Hi, I wanted some advice. My CM was off sick last week, plus she forgot to ring me on Monday so I received a call from the school because dd was left waiting for her. I had to send my mum immediately to pick her up as I'm over an hour's journey from work. My mum then covered the following two days too. The CM was having chest pains and went for tests but they all came back negative. (She was also off sick a couple of weeks before with a chest infection). This morning I rang her myself at 8:45am, she was off sick again (I only knew she was off sick cos she also works at the school as a TA & runs the breakfast club, her colleague there told me), she has been having panic attacks & is seeing the doctor today, she said she'd ring me later. My mum is on standby for the rest of the week, I've left work early and will make up the time later in the week. (I only work mon-wed)

I'm starting to get a bit fed up of it - over Easter she was off for a few weeks with sciatica, and has taken the odd day off here and there with colds, tummy bugs etc which are fair enough i guess. But I'm not sure how long I can continue like this, it impacts on me, dd, my job, and my mum or others who step in for her and I can't really continue working like that can i? Supposing I didn't have a free mum who was willing (and she's only willing - and able - up to a point of course) to cover at short notice. (Plus she's an hour's journey from home, so dd has a late bedtime when she has her, she'd rather not bring her back to mine cos she has her own things to do, fair enough.) Now that the CM has failed to ring me two weeks in a row as well, it feels even worse.

I feel bad though because she's obviously going through a tough time and possibly has health issues.

What should I do? I wish I could change my hours around or something (would need to do less) but that's not really a viable option I don't think, and even if I could (would love to!) there would still be the school holidays to sort. Should i find a new CM and if so, what do I tell the current CM? Are there any rights & regulations protecting her job for me?

Would like opinions/experience from both CMs and parents.Thanks.

Sack her.

I feel so awful if i have to do it, I know she's worried about her job at the school too because of all her sick days.

If I don't reply for a while btw I'm off on the school run!

I'd just tell her you have every sympathy and everything but you're going to make alternative arrangements as you have to know where you stand. You could always say that once she feels she is back to 100% health, she could let you know and you might consider going back?

The situation can't go on though, tis silly.

Thanks. Maybe I'll wait to see how she is by the end of this week - and I'll actually ring her at the weekend this time! - and if she's still not good next week i'll do that.

Has anyone else had to deal with a similar situation? I do wonder what her other mindees' parents are doing about it, but I hardly ever see them to speak to.
Is there not an unfair dismissal type of thingy for CMs?

She forgot to tell you and no-one was there to pick up your DD - thats bad and so un-professional.

I would speak to her, and say you need more communication about sick days. If it doesn't improve, I would look around for someone else.

Yep, I think failing to pick your dd up from school, or at least warning you that she couldn't, would constitute gross misconduct and fair grounds for getting the sack.... It wouldn't be unfair dismissal.

A childminder can't be sacked - they are self employed - they are a service provider. Service users (parents) and stop using the service at anytime, under the terms as stated in their contract.

Capri - think you need to start looking at alternative providers. Parents need reliable childcare... doesn't sound as if your current CM is being all that reliable.

Sorry - but I would go elsewhere. With my childcare providers I expect very few sick days (ie about 2-3 days a year, unless there is a particular problem). It's just not on. And the forgetting to phone you - that's unforgiveable and unprofessional (in the circs as described).

She sounds useless.
Get rid.

I'm a childminder and also say get rid! Not phoning you is VERY unprofessional and to actually have a child left at school because of it imo is neglectful! Poor child I've been the one at school in a state as not been able to find a mindee and when I ring parent all worried, they say 'oh, they're off today' which is very annoying BUT for a childminder to do this is even worse!

Agree, you cannot SACK her but definitely can give notice as per your contract.

I've worked when really poorly, just close when I have to i.e. D & V. I worked when in early pg and bleeding (convinced was loosing him as happened in the past), just put a smile on my face and business as usual. I had times I was in agony walking as fell when pg but I still worked.....AND....I worked recently when I'd been sick because the mum was desperate (made clear if mindee got it, she'd have to stay away for 48 hrs) and only called her to get her to come home when I'd been sick for the 4th time and was just not fit to work (mindee was 9 months and my baby only 3 months so it was a bit much!). My point is, MANY childminders hardly take any sickness as they understand the impact on parents (plus we loose money! ). She sounds totally unreliable and I think you are going to continue to get let down.

