Increasing milk supply?

[mincepies]

I know that this has been done before, but usually it's someone with a bit of a younger baby, so please just humour me asking this again!!!

My DD is 12 weeks old and I have had supply problems right from the off. I offer the breast at each feed and it's empty after about 5 mins - and if I feed for that long in the morning there's nothing for the next feed. So she gets formula - she lost a scary amount of weight when she was very little so please don't judge... And yes, I went down the whole expressing 8 times a day (including through the night) route too but could not physically do that as well as look after DD when DH went back to work when she was three weeks.

I keep reading about a supplements - have I left it too late for that? A paediatrician at the hospital told us I could take something but a breastfeeding midwife, who made me feel like a bad mother for giving formula (at the advice of three doctors - DD was really quite ill) said there wasn't.

Can anyone help? I'd still love to be able to bf more than I am!!!

Thanks in advance

[Notquitegrownup]

It sounds as if your bfing midwife wasn't the most helpful person to have met! Of course, you had to top up an ill baby, who was losing weight so drastically, unless someone was able to give you a better solution.

Someone did mention a supplement recently here, so you may get more advice on that. In the meantime, do you have anyone who can check your latch? Look out for a local breastfeeding clinic, or contact your local NCT . Your daughter may be latched on, without being in the best possible postion. The better the latch, the more milk she will get and the more you will produce. "It's all in the latch", my bfing counsellor used to repeat several times a day!

Well done on getting so far, and best of luck.

[Pixiefish]

I have supply probles and am taking 3 fenugreek tablets 3 times a day and also a tablet that you can only get on prescription called domperidone- it's not actually for bfeeing - its for stomach issues but a side effect is that when taken and the nipples are stimulated it increases milk production. So if taken by a breastfeeding mother it will help hopefully.
Also pump to increase supply even if you're not getting any milk a the actual pumping will increase the supply. Don't pump to the detriment of the baby suckling though.

I agree that you sghould see a breastfeeing counsellor though as you could get a supplementer to give the formula through- that would also help your supply as the baby would still be suckling=increasing your supply but also getting formula

[Pixiefish]

here is the info on domperidone www.breastfeedingonline.com/domperidone.shtml

[maisiemog]

I had a pretty chequered start to bfing and did take domperidome, which did work for me, but also did a lot of feeding and offered the breast every hour and whenever my little boy demanded. He was three weeks early and weighed in at 5.5lbs, so not the smallest, but still quite a teeny boy.
As far as I know this is a supply and demand thing and the more the baby feeds, the better your supply will be. I was lucky and had excellent support from my DP, who took over all the cooking etc... and I recommend getting all the help you can and not cleaning anything that isn't actually caked in mud. Just for now at least. You are getting to the point where the feeding is less frantic, and it will become easier for you to cope with in terms of the time.
Tik Tok will know the details, but as far as I recall, when your supply is established, you make milk as your baby feeds, so even if your breasts don't feel 'full' you are still likely to be making enough milk. If you look at this link on Kellymom it says that if your milk production slows down when it is actually full, so 'keeping' milk for the next feed is a bit counterproductive. Also she will need the foremilk which comes first, to quench her thirst then after that, the creamier hindmilk, so if she doesn't feed for long enough to get both, she may get hungrier faster.
Is your little girl alert and producing wet nappies? They are better signs of the amount of milk she is getting than your breast size. Kellymom is a great site and has advice on herbal remedies such as fennel tea and that type of thing.
Is your DD feeding for five minutes at regular intervals? They become quite efficient and go from feeding for ages to relatively short periods, so If you let your LO feed as much as possible and for as long as she likes she should be able to your supply up to where she needs it.
Best of luck with it.
I know how stressful this is, so please congratulate yourself on everything you are doing to give your little girl a great start.

[mincepies]

Thanks all - I'm just still feeling so guilty that I haven't managed to get going. I don't really get much help from anyone, so it's been really very difficult for me. My mum thinks it's odd that I've been having difficulties (she bf me with no trouble at all, and instead of being supportive, her only comment has been "I just don't get it") and my mil thinks it's odd I'm bothering at all!

I offer the breast with every feed, and i know she gets something.

Thanks again

[tiktok]

mincepies, supplements can't harm your supply, but nothing will work unless you also manage to increase the effective and frequent removal of milk from the breasts - please don't limit your baby's time and frequency on the breasts to 'save it up', as this will do exactly the opposite of what you want, and actually reduces your supply. Breasts may feel soft but they are never empty unless supply is really very low.

