9w bf baby not putting on weight

[milktraylady]

Hi can you please advise me if there is anything else I can do to increase my milk supply?

DD is 9wks old (10w tomorrow) 5oz formula at midnight each night, sleeps til 5am ish most nights.

Other than that she's bf.

But here's the problem- she's been 4kg for 4 weeks at her weigh ins. She's gone down the centile chart from 50th to 2nd. She is 91st for length.
(I was a skinny baby too)

All HVs say she is too light & we need to top up more formula in the day.

But I don't want to - I didn't want to ff at all, (only doing midnight feed for my sanity as I can't survive on less than 4 hrs sleep) plus my milk should be enough right?

I spoke to la leche league lady who reckoned I wasn't feeding often enough. So for the last week I upped the feeds to every 2 hours. Still no weight gain

I am eating ok, drinking lots of water. Taking vitamin tablets. Started fenugreek yesterday (found this on Kelly mom website) in case this works to increase my supply.

So my question is- is there anything else I can do to increase my milk supply?
Or do I have to top up?

(Not sure if its relevant but I have been getting lots of blocked ducts, taking lecithin & more water & this is working)

I am really upset that my body can't make enough milk, is it a myth that everyone can bf? If there is ANYTHING else I can do- I will!

Thanks

[DonkeysDontRideBicycles]

Someone with more recent experience than me will be along to advise. Please don't lose heart.

I assume as you are keen to bf your technique is fine but do you switch from one breast before the creamy hindmilk has had a chance to get going? The foremilk is more watery so less calorific. Maybe let her finish at one breast until she stops before switching.

Can you tell us when do you put DD down to sleep? She needs more feeding to activate your supply. (You will end up with more dirty nappies as she'll poo more but that's a sign she is taking on board what she needs and gaining weight).

If you settle her around 10pm she could sleep through to at least 2 am, then have a feed, then go back down until at least 5 am and have more milk. she get at least 9 feeds in 24 hours plus a good spell of sleep either side of midnight. etween

[DonkeysDontRideBicycles]

Oops sorry for random final word - on phone very cack-handed at editing

[milktraylady]

Thanks if I feed at 10 she wakes at 12 then again at 4.
The last 3 days I've fed her nearly every hour to increase the supply, but she still seems to be hungry.

Yes I finish one side then swap to the other so she's getting plenty of hind milk.

I have her formula yesterday afternoon as well as all the bf 7oz.
There's no way I have that much spare in me!

Gutted that I can't make enough milk.

[sarahbanshee]

The more you feed her, the more milk you will have - the best way to up your supply is to feed as that signals your body to make more milk. I'm afraid though that if you are not breastfeeding at all in the night then that will be decreasing your supply a lot, as in the early days going as long as 6-8 hours without feeding is a long time and a signal to your body to make less milk.

Can you try a 'babymoon' - stay in bed for 24-48 hours with your baby, feeding every time she will take it, no formula, and sleeping in between? That will likely make a big difference to your supply. Fenugreek is good, as are oats, and keeping well hydrated and well nourished will certainly make you feel better, but in the end the most reliable way to up supply is to feed more often.

[milktraylady]

Yup did the baby moon thing for 2 days.
We have never got 6-8 hours sleep! 4 max. If I get less than this I can't function.

No one told me bf might not work. This is shit.

[MigGril]

Sorry just to clarify a few things. You've been giving a bottle at 12pm and baby is sleeping until 5am? Are you expressing at 12pm?

Many mums can introduce a bottle and still breastfeed but night feeds are important for supply. So not doing these feeds can often have a big impact.
The hindmilk thing is a bit of a distraction really. As Long as baby comes of each side of there own accord then that's fine. As well as feeding more often you could try switch feeding. Offer both sides each feed then offer the first side again keep switching sides until baby has had enough. This is a great way of upping supply. Remember breats are never empty most milk is made during a feed and the more milk removed from the breast the more you'll make.

A drop that much is quit concerning, has your HV referred you to a pedatriation? They should have and if not ask for a referral. As this may not be a milk issues but a health issue. Is your baby happy and meeting milestones regardless of the weight issue?

[milktraylady]

Thanks Mig- I am feeding her bf at 10pm to 11. Then she is asleep & when she wakes next my husband gives her 5ish oz.
before we started doing that I was of course feeding her but she never slept more than 2 hrs in a row. And after 5am doesn't really sleep again.

I have tried expressing but never get more than 1/4 oz.

[milktraylady]

The switching thing yes I've been doing that & always letting her finish the feed.

Paed referral- HV coming tomorrow to check in detail what I am doing wrong with bf. yes she is meeting all development milestones, growing longer. I was a skinny baby too.

[DeathMetalMum]

I think at 9weeks shes is unlikley to be feeding every 'x' number of hours both of mine certainly were not they would be feeding lots whenever they made any sign of being hungry/not happy. They could feed for 90 minutes have a little sleep feed for another 90 minutes then a slightly bigger sleep and so on throughout the day. Both went for quite long periods overnight quite early.

I would be putting baby to the breast at any grumble as this will stimulate your supply, try and ignore the 'clock' if she seems hungry feed, she will drop into a more predictable feeding schedule eventually.

