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My parents pay my daughters nursery fees

(46 Posts)
justinemansfd Sat 16-Feb-13 18:52:44

Just wondering if anyone else has help paying for childcare from relatives?
If so do you claim tax credits on the full amount it costs for nursery or just the amount you pay?

Would really appreciate the help s I have a query

Thanks xxj

ReetPetit Sat 16-Feb-13 19:21:55

not meaning to be rude, but why do you parents pay your dds nursery fees?? hmm

if you work and claim tax credits, then you are meant to pay for nursery out of that. Are you only just starting work? If so claim the tax credits, pay for it yourself out of that and top up whatever you have to pay on top and tell your parents they don't have to pay for your daughter anymore!!

Meglet Sat 16-Feb-13 19:28:18

reet because childcare is expensive and her parents might want to help out? Grandparents paying for things isn't that unusual.

just I don't know about the TC thing, interesting question though. I'd guess the TC are based on the nursery fee's, it would be a faff for HMRC to start asking how much the grandparents pay.

justinemansfd Sat 16-Feb-13 19:48:40

Thanks meglet will ring them on Monday!
Reet you have no idea of my earnings or circumstances so your opinion really isn't helpful but thankyou anyway, cheers guys xx

Fightlikeagirl Sat 16-Feb-13 19:50:14

I don't pretend to know much about tax credits but would it not be fraud if you don't use the money to pay for childcare but you claim that you are?
Maybe your parents could help you out in another way such as groceries/rent/bills/clothing etc?
I know that in the past as a cm I have had to verify how much a certain family pay me for childcare and it was quite official stating that I would be liable if I was not truthful about how much I received.
Just to warn you really in case you ever get looked into.

SamSmalaidh Sat 16-Feb-13 20:29:19

I get tax credits to cover about 1/3 of DS's fees, grandparents pay another 1/3 and I pay the rest. I told TCs the full amount, not the 2/3s.

Bluemonkeyspots Sun 17-Feb-13 09:56:40

Would be interesting to find out if you can claim the money for childcare even though it's not being spent on it.

You would be onto a winner if you could anyway.

How are your patents planning on paying if you don't mind me asking? Will it go direct to the nursery or come to you to pay them?

Just thinking that if it came to you I can't see how anyone could prove it was supposed to be used for fees and not just living expenses.

Very nice of your parents to be doing this smile

insancerre Sun 17-Feb-13 09:58:45

Is that not fraud?
Benefit cheats come in all guises it seems.

SamSmalaidh Sun 17-Feb-13 10:40:04

How on earth is it fraud?

mrscog Sun 17-Feb-13 10:44:25

It depends on what you've claimed - on a TC's form you must only claim for the fees you pay - so if your bill was £250 per week but your parents pay £200 you must put that you only pay £50 per week.

For what it's worth I think there have been some spiteful comments on this so far. Op I'm pleased you have nice supportive parents who can help you out. smile

insancerre Sun 17-Feb-13 10:53:12

Because as I read it, she is claiming tax credits for nursery fees she is not paying herself.
From the HM Revenue and customs
If you work, you could get extra tax credits to help with your childcare costs. You can claim as soon as you start paying for childcare, and only for the amounts that are actually paid by you.
www.hmrc.gov.uk/taxcredits/start/who-qualifies/children/childcare-costs.htm

Fightlikeagirl Sun 17-Feb-13 11:00:42

Sam It could be classed as fraud as you're claiming that you're paying out an amount for childcare but you're not actually paying it all yourself.. To get around this could the grandparents not contribute to something else and you pay for the whole childcare bill yourself?

Not bring spiteful at all just offering advice.

thesnootyfox Sun 17-Feb-13 11:14:40

Use the money that your parents pay you towards groceries instead.

ZenNudist Sun 17-Feb-13 11:19:33

Insancerre that sounds like it answers OP's question. People were a bit quick to rush in and cry fraud when she was just asking for clarification.

OP if you need the help and your dps can afford it and want to then I'm sure they'd help out in other ways. Clothes, trips, treats or holidays? Then you can pay and claim nursery fees reasonably knowing you get support from your dps for things the state shouldn't have to pay for.

