Bootcamp Week 5 - Ha Ha Ha Ha Ha Staying Alive - chat here!

(420 Posts)
BIWItheBold Sun 13-May-12 10:26:12

Welcome to week 5 - how time flies when you're having fun!

Those of us who have been here since the beginning may be finding the going tough now. You may have found that your weight loss has stopped, or you may even have put weight on <looks at self>

But hopefully you will also be enjoying the food now, and settling into this as a new way of eating. You may also have discovered the other benefits of low carbing - not being hungry, having better skin, sleeping better, fewer problems with conditions such as IBS or even asthma, fewer hot flushes (for those of us of a certain age grin) etc.

A month in, whilst you should be more used to eating like this, you will also have discovered that it's not always possible to follow a strict low carb plan because Real Life has an irritating habit of getting in the way.

But that's an important lesson for us all to learn. There are two key things here:

First, it demonstrates very clearly that you have to plan what food you buy and how you're going to eat. For example, I do quite a bit of travelling for work - going to meetings by train all over the country and sometimes abroad. If I don't plan my meals, then I will end up eating something like a sandwich because that's all that is available. I went to a meeting on Friday where the client very kindly suggested that she order lunch for us. I knew that if I didn't say I was low carbing, then we would sit down to a plate of sandwiches. It feels awkward to have to ask for special food. But - if you had a medical condition that meant you couldn't eat wheat, there would be no issue with such a request, would there?

Dieting is often seen as a trivial issue, and we think it's silly to have to ask for special/different food. But think of the impact/implications of being overweight. High blood pressure, diabetes, heart disease, etc etc. None of these is trivial.

So in these situations, plan ahead and ask for something that suits you.

If you're travelling - eat properly before you set off. Get to know what shops are available at any station you're travelling through - there are an increasing number of M&S Food shops at railway stations and service stations, where you can always buy cooked meats/fish, small portions of cheese and salads (there are one or two without pasta/rice/noodles/potatoes!)

Second, despite your best efforts, sometimes life seems determined to sabotage things. Even if you ask people to cater for you, few people really understand what a low carb diet is. This has happened to me twice since Friday! My client very kindly ordered me a salad for my lunch. I was provided with a bowl of lettuce - with no dressing. Presumably whoever made it was thinking "this person is on a diet, therefore it must have to be fat-free". On top of the lettuce was sweetcorn (one of the carbiest veg there is), a dollop of coleslaw - presumably with sugar in it, like most is - a huge mound of grated carrot, some sliced cooked chicken, cucumber and tomato.

At least I could eat the chicken! But it was very dry and so to make it palatable, easy to eat, I ended up eating more of the coleslaw than I intended. I also was in the embarrassing situation of having to leave a lot of the lunch that I had specially ordered.

And last night, at dinner with friends, I had again plucked up courage to tell them of my low carbing. Despite being reassured that the meal would be low carb-friendly, it was anything but. And it was (mostly) served plated up, so to not eat it was to have been very rude. And it was delicious, and I was hungry ... smile

But this is life. We have to get through these kind of occasions and accept that they may throw us off course briefly, but that this is a longer term process we are involved in. To use a horrible cliche, we are all on a journey here.

So if it happens to you - just accept it. Don't obsess about it. Avoid the scales for a while, and make sure you are super good for the following days. Don't use it as an excuse to jump off the wagon, for that way, surely, fatness lies!

Come and tell me how you're all getting along. How has life changed for you since we set off on this journey?!

doradoo Sun 13-May-12 12:12:22

WOW Biwi you know how to keep us going......

My week 4 was not good - not put anything on but not lost anything either - and I have to confess to being very, very bad - far too many chocolate and biscuity things in the house following DS2's birthday.

I'm fairly well entrenched in the WOE now and am enjoying it - though think I'm not in ketosis at the mo due to the above.... DH is struggling with lunches for work though as he 'doesn't DO salad' so not sure what to take as he doesn't always get a break to get to the canteen.

Still am feeling healthier and enjoying the food - it suits me soooooo much better than a traditional 'low-fat' diet - love the butter/cream/mayo/fatty meat - all my thing so will definitely be carrying on.

No bread/pasta/potaoes/rice have passed my lips since bootcamp started - and although I'm only 4lbs down I feel so much better and have definitely lost inches.

So I'll raise a glass of wine (yes I know but can;t give up everything.....) and say thank you so much for your hard work in keeping it all going - and here's to some more success!

Ilovemyteddy Sun 13-May-12 14:12:33

Week 5 already! Well it's the end of week 17 for me and as of this morning I am down 37.4lb. So I'm pleased, as my target was 2lb a week when I started this, and I'm only 1.1lb away from being halfway in my mission to lose 77lb.

I've been trying to set myself mini-targets, but get frustrated when I fail to reach them. So, from now on, every pound off, however long it takes, is going to be a pound nearer to my ultimate goal, however long that takes!

Sometimes it all seems a bit of a faff, and there's a lot of effort and organisation involved in this WOE; but I know that I'm eating good food, am rarely hungry, and it is working - just slooooowly grin

I'm definitely losing inches though as I have a pair of Fat Face trousers that fit me better than they did three years ago when I was 9lb lighter than I am now. Woohoo!

2bayumimum Sun 13-May-12 14:22:08

Well its Day 1 Week 1 for me, so looking forward to when I too can say Week 5. Loving all your advice and support BiWi, its your enthusiasm for this WOE that has given me the incentive to try it. One question, Total Yoghurt, am I allowed this on the two week strict version of Bootcamp ? Also could you point me to where I can find details of Bootcamp Lite, as would like to have the encouragement infront of me, of what I can add in, after the intial two weeks ? Thanks. Good luck everyone x

BIWItheBold Sun 13-May-12 14:29:40

Welcome, 2bay!

You can have Total yoghurt - just go easy with it. Some people find that dairy can impede their weight loss (although I have read in Dr John Briffa's books that yoghurt is better tolerated).

This thread has the Bootcamp Light rules - just scroll down a bit from the start

And good luck! I'll be setting up a weigh-in thread as well, so you can post your official start weight tomorrow.

Ilovemyteddy Sun 13-May-12 14:40:37

BIWI can I ask what is the difference between dairy and fat? (It's probably obvious, but not to me!)

I stopped eating yoghurt because I got sick a couple of times and wondered if I'd developed an intolerance to it. I can eat soya yoghurt without any bad reaction (but should I be eating it? I include it in my daily carb allowance.)

I've just been reading some other threads on the Weightloss Board - there is an awful lot of resistance to LC-ing, isn't there? As someone who's weight has yo-yo'd for years counting calories I can't see any reason NOT to LC if you need to lose/maintain weight. Good, healthy food and lots of it -yum! But then I don't drink (much) so I'm not freaked out by the need to
drastically cut your alcohol consumption grin

BIWItheBold Sun 13-May-12 14:47:51

The thing about dairy is to do with the lactose that it contains - which is a sugar - because many people are intolerant to it. I don't know why it would impede weight loss, but I have read posts from many people asserting this, and I know myself that I can't eat cream very often.

Yoghurt is apparently usually more easily tolerated.

here's an interesting piece from Dr Briffa about dairy

And yes, 'conventional' wisdom still has it that low carbing is somehow dangerous. Although the tide is definitely turning. Increasingly doctors are recommending it, other weight loss 'systems' are becoming more about low carb, etc.

LynnCSchreiber Sun 13-May-12 15:04:08

Ok. Signing in officially.

Am going shopping now so going to have a good look at the other threads and see if I can find good stuff to eat.

2bayumimum Sun 13-May-12 15:14:25

Another quick question, having now read a load of the threads you are on BiWi ( so much brilliant info ! ), Carrots are on the list as 2.5g of carbs, but Ive read your comments where you say they are high carbs and should be avoided...or am I misunderstanding something ? Are they less carby if cooked vs raw ? Will add my details to your thread tomorrow and hope to see some encouraging results by the following very pleased that I can have a BBQ tonight, with wheat free sausages, chicken thighs and salad, just brilliant

vnmum Sun 13-May-12 15:16:18

i'm still floating about on here. still not losing anything though angry. think i need to up my fat. have been reading about paleo recently too. very interesting. it's basically low carb rules but eating clean, no processed food and you can eat any fruit and veg. fruit is in moderation though. it brings up some very valid points about how the human species didn't have all the illnesses (diabetes, cancer, heart disease etc) that we do today until they started to farm and eat grains. there is also useful info on how grains have antinutrients that stop you absorbing vitamins etc.

biwi it is very true about how life can get in the way. I have to say though, that if i am forced to eat carbs because of no other option, i feel bloated and quite ill. that is enough to make me ask for options to suit me where i can. for instance, the other day I went into a local sausage shop. I asked the assistant what percentage of meat the sausages were, thinking they would be high percent meat as made by a butcher, and she said they were about 70 - 80%. I then asked if they used any fillers like bread or wheat and she said no, that they were very healthy and that no fat came out when cooked. she also then said that they were ok for people on weight watchers or those on special diets for their heart. (there goes the old low fat thing again!).

I said I wasn't bothered about the fat content, it was the carb content I was concerned about and she then kind of did hmm and asked which we wanted.

Anyway, we bought some different types and after eating both lots, I felt bloated and ill. I think from that that I can deduce that there were carby fillers in them and I will not be buying from there again. My body has obviously got used to not eating grains anymore and doesn't like it when I do.

anyway, I will see what weigh in brings tomorrow

LynnCSchreiber Sun 13-May-12 15:24:11

Ok, first question.

I have found the recipe thread and will be using some of those ideas. What about breakfasts?

BIWItheBold Sun 13-May-12 15:31:18

2bayumimum - the different carb counts reflect young and old carrots. Old carrots are lower in carbs. However, I know not why - and I have no idea how you tell if you're buying an old or a young carrot! Therefore I always assume that the carb count will be high, just to be on the safe side.

MmeLindor - welcome! Re breakfasts - eggs will be your friend. My usual breakfast is 1 or 2 boiled eggs. Sometimes I have them poached, occasionally scrambled, or as an omelette (which I usually make with cheese and mushrooms). When I have my early start at the gym on a Wednesday or Thursday - 6.45 am! - I don't really have time to faff around cooking, so I have some yoghurt. Total full fat Greek yoghurt is lovely.

There are plenty of other things you can eat - bacon and egg, smoked salmon with scrambled egg, low carb sausages - but actually the trick is not to think of breakfast as a meal that requires special food. Sometimes I have left overs from dinner the night before. A favourite is left over pureed swede and leeks, with a fried egg on top - a bit like bubble and squeak!

LynnCSchreiber Sun 13-May-12 15:37:04

Sounds good.

I have discovered the Oopsie Rolls on the recipe thread. ARe they ok for now? I think my biggest issue will be missing bread. Although I have to admit that it will be easier here cause Mum buys cheap yukky bread.

ohforfoxsake Sun 13-May-12 15:50:07

Great OP BIWI - enjoyed reading it.

I don't really miss bread or crisps (saying that I had a pang of jealousy when I saw someone eating a sandwich yesterday). Really struggled to find anything to eat on the hoof yesterday.

Re. breakfasts - sometimes I have kippers.

5 weeks in I feel that when I have eaten a bread roll (two in total over the 5 weeks) and the cookie it is definitely not the norm anymore.

Even managing to watch the football without nervously munching my way through the contents of the fridge/cupboard/biscuit tin.

BIWItheBold Sun 13-May-12 15:56:50

Thank you, OFFS!

Mme - Oopsie rolls are, on the face of it, OK. But - they use Splenda, which we're trying to avoid. And it's a good idea to try and get used to a way of eating without a bread substitute - the idea of Bootcamp is to break the addiction/reliance on carb-heavy foods. Why not try the two weeks of Bootcamp without?

kandinskysgirl Sun 13-May-12 16:12:55

Fab I love Pesto! Another shopping question...I have had a craving for hot dogs for some reason...are they allowed?

LackaDAILYcarb Sun 13-May-12 16:21:50

Ha ha ha ha at the thread title smile
I am certainly staying alive for the time being, but having a massive flare up of my lupus symptoms.

Needless to say since getting out of hospital on Friday, and feeling like crap, my diet has been the last thing on my mind and a certain amount of comfort eating has been going on.

But...I have managed to maintain, so it's not as desperate as I thought.

Back on track tomorrow, and hopefully I'll get into the rheumy clinic for a steroid shot. Needless to say cardiology didn't get in touch with my Rheumatologist, and sent me home saying call them on Monday after (one particular registrar) lecturing me over taking drugs when not required when I asked them if they could arrange the steroids for me. If I hadn't gone to A&E, I would probably have been sorted on Friday at my own clinic. Hey ho!

I'm now worrying about work as I've already had a disciplinary meeting over the number of absences I've had recently.

LynnCSchreiber Sun 13-May-12 16:23:48

OK, will give the Oopsies a miss for now. Thanks.

MNP Sun 13-May-12 16:32:42

<signing in>

BIWItheBold Sun 13-May-12 16:33:31

Kandinskysgirl hotdogs/frankfurters probably OK, as long as you don't have them in a bun, slathered with loads of ketchup grin!

Lacka - you are having a tough time of it, aren't you? confused I hope work is OK. And good that you're maintaining.

BIWItheBold Sun 13-May-12 16:33:47

<waves at MNP>

i don't put splenda in oopsies and but they can stall me so I think (for me anyway) it's the cream cheese that's a problem

chicken pizza for supper (chicken breast baked in a spoonful of tomato sauce with grated cheddar on top) with lots of salad

re breakfast I have two eggs usually (sometimes with two rashers of bacon) - scrambled or fried with butter. i leave for work at 6am so eat this at 5.45 - I know many can't stomach food at this time but I'm used to it after several years of early starts. importantly for me, i find it really takes no longer to cook a couple of eggs than it does to make toast or porridge

RatherBeOnThePiste Sun 13-May-12 17:26:43

Checking in wine

Jacaqueen Sun 13-May-12 17:30:07

Week 5!

The scales are refusing to budge this week but I guess that is to be expected.

Not been too bad over the weekend. No alcohol but probably a bit too much dairy and not enough water.

BIWItheBold Sun 13-May-12 17:32:56
Thegoddessblossom Sun 13-May-12 17:37:57

Lunch was avocado filled with prawns and a small amount of 1000 island dressing. Had full fat total yog with blueberries for pudding.

Snacks have been a pepperami, pork far. Am majorly hungover and cannot stop eating today.

Roast chicken for tea, with courgettes, and cauliflower mash.

teaandthorazine Sun 13-May-12 17:44:10


Am just leaving work. Now have to 50 mile round trip to pick up ds from his dad's. Am knackered, starving and need a wee. And, frankly, a bloody big glass of chilled sauv...

GreenEyesAndHam Sun 13-May-12 18:12:31

Well tea was roast chicken, spring greens, broccoli, pigs in blankets and as a special small roast potato! Which tasted by the way, really sweet. And a spoonful of gravy.

smokinaces Sun 13-May-12 19:11:53

Afternoon. Is it bad to go with my weight on Saturday pre wine sabotage? I lost 1lb and was down to 10st 11.....

