Mumsnet members get a 10% discount from Boden (including free returns and free delivery), The White Company, sweaty Betty, Luxury Family Hotels, JoJo Maman Bebe, Siblu, GLTC, Bump to 3 (the official online shop for Grobags) and more. Click here for more info Join mumsnet here.
I need some advice please, on whether I am being reasonable or not!
Early Jan this year I received a phone call from Mum asking me to to school pick ups for her from the start of the term. I could help out, so I did. Four weeks before summer holidays started i received a text message giving me notice saying that Mum was taking time off work for the summer.
Two days before the new year started I received a call from Mum asking me if I could childmind for her again. She thought school started the very next day! But when I confirmed when she needed me to start (I had a vacancy) she realised school only started a couple of days later (!!) and that was when I would start childminding.
More often than not she is half an hour late for pick without a text warning or a phone call. Her pick up is already 6.30pm so a 7pm pick up is really late for my family as I have a 4 year old who needs to get ready for bed and a really small house where noise travels easily and LOUDLY!
I have talked to Mum about late pick ups on a number of ocassions. My DH is a bit fed up to say the least and I feel as if I am being taken for granted.
Mum works shifts so from one week to the next I do not know whether I am providing breakfast or supper. Some mornings are 7 drops off and 4pm pick up after school and other days are collection after school and 6.30 (supposedly) pick up.
I texted Mum the Sunday before term started and asked when would I be having her child. She phoned me the following morning.
I feel as if I am at her beck and call but part of me thinks that maybe she does not appreciate the fact that I need to plan things and arrange matters to accommodate her child.
I have decided to give her notice but I am worried that I am being too harsh. Her running late puts a huge strain on me and DH. I 100% understand that sometimes people are late and that unforeseen circumstances arise. But I feel that she is taking the p*ss.
WWYD????
Losing her will not break the bank. Just dent it somewhat.
I'm not a childminder but use one. I don't think you're being unreasonable and wouldn't treat my CM like that, but do wonder (as someone who used to work shifts) whether she's just used to a more chaotic lifestyle and expects everyone to be able to roll with the punches. If you're unsur whether to terminate her contract I would suggest maybe you give her one last chance and say you will need to give her notice unless she a. gives you a copy of her shift pattern 1 month in advance and b. does not pick up late (which I think is really unacceptable). My only caveat is whether she is working in health care etc. - my experience is it's often difficult to get off on time for really good reason. However, in that case maybe she needs to find alternative childcare anyway, as agree in your situation 7pm is very difficult.
Articlemming, thanks so much for your reply. I appreciate hearing a parent's perspective in some cases more than another CM (with all respect to my fellow minders!)
The problem is that I had agreed with DH that if things did not improve I would give notice. That may sound like I am doing what he asks and that is not the case. What I must do is put my family first and having 7 pm pick ups time and again has taken its toll.
I know that this Mum is going to find it difficult to get another CM to help out.
And yes, she is in healthcare .
But I feel like I need someone's permission to put me and DH and my son first!! How pathetic am I.
I think I should pluck up the courage and give notice.
My last nursery in London introduced a £10 for each ten minutes late, so half an hour would be £30. They sent a letter out to all parents saying that they were introducing this fine for all the children as there were a few that were constantly picked up late, and staff needed to finnish on time, and the nursery was not insured for children who stayed beyond their agreed time.
I dont know if this is something you could adapt to suit your particular situation.
First bit, Mum ended contract for the summer, so that she wouldn't pay retainer I suppose, but what would she have done if you had filled the vacancy?
Second, what ever the job, she has, you shut your doors at 6.30. you have told her this, she is not complying with it. The late finishes are interfering with your home.
Third, she is using you when it is convenient, which OK has been fine for you up to now.
I have learnt the hard way as a childminder that people WILL take advantage if they can... most of my parents have never though and I love working with them. But there are always those that do.
If this is affecting your home life you need to give notice, for me, family come first. You probably have a knot in your tummy every day when minding her child, not knowing how the evening will go, and it's not fair on your family, or you.
Perhaps write a letter, start charging for being late (this might clear it up immed!), tell her you are not insured for uncontracted time etc, and give it a time limit... if she continues to do things her own way, give notice.
I think again it is one of those cases of learning by your mistakes.
No, Quintetc, I stupidly do not have a fine in place. I only charge double my hourly rate after 7pm. Fat lot of good that is. Guess what one of my new policies will be!!!