Catchingmockingbirds Sun 17-Feb-13 11:26:31

Are you asking if you should claim extra tax credits for nursery fees you don't pay and then keep it for yourself? No, ofcourse you shouldn't.

Fightlikeagirl Sun 17-Feb-13 11:28:55

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

Bluemonkeyspots Sun 17-Feb-13 11:35:02

Well the easiest way round it then would be to explain to your parents that it would help you out more financially if they could give you the "fees" money to use for living expenses and let your wages pay for the actual nursery that way you would not be doing anything wrong.

I'm sure your parents would be fine doing this if it was to help you out even more, it's not like it would make any difference to what they are paying you. Unless they are somehow uses childcare vouchers to save on tax but I'm sure it's only parents that can claim these?

Fightlikeagirl Sun 17-Feb-13 11:49:18

Yeah what bluemonkeyspots says or if your parents pay the fees to you there isn't an actual paper trail to the childcare setting anyway so would be ok. I was just saying that you could be in trouble if your parents pay the fee direct.

It is great to have parents who help out, I always take my dad with me on the new school uniform shop!!!

ReetPetit Sun 17-Feb-13 15:27:01

i know op said my opinion is not hellpful hmm but this is benefit fraud!! if you are not paying the childcare yourself you must tell tax credits that! all i was saying is why can you not claim the correct amount,pay it from that and relieve your parents of having to pay your dds childcare costs?

SamSmalaidh Sun 17-Feb-13 15:55:25

Get your parents to pay for something else then (or just give you the money as a gift every month).

Fightlikeagirl Sun 17-Feb-13 16:21:15

Apparently Reet we're being spiteful by pointing out it would be fraud, oh well!

justinemansfd Sun 17-Feb-13 18:31:25

Thanks guys,
I havnt actually started claiming tax credits but now I'm eligible I will probably pay all the childcare and get my parents to help out on the mortgage! Thanks x

Xenia Sun 17-Feb-13 19:06:57

No lawful but of course your parents can pay for other things and then no problem.
yes, get them to help out on the mortgage. They may want to pay direct to ensure the money isn't going on booze so they could make a monthly or annual over payment to your building society.

MirandaWest Sun 17-Feb-13 19:15:01

Xenia, why would the payment be spent on alcohol?

missmapp Sun 17-Feb-13 19:19:12

When I had an overpayment using childcare vouchers, it had to be repaid direct to cm as it could only be used on childcare( no problem as a huge amount of my money is only spent on childcare!) is this not the case with child tax credits??

SamSmalaidh Sun 17-Feb-13 19:24:06

I haven't used childcare vouchers, but tax credits are just paid into your bank account rather than direct to the care provider.

Maybe Xenia's thinking is that if an adult woman can't manage her mortgage and childcare bill and instead of making changes to her life wishes to carry on as she is, simply relying on Bank of Mum and Dad to bail her out, well perhaps said Bank may worry about where the money/judgement has gone?

SamSmalaidh Sun 17-Feb-13 19:26:40

Well I am very grateful and fortunate that my parents are willing and able to help me out financially, and DS is very happy at his nursery because of it smile

tabulahrasa Sun 17-Feb-13 19:31:47

If you're claiming tax credits anything paid by someone else needs to be declared.

Fightlikeagirl Sun 17-Feb-13 19:33:03

That's a good idea Op, then you will be able to claim your full entitlement of tc's and get help with the mortgage, win win! smile

Scootee Sun 17-Feb-13 19:35:13

Am amazed at some of the spite on this thread.

OP it's best if you pay the nursery fees out of your earnings and use any money your parents help you out with for something else, like elec bill, food, mortgage etc.

Viviennemary Sun 17-Feb-13 19:39:16

I can't see the problem with this. A lot of people get financial help from parents. If the parents give the OP money it isn't classed as income. And could be used for any kind of expense. That is how I would see it.

snowmummy Sun 17-Feb-13 19:55:31

I'm also amazed at the vitriol on this thread.

