DS: charming but controlling

(75 Posts)
Mummyoftheyear Fri 05-Apr-13 23:50:16

My son is just wonderful (as is everyone's, I'm sure).
He is caring and kind, charming and incredibly articulate. He is particularly interested in electricity: how things work, making circuits (a game called Hot Wires is a sage way to do it). He is 5 years old.
Since he has been at nursery (2 and a quarter), I've heard nothing but complaints about his resistance to go along with instructions - be it signing at singing time, stopping to tidy up, sitting on the carpet, etc.
I'm quite strict at home a d have tried everything. Sticker charts / other positive incentives, consequences, etc.
I've even gone so far as to photograph, laminate and cut up a picture if his favourite toy to give him one if four pieces of it to incentivise good behaviour. Nothing! He loves in the here and now I'll do what if like.
He's not naughty - just determined to follow his own interests, ideas and plans.
I'm despairing as its been complained about at both nurseries and now at school. He's been asked to leave: football, ballet, Zumba, drama, etc.
He doesn't endear himself to have friends although he would love to - because he tries to tell them (nicely but all the same...) exactly what to play with/ how to play with it. He's fantastic at setting up games, activities, etc and wonderful with younger children. I'm at the end of my tether as we have had play dates and mums have said, surprised, "He's fine, isn't he!". They've obviously been told by their children that he doesn't listen and is 'redirected' a billion times a day. His eye contact and interpersonal skills (BAR LISTENING TO OTHERS unless they're telling him about something he would like to know).
Feeling isolated and at the point of getting him assessed. Can anyone relate????

Mummyoftheyear Fri 05-Apr-13 23:52:30

Please excuse word omissions and autocorrections. Drives me mad and I'm too tired to edit!

What do nursery say exactly? Have they suggested getting him assessed? Do they have any strategies in place to help him?
Is he happy at nursery? (why is he in nursery at 5 btw?)

Mummyoftheyear Fri 05-Apr-13 23:57:47

Thank you for responding so quickly. He is now in Reception. He went to one nursery from the age of 2 and a quarter until he was almost four. Then he went to another nursery in a primary school until September when he started Reception. He's been observed a couple if times (Health Visitors and SENCOs. They couldn't put their fingers on it and said he was clearly bright but unusual n could t put their finger on it. I know myself that it's like pushing a lead ball up hill trying to get him to do something he doesn't want to. And he doesn't want to follow other people's instructions - especially if not interested. Even on things he's interested in, he likes to decide how to go about it.
Exhausting and unmanageable in a class setting. No positive incentives have had effect. sad

LadyMaryQuiteContrary Fri 05-Apr-13 23:58:57

Hi smile

I have a nephew a little like this. He isn't really interested in anything you have to say as he's too wrapped up in his own world. He can talk the hind legs off a donkey but only about the topics that he finds interesting. It can be very draining, my sister finds it tough. My nephew has aspergers. I'm not saying that your son has this, it's something that you should consider though. There's a lot of wise and knowledgeable parents in the SN section so it may be wise for you to post in there as well. Just write a little about what he's like. Any sensory problems? Will he only wear certain clothes, eat certain foods? Won't hug? You mentioned something about eye contact and interpersonal skills in your post but you didn't finish the sentence.

Mummyoftheyear Sat 06-Apr-13 00:04:41

I know ... so tired and typing on my phone, so I didn't realise ;)
His first cousin has asperges. I've always thought that a child who sought out conversation and eye contact probably wasn't asperges. Maybe I'm
Wrong? I'm exhausted! I'm also upset ;(
He's so bright but just wants to control and isn't endearing himself, as I said, to peers or teaching staff.
I question myself all the time:
Am I too strict?
Too lax?
Don't stick to the boundaries?
Is my house too chaotic? - that's my latest theory of self-blame... My house is so messy that he's trying to exert some control over his environment.
Has he got my 'busy brain'?

He is fine with all food. He has slight and occasional sensitivity to loud noises (but loves a loud disco). He loves cuddles. Hands up. I give up!

LadyMaryQuiteContrary Sat 06-Apr-13 00:13:54

I was told that a child with autism doesn't want friends, a child with aspergers wants friends but doesn't know how. sad I've no idea if it's accurate or not but I can see why. I do think that we all have a trait or two if we look hard enough.