Mega chuffed, just bought some chinos from Asda for work. In a 10. A goddamn 10. They are snug but not tight and I can wear them no problem. I know Asda come up big - am a 12 in primark - but to be fair I tried on a 12 in new look today and they were too big (but 10s in there too small) someone last night also commented on how small I was. Mega ego boosts and made getting back on the wagon today a lot easier :-)

LynnCSchreiber Sun 13-May-12 19:20:30

Oh, well done. It is going to be good motivation for me seeing how well you are all doing.

I had shoesoles roast beef that Dad ruined in the slow cooker for dinner and made spinach and mushroom frittata kind of thing. Was yummy. I did have to defend it from Mum's attack with the fork. I was all, "OI. Go get a tattie".

Could have done with some gravy to moisten the beef, but was sure it was on the banned list.

2bayumimum Sun 13-May-12 19:21:58

I shall give carrots a miss totally for two weeks and then maybe introduce them on Bootcamp lite...thanks BiWi

mummyduff Sun 13-May-12 19:30:28

Hi All,

Lacka hope you are feeling better x

BIWI love your inspirational OP its fabgrin

Cant believe we are starting week 5, I am loving this WOE, have rediscovered food. Also I have to say in the last 4 weeks I have not eaten any bread, pasta, rice, sweet stuff or potato's and dont miss any of it, which surprised me as I really thought I would. It really helps having everyone on here keeping me on the straight &

Fingers crossed for a good weigh in tomorrow morning, I'm hoping for another pound at least.

BIWItheBold Sun 13-May-12 20:25:12


Mme - gravy is a difficult one - if it's been thickened, then it's not great (but on the other hand, if you're only having a little bit, how bad can it really be?!)

If it's called 'jus' then it's usually safe ...

LynnCSchreiber Sun 13-May-12 20:29:46

It was Bisto, BIWI. None of that fancy stuff.

Thegoddessblossom Sun 13-May-12 20:40:17

No wine. No nuts. No dark choc. Boooooring....

BIWItheBold Sun 13-May-12 20:45:55

No wine. No nuts. No dark choc.


weight loss



androbbob Sun 13-May-12 20:58:13

Hello - do you have room for a not so little one?

Been following the threads over the past few weeks and reckon this could be the way forward for me. I am diabetic (diet controlled) and trying to lose the same 3 stones since last summer, the summer before, the summer before...... you know the script! Done WW quite sucessfully before but stopped going as moved offices and classes were not easy to get to, so on the weight went.

Starting tomorrow - clean slate - WI and then to the gym.

BIWItheBold Sun 13-May-12 21:17:31

Welcome, oh little one!

Creamtea1 Sun 13-May-12 21:18:44

Checking in again after bit of absence (wisdom teeth out)
Weighed yesterday, was 10 st 0 :-) so have lost half a stone in the last month. Soooooo close to the 9's!! Will weigh in again the morning but am in fear of it being up a pound...have had lots of 'you look skinny' compliments but I still think there is a stone to go.
Online shop coming tomorrow with lots of good stuff

SharonGless Sun 13-May-12 21:21:45

Androbob welcome! Loads of room for one more and always welcome. There are links to research about LC being far better for diabetics and in fact GPs are belong sent on courses now to learn about the benefits.

Emotionally i am fucking drained but don't want to go into reasons why. Suffice to say I m hanging on by a thread.

For the first time in my 40 years I have not rewarded myself or comforted myself with food. This is a major breakthrough for me as the two have been inextricably linked.

BIWI I cannot thank you enough and everyone who posts on here. Each post represents to me a community of people who feel much like me abut food and are working towards changing our woe and eventually impove our quality of life

gothicmama Sun 13-May-12 21:28:27

BIWI I'm still here struggling as have comfort ate for about a week - well done Sharon for sticking witht this WOE I shall keep on trying I want to lose these last 7lbs

Hepsibaaah Sun 13-May-12 21:33:01

<opens deckchair, plonks self down>
still, here, still LCing, still losing (v slowly, but those numbers are decreasing)
Skin's great (for my age...), brain's clearer (again, for my age!), clothes are looser! Wore some shorts for the first time this summer today and didn't feel like a beached whale, so very positive about this

BIWI you are a star thanks for this

BIWItheBold Sun 13-May-12 21:36:49

Hepsibaah - how old are you? I'm nearly 53 and really fighting against it! Hence starting these threads, working hard to lose weight, going to the gym, etc etc.

And I so identify with feeling like a beached whale.

Hepsibaaah Sun 13-May-12 21:47:36

I'm 52 BIWI, same as you, fighting it all the way!
Think I said it way back in the first week, but I've yo-yo'd weight-wise all my adult life (heaviest was 11 stone 4lbs after my second DC) and as the years have gone by so it's got much much harder to shift the fat. I've found running fits around work and life, so doing that as well as this WOE has worked for me.

BIWItheBold Sun 13-May-12 21:55:52

I'm determined not to allow the menopause to defeat me! <deluded>

I am now 9 months since my last period, and I believe that the marker for 'achieving' the menopause (as opposed to being perimenopausal) is 12 months, so I really want to make sure I've got shot of this weight as soon as I can. 'Before' seems easier than 'after' from what I can gather.

DoUntoOtters Sun 13-May-12 22:29:22

Good evening, everyone.

I am both excited and anxious about tomorrow's weigh-in. After staying the same in week 3 and losing half a pound last week, I have been really good this week. My only slip was one chocolate button, which DS2 put in my mouth. I couldn't spit it out at him, now could I? grin

Anyway, I hope to see the numbers drop in the morning (I've stayed away from the scales all week), but if they don't, I just hope I can stick with it until the weight does start to shift.

Oh, and thanks for the Belly Pork recipe. We had it tonight and it was a big success with everyone. thanks

mummyduff Mon 14-May-12 06:33:15

Wohoo weighed in at 9st 5lb, so have lost another 1lb, a total of 11lb since the start of this WOEgrin

Weighing in on Mondays really keeps me being good over the weekend(genius idea)

Thegoddessblossom Mon 14-May-12 07:52:45

Welcome Andro/Little one! grin

Sharon sorry to hear you have been struggling. Well done for not succumbing to comfort food. Massive achievement.

Well done Mummyduff - I haven't weighed this morning - was a bit of a kerfuffle as SOMEONE who we won't name, forgot to be the tooth fairy last night for DS2's first lost tooth (oh the shame - what a useless mummy), so I had to scramble and find a pound that for some reason the tooth fairy left in the playroom. He was happy with that thank god. In my defence, he had fallen asleep in my bed, and I moved him into his and Iwas----so----hungover----i----went----to----bed----at--9

Breakfast - last night's leftover courgette and mushrooms in a 2 egg omelette. DH had meal envy again, fnar.

SharonGless Mon 14-May-12 08:08:21

Goddess, we had same palaver with DS1 first tooth on Thurs night. Tooth fairy manged to leave a pound but FORGOT TO TAKE THE TOOTH!!

Deep breaths

BIWItheBold Mon 14-May-12 08:26:45

Morning all!

Here's a really interesting article about 'Five a Day' - you may have thought this was something that the government were promoting because they genuinely believed it was good for us. But no. It turns out to be a marketing campaign, which is not even based on good science:

LittleFrieda Mon 14-May-12 08:54:24

Welcome Androbbob and Mme Lindor.

Went to two parties yesterday and managed to decline cake and all sorts of nonsense, without drawing too much attention to myself. I even declined wine in favour of water.

I'd also like to thank BIWi and everyone else for the support and advice on this thread. I started taking a multivitamin without iron a few days ago and I feel brilliant now. Not sure if the multivitamin is coincidental or not though as it may have coincided with my body becoming used to this wy of eating.

our tooth fairy was useless when i was small, always forgetting. I thought when we moved house we might get a better one but no she MOVED with us!

biwi i remember reading the same re 'super-foods' - mostly marketing label (though i'm sure they do plenty of good)

kandinskysgirl Mon 14-May-12 09:16:59

So just nibbled on a chunk of cheese, think I need to monitor my cheese consumption as it is rising.

Shopping is being delivered this evening so just need to get through the day with my limited supplies. Should be ok though.

I did have a few slip ups last week so this week I am determined to be hard core bootcamp. TBH the thought of eating pizza/bread was nicer than the reality and my tummy really didn't like it so I just need to keep that at the forefront of my mind.

MNP Mon 14-May-12 09:22:39


Am getting more bruises, think a few others mentioned that a whle ago and they are in not easily knocked places confused

BIWItheBold Mon 14-May-12 09:26:47

Bruises? I've never heard of that in association with low carbing. That might be worth getting checked out with your GP

BIWItheBold Mon 14-May-12 09:28:54
BIWItheBold Mon 14-May-12 09:37:55

And here is a thread from another site (

Bruising easily on a low-carb diet is not uncommon. (To be
fair - it's not uncommon in people who are not low-carbing,
too.) It could be caused by a number of things.

*Vitamin K deficiency. Vitamin K is crucial to clotting. If
you are not getting enough from your diet, a small bump which
might otherwise have gone unnoticed could cause enough
subcutaneous bleeding to become a noticeable bruise. Good
dietary sources of Vitamin K include kale, Swiss chard,
spinach, cabbage, broccoli, liver, canola oil, olive oil,
soybean oil.

*Vitamin C deficiency. This is very common in people who are
low-carbing, especially if they are restricting their carbs
severely. Getting only the USRDA (as found in most
multivitamins) is probably not sufficient to prevent signs of
deficiency - like bruising. Vitamin C strengthens blood vessel
walls and makes them more resistant to injury. If you have a
Vitamin C deficiency, you might also have noticed that your
gums bleed sometimes. Good sources of Vitamin C include
peppers, broccoli, tomatoes, Brussels sprouts, strawberries,
cranberries, kohlrabi, cauliflower, collard greens, cabbage,
raspberries, turnip greens, blackberries, okra, and
blueberries. If you are not getting several servings of these
foods daily, you may not be getting enough Vitamin C - even if
you are taking a daily multivitamin.

*Pain killers. Many people experience headaches when starting
low-carbing and take ibuprofen or aspirin to combat this. Both
of these can cause increased susceptibility to bruising for
days, if not weeks, after the last dose.

*Vigorous exercise. If you have recently started a new
exercise program, you may be stressing blood vessels in
unexpected places. Take note if new bruises appear a day or so
after a day of heavy exercising.

*Blood thinning foods and supplements. Vitamin E, fish oil,
garlic, ginger, and ginkgo biloba (among others) can all
cause increased bruising in some people. Taking extra Vitamin
C may help strengthen your blood vessels enough to counteract
this effect.

*Insufficient carbohydrates. This theory is controversial, but
some authorities feel that carbohydrates are necessary at some
level for normal repair and maintenance of body tissues. If
you have been unable to find another cause for your bruising,
you may consider raising your carb level a little bit.

And of course if the bruising continues, consulting with
your doctor is always a good idea just to rule out anything
more serious."

So it would suggest that you might need to look at taking supplements as well as making sure that you're eating the right veg.

vnmum Mon 14-May-12 09:52:57

morning all. a sts again for me. thats 5 weeks of no change. I have cut out cheese and cream. Maybe I am officially in a plateau but how the hell can I break it? Really don't fancy the idea of the 'fat fast' but I may get desperate enough sad

Waves to Androbbob. We know each other from an old WW thread where we found out we lived quite close to each other. androbbob I swapped to this from WW after finding I was still eating too much crap on it because I could fit it in my points. Even though I am having a stall at the moment I feel so much better on this way of eating and just don't want the crap I used to eat on WW, so despite not losing for a while I have no intention of changing the way I eat now, it makes you feel that good and I think it would be really beneficial for your diabetes.

well done to everyone who has lost this week smile

2bayumimum Mon 14-May-12 09:54:54

Can I check if there is something I should be eating to ensure Im getting enough fibre on this WOE, to ensure everything continues to, ? Read the post about bruising with interest, so going to ensure I eat brocoli and cauliflower as much as I can for these two Bootcamp weeks and then add in the recommended superfruits after that....For me not eating carbs, actually just means ( on the whole ) cutting out the rubbish I was eating ( with the exception of porridge which was a good carb, but off this now too of course ), so pretty certain low carb can't be bad for you, in the way some so called 'experts' suggest, as long as you ensure you eat enough of those things that provide the vitamins and minerals we need...

LynnCSchreiber Mon 14-May-12 10:02:47


Egg Benedict with Salmon for breakfast. It felt very extravagant, and I can see the doubt in my mother's eyes. Will make it without hollandaise next time, as it was a bit too strong for me.

Did my weigh of shame this morning and found that I am at my highest ever weight. So, if you see me slipping, you have permission to kick my arse.

I am going to Kenya in 6 weeks so want to lose as much as possible by then.

FiddleDeFat Mon 14-May-12 10:15:41

2bayumimum - the Idiot Proof Diet by India Knight recommends 1000mg of psyllium husk fibre. I've stopped taking them as I don't think they really made much difference, but they may help you to keep things moving along.

BIWItheBold Mon 14-May-12 10:35:29

The other thing to do, 2bayumimum, is to make sure you're drinking plenty of water. It really does help.

Welcome, Mme! Lovely breakfast. Your mum is just jealous. I remember when I very first started low carbing, tucking into bacon and eggs - which felt so bad after years of low calorie/low fat eating - and DH saying to me "you're never going to lose weight eating that!". It does feel like a huge leap of faith, but when you see the results it does confirm that the expression "a calorie is a calorie is a calorie" Just isn't true.

vnmum - if you've cut out cheese and cream, that's a good place to start. I know that too much of those, cream especially, causes me problems. But are you eating enough fat from other sources?

teaandthorazine Mon 14-May-12 10:47:12

My Taubes and Briffa tomes arrived over the weekend. There won't be much housework done over the next couple of days, I'll be geeking out low-carb stylee grin

Thegoddessblossom Mon 14-May-12 10:50:03

BIWI - I read that Harcombe article before. What a successful marketing ploy that has been.

"Tooth" (was actually a piece of tooth shaped tissue wrapped in a note explaining to the tooth fairy that DS2 appeared to have swallowed tooth in question and could he please have the cash anyway) and note do seem to have disappeared anyway however, despite rubbish tooth fairy not actually coming. All very strange.

Just been to gym - don't you just love WAH-ing? (Working at home grin). Seem to have broken into being able to work out on LC which is brilliant, amd even running for longer than I was before.

Feel great today, or is that just better than yesterday? Which would not be

Kenya? Wowzers, am well jel. Work related?

SharonGless Mon 14-May-12 11:09:08

B bacon an mushrooms fried in butter as on lates today.
L chicken and cauliflower cheese
D tuna mayo and big green salad

DH was supposed to be cooking tea last night but this football thing got in the way. He got fish and chips for everyone but I cooked myself chicken breast wrapped in ham with feta inside broccoli and cauliflower. How virtuous do I feel today. apart from the champagne of course

NotMostPeople Mon 14-May-12 11:10:41

Morning all, well yet again just like last weekend I went off piste yesterday. We are big Man City fans in this house and the stress during the match followed by celebrations after, resulted in me eating potatoes and cake whilst washing it down with a lot of alcohol.

I'm finding it hard, but I love being able to fit into skinny jeans, I sleep much better and overall I just feel better. So I will put the weekend behind me and carry on. I've bought the John Briffa book, so I'm hoping that reading it will keep me on the straight and narrow.