Offer the breast at every feed as you are doing, and make sure this is often - 8 times in 24 hours as a minimum - with both sides offered for as long as she will take, going back and forth from side to side; as she loses interest in one side, switch to the other. Try breast compression to keep her interested (google, or check archives here on MN).

No amount of herbalbor pharmaceutical supps will do much good unless these very basic things are done. It might be worth checking the latch but I suspect the most important thing with you is just feeding more often. Hope this helps

[ca3004]

I have just started talking funugreek herbal supplement to try and increase my supply, as I am finding that my DS (he is 4 weeks today) is empting my breasts quickly too. I am struggling to BF as I have flat nipples and I am still having to use breast shields, although he is latching on for a few sucks at each feed now.

Within 24 hours I noticed the difference - I am now leaking milk in the night and morning, and I am able to express more milk than before talking it - I can now express about 40 - 50 ml in one go - and this is making a great difference.

You can get these tablets from Holland and Barrett.

Have you tried the NCT breastfeeding helpline = they were a good support to me.

Can your health visitor suggest any breastfeeding classes in your area?

Good luck and keep with it.

[determination]

Here are a whole bunch of thing you can take to increase your milk supply - they are all herbal and most contain Fenugreek, fennel, blessed thistle, goats rue, nettle. These are all herbs known for increasing breast milk supply

[maisiemog]

Oh it is so tiring having a newborn, I really do feel for you! If it is any consolation, it took me 12 weeks to get my little boy completely onto the breast and off formula. He was very jaundiced and I had to express and feed him and the hospital introduced formula because they were worried about him.
He didn't latch on until 6 days and was very hit and miss then.
For the first 12 weeks, I used to offer the breast and feed both sides with breast compression him and then express (very boring) and then top-up with the expressed milk from the previous session and a bit of formula. Sometimes he wouldn't go on the breast at all, so I would just give him the ebm from last time and some formula if the ebm was under whatever he was supposed to have (can't remember the number of mls).
It is so horrible though, because you don't want them to lose weight and go hungry, but if you top up too much with formula they won't be hungry enough to take from you and increase your supply.
Sorry a bit of a ramble, but I remember crying at least once a day.
I am sorry you aren't getting the support you need from your DM and MIL, perhaps you could tell your mum that her response isn't helping you and makes you feel like a failure, she might make a bit more of an effort to rally round.
Definitely phone a counsellor and if you can get to a bf group, perhaps at your maternity hospital go and get the help.
It is difficult, but if you can be as bloody minded as possible and think 'there is no way I am giving up! I will cut out the formula!' it helped me to get through that very difficult, emotional time.
What happened with me and my ds was that gradually, I reduced the amount of formula after feeds until he wasn't having any after any feeds at 12 weeks.
You can do it! Hugs to you and your DD!

[determination]

Here are the numbers for the lines;

The Breastfeeding Network (BFN) - Supporter Line 0870 900 8787 - The service operates from 9.30am to 9.30pm every day of the year.

La Leche League Great Britain - 0845 120 2918

National Childbirth Trust - 0870 444 8708 - 9am to 6pm, seven days a week.

Association of Breastfeeding Mothers' - 0870 401 7711 - Open every day from 9.30am to 10.30pm

Hang in there, it will get easier. With my dd1 i too was led into a viscious circle of supplementing after my supply had decreased following 4 spouts of mastitis and we ended up experience nipple confusion at its best. dd1 hated the breast so much that she would not allow me to hold her in the cradle position even when NOT trying to feed her. With shere determination and patience i managed to get her back to the breast for good and ditched the bottles.

I would honestly, consider ditching the bottles and feed, feed, feed, feed your supply will increase within 1 - 2 days as long as your dd stimulates your breasts enough. Get a herbal tincture if it puts your mind at rest. YOU WILL produce enough milk though.

If your body was good enough to make your dd it is also good enough to make the milk for your dd Believe in your body

Well done for carrying on, it will definately pay off...

[maisiemog]

Hear hear! You can do it Mincepies!

[redadmiral]

I took domperidone and got it on prescription from my sympathetic gp when I showed her the documentation. When I was using it, hoxever,(3 years ago) you could buy it over the counter too. Can't remember the trade name, but Googling may bring it up. Afraid I can't really say whether it worked for me, as I think problems with 2nd child may have been reflux related.

[maisiemog]

The trade name is motilium and you can buy about 6 or 8 in a pack. They will only sell one pack at a time, so it's a bit of a faff.