I don't think this is anything to do with parenting, it's about his need to control the world around him which is uncontrollable if you think about it. He feels safe when things are his way; everything else upsets the balance so causes him a great deal of stress. I bet you're a fantastic mother, it's just that his need to control what's going on around him is strong. Try to change your perspective and see that you have no control over the world around you. People come and go, things change quickly, routines are a mess, you don't know what's happening next... ARGH!!! Wouldn't it be better if you knew what was coming up? That's (possibly) how his brain is processing information.

He could do with being assessed, it's a gateway to you all getting some answers and some support. smile

Mummyoftheyear, Please don't be upset. He sounds like a bright boy with an awful lot going for him. Just think how successful he is likely to be when he is allowed to chose and follow his own pathway?

School is 'mainstream' and some children just don't fit into the system as it currently stands. Some of these are identified as having special needs because they require 'reasonable adjustments' or adaptations to the school environment or curriculum.

Whatever is going on though it would be sensible to find out as much as you can, because when you have an information void, you fill it with your worst fears. With knowledge can come understanding and strategies, and there is loads of both on the www.mumsnet.com/Talk/special_needs section of the board.

notapizzaeater Sat 06-Apr-13 00:19:22

This sounds a lot like my son, he is very articulate about "his" subjects and has a brilliant imagination and barks orders out at his friends about how to play the games he has made up.

My son is on the spectrum - I feel PDA fits my son better. He genuinely does not believe he has to do anything he doesn't want to do !!! He "thinks" he is an adult so the things we /teachers ask him to do are obviously for the children so don't mean him ....

EggsEggSplat Sat 06-Apr-13 00:29:54

I was thinking PDA too - pathological demand avoidance - it's ASD related.

I don't think it is very ethical to be throwing dx around tbh. The OP has some concerns which are symptoms of a whole range of dx but also within the reals of typical.

And besides, she needs strategies and next step tips, including if appropriate, how to get a proper medical investigation underway, not lay people making dx over the internet.

LadyMaryQuiteContrary Sat 06-Apr-13 00:33:49
Mummyoftheyear Sat 06-Apr-13 00:38:06

My son often gets momentarily frustrated (cross and upset) that HE can't be an adult.
I have to say, I am so thankful that you mummies responded tonight as my pseudonym is ironic. I'm an aspiring mummy of the year- but feel I'm a big fake. As a teacher (primary) and assessor (dyslexia), I feel I ought to have been able to 'correct' or avoid those behaviours (strong will that goes against direction at school and at home). However, on the other hand, I'm amazed at his quirkiness - his avid interest in electricity, articulacy, etc.
just wish I could help him to bend to life rather than try to pull the globe in his direction.
Since he was at nursery (2 years old: 2 mornings a week), I've held back the tears as I drove to him. I was always dreading the 'what'll they say today' thing. Never terrible- but always (3 places including his current school) enough for them to complain about...
He would t sit down when asked
Wouldn't sing with the others
Would t tidy up with the others

Purposeful belligerence as wants to so what interests HIM and control OTHERS.

Mummyoftheyear Sat 06-Apr-13 00:42:07

My son often gets momentarily frustrated (cross and upset) that HE can't be an adult.
I have to say, I am so thankful that you mummies responded tonight as my pseudonym is ironic. I'm an aspiring mummy of the year- but feel I'm a big fake. As a teacher (primary) and assessor (dyslexia), I feel I ought to have been able to 'correct' or avoid those behaviours (strong will that goes against direction at school and at home). However, on the other hand, I'm amazed at his quirkiness - his avid interest in electricity, articulacy, etc.
just wish I could help him to bend to life rather than try to pull the globe in his direction.
Since he was at nursery (2 years old: 2 mornings a week), I've held back the tears as I drove to him. I was always dreading the 'what'll they say today' thing. Never terrible- but always (3 places including his current school) enough for them to complain about...
He would t sit down when asked
Wouldn't sing with the others
Would t tidy up with the others

Purposeful belligerence as wants to so what interests HIM and control OTHERS.

I know that these traits will please gd make him successful and talented as an adult.
But he is 5.
And at 5 they are proving to make him unpopular (play dates aren't repeated), and out of favour with teachers who find him almost purposely obstinate as he tries to show them that he will not be controlled. I actually understand and empathise with them. I practice clear boundary setting with tolerance. It's like bring wound up continually throughout the day!!!