Moggiemad Mon 14-May-12 12:00:36

Good morning everyone. Moggie here, creeping in under the radar. I weighed myself on Friday and I`ve lost a pound and a half, not as much as I`d hoped but I`m now 12st 5.5, so moving in the right direction. My first goal is to see number 11 on the scales. After that, down to below 11 stone. I admit I fell off the wagon a bit last week, but I`m staying with this low-carb WOE because it works and it suits me. Sorry to be late with my post but life got in the way last week!!

vnmum Mon 14-May-12 12:07:47

BIWI probably not eating enough fat. I have been having protein shakes for breakfast and lunch for a week as these kick started me into LC when I first started so I thought they may start kick start me losing again. It seems like they haven't. They are low fat too so although i've been in my carb allowance I haven't had much fat as only eating one proper meal a day (protein and veg/salad cooked or dressed with some fat). I guess i've been eating LC and low fat and it doesn't work. Back to real food and more fat for me

FourThousandHoles Mon 14-May-12 12:44:37

Hello everyone, back on the wagon today after a week or so of eating rubbish. Hen night last weekend, followed by hangover, followed by ridiculously stressful and busy week at work, followed by Waitrose Cookery Thingy on Sat (grin) and a night in Lunnon town with dh who was at Wembley on Sat supporting the winning side so was in the mood to celebrate on Sat night grin followed by further hangover yesterday.

NMP we are a football household too - DH is a York City fan, they won the FA Trophy on Saturday and are back at Wembley this Sunday for the Conference play off final and I'm a Blackpool fan and am at Wembley on Saturday... back to London for the weekend for us then! I can't imagine how you must have felt yesterday, I was on tenterhooks and we aren't Manchester City fans. Well done to them. We'll be taking the dd's to London this weekend so not so much drinking celebrating/commiserating this time. Low carb breakfasts are of course ridiculously easy if one stays at a hotel with bacon, eggs and mushrooms on a buffet.

B - protein shake on the way to work in the car
L - rocket, chicken & parmesan cheese with caesarish dressing made from mayonnaise, double cream and a few splashes of anchovy sauce.

FourThousandHoles Mon 14-May-12 12:48:13

vnmum I add a bit of double cream to my protein shakes to get the fat level up and make it taste less powdery, I have a choc flavour one atm but find it too sweet so may just get the unflavoured version next time, fewer additives and artificial sweeteners so more BIWI low carb friendly.

BettyBathroom Mon 14-May-12 13:03:36

I feel sick! I have just made Choc Truffles - to use up the double cream and as a surprise for the dcs using our newly acquired flavourings - orange oil, lime oil, raspberry extract & maple extract...lets just say I got a bit carried away with the tasting blush - I feel awful sad - have been drinking gallons of water but really I should have stopped.

Still managed to make 30 truffles, will top the non-citrus ones with white choc & space dust and the citrus ones with milk choc & space dust to sweeten but more importantly so I'm not tempted to eat them.

BIWItheBold Mon 14-May-12 13:36:53

grin @FourThousandHoles

vnmum Mon 14-May-12 14:04:33

fourthousand I had been adding double cream at the beginning of the week but then cut it out as it didn't seem to be making any difference to weight loss. My shakes are diet whey, bodybuilding ones with added CLA, green tea extract etc. They are 8g carbs per shake though and do contain sweetners. I think the carbs come from grain source too so I think that may be the problem. They may be triggering an insulin response. Thing is DH has lost loads just by having the shakes and one evening meal of protein and veg but alas that doesn't seem to work for me. I have been checking ketostix too and have not been in ketosis all week. It has been TOTM which sometimes knocks me out but that has finished and going off carb count alone I should be back in ketosis but I'm not which is why I think something in the shakes is triggering an insulin response.

BIWItheBold Mon 14-May-12 14:17:22

Personally I would avoid them if you can, vnmum - they are high carb as well as containing artificial stuff which is banned on Bootcamp anyway!

Thegoddessblossom Mon 14-May-12 15:00:02

Lunch: Mackerel fillet, mushrooms (i'm going to turn into a shroom at this rate), spinach, and some celery with camenbert.

kandinskysgirl Mon 14-May-12 15:29:45

B: Scrambled eggs and half a tomato
L: Tuna mayo and some salad (never had tuna mayo was very yummy, I feel like I have been missing out all these years!!)
D: After the shopping arrives I will have so much food to low-carb I think it will be a difficult decision!! And its all nice, fresh, natural ingredients-I feel very wholesome.

mummyduff Mon 14-May-12 16:40:46

Afternoon all,

B: Boiled egg
L: Chicken salad
D: Roast belly of pork with green beans

oh and what feels like gallons of water grin

NotMostPeople Mon 14-May-12 16:54:15

vnmum - I was having protein shakes (sound like the same one) mixed with milk and then realised that the milk had loads of carbs. Perhaps that's where it's stopped working for you.

MNP Mon 14-May-12 18:13:06

Have only managed lunch today of belly pork and cucumber as a bad nausea day earlier. Dinner will be salmon wrapped in Parma ham and with spinach in sour cream or mayo.

The bruising threads were interesting, am taking vit c already but am taking an omega 3,6,9 so this could be a contributing factor.

MNP Mon 14-May-12 18:13:51

I have a whey shake powder, low carb made with water and cream.

Thegoddessblossom Mon 14-May-12 20:18:10

Tea: chicken and prawn salad, with dollop of coleslaw and cucumber and cherry toms. Full fat total yog with some blueberries and strawbs for pudding.

No nuts or wine. I have to confess I poured a small glass (habit is just so ingrained) took a tiny sip and poured it back. Ridiculous really.

Will report back if I succumb to the dark choc but am so stuffed it's unlikely....

BIWItheBold Mon 14-May-12 20:22:22

Good for you!

teaandthorazine Mon 14-May-12 20:52:51

Protein shake for breakfast
Couple of handfuls of nuts for lunch
Leftover moussaka, cauliflower cheese, courgettes fried in butter, steamed kale and spinach just now.

Not enough water. Definitely needed to drink more today.

The cauli cheese was made by dp and I know he used flour in the sauce. But I figure he's learning, slowly grin

Have read 100 pages of Taubes, fascinating stuff.

androbbob Mon 14-May-12 21:06:33

Evening all - thanks for all the welcomes (even if I am late to the party) and a big wave to vnmum - first day nearly over!

I have tried my best today and managed ok. A bit thwarted as went to the gym with my SIL and it was shut - the re-furbishment which was supposed to be a week, so we decided to go for a power walk instead (the gym is next to the beach). Neither of us had a jacket and it was blooming freezing, but made is walk fast and certainly blew the cobwebs away.

The water side of things is a little hard to get used to - I do drink plenty of water but not 3.5 litres as advised! I had 1 litre before going to school, took half a litre out with me and then managed another 1 litre before tea. I really need another 1 litre before bed but is not going to happen! Been to the loo loads as well!

Planned my food for the week and will keep away from the scales until Thurs.

Thegoddessblossom Mon 14-May-12 21:55:44

No dark choc!!!! [punches air]

Night night. X

NotMostPeople Mon 14-May-12 22:00:23

Well I've read the John Briffa book on my kindle today and feel reinvigorated although I have dashed down to the shops to buy 70% dark choc as he says it's ok. Suspect I may get told off by BIWI.

He says no to soya so I'll ditch the soy protein shakes.

BIWItheBold Mon 14-May-12 22:05:22

Is Dr Briffa running Bootcamp? No.

No chocolate on Bootcamp!

RatherBeOnThePiste Mon 14-May-12 22:14:52


BIWItheBold Mon 14-May-12 22:29:16

I think I may have to post the rules again just to remind people.

Be frit. Be very afrit.

SharonGless Mon 14-May-12 23:03:55

Ok made it through the day without meltdown which is a bonus.


DH had to nip to shop an hour ago to get cat food and brought back a magazine and a big fuck off bar of mint aero which is my favorite. Lovely, lovely gesture. but has he listened to nothing over the last month.

I haven't eaten any and have hidden away in a cupboard. But I know it's there...

LynnCSchreiber Mon 14-May-12 23:49:09

First (well, second really cause I kind of started yesterday) but first official boot camp day done.

It went ok. I am finding that I am drinking a lot more, not just because I have been told to but also because I am thirstier. Drunk well over 2 litres.

Had a bit of a wobble when I came home and made the kids a quick sandwich after Beavers, but ate half a slice of ham and drank some water. Snack ideas anyone?

BIWItheBold Tue 15-May-12 08:49:48

Mme - once you're in ketosis, which should take you about 2-5 days, you shouldn't be hungry.

Snacking is often a habit that we get into, with high carbohydrate eating - you really will find that you shouldn't actually need to snack, as you won't be hungry, but it's the habit that has to be changed.

That said, you will feel hunger, as it gets towards your meal times - good snacks are cooked meats, hard boiled eggs, cheese and nuts. But be careful with cheese not to eat too much of it. And nuts aren't allowed in Bootcamp!

doradoo Tue 15-May-12 08:57:15
BIWItheBold Tue 15-May-12 09:06:01

Damn. Don't make me read the Daily Fail!

MNP Tue 15-May-12 09:13:33

My acupuncturist was talking about a study that points to the low fat diet being a huge contributing factor in altziemers (sp) as the lack of brain at leaves it open to deteriation. He is all for low carb.

MNP Tue 15-May-12 09:13:53

Brain Fat

BIWItheBold Tue 15-May-12 09:16:09

Yes, Gary Taubes talks about that as well, in The Diet Delusion. Amongst other things - diabetes, high blood pressure, cancer - all related to high levels of carbohydrate.

Ilovemyteddy Tue 15-May-12 09:27:27

I think the Briffa book is great, but I think his list of allowed foods is more to maintain a healthy lifestyle than to lose weight.

I started off with his list (printed in one of the Sunday papers in the New Year) pinned to my fridge. Back then I ate things like greek yoghurt, nuts and berries; but I've had to cut these out in order to continue to lose weight.

The Harcombe article is really interesting, particularly the part which said that they did a study in 1956 comparing people eating 2000cal a day with carbs and people eating 2600cal a day with low-carbing and the low carbers lost more weight. 50+ years later and the calorie counting myth is still being perpetrated...

Oh, and because I'm very proud of this I just want to mention (again) that I had a cholesterol check about 9 weeks into LC-ing and it was 4.5 (5 is 'normal'). So eating eggs, butter, cheese and cream hasn't done me or my cholesterol any harm smile

BIWItheBold Tue 15-May-12 10:10:10

I agree with you about his diet, ilovemyteddy - I think it's great for everyday/maintenance, but won't necessarily allow you to lose weight.

I am finding myself getting increasingly angry with the way the calorie myth has been perpetuated over the last 50+ years, despite evidence to the fact that counting calories just doesn't work. And the way in which people who are overweight are told that it's because of them and their behaviour.

Yes, if you stuff your face with junk food, sweets and soft drinks you will pile on the weight and it is a way of eating that shouldn't be condoned. But when you're overweight yet do none of those things, how is that about your behaviour?

Gary Taubes book is an absolute revelation in this regard. I am so evangelical about both his and Briffa's books I think I should be taking commission!

NotMostPeople Tue 15-May-12 10:20:44

I only bought the chocolate, I haven't eaten any but I figure that if I have another weak moment at least I have a better option than the easter eggs that are still knocking around.

LittleFrieda Tue 15-May-12 11:09:53

I feel fanstastic. I had brain fog, which I thought was a feature of the perimenopause, but clearly not. I feel really sharp and on the ball. Heck. Why didn't I follow this WOE ages ago. I have a really complex work document to write later and I have already planned it in my head.

My jeans (albeit size 16 ones grin ) are loose loose loose. At what point does one buy new clothes? I would like to end up a size 12, so don't really want to splash out on interim clothes. It all feels so simple.

<<kisses BIWI>>

teaandthorazine Tue 15-May-12 11:21:09

Great stuff LF - feels good doesn't it?!

Unfortunately I've already slipped up and it's not even lunchtime. Just been round to visit a couple whose first baby I delivered at home -they've just had their second also at home (which I missed) so just had to see them and catch up. Of course they offered tea and biscuits! I only had one biscuit but god it tasted sweet, and the aftertaste is still with me now... Oh well, it was just the one, probably not too much harm done.

Feel a bit queasy now though - hardly surprising when 85% choc tastes sweet to me these days grin

LF my work clothes are hanging off me at the moment but I'm holding on for now (don't have any important meetings for a while!)

Thegoddessblossom Tue 15-May-12 13:02:17

I am having a total skive day - massage and nails done. Bliss.

I love Zoe Harcombe. My friend lost 3 stone doing her WoE.

Breakfast: 2 egg, 2 bacon, mushrooms
Lunch: steamed curly Kale, mackerel fillet, celery, coleslaw and the omnipresent mushrooms. Does that win for most random lunch ever? Delish though.

Out for curry for my Dad's birthday tonight. Can I have some suggestions about what to order please?

teaandthorazine Tue 15-May-12 13:26:15

Mmmm, love curry! Quite easy on this WOE if you can avoid the rice, naan etc. I tend to have a dry curry eg a tikka (green spice tikka with spinach, mint and coriander is yum). I guess you could go for creamy-type sauces but watch out for sugar in the sauce.

veg wise: mushroom bhaji, aubergine bhaji, sag paneer all good.

Thegoddessblossom Tue 15-May-12 13:44:25

Thanks Tea!

addition to lunch: strawbs in double cream for pud.

SharonGless Tue 15-May-12 14:49:10

Goddess how about tandoori mixed grill or chicken shashlick. Both come with salad and mint yoghurt. Enjoy envy

BIWItheBold Tue 15-May-12 14:56:52

LF - I bought two pairs of size 10 jeans at the beginning of April. I was gringringrin that I could fit into a size 10! 3 weeks later, I tried one of the pairs on - I hadn't worn them up until then - only to discover that they just didn't fit any more! Although round the waist wasn't too bad, they were all baggy round my arse - so I had to return them. The denim jeans that I have been wearing are definitely too big - I keep having to wash them and tumble dry them, so that they shrink a little bit!

I was trying not to buy anything new, but my other jeans were literally falling apart, and I had no option.

(And it feels great wearing tighter, closer-fitting clothes - even if you're not at your final target).

Thegoddess - if you tick to chicken (or lamb/prawn/fish) tikka/tandoori you can't go too far wrong. No naan, rice or poppadoms, obviously! Good side dishes are spinach bhaji (just make sure you don't order one with potato in it) and/or mushroom bhaji. Be careful with the yoghurt sauce they serve with the tikka/tandoori - it always tastes suspiciously sweet to me.

Ask if they have plain/natural yoghurt to go with it instead.

Thegoddessblossom Tue 15-May-12 15:05:27

Brilliant - thanks guys. Tikka/Tandoori all the way.

Ilovemyteddy Tue 15-May-12 15:44:30

LF I've given in to buying new clothes as my size 18s are all too big and I too want to get down to a size 12. I tried to just go for cheaper brands (Matalan etc) in this interim phase of being a 14-16, but I fell at the wayside when I 'just popped in' to Phase Eight last week and spent £££! It's such a novelty for me to go into any shop and fit into clothes that actually look good on me. I was 16st when I started this WOE but have been 18st in the recent past, and it's YEARS since I could go into 'normal' shops.