Shoshe, when you put my situation as succintly (SP??) as that, it makes it all perfectly clear.
Jennipennie, on the whole I also have good relationships with my parents so this kind of thing really throughs me. Like many CMs I do not like confrontation and you are 100% right about that knot in the tummy thing. Spot on - will she be late? how late will she be? how annoyed will DH be? how much calming of the domestic waters must I AGAIN do because mum is late.
I am a parent and use a childminder and would never treat you like this.I was previously a Nanny so always treat childminders how i would like to be treated.
Its really cheeky to cancel you during the summer and not pay the retainer and its not fair to expect you to take the children until 7 - if she can't pick them up then she should get someone else to caome and take over and do the pick up.
I have decided to write Mum a letter rather than give notice at this stage. Implementing £10 per 10 min late fine (gulp) Asking for shift rota in advance Small amendment to contract unrelated to the above
Will be giving it to her this afternoon. again: gulp!
You are doing the right thing, give it another week or two then just give notice if she hasn't improved. Good luck! It's hard being assertive and putting your family first.
I am FURIOUS!! Mum told me on Monday that her child would be dropped off at 7am today. I rang her at 8am to find out what was happening.
She said she arrived home too late last night to let me know that she has to work late again tonight and she knows that she will not be here by 6.30 so someone else will be looking after her. (I had been waiting for her since 7am).
Then she queried my retainer fee for the half term. I said that it was in the contract. She said she did not think that a part time child would be charged a retainer for the holidays.
I saw at school this morning and waved. Her child waved back.
I am giving her notice. I have had enough of being used and abused.
i gave up any before and after schoolers in july. just have under 5s now. it has made such a difference to my family. when my kids leave home i may only do before and after school but at the moment this suits us all. dont let this person take you for a ride, give notice.
That's outrageous. However late she could have sent you a text (and I find it hard to accept she only knew of her shift change very late at night). It doesn't sound like the letter would have much affect anyway, and if she's querying a retainer she's bound to kick off about late fines. She sounds a pain.
ooh Number4, reading that im really annoyed for yoU!
Def give notice, write down everything matter of factly. i am giving you notice to terminate our contract and from x date will no longer be able to care for your child . An explanation of which you can find below. 1. Lack of communication regarding hours/days/dates and lateness. 2.constant/regualr lateness with no thought to myself or my own young family. 3. Inability to properly discuss and resolve any issues as these problems are still arrising regardless of my speaking to you previously. 4. Questioning of our contractual agreement - this should be done prior to signing, there for whatever is agreed, stands.
or something to that effect!
(can you see ive been here before!?)..also state how much she will pay the weeks she comes until end of contract, the days which she MUST pay it, the hours you have and the hours to which you agreed/will work too.
PinkChick, you are THE Chick! brilliant content for letter - will definitely use it and no, the kid is not here today and is not supposed to be here tomorrow.
As for next week, who the ** knows. (I do not feel comfortable saying the eff word on CM thread!)
geraldinethe etc: half way with the letter. have not heard fromk her so don't know if I must phone and post notice letter or just text and post notice letter. putting it off, i know.
i think I will phone her tonight and then post letter 1st class tomorrow. She is 2 weeks in arrears. and
well you haven't done anything wrong here, so if she is reading, maybe it will do her good to realise the stress she's caused!! Do the letter drop, I think that is fine, go, go, go!!! Good luck
Hey Number4, i would drop the letter round, i wouldnt give her a text/call as she has shown you no decency and TBH texts (o lord do i know) can be soo taken the wrong way and ATEOTD not a very profesional way to do things(but yes we all do ).
In your letter ensure you put what she owes and is now in arrears of, stating that this amouunt must be received by you no later than x date (id say wednesday of this coming week) otherwise after having sought advice from NCMA, you will begin legal action to claim this amount back from her, put in about how she signed contracts confirming she understands payments etc and state you do hope it doesnt come to this as you feel you are/have been more than reasonable and would prefer to work out the notice period in a friendly and proffesional manner as you will miss x(her LO)..the amount required until end of notice will be x amount each week, to be paid no later than the (give day of week you require payment)x of each week.
Best to stick to facts and figures, still put in your reasons, but when it comes to the money/fees, make sure there is no way she can misunderstand..good luck chick.x
Before hand, I must say that on 19 October (sunday morning) I suddenly remembered that I had not give this mum notice that I had taken 20 and 21 Oct off. I had notified all my other parents by newsletter and had reminded them but for some god forsaken reason I had not told her. She joined me (again) after my newsletter had gone out. When I called her that morning I gave her the names and number of two other minders that may be able to help as emergency cover. I later learned that she rang both of them - one could help and one not, but she did not for whatever reason take up the offer of help. She landed up not going in to work for 3 days and says that she is now up for a disciplinary enquiry because of my late notice of leave.