Mummyoftheyear Sat 06-Apr-13 00:47:08

I welcome advice and shared experiences, StarlightMcKenzie. I'm sensible enough not to assume a label will fit if given on the net. But it's a good place to share honestly and feel less alone. Impossible to do at the school gates/ with friends I don't want to discourage from making more play dates with. I'm thinking of getting an assessment and am hoping others will have valuable experiences / children with similar characteristics to share. This in itself may help me to feel more secure about my decision to go for an assessment as the NHS said he wasn't bad enough to warrant it!

Mummyoftheyear Sat 06-Apr-13 00:49:59

Any label with the Wird 'pathological' is waaaay too scary, though! Lol

LadyMaryQuiteContrary Sat 06-Apr-13 00:50:24

I know it's stressful, we went through 5 schools before we found one which understood (ds has traits of aspergers, hypotonia and a sensory processing disorder). I knew he wasn't 'naughty', he just wasn't singing from the same sheet as the other children. The parents in the special needs section will know of strategies that you can try but they may not be around tonight. smile

Mummyoftheyear Sat 06-Apr-13 07:03:51

LadyMaryQuiteContrary, why? Do I get a night off if I join that gang, too? Joining! Lol
Or, like me, are they all exhausted from pushing lead weights up hill (much as we love our children)?
Really useful info., ladies! I'm hesitating over getting a referral as after a horrible experience at a state school he is now in a private svhool. It's killing us financially and so I'm not keen to jump to pay for an assessment if it isn't the right time. We shall see. Half of me think sits be useful to know (ie have a label), the other half of me thinks it may make the parents of his peers alienate him further out of ignorance and view him negatively, rather than with a question mark.

Branleuse Sat 06-Apr-13 07:39:19

my two boys are HFA/AS and they are both talkative and friendly but its always entirely on their terms and about their subjects

Mummyoftheyear Sat 06-Apr-13 08:37:55

Branleuse, please excuse my ignorance on this matter but I've no idea what those letters stand for - I'd love to know!

Mummyoftheyear Sat 06-Apr-13 08:41:57

Do you or anyone else have links to characteristics / traits that'll make identification easy? Can't find any easy ones.

xyla Sat 06-Apr-13 11:15:12

regarding how you can help: maybe you could give him a particular responsibility/activity of which he has full control and can make all of the decisions. perhaps feeling in control of something will help him relax a bit about things he has to do in other areas of his life?

HFA = High Function Autism
AS = Aspergers Syndrome
PDA = Pathilogical Demand Avoidance

However, from April no-one is differentiating when diagnosing. Dx will be ASD with specific characteristics.

I think people like to differentiate because ASD is a massive spectrum and it can feel unfair to be given generic strategies, or have assumptions made about your capabilities based on someones preconceived ideas about how you might be or react.

I don't like the above terms however and agree with the new format for dx. The above are kind of 'symptoms' of ASD iyswim.

LadyMaryQuiteContrary Sat 06-Apr-13 11:36:12

You can go through your GP for an assessment, they will refer to the community paediatrician/OT. It won't cost you if you go down this route.

I know it sounds silly, but have you given him a time limit for his activities? 'You can do X for 10 minutes, then we need to do Y' and use a timer? Sounds like you need saint like patience but it's important for him to learn that even adults have to do things they don't want to do. If he wants an easier life he has to do as people have asked. I have a child who thinks he's an adult. He's very, very bright and would rather spend time with adults as they are more on his wave length. He's compliant and not particularly obsessive. It's incredibly difficult to parent a child with an old head on their shoulders, you're doing a great job and this has nothing to do with your parenting. thanks

Mummyoftheyear Sat 06-Apr-13 17:54:22

You're so kind. Yup. Done timers: coloured sand timers, barking phone timer, flashing timer for SEN kids, etc. '5 min to go' warnings, eye contact with unobtrusive tap on shoulder, etc. Each one I tried with consistency. Hard work!

LadyMaryQuiteContrary Sat 06-Apr-13 18:03:02

Was one more effective then the rest? What about a visual timetable? It's trial and error I think, just keep looking for something that works. Mine's 13 and can be a bit quirky. It really does get easier. smile

Mummyoftheyear Sat 06-Apr-13 18:10:10

I actually find that after about 2 weeks my son loses interest / is less incentivised by any of them. He certainly keeps me on my toes. Currently using a marble jar.

