baby EVER again. I can't go through this again, no matter how this pregnancy turns out. My husband is already looking into the snip.

I do admire you ThomCat for obviously being a very giving mother, your DD is lucky to have you.

ThomCat Wed 30-Apr-03 14:52:27

Thanks Pie.
I wish you health & happiness, good luck.

Rosy Thu 01-May-03 10:31:03

Hi Thomcat - I could come up with lots of excuses about why I had a termination when I found out my child had DS, but I try not to attempt to justify that decision to myself or anyone else. I know that what I did is completely wrong in any moral sense, and sometimes I find the guilt almost overwhelming. But on another level of consciousness, I'm convinced I did the right thing. It's a strange situation, when something so appalling (ending the life of your child), that would be condemned by society at any other time, is allowed and supported by authority in the form of medical professionals.

It's great to hear how happy your wee girl has made you and your family. If that doesn't sound too hypocritical coming from me. (I think you're absolutely justified in commenting on this by the way - it is life and death we're talking about, after all. I can't speak for anyone else, but I'm certainly not offended by you fighting your dd's corner.)

ThomCat Thu 01-May-03 13:33:14

Hi Rosy and thank you for your reply. I'm so glad you weren't upset or offened by anything I said, I just wanted to point out that it needn't been an awful thing, but I totally understand your feelings. I think when you said that you had had a a new baby boy who was wonderful in every way, that got me a bit and I felt incredibly deffensive for Charlotte, can you understand? I'm sure, in fact I know you didn't mean it in the way I took it at that time, it was just a knee jerk reaction. All said and done Rosy you're brave to have gone through with such a difficult decision and I'm very glad everyhting worked out OK for you. Congratulations on the birth of your son. Look forward to chatting with you in the future, TC x

Rhubarb Thu 01-May-03 15:22:29

I have avoided this thread for the very same reason as Thomcat, but I don't think it helps the mothers in this situation to be criticising them now, they've made their decision and the past cannot be changed.

My nephew has Downs and the heart defect that often accompanies this syndrome. The docs told my sister all the worst possible outcomes and scenarios and suggested it might be kinder to end the pregnancy, she was 25 weeks. She refused. When my nephew was born he had to have open heart surgery at 3 months, he was very ill for a time. But he recovered. Now his immune system is weak, he is forever picking up bugs, and his physical and mental development is behind (but he was in and out of hospital for 9 months). However not all the doctors' bad omens came true, he 18 months old and smiles, sits up, makes dada noises, laughs and so on. He is a true delight! There are many people out there with Downs and you would never know by looking at them, some have very mild versions indeed, but doctors cannot tell how bad the Downs will be by the tests alone, that is only known as the child is growing up.
I also have a brother with severe learning disabilities and I work at a school supporting pupils with special needs. So it is a topic that is close to my heart.

It is sad that most doctors do give the worst case scenarios, which are a factor in influencing mothers' decisions. But most mums know what they would do if the amnio tests come back as positive. This thread was set up to support mums who have made that hard decision, and so I truly think they should be left alone to support each other. However if you want to start an alternative thread Thomcat, I would happily join you.

ThomCat Thu 01-May-03 16:41:49

Hi Rhubarb
I don't think at any point I've critised any of th mothers. I just wanted to make sure people reading through were aware of some plus/positive things and asked them to look in the special needs section. Then things kind of kicked off and I tried to end this thread really but since then I've just been responding to people's comments when my name was mentioned, and all comments have been very nice and very positive I replied to Pie & Rosy and wished them all the luck etc etc. But yeah sure I'd be more than happy to chat to you anywhere. Girls you have your thread back for it's original purpose, sorry I butted in but hope you understand why.
Love Thomcat xx

juelgaz Thu 01-May-03 18:51:58

Just back from holiday and I am shocked at the responses from my original message.I know that it is a very personal decision to make and whilst hoping to find support from others who had been through the same as me, I did'nt realise that I would spark off such a strong debate.
As I said in my original message, I take my hat off to families who love and bring up a child with Downs Syndrome, but I felt that it was not the right choice for my family. I know fine well that there are many happy children and adults out there who live happy lives whilst bringing so much joy to the people around them even though they suffer from Downs. The guilt and hurt I feel when I see them is indescribable. Only someone who has been through termination for these reasons will fully understand, and I realise that I need the support from these people, and would like to think that I could support someone who was going through a similar situation. That is the wonderful thing about the internet, it allows people to share support, and helps you to relise that you are not alone.

Batters Thu 01-May-03 20:15:30

juelgaz, I am so sorry that you feel upset at reading some of the messages here. I can honestly say that is not what Mumsnet is about normally, and I hope that your posting receives apologies from anyone who has upset you. And please do not feel that you have to try and justify your actions, again that is not what Mumsnet is about. I think if you are brave enough to read this thread again you will find some posters who have shown support.