Hoaz Sun 17-Feb-13 20:00:08

I agree, lots of parents help with all sorts of costs. Were they planning to pay the nursery direct, or to give you something towards the cost of the nursery?

Actually, Viviennary I think you do need to declare regular gifts as income for tax and benefit purposes, particularly if that money is being spent on living expenses see here under other income

JuliesSistersCousinsAuntsCat Sun 17-Feb-13 20:02:56

Nothing wrong with a child's grandparents helping towards the costs of childcare, I know plenty who do (my parents not included).

Justine, claim for the amount you pay.

mum23girlys Sun 17-Feb-13 20:10:51

Justine what lovely kind parents you have. We're also lucky with both sets and get dance lessons, school shoes and winter jackets bought. I think if you get your parents to give you the money towards living expenses instead and pay nursery yourself then that would probably be best. I wouldn't call that benefit fraud as they are then not funding nursery.

I'm glad they are able to help you out so you are able to work.

montage Sun 17-Feb-13 20:16:15

A lot of grandparents help out by providing free or virtually free childcare. I would see this as a variation on that tbh, rather than as an indication that OP has difficulty managing finances.

Xenia Mon 18-Feb-13 07:28:16

It just cannot be paid to the nursery and should be for other costs under the tax credit rules.

For tax purposes (but not benefits see the rules above) though gifts in the UK are not taxed. If you give money to your children and survive 7 years there is no 40% inheritance tax paid when you die on that earlier gift so there is a lot of merit on gifts to children. If the family is on benefits however then you do need to read benefits rules.

The op actually asked about how tax credits work. Nowhere did she say she was fraudulently claiming.

In answer to you op you tell tax credits the full amount of fees and they will pay up to 70% depending on your eligibility.

You may be able to use Childcare vouchers if your earnings are too high which are deducted from your wages before tax.

The forms are easily available. You will need your nurseries address & Ofsted registration number.

Good luck

Heebiejeebie Tue 19-Feb-13 07:00:00

Northern lurker, you might have been better lurking, not posting. Can you not imagine any 'acceptable', even to you, reasons for parents helping their adult children?

thesnootyfox Tue 19-Feb-13 13:42:24

Lots of parents help out their adult children, it doesn't mean that the adult children are irresponsible. Times are tough and if you are comfortable why not help out the younger generation if you can afford to?

Viviennemary Tue 19-Feb-13 14:03:32

I thought you would only have to declare a gift for tax purposes if it was over £3,000 a year to any one individual. (or used to be around that amount). Which it might be over I suppose in this case. But of course that is for the giver. I can't see any problem with parents helping out financially.

Xenia Tue 19-Feb-13 15:07:37

VM, that's right - after death they go back and ask for a declaration of gifts made in the 7 years before death of about that level. If parent were paying childcare which is often £25k a year for full time then they would be well over that limit but in most cases parents would be in their 50s if paying that so probably a long way from death. This was more a rule about tax credits which I have never been eligible for at all. If the parent just pays for something else not childcare then their child can still claim their tax credits.

tabulahrasa Tue 19-Feb-13 15:16:51

Any regular money counts as income for tax credits whether that is cash or paid straight for childcare, mortgage or any other household bills. Even if it is a gift from parents.

Tax credits aren't really that much to do with tax, they are an in work benefit to supplement the income of low earning families, if hat income is already being supplemented by someone else then that will also be taken into account.

Xenia Tue 19-Feb-13 16:16:00

It was this bit posted above which suggested the crucial issue was that you were paying for childcare. If your parent pays you are not paying for childcare.

"Because as I read it, she is claiming tax credits for nursery fees she is not paying herself.
From the HM Revenue and customs
If you work, you could get extra tax credits to help with your childcare costs. You can claim as soon as you start paying for childcare, and only for the amounts that are actually paid by you.
www.hmrc.gov.uk/taxcredits/start/who-qualifies/children/childcare-costs.htm"

Whether your income is too high for tax credits at all is a different issue. I have never earned so little I got even a penny of them.

Mrscupcake23 Tue 19-Feb-13 20:52:30

Bet the op wishes she hadn't come on here. It's not really anyone's business if her parents want to help. It's between her and her parents.

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