LadyMaryQuiteContrary Sat 06-Apr-13 18:11:44

Does he like Lego?

matana Sat 06-Apr-13 20:23:39

Hi, don't mean to sound dismissive, especially as I'm sure it can be very wearing and youre clearly concerned. But maybe your ds is just destined to be a leader, not a follower and perhaps you shouldn't be trying to 'correct' him, but embracing his uniqueness. I don't mean indulging him, every child needs to learn humility and empathy etc but he sounds like a really unique child with a lot to offer if focussed correctly. Your description actually made me think "yes, the world needs these kinds of people too". I don't think there's anything wrong with him other than being a true individual. I rather like that. Children like yours just need their energies focusing in the right direction.

Mummyoftheyear Sat 06-Apr-13 21:23:36

Mantana, your response is really moving and hit home with me. I hope you're right but since school and his child minder are finding him difficult, I'm having to think harder a d consider having someone 'take a look' fir professional objectivity'. Occasional mildly aggressive outbursts towards childminder. That's not ok.
But yes, he'll please gd be a leader. That's for sure! Lol

Mummyoftheyear Sat 06-Apr-13 21:25:06

Not into Lego really.

LadyMaryQuiteContrary Sat 06-Apr-13 21:27:07

Even the best leaders have to stop and listen to others though. It's a vital skill that he does need to learn.

What is he interested in?

Mummyoftheyear Sat 06-Apr-13 21:32:37

Exactly what my DH just said to me. Exactly the problem. Moreover, I'd like this little boy of mine who'd looooove to have friends and affectionate adults around him to engender that by listening instead of being obstinate and controlling.

Mummyoftheyear Sat 06-Apr-13 21:34:09

He is interested in electricity. In fact, thinking about it, this interest came about at the age of about 2 and a half - same time these controlling behaviours became apparent.

LadyMaryQuiteContrary Sat 06-Apr-13 21:35:52

Have you tried a little reverse psychology? Show him that adults have to communicate and work with each other. If he thinks he's an adult then part of being an adult is being able to work with others and not dish out the orders. Can you see what I mean?

LadyMaryQuiteContrary Sat 06-Apr-13 21:38:53

Can you buy him an electricity science kit? One piece for each day of the desired behaviour. He'll be able to build it up and will see what he's achieved. Trick with this is to only use it for one behaviour issue as it's confusing for him otherwise. Listening to others would be a good one to start off with.

belfastbigmillie Sat 06-Apr-13 21:48:24

Gosh he sounds very, very like my eldest son (now 7). DS was v. into physics, circuits etc, 'charmless' to visiting children (yet liked them coming round), very bright but very difficult, has to do things on his own terms - yet lovely and very affectionate on his own terms. He is also very kind to smaller children, animals etc.

I finally realised that DS is dyspraxic but it just hadn't revealed itself in the normal way. Have a look at the dyspraxia society website. I now home ed DS which has helped him massively and he has a couple of home edded friends who are into his hobbies. He does well academically as the one to one style of teaching really suits him. He too is often described as 'quirky' and I also used to be a teacher. I've decided I'm not really bothered about labels. He is happy and coming on well, academically and socially (albeit that he is still immature compared to others) and that's all that matters really.

Mummyoftheyear Sat 06-Apr-13 21:54:06

I have Hot Wires and use You Tube to understand how to make potato batteries, etc.
I'd not home school him. I'm not against it but it's soooo hard to get him to do anything he's not interested in that we'd either spend the day waiting for a mini meltdown to pass or having time outs or doing what he's interested in.
I also suppose I feel I'd like him to socialise with others. It's healthy for him. We don't have a huge circle of friends or family with children and do its even more of an important aspect of his education.
How would I know whether he was Dyspraxic? He's not clumsy, his coordination seems fine (excellent fine motor skills), etc.
- scratching own head.

belfastbigmillie Sat 06-Apr-13 22:03:51

I think dyspraxia is now considered part of the big picture of autism in some circles. It makes sense to me as there are a lot of kids who are difficult to define but just stand out as being 'quirky'. Have a look at the checklist on the dyspraxia website. Dyspraxia isn't all about clumsiness.

DS was totally refusing to do things at school, saying they were ridiculous. He is doing maths/literacy etc through his love of physics and now he's got into programming too. Don't be too quick to dismiss HE. It has really worked for my son.