Anyway, phone call REALLY upset me. She said that she felt she was being treated differently to other parents and that I did not get annoyed when they were late. I told her that they ALWAYS let me know as soon as they could (this mum never did) and that it happened very rarely.
She said that clearly I do not have her child's interests at heart because I get upset when she is late. I made the mistake of telling her last time she was late that DH was annoyed about it so in the phone call she said that she did not feel that she could leave her child with me if her presence was causing a problem. I told her that the care of her child was never compromised and that all her needs were always attended to when she was late.
She could not seem to grasp that it was an inconvenience (to put it mildly) when she was late time and again because she said that she paid me for the late pick ups, which she always did. She said that it was clear to her that I did not want her child here or something to that effect and that they were being treated differently.
I felt as if I was being accused of discriminating against her and her daughter and without meaning to sound precious, it has really and truly upset me.
Anyway, I said to her that I hoped we could end this matter in an amicable way seeing that her child's interests were paramount and that we would no doubt be seeing each other at school every day.
She said I should make the settlement offer and then she finished the phone call.
There were a few more things said as the conversation went on for 15 minutes. I felt like I had to justify myself to her which is bloody stupid.
Just remembered that she said she has talked to people at work about how I have treated her and she said that they told her it was clear that I did not have her child's interests at heart. I said that it was up to her to decide what the case was: listen to people who have never met me, or make her own decision having known me since the beginning of the year and having entrusted the care of her child to me.
Pinkchick, I had not mentioned in the letter about me being fond of the child etc etc so I made sure I told her that.
Also, now she is going to use unregistered care! A friend of hers is going to look after the child. Child will not be coming to me anymore. Despite my best attempts the relationship has broken down.
Awww NumberFour [big hugs]. Im so sorry that things have ended this way.
Before the summer hols I had to deal with a woman who was always late dropping off and picking up. It was so annoying and inconvenient. She just couldnt grasp the fact that it puts your day and planning out. She eventually took her DS out of childcare. I was so . She also always quibbled about money it was so draining.
I hope you can put it all behind you. You will feel relieved that this situation has ended.
I'm sorry this ended badly number4, you sound really caring towards this mindee, and I totally understand where you are coming from in terms of late pick ups in an evening it is so stressful.
I'm sure you will find another family with a lovely mindee for you and parents who appreciate you.
I am really upset by the whole matter but I will propose a settlement amount to make it all go away. I will not write off the whole amount because doing so means giving in.
At least I will not be stressed out every afternoon wondering what time the mother will be here to fetch her child.
And I very seldoom see her at school because she more often than not drops her child off late for school
Aw Number4 i am SO sorry sh made you fel like this!..however i have found to my expense its the ones who ARE so HORRIBLE and KNOW THEY ARE that behave this way...SHE is not putting her OWN childs best interests at hewart, picking up late, disturbing routine, it has nothing to do with her WHAT you say to other parents!, you are proffesioanl enough to discuss that with THEM NOT HER!
i would communicate through letter now, again the facts!..give her 2 scenario's..number 1: she owes x amount, followed by y amount over the next x amount of weeks for her notice period (since you have not immediatly temrinated contract)..i would accept owed amount within 2 days, the rest,e ach week till end..2nd option if she decideds to not bring child back she owes X amount (owed and n notice) within 7 days otherwise you will proceed to take legal action (phrase this however you wish).
If you want to, in letter explain that her lateness and inconsiderateness resultied in many children being late/missing groups etc as well as her own child and THIS is the reason you AND your family were upset..&YOU* run a business, you love the children, however, same as she, you have to pay your bills and had you continued to mess up the days of the other children (being late, not being able to go on fna ctivivites) then you may have lost these other children as a result of her actions!..arrrrrggggggggggggggggggggggghhh.for you.xxxxxxxxx
i wouldnt write off ANYTHING chick, shes set out to intimidate and undermine you and wouldnt dream of telling O2 or whoever, actually i dont want my 12 month onctract now so i will give you a tenner to bugger off!!!..stick to your guns chick!.x
Seems like you know the kind of woman I am dealing with,PC. And you are right - accusing me of not having her child's interests at heart yet she is the one late collecting etc. The poor kid would sometimes sit here with her coat on and book bag in hand waiting "My mum is coming soon".