Please don't let this put you off childminders though, most of us are not like this

I was a childminder and gave up because I had health issues. I needed time to recover and it was not fair on the parents or mindees! It is really not on to leave a child in the lurch at schoola dn to not give a parent as much notice of illness as possible.

I would look elsewhere or have a frank discussion with CM.

I also never took any sick time off except when had sickness and dhiorreoa (sp) and following a major op! We loose money and it is not good for business.

if the cm was rushed to hosp ahving chest pains, then although leaving you DC at school is terrible, she may not have been able to ring/pass on numbers???(benefit of doubt there)..however as her hsitory shows a huge lack of communication and notice i would definatly get yourself another cm and tell her the reason you're doing this, yes she may be very worried/poorly and 'need' to have these days off, but surely she must have known this was coming..any normal person would...good luck.

The fact that she left my child uncollected would make me forget about any sympathy for her ill health and I would sack her.

No notice pay either.

Thanks everyone, I think I find it hard to be angry at people, but you've all expressed pretty much what I've been thinking, i just hate confronting people or anything like that.

PinkChick -The day after she forgot, she rang me and basically she had rung round everyone and forgot about dd . She felt awful about it. It was then that day that she spent all day at hospital having the tests, she rang me again on the morning of day 3 to let me know & the tests were negative but she had to take rest of week off, but that she'd ring me at the end of the week. -She didn't. It was me who rang her this morning as her colleague told me she was off sick still. tbh it sounds as if she's got some ishoos and isn't coping very well atm.

I felt so for dd last monday and was in a panic when the school rang, but they said she was fine, there were other little children waiting too, and then one of the teachers occupied her in a classroom till my mum arrived. Thank god for grandmothers huh! But anyway, I agree, I was pretty shocked as it was the first time she's actually not contacted me.
It's a pity because she's pretty flexible otherwise - can work other days at short notice, and any days in the holidays (bar her own booked week off). Plus she's v cheap for where i live -and having her attached the school is good too. ah well.

She's no good if she doesn't actually do her job though.

Goodness I hope none of us CM ever dare to be sick!

Most childminders I know (and I am one too) rarely take time off sick unless we really really have to.

I have to be horrendously unwell to take time off, as I do too much of a guilt trip - I am well aware of the chaos it can cause to parents to be let down at short notice.

As long as you give the agreed amount of notice to your childminder, there is nothing to stop you looking for care elsewhere. However unwell your minder may be, and however sympathetic you are, you do need to have reliable childcare in place.

But othermarypoppins its not the being sick so much thats the issue surely its the not phoning the OP regarding this.

I'd feel sympathy too but ultimately you need your child to be looked after so i'd have discussion with her and say that regrettably you have to give notice because of the failure to contact you rather than because of her illness.

Clearly the issue is not her being sick - it's her organisation and committment. And also the frequency with which she is sick. I very rarely miss a day off work and couldn't have someone looking at after my child who was constantly having days off here and there. The OP is lucky to have her Mum to call on, most of us don't have that.

It's kind of both that's the problem, I'm afraid. Forgetting to ring me was unforgivable, that's one issue. The other is how often she is getting sick and how long for at a time - i'd love to be able to be sympathetic & flexible, but the fact of the matter is, I have a daughter who needs looking after, and a job that I can't mess around too much. As others have said, if I didn't have my mum I would def have been called into official meetings about my attendance by now! Not to mention, I am studying and my 2 free days are spent doing that, they would have been filled with making up the time at work instead. It's hard enough as it is fitting it all in!

I am going to try and write down all the occasions she has been off sick, in case I am being a bit melodramatic in my anxiety & exaggerating it. Just to see how often it has really been...

God, I am dreading having to make a decision & tell her...

