Mumsnet Talk

Okay, so there are only two local ASCs near my daughter's school. And i have to start her in one of them in a few weeks.

Went to visit them this week.

They were roughly the same in price, but i didn't like the first one. So have decided to go with the second.

I got the contract sent out today in the post and i've just discovered they charge a retainer fee! I'm really surprised by this for ASCs actually.

They don't charge by hour. They charge by session. 3pm-6pm = £11.50, regardless of whether you pick them up at 4pm or 6pm.

£5 additional charge for up to 20 minutes late.
£7 additional charge for up to 30 minutes late.

A full day (in service day/school holiday) costs £23.

I called today to say i only require a term time place, what will the retainer charge be?

It's 50% normal rate. So £5.75. Which, over the course of a 6 week summer holiday, really adds up.

They said it was so that my child still has the option to attend the club during holidays. E.g. trips/outings etc.

This I don't get. What if i wanted to send my child one day during the holiday at her usual time 3pm-6pm, but they were away on an outing? It wouldn't be possible. Yet i'd still be expected to pay the retainer fee, or else send her for the full day, so she could go out with them, which is yet more money.

Can anyone advise whether or not this is normal re costs. Seems quite extravagant.

Also - I'm really stuck with what to do in the mornings. Come October, i'm going to be full time, so dd will be out the house 8-6 every weekday. Can only find one breakfast club, but it's part of the other ASC i went to visit which i didn't like very much. But then, it would only be for an hour a day.

Would it be too much for my dd to go to one club for breakfast, then a different one after school?

Really panicking how much this is going to cost me - especially over the summer. Tax credits won't help with costs over holidays if my dd doesn't attend the clubs during that time, will they?

Sorry for the rambling questions.

Seriously panicking!

What age is your child? If over 8 and/or low maintenance, could you use an au pair instead? Then she would be at home instead of having a long day split over 3 venues.

Thanks, Guffalo. No room for an au pair though (and don't think i'd like someone else living with us tbh).

The breakfast thing come October might not be a big dilemma though. There's a chance my mum can have her.

It's just the cost i'm reeling at for ASC. I've heard people say their's is around £5, so was really surprised by all of these fees.

What about a childminder?

Thanks, Nick.

I've checked costs for CMs before and after school, and they're roughly the same as ASCs.

My preference is the ASC because i know they'll always be open (whereas a CM could get sick/take holidays etc), and several of my dd's friends go to this club she'll be starting - which is great.

I may have to consider a CM though if my mum can't manage the morning drop offs to school in October.

I never paid a holiday retainer at ASC but when i handed in notice to leave at the end of summer term i had to pay all of Septembers fee as notice as the school holidays didnt count as the 4 weeks notice so they got me that way instead!

Our ASC is £9.50 per child from 3:15-6pm. This includes them being picked up and driven fro school to ASC.
If we want to use them during the school hols, it will be £60 per day for the pair of them, 8am-6pm which will include 3 meals and any off site outing. No retainers at all though.

I think the charges for the after-school club sound reasonable, I pay £11 per session from 3pm - 5.30pm. The late fees are steep, they strike me as more in line with nursery charges (I have to pay £11 for every 15 mins I'm late) but I suppose its there as an incentive to make sure all the children are collected on time and the ASC doesn't have to stay open with a member of staff there just to accommodate 1 parent who is running late.

I think the retainer is exceptional though - I've never heard of an ASC charging a retainer for the holidays. IMO, the families that use the holiday club are not necessarily the same families that use the ASC, and I agree at close to £30 a week, you don't want to be paying that if you're not going to use it. I would try to speak to the manager and explain that you're never going to use the holiday club and whether there is any room for negotiation.

I think its quite a big ask to do breakfast club at one place, then school, then ASC in annother place. Depends whether you think your DD will adapt to that. If your mum could drop her at school, that would be better, or maybe perhaps one of her friends might have her for breakfast? Good luck!

UM, those charges seem very steep to me but my only comparison is France where breakfast club and ASC together cost €3,50/day or €40/month, 7:45am to 6:45 pm including breakfast and afternoon snack. I actually think these frankly ridiculous charges is one of the major problems with work/life balance in the UK.

Remembering my niece and nephew's ASC, where about 30-50 children attend, a bit of basic maths would suggest that at a staffing ratio of 1:10/15 (which is what it seemed to be), a cost price per child for staffing would be only marginally above £1/hour. Of course your place should not be charging a retainer for holidays. They're just taking the piss. They are easily charging enough to offset a total lack of business during holidays, although of course they will be getting a fair number of children during holidays as well.

Here's a scenario i'm playing out in my head.

It's Easter. I've took the holidays off work. DD is bored stiff so i decide to send her to the after school club for her usual three hours anyway. I go down and they're not in, yet i've been charged the retainer fee. What do i do? Ask for money back? Or is it my own fault for not arranging it the day before?

Think i'm just going to have to suck it up and pay tbh

It'll be a full time uni course i'm starting late Sept/early Oct, which is why i'll only need term time care.

Ahhhh it's so much money!