Please keep posting -

juelgaz Thu 01-May-03 20:35:48

Thanks for your message Batters, I have had alot of support and I am truely grateful for all of those who gave it. I will continue to use mumsnet, to be honest it is a God send to be able to talk to people who have experienced similar things.I hope that one day through mumsnet, I will be able to make a differance to someone elses life, who needs support in similar circumstances.

Rosy Thu 01-May-03 21:23:14

Juelgaz - I hope you realised that my earlier comments were how I felt about myself & my own actions, and not anybody else's. And I hope you continue to feel the support from Mumsnet - two people particularly were really supportive to me at the time. As I remember, 3-4 months later were the worst time for me, but it gets better.

Thomcat - about being defensive for your dd, I understand completely and I'm sorry that I caused you upset, however unintentionally.

Marina Thu 01-May-03 22:39:01

Juelgaz, ThomCat, Rosy (Rosy already knows this ) Mumsnet postings can bring support to people in a wider way than you might imagine. When my son Tom died of causes unknown the womb at 22 weeks, I turned to Rosy's brave post about the birth of little Rosy. More than anything else I read or was told in the two horrible days waiting for him to be born, her account helped me face the prospect of his birth. I knew if she could do it, and survive it, so could I. I am now 26 weeks pregnant, have had a very nervous pregnancy so far, but despite being nearly 40, I opted out of invasive testing, partly because I was terrified of losing the baby. If our child is born with Downs (a possibility even with our quite good nuchal result), I hope I'll be as inspiring a mum as ThomCat and Eidsvold are.
Juelgaz, I hope you had a good break and get plenty of support as you prepare to TTC. Nice to see you back.

mindy Thu 01-May-03 23:53:24

Hi
like juelgaz I logged on last night for the first time in a week or so and was upset by some of these postings - I started to write a long thread and decided it was not the best time to respond,
I have been thinking about it today,

I have drawn support from hearing of others in the same situation to me and the knowledge we can help each other, reading Rosys message last year was the first time I had spoken with someone who had been in the same situation as me and just knowing that made a big difference.

Our decisions are personnal and each to our own - just because we have done something that someone else necessarily would not, it does not follow that it was an easy decision to make or live with.
I wonder how things would have turned out if I had not known in advance.

juelgaz - hope you had a good holiday, I have emailed tech with my details for you.

ThomCat Wed 07-May-03 14:07:28

Hi again, Rosy - please don't apologise you have no need, I was upset initially but only becuase as a parent I was incredibly deffensive and I know you didn't mean the way I initally took your comment.
And to Juelgaz and Mindy i hope I wasn't one of the people to have hurt you. I keep logging back on to this site to make sure there isn't anyone I've upset. I hope when you read my first comment you realise I wasn't critising you in any way and just wanted to point out the special needs section to other readers in case they were in the middle of having to make huge and difficult decision like yourselves. It's a difficult and sensitive subject so i'm sorry if I did offend you, it was never my intention. I just wanted to let people, and you if you were nervous about it happening again, that it's not always as bad as we think it might be, but full support to your decisions.

Rhubarb Thu 08-May-03 15:02:26

I just need to come out in support of Thomcat here too. I contributed to a thread very similiar to this one when my nephew had just been born with Downs. All in all the other mothers, including the ones who had terminated their pregnancies, were very supportive and understood my need to tell my own story of my experiences with children who have special needs. Rosy was particularly understanding and I have nothing but admiration and respect for her.

This is a very senstitive topic, and as someone said, everyone is entitled to make their own decisions and not to be criticised for that. But there really is no criticism of any kind here. You must realise that there are mothers on Mumsnet who have children with special needs and they do get understandably defensive when there is talk of terminating a pregnancy because the baby has Downs. Just as each one of you probably gets upset when you see a child with Downs yourselves. It is so close to the bone. But I have been impressed with the dignity at which people have expressed themselves, and the tact and sensitivity they have shown to others. This thread does stand out as a very good example of a supportive thread, as it tolerates views from both sides.

So please do not get upset just because someone else has had a different experience than you, or has a different take on things than you. Do understand their point of view and how upsetting it is for them too. By welcoming other people's views we can really make this a brilliant thread for other mothers who may find themselves contemplating the same situation.

Now I really don't think we need Thomcat to apologise any more do we?

ThomCat Thu 08-May-03 16:49:04

Thankyou SO much Rhubarb what a wonderful and supportive posting, not only to me but to us all. Thank you, thank you, thank you. I just hope that the everyone else involved in this thread agrees with you. I hate the thought of having upset anyone. I agree that I think this is a very informative and supportive thread which shows lots of different sides. A lovely posting and thanks again. XX

jasper Fri 09-May-03 08:10:45

in the absence of wine, raising a cup of coffee to rhubarb's excellent post.
Thomcat your dd is fortunate to have such a lovely mum.

mindy Sun 11-May-03 23:33:46

Rhubarb, thomcat
thanx for the messages, I must admit I was slightly apprehensive about logging onto this thread again but glad I did now,
I can see the other side of this, and find your posts about your your own situations interesting and inspiring, good luck hto you all....mindy

kittykat01 Mon 22-Jul-13 16:01:33

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