I am a childminder and have only been off sick once only... until Fri 7th Nov when I had a severe asthma attack and had to be hospitalised for 5 days. Today was my first day back with the kids. Me becoming ill is something I am CONSTANTLY aware of as it really puts parents in an awkward situation... parents appreciate reliabilty and openess.

On the other hand, I cannot knowingly infect children if I become ill and if I am not well enough to care for them properly, then I should not be caring for them... thankfully this doesn't happen often! Plus I cannot afford to be sick to be honest, as I do not charge for days I am off sick.

Even with a nebuliser and battling to breathe, I wrote a note to my hubby to phone X, Y and Z (it was Fri eve) who were coming on Mon... to tell them there was a possibility I could not mind on the coming Monday and to please look at making alternative care arrangements in case (and reminded them of a local childminder who could care for them if need be, who the kids know).

I think that only fair. I was so worried about what they would do, and I was amazed at their support and care - flowers, get well cards made by the kids etc. As soon as doc gave me any news I would let them know. Kept them in the loop the whole time.

In any business, communication is key, it's professional and expected. I personally would not be happy dealing with a childminder (or any service provider) who was as unreliable as yours. I do think you need to have a frank chat with her, and, judging by her response, possibly think of finding alternate care.

Good luck x

I have been a CM for 7 years and have only been off sick 3 times. I am so aware of how difficult it is for parents to find alternative care. Plus I would have to let down upto 4 different families each day.

agree with others you need to find childcare that is reliable or else you then look bad at your job and as you said you cant always rely on your mum etc

forgetting a child is UNFORGIVEABLE my charge was meant to go home with a friend last year from school, and then mum forgot her, i had a call from teacher with upset child - i was FURIOUS with that mum - still am tbh

i am very sorry that your cm is having health problems but it is not your problem, look around for new childcare and give the notice as stated in your contract

Tricky one because you can't help having sympathy for another person who is trying to earn a living but is suffering from ill health. Particularly as being S/E they won't have any sick pay.

I'm extremely lucky as my C/M has only had 1.5 days off sick in the 2 years that DS has gone to her, but she might just be having a bad run.

If it were me I would say to her that you are concerned about having to find the cover for the days of sick, you hope that her health recovers but if the situation hasn't improved by the end of year or a month or whatever you think is reasonable, then you will need to look for alternative child care.

That way you are giving her an opportunity to show that she is capable of doing the job, and if she genuinely isn't then you can get someone else.

Actually maybe I'm being too soft, just because I'm off work after an op myself and really appreciate having sick pay and understanding employers.

I am coming over all panicky when I think about having to let her go or warn her I may have to. I wouldn't mind so much if I wasn't going to be continuing to see her at the breakfast club!

I had to ring her in the end last night at 8:30ish as she still hadn't rung me. Doc has signed her off for the rest of the week, and she said she will possibly be signed off for next week too but will let me know after wed. She didn't tell me why, unless the story hasn't changed and it's still panic attacks.

She has worked for me since January and as far as I can tell from the info I kept (I have kept a record of all my payments to her, and of course I don't pay her sick pay so I'm not sure if I noted down all the sicknesses), apart from the long period over Easter and now this period, there have been 3 other sick periods (1-3 days off each, colds, d&v and suchlike), and one week she had to take her dd (who is in her early 20s ) to the doc with stomach pains that turned out to be D&V. (It was me who then chose to keep dd away the rest of that week, to be fair.)

I've just remembered, there was also one scenario coming up to the summer holidays that she let me know at quite short notice that she was taking an extra couple of days to visit family - I was working those days (had pre-booked her official week off at full pay as well as a second week of my own at half pay so I had to get cover for an additional 2 days, at no pay to her iirc). At the time i was like, eh? but thought nothing more about it.

But now, the big picture doesn't really look good, does it? She's obv not in very good health generally, and now doesn't seem to be coping very well. She used to ring me either the evening before or on that morning if she was going to be off sick, but this past week or so has been really odd.

TBH it's none of your busniess as to WHY she has been signed off, only that she has.
I agree it's not acceptable that you are having to chase her around but if she is genuinely ill then it might be the furthest thing from her mind.