Phoned my lovely, lovely mum for a bit of a chat panic attack and she said that she would take dd before AND after school for me when i start uni.

However, i'm really reluctant to accept this much help from her for the folowing reasons.

1) She used to watch dd full time weekdays 7am-5pm when dd was younger and i was working full time. She would always moan about it, and cause me to stress at work, feeling guilty and conseqently rush work because i was trying to get out early.

2) She and my dad go on holiday about 3-4 times a year during term time, meaning i would have to find short snippets of child care anyway.

3) She's not showing great enthusiasm about watching her, but sort of saying it as in 'if you need a last resort - choose me!'

I know that dd would much much prefer to go to her gran's than a childcare setting every day, but i just don't want to be so reliant on my mum again.

But i think these childcare costs are just taking the P.

So, so confused.

University semesters aren't the same as school holidays so you may well need holiday care for your dd too, the students that come for placements with us only have 4 weeks summer holiday and obviously no half terms.

Your DM seems to be saying what she thinks you might want her to say, but going on past experiences that doesn't sound like a great plan.

Have a close look at university semester dates and school term dates - you might be surprised at how much school holiday time you will need the out of school club for.

Ah, that's a great point, IwishIwas...

I know that my placements won't start until second year. But i also know i don't get a week off in October (but the schools do) and i will need a lot of study time, so could use the club during holidays for this occasionally.

I'm new to professional childcare settings, and really didn't prepare myself for the costs.

My mum is definitely the easiest option (and she refuses to take any money either, so is also the cheapest), but i know i couldn't tolerate that level of guilt/stress again.

If she can manage the school run in the mornings - that would be great.

For now, I'll put my dd into the ASC and just hide my groans at the cost. I'll worry about her full time placement once i get my uni timetable.

You have paid the retainer to keep your place. By only using a term-time place you have stopped someone else paying for a full-time place which would be more lucrative for the AFC. I think this is pretty standard unless council-run. Certainly where I live.

I wonder what would happen if everyone withdrew their child formally before every holiday and then re-registered them at the beginning of term. And Lee, no-one is going to be using a full-time after school place. It does what it says on the tin, an after school scheme.

I would imagine that, if you aren't prepared to pay the retainer and try the scam that duchesse suggests, you risk losing the place.

I would also think that you have to notify them in advance if you plan to use days in the holidays, too. That's only fair. They can't have the other kids confined to barracks on the offchance that you might be dropping yours off.

It sounds like this ASC is not subsidised like many others are. It's a business and it has to charge realistic fees to cover its costs.

Our ASC requests a one off registration fee. Pulling your DD out as suggested Duchesse suggests could incur more expense?

Ie it wouldn't end up being a one off charge, you could be paying it at each term.

I can understand the club charging a retainer if they are open over the holidays and could take a child who would come every day if they weren't keeping a place for yours. Do you perhaps know anyone who would use a place in the holidays only? If so, maybe the club would let you share one place between two children?

I imagine they charge a retainer because they are paying rent on their premises during the holiday periods, but cannot guarantee that they will cover those costs with holiday-only children.

I am afraid this is the nature of of privatised childcare, and why there are areas with very little ASC provision whatsoever.

OP - I really disagree with some of the posts here - an after school club is just that. If they also offer a holiday club, then thats a separate entity and just because you use the ASC in term time, it doesn't mean you should be paying for a holiday club. You don't need to "retain" your place - you're not having any time off, your DD will use the after school club every school day.

If you want to dip and out of the holiday club then that is different.

I would telephone the manager and explain that its an after school club and on what basis do you have to retain a term time place. Its not like they can offer your after school place to anyone else because there is no after school in the holidays!! It really doesn't make sense and the manager needs to explain why you have to pay that - just that its in their Ts and Cs isn't really good enough.

Wow our afterschool club is cheap compared to those prices,
No retainer fee, we can use as and when needed. Its 3 pounds from 3.15 until 4.30 and only 5.50 from 3.15 until 6.

I feel very lucky with our ASC - it's right next to school, you can make casual bookings (although ASC is £1 more if you don't have a regular place) and there's no difference with breakfast club price. The holiday part is separate so no need for a retainer. The only thing that would be good would be an hourly rate for ASC but that would really be the icing on the cake rather than something very important.

The ASC we use is £12 per child from 1530 to 1800 (including a snack such as beans on toast) with a late charge of £5 per 15 mins. Holidays are about £22 per day from 0800 to 1800, but not including food. So the standard costs seem about the same - but absolutely no retainer.

Given that the are upfront about their T&C, I don't see how complaining is going to make a difference. Eitherr you suck it up as part of the cost of using this facility, or use somewhere else

I think the retainer is steep. I pay 7.50 for after school club 3.15 to 5.30. There is no retainer and they are pretty flexible and will take dd if I am stuck and they have space on the odd day that my work pattern is different. Wouldn't a childminder be a better option?

Thanks everyone.

Arranged for them to call me again later to discuss this retainer fee again before i hand in my contract.

Cansu - don't childminders have retainer fees too?