I think I like it grin

mummyduff Tue 15-May-12 16:13:01

well done Ilovemyteddy and enjoy the retail therapy, I know exactly what you mean.

Hi to all the newbies x

Work early today so breakfast was a little bit of cold pork
Lunch - chicken and bacon salad
Dinner - ???

I have had 3 people tell me today I am looking fabgrin such an incentive to keep going, I even tried on my bikini as going on a girlie holiday to Turkey at the end of June and family holiday beginning of June, it actually is looking ok. However another stone and toning to ensure it looks great. (girls im going with are all skinny minnies) smile

MNP Tue 15-May-12 17:13:33

Yeah MummyDuff.

mummyduff Tue 15-May-12 17:35:24

thanks MNP x x x

would you be able too look at what ive eaten today and tell me if its enough please

breakfast 2 chicken drumsticks as was out shopping straight after school run

lunch pork a boiled egg and salad

dinner a big rib eye steak oven roasted pepper mushrooms tomatoes and corgette with a little feta cheese.

ive also drunk 2 litres of water and now working my way through my second 2 litre bottle

BIWItheBold Tue 15-May-12 18:33:25

That looks OK - but how much fat? How did you cook your pork/steak/vegetables?

i cooked the veggies with butter in the oven and fried the steak in butter the pork was done in the oven but it was a fatty cut.

BIWItheBold Tue 15-May-12 19:02:00

Good smile

And an oily dressing on your salad, I hope?

BIWItheBold Tue 15-May-12 19:02:39

BTW - I think the poster who said it was right - you have to change your posting name! Seeing as wot you're contracting now rather than expanding!

no dressing on my salad lol will have too buy mayo tommorow smile Thanks biwi

NotMostPeople Tue 15-May-12 19:11:11

B: a couple of spoons of Greek yog with handful of blueberries.
L: cauliflower cheese from recipe thread, four cherry tomatoes.
S: spaghetti bolognaise, spaghetti for the dc's and leeks for me, which worked very well.

Small handful of macadamia nuts, couple of decaf coffees.

Livelongandprosper Tue 15-May-12 19:34:36

Went to the local pub for dinner last night, I had chicken breast with green beans. With a few crushed new potatoes. With sticky toffee pudding with caramel sauce to follow. Then lots of hot flushes afterwards. I think I heated the entire house on my own. Oh well. Back on the wagon today.

Maintaining my weight so far! <ignores last night>

SharonGless Tue 15-May-12 19:40:16

B:Had total Greek yoghurt with few rasps
L: spag Bol sauce which had loads of veggies chopped up in it with grated Parmesan
D: chicken tagine with Mediterranean roasted veg in olive oil and oregano

My SIL is really keen to join but has been conned into lighter life before and is trying that first. She will be low carbing by end of the month. wink

teaandthorazine Tue 15-May-12 19:40:54

Can I just say - cauliflower rice - OMG!

I was seriously sceptical about this, even though it's a staple of low-carb cookbooks. It just seemed a bit too weird... However, I had a half-head of cauli in the fridge and thought 'what the heck' tonight. Fried it up with garlic, five-spice, broccoli and an egg, with a dash of soy sauce - bloody GORGEOUS.

Honestly, if you've not given it a go, try it. It is a revelation and - best of all - it doesn't taste ^ of^ cauliflower grin

SharonGless Tue 15-May-12 20:07:12

So do you cook the cauli up first? I have some lingering in the fridge too

kandinskysgirl Tue 15-May-12 20:12:23

B: scrambled eggs with half a tomato
L: Ham salad
d: Paprika chicken (with skin) asparagus and green beans with butter

I had a size 16 and 18 pair of jeans arrive today-the 16 fits perfectly smile the 18's are going back..I would like to end up a 10-12 but at the moment I am happy.

All my fat seems to be on my tummy so although the weight is creeping off slowly I am definitely loosing inches which is keeping me motivated.

BerylStreep Tue 15-May-12 20:39:01

Have just had roasted butternut squash in coconut oil, chicken breasts and home-made tapenade.



teaandthorazine Tue 15-May-12 20:40:33

Sharon - you grate the cauli raw and then just stirfry it. I'll put something on the recipe thread.

teaandthorazine Tue 15-May-12 20:42:05

Beryl - where do you buy your coconut oil from? I never seem to be able to find it in the supermarket. Can you use it like any other oil?

BettyBathroom Tue 15-May-12 21:20:22

We shred our cauliflower in a food processor and then steam it in the microwave for 8 mins - very easy and goes very nicely with a take away curry!

Meals today
B - boiled egg
L - chunk of parmesan & some nuts
D - Prawn Fajitas with lots of veggies and sides but without the tortilla

Went shopping today - most things I tried on were size 10 - a few were too big and I had to shout ask the sales staff for a size 8 - I can hardly believe it!!!! I love my new shape - praise be the BIWI! grin

BIWItheBold Tue 15-May-12 22:01:33


Sainsbury's sell coconut oil - it's in a glass jar and with all the other oils - but it's hugely expensive! Around £6.95 a pop. It is lovely though, especially in oriental-type dishes.

NigellasGuest Tue 15-May-12 22:20:42

today I've had:

B: 2 scrambled eggs (with butter & cream) with some cherry tomatoes and lettuce.

L: More salad, this time with tinned mackerel, mayo and olive oil.

D: beef casserole without the potatoes.

Have been drinking the water but it's awful finding loos when you're out and about. It seems to go straight through me.

I've cut back on cheese and yogurt today, following BIWI's advice!

What I am loving is the fact that I do feel full a lot of the time. Not like before, when I would just have 3 fat free fruit yogurts in a row to try and fill a gap! I am also finding that I am having less of a craving for something sweet after a meal. I just wait a bit and it goes away (sometimes). I know that over the coming weeks at some point I am going to have a major major need for some sweet sugary carby comfort food though - probably when I'm pre-menstrual again. I hope I will be strong enough to resist.

androbbob Tue 15-May-12 22:25:45

Evening! Back from the gym and showered - did a Zumba class. Been ok today - getting a bit jittery as TOTM is due in the next day or so and is usuallu preceded by a carb fest! Had sausages today - from the butchers and had very little in the apart from meat - probably not the best choice, but shopping not coming until tomorrow.

Today I had:
B: 2 boiled eggs
L: left over chicken stir fry from last night - veggies fried in butter
T: sausages cauli mash (looks like mash but is just a load of cauli) and some fried onions
Had about 3 litres of water.

A quick question for BIWI - portion sizes? Any advice??

NigellasGuest Tue 15-May-12 22:31:28

whoops - forgot to mention the four cups of coffee with cream blush

Also, today I've bought something called arla apetina garlic and olive snack - I will have it tomorrow at some point as it looks like it passes the Bootcamp test - BIWI do you give it the thumbs up? wink

BIWItheBold Tue 15-May-12 22:36:24

NigellasGuest - I can't see the problem with those - as long as you're OK with dairy? Just check the carb count on the pack.

androbbob - the general advice with low carbing is to eat when you're hungry, and that calories don't matter - which would imply that portion sizes are up to you! That said, it would be wise to make sure that you're not eating massive portions of anything. Why are you concerned about it?

BIWItheBold Tue 15-May-12 22:42:52

What Atkins says:

"I encourage you to eat until you're satisfied. Just don't confuse being satisfied with being stuffed"

RatherBeOnThePiste Tue 15-May-12 22:49:37

Hello wine

NigellasGuest Tue 15-May-12 22:58:15

BIWI as far as I know I'm alright with dairy - it's never occured to me that I'm not.
What would the symptoms be if I'm NOT ok with dairy do you know?

BIWItheBold Tue 15-May-12 22:58:19


No wine on Bootcamp!

BIWItheBold Tue 15-May-12 22:58:42

<polishes halo>
<drinks water>

RatherBeOnThePiste Tue 15-May-12 23:00:49



BIWItheBold Tue 15-May-12 23:05:49

I managed 4.5 litres yesterday shock

RatherBeOnThePiste Tue 15-May-12 23:06:45

Bloody hell BIWI - where did you put all that?

BIWItheBold Tue 15-May-12 23:13:18

I don't know! Although mostly down the loo I suppose grin

I wasn't setting out to drink that much - I just seemed to get through it very easily. Not so much today - am just finishing my last glass before I go to bed, which will make it up to around 3.5 litres.

LynnCSchreiber Wed 16-May-12 00:24:34

I want praise.

I went out for a meal with my cousin and ordered surf and turf, but with salad instead of fries. And no wine. And I took the breadcrumbs off the prawns.

<pats self on back>

B: Spinach and mushrooms with scrambled eggs
L: um. Kind of forgot lunch
D: surf and turf with salad (and no wine)

LynnCSchreiber Wed 16-May-12 00:34:48

Oh, but a question - I ordered the salad with vinigarette - is that ok?

Mme you are positively saintly!

vinaigrette good, but sometimes people put sugar in them so I would take care

re portion sizes i find that because i'm eating full fat i am satisfied with less anyway - i'm not consciously trying to eat less but i'm not trying to fool my body with low-fat stuff

Thegoddessblossom Wed 16-May-12 08:12:49

Hi all.

Dinner last night - Reshmi kebab (patti of lamb with an egg on top); chicken tikka korai, with sag paneer and cauliflower bhaji.

No nuts, no dark choc, no poppadoms, no rice or naan, or birthday cake after. But I did have a glass of red.

B today: greek yog with strawbs.

Gonna try cauliflower rice this week.

BerylStreep Wed 16-May-12 09:03:48

Teaand I got my coconut oil in my local asian supermarket, at a fraction of the price of Sainsburys - a 500ml jar for £2.25. It is solid at room temperature, so you need to scoop it out with a spoon. A little goes quite a long way.

Actually, Asian supermarkets are fab for low carb eating - they sell massive bunches of herbs for next to nothing, those big banana shallots, the long thin aubergines, and those shiratake noodles, which so far are sitting in my cupboard waiting for inspiration.

BIWItheBold Wed 16-May-12 11:07:12

Recipe on the recipe thread for using shirataki noodles, Beryl!

Well done, MmeLindor. And yes, vinaigrette is postively encouraged - ask for it to be just oil and vinegar though. If in any doubt, ask for it on the side. Pre-prepared dressings often use sugar. And avoid balsamic vinegar as it is way too carby.

LynnCSchreiber Wed 16-May-12 11:17:44

Thanks smile

B: fried egg with mushrooms and salmon
L: broccoli soup
D: low carb lasagne

My mother looked on enviously today, as I ate my salmon and eggs and expressed interest in joining me. Particularly when I told her that I have already lost 1.5kg since Monday.

Had a bit of pain in my legs last night, but seems to be ok today. Other than that feeling pretty good. I am noticing that I sometimes don't actually need a proper lunch cause I am still full from breakfast.

LynnCSchreiber Wed 16-May-12 11:20:10

XP BIWI. That is good.

I reckoned that the slight risk of something being in the vinaigrette was negated by the resistance to the chips smile

MNP Wed 16-May-12 12:33:31


I got some coconut oil and coconut flour from Holland and Barrett, ouch at cost but no Asian supermarkets nearby.

B:water, meds
L:water, salmon wrapped in panchetta and asparagus in butter
D:water, cod wrapped in pancetta with broccoli in butter

Why oh why do the add colourings to supplements, I take a B complex three times a week and it is soo yellow so is morning widely and as for #2's they look hazardous ;)

MNP Wed 16-May-12 12:34:23


I got some coconut oil and coconut flour from Holland and Barrett, ouch at cost but no Asian supermarkets nearby.

B:water, meds
L:water, salmon wrapped in panchetta and asparagus in butter
D:water, cod wrapped in pancetta with broccoli in butter

Why oh why do they add colourings to supplements, I take a B complex three times a week and it is soo yellow, so is morning widdle and as for #2's they look positively hazardous ;)

MNP Wed 16-May-12 12:34:33


BIWItheBold Wed 16-May-12 12:40:32

It's the vitamin B that's doing that - not any added colour!

A couple of observations - pancetta is a processed, very salty meat - having it for two meals in one day is a bit much!

And why no breakfast? <stern face>

RatherBeOnThePiste Wed 16-May-12 13:14:25

Am back to getting cramp <whimper> in my calf muscles at night. I no likey, what should I be taking again?

BIWItheBold Wed 16-May-12 13:25:05

Potassium, magnesium, calcium - and salt
If you're drinking a lot of water, you can also need a bit more salt.

QueenStromba Wed 16-May-12 13:39:57

I take some of this electrolyte powder when I get a bit crampy or just feel like I'm lacking a bit in salt. You know the feeling when sometimes drinking water doesn't make you feel any less dehydrated? That's lack of salt. I usually take it once or twice a week with one of those fizzy vitamin C and zinc tablets.

RatherBeOnThePiste Wed 16-May-12 13:44:43

I really am sloshing, and I do get that feeling of being thirsty too which always seems bonkers.

I just hate that feeling when you stretch out in bed and it starts to go into cramp.

I need to find some supplements or electrolyte stuff.

Lunchtime though now which is a happy thought!

teaandthorazine Wed 16-May-12 13:49:40

B - protein shake with flax, vits, water
L - 3 eggs, scrambled with butter and cream, smoked salmon, cucumber, water
D - will be bacon cheeseburgers with coleslaw and salad for me; dp and ds will have theirs with buns! And, of course, more water.

Maybe a glass of red wine and a bit of dark choc tonight, but only if I really feel like it.

I simply cannot understand why people persist in eating low-fat, low-cal when this WOE exists!

teaandthorazine Wed 16-May-12 13:51:24

And thanks for the suggestions re: coconut oil, will search it out. Asked in Waitrose this morning but it was a no, just about 75 different types of extra virgin olive oil!

Jacaqueen Wed 16-May-12 13:57:52

Just had lunch of chicken and bacon salad with mayo and a little tiny bit of sundried tomato.

I had breakfast (eggs and butter) at 8am and I wasn't even that hungry when I ate at 1.30.

Dinner will be pan fried salmon with roast broccoli.

Not being hungry is one of the best things about this.

MNP Wed 16-May-12 14:10:52

Tis only 1 slice each time instead of 2 like I normally would use.

Tummy whirling and water refluxing hence no brekkie.

Added a few strips of yellow pepper to lunch s needed eating up and a little our cream as salmon cooked a little to long.

Thegoddessblossom Wed 16-May-12 14:23:48

Lunch: 3 egg omelette with mushrooms (obviously) and smoked salmon, and a mountain of curly Kale.

Snack: pepperami

1.5 litres water so far.

LynnCSchreiber Wed 16-May-12 15:50:55

Coleslaw and mayo - is that for after the two weeks? I looked at mayo, but it quite a lot of carbs.

Olives are good for bootcamp? I love olives.

MsRinky Wed 16-May-12 16:07:59

Mayo varies but you can easily buy stuff with hardly any carbs at all - it is after all essentially egg yolks and oil. Olives are fine.

I make my own coleslaw - no carrots. Usually use cabbage, celery, shallots. Occasionally a bit of green pepper.

