Ok, can I have a definative answer about airbeds and fleeces?

[Fillyjonk]

Do I put the fleece on top of the airbed or underneath?

Should I really be using a plastic backed picnic rug?

I can see the argument both ways, really...

[Fillyjonk]

oh come on now, this is about camping...

[charliecat]

i put a fleece ober the top of the airbed then me then a cosy quilt. Usually snug as a bug :) Not sure if thats right or not but its the way I do it :)

[nannyme]

It is all becoming too scientifically vexing for me fj - do let me know if you get it sussed.

We all want to know what your decision was re. breadmaker and whether we can queue up at your tent for cakes??!!

D'you reckon this weather will last 'til 1st July?

Don't answer that! MIght tempt fate!!!!

[Fillyjonk]

Ah.

Shwmae, nannyme, a sut wyt ti?

[Blandmum]

You want to insulate you not the air bed. So fleace on top of the air bed, to trap warm air under you. If you want, put something under it as well, but I have never bothered TBH

Nanny me

The science!

Air is a geat insultor, but only if it is trapped. If not the warmed particles will move away from your body, taking heat energy away from you and leaving you cold.

If you trap the air, the warmed particles cannot move away from you, and the warm air acts as an insulator. This is why birds fluff up their feathers in winter..the feathers trap more air, and keep the bird war. Ditto a human and a quilted jacket.

The air in an air bed isn't trapped 'enough' IYSWIM. Putting a blanket etc on the top will trap more air. This is why bibble wrap is a good insulator!

[Fillyjonk]

ok mb i like your "bibble wrap" explaination, but whats comfusing me is that won't the air inside the airbed get cold from the ground without an insulating layer between it and the ground?

[Blandmum]

Theoreticaly it will, but in practice it doesn't seem to make that much of a difference. As long as you trap air under you that gets warm, you'll be OK. It is this layer, of trapped air, that isn't going anywhere that keeps you warm.

the same is even more true if you sleep on camp beds....we do and use a crash mat on top....full of spongy air pockets that get warm and nice and insulating.

Nice to see my y8 physics coming into some use

[Fillyjonk]

...ooops, run out of science.

[Blandmum]

heat loss happens in solids by conduction. Gases don't conduct heat well at all, but can convect the heat energy away (same is true of liquids). If you stip a gas moving (or a liquid), you stop convection....then they become a good insulator! This is how wet suits work....you warm the water and it can't get convected away IYSWIM!

[Fillyjonk]

so....cold gas is a good insulator...? That does make sense...I think...no it doesn't, it makes things more cold. you need to stop your heat passing to the cold gas...

oooh, you can really tell I'm doing a science degree, can't you?

(sings "heat can pass...by conduction and heat can pass...by radiation and heat can pass...by convection...and thats a physical law")

[Blandmum]

No, it is once the gas is heated that it acts as a good insulator. The heat energy passes from you to the gass, and because the gas is trapped further heat cannot be lost from the system by conduction or convection (well it will a bit, but you see what I mean)

To keep to your very warmest, then stopping any heat loss would be preferable, but that is never going to happen.

However trapped air is an excellent insulator since the heat energy cannot be lost via conduction (because we are dealing with a gas) and cannot be lost via convection, because the air is trapped.

Essentialy you should aim to get yourself surrounded by a layer of trapped air. Initialy this will take heat energy from you, but once warmed to your body temperature it will stay roughly the same.

I'm not teachiung this till next year, so I'm doing this out of good well!

[Surfermum]

Blimey this is getting technical.

[nannyme]

I go manner you are being you, fillyjonk?

[Fillyjonk]

Nm

please say that again

[LucyCampCat]

Do both filly, then you'll wake up roasting in the morning - that scientific stuff makes my head hurt and I've got a BSc!!

[nannyme]

It was an attempted translation of wot you sed to meee earlier !!!

[Fillyjonk]

ah yes, what did I say, sut wyt ti or similar? That is the best translation I've ever heard, I shall remember that...you will notice it was in Welsh there? I know how fond you are of Welsh famers

Hmmm...theres no harm in being nice and toasty whilst camping...

Now, fleeces or picnic blankets?

It can be cold, you know, in Cardiff

[nannyme]

Yes, totally noted the welsh there. Are you not impressed by my bilingual-ness?

Even though I could not understand my own translation, I am!

Are you sure you are actually capable of speaking welsh - I mean how long have you actually been there, 8 years is it? You may be a little rusty??

I do love the welsh - especially sheep..farmers it is just that other woman wot don't.

Mind you, I have lived with sheep myself and found them rather ticcy. Horses for courses though, eh?!

When I say lived with sheep I don't mean in the welsh way - just to be clear.


I am totally making use of an unkind and unfair stereotype for humour here which is probably just perpetuating the stereotype, but nonetheless I do realise it is an unfair and unkind stereotype like onions and french persons and do not believe that welsh people do anything silly with sheep.

I thank you

[Fillyjonk]

dunno, you seem to have great knowlege of what might be done with sheep...

[nannyme]

Oh have I pushed it too far?

I have a tendency to do that, sorry.

Don't take things too literally myself and have too thick skin and forget all peoples are not the same as me.

My apologies. I knew you were welsh you know - that is why I thought you would be so clever in sorting out this cold air science problem.

Arse-lick!

[Fillyjonk]

no no no, I'm not offended at all, I'm just curious to know more about sheep...sit down here, next to this nice pitchfork, tell me more...

(Oh god, pitchforks aside, I'm really not offended though, nm . Really. And anyway...I'm english )

[nannyme]

phewee! I was clicking refresh like the billy-o there, waiting for your response!

[Fillyjonk]

I shall try to be less caustic and more fluffy in future. look.







GOD that hurt.

[nannyme]

God, I have to fluffy myself on purpose all the time!

I am not a big user of emoticons but find I HAVE to use them or I just get in all kinds of trouble!

Sooo...I can understand how that must have hurt doing al those ...I can't compete!!!!

Crashed and trashed your thread totally, sorry!