[Tweak32]

I had exactly the same situation, it was really upsetting as felt like no matter what i did my ds kept dropping down the centiles.
We gave one bottle of formula a day, he would also have a feed from me straight after if he could but i dont think it was a case of him actually wanting more milk, just a comfort suck so he could fall asleep. I did find that switch feeding helped a bit although it was quite hard going as it meant feeds went on for ages! To be honest though we just perservered and it slowly worked out ok.
I know its hard when there isnt one specific answer but 9 weeks is still so young and you are both figuring it all out. Give it time, maybe try feeding around 3am so you get an extra feed in during the night but still around 4 hours rest after the 10pm one (get dp/dh to do bottle at midnight). Is she smiling and alert otherwise as thats a good sign of health. Easier said than done but worrying is not good for your supply either so if an extra bottle means you can keep bf'ing the rest of the time, at least til she starts gaining weight, and you are both happier then maybe its not such a bad option. Good luck, I know how shit it can feel but it does get better!

[milktraylady]

Thanks tweak you have given me hope!

[milktraylady]

Thanks too dmm, I think I was trying to get a routine way too early.
Any squeak and she's bf now!

[FannyFifer]

So she is not losing weight at the moment?

DD often stayed the same weight for a few weeks, I went with the as long as she is peeing, pooing and happy then she's fine.

She was and still is just a petite wee thing, although she was quite heavy when born (8lb8oz) and up in top centiles she then dropped and sat around 2nd centile till she was about 2.

My health visitor wasn't worried about this as she wasn't losing weight just gained slowly.

[milktraylady]

And yes yes yes to smiling & alert!
She has been alert since she was born & lifted her head when she was put in my tummy & looked at me!
Started bobbing her head & latched on!

Every single person who meets her says how alert she is. Lots of smiles, found her hands, very interactive, loves the bath.

So I'm not worried about her development, it's just she's too skinny & hasn't actually put on any weight in weeks.

Extra ff in the day is bound to put weight on. I just don't want to give up bf completely. Hopefully we can find a middle way

[milktraylady]

Xpost with fannyf
Yes she's not losing weight, but not putting it on. Is getting longer though.

2nd centile weight 91 for height.
So even if she stays on 2nd for weight I would be happy, as long as she's gaining weight.

[SpanielFace]

DS was born on the 50th centile and dropped to the 0.4th centile (and, eventually, below it). His problem turned out to be a tongue tie. I fed on demand, roughly every 2-3 hours, including overnight, he cluster fed in the evenings, and yet he still failed to gain weight. But I had no pain, none of the classic tongue tie signs. Has anyone checked for this? It might be worth seeing a lactation consultant, it can be easily missed. It's so demoralising isn't it?

[DonkeysDontRideBicycles]

See what HV says. It is a shame you are feeling disappointed but you're certainly not letting DD down.

You mention blocked ducts, I wonder if your baby is latching on fully. Have you consulted a La Leche advisor face to face?

[milktraylady]

I've got a HV coming tomorrow to check the bf situation.
I will definitely ask about tongue tie- thanks!

And I'm going to la leche league meeting on Thursday so will ask them too.

I did ask in hospital for her to be checked- after reading a lot of people having tt problems on mumsnet.
Was told no she's fine.

[TeaMakesItAllPossible]

My DS was born on the 50th for weight and 75th for height. He did the same as your DD - over the first four months he didn't have steady gains and fell to 2nd percentile. He's now 11 and on the 2nd for weight and 97th for height.

With hindsight, and other DSs under my belt, it was a combination of two things. He was moving to his genetic build -tall and very thin. He is also an endomorph body type. He immediately burns energy so gets hungry very suddenly and needs a huge amount of food to put on weight. He now eats twice the amount I do but still can't put on weight.

I'm really sorry you're experiencing this too. It's a tough gig, especially as bfing benefits are universally discussed and it seems to be so easy to do until you get there. You are doing great though.

Get tongue tied checked out. Try a craniopath. Have the meeting with the HV. All i'm saying is that your baby is alert and you should trust your instinct rather than go on the HVs concerns.

Make the right decision for you - giving more formula if you want but carry on EBFing if that's what you want.

I EBF and introduced some solids at 15 weeks but I'm an old gimmer and that was what was recommended then.

[crikeybadger]

Is there anyone else who knows about breastfeeding that you can talk to? Someone at a bf ing group or on one of the helplines?

Any HV who only suggests giving more formula without doing a proper breast feeding assessment is clearly lacking.

Tongue tie and poor attachment are definitely worth investigating regarding the blocked ducts.

Hope you get some help

[crikeybadger]

Duh, just seen you are going to Lll group- they usually v knowledgeable.

[crikeybadger]

Oh and one more thing.... You don't need to overdo the water....just drink to thirst. Sometimes drinking gallons of water can negatively affect supply.

I'll be quiet now

[tumbletumble]

My DS1 was born on 75th percentile and gradually fell to the 25th percentile (while staying at 91st for height). I agree that he was settling into the body shape that was right for him. My DH is tall and skinny. I persevered with bf and did not introduce formula. He's now a healthy 7 year old - still tall and skinny!

Try not to stress about it - I know that's easier said than done! I have 3 DC and the other two followed a similar pattern, but I was much more relaxed about it by then.

[milktraylady]

Thanks you have all made me feel more confident.
My mum says I was like this but didn't get freaked out as I was her 3rd & knew what she was doing.
Plus one of my sisters was a dentist (fribro now unfortunately) so I am facetiming her today to see if she can see a tongue tie.

Can the HV force you to top up with formula?

[StuntNun]

I would offer the breast as often as you can, you could express milk after feeds to stimulate your supply and give that instead of the formula. If you want to increase your supply then feeding (or expressing) between 2 and 5 a.m. would help due to the breastfeeding hormones being at their highest then. One of the women on my birth club had her DH giving a night bottle so that she could sleep and her milk supply dropped disastrously. Also dropping percentiles can be normal, sometimes a baby has to find their own percentile. My DS1 dropped from the 50th to the 2nd but then he stayed on the 2nd consistently from then on.