BIWItheBold Wed 16-May-12 16:13:51

Sainsbury's French Mayo is reasonably low in carbs. They also sell a brand (can't remember the name, sorry) which is virtually zero carbs. Hellman's is higher, and M&S ones are shockingly carby.

Or you could make your own - it's really easy!

vnmum Wed 16-May-12 16:25:41

Had an issue with DS school today. We are trying to move both DC onto a lower carb woe, especially reducing processed stuff and grains. Anyway, DS normally takes in a 'trail mix' cereal bar for a snack. This has been allowed with no comments made. Fruit, fruit flakes etc are also acceptable. Today DH sent DS in with a pack of fridge raiders as a snack. I know they are processed but there is not a long list of unpronouncable ingredients. He was told by his teacher that he couldn't eat them as they were not healthy. Per 60g portion, they have 133 kcal, 12.9g protein, 2.9g carb and 7.7g fat. The cereal bar (which the school deem healthy enough to have) has per 30g bar, 123kcal, 2.1g protein, 3.4g fat and 20.1g carb! sugar in some form or other is mentioned 6 times in the ingredients list.

DH wants to take both packets in tomorrow and explain which is healthier, I want to give them a copy of Taubes to educate them but I have a feeling we would be flogging a dead horse, especially when you look at the typical 'balanced' school lunches thery serve (pizza with wedges, cottage pie with wedges followed by cookies or sponge and custard).

The typical low fat, high carb mentality strikes again and we are getting quite frustrated. grr

sorry, rant over

My head is really sore today think its because i havent had as much water as normal so now working my way a 2 litre bottle hopefully will have another litre after .

B: 2 boiled eggs
L: I was on the run so had some chicken and coffee with double cream
d: I will be having a lamb chop some king prawns in butter and garlic with salad and also roasted veg in butter

BIWItheBold Wed 16-May-12 16:38:04

I know! I was reading another thread earlier, where women are talking about 'cutting down' and calorie counting - but all being hungry and eating really carby stuff - e.g. 2 bananas as a snack after breakfast.

I really, really wanted to pounce on them and drag them over here! But I restrained myself.

Having read Briffa and Taubes, I feel like I'm seeing things through totally new eyes. This despite having been low carbing for years!

LittleFrieda Wed 16-May-12 17:27:52

I keep having the same lunch. Half and avocado with a little dinky pot of M&S prawns and mayonnaise (have checked its carb content and it's v v low). It makes a lovely lunch.

Thegoddessblossom Wed 16-May-12 17:32:40

LF - I think I am just a pig. I'd need to eat at least 2 of those to be full.... sad

BIWItheBold Wed 16-May-12 17:32:56


Just don't get bored - variety is also important to keep you on track.

2bayumimum Wed 16-May-12 17:36:21

Sorry for a very basic question, but what counts as low carbs, anything under 3g per 100g maybe ? Im a bit concerned about your comment BIWI about Hellman's Mayo being High Carbs, as just bought a large jar of it ! Checked and its 1.5g per that OK ? Also with regards to cheese, how much is it ok to eat on the 2 week bootcamp ? Am really limiting cheese currently, but wondering if I could actually be allowed more....? Reckon you should start charging us all soon BiWi for your consultations :-)

teaandthorazine Wed 16-May-12 17:49:13

Hellmann's is fine, don't worry. There are some mayos that are lower in carbs but I love Hellmann's. Just don't eat spoonfuls of it straight out of the jar grin

Am soooo with you on the irritation re: low-fat, low-cal atm. So many threads on here just make me want to barge in shout 'Oi, step AWAY from the low-fat yoghurts and muesli!'

But I don't (generally speaking...)

Schoolwise- they have it all wrong, don't they? Was slightly heartened by ds coming home today to tell me that one of his classmates gets cheese wrapped in parma ham for lunch - ds liked the idea so that's what he's having tomorrow! But they get sweets as a reward for doing well in class... drives me mad. It's not that I'm against sweets per se (part of every childhood imo) but I'd prefer they're not given as a reward! Don't even get me started on 'healthy' lunchbox rules... GRRRRRRR.

BIWItheBold Wed 16-May-12 18:22:27

This is the 0g carb mayonnaise

Sainsbury's sell it - it is expensive, but also very nice.

This is the one I buy/like It's 2.1g carbs per 100ml

And yes, Hellman's is 1.5g per 100ml - apologies - I must have been thinking about another brand smile

I know I was trying to buy some mayo in M&S recently, and was shocked by the carb counts when I checked theirs - maybe it was their OL version of Hellman's I was looking at!

2bayumimum in terms of how low/how high, it depends what you're looking at. For veg/salad, I have recommended that you should focus on those that are 3g per 100g - but it doesn't mean you can't eat any that are higher, you just need to be aware that you are eating more carbs.

If you're buying packaged goods, then anything around 3-4g carbs per 100g should be OK - but obviously it depends how much you will be consuming! With something like mayonnaise, for example, you're unlikely to be consuming 100ml in one go! Whereas it would be easy to eat that amount of yoghurt.

And with cheese, I would limit it - partly because it's dairy (and we're trying to minimise that, in case it impedes weight loss), but also because it adds a lot of extra calories. Whilst we're not calorie counting, nor do we want to add lots of unnecessary calories by snacking on cheese. Atkins limits you to 3-4oz/75-100g of cheese per day.

mummyduff Wed 16-May-12 18:34:19

Hi all,

ok today I have been so thirsty again which on week 5 I thought would tail off, I have now had 9 pints of water and still want more confused

working loads at the moment and because it exam related I dont always get breaks to eat, trying to fit meals in as and when I can.

so today was B:cheese
L:ham and cucumber
D: pork chops, sweede, green bean all dripping in butter
<runs off to visit the loo again!!!> smile

2bayumimum Wed 16-May-12 18:44:56

Thanks BiWI, brilliant re the mayo and I now know where I am on the low cards too. Plus Ive been way under the limits you've mentioned for cheese ( still in low fat mode I think ) so that's good news too. Thanks for all the great advice, its really helps ! x

BIWItheBold Wed 16-May-12 19:18:17

My pleasure!

I cant believe im not craving sweet stuff anymore i bought the kids a bag of percy pigs from m&s earlier and havent had one had a sniff of one though i would have eaten a good few by now if this where before !!

LynnCSchreiber Wed 16-May-12 19:24:44

Checked the mayo that we have - 7.1g per 100g, so a lot higher than the ones you recommended, BIWI. I presume that is because they are low-fat ones.

<adds mayo and olives to the shopping list>

What about hollandaise - just checked and it has 5.1g carbs per 100g - is that normal or a bit high? I have only been having a teaspoon on my eggs occasionally.

LynnCSchreiber Wed 16-May-12 19:25:38

Yes, and massive thanks to BIWI for doing this. Are you going to offer a MN Low Carb Academy Course?

BIWItheBold Wed 16-May-12 19:26:30


For £299 a pop, it would be a bargain, don't you think?!

Re the hollandaise - yes it's high. Can you make your own?

BIWItheBold Wed 16-May-12 19:27:35
LynnCSchreiber Wed 16-May-12 19:41:28

Delia and I are not friends.

I will ask my brother to come down and teach me.

DoUntoOtters Wed 16-May-12 19:51:57

After being good, good, good for 5 weeks, I am suddenly craving toast/bread/crumpets...any refined carbs. Please tell me this is just a blip.

Today I have had:

B: omelette/frittata made with 2 eggs, 2 rashers bacon, mushroom and left over broccoli, cooked in butter.
L: celery sticks with Philadelphia cheese, small handful of walnuts
D: salad of rocket, cucumber, avocado pear and smoked mackerel, dressed with lemon juice and olive oil

Three litres of water (and still drinking) and 3 small, black coffees.

Does this sound OK? Why am I suddenly craving?

BIWItheBold Wed 16-May-12 20:46:33

That all sounds perfect, DoUntoOtters.

No idea about the cravings, I'm afraid. Are you hungry? If so, have something to eat. Are you Bootcamping or Bootcamp Lite?

DoUntoOtters Wed 16-May-12 20:55:48

Bootcamp Lite, I suppose but not very lite, IYSWIM. I'm still being quite careful with the carbs as I've tried this before and they creep up on me really quickly.

Not hungry, but I want to eat something. Had a bit of a stressful evening with two of my three DCs. Perhaps it's that? I would normally have opened the wine or sent DH to the shop for chocolate.

BIWItheBold Wed 16-May-12 20:58:02

Do you think you have been using food as an emotional crutch in the past? Refined carbs are, somehow, very cosy/comforting! If you can get through it without giving in, you will feel very much better tomorrow. (As well as smug grin)

DoUntoOtters Wed 16-May-12 21:17:03

Not so much emotionally, but definitely to cope with tiredness.

Early night for me then. grin

BIWItheBold Wed 16-May-12 21:17:56

Night night!

MNP Wed 16-May-12 21:29:20

Evening. When I said pancetta earlier I meant Parma ham, despite having lived in Sicily in the past I still get them mixed up.

This WOE has my eating broccoli and mayo, have yet to try the avocado tho I have bought one.

NigellasGuest Wed 16-May-12 21:32:01

DoUntoOtters - could you be pre-menstrual? Google pre-menstrual food cravings - I did today because I am dreading that time, in a few weeks, when massive sweet/carb cravings will kick in. Apparently 1,000 mg Evening Primrose Oil, 100 mg vitamin B6 and 400 mg magnesium twice a day from 10 days before your period is the way forward! I might try it.

NigellasGuest Wed 16-May-12 21:34:11

And BIWI you were talking earlier about feeling like turning up on other threads and converting people to this WOE - well I am very happy indeed that you did that to my thread! thanks

NigellasGuest Wed 16-May-12 21:35:16

and Teaandthorazine aswell thanks

BIWItheBold Wed 16-May-12 21:36:51


But you were asking questions and for help! It's a bit different to just pile into another thread and insist that they follow low carbing instead of what they seem quite happy with!

GreenEyesAndHam Wed 16-May-12 21:41:12

Evening all

B- slices of ham and a nibble of cheddar
L- slice of turkey and some broccoli soup
T- beef stew with swede mash and kale

BIWItheBold Wed 16-May-12 21:42:44


2bayumimum Wed 16-May-12 21:46:43

Mme Lindor, the classic Hellmans Mayo isn't low fat, it's the original full fat version and 1.5g carbs per 100g so perfect for this Woe :-) and tastes fab !

NigellasGuest Wed 16-May-12 21:48:43

Breakfast: boiled egg and mayo (Hellman's)
mid morning: olives, garlic, feta cheese in oil (apertina snack pot thing - carbs are zero)
Lunch: tinned mackerel, lettuce, cherry tomatoes, mayo, olive oil
mid afternoon: not so good - a small pot of yogurt. but it was full fat plain Yeo.
Dinner: have not yet eaten, not hungry.. I suppose I'd better find something!

LynnCSchreiber Wed 16-May-12 21:57:12

Thanks, 2bay. Will get that.

I made your lasagne with the courgettes instead of pasta sheets, and used some left over broccoli soup with added cream to make the bechamel ersatz. It was the BEST thing I have ever tasted. Absolutely delicious.

Even the kids (who had the normal version) said that it was the best lasagne I had ever made. And they didn't even notice the leeks that were in it, which would normally be picked out and moaned about.

Next time I will make the bootcamp version for the whole family and trick them into eating courgettes. <evil laugh>

BIWItheBold Wed 16-May-12 21:58:23

Whilst Id love to take credit for it, Mme - that's not mine! But it does sound lovely.

QueenStromba Wed 16-May-12 22:14:00

Has anyone got any recipe ideas for using up mayo? I want to start making my own because I can't find any commercial mayos that aren't made with vegetable oil which is highly inflammatory and so not compatible with my view of healthy eating. My problem is that my DP doesn't like mayo and I'd normally take months to get through a jar of the stuff so I don't know how I'd eat a whole batch in 3/4 days.

londonone Wed 16-May-12 23:12:53

If you just make a one egg yolk batch it isn't that much and will keep for a week in the fridge. Only takes 5 mins to make a one egg batch, I know as I made some last night!

QueenStromba Wed 16-May-12 23:33:54

I thought it only lasted 3/4 days. It's still more mayo than I'd normally get through but I suppose I could make celeriac chips a couple of times and maybe some coleslaw. I normally just have it with tuna but I suppose I could mix it with some chicken pieces - I've got some basil olive oil which would probably be really nice with chicken.

smokinaces Thu 17-May-12 06:55:12

Struggling this week. Has taken ages to lose the water weight for my Saturday blow out and everything is so slow. Week 5 though, so to be expected. I'm not struggling with the food, just lack of movement this week. Roll on week six....

teaandthorazine Thu 17-May-12 07:27:43

Did anyone watch Secret Eaters last night? Whilst it was quite interesting re: how much food we eat compared to how much we think we eat, I was still rolling my eyes and muttering at the tv all the way through.

As usual, it was all about counting calories, cutting out the fat etc. They showed big takeaway portions of chips and burgers, saying 'look at the amount of fat on these' - I was yelling 'it's not the bloody fat that's the problem, it's the great big bun and pound of chips!' - sooooo frustrating.

Dp is slowly being converted, I think. Its hard not to sound preachy, though. I don't want to become a diet bore. I never tell him what to eat but I couldn't help pointing out that the yoghurt he was scarfing down (after burger and chips!) had a whopping 60g of sugar in it...

MNP Thu 17-May-12 07:56:48

B1: meds
B2: yog
L: meatballs and veg
D: undecided

Thegoddessblossom Thu 17-May-12 08:06:39


Pizza Express for tea last night. I know, get me, 2 nights out in a row! Had a voucher for a £10 meal which of course I couldn't use as it entitled you to a bread like starter, a pizza based main, and a glass of red or rose wine. angry

So shared olives and nuts for starter and had salad nicoise with no dough sticks, dressing on the side and extra tuna. anda----glass----of----red

Breakfast: handful of strawbs and 3 tables spoons of greek yog.

off to gym after school run.

BIWItheBold Thu 17-May-12 08:12:06

tea - DH asked me if I thought his diet was unhealthy recently. When I started to analyse it, and point out that, yes, it was - he got really defensive! Despite the fact that

a) I have been low carbing (on and off) for ages
b) I have been doing a lot of reading up about it recently

He was still adamant that

- skipping breakfast was fine, because he's always done it
- fruit juice is good for him because it's fruit
- he was worried I wasn't getting enough vitamins/minerals in my food

the last point made me grin and shock that he would really think that - the man who is often so busy at work that he won't can't make time to eat anything other than a chocolate bar out of the vending machine at work!