LadyMaryQuiteContrary Sat 06-Apr-13 22:04:25

Find something that has lots of bits. He can watch his collection grow which will motivate him (hopefully). Have you tried relaxation techniques? May help when he melts down. The ASD traits do overlap with Dyspraxia, it can be tricky to differentiate the two. You're better off popping to your GP and having a chat, he needs a referral really. In the mean time you could do with some strategies to try and diffuse things when he's in melt down mode. Does this happen when he's asked to do something he doesn't want to do?

belfastbigmillie Sat 06-Apr-13 22:05:57

Also, you can't force someone to become sociable. I am an extrovert but finally I've accepted that DS isn't. He doesn't give a shit about pleasing the group. He likes who he likes and a couple of play dates a week are enough for him.

Mummyoftheyear Sat 06-Apr-13 22:11:29

I'll never say never ... but I'd rather not! I am patient with others' children but not able to maintain it with him on educational stuff as he us so opposed to doing anything educational- however I disguise it (electricity based).
He listens to wonderful meditation CDs most nights. He also does a bit of yoga for kids with a video if he's inclined fir 5-10 mins at the end of the day.

LadyMaryQuiteContrary Sat 06-Apr-13 22:14:30

Every child is different, chuck. They all require very different parenting skills, so what works with one child won't work with another. Is there something that triggers him off? What do you usually do to diffuse it?

belfastbigmillie Sat 06-Apr-13 22:17:28

There are many ways to home ed. Also there are very good networks for socialising. I had to take DS out of school for his own mental health. He was frustrated by the easiness of the work but instead of completing it to be a 'good boy' just refused to do it, no matter what the punishment. What is your son like re self-organisation, eye contact, listening skills and writing/drawing?

belfastbigmillie Sat 06-Apr-13 22:18:42

Also is he socially mature or immature compared to his peers? What is he like re sensorial experiences eg getting wet/muddy or textures of food?

Mummyoftheyear Sat 06-Apr-13 22:26:22

Mature - in TES of knowing what's what, summing up and deciding immediately what and how he'd like to go about things.
In terms of listening skills (ie mouth closed, ears open, conversing TWO WAY), not great.

Mummyoftheyear Sat 06-Apr-13 22:28:25

He hates anything related to listening, concentrating, writing. It's too constricting for his busy brain and independence. He will literally draw a line on the other side if the page to write his name rather than write it on the name line provided.

LadyMaryQuiteContrary Sat 06-Apr-13 22:28:59

I know it sounds silly, but have you tried teaching him the basics of listening? Some children pick it up through osmosis so don't need teaching, some children don't. Have you tried role play? I used a book called the unwritten rules of friendship (someone on here recommended it many moons ago), it really helped. smile

Mummyoftheyear Sat 06-Apr-13 22:29:22

TES should have read 'TERMS'

Mummyoftheyear Sat 06-Apr-13 22:30:49

I think home edding would allow him to tailor his day to exactly what he'd like to do- all day long. I'm not up for that. He needs to learn to cooperate and respect some instructions. Whether its at home or school.

belfastbigmillie Sat 06-Apr-13 22:34:48

I have to say, he sounds identical to DS at that age.

Mummyoftheyear Sun 07-Apr-13 06:35:59

And does your little one have a particular difficulty / need- or did he grow out of it?

belfastbigmillie Sun 07-Apr-13 13:38:55

His difficulty is (and always has been) doing what is expected of him in group situations. He is now 7. His listening skills are still poor but I am always available to work with him on them. He doesn't do many group things but because we only go to things that he chooses then he accepts in advance the behaviour rules that go with them. His academic work is very good and he is at key stage 3 level for his good subjects eg physics and is now average at handwriting (which, believe me, is a miracle). I know you don't like the sound of it but I do suggest you consider home ed. At least read up on it (it isn't anything like a mini classroom scenario).

Read How Kids Learn by John Holt. Also How Children Learn at Home by Alan Thomas and Harriet Patterson. I think a bright spark like your DS would thrive in a non group setting and I think ultimately you need to consider which is more important to you - your need for control (and embarrassment about) around your child's conforming or your child's happiness and self esteem.