You don't sound happy with her anyway, so that's reason enough to look elsewhere and then give notice according to your contract.

I think you do need to give notice. In any job i've ever had you've always had to phone in and say you're sick or get someone else to do it.

In my opinion its just not on to forget.

I know it is none of my business but if it's going to be something that keeps impacting on me & dd in the long term, then I need to know don't I. Plus, being genuinely ill isn't an excuse to not let your mindees know you can't pick them up!!!

I am going to see how I feel after next week and then perhaps look for a CM to start after christmas, and only tell her when I've found one, in case I don't find one (she was my only option the same time last year). I will hate having to do that though.
Also, if she fails to ring me by next sunday evening i will say something when i ring her along the lines of I need to know!!

I have today spoken to the CM and she is signed off for next week as well, with anxiety problems, she is having to take each week as it comes, she said she is really not very well. She did apologise for messing me around.

I am therefore looking for another CM as of today (I haven't told her yet though). I am actually feeling suddenly quite upset about it, though also relief that at least i know i HAVE to find someone and i don't feel guilty any more about it. The CIS have no CM vacancies that go to dd's school but with any luck one of the others can go there even though they haven't listed it, as they have more than one school listed. I will be in a real sticky situation if I can't find one.

So the saga continues...
I rang her this afternoon "oh, i was going to ring you tonight, you must have read my mind!" i, er, need to know about next week so i can sort work?

Anyway, she is still off work next week she reckons, said she is a lot better but off to the doc later today. She said her daughter (grown up) could pick dd up, that she'd be home. Her daughter has helped out in this way before too, i normally don't have a problem with it. She then asked that i don't tell anyone (i.e. at the school, in case you've forgotten she's a TA at the school too) that she's got dd. i was like, err, but your dd is picking her up, they'll know! and she said, well we can say she's having her! So she's now expecting me to lie for her!!! I guess she's trying to a) do right by me by providing child care next week cos she's worried she's messed me around too much and I'll let her go and b) needs the bit of cash i pay her.

Well, needless to say I'm not standing for that. I didn't really know how to respond at te time so had agreed to it but I'm going to ring her on sunday and tell her my mum will have dd (she can do 2 days, have to do the other day in 2 halves, like I did this past week), that I'd rather wait till she was completely better and back at work. (Thing is, I don't really want to, I really don't feel I can trust her any more. I'm kinda hoping she remains off sick in time for me to find a new CM and give her notice!!)

I am feeling really miserable and stressed out about this whole thing. I haven't yet called any other CMs though there are a couple who live literally round the corner from dd's school, but they have other schools listed as their pick ups. I'm sure it's worth trying them anyway. I guess my worry is that I won't be able to find anyone else and be stuck, and I really don't want to - and can't really afford to - give up work (appealing though the thought sometimes is!)

if anyone has any pearls of wisdom for me i'd be grateful! or even just sympathetic nods would be nice!

PS is it ok to call a potential CM in the evenings or at weekends?!

Yes, it is, Caprica. Though personally I find phone calls after 9pm and on Sundays a bit intrusive but that is my own thingy.

Yes, I would phone now. You have done as much as can be expected. I think I would have given her notice when she forgot to pick my child up.

Try everybody and if they say no spaces ask if they have somebody else that they recommend.

I agree with No4, before 9 & not on a Sunday (or a Bank Holiday)

Good luck

Thank you. NumberFour, i used to be called NumberSix but ppl kept thinking I was from ThePrisoner so i changed my name!

Miyazaki - risky notion giving her notice, i want to find a new CM first.

But it seems to me that you don't have a CM now?

Nothing to do with this thread - but don't you dare call yourself NumberSix again, or people will think that you and I are the same person!!

OK, the situation is this:-

CM is officially off sick with regards to her job at the school- signed off by doc in fact, though that may not be the case for next week (she was seeing doc after i called her today so i obv don't know yet). But she has offered to send her dd to pick my dd up, presumably so she stays hidden from the school. So in effect she IS working for me next week.