So far, I have only been dealing with my own diet, because I want to lose weight. But the more I read, the more I realise I need to change what I'm cooking for the whole family too. So all those meals where I add potatoes for them, I think I will cut those down/out and just serve different, low carb veg/salad.

vnmum Thu 17-May-12 08:12:53

how do you make your own mayo? fancy trying but don't know how

BIWItheBold Thu 17-May-12 08:24:04

mayonnaise recipes

It's easy to make (especially if you have a stick blender/blender), but don't make it with all extra virgin olive oil, as the flavour will be too strong. Also, if you're using lemon juice, it will become quite tart - which is probably why commercial ones are sweetened.

i saw one of those adverts on tv for sensodyne (or one of those toothpastes that help stop enamel erosion etc) and I thought ha! except for fizzy water i no longer really have any of those foods which are damaging to teeth!

so i felt smug.

re DP's diet he is a bottomless pit and I don't think we could afford for him to eat like this, even accounting for the feeling more full factor on this woe! he eats loads but does lots of rugby and is on his feet all day long (teacher), and he never snacks as he doesn't have time.

he has said though that he reckons he will have problems keeping his weight down when he is older (both his parents are hugely overweight) and he has taken on board some of the principles of this woe. he also appreciates the food I'm cooking at the moment which is really delicious and I'm being much more experimental... we had got into a bit of a rut. he is an excellent cook but I can't yet trust him not to coat meat in flour etc

BIWItheBold Thu 17-May-12 08:41:06

It does make you realise how often we use flour in recipes without thinking why - and without there being a real need for it.

I see it a lot on MN - people giving recipes for things like Bolognese sauce or the meat for Shepherd's Pie, using flour to thicken it, whereas all that is needed (and which would make it taste better anyway) is for the sauce to be reduced further.

BIWItheBold Thu 17-May-12 08:41:57

Willie - once you are able to introduce some carbs, life will be cheaper and easier - but if you can focus on carbs like pulses it will also be better from the blood sugar/insulin point of view.

MNP Thu 17-May-12 09:12:21

I have bought coconut flour to make gravy and cheese sauce etc. my bolg sauce cooks for 6hours so it is lovely and thick.

BettyBathroom Thu 17-May-12 09:14:40

It's a lot easier to stick to this WOE when your partner is in it with you - Dh and I low-carb and the dcs now have good quality slow carbs and no more processed breakfast cereal!

MNP Thu 17-May-12 09:18:14

Agreed Betty DH isn't into it yet but I hope if I loose the excess he will be more inclined, I find he wants spuds/pasta with his and as he is then having high fat and high carb I land up cooking separate portions of essentially the same thing with mine buttered and his in oil with carbs.

BIWItheBold Thu 17-May-12 09:24:59

How many carbs in coconut flour, MNP?

MNP Thu 17-May-12 09:30:31

A quarter of wheat flour BIWI, we have this one and is 21.7/100 so 2.17/Tsp.

BettyBathroom Thu 17-May-12 09:34:54

I had to prove to dh it worked - even though it had worked, he was enjoying his food and he had lost weight, he still didn't believe it wasn't about calorie restriction in a round about way - this morning we reached the end of another test of this WOE and the scales were lower than ever for him - he is now eating humble'll be the only pie he gets!

I think it's really hard to have faith that this diet works, it goes against everything we thought we knew....

MNP Thu 17-May-12 09:40:44

Only just bought it so not tried it yet. Hopefully this weekend.

MNP Thu 17-May-12 09:41:17

As they say the proof is in the eating Betty grin

BIWItheBold Thu 17-May-12 10:03:01

MNP - you can make gravy and cheese sauce without any flour ...

MsRinky Thu 17-May-12 11:12:44

I have done the experimenting for you with coconut flour and can report that it is completely useless for thickening sauces.

It does make ace crackers with flaxseed though.

What do you all eat instead of bread and potatoes and pies?

I have potatoes with virtually every cooked meal, either that or pasta

I have not started am not doing very well on my attempt at low carb.

BIWItheBold Thu 17-May-12 12:11:50

I just don't eat it - replace potatoes with other veg/salad

NigellasGuest Thu 17-May-12 12:15:00

can I ask someone to point me in the right direction to find out how to make celeriac crisps? I've looked on the recipe thread......

MNP Thu 17-May-12 12:22:00

How BIWI, ok thanks MsRinky can use it in baking as been wanting to try it for a while. Maybe the agar agar will thicken sauces?

2bayumimum Thu 17-May-12 13:32:09

Nigella, if you do a search using 'celeriac' there are loads of different recipes there, not sure I spotted the crisp one, but I was on the hunt for celeriac chips, which are delish !! Just olive oil, salt and chilli or curry powder. Presume crisps would be the same just much more thinly sliced ? Hope that helps.

Creamtea1 Thu 17-May-12 13:35:03

Hello ladies! Been busy so not posting so much, however please prepare a fanfare!!!! Yes, 9 stone 13 lbs this morning!!!! Wooooooooooooooooo
Haven't been this weight since 2003!
Am so pleased.

And can I stress again it is ALL from low carbing - am doing same exercise now as I did before.
Smiley faces all round!

I am finding it really confusing. I thought it was basically more veg and less bread and pasta, but now it seems like there is good veg and bad veg and everything I cook as an accompaniment is bad.

It's like Quantum Physics Cooking

I think I'll just live on cabbage....I love cabbage.

BIWItheBold Thu 17-May-12 13:47:21

Read the rules here, YouveCatToBeKittenMe

That will make it much simpler!

Thegoddessblossom Thu 17-May-12 13:47:58

You've - there is a list of allowed veg somewhere, perhaps someone can link you to it.

It's really not that confusing once you understand the basic "rules"

BIWItheBold Thu 17-May-12 13:50:21

thanks to CreamTea1


LynnCSchreiber Thu 17-May-12 13:52:48

Well done, that is fantastic.

I made a white(ish) sauce using left over broccoli soup and bit of cream, reduced by boiling for a few minutes. It was fab for lasagne. Would be good for using to make a veg bake kind of thing.

Am going to make more broccoli soup tomorrow and freeze some so that I can use like this.

Thegoddessblossom Thu 17-May-12 13:54:31

Well done Cream Tea. grin

Lunch: 3 egg omelette with mushrooms, smoked salmon and a couple of sticks of celery with a slice of camenbert.

NigellasGuest Thu 17-May-12 14:11:06

Thank you 2bayumimum - I've found a BBC recipe.
I've got to get the confidence to get out of the mindset that unless it's on one of Biwi's threads in black and white I can't eat it! <becoming very anal about Bootcamp>

Creamtea1 Thu 17-May-12 14:14:05

Thank you lovely ladies smile
Obviously if I put on anything I will of course plunge in to the depths of despair and doom... biscuit

Thegoddessblossom Thu 17-May-12 14:15:27

Nigella - I'm going to do that BBC recipe tonight - shall we report back and compare results? DH did them last week, but they came out all soggy, I think he cut them too thick.

NigellasGuest Thu 17-May-12 14:29:31

Goddess - I will be making them tomorrow lunchtime as I'm not back til later tonight (and have made them all a pasta bake to have - I'll be having the bake minus the pasta)!

Yes I'm looking forward to your report - and will report back too!

mummyduff Thu 17-May-12 16:45:18

creamtea well done!

Breakfast today was left over pork
Lunch was mushroom omelette
dinner ????

Gym tomorrow thank god, missed it this week working loads, will have to work much harder for the next 3 days smile

DoUntoOtters Thu 17-May-12 16:55:47

I've just been to Aldi - oh, the glamour - they've got family packs of field mushrooms; those banana shallots, and pork loin joints for £2/lb. Just in case anyone is finding this WOE a bit hard on the pocket.

Made some of the flax and almond cake today, looking for that bready hit. It is now sitting like a breeze block in my stomach. I've become accustomed to fresh salads and veg without realising. shock

MNP Thu 17-May-12 19:11:44

D:flax pitta with spring onion and cheese with butter on the inside which was the outside as I snip all the way around to get 2 discs then grill with filling inside.

MNP Thu 17-May-12 19:12:24

Creamtea well done, on the scales Sunday, will see how it is going.

Thegoddessblossom Thu 17-May-12 19:38:34

Tea: celeriac chips (yum yum - cooked them in chilli oil salt and chilli powder, delish) served with 2 slices of high quality ham and a big dollop of Mayo.

Snacks: pepperoni, handful of macadamias, big glass of red.

Am extremely tired today. Considering going to bed after eastenders. Being tired makes me want to eat I have realised, and am trying to resist dark choc. 2 nights out in a row and a hard workout in the gym today....zzzzzzz.....

moussaka tonight from the low carb gourmet book, though i have adapted it quite a lot. she puts parmesan cheese in the meat mixture which I think is completely unnecessary. and i accidentally bought beef mince instead of lamb because I was on autopilot in the supermarket, so altogether it is a completely bastardised moussaka!

Shimbo Thu 17-May-12 19:53:22

Hi, can I join please? I am on day 3 of low carb, more or less according to BIWIs rules, with a few almonds and dark chocolate thrown in. I don't have much weight I want to lose, just a few kilos would be fab.

I must admit I do feel strange, it is a big adjustment I think as I have a sweet tooth and really miss my morning porridge. I don't feel hungry between meals which is good. I am trying to drink enough water.

Today's meals were kippers and egg for breakfast, first time ever and they were pretty good! Tuna and cheese mayo for lunch. Roasted aubergine and peppers with lamb tonight, lots of olive oil and garlic.

Can I ask if I do start eating a few carbs again (not blowout though!) after I have reached my ideal weight would I pile it all back on and more?

Shimbo Thu 17-May-12 19:54:09

Urgh forgot to say my mouth tastes friggin awful! What causes that and what to do to get rid of it?

BettyBathroom Thu 17-May-12 20:20:45

Well done to Cream Tea. Caleriac crisps are fab!

B Greek yoghurt
L Left over Fajitas - without the wrap
D Paneer & herb fritters with a tomato salsa, habanero & chipotle sauces

S some 85% choc & some goats cheese

No exercise as knee is still buggered. sad

Shimbo Thu 17-May-12 20:32:43

Also can I ask is there any other alternatives for breakfast apart from eggs, which I am a bit sick of on day 3, or yoghurt?

smokinaces Thu 17-May-12 20:37:02

Bacon and mushrooms?

Or change your eggs around. scramble them with tomatoes in them. Omlette with courgette and shallots.

Or cheese and meats ala Europe if you're ok with dairy.

BIWItheBold Thu 17-May-12 21:48:59

Welcome, Shimbo!

That awful taste in your mouth is a good sign, as it means you're in ketosis - so your body has switched to fat burning mode. Drink plenty of water and that will deal with it.

But almonds and dark chocolate are NOT ALLOWED on Bootcamp! Seriously - you really need to leave these out for the first two weeks.

Re breakfast - there are loads of things you can eat. And don't think of breakfast as a 'special' meal that needs 'special' food - you can eat anything you like! Leftovers from dinner the night before are good. Or think continental - slices of meat/fish - something like smoked salmon is lovely. You can have yoghurt, but make sure it's full fat, and keep an eye on quantities as it's easy to overdo the carbs here.

Once you've finished the two weeks of Bootcamp, you can start eating some fruit, so you could have berries for breakfast.

Shimbo Thu 17-May-12 21:53:52

Thanks BIWI, I will stop the almonds and dark choc! Do you know how long the horrible mouth taste will last for?

Creamtea1 Thu 17-May-12 21:55:28

Just checking in post dinner. Pork belly and cabbage/leeks. And a coffee after. Should really go to the gym tomorrow!

BIWItheBold Thu 17-May-12 21:59:42


(It's my job to shout at you, by the way)

I don't know how long it will last, to be honest - but as Bootcamp is the 2 weeks of lowest carbs, it should resolve itself after that, when you increase your carbs a bit.

Make sure you really do drink plenty of water, as that is one of the big thins that will help you.

Have you seen the weigh-in thread to put your weight in? Or are you going to wait until Monday, which is the next official weigh-in day?

heartstart Thu 17-May-12 22:11:39

Please will someone critique my intake today

B 2 boiled eggs tea and water
L mattesons sausage and tomatoes 4 Cherry
D Thai green curry leeks and courgette
Raspberries and total ff yoghurt

3.5l water

Creamtea1 Thu 17-May-12 22:47:10

Heartstart - looks ok, but maybe need to add more salad and less tomatoes at lunch. Plus chicken or other meat may be better than the sausage (probably processed). Also easy on the yog if you're doing bootcamp.
And don't forget your water! smile

BIWItheBold Thu 17-May-12 22:50:10

Are you doing Bootcamp or Bootcamp Light? Raspberries are OK for the latter but not the former.

Looks OK, but difficult to comment on the curry without knowing what the ingredients were.

But not bad really - and good on the water!

Windandsand Fri 18-May-12 03:34:58

Am do thick I am scaring myself... Have only just realised the bootcamp thing at the top of the thread, where are the rules? And had no idea this is a weigh in thread. Sorry ladies have not been doing this properly and I had some Brie last night. sad

teaandthorazine Fri 18-May-12 07:32:37

windandsand - you're allowed Brie, even on bootcamp! Just keep it to small amounts and see how you go as dairy products can slow down weight loss for some. Cheese is one of the great joys of this WOE!

Have a good look at the rules (link below) and don't panic - it's easy once you get going smile.

BIWItheBold Fri 18-May-12 09:12:57

.... or link above, depending on which version of MN you're using!

Welcome windandsand. You'll get the hang of it quickly enough. smile

And this is the chat thread - you are in the right place!!!

heartstart Fri 18-May-12 09:52:59

Thanks curry was as per recipe thread.

Am doing bc light

Need to reduce dairy a bit

having people over for lunch next weekend. for pudding am planning to do this but with sweetener instead of sugar - it doesn't need much as it's quite a tart pudding anyway. i know it's not ideal for bootcamp but i do want to serve a pudding, what do you think biwi?

this morning is the first morning ive actually been hungrey just had 2 boiled eggs beaten up in a cup with tomatoes and lots of butter and my morning coffee with cream smile

BIWItheBold Fri 18-May-12 10:34:21

Willie, that looks absolutely stunning. I would think that although it's not ideal in Bootcamp, a little piece of that would be OK. Desserts are a nightmare at this stage! I'd just go for it - but make sure you've kept your carbs really low the day or so before, and keep them low the following day - as well as drinking plenty of water.

BettyBathroom Fri 18-May-12 10:38:08

For pudding why don't you serve home made truffles with cream.

The jelly is too subtle for sweeteners it will taste awful. I make truffles for the dcs now, I put orange oil in them and they are lovely and they are low carb as I use 85%choc and no sugar or sweeteners. But if you find dark choc a little challenging then add a bit of sweetener.

BIWItheBold Fri 18-May-12 10:39:43

The point about sweeteners is a valid one actually - have you tried making this dessert before with the sweeteners?

vnmum Fri 18-May-12 10:49:28

I have my parents coming down this weekend. My DF is type 2 diabetic so I asked my DM what he eats so I could get it in and she said the following:

Honey mini shredded wheat with milk for breakfast
sandwich for lunch with flora on it, no butter (her words as apparently needs to be polyunsaturated)
then pasta or risotto or something with potatoes for tea.
snacks are crisps

I did say that new research has shown that the advice for diabetics has been wrong and that they should do low carb but as soon as I said eat fat I got "FAT!". I feel I am fighting a losing battle as he is just following the advice from doctor.
I know he would be much healthier and lower his risk of complications if he cut the carbs. I may have to send them home with Taubes in the hope they read it

BIWItheBold Fri 18-May-12 10:51:55

I find this the most shocking - that diabetics are advised to eat high carbohydrate diets. (My dad is a type 2 diabetic, so I'm very familiar with this!)