I will propose a settlement amount once I have thought about it because she is not bringing her child back again.
Really horrible when things go tits up like this. Oddly enough I quite liked her!!! Oh well, back to the advertising boards of Netmums....
I am expecting my first child and will be looking for a childminder. I have worked for 20 years in health and social care posts and, yes, sometimes it is tricky to get away on time. But sometimes you have to organise yourself better in order to have good timekeeping. If she is varyingly late I would be more sympathetic. But if she is 30 minutes late nearly every time I suspect she needs to negotiate some aspect of her working day. After all I assume she originally arranged 6:30 with you on the grounds that this will leave her time to get to you after completing her day's work. She needs to talk to her managers if she is having difficulty getting away on time. She ought to value you more. After all I suspect her child is the most important thing she has and she and she wants you to value her. Even if she cannot contact you from work she can at least phone and apologise as soon as she leaves work. You are not being treated well. You should be much more important to her. I am sure there are other people wanting CMs who would treat you better. I agree with others, get it all written down and keep copies of any communication you send/receive so that there can be no misinterpretation' at a later date. Part of me says dump the woman and move on. Part of me says take control, present her with clear guidelines about each area and get her to change. If she does change you will feel more confident and in control now and in the future, if she doesn't, give her notice immediately. If you decide to give her a trial run explain what you are doing and why you are doing it to your husband.
I shall be returning to shifts and have spoken to a CM and explained that even if I don't use her as much as anticipated (because of weekend work etc) that I would still pay her for the agreed amount of days each week. I don't want my child looked after by someone who is always angry with me !!
Whatever you decide remember that you and your family are the most important people in all of this. Of course her child's happiness is very important too - but it is her responsibility, and she's not taking that responsibility at the moment.
i Do unfortunatly chick!...ok so if you are prepared to take a cut, then what about what she owes plus half fees for the notice period, seeing as though mindee is not coming back?..i charge 1/2 when im on hol, so it would be like that?..but DONT undervalue YOURSELF..personally knowing what i now know i WOULDNT offer her the option to pay less, but i know sometimes you jsut want things done and dusted..good luck chick.x
Update: Letter of demand went off today by recorded delivery. I have asked for payment by 26 Nov failing which Small Claims court action will be instituted.
I saw the little girl this morning and I got a big cheery hello
good luck number four, have just caught up with this as pc has been offline, what a stressful situation. In the long run, i thin kyou will be glad you gave notice, especially if you end up having a much more reliable family to work with in their place.
im not a cm but i have dealt with people like that both in work and at home, she will move on to the nnext childcare provider and do exactly the same thing and sit and laugh about how upset you sounded with her friends, unfortunately, her dear little girl will most likely become of the same mindset. which is such a shame for you as you like to think your input has a positive effect on your mindees. the best advice i can give is not to take anything she says personally, do not let her intimidate you into settling for less that you deserve and and take heart that most parents do put their children 1st and will give their right arm for good quality childcare, such as yours. you have done nothing wrong and are well within your rights to take this to a small claims court if she doesnt pay. relax that she wont be disrupting your business or family life anymore and carry on doing the great work that you do.
I really appreciate your post,breaghsmum! Thank you.
I saw the child and mother yesterday. Little girl came bouncing up to me so we chatted a little. Mum then joined us and we exchanged rather uptight pleasantries. She asked why she had not heard from me. Turns out she had a note from Royal Mail about a recorded delivery letter to collect - must be my letter i posted to her.
I asked her if things were improving for her with respect to her working hours and she just shrugged.
I see that her child now gets dropped off and collected by child's friend's mum.
Breaghsmum, you are right. She is now disrupting some other poor family and not us anymore. I am definitely relieved.
Once the money is paid, i will treat myself to something I can keep to remind myself not to be taken for a ride again.
..also state how much she will pay the weeks she comes until end of contract, the days which she MUST pay it, the hours you have and the hours to which you agreed/will work too. 
advice from NCMA, you will begin legal action to claim this amount back from her, put in about how she signed contracts confirming she understands payments etc and state you do hope it doesnt come to this as you feel you are/have been more than reasonable and would prefer to work out the notice period in a friendly and proffesional manner as you will miss x(her LO)..the amount required until end of notice will be x amount each week, to be paid no later than the (give day of week you require payment)x of each week.