However, aS far as she knows I have agreed, but I am going to tell her otherwise on sunday, tell her that i'd rather wait till she was properly better & back at work. Not sure if I would need to pay her half pay for this though? (She gets zero sick pay).

So, no, I don't have a CM atm. Having spoken to my mum, though, there is only 3 weeks left till xmas and between my mum & swapping hours at work, I can have it covered (i then have 1st two weeks in jan booked off work.)

If one of these CMs can pick up from dd's school, the soonest i can get to visit them is wed afternoon. So i don't really need to mention anything to current CM till details finalised with a new CM.

Either way, I'd rather CM didn't work for me at all any more, but I suppose a couple weeks more does no harm, and wld probably be good for dd too, to say goodbye properly etc...oh i'm starting to feel a bit butterfliesy again about the thought of giving her her notice...

Would I still need to pay her months' notice if she DIDN'T work or was off sick? Can she be classed as off sick next week given that it's me who will be telling her not to have dd?

sorry my head's a bit of a mess with all this...it's probably a lot simpler than i think!

Tee hee. you know i wrote ThePrisoner with no space between the words completely automatically - i didn't mean to name you, I think you just popped out of my subconscious

I've never even seen the Prisoner!

Who's NumberFour?

Just thought I'd update and let you all know i got hold of CM yesterday morning, she has been signed off sick for another 2 weeks, and was still offering to send her daughter to pick dd up. I said no i'd rather wait till she's completely better and back at work. There's only one week after these two till xmas, so come the end of the two weeks, I'm going to tell her not to bother with the 3rd week (even if I end up having to pay her half) - hopefully i'll have given her notice by then anyway. I decided Christmas week (am working 22-24th) I def don't want dd to be with her, so she'll be with my dp/mum. I know for sure now that I don't feel comfortable at all about keeping her on, I don't think I can trust her again, so even if there's no one else and I have to use her come January, I will be keeping on looking for someone new. I don't think I can risk giving her notice without doing that first.

The ironic thing is that yesterday morning when I couldn't get hold of her (so had both her daughter & my mum due to collect dd) I was almost starting to have a panic attack myself about it. What do i explain to the school, do i allow my mum to have to go and deal with it, etc, can i leave work early to sort it?! It's the CM who's supposed to be suffering from anxiety!!

Why dont you post up the area you are in so that someone on here might be able to help? There is a no mindees thread somewhere - im useless at linking so cant help with that!

Have you tried calling the CIS? They usually have more CMs than it says on the internet so worth calling to find out and then just ringing round everybody to find out if anyone has any spaces.

You might also find some newly reg Cms who are most likely to have vacancies.

Good luck

'PS is it ok to call a potential CM in the evenings or at weekends?! blush'

I personally would never call someone on the weekend unless in an emergency - in your case as you need childcare asap I would be fine with you calling me.

Evenings during the week are probably better than during the day as I am often far too busy with the kids to be able to talk on the phone anyway. I often say I'll ring them in the evening then.

As a CM I do get calls anytime, Sat, Sunday, even at 10:30pm at night, which I am not happy about, but I am far too polite to tell them. I even ask my own family to not call me after 9p unless an emergency... beggars belief that some people just don't think.

Thanks. I'll ring round this evening.

To update, her 2 weeks off ended, I decided not to ring her myself (having sorted my mum/dp up till xmas then i'm off 2 weeks anyway) just to see if she rang me for once. She hasn't!! Shocking really.

I have found another CM, just when things were starting to look desperate, who i am seeing on thursday. Assuming i like her, etc, I can then ring current CM and hand in her notice, yay! (I would have done anyway, tho, my mum was willing to do what she could as long as i needed her to).

Is there anything I need to know about handing in notice? Given that she still seems to be off sick, and hasn't contacted me, do I need to pay her for her notice period?! (I would have been paying her half for my 2 weeks off.) Or, if she was going to be off sick anyway - i.e. unpaid - do i just not pay her?

PS just realised it's not this thread i updated about her two weeks signed off sick! Since my last post here, she was signed off for the last 2 weeks, this would be the third week...