BettyBathroom Fri 18-May-12 10:55:59

I feel you pain Vnmum my DF has Type II - it seems to me that the drugs companies are winning. They are getting richer and richer and people are getting sicker and sicker. My DF is 80 now and has got to the point where he doesn't want to change things - taking drugs is much easier sad

teaandthorazine Fri 18-May-12 10:59:24

Well, have just had my first spoonful of coconut oil...interesting! Very weird sensation to be eating pure fat by the spoonful (even for a fat-o-phile like me) but I quite liked it. Put a bit in my coffee, unsurprisingly it formed tiny globs of fat on top but tastes fine. Very mild coconut taste and smell. Can't wait to try cooking with it. Am totally sold on the fat thing - have used nothing but jojoba oil to clean my face with for about two years now and love it. Fat works!

And also bought magnesium and vit D - think I might be turning into a health nut wink

yes, i had thought i would need to experiment with sweeteners to get the right amount, but if it will taste awful... sweeteners are so distinctive aren't they?

good idea betty, though sadly can't do truffles as chocolate triggers migraines for my mum

hmm might just do berry-heavy fruit salad and cream in that case (and surreptitiously pick out the carbier fruit when i serve myself!)

BettyBathroom Fri 18-May-12 11:03:51

Tell us more about the coconut oil - where do we buy it? Can we cook at high temps with it or does that destroy all the good stuff - I love this way of eating....makes me feel like I'm a defiant teenager again - Gov health advice sucks! wink

Agree with Oil as a moisturiser, it's fab - might progress onto cleansing too!

teaandthorazine Fri 18-May-12 11:04:46

vnmum - that menu is shock isn't it? Honey shredded wheat and crisps! Wow. I hope they do read Taubes, but it's so hard to change faith in 'expert' medical opinion, isn't it? Just out of interest, do you know if your dad's diabetes has improved over the years or worsened?

I work with lots of women who are diagnosed with gestational diabetes, and the menu plans/dietary advice they're given is appalling. Carbs, carbs, carbs. I try to gently steer them in a more sensible direction but am worried about being seen to be in opposition to the advice they get from their dieticians, obstetricians and 'specialist' midwives. It's a very fine line.

NigellasGuest Fri 18-May-12 11:04:49

have just made my first celeriac crisps/chips and had them for breakfast/midmorning snack - How Delicious Are THEY !!!

will be making tons of these!

BettyBathroom Fri 18-May-12 11:08:55

OK other ideas - can't vouch for them but they come from a book I love!

Berry Gratin
Coconut ice cream
Coffee Ice cream
Lemon Custard Macroon Tart
Cardamom cake
Cream cheese and Macadamia Nut Brownies
Rose and Raspberry pudding
Pistachio meringes
Rhubarb fool
Eton mess

teaandthorazine Fri 18-May-12 11:09:49

Betty - I ended up getting mine from Holland & Barrett - not the cheap option at £16 but I was too impatient to wait for an online delivery blush. It's a big 500g tub of extra virgin stuff - it just looks like lard! You can definitely cook with it, apparently it has a very high 'smoke point' so you can use it for frying etc. But the advice on the side says just eat a tablespoon a day...

I know what you mean about being a defiant teenager - I had to smile when I saw the nutrition label said 94% saturated fat grin.

BettyBathroom Fri 18-May-12 11:10:05

Should be a Macaroon tart!

BIWItheBold Fri 18-May-12 11:11:07

Willie - an alternative that I have sometimes done is a platter of different berries (which look lovely because of their colours) with a white chocolate sauce. If you can get hold of some low carb white chocolate you can make yours with that. (Or just serve yours with cream).

White chocolate sauce:

175g white chocolate, broken into pieces
170ml cream (I use double cream)

Put chocolate and cream in a heatproof bowl over a pan of simmering water. Sir until the chocolate has just melted and pour into a jug.

How hard is that?! (recipe is from Bill Granger's book "bills food")

teaandthorazine Fri 18-May-12 11:13:03

Like the sound of the lemon custard tart - mmmm.

I'd probably just make a big pavlova with a ton of whipped cream and berries (maybe dark choc curls also?) - the meringue will be fine with sweeteners.

mummyduff Fri 18-May-12 11:16:50

Morning ladies, I may have to indulge in some bubbly tonight as have a new nephew grin

Have been to the gym and had boiled eggs for breakfast.

ohforfoxsake Fri 18-May-12 11:17:55

Ah found you! Fell off the thread there.

Anyhow, I have been wobbling around all over the place but have still lost. So 11.7 today. That's pretty much a stone, half way to my goal. grin

Off to catch up now.

moonshine Fri 18-May-12 11:26:22

Hello can I join your merry band? I'm 45 and and been trying to seriously lose weight most of my life over the past year but instead have managed to put on 1.5 stones shock. Have felt very depressed as nothing seems to work, including the Cambridge Diet (am an old hand at that!) joining MFP and even various attempts at low-carbing - I convinced myself it's because of my hormones and/or I have seriously f**ked up my metabolism.

However, this week, have been following your bootcamp well sort of but have given up milk totally this time and 5 pounds so far has dropped off shock.

I'm trying not to get too over-excited - have been here so many times before, and I know all my loss so far is probably water/gyclogen stores but it's further than I've got for months. And I have about 2 outfits only I can get into and a wardrobe full of lovely dresses I can't even squeeze into now (only size 14 - am not being over-ambitious!).

Need to lose 3 stones to get into healthy bmi but 2.5/2 stone will suit me fine for now so am hoping for some hand-holding and guidance - it's going to be a long journey.

Jacaqueen Fri 18-May-12 11:33:35

My FIL has type 2.

According to his doctor Hob Nobs make a great snack. Fat should be avoided and sweetners are fine!

Of course FIL is from the generation that never questions what the doctor says. I have tried to get him to have a cooked breakfast, which he loves, but he insists on eating cereal and toast as directed by the doctor.

thanks for all the pudding ideas, these are great!

vnmum Fri 18-May-12 11:54:29

betty I get my coconut oil from an asian supermarket. £2.75 for a 500g tub of the solid stuff.

Tea My DF was only diagnosed a couple of years ago. It is now classed as under control. He takes metformin and goes to the gym and walks the dog everyday. The only change to his diet has been that they have cut down on takeaways. He still has a lager or 2 every night as he was told that was fine. I am worried about my DM too. She is overweight, doesn't eat breakfast, has a yoghurt or toast for lunch at about 3pm due to that being her only lunchtime at work then comes home to a carby evening meal and a glass of red every night. She keeps saying she wants to lose weight but that there is nothing that works because at her age it's normal to gain weight. I notice she is definately getting heavier every year and I worry that she too will get diagnosed with Diabetes or something worse. She is on her feet at work (waitress) but other than that does no other form of exercise.

Also tea, I had been doing oil cleansing with jojoba but since I started this woe my skin has got a bit more spotty. I thought the oil cleansing would sort it out but it seems to bring more spots out so I then stop doing it. Do I need to just persevere and eventually the skin will clear?

teaandthorazine Fri 18-May-12 11:56:02

Hob Nobs? Hob Nobs?? FFS, that is unbelievably irresponsible advice angry

Hi moonshine and well done! Have you read the Bootcamp rules etc? Giving up the milk is a great start and will have probably made a real difference. Keep going, LC is kinda fun once you get into it grin

BIWItheBold Fri 18-May-12 12:00:10

Welcome, moonshine, and really well done! You will probably gather from this/these Bootcamp threads that I we are all a bit evangelical about low carbing!

I am never, ever, ever again going to count calories.

teaandthorazine Fri 18-May-12 12:01:47

vnmum - I'd say keep going with the jojoba. For the first couple of weeks of low-carb my skin did go completely haywire, to the point where I was even thinking of giving up as I figured I'd rather have clear skin than a flat stomach! But... I kept on and now, a few weeks later, it looks great, all soft and plump and dewy (kinda) grin. And no more spots, even around TOTM.

I think giving up the sugar and upping the fat counts for a lot. It just took my skin a little while to adjust, I think.

Thegoddessblossom Fri 18-May-12 12:04:49

Congrats MummyDuff! I am expecting a new nephew any day!! grin Very exciting.

Welcome Moonshine - huge support on this thread you are in the right place.

Breakfast: greek yog with blueberries.

Have swum 60 lengths this morning.

BIWItheBold Fri 18-May-12 12:06:39

Oh yes! Congratulations, mummyduff - how lovely!

teaandthorazine Fri 18-May-12 12:08:44

btw, vnmum, your mum's diet sounds just like mine was before LC sad. I felt crap all the time and was getting persistently more and more overweight. But it does take a big leap of faith to change.

I would love for my parents to start following this WOE - my mum is morbidly obese, pre-diabetic, addicted to fruit juice, white toast with marge, cigarettes and endless cups of milky tea. She has had severe mental health issues for many years and both her depression and the medication have screwed up her metabolism and eating habits completely. My dad is healthier but still overweight, and on statins. I'm sure this WOE would be of benefit to them both - they're impressed with my weight loss - but I think they'd find it so hard to change.

NotMostPeople Fri 18-May-12 12:12:05

Sorry to be dense, but why coconut oil rather than olive etc?

vnmum Fri 18-May-12 12:15:08

tea I think it is the idea of change that is hard for our parents. They are of the generation where you listen to the doctor and don't research stuff yourself to question what the doctor says. Also mine have grown up with all the low fat low cal advice for so many years it is kind of engrained sad. I really just wish the government would give up on the low fat advice and start giving out low carb. It is not as if there isn't enough evidence to support low carb. Now they want to put a fat tax on things. Now fair enough if it is on high sugar high transfat junk but if it ends up on just high fat stuff then it will make this WOE alot more expensive and give the message to the general public that fat is sooo bad. angry

jan2011 Fri 18-May-12 12:28:47

i am not following all the rules exactly, but doing my best and hope its still ok to post here for support.
bad day yesterday after a week of low carb, i which i progessively felt better. back on track again today - you guys are right about the government. i had a dietician for awhile and she was always on about carbs carbs carbs

Ilovemyteddy Fri 18-May-12 12:58:07

Out for dinner tonight for the first time in ages to a vair naice restaurant. I've already been on their website and have decided on chicken stuffed with mozzarella wrapped in parma ham. I'm going to ask them to substitute the potatoes with a green veg. I haven't had a drink since I started this WOE (how very Un-Mumsnetty of me grin ) but thought I might indulge in a small wine How many carbs are there in a glass of red?

Oh and can I say ETON MESS!!!! I love Eton Mess and hadn't thought for a moment that you can eat a large bowl it on this WOE. Yum!

Thegoddessblossom Fri 18-May-12 13:00:52

Sorry but how come you can eat meringue? It's sugar innit?

Thegoddessblossom Fri 18-May-12 13:01:24

Lunch: 3 egg omelette with mushrooms, smoked salmon and large salad with mayo.

teaandthorazine Fri 18-May-12 13:07:55

You could make the meringue with sweetener, blossom. It's not Bootcamp-y, but there is, iirc, a recipe in the IPD Cookbook for Eton Mess, so technically you could consider it a low-carb option. But only for Special Occasions grin

BIWItheBold Fri 18-May-12 13:12:03

jan2011 - welcome!

When you say you're not following all the rules exactly, what do you mean? Tell me what you're doing! And why aren't you following them? They are designed to make life easier not more complicated.

My concern is that if you aren't following them then you won't see any weight loss which is, after all, the whole point of Bootcamp

BIWItheBold Fri 18-May-12 13:12:45

Carb counts for wine, per 100ml:

Wine, red
Wine, rose
Wine, white, dry
Wine, white, med
Wine, white, sweet

Thegoddessblossom Fri 18-May-12 13:29:01

Can someone please tell me how I make a cheese sauce without using the packet? I mean is it just loads and loads of cheese and a bit of milk?

LynnCSchreiber Fri 18-May-12 13:31:27

Oh, I am looking forward to a glass of wine. I may have to cheat slightly and go onto Bootcamp Light a couple of days early cause I am going to London next Friday with a friend. And to meet some really lovely MNetters wink

Going well here. H arrived last night and is impressed with my dedication. We had big fat yummy omelettes with mushrooms, spinach and salmon last night.

B: 2 eggs, scrambled with chicken breast and mushrooms

L: salad with chicken breast and homemade mayo

We went out for lunch and I asked for the chicken with salad rather than potato and resisted having a scone. Which was actually easier than I thought.


BIWItheBold Fri 18-May-12 13:43:51

Cheese sauce - cream, or creme fraiche, heated up with cheese melted into it.

Easy peasy! (As long as dairy doesn't cause you problems, of course)

wink @ Mme - and food is looking good! Especially the resistance!

ohforfoxsake Fri 18-May-12 14:02:00

The moussaka topping in IPD is a 300ml pot of cream, 3 eggs and a 200g block of feta. As its baked it thickens up. I guess you can use any cheese though. Essentially its a cheesy-custard.

teaandthorazine Fri 18-May-12 14:06:20

Downside of this WOE:

Am on nights this weekend, and normally would toddle off for a little nap now, aided by the post-lunch sugar slump. But because my bloody sugars are so annoyingly stable now, I'm not tired!

Have packed my bag with cheese and nuts to ward off the temptation of the inevitable biscuits, sweets, toast and that 3am bowl of cornflakes. Might take a bit of dark choc with me to help me through...

Breakfast - protein shake with flax
Lunch - three eggs, scrambled with full-fat Philly, steamed asapargus, fried mushrooms. Water. Feel quite stuffed - ketosis has definitely knocked my appetite on the head.

moonshine Fri 18-May-12 14:09:07

Did someone mention wine? Well I know I'm only a few days in but would it be ok to drink a couple of glasses of wine tomorrow and maybe one tonight? I presume you won't lose weight on it but does it stall or put back weight loss a lot?

And also, is there a particular cookbook anyone would recommend with lots of lc recipes eg is the P2T one worth getting??

Thank you all!

BIWItheBold Fri 18-May-12 14:20:42

moonshine - Bootcamp should be an alcohol-fee zone!

Alcohol is a very easy source of fuel for the body, so it will burn this before anything else. In other words, you won't be burning fat.

Definitely get the Idiot Proof Diet Cookbook - there are some fab recipes in there. Just note, though, that it doesn't give carb counts at all, and a lot of the recipes use a lot of dairy, which can cause problems for some.

Thegoddessblossom Fri 18-May-12 14:29:22

Bollocks I made it with milk. Way too runny. Oh well, maybe it'll thicken up when I bake it....

NigellasGuest Fri 18-May-12 14:33:09

the possible problems caused by lots of dairy- are the problems stalling related or are there other symptoms?

Thegoddessblossom Fri 18-May-12 14:34:08

Do you think if I pour cream into the dish and then bake it it will improve things or make the whole thing a write off?

moonshine Fri 18-May-12 14:35:26

Oh you really are being cruel to strict with me then. Ok, shall attempt no booze, or at the very least just one glass tomorrow - as I'm in for the long haul I'm prepared to stall a little bit as long as the overall trend is down! Life at the moment has such few pleasures so even tiny things help!

moonshine Fri 18-May-12 14:38:49

NigellasGuest - I lost nothing doing one week lcing but having a little bit of milk in my coffees. This time have given up totally (and have only had some spoonfuls of cottage cheese and a taste of cheese - no other dairy really) and 5lbs have come off in 4 days - co-incidence?? I certainly didn't have any stomach aches indicating milk etc was 'irritating' me.

BIWItheBold Fri 18-May-12 14:46:40

NigellasGuest - it's more to do with impeding weight loss (although Dr John Briffa is certainly of the view that lots of people are intolerant of dairy products - will find a link), which is why I suggest limiting it.

Also, with milk especially, there are lots of carbs in it, and it would be very easy to over do the carbs if you keep milk in your diet.

BIWItheBold Fri 18-May-12 14:50:15

Dr Briffa - dairy products can help weight loss apparently

This is an interesting view. I know, for myself, that if I eat cream then I am much more likely to see no movement on the scales. Yoghurt seems to be OK.

LynnCSchreiber Fri 18-May-12 15:32:27

You linked to Text from Dog, which might aid weight loss due to excessive laughter

ohforfoxsake Fri 18-May-12 16:13:31

Goddess - did you use eggs too? They will help thicken it up. I baked a moussaka yesterday, over did it and it was very thick once cooked (and burnt).

DoUntoOtters Fri 18-May-12 16:24:02

That is hilarious. I am actually crying. grin

Moggiemad Fri 18-May-12 16:57:27

Hi Everybody
Moggie here reporting in, I`ve lost 2 pounds this week and I`m delighted! Onwards and downwards with the low-carb WoE.

smokinaces Fri 18-May-12 17:58:33

Salt and pepper celeriac crisps.



May have to make another batch.

BIWItheBold Fri 18-May-12 18:00:51

Whoops! blush

Hang on ...

BIWItheBold Fri 18-May-12 18:01:36
mummyduff Fri 18-May-12 18:29:29

thanks ladies the new nephew is so so cute grin.

Thats a great thread BIWI I have to say since cutting down on carbs I feel so much better in myself, not bloated and I have loads more energy. Dont know if this is related but DH says I am a happier person also smile

NotMostPeople Fri 18-May-12 18:36:38

I'm still ploughing on with the odd weak moment but I'm trying to make my weaknesses ones that aren't too awful, so I've had a couple of bits of chocolate but it's been 85% coco.

However I have to say the difference in how I feel is amazing especially in regard to sleep. I haven't had as many good nights of sleep in a row for years and years.

Creamtea1 Fri 18-May-12 18:46:26

Doom - DH is celebrating tonight and dictates that a Chinese takeaway is for dinner..what can I have which is slightly damage limitating?? Yuk sung? Beef or prawn something? Foo yung even?

BIWItheBold Fri 18-May-12 18:48:36

I'm so glad it's going well for people - and that you're finding benefits beyond just the weight loss.

Imagine the horror if I'd got you all signed up, all 80+ of you, and it hadn't worked! I would have been hounded off MN! grin

BettyBathroom Fri 18-May-12 18:50:16

Just fried up a whole celeriac into crisps - dcs have eaten the lot and none left for poor hard working dh. I would call that a success!

Previously on a friday evening after work I would just flop, possibly takeaway and pub.Today I have come home and done an hour's gardening, cleaned the bathroom, changed the sheets and done a load of washing. I'm off to the pub in an hour (to drink sparkling water <saintly>) and I've still got so much energy. It really is fab

Enjoy the ne

BIWItheBold Fri 18-May-12 18:55:59

The ne?!

Bugger. Enjoy the nephew mummyduff!

OFFS I made moussaka last night too - used the low carb gourmet topping of ricotta, eggs and Parmesan which was v nice

Creamtea1 Fri 18-May-12 19:12:04

Anyone? Don't want another row about how my 'wierd' eating spoils everything!

BIWItheBold Fri 18-May-12 19:14:58

CreamTea1 - Chinese isn't easy. Do they do lettuce wraps? Have that but without the sauce that they will send with it.

Stir-fried waterchestnuts and celery? Or stir-fried beansprouts.

Some kind of meat in oyster sauce? Apologies - without seeing the menu it's really difficult to help more!

BIWItheBold Fri 18-May-12 19:15:24

You could go for crispy duck - eat the duck and cucumber/spring onions but not the pancakes or hoisin sauce?

heartstart Fri 18-May-12 19:17:59

Char siu pork with mixed veg stir fry?

I have just had homemade burgers with salad and mayo xx

Creamtea1 Fri 18-May-12 19:29:21

Ok lettuce wraps got - with minced pork filling no sauce
Main shall be either beef in oyster sauce or special foo yung (Chinese omelette basically, has meat of choice in it)
Thinking the egg dish is prob safer

Thegoddessblossom Fri 18-May-12 19:55:29

Cauliflower cheese with courgette onion and bacon - sauce was a bit runny but boys wolfed it as did I. grin

2 large glasses of red, macadamia nuts.... Sorry biwi but it is Friday....

Thegoddessblossom Fri 18-May-12 20:47:07

5 odd squares of 85% dark choc.

I'll get my coat.

I havent lost anymore weight is this normal or am i doing something wrong ?

Creamtea1 Fri 18-May-12 21:34:39

Ok Chinese done- salt and chilli ribs (2 small) lettuce and minced pork wraps (2 small) and special foo yung (egg, prawns, char Sui pork, bean sprouts) half a portion. Then was fullest I have been in weeks! I think I made ok choices but I bet I pay for it in the morning! Getting lots of water down now.

BIWItheBold Fri 18-May-12 21:34:48

You lost a fantastic amount last week, so it's entirely normal. I would guess that your body is adjusting to your new way of eating.

Don't fret, and don't change anything. Just carry on - making sure that you are following Bootcamp rules - and you will be fine.

Weight loss isn't linear. You will go for periods of time where you don't lose anything, and then you will suddenly drop a few pounds.

NigellasGuest Fri 18-May-12 21:43:11

I bought some ketosis sticks this afternoon and when i gave it a try, it turned a definite mauve. That must be good!
BIWI I read the dog texts Dr Briffa article about dairy, and i really hope that he is right because I love, love, love cream and Greek yogurt. I have definitely read elsewhere that plain yogurt is good for tummy fat (along with exercise and all the rest of it).

heartstart Fri 18-May-12 21:52:52

Hi I just used map for first time 28% of my calories from fat And 40g carbs is that enough fat?

QueenStromba Fri 18-May-12 22:07:17

That's not enough fat at all heartstart! Really you want 60% or more of your calories from fat.

I just had a lovely dinner of waitrose fillet steak, spring greens fried in butter and celeriac chips cooked in goose fat with homemade peppercorn sauce and mayonnaise. I have to admit that I felt like a bit of a ponce having two different homemade sauces with my meal but it was lovely. Actually, looking at the time dinner was about an hour and a half ago but my stomach is telling me that I've only just eaten - this is why high fat is a good idea.

heartstart Fri 18-May-12 22:14:08

Ok thanks will try harder

heartstart Fri 18-May-12 22:14:58

Ok thanks will try harder prob explains slow wt loss

BIWItheBold Fri 18-May-12 22:48:46

heartstart - what are you eating? What have been your meals for the last few days? From what you've posted, that's too much carbohydrate and nowhere near enough fat.

RatherBeOnThePiste Sat 19-May-12 07:57:53

Giving blood on Tuesday, hoping it's not too thin and watery grin Fingers crossed being in full ketosis won't affect this!

Gave in last night and had some haribo cant believe it but going too do another week of bootcamp before bootcamp lite (hangs head in shame blush)

BIWItheBold Sat 19-May-12 10:07:37

Noooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo! What made you do that?! Careful you don't end up undoing all your good work.

Ds was up throwing up last night i have had about 90 mins sleep so did it without thinking but back on the wagon so too speak now boiled eggs with butter for brekkie coffee with cream no sugar and 2 litres of water

MNP Sat 19-May-12 10:26:27

Oh botheration, I am struggling to eat enough on this WOE as I am not hungry, looking at food diary my portions have shrunk tho I am still doing the 3+Ltrs of water.

The scales say I have gained 5lbs sad I have been having cheese, cream in larger quantities, back to strict Bootamp starting today.

MNP Sat 19-May-12 10:27:48

iPad does not like bootCamp

heartstart Sat 19-May-12 10:32:36

Hi went back and re looked at yesterday had miscalculated carbs so was actually 25g of which 13 were 2 slices of flax focaccia which map counts as 13g and recipe says it would be 1.4g of available carb. I was assuming that because flax is largely fibre, hence useful re constipation, that it works by passing through gut rather than being broken down and all calories/carbs etc absorbed.

Yesterday I had

B Slice flax bread and cheese for breakfast with coffee and cream
Smoked salmon and avocado with mayo and green salad
Homemade burgers slice focaccia lettuce, cucumber, tomato 1 small mayo, mushrooms fried in butter

Snacks 85% choc, 25g cheese, strawberries

3 litres of water

heartstart Sat 19-May-12 10:39:45

Had cheese to increase fat

heartstart Sat 19-May-12 10:40:39

MFP not map

BIWItheBold Sat 19-May-12 10:41:16

That's quite a lot of carbs - bread, chocolate and strawberries - that aren't coming from veg/salad.

If you've put 5lbs back on, then I'd look at cutting that out/down - and keep an eye on your dairy (cream/cheese).

BIWItheBold Sat 19-May-12 10:42:06

Look to other ways of increasing your fat - vegetables (not just salad) cooked in butter, mayonnaise on the side etc

heartstart Sat 19-May-12 10:59:15

Thanks for advice as ever - I haven't put weight on just not losing hence checking numbers on MFP. Actually think have found carbs level of maintenance but obviously too early smile and def feel better with this woe. Lost 3 stone last year on a combo of shakes etc and then low carb then went to low cal and weight started going up again. So am pleased am back at lowest weight from last year but want to get more off. Also been unwell, am fine now but have loads of meds which may play a part.

BIWItheBold Sat 19-May-12 12:02:28

Oops - sorry - got you mixed up with MNP! blush

Meds may well have something to do with it. I think the key thing with this WOE is to understand how many carbs you can/can't eat - as well as the sorts of foods that don't agree with you, in terms of impeding weight loss.

It's all a bit of a learning thang smile

Scales back up for me this morning <sighs> which is only my own fault. Had wine last night, and then a spoonful of tarka dall with my otherwise very virtuous takeaway (tandoori chicken and spinach bhaji). I also made some Parmesan crisps which, although very lovely, are too moreish, and I think I probably ate too many of those.

Off to the PILs this weekend. Normally this would spell disaster on the carb front, but I'm cooking this evening (MIL finding it increasingly difficult to cook for more than herself and PIL sad), so am in charge. We will be having steak and salad (with frites for DH and DSIL). Then tomorrow we're going for lunch at a carvery which, although not somewhere I would normally choose, should at least be manageable from the LC perspective.

Thegoddessblossom Sat 19-May-12 12:06:11


Weighed this morning and scales said 8.12. I nearly fainted as I haven't been that weight since I was about 19. Moved scales, weighed again, 9.4. Oh well, it was nice while it lasted.

Terrible night's sleep. Feel like a zombie today. Got a kid free afternoon today, and I would normally grab the opportunity to do some exercise but can't see that happening.

Breakfast: Full fat greek yog with a few blueberries.

BIWItheBold Sat 19-May-12 12:29:47

Well, I was once told, on the Carblife site, that there's no such thing as a false low reading. Whereas there is such a thing as a false high reading.

I don't know if that's true (actually I can't see any reason why it's true grin) but it's sustained me for a long time!

Personally, I try to only get on the scales once at any one time. If I think it's dodgy, though, then it's best of three ...

Thegoddessblossom Sat 19-May-12 13:08:38

It must have been dodgy Biwi, although bless you for your

I did best of three...

SharonGless Sat 19-May-12 13:18:49

I did best of three this morning and put 2lbs on

However I went out for Greek meal
Last night as it was my sisters birthday. She has already ordered three platters, one meat one veggie and one seafood so I wasn't worried. However all the meat dishes went very quickly leaving lots of rice and cous cous. I had tiny bits and a big Greek salad plus two tiny squares of pitta. Had raging stomach ache all night which have just managed to get rid of.

DH is very sceptical of this WOE despite not having read round externally he is going off anecdotal evidence. Last nights offering was a friend at work who lost 5 stone doing Atkins and got obsessed with weight. Tried to explain that although I want to lose weight this is about a healthier way of eating. He was laughing at me about conspiracy theory. Tbh it doesn't surprise md the lack of support just makes me sad

moonshine Sat 19-May-12 13:34:49

Ha Ha - I have to average out countless weigh-in as scales show something different every single time I stand on them.

1lb on this morning, so the honeymoon period is over but I am hoping it is perhaps water retention as I reckon I had a lot of salt yesterday - the only different thing I ate was 4 olives.

I am going to attempt my first ever celeriac mash tonight. What do you reckon is a decent portion size (half of one??) and does everyone add butter?

sharon sorry your dh isn't being supportive, that must make it hard

dp hasn't really got his head round it (he talks about 'when you're eating normally again...', though tbh my eating has never really been normal since I was a teenager) but he is very pleased i'm feeling so good on this woe

LynnCSchreiber Sat 19-May-12 16:22:11

Sorry your dh isn't more supportive. It is difficult to believe in this woe cause it goes against all we have been told for years. Still doesnt excuse him.

I am noticing how much dh is eating, particularly carbs. Am buying my tongue though. He has to see long term results before I can persuade him to think about his diet.

Went for lunch today and there was nothing on the menu that suited bootcamp. I ordered quiche with salad and didn't eat the base. Hope it was made with eggs and cream and not milk.

Going to cook something low carb for all tonight. Maybe chilli.

teaandthorazine Sat 19-May-12 16:29:50

Helllo all

nightshift last night and another tonight so feeling Not Great. Was insanely busy last night so didn't eat, hence waking this afternoon to carb craving, that I gave into in a fog. Bacon roll and some milk choc. But actually it didn't really make me feel any better, so will get back on the wagon right now! Lovely dp has gone out to buy me Stilton and broc soup to take to work, have also got almonds I didn't eat last night. Will have scrambled eggs with spinach before I go in. Feel exhausted. Nightshifts are the pits.

On the plus side, I appear to have dropped another 2lbs!! Maybe it was the coconut oil!

QueenStromba Sat 19-May-12 16:48:54

I'm sorry your DH isn't supporting you Sharon. My DP has been really good about it. He's happy to forgo restaurants where I can't eat anything I fancy and he understands that I'm never going back to eating "normally" especially when it comes to wheat. I do most of the cooking and he's just really happy that I put food down in front of him and will probably eventually adapt to this way of eating without wanting extra carbs with some of his meals - he'll eat the same as me in a fry up now without complaining about lack of beans or toast.

LittleFrieda Sat 19-May-12 17:07:58

I stood on a bee this morning and it stung me. Poor me, poor bee.

Forgive me Biwi for I have sinned, I bought some peanuts -- salted -- on weds and ate them all. blush It wasn't a huge packet but boy did I feel rank after eating them. Interestingly it didn't knock me out of ketosis but I think I'm on the week 4 stall. I know now I can't buy nuts and trust myself o eat just a few.