Mummyoftheyear Sun 07-Apr-13 14:12:18

Thank you for your tips. I really don't think my child would be happy at home. Home Ed is for those who are up for it - and I'm just not. He would be devastated not to be able to go to school with peers his age every day. I can't offer him what he'd need at secondary level, and I'd have real concerns about how he would then adapt having been out of school until the age of 11.
My hope is to help him to adapt his behaviour enough to do what he would like to do: learn alongside peers and make some friends. He really likes his teachers. He would listen to me as little / less than he listens to them and I'd get v cross with him ultimately - so being at home would be a meltdown nightmare for us both and affect our relationship as well as his motivation towards his work.

belfastbigmillie Sun 07-Apr-13 18:03:56

Well, good luck with it all. Read the John Holt book anyway (and How Children Fail) as I think it will help you to understand your child's motivation. If you do get him diagnosed and get a label, could I ask you to let me know what they say. Purely out of curiosity as I know that whatever your son is, my son is too! All the best x

Mummyoftheyear Sun 07-Apr-13 19:16:58

Of course u will. I really respect your choice and your patience as a home ed parent. I find it easier to teach a class of 30 than to teach my own son. He resists both direction and education. but I love him and admire him all the same. Did you say that your son is into electricity, too - or was it Lego?
If he (or was it someone else on the thread's son) likes electricity, I absolutely recommend purchasing Hot Wires!Check this out on AMZN: John Adams Hot Wires Electronics Kit http://amazon.co.uk/dp/B0006SK3WG

belfastbigmillie Sun 07-Apr-13 19:53:23

Haha - mine already has hotwires, logiblocs, laptops he's taken apart etc etc etc... (I didn't even do science O level smile )

Mummyoftheyear Sun 07-Apr-13 19:58:51

I know... I've needed to become interested in science like never before! It's pretty easy really as there's so much on YouTube, kits like Hot Wires are very clear and self explanatory... and he just loves to discover it all himself, anyway ;)
DS' favourite programme is: How It Works.
Fabulous boys' stuff!

Mummyoftheyear Sun 07-Apr-13 19:59:45

Thankfully, he also likes to dance to the music of 'Chorus Line': I Can Do That. Lol

belfastbigmillie Sun 07-Apr-13 20:15:04

Get him into programming - research using Scratch or build up a Raspberry Pi - I bet he'd love it. Also buy or get him old or broken gadgets to take apart so he can look at the insides. DS has always preferred that to toys.

Mummyoftheyear Sun 07-Apr-13 21:42:30

Ooh cool
Tell me about the PI?
How do you get broken gadgets apart from waiting for them to break?

Mummyoftheyear Sun 07-Apr-13 21:43:13

Raspberry PI?

belfastbigmillie Sun 07-Apr-13 21:52:44

People give us broken stuff. Also no charity shops take electrical stuff these days so we have a deal with our local one that they keep things for him. Also my DH works in IT so every so often they throw out old machines etc and he brings them home for DS.


belfastbigmillie Sun 07-Apr-13 21:54:15
belfastbigmillie Sun 07-Apr-13 21:55:25

My DS would never be good for a reward chart but he was impeccable for a month to get his hands on a broken laptop smile

Mummyoftheyear Sun 07-Apr-13 22:02:15

Can sooooo relate! South on common. Where do you live?

Mummyoftheyear Sun 07-Apr-13 22:02:28


belfastbigmillie Sun 07-Apr-13 22:05:04

No smile

Mummyoftheyear Sun 07-Apr-13 22:05:31

So much in common
My typos drive me mad! iPhones and fat fingers don't mix

belfastbigmillie Sun 07-Apr-13 22:07:03

Have PMed you.

Mummyoftheyear Sun 07-Apr-13 22:15:36


MummaBubba123 Sun 21-Apr-13 13:08:45

I haven't had a chance to think about the programming stuff you recommended - but I'm anxious not to forget about it as it sounds fantastic. I have two identities - no idea why. I'm not very good at Internet stuff and think I couldn't log on one day so set up another much a more recent email account. Anyway, could we liaise somehow about the programming and kiddy issues, etc? I really hope you find this message!

Branleuse Sun 21-Apr-13 13:20:32

Sounds a bit aspie to me.

All the aspie children I know really want friends, and often have friends.

Thats not a criteria

MummaBubba123 Sun 21-Apr-13 19:40:14

Do you think? What do you think about us going for an assessment? He is in Reception (nearly 